BRRRs To Pre Construction Condos; Travelling to the Ukrainian Border To Help Refugees With Todor Yordanov

What a strange time to be alive!

One day, I’ll stop saying these are historical times we live in, but I’ll say again, these are historical times we live in.

I’ve spoken to a couple of real estate investors who have lost significant amounts of money in alternative cryptocurrency coins. I find it difficult to reconcile how one invests in cash-flowing real estate because it’s an incredibly defensive and offensive investment, and then place their money into such speculative… I don’t even know what to call them, alternative coins, e.g. Luna coin, which fell from $80 to 2 cents in a matter of hours.

Personally, I’m a believer of the Ethereum and Bitcoin, but I don’t have much because I don’t like the current prices; I own enough stocks I overpaid for, so I’m being patient this time as the risks in the crypto and financial markets are high compared to the reward, so I’m being patient. What I’m not being patient about is pushing our refinancing process through to free up more capital to take advantage of opportunities in real estate, stocks and crypto. 

So far in 2022, cash is a winning asset, but I don’t think it will stay that way for long. The central banks in both Canada and US have been very successful in cooling both housing and stock markets. 

My crystal ball is no better than yours, but I expect at least two more interest rate increases this year. The pain for some will be great, and that may also be the best opportunity to get into any quality asset for the next who knows how long.

Today reminds me a lot of 2017 when the housing market corrected, and Cherry and I picked up two houses in the 4-500s.  There were no competing offers; I had conditional offers. We have since converted both into duplexes, each recently appraised for $1 million.  We plan to buy this dip as soon as our refinancing is done.

The nice part of the market today is there are turnkey duplexes available for sale, which was not a luxury back in 2017. Cherry and I are too busy with our lives and prefer turnkey these days, collecting rent and cash flow ASAP, and going back to our busy lives, including watching our kids in sports since they grow up so fast! 

When I was a bit younger and had more time, I’d be all in doing BRRRs and renos, but our businesses provide enough cash flow, and we’re having fun hence no immediate plans for retirement. 

Everyone needs to choose an investment strategy suited to their goals, those who want to quit their day jobs will have to be more active than Cherry and I. That’s the Truth About Real Estate Investing, AND I have several multi-millionaire clients who invest as a side hustle.

If you’re new to investing, whichever you choose, please start with quality education and have some expert eyes review your deals.  This week, I learned of an investor who bought a property from a well-known wholesaler. Unfortunately, the wholesaler did not disclose there was a legal marijuana grow-op in the basement. An honest omission? Maybe but at the end of the day, buyers beware. Verify everything, and do your own due diligence.

This wouldn’t have slipped by my coaches.  If we wouldn’t buy a property with our own money, we’ll let you know.

A few other investors asked me how to scale their real estate portfolios when they own pre-construction condos when theirs are negative cash flow. I tell them they don’t.  The bank doesn’t like negative cash flow.  

If you were the bank, would you prefer a negative cash flow property or a positive one?  Definitely the latter; hence I’m able to keep getting more mortgages to buy more real estate, which is in line with our goals.

BRRRs To Pre Construction Condos; Travelling to the Ukrainian Border To Help Refugees With Todor Yordanov

On to this week’s show!

We have an incredible story from my old friend Todor Yordanov, one of the first serious real estate investors I met in 2007, and he’s done quite well for himself.

He’s done so well that he’s progressed to helping others, specifically Ukrainian refugees in Varna, Bulgaria, where he’s from. How his partner Natalia would cry all night when the war broke out, and one morning, they dropped everything to get on a plane to go help.

Today, Todor is sharing how he became a successful investor and Broker, from BRRRR investor to his now focus, pre-construction condos.

As I type, Todor is actually on his way back to help Ukrainian refugees.  What a guy!

Todor’s gofundme for charity the Ukrainian Humanitarian Emergency Relief: https://gofund.me/bc23b150

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Hello everyone, this is Erwin Szeto bringing you the truth about real estate investing show. And what a strange time it is to be alive. One day I’ll stop saying these are historical times that we live in. But I’ll say it again, these are historical times we live in. I’ve spoken to a couple of real estate investors who have lost significant amounts of money in alternative cryptocurrency coins. Try saying that three times fast. I actually find it difficult to reconcile how one invest in cash flowing real estate, sorry, cashflow. Real estate is an incredibly defensive and offensive investment strategy. But I can’t reconcile is how the same people then place money into something so speculative, like alternative cryptocurrency coins, I can’t even name them all. I don’t even know what to call them. But these alternative coins One example would be Luna, which is making headlines these days. It fell from $80 to two cents in a matter of hours. I think overnight. 48 hours ago, I didn’t know what Luna was actually no I did. It was a friend of mine told me what a great investment it was about a month ago. And there were people that told me that they lost their entire investment in that investment. I was actually speaking to someone at lunch who had bought 17,000 Luna coins, they’re bought them for fractions of a cent because they’re trying to buy the dip. And then the coin shop the five cents, they got too busy. They didn’t take their exit, they could have had a 600% return in just minutes. But it’s it’s crapped out even more. But it’s an investment. So it’s not like it went negative and they already might even work. So yeah, so a friend of mine gambled away $200 That’s nothing like what other friends have shared with me. People have lost 1000s of dollars on this on this coin. And then the coin has actually brought down the entire cryptocurrency market for those who aren’t familiar, not tracking. So yeah, Cryptos are bad. Me personally, I’ve only been focused on mainly Bitcoin related stocks. So my generally my exposure is very, very small compared to my net worth compared, especially compared to my real estate portfolio. So yeah, and I believe in the business case for Bitcoin and Ethereum It’s just I don’t like the valuations. I don’t like the prices I don’t like who’s investing in these things. And it seems to be too many legislators. And when there’s too much speculative buying that, you know, then that price gets pumped up a little bit and it feels little bit artificial. So I gotta be patient. I’m actually worried that the cryptocurrency market may bring down the stock market with it. So we’ll see. We’ll see I’m being patient right now. And just sitting on a bit of cash, waiting for opportunity. Hopefully I can free up more cash to Yeah, so I mean patient, but we are pushing along our refinancing process to free up some more capital to take advantages in real estate, stocks and crypto. That’s just me, though, I’m not an expert at all in anything. And this is not financial advice. So far in 2022 cash has been the winning asset. If you actually look at the US dollar, I believe it’s like one of the best I went to one of the best performing asset classes in terms of this year alone. But don’t do stay that way for long. It’s actually beating gold, I believe I believe the US dollar is beating gold. What a world! The highest inflation going on the US dollar is beating gold. The central banks in both Canada and US have been very successful in cooling respective housing markets and stock markets. You know, for any Canadian go have a look at Shopify, see how that stocks doing? 

 

Erwin  

My crystal ball is no better than yours. But I from their sources that I trust and follow, we’re pretty consistent that we believe there’s gonna be at least two more interest rate increases this year, some predict more, I think that may be it, because the pain will be too great for too many Canadians, especially those who overleveraged. And we may be running into one of the best opportunities to get into any quality asset. And you know, whether it’s stock, crypto real estate, and it may be the best opportunity for I don’t know how long because not only we’re trying to time the market, we’re also trying to time when the central bank start printing money again. So holding cash, pretty soon, I would guess, maybe this year, maybe that by the end of the year, will not be something you want to be holding, as I expect the central banks to be increasing monetary policy again, like they always have in the investment world. And there’s only one thing guaranteed is that the central banks will print money. They’re not doing it right now. They’re actually easing their easing right now. But I don’t see a world where they don’t increase their their the money supplier that’s out there. Today. Reminds me a lot of 2017. So for those who have been around for a while, and I know many of you haven’t I see on my social media, lots of real estate coaches who got into the market within the last two years. But anyways, when the housing market corrected and back in 2017, Cherry and I picked up two houses and we paid in the four and five hundreds for them. Have you paid in the 500 as they were low five hundreds, and at the time, there were no competing offers actually broken Additional offers that were accepted, and we since converted both into duplexes each recently appraised for a million dollars. And we fully plan on buying this dip as soon as buying this dip as well, as soon as we have our right refinancing done of a couple of our properties. The nice part of the market today is there’s actually turnkey duplexes available for sale. My team has several of them available for sale that are they’re coming up coming up available for sale, and which was not a luxury back in 2017. The properties I bought, I had to do the conversions myself. By doing the conversion myself, I hand them off to my power teams of designers, architects, painting people, contractors, all those sorts of things, electricians, Cherry and I are too busy today. Back then, you know, I guess I’m still being a little ambitious, and want to make every single dollar. Cherry and I are too busy with their lives, and prefer turnkey investing these days, collecting rent and cash flowing as soon as possible. So we can go back to our busy lives, including watching our kids in sports, since they’re growing up so fast. Like I said, when I was a bit younger, even 2017 Five years ago, I think the pandemic aged me a lot. But anyways, when I was younger, and I was chasing every single dollar out there, I would have been doing BRRRs the whole way. Buy renovate, rent, refinance, whatever repeat or in just general, I buy beaten up properties. But our businesses provide us enough cashflow in we’re having fun running our businesses. It’s hence we have no immediate plans to reach for retirement. So everyone needs to choose their own investment strategy suited to their goals. Those who want to quit their day jobs will have to be more active than Cherry and I were not the model to follow for everyone. And that’s the truth about real estate investing. One of the truth is I have several several multimillion Naira clients who weren’t multimillionaires, when I met them, they are now multi multi millionaires who invest in real estate as a side hustle. They still like their day jobs. They don’t want to be real estate full time. They just collect three to five or eight houses, and they’re perfectly happy. If you’re new to investing whichever path you choose strategy you choose. Please start with quality education and have some expert eyes review your deals. This week, I learned from an investor who bought a property off a well known wholesaler. So that’s a private deal. No Realtors involved and the wholesaler did not disclose those a legal marijuana grow-up in the basement, legal or not, that’s not something I want my property and honest permission. Well, if it was a realtor, you could sue the pants off of them. And they probably lose their licence, at least at minimum be fined a significant amount of money, maybe maybe an honest omission. But at the end of the day, buyer beware. Verify everything, do your own due diligence. I have trust issues, because I’ve seen so many things, terrible things happen. And that’s part of capitalism, people will do what’s in their best interest. So for those of you listeners out there, you know, you are my community. I want to see you safe, investing safely. So do your own due diligence, have a healthy amount of mistrust, and anyone who’s trying to make money off of you? FYI, this would not have slipped by my coaches were not dummies, nor the supplier, anyone on my team. We know perfectly well what investment properties are good investments that we would put our own money into. And that’s what we advise our clients to do as well. A few of them other other investors asked me actually, just last night, I was hosting a free training for our own clients. And I had two investors asked me how do they scale their portfolios? Now, there’s always context needed both happened to own pre construction condos that they plan to own and plan on. Having negative cashflow is just the nature of that investment for the properties that they bought. They bombed downtown Toronto ish somewhere within Toronto City of Toronto proper, they’re likely quality deals in terms of a condo, but I tell them because your property isn’t cashflow. And when the bank looks at your negative six three or $600 cash flow and compare it to when the bank looks at my property that is positive cash flows, who do you think they’re going to lend more money to? Which portfolio Do you think they prefer? So my goal is to own multiple properties. Therefore, I need to do strategies that positive cash flow the only way a negative cash flow portfolio will scale is if rents go up, or you make more money personally, and this is Canada and let’s not forget the lessons of Rich Dad Poor Dad. The more money you make, the more tax you pay. Gotta love it. Yeah, in summary, I’m able to get mortgages still versus like condo preconstructed Condo buyer. It’ll be differently definitely different path for them to be able to scale. 

 

Erwin  

Onto this we show we have an incredible story from my old friend Todor Yordanov, one of the first serious real estate investors I’ve met back in 2006/7 and he’s done quite well for himself. Just like most investors have, you know, who’ve invested like 15 something years. He’s done well And he’s progressed to helping others. He’s done so well that he’s able to afford to go and help Ukrainian refugees at the border, where Ukraine borders with Bulgaria. Todor is from Bulgaria. Originally, he shares how his partner and Natalia would cry at night when the war br oke out. And then one morning, they dropped everything and get on the plane to go to the border and help. Todor is here today to share how he became a successful investor and real estate broker. He used to burr properties on townhouses in Hamilton and for example, and now his focus is pre construction condo, he’s gone from opposite ends of investing. Actually, when I was checking the links for Twitter or social media, I found out he’s on his way back to you to the Ukrainian border, to help more refugees. So he’s going back, even though he has admitted PTSD, what a guy! Todors GoFundMe for the charity, the Ukrainian humanitarian emergency relief fund, the links are in the show notes. It’s a GoFundMe. And yeah, he’s a good guy. He’s doing a lot more than I am to for Ukrainian refugees. Please enjoy the show. 

 

Erwin  

Hello, Todor. What’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Todor  

Hey, everyone, good to see you. Good to be with you.

 

Erwin  

I’m just happy to see that you like when when you first walked in the door, I had to check you for bullet holes to make sure you were whole. And

 

Todor  

I’m perfectly fine man. Like I’m perfectly fine. We’ve seen things that that most people are not going to see in their lifetimes. And it’s good for them. Coming back from the border of Ukraine, and spending five weeks there with mothers and kids that are fleeing from the war was definitely an experience that we know we’ve been back for exactly eight days now today. And it’s an experience that definitely now that I think about it is changed me and a lot has changed pretty much the fabric of me. It brought a lot of knowledge, experience, things that we’ve seen things that I think that I still think about our work has not finished because we still have volunteers back in Varna, Bulgaria, helping with the women and the kids and whatever they need medicine, mostly some of them food shelter. So we’re still fundraising money, we’re still doing work. It’s just that Natalia and I came here to, to do what we do so real estate, and but my mind is constantly on the need of those women and kids that are still displaced over Europe, you know, Varna Bulgaria is like a very, very small, small number of people compared to Poland, compared to Romania, Moldova, other countries.

 

Erwin  

So I’ll speak on behalf of the average Canadian is, you know, when the wars started, I had some very poor. So actually, first, I’ll speak for myself at some very poor emotional responses. When the war started, I wanted some bad things to happen to Putin and Russian soldiers. It was just an emotional response to myself. Once I calmed down, and thought about what I can do, I made a donation to Red Cross.

 

Todor  

And thank you so much for your donation to us.

 

Erwin  

And private donation to you as well.

 

Todor  

Thank you. I really appreciate it.

 

Erwin  

You know, what I did is like, I don’t I can’t say I know how big the problem is, but I have no idea how big the damage bill is going to be. And the drop in the bucket really fell it it really felt like I should be doing more. But after I’ve resigned myself, I have I got what I have here. And I have to move on. Versus you. You decided to do something about it. 

 

Todor  

Yeah. So when the war started, like, you know, a little bit of a backdrop by I’m originally from Bulgaria, from the coastal city of Varna, from Varna to Odessa, Ukraine, it’s about 200 kilometres across the Black Sea. So you know, direct 200 kilometres like we’re very, very close. Natalia, my, my fiancee, Natalia. She’s from Ukraine originally. You know, we both live in working in Toronto.

 

Erwin  

Sorry, what’d she come over?

 

Todor  

So Natalia came over when she was 13. And she’s only been back to Ukraine once when she was in her early 20s. I go back to Bulgaria every summer. So she always wanted to go back to Ukraine. And last year, we wanted to go back to Ukraine, but it was COVID it was kind of like a bit of unsafe to cross borders and go to different countries. Ukraine, at that time, had like a really bad break out of COVID. And people are saying is like, you know, don’t be ridiculous, like, don’t go. So we stayed in Varna. So when the war the war started, Natalia like most Ukrainians, you know, they just couldn’t stop crying for two days. So on the third day, I remember when I was, you know, going to bed and the last thing that entered my mind before I fell asleep was like, We gotta go. Like we have to go to Varna, where all of these refugees are coming now and see what we can be helpful with. I woke up that morning can I looked at Natalia We didn’t even have coffee yet. And I says, like, I think we should go. And she says, like, Yeah, let’s go. So I bought the tickets on the spot. And we were on the plane that night. And, you know, five weeks, in the country, we spent, you know, quite a bit of our own money. And then people friends, like you started donating to the campaign as well. And every day, we were going to the refugee centres to the crisis centres, and seeing what they need, you know, water foods, bedsheets, blankets, space heaters, because it was still called all kinds of stuff that, you know, we people need it in order for them to be warm and fat and have a decent accommodation. So we were buying all that. And at the same time, we were driving to the Romanian Ukraine border all the time to see them arriving and to pick some of them up with us, and to arrange for transportation as well. Because at the beginning, at the very, very beginning, when we arrived, everything was not disorganised. But everything was run by volunteers. It was all people like us, they just jumped in. And they’re like, I’m here. What can I help with? Like, there was no government, no organisation knows, no support, no, nothing, no financing. So it was pretty much until the very end, it was mostly run by volunteers, and mostly paid by money donated, private. So private donations. Yeah. So I’m, like, super glad that we are super glad that we did rediscover that spark inside of me, you know, when when something like that happens, let’s like, you just have to go, you have to jump like you can’t really think about it, you know, in many areas of life is like you either do it or you don’t do it. And I respect both. Right, like you said, you donated and it’s now time to move on to your life and to what you do. And, you know, I totally respect that, you know, for me, was I decided that I’m going to go there, and I’m going to do something, I’m going to try to do something more. And when I say more, one of the most devastating things in this kind of volunteer work is when you wake up in the morning, after you’ve been exhausted after a month, and after so much money spent, and you look at yourself, and it’s like, You’ve done nothing. It’s like the impact is so tiny, and so little, in the grand scheme of things is like you feel like, How can I do more, and then you realise that you’re not a superhero. Like you cannot heal everybody, and he cannot help everybody. And he cannot, you know, there is no way that you can have all of the money in the world. So you can make an impact for everybody. And you’re just making a tiny little impact here and a tiny little impact there. And that’s, you know, the human limitations.

 

Erwin  

Todor, you inspired me. And it’s not much to say, but you inspired me that you stood up and took action. Does Natalia have family in Ukraine?

 

Todor  

Her father and her mother and her siblings are here, and everybody else is in Ukraine. So all of the aunts and uncles and cousins, everyboby’s in Ukraine. They’re staying Yeah, they’re older people.

 

Erwin  

Any of them fight?

 

Todor  

So we, one of the people that we picked up from the airport is her cousin’s daughter. She’s 23. And we picked her up and she basically took a bus to the border, from Kiev, young woman, very capable, travel, the world has master’s degrees in communication, and she wants to have a better life for herself. But the moment things improve in Ukraine, she’s gonna go back. And so her father is in the army, her brother is in the army. And both of them are pretty much every man who is capable of fighting between the ages of 18 and 60. In Ukraine, you cannot leave if you are a man between 18 and 60, you cannot leave. And all of them are a general mobilisation. So some of them are fighting, some of them are being trained, and some of them are on audits, depending on where you live. So anybody can be on a frontline at anytime. It’s really, really, I have no words to describe, because this is now so close to home, right? So close to me so close to Bulgaria, but so close to me as a person, and it’s happening in Europe with I don’t know if people realise how big Ukraine actually is. Ukraine is a it’s the biggest European country by landmass. 45 million people. Very, very rich in natural resources, black soil, growing a lot of food for Europe. So this is happening in Europe. It’s war, bombs, tanks, Molotov cocktails. It’s just First, in the 21st century to experience something like that, especially, you know, take me with my lifestyle and what we do and how we live here in Canada, in Toronto, and then all of a sudden, boom, you’re in a completely different world of war and despair. And, you know, like these women that we met, and a lot of them is like, with their little kids, you know, they’re all running scared. And then two days later, one of them the husband, you can reach the husband anymore. And then a day later, somebody tells you all he was killed. You know, it’s just just devastating. Devastating. Sorry, this is not a bit fun story for a real estate podcast. 

 

Erwin  

I give a warning at the beginning of the show. 

 

Todor  

But this is, this is what my life has kind of like shifted in a very big way in the last month and a half, two months.

 

Erwin  

So we negotiated through real estate. You’re actually the first how you say it, I guess, first real estate investor I met? I’m sure many other people. No, no, I’m sure I met other people on the way. But there was never the how that relationship started, you know? Wow. And we probably never actually had an in depth conversation about real estate. Actually, I don’t even know how I ended up at your Meetup. We were discussing before we were recording what year it was, and we’re not absolutely sure, but it could have been 2006 or 2007. Good time to get in. Yes. But I mentioned at Tim Hortons. I think you organise the meetup. I think this is back in the day when when email distribution lists like just like, we’re just starting, I guess. Yeah, yeah. But it was really just like you put everyone’s email in the To field like, Hey, who wants to meet up? Right, right. And I’m not sure it happened. But it only ended up being yourself. My now ex wife and I, yes. And we start talking about real estate. And then that led to you’re already a REIN member at that point? 

 

Todor  

Um, yes, yes. Okay. We’re trying to I’m trying to remember but yes, because I already had purchase townhomes in Hamilton. So I must have been a REIN member at that time. Yeah, for sure.

 

Erwin  

What year did you join?

 

Todor  

I honestly don’t remember. I don’t remember it must have been 2005 2006. 

 

Erwin  

Okay. But I remember it has been counting when I deserve my ten year awards. Right. Don’t ask to say it. But without your real estate, you wouldn’t have been able to go not at all within a year without your investments?

 

Todor  

Not at all. Like even actually, when we when we made the decision. And I turned to Madonnina says like, let’s record a little video of us making this decision and basically telling telling the people that, you know, we’re gonna go, this was March 2. So it was like four or five days after the war started. And from that moment, and not only from that moment, but from from every moment because of real estate, because of real estate investments because of business mentality that came after real estate investing, because I was working for a company like you were working for a company, you know, paycheck, security, jobs, good jobs, great jobs, great company, great advancement opportunities, like you, you move up, make more money, you know, you go to work, like you get your paid vacations, like whatever, all these good things. But then when I stepped out of that world, into the world of real estate investing, first while still working, but then selling real estate as a, as an agent, you become a business person. And that is like a completely different mindset and a completely different life, that you live our life or our life where you take, we take all of the risks, but then you also take all of the reward. And then you have all of the freedoms, but at the same time, you have all the responsibilities. So that realisation was not because of what we decided to do on March 2, but that realisation was you know, wait time before that, when I can, you know, take three months off in the summer and go back home to my hometown, and spend time with relatives and not not think about it. You know, many people will say, Well, what, how can you take three months off from your business? And my answer is like, look, it may not look like I work a lot. But up here, I work 24/7, 7 days a week. So when the summer comes and I decided to go and take off three months, like I’ve already worked three years, in a normal nine to five job. So yeah, it’s just like, the pay is different. You know, you have a lot more responsibility, we take some freedoms. So when on March 2, we decided to go I realise that you know, we are we’re fortunate because of what we we do and what we’ve done to be able to make this drastic change of course, and say like, I’m not going to worry about working right now and I’m not gonna worry about, you know, bringing an X number of income this month, I’m just gonna go and help. And I’m just gonna go and fully commit to helping, because I can. And because of, you know, if I don’t do it, then who’s gonna do it? It comes with, you know, the responsibility comes also with the freedom, you can do it, then why don’t you, you have to have an answer to that question. And again, like, whatever that answer is like, I’m totally fine with anybody else’s. No, I’m not putting responsibility or blame or asking people to do more No, like, have an answer. And that is your answer. And it’s like, totally okay. My answer is like, my work the needs of my clients right now. You know, so if you’re listening, but way in the back seat, I gotta do this.

 

Erwin  

I’m sure they can appreciate. That’s it. And on the far end of the spectrum, I follow a gentleman on Twitter who is a who is a trained Canadian medic. So he’s in Ukraine.

 

Todor  

Yeah, he’s in on the front line. You know.

 

Erwin  

But he’s got and he’s trained with weapons. So he probably is. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Dangerous. That is no sacrifice leaving behind him. He’s got three kids at home. Oh, yeah.

 

Todor  

My like the Second World War. This is just different part, but also real part. A second day of war, I turned to Natalia and says, like, you know what, like, I want to go and join the army. She goes, like are you insane. I said, No, I’m not insane. Like, I’m trained. I’ve trained for this. Like, this is what I was made to do. Because I was in the army back in the day when I was growing up. 

 

Erwin  

Excuse me. What year?

 

Todor  

85? I got out of the Army in 1985. Got in at no got in 85 got out at the end of 87. So I was in the army for two and a half, three years.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so you’re more qualified than i Okay.

 

Todor  

She says like, no, no, no, you’re insane. And then I thought about it. It says like, I’m 56 I’m not 20 anymore.

 

Erwin  

I can superpower over there on the other side. 

 

Todor  

Yeah. Plus, Plus, you know, real bullets. Real blood? Probably not. Not right now. So we decided to do something else. But I totally sympathise and I totally get it when, you know, people from Canada from all over the world, like are flying into Ukraine and joining the actual army.

 

Erwin  

And all the power to them now. 

 

Todor  

Yeah, exactly. 

 

Erwin  

I believe in freedom of choice. So

 

Todor  

Correct. Correct. Small Na, it’s like you have to decide like, this is my fight. This is not my fight. Right. That means totally.

 

Erwin  

I probably be a liability. No one want to be in my unit.

 

Todor  

Oh, you’ll be surprised.

 

Erwin  

All right. So Todor, you mentioned that you start investing in townhouses in Hamilton was it?

 

Todor  

Yeah, yeah. Actually, my first investment was townhouse row house on Berkeley and parliament in downtown Toronto. Okay, that is where I started back in 1995. 

 

Erwin  

Good time to start.

 

Todor  

Right. Yeah, I had that unit for about a year and I decided that that is not getting me rich quickly.

 

Erwin  

What do you pay for? What do you pay for?

 

Todor  

I don’t know. 120, 110, 95, Maybe?

 

Erwin  

Somewhere around there. Somewhere between 95 to 120.

 

Todor  

Exactly. That’s where? Yes. Okay, what do I know? I remember where the downpayment came from? came from my credit cards. I bought that on my credit card. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, if folks don’t understand that this is not financial advice. I don’t know what will tell them it is. What was a new construction, or?

 

Todor  

No, no, an older an older building that was sitting empty. It was part of six townhouse row houses. Very, very old, like one of the first like, I mean, one of the old buildings in Toronto, like

 

Erwin  

18 Something build them. 

 

Todor  

Correct. Correct. 

 

Erwin  

Oh, so well over 100 years? 

 

Todor  

Correct? Correct. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, you buy on a credit card, okay,

 

Todor  

I bought it in 1995. My son was just a baby. That’s how I remember. And I had tenants and I had tenants from hell and I had good tenants and then tenant from hell again, and did some renovations again on my credit card. And then after a year of, you know, income expenses, income expenses, paying off credit cards and going on an extra vacation because now we are rich property owners, so why not, you know, go on a nice, big vacation and seeing that actually, we’re not making any money from this. In one year. I got discouraged and I said, Well, this is not working and, and sold it, probably made a little bit of money. Ironically, this was probably about six months before the market started taking off. But I sold it just before the market started taking off. I decided like real estate is not good. It’s not working.

 

Erwin  

Right because 95 is playing on the way up after the 1989 crash. Yeah, I think people need to remember that too. 

 

Todor  

They made a little bit of money like probably, I don’t know. 5k 10k like whatever

 

Erwin  

You want, I guess what it’s worth today.

 

Todor  

It doesn’t even exist anymore.

 

Erwin  

Developer got to it?

 

Todor  

A few years after I sold it, somebody bought all six, and demolish them. And it’s sitting like the parking lot since the corner of Yeah, it’s been land banking, right. So somebody bought

 

Erwin  

areas, someone wanted a parking lot over having tenant six tenants. 

 

Todor  

Correct. So it’s like, right on Berkeley and parliament,

 

Erwin  

Can you blame the investor for wanting your parking lot over having six tenants?

 

Todor  

You know what like this, this leads to, you know, it’s a good example for another people saying this, like, why condos are expensive, or condos are expensive, because the only people that are able to build condos are people that bought land 30, 40 50 years ago, and that land was sitting as parking lots. And now you’re putting up a building, like trying to buy the land and build today, he can’t paint with it. So this is this is how so like a condo building lifecycle. From the moment it starts to the moment it’s finished is really 30, 40 years in some cases. Like think about that. It doesn’t start from the moment you give your deposits to buy a condo. And four years later, you have a unit. No, it started so many years prior to that.

 

Erwin  

So as we were before we were recording, we talked about townhouse versus a condo because you have pretty decent experience in both areas.

 

Todor  

Townhouses, student rentals, condos? Yes.

 

Erwin  

And you had a number of townhouses. Am I right? True, wait, so do 95 and then your exit 96-97. 

 

Todor  

96 97. And then for seven, eight years, I didn’t do anything because I was basically, like, when you think about 9596, that is just before the internet. Like we didn’t have computers back in those days, we didn’t have internet before a those days, the only thing that you can get on real estate is possibly you go to one of those bookstores and buy one or two books on real estate. That’s it. Like this is how limited the information was back in those days

 

Erwin  

Versus overload today,

 

Todor  

There were no clubs, there were no no, no podcast meetings, podcasts, like you couldn’t really get information.

 

Erwin  

So you know, you didn’t have a mentor, either No, or no,

 

Todor  

Like, if you don’t know anybody, right? Like you, you’re basically, your real estate agent tells us like, Oh, I think this is a good idea. You know, why don’t you buy it? And it’s like, Okay, how much can I charge for this? How much can I charge for that unit and how much is the I mean, the basics are still the same. It’s just that the information that is so much so easily available now, was not there, back in those days. So for seven, eight years, I was thinking like, Ah, this real estate thing doesn’t work. This just stupid. And you know, I want to be out of this.

 

Erwin  

Is that parking lot still there?

 

Todor  

If I was, I mean, I probably would have made the same mistakes. But nowadays, everybody tells you like real estate is not a quick game. Now, you can make a lot of money by buying and selling quickly, you can quote, but then then you have to look for those opportunities. But when you buy a house that is going to appreciate then you better be in it for 5,6,7,8 years, more than 10 years, 15 years, whatever the case is, right? So I just didn’t have the knowledge of the the basics even right, a success for seven, eight years, like I didn’t do anything, and then I joined REIN, and then REIN basically got me thinking about educating myself and meeting other people. And, you know, the, what Don Campbell was saying is like, it should be easy. You know, it’s not simple, but it should be easier. It’s like, you know, you have to set it up in a way that you don’t really think about it too much and, and you eliminate the pain.

 

Erwin  

Less mistakes means less pain.

 

Todor  

Less mistakes means less pain, right? And then just do it as a business. So when you start thinking about investing as a business, then then you look at opportunities in a different way. And also you adjust your expectations. So you don’t have the expectations like oh, I bought a real estate property and now I’m just gonna walk talk and proud of mine like me like a millionaire now, right? Like, no, it doesn’t work that way. It takes like long time. You go through ups and downs emotionally, mentally, and so it changes you right, like you need to change in order to meet the future that you are projecting for yourself.

 

Erwin  

Definitely. We have to be patient. Yeah. And it’s missing from a lot of places. A lot of people often what was a lot of, you know, HGTV was terrible for that. Yeah, you can do a flip in an hour watching an hour TV show. Yeah. I like HGTV. So, but I think they unintentionally some people walked away with unrealistic expectations. But when I remember early days, Don Campbell would teach us you know, run your numbers. On 3% appreciation, that’s right, right, because 3% appreciation works up to 15% Return assuming your down payments 20%. That’s right. All right. And like, we’re going to beat that.

 

Todor  

And everything else is cherry on the top. 

 

Erwin  

Everything else is moving. 

 

Todor  

We know in our in our market this year is like humongous, humongous, but in world’s real estate, you know, if you look at some European countries, and I don’t know, like, I don’t really have experience anywhere else, but they don’t have the appreciation that we have. Ireland, England. So three 4% 2% appreciation 0% appreciation for peers, is this is quite normal. So, you know, you train like an athlete, right? Like, like real estate in any business, like you have to change in order to get the results that you don’t have today. If you want bigger results, you have to change who you are, how you think, what you’re capable of, like he can he can otherwise think you’re gonna get what you get. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, I think it’s again, it’s lost. And along the way somewhere, like, if you want to win anything, you’re gonna have to show up, show up prepared. Right? That’s right. Nice thing about real estate is there’s plenty for everybody, in my opinion. And like, you’re saying, well, back then there wasn’t much to consume in terms of quality education. Today, it’s like, you have to be good at choosing what is good education, because there’s so much out there.

 

Todor  

Right? If you’re being strategic about it, I’m totally guilty of what I’m gonna say. But you know, I think we all humans, we complain, it’s like, how come I have this, and I don’t have that, and so and so has this and I want to get that. And I’m like, I want to be like Elon Musk, you know, well, nothing is stopping me to be like Elon Musk is the only person that is stopping me is me. It’s like, I don’t think like him, I don’t have his education. I don’t have his abilities, his liabilities,

 

Erwin  

Photographic memory, too,

 

Todor  

Right? Let’s let’s just like okay, no, I want to buy I want to buy another million dollar worth of properties. But it’s like, too expensive right now. And the prices are this and but then people are still doing deals. The fact that you are not in the deal making group is because you didn’t invite yourself there. And you didn’t invite yourself there because you didn’t see the opportunity. And you didn’t see the opportunities because you’re lacking something, figured out what you’re lacking, and get it and then you’re gonna be in the group that is making a million dollar deal. Is just that simple.

 

Erwin  

I’ll start off. I think the first step is to have an open mind, because I’m sure you run into this as well, for someone will tell you debt is bad. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So like, right there is like, Oh, okay. You obviously know everything. So how rich are you?

 

Todor  

Right, right. No, I, you know, the more years past and the more years I’m in this business, the more I realised how little I actually know about real estate. Real estate is like huge. There’s like so many different property types. And like, then you talk about like, Toronto, Ontario, Canada, world. There’s like real estate opportunities all over the world that we don’t even know. 

 

Erwin  

I’ll even take us back up there. And also all there’s spending more time these days on economics and history, because I’m interested in what drives asset values. Right? So that’s, that’s a humongous conversation.

 

Todor  

But even even in that, like you have one of the big drivers is emotions. Emotional. Oh, I like to own a piece of paradise in Aruba. Or you know, our friend Mike is calling me from Thailand. He moved to Thailand and he’s like, which makes very Mike Krastev odd Yeah. Thailand so yeah, he’s always there of last year Good for him. He bought he bought a Costco on the beach. And then kiss some way is the island.

 

Erwin  

Oh my god. I don’t even know how to properly Koh Samui.

 

Todor  

The city, I don’t know. But he bought this hostel on the beach. He has a little bit of a restaurant and nightlife stage scene where he’s DJing music and he says this is great. 

 

Erwin  

Even Instagram or something, I need to follow him. Yes.

 

Todor  

So he calls me up. And he goes like, oh, you know, you have to we’d like you have to we have to start the real estate company here. And we you know, we’re gonna be selling so many properties here for sale. And like Mike, you know, who are you going to sell to? He goes like, oh, Canadians are buying Americans are buying Russians are buying them like Mike. Okay, let’s let’s get serious now. How many Canadians are buying versus how many Americans versus how many Russians? He goes like, all Well, you’re right. Like it’s more The Russians, I’m like, Yes, that was before the war. 

 

Erwin  

But this geography then way closer,

 

Todor  

Exactly. And I’m like, how many Canadians do I know that are actually talking to me about buying something in Thailand, zero, like, I don’t want to start something different than I don’t know anything about. But at the same time, on the on the other side of the coin, I may be missing the greatest opportunity of my lifetime, because I don’t see the opportunity. Because I don’t know anything about continent. I don’t know anything about real estate in Thailand, I don’t know anything about vacation properties, you know, on the islands,

 

Erwin  

You can’t say the name of the city.

 

Todor  

So we’re always blind sign that in some areas, opportunities to watch, you know, get better than the get better at what you know, and what’s working. And then if you can expand later on. That’s fantastic. Right?

 

Erwin  

So talk about learning lessons. Mmm, a couple of years ago, we were talking about, I wish I just bought new construction condos in Toronto. Yeah, it was a conversation somewhere on that. Because at the time, you still own a couple of these correct, tougher, but actually, I didn’t mean to put words in your mouth. Explain your experience working with these townhouses in Hamilton.

 

Todor  

So the town’s is there were, you know, there were about Connerton 15 125. To buy really expensive mortgages were very easy to get with 5% or less, some people were actually pushing it and getting them for nothing for 0% down payment and good old days, you know, the good old days. So really, with, you know, 25 $30,000 on your credit cards, you could be buying five or six of those townhomes in in Hamilton. And then they needed some renovation paint, you know, carpet, this and that. And then you put tenants and tenants in Hamilton, for the most part, in my experience, were tough tenants difficult not paying rents and all kinds of issues, maybe because I was not that good as a property manager. But you know, it is what it is water under the bridge. And after a couple of years of doing that, I decided that this is too much work. I again, discovered student rentals in St. Catharines. By by an accident. I got a student rental I absolutely loved it loved the experience with dealing with the students and love, love the cashflow, because each house in St. Catharines at a time was paying me anywhere between 800 to $1,000 in cash flow per month, per month, per month. So when you have like three or four of those, like you really think that, you know he made it. But two, three years go by and again, like you started replacing roofs, you get like basements that are leaking things change with Brock University was building purpose built student residences that change the market. So I got out of Hamilton because I found more cashflow in St. Catharines. And then I decided to get out of St. Catharines because I discovered pre construction condos.

 

Erwin  

And you’re in either there. Or you didn’t?

 

Todor  

I had no idea. Okay, okay. I had no idea. Actually I wasn’t. I was at the real estate event hosted by this magazine. I can’t remember the name of

 

Erwin  

it just a magazine. That’s it crew magazine,

 

Todor  

Right. So I was just about to leave on day one or day two. And I see this guy sitting behind a desk with promoting condos. But he had like a little a little pluck up promoting student rental financing, financing for student rentals. And because I was interested in rentals that piqued my attention. So I went and met with Jerry and Jerry told me about this guy in Kitchener, who is a mortgage agent who has a way of getting better financing for student rentals. So we talked about that. And then I just out of politeness before I left. I said like oh, so what about this? Like, what do you do? So he’s the one that introduced me into pre construction condos and that world. So I met up with him after that. And that was the day when I basically decided okay, I’m done with rentals. Now I’m gonna do this.

 

Erwin  

So why the pivot? Because, you know, there’s this if it was this whole community that’s pursuing what you had a whole lot of cash.

 

Todor  

Right, right, right. You didn’t. Like I’m always I’m always trying to I guess like my whole life. I’ve always been trying to find the most efficient way to go from point A to point B.

 

Erwin  

And more cash flow does not always mean more efficient.

 

Todor  

No, no more cash flow is great. But you still have the responsibilities and you still have the tenants and you still have the risk of having an empty house. You still have the risk of something breaking in the middle of the night and you have to drive to Hamilton or St Catharines and in You’re replacing the roofs and replacing this and then every 6,7,8 months you have to you have the turnover new students, and you still isn’t active. So it’s like because you never know that if this perfect student is going to leave the room the way they found that, like now do you have to repaint it, you know, repainting a room is not an easy task. Because like, it’s either you have to do it, which means like a day of your time, we have to find somebody else to do it, I guess it’s not an act, it’s more passive is very active investment. So I’m always trying to make money easier. How can we make money easier, and pre construction condo is exactly that. Because all you have to do is you come in signed a contract, put your deposit, and then four years, you have an asset that is appreciating why it’s being built. And then you have no tenant. So it’s awesome. It’s almost like weird, because you have an investment, but nobody calls you and you don’t have to do any work for four years, and then you get the keys. And then once you get the keys, you have to decide, am I going to move into this unit? Am I going to rent it? Am I going to assign it? Am I going to sell it? Am I going to keep it for one year or for two years after I close on it, you know, you have to make these decisions. But basically, if you take a typical condo investment is let’s say seven years, four years is construction phase 75% of the time, you do absolutely nothing, no work is required, but the asset is appreciating, and then if you decide to hold it a little bit longer, which I would recommend 25% of the life of that investment. You have one or two tenants and they usually professional tenants downtime, professional mean professional professional job professionals, and you don’t hear from them their checks cash and lives good.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. But for the listener who doesn’t have context, get share with your SIR experience renting out to a Hamilton townhouse condo tenant versus renting your Toronto condo. They were all equal.

 

Todor  

I don’t want to be judgmental, but I am judgmental. We all judgmental people. I don’t think this is the only state show. So

 

Erwin  

If it was a job interview,

 

Todor  

we are not all equal. Exactly. I mean, you’re judging this candidate versus that candidate. 

 

Erwin  

I mean, this is an interesting one with the multiple, several $100,000 asset. Yeah, yeah. So so my opinion that’s more important than a job interview.

 

Todor  

The downtown the downtown tenant is condo tenant is Toronto, the Toronto is usually a young person with great education, great job, and you know, making good money. They don’t, they don’t cook at home. Or they don’t cook at home. Like it’s not it’s very, very typical to have a tenant in a brand new condo, and then they move out one or two years later, the labels and the manual are still in the oven. So you know, that’s that’s how they are a friend of mine, they take out to eat out, they don’t cook at home. So you know, they pretty much work at home, sit on the couch, watch TV, sleep, or go out with friends. So there is a lot less wear and tear on the unit.

 

Erwin  

Less than a student rental?

 

Todor  

That also depends on what type of student rental you have. As you know, some of the cheaper student rentals are beat up because you know, you, you you you have to lower your standards in order to get tenants but you have like a prime if you have a prime prime prime student rental, then you get the top of the crop

 

Erwin  

You say okay, are you talking about like a condo Toronto condo as well for student rental or No?

 

Todor  

I don’t have experience with Toronto condos.

 

Erwin  

For students and for students. I hear about it. I think it’s in the news as well, like a lot of international students are in Toronto, and they always need a place to stay.

 

Todor  

I never had tenants like that. So I can’t really comment. But yeah, so usually a single tenant professional, or a young couple, boyfriend, girlfriend professional, and you have very, very little issues, if anything at all, versus what my experience was in Hamilton, you know, back in the day, and you know, constant money issues, breakups, you know, fortunately, the tenant profile in Hamilton, a lot of people are on some type of social assistance. And and that’s the pool that you have to pick your tenants. And it was, you know, one issue after the other. It’s just different. I mean, it is the reality of situation. Again, we’re comparing. It’s not a fair comparison because you’re comparing Hamilton in the Early 2000s to Toronto of you know, late 2020.

 

Erwin  

True. And then I’ll add my own experience that that’s why I liked student rentals instead. Because my tenants are typically rich kids. Correct. So they were a better tenant profile than what you would get locally. Right? Right, right, because my orange student tenants are typically from out of town. Their parents have budgeted for this expense. And, yeah, again, they just, they have way more money typically than your typical local restaurant. So, back in the day, you and I received a lot of education around why new construction was bad. Right? Is that accurate? Um, is it bad to be a speculator?

 

Todor  

No, I don’t remember it like that.

 

Erwin  

Because I almost feel like a speculator when I buy something and hold it. Almost all my money is made through appreciation.

 

Todor  

You you sit in a room and our listening is different for every person, right? Like you listen, we listen to the same thing. And you hear one thing, and I hear something completely different. I remember a guy who’s a real estate agent member who did exactly the opposite. He bought pre construction townhomes. And within six months, he was able to make $100,000 from four townhomes. So, and I’m like, How come? I didn’t know about that? You know, but I don’t I don’t necessarily put the blame on the network and say, How come you didn’t tell me about this? You know, it’s like I said, like real estate is such a vast ocean, that, you know, you can only talk about a certain like, you cannot cover everything. You know, especially when you want to make it educational, and you want to focus the group on to something actionable? No, I do remember that there was some, some type of ridicule of people lining around the corner for condos. Rich, right. And it’s just, it’s just, you know, it just didn’t, I guess it didn’t fit the formula of what they were teaching about how to evaluate a property because you cannot evaluate appreciation. You know, it just like it happens, it doesn’t happen, like nobody knows. And it is true today, it’s always been true. So what I discovered with experiences, that the safe and proper way of investing after a while is not enough for you. And if you’re a little bit more adventurous like I am, then you’re gonna try to do something else. And then here, you’re supported, because, you know, they’re telling you how to do things. And when you start to, to basically go on your own way, like there is no support, you have to discover things. So you start making mistakes. So student rentals, definitely, I didn’t have anybody to talk to you not in the same way that you know, the hotel houses in Hamilton were the way that they were teaching us how to invest. It was great to get me started, and then I wanted to do something else, and then you want to do something else. And then you venture into a territory that, you know, in the metaphor of a jungle is like anything could happen. So you take some you take some more risks, but then you have bigger rewards. So not always the case. Not always the case. Yeah, exactly. So that’s why I, you know, from looking back in the last, you know, 15,20 years, you know, I’m grateful for everything. And, you know, mostly grateful to myself and doing things the way that I wanted to do them.

 

Erwin  

It’s making headlines these days, some projects are not being completed. I’m falling Hamilton and Burlington stories. A friend of mine, he bought his in August, new construction. Yeah, it’s just not built yet. And then the builder sent them an email and said, You’re cancelled, because it’s gone up too much. Yeah, that was funny thing was then he called and he said, and then negotiate and like, oh, okay, if you pay 6%, five, 6% more than you can keep it. And then he asked me there is my thoughts like, inflation has gone up more than five 6% doesn’t sound bad. It’s an issue in Toronto, or products not getting built.

 

Todor  

When it started happening. Two, three years ago, we were saying all it’s the it’s the one offs, it’s the builders that are ready to completely destroy their reputation. Because they will not be able to build anything else in the city after that. 

 

Erwin  

And as small ones, small ones, no, it’s not like a try Dell or something. 

 

Todor  

Try to Miami, you know, the big the big companies, the big builders, like will not be able to they will never destroy their company or their reputation by doing something like that. That’s what we were saying two years ago, one year ago. Now, I don’t want to say it’s happening more often, but because it’s not, it’s happened more than in the last three years. You But the you know, look at the the craziness of the world that we live in the prices in the grocery store. You know, last Sunday, we went to play golf at Royal Ontario with me and my daughter and my son, three of us. We were playing with another family. So I went up to pay for us three, and it was $357 we to play golf. And then we spent $85 On three burgers, three Cokes, two orders, and onion rings at five bucks. So that golf day on Sunday, when we started playing, it was three degrees. Okay. There was almost nobody else on the golf course. Almost nobody else it was just the US. So forget about like the summer, the spring specials, the late fall specials know, though, they’re charging you full price from day one. So $450 for the three of us to play golf. Okay. So we ended up the golf round, we had a great time. And I called the golf superintendent, because he’s a friend of mine. And I said, Tony, like what the hell? I just paid $450 to play golf with me and my two kids. Like what’s going on? He goes, buddy, last year, I was buying fertiliser a bag for $38. This year, I’m paying $62 For the same bag. So translate this now into a builder who needs to buy the build, like a big building? And it takes four years to do that is like how do you do that? Like, how do you cost calculates your end cause here four years in advance,

 

Erwin  

let alone actually get all your supplies that you need. 

 

Todor  

So So we kind of like have to start believing them. It’s they’re not, they’re not charging you an extra $100,000. Because this is what’s happening. A lot of people, not a lot of people, but some people are getting letters from a builder. So saying, Look, your unit that you bought for 450 is worth about 650. Now, you have two options. One, you cancel, two, we adjust the price to 550. So basically split the appreciation in half, and people are up in arms. Because they’re they you feel that they’re stealing from your appreciation, it may be opportunistic on the builder side, but at the same time, it also may be true is that if they don’t get more money, they’re not going to be able to finish the projects that are going on chance they’re gonna cancel out anyway. And they’re going to resell it the next day to a willing buyer. So that’s the reality. That’s that’s the reality of doing something long term in inflationary times.

 

Erwin  

I’m glad I hold a lot of real estate.

 

Todor  

A lot of wanted to share a couple of things that I kind of like mental notes that I was making to myself, like, lessons that I was learning during my time helping the Ukrainian refugees. And these are the four lessons that I brought to myself. Yeah, down to four. Yeah, four. It’s not a complete list. And it’s not, it’s just my list. One is you don’t have the last moment. The two is, are you prepared for the real plan B. Three is most people are not ready mentally, and everything else that stems from that mental preparedness to help you in a meaningful way, in a time of personal struggle. And number four, is snap your fingers. And we’re still in mediaeval times. And I just want to if you have a few minutes on explain this, what I heard from every single person in Ukraine that we were calling and, you know, relatives or relatives and was like, like, Get out now get out now. They’re like, No, I’m just gonna wait a little bit more. It’s like, it’s not it’s not close to us, you know, it’s probably not gonna come here. And and they are waiting and waiting until the last moment. Like, and I’m thinking is like, look at us humans. Like we’re always waiting until the last moment. You know, it’s like it’s inside our DNA. You know, I’m not gonna go for that medical exam. It’s like, I’m gonna call my doctor but not today next week, like things that that are important for us for our own safety for our own life. Sometimes, like, we don’t want to deal with that. I’m just gonna go and wait until the last moment. And then the one hour later, you’re surrounded by tanks and bombs are falling on you. You don’t have the last moment that is no Luxury that you have. The last moment is not for you. The last moment is, it’s not yours. So you always have to, like whatever you decide to if you decide to stay in fight like that’s your that’s your decision. But if you decide to leave, because it’s war, like, don’t wait until the last moment, like get out a day, early a week, early a month early is better than the last moment because so many people get stuck on, for example, one of our friends here in Toronto, we’ve been begging her to get her mom out of her son and her sister. And she’s like, Oh, they don’t want to go. And Natalia was like, let me call them. We have an apartment ready for them, we have saved for them, they just have to come like we got everything for them. And they’re like, oh, no, no, no, they’re okay. There will be okay, there’ll be Cara, and her sister got killed two days ago. Just this is real. Are you prepared for the real plan B, you know, because we talk about like how prepared we are. This goes to, again, real estate and holdings and money and you know, personal wealth. And you see these people crossing the border with, you know, a mother with two kids, and just the small carry on and a backpack. That’s it, that’s all this in 25 euros in your pocket, that’s all they got. And then a week later, the war really moves to the area and the apartment is destroyed, the car is destroyed, Kuzmin is killed, you have nothing, you have nothing to go back to you have nothing you have nothing, you have nothing you have nothing. Like how do you go back from that, and people do, people do. But the point is, like, you know, because you know, we’re building something, right, you’re building a real estate portfolio, you’re building your life, you’re you you’re doing it because you want safety. That’s what you want. You want safety you want is your life, you want more freedom for you, for your kids. Now, and this is why also, back to real estate, this is why a lot of people are coming to Canada, because Canada is seen as this almost like islands of safety. We’re protected by two oceans, United States and the North Pole. We’re an island, a very big island, but we are an island of safety. I cannot get to Canada. Unless you cannot come to Canada unless you’re approved. It’s very different. It’s very different than Europe. Yes, you can walk to Europe, from Afghanistan, people do today. And to open up a map and see how far Afghanistan is from Europe. You can walk to Europe, from India, you can walk from Europe to from China, you can walk to Europe from you can walk, you know, you can walk to Canada. So we are protected. And this is why people are coming here. This is why real estate here just keeps on going up and people from all over the world. They want to be here. And because it’s nice, it’s new, its infrastructure. This is why the prices are where they are. So what is the real plan B for people? That’s a very, very difficult question. I don’t have the answer. Because I’m, I’m thinking in my mind is like how do you get prepared? How do you make sure that what you have for most of it are some of it will be available to you in a time of disaster? Disaster Planning. That’s what we’re talking about here, right? different scenarios. I don’t have an idea. I mean, I have some ideas. But so far, nothing’s working, right? That I was thinking is like, Oh, I’m just gonna go and buy a piece of land somewhere. So I can grow things. And then I’m gonna buy a bunch of like arms, you know, machine guns. And I’m thinking is like, yeah, I don’t think so. If this is really valuable, and people are hungry, overwhelmed me, like who would be the next victim? It will be me. So So what do you what do you take from this life in a time of disaster, what I’m also finding through our, you know, fundraising work, but also with the Ukrainian community, and the Ukrainian refugees, and the dynamics between people that I see is how most of us I think, in the back of my mind, I own a backup in the back of our minds, like you’re always thinking that somebody else is there to help you. And then in a time of Rioni, like you find out that they will give you just a little bit more time that they give their Facebook feed. Like they’ll scroll through you, they’ll probably pay attention to you for a second or a minute or a day. And then everybody goes on with their life. And that’s how we are right. So like know that that most people mentally and in many other ways, are not going to be able to help you or pay attention to you in a time of personal struggle. So again, help yourself before other people help you. And the last thing is like we’re still in mediaeval times, not nothing’s changed. To, like Molotov cocktails and people killing each other, and like, it’s brutal, it is absolutely brutal what we are still capable of doing to each other. And it’s, it all goes through our belief system, you know how we see each other as enemies, and how we’re still making somebody else’s wrong on something, and then that spins into all kinds of stories and makes a monster out of you. And, you know, monsters and victims like mediaeval stupidity in the middle of Europe. It’s unbelievable. It’s unbelievable. But at the same time, you know, I flew back to Toronto, we landed in Toronto got into a taxi. And I’m thinking like, this is nice, wide roads, clean, organised, planned, like when you like, because we were landing during a daytime. So I took a really nice video of the plane, approaching Toronto and making a turn over Toronto. And you see everything, like manicured like, everything is like, nice. And I’m like, it hit me and I’m like, okay, I get it. I get why people want to come here, even though our prices are very expensive. And even though, you know, life is not easy, sometimes for some for a lot of people. And even though like the weekend comes and like what are we going to do, and there’s nothing to do really like Muskoka, it’s far this that, like when you’re in Europe, things are so much closer, and so many interesting things to do, that I miss here. But at the same time, like working here, living here, creating life here for us, for clients, for everybody else, it’s very rewarding. It’s very easy. And easier. It’s fantastic.

 

Erwin  

I think we’ll leave it there. Thank you, Todor for coming in. 

 

Todor  

My pleasure. 

 

Erwin  

Glad you’re safe in the thanks. Oh, before we go away, tell us about your charity. Where can people find out about it?

 

Todor  

So, we have a GoFundMe campaign on GoFundMe. And it’s Ukrainian humanitarian emergency relief. It’s a nonprofit, every single cent of every single dollar goes directly from the bank directly into medicine, or foods or transportation, or the items for the daily life of those refugees that need it in Varna, Bulgaria, we already we have raised about $68,000. So far, we spent pretty much all of it. We are now in a big drive to raise more money. And as soon as we do, we open up a school for Ukrainian kids. So we opened up, we’re going to open up a donation centre environment, so people can donate clothing and all kinds of stuff. So we’re still doing a lot of work. I’m planning to go back in about, I don’t know, it’s gonna be anytime between 10 days from now and a month from now. And, yeah, that’s entirely what I’m focusing on right now. And then working people, and but but I also have to say that you know, that you don’t wake up one day, and you are like that, right? I mean, I’ve watched you with your brigade for the Thanksgiving dinners, like, you know, the pictures with the tables and all the preparations like, you know, these things inspire you, they are seeds that are planted in, you know, they were planted in my mind, and then you watch other things. And then it’s like, okay, I want to do this, and I want to do that. But now I’m busy with this, and then all of a sudden, boom. So I didn’t, I didn’t just like I’m the product. And I think we all are the product of the people that were surrounded. So thank you for the great work that you’ve been doing for for years now. You know, collecting, donating, raising, helping, you know, you are my example, you know, you are the the leader that that I’m following.

 

Erwin  

There are many people before me. That’s right. And then to add to your point about, like, you have to do it for yourself. we pivoted away from from fundraising and focusing more on this. In our experience, it was easier just to work on our businesses to create more value, make more money for the business, and then we were able to donate, right, that was an easier path and then fundraising, in our experience.

 

Todor  

That is an amazing, amazing point. Because, again, I’m new to fundraising. 

 

Erwin  

It’s hard. 

 

Todor  

I’m not even thinking that I’m in fundraising. I’m not in fundraising. It’s just that we, you know, we I was I was you know, able to go to the bank and put $30,000 on the day and we left and we said like we’re going with our money. And then people started like Okay, can I contribute and started sending e-transfers. And then a friend of mine says, like, oh, you know, Rihanna, she says, like, I can create a GoFundMe page for you. I’m like, okay, and she did all of the work. Like I actually logged on to the GoFundMe campaign. For the first time, two days ago, after we came back, the time when we were there, I had no time. So she was managing all of that. It was all based on trust. And still is funny enough, I called a friend of mine, who’s who’s the president of a Hospital Foundation yesterday. And I said to her, I says, like, like, how do I, how do I grow this bigger? How do I do this in a much bigger way? Like I’m talking about, like, we have a goal to reach $100,000 Now with this campaign, but then my next immediate goal is $1 million. And then the goal after that would be like $10 million, right? And things like, Okay, this is crazy now. So fundraising is a job. And it’s not a job I want to have, I don’t want to be seen as a fundraiser. I just want to I just want to help. So I appealed to people to help. And, you know, with the help with people like yourself, and so many other individuals that contributed, we can make the lives of few people a little better. But at some point, like, you’re right, like, at some point, I have to come back from all of this, and focus on me, my work, my family, because it’s let me just say, I hope this war ends very soon.

 

Erwin  

I think we all would like that. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

And where can, people follow you on social media for your personal journey?

 

Todor  

Um, I don’t have the links. Instagram, I can send that to you if you can include it. Somehow. Instagram has todor underscore, CT real T point, boss, that’s Instagram. Oh, that’s my new Instagram. Before before?

 

Erwin  

What would your Facebook your Facebook’s easier? And I’ll have all the links in the show notes. 

 

Todor  

Few of us with the same name. But you know, they’ll recognise me.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, and I noticed it was largely the real estate community that supported you as well. Well, like Susan White past, like, was one that informed me like your Twitter left the country like, what is the UK? No, it’s not Ukrainian. He’s on his way over. And he is actually there right now.

 

Todor  

It is true, like a lot of people support us. And it was very heartwarming to see that. It was a great feeling. It was it was like, You know what, like, I’m gonna say this, and I don’t know if it’s gonna sound appropriate or not. But it’s, it’s a great feeling to spend somebody else’s money on something that matters. And you have full control of that, like, not full control in terms of like you’re controlling it, but you’re the decision maker. And I was not even the decision maker. Like, it’s the moment that decides, like, you need you need. You have, we have a woman that came from Morocco, from with her elderly father, and his blood pressures, like the guy is like about to have a stroke, like so high, because they lived in a basement for three weeks. And she says like when a basement like mouldy and wet basement with no food, or just bread. And after three weeks when they got out, and it was a night and she says we’ve never seen a night skies like this, it was full of stars, because everything was destroyed, and there was no light pollution, like there was no light on the street. So you see the sky. And anyways, they arrived. And the guy doesn’t have a blood pressure monitor, he doesn’t have blood pressure medication. She doesn’t have any clothes, like nothing like that. So we just go and buy these things. You know, it’s like, some of it is my money. Some of it is like most of it is money from people like you, you know, and it’s to be able to do that for another person completely outside of any official organisation or, like it’s not even my job. And I don’t even know how to do it. And I don’t know even how to do it properly. But like, how do you do it properly. You have a human in front of you and they need something and you can buy it so you just go and buy it and say here. That’s for you. That’s all!

 

Erwin  

Amazing, your work Todor , I wish more people like you.

 

Todor  

Thank you Erwin. 

 

Erwin  

Thanks again for coming on the show.

 

Todor  

My pleasure.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cashflow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more but secure for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

To Follow Todor:

FB: https://www.facebook.com/todor.yordanov.real.estate/

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/todoryordanov/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/todor_cityrealtypointboss/

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

How To Invest In Florida Real Estate in 2022 With Ryan Poole

Do you like researching stocks and real estate? 

I personally love it. I don’t know why and it’s not always narrowly focused research because ever since I got back into Stocks and Stock Hacking, I’ve been looking at world economics even more. 

I’m also reading a bit about the history of money and economic cycles to learn from history as I want to be prepared if history repeats itself. Some may call me a conspiracy theorist or overly anxious, but I like being prepared.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Am I always right? Heck no, but I’ll admit when I’m wrong, take responsibility, learn from it and course correct.  But as always, I prefer to be over-prepared rather than under-prepared.

I read something recently that I found particularly disturbing and further fed my protectiveness of my daughter.  As reported in the Globe and Mail, nearly 1 in 3 students in a 2018 survey from my alma mater, Western University, were sexually assaulted, 10% higher than the Ontario University average.

Then yesterday, while driving the kids to a kickboxing class, I explained how many have been touched inappropriately at University. That’s part of the reason the kids are in martial arts 4X per week, to tell bullies, “No, don’t touch me,” and try to get away and tell an adult or teacher. If they can’t get away or find help, give one final warning and then exercise their training.

There are other fundamental problems globally, including one’s ability to retire comfortably. CIBC just published survey results that only 52% of Canadians are confident in their financial security to retire.  Thankfully, that’s our specialty here at iWIN Real Estate. 

Thanks to the most recent run-up, I’ve been having more conversations than ever with clients regarding their imminent early retirement from their day jobs, some have already retired in the last six months, and I have a couple more coming this year.

The market is also dipping, so the timing couldn’t be better for anything looking to get started.

I’m no financial advisor, but I have dozens and dozens of clients who have increased their net worth by millions and millions of dollars by buying, renovating, renting and holding cash-flowing real estate. We’re always looking for more hard-working Canadians to help.

As such, we’re back to in-person for many of our networking and training opportunities. Most are free, and those who subscribe to our email newsletter will be informed when registrations (which tend to fill up quickly), are available. 

To get our emails, simply go to https://www.truthaboutrealestateinvesting.ca/, fill in your name and email on the right side, and you’re good to go!

How To Invest In Florida Real Estate in 2022 With Ryan Poole

On to this week’s show!  

We have Ryan Poole, who’s not your average Florida Realtor with 24 years of experience. 

He’s on the show today to share his experience during the housing bubble and the financial/credit crisis of 2007/08, including buying portfolios of distressed properties for cents on the dollar, how current times are different, what specific investments and who are these Florida buyers are. 

We talk about the local amenities, weather, hurricane preparedness, and foreign buyer financing. That’s right, we Canadians are the evil foreign buyers this time, lol. 

As mentioned, Ryan is not your typical Realtor; he’s the Founder and CEO of a tech startup called Realtrade.io, a marketplace for Realtors and real estate. Kind of like Facebook and Realtor MLS in one. I’ll let Ryan explain it.

Anyways, Ryan’s a good guy, and I learned a ton about investing in Florida from a local 24-year real estate veteran. I hope you do too. 

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Greetings real estate investors and friends. Welcome to another episode The truth about real estate investing show this is Erwin Szeto. Small confession. I really like researching stocks and real estate. I personally love it. I got to the office early and make coffee. And as diving right in this stuff. I don’t know why. And I’m not always narrowly focused actually like to look, ever since I got into stocks and stock hacking. I’ve been looking at the world more in terms of economics, and I’m reading a bit around history of money and economic cycles, which goes back beyond past 300 years. I’m even reading about Chinese history and their economic cycles, because my plan is to learn from history. So should it repeat itself, I will be prepared. And along the way of in the middle of researching muscle taking action. Some may call me a conspiracy theorist, you know, all this talk about resets. It’s not new to me now. Again, some people might call me a conspiracy theorist, or I’m just overly anxious, but I like being prepared. Am I always right? No. But when I’m wrong, I’ll take responsibility. Learn from it, of course correct. But I do prefer to be over prepared. It’s actually benefited my family, my clients quite well. What I read recently, I found particularly disturbing is that only further further feeds my overprotectiveness of my daughter, as reported by Globe and Mail, nearly one in three students in a 2018 survey from my alma mater. So where I went to university, it was called The University of Western Ontario back then now it’s called Western University, I believe. Anyways, when three reported just under one with one and three were reported they were sexually assaulted. And that statistic is 10% higher than the Ontario university average. I’m obviously a bit disappointed. Again, being a productive father of a daughter, my imagination runs.

 

Erwin  

Usain Bolt was a hamster on a hamster wheel. That’s how my That’s how fast my brain runs. When on stuff, I tend to consume information and then I take action from it. Or I completely ignore it because I can’t change everything in the world. But I’ll action and what I can do so yesterday, so the same day, yesterday, while after reading the article, I was driving my kids and myself to kickboxing class, I take kickboxing class as well. I was explaining to them how, how many people have been touched inappropriately at university. And that’s part of the reason why I take my kids to keep martial arts. So I’m explained to them. People University, good number of them are touched inappropriately. And that’s part of the reason why they’re my kids are going into martial arts four times a week. That’s some questions. I tell them if someone bullies them, which include inappropriate touching, I tell them, No, you tell them loudly. No, don’t touch me. Try to get away. Running is the best defence, tell an adult or a teacher that they can’t get away or find help give one final warning, and then to exercise their training. I’m not giving you advice. I’m just what I’m telling my kids. And I fully support whatever repercussions come. My kids are friendly people. They don’t want to hurt people, but they will have to defend themselves. Because I won’t always be there. That’s why they’re doing all this training. There are other real problems in the world, including one’s ability to retire. I was reading an article that was talking about a CIBC they just published results results. And those survey results shared that 52% of Canadians are confident in their financial security to retire only 2%. Only half. So if that’s a problem for any of you out there. Thankfully, that’s our specialty here at i o in real estate, thanks to the most recent run up in prices. I’ve been having more and more conversations with our clients regarding their imminent retirement or they’ve actually already retired, retiring from their day jobs. Some have already retired in the last six months. And I have a couple more coming this week this year. You know, some of them took my advice, some of them were playing to sell. And one of my clients actually nailed the time perfectly. Based on our advice. I was based on the readings that was available out there. My suggestion to her was to sell in early in the year if her plan was to sell in the next year or two. I told her you should sell early in 2022. She did. And then I texted her yesterday, if she were to sell that same house today, that has to be worth about $100,000 less. So my client pocketed an extra 100 100,000 She’s of course very happy, so as to mention so along that same line of thought the market is currently dipping as expected. And the timing can be better for anyone who’s looking to learn DMS and real estate or get started or even just buy the dip and I’m no financial adviser, but I have dozens and dozens of clients who have increased their net worth by millions and millions of dollars buying, renovating, renting and holding cashflow, real estate, cash flowing Real Estate and we’re always looking for more hardworking Canadians to help understand all so that we introduce all our clients to the same people that we work with, to make their investing experience as easy as possible, including property management. So folks can get back to their day job and their families, which is really their priorities. Real estate investing to me is largely a side hustle. And I believe that’s appropriate for most people, all the power to people who want to do it full time. It’s just in reality, that’s a small, very small population. So as such, we’re back to in person for many of our networking and training opportunities, training events, most are free, and those who subscribe to our email newsletter will be informed when registrations available, which they tend to fill up quickly, especially for in person, right, so we can’t have unlimited numbers like virtual to get on our email list. Simply go to www truth about real estate investing.ca, fill in your name and email on the right side of the web on the website. And you’re good to go. Also, you’ll find there on our website in our show notes. So for example of our of our guests, we have our contact their contact information there, and you’ll get them in your email as well. Once we have your email address, please enjoy. onto this week’s show. We have Ryan Poole back with us and who is not your average Florida realtor. He’s got 24 years experience. He’s on the show today to share his experience during the housing bubble crisis. What wasn’t a crisis at the time when the prices just went up like crazy, and then the eventual financial credit crisis of 2000 2008. So he shares his experience about the run up and also during the crash, including when they’re buying portfolios of distressed properties for cents on the dollar. Of course, I asked him, does he see the same thing happening right now? And he’ll share the answer to that he shares also what typical investments are for those and also who aren’t for the buyers beyond Canadians, which make up a certain percent of buyers in Florida, we actually have the majority. So Ryan actually shares his experience and the splits between who’s buying in Florida. We talked about local amenities weather, hurricane preparedness, foreign buyer financing. Can you tell? I’m curious, that’s why I’m asking all these questions.

 

Erwin  

That’s right. Oh, yeah. Again, foreign buyer and financing. Ryan says he’s got access to that you can make introductions. Because now as Canadians we turn the tables we are now the evil foreign buyers this time. Haha. As mentioned, Ryan is not your typical realtor. He’s an owner of a tech startup as well called Real trade.io. Both sorry, that’s the that’s the URL as well, real trade.io which is a marketplace for realtors and real estate. That’s kind of like a combination of Facebook and realtor MLS in one, but it’s owned and operated by Realtors meant for realtors. So it’s a lot more friendly that way. I’ll let Ryan explain it. He’ll explain it better than I will. Anyways, Ryan’s a good guy. And I learned a tonne about investing in Florida from a local 24 year veteran of real estate. I hope you enjoy it just as much as I did. Please enjoy the show. Hey, Ryan.

 

Ryan  

Good. Is that clear? Can you hear me better on this one? I think so. Hopefully stays good. You know, we’re working on this awesome. I don’t know if real trade went through this pretty amazing tech accelerator. There’s this community called 1909 here in South Florida. It’s like an incubator accelerator. And I went through the accelerator and then I actually worked out of the space here. It’s pretty exciting.

 

Erwin  

Oh, I was wondering what the space behind you is, it looks for, ya

 

Ryan  

know, it’s it’s like this, you know, accelerator incubator, a bunch of cool tech companies coming out of it, you know, so let me some really successful ones. There’s some companies here that already have like, you know, 20 to $50 million valuations. So, pretty cool to watch it all happen.

 

Erwin  

Can you show it real trades evaluation is?

 

Ryan  

Well, we’ve we’re working on some investment, but we’ve got it in the millions, you know, we got in the millions valuation right now. So, you know, it’s pretty exciting, you know, with everything that’s going on, but we’re just trying to build it, you know, build it up more, you know, to mean to, you know, take out still

 

Ryan  

started going, I mean, we got a whole different business model than they have. It’s like, which people really are gravitating, especially the agents, you know, because obviously a lot of agents don’t like Zillow, the way that their business model is set up. You know, they use the agents data’s against themselves. They make the agents you know, they just work hard to get those listings, take those photos, get the property for sale, and Zillow takes that data then then they make the agents bet against one another for the leads off their own listing.

 

Erwin  

Zillow is not big here, but I see like the Instagram social media posts where you can tell agents don’t like them.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, and while there well the worst part is like Zillow is now like becoming like a broker. So they’re literally like starting to cannibalise. They’re basically content creators, which are the agents, right, which are their listing agents. So it’s like, yeah, it’s nuts.

 

Erwin  

It’s the thing that I’ve seen in many businesses, for example, Costco where I shop a lot, you know, I see the Haagen Dazs ice cream bar for like, you know, 10 bucks, whatever it is. And then you see like the Kirkland ice cream bars for like six bucks. Right, exactly. And that’s where it’s intentional. Oh,

 

Ryan  

no, yeah, no, of course it is. I mean, they’re, you know, they’re over here. There’s people there I buy our programme, you know, basically blew up. But you know, they’re they’re trying to basically become the whole thing, right? Broker, they’re the title company, the mortgage company, they basically try to take over everything which you’re in real estate, real estate’s very local, you need that local knowledge boots on the ground, right to help facilitate the sale. So yeah, and that’s what we do real tribe, we really concentrate on the local agents and the local service providers, you know, allow them a chance to network with one another, you know, help facilitate the sale.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, so like a real estate commercial. They’re selling mortgages, they said entirely, it’s so it’s such a so easy, it’s entirely online. And I’m like, if I’m a first time homebuyer or a first time real estate investor, I’m probably pretty nervous. And I can use someone who knows what they’re talking about on the side of the conversation. Buttons and feel confident in my decisions.

 

Ryan  

Exactly. No, you do you need to have a pro right? Especially like the first couple times, like you said, so it’s still it’s still when you go to sell a home. I mean, you know, you didn’t you know, Miss value an asset or you do something wrong. I mean, it could cost you 10s of 1000s, or not hundreds of 1000s of dollars, you know, so it’s crazy. You definitely have a pro on your side for sure.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, we won’t get into that. There’s other things more interesting. So right, right. And when I asked you to come back on the show was twofold. You’re a fan of cryptocurrency, we’ll get into that later, we will get to that stuff. But before we were recording, I mentioned how there’s a whole bunch Canadians who are looking to diversify by vacation property somewhere warmer than Canada, because it is cold. Whatever people say it is colder than Florida. They don’t think anyone can. It’s cooler than Florida. I don’t think anyone can argue with me on that. some neat things that I like about Florida specifically for is, it seems like Miami may become like the Bitcoin capital of the world, potentially, maybe at least for America, I don’t know, you tell me better, because you’re least American, I don’t really know. I’m just a Canadian. But I just find it weird that I see a lot of Canadians who don’t have much more experience in real estate in Florida, by law in the US. And now they’re touting themselves as experts. So I thought I’d reach out to someone who actually, you know, have spent more than 18 months in Florida to tell me what it’s like to invest in Florida.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, just so you know, you know, my, over my 24 year career in real estate, you know, when the market crashed last time, you know, in Oh, eight, you know, I started a boutique asset management company called rsis. On management, where we basically help hedge funds and, you know, basically acquire assets from regional banks, they were buying non performing loans and distressed assets. So far as the investment side. Yeah, I’ve seen it all really helped these funds that make some of the biggest money I’ve ever seen being made in real estate was from like, oh, nine to 12 or 13. credible? Do they were buying these loans? Like they were buying distressed, distressed debt, you know, they’re buying non performing loans for like, 10 cents on the dollar, to do keep some of these for yourself? Yeah, I was able bobbum was the way that these things were set up, was like to even bid on those loan pools from these regional banks, like you needed to have like, you know, proof of funds of like, 20 to $50 for the bid on them. And they wouldn’t they would bid them all in one portfolio. Like one tranche. Do you know what I mean? Now that the cool thing about the fund that I had, like they would buy them, and then they spin them off, obviously, you know, ones and twos, but their goal is to maximise the returns. So they would usually they would see the property, you know, get the property back through deed lieu of foreclosure, if it was a note, they just go to the borrowers and go, Hey, you know, we’ll make this whole thing disappear. Like it never happened, you’re in foreclosure you’ll have on you know, you owe more than your house is worth, you know, worth half of what you bought it for, will forgive this whole debt and things like this purchase never happened. You just signed over the property to us. And that’s what they did.

 

Erwin  

The parallels between the run up now compared to Oh, 708. Yeah, so

 

Ryan  

I went through that whole I went through all of that, right. So no, it’s totally different, at least here in Florida. I don’t know how it is in other markets, obviously. But you know, here in Florida, the buyers that are buying here, I majority of them are cash. Right. So they have no mortgages. I mean, I mean, seriously,

 

Erwin  

the opposite of what it was before then. Got property?

 

Ryan  

Exactly. It was like I remember vividly, like, like I said about, oh, 708 You know, when teachers school teachers in Florida, were buying second investment properties, not their first their second one, you know, and then I was like, with no money down. No money down stated loans. That’s when I knew I was like, Man, this is crazy. And the developers at that time, they were giving cash back incentives. So the people would actually buy the house make money when they bought the house. Put no money down the you know, Were an interest only arm loan, negative and loan. And they were like, you know, cashflow positive. But of course, everything’s getting paid down to the backside of the house. The property. I was like, Man, this, this is crazy. I don’t know how long this can last literally, like, a few months later, but four months later, right, the peak of the, you know, the craziness is one that was that the negative amlaw. Like, I think that was like literally like the crater like you know the grenade that blew everything

 

Erwin  

  1. So I can explain negatively I’m alone. So basically,

Ryan  

you’re just paying, you’re going negative every single month. So your pain was set up a negative amortisation loan that like you never paid, the principal got added, kept increasing over the length of the loan. But you know, people were betting, so your payments were very, very low. But people were betting that the payments were like hardly anything, actually, then people were just betting that you know that the market was going to continue to go up, they could rent it out for six months to a year and have a good cash flow. And then to sell it in a year, right and then pay off their loan and still make this money. That to me was like, like I said, the grenade pretty much blew up the

 

Erwin  

market here. It’s like the investment on multiple levels of steroids. Yeah.

 

Ryan  

Yeah. And wouldn’t wouldn’t do and like I said, like doing the loan with no money down. So it’s just like, you know, and then they were buying

 

Erwin  

zero skin in the game. No skin in the game. cost you nothing.

 

Ryan  

The developer was going. Okay, so you’re buying this, this condo for $250,000? Right? With no money down. Okay, great. You’re gonna rent it out for 1500 $2,000 a month great. Your, your negative and loan is only, like 500 600 bucks. Your taxes are this, you’re gonna cashflow this, and then the developer would come in and go, hey, you need to furnish your place, right? Like you gotta you want to rent it out furnished, that’s where you’re gonna make the most, and then they would give them what’s called, you know, a decorator credit. And they’ve given $40,000 at closing back, dude, see them saying they would give him $40,000 Back at closing to decorate their unit to decorate their unit.

 

Erwin  

So everyone knew this was coming in short the market, right?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, I mean, that’s funny, every but people were piling on. I mean, I remember guys, like, I mean, I watched guys like five, five or six units like this, right? I mean, it was, it was crazy. That was at the very like, at the very peak that was like at the very peak, like that last six months to the developer started like, because they wanted to move all that inventory, right? They probably they probably saw it common. They probably saw something common. They’re like, we need to spin these units out.

 

Erwin  

Because someone’s buying this debt. So then what happened to these investors? Like what happened to the gentleman who had five, six units?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, so this is exactly what happens. The hedge fund guys in case so ironically, the guys that basically originated those loans, right? These guys were like Bear Stearns, guys, and, you know, those kind of guys that came up with these crafty way

 

Erwin  

we can bash them since they’re gone. So

 

Ryan  

they are they are gone, right? They’re the ones that like, created these instruments for them to do those loans. Ironically, when the market crashed those guys a lot of laughter Bear Stearns blew up, they went and then formed these other vulture funds that went and bought back the loan lenders at 10 cents on the dollar.

 

Erwin  

were way up and they made money on the way down. Yep.

 

Ryan  

They made it both ways. I know. It’s crazy. And

 

Erwin  

planning from the beginning.

 

Ryan  

was like, yeah, no, believe me, I got to see the inner workings of real estate just through this whole process. So like, you know, I’m trying to like learn from what I can hear, but I have my own, like reasons what I think the real estate market hears happening. And, you know, obviously, Florida is very hot, people want to move here. But there’s, there’s inflation happening, which is getting pushed into assets too. And it’s not so much like, oh, the prices of real estate are going up so much too. It’s like the price of the US dollar, you know, the value of the US dollar is coming down. And I mean, that’s happening too, as well.

 

Erwin  

So Serena, and some people don’t understand what happened after like, for example, so say someone had five, six properties, because, you know, ignorant Canadian here, there’s something about the state, you can just hand back your keys or like the situation you gave, they just walked away from their property. Like yeah, how was their credit affected?

 

Ryan  

See, that was the good thing is like the crazy thing is like these all these units needed to get moved out, right. So that’s why they got you know, they got gold at 10 cents on the dollar to these hedge funds, or we’re just buying up at huge bulk and that hedge funds didn’t want to foreclose on him. You know, they didn’t want to foreclose on the units because it costs more monies and attorneys fees to close to foreclose on them. So this is how these units got worked through. They would go to the borrowers and just be like, listen, just sign over the property to us. You know what I mean? Just sign it up. We won’t foreclose on you. You’ll won’t have any foreclosure on your record. You will have no deficiency judgement and just They literally like this purchase didn’t happen. Because, you know, they’re let’s do that 250 contest and the people have 250 you’re on the hook for 250,000, the condo is now worth 100 grand, the hedge funds bought that that $250,000 loan for 25 grand. So they’re still got like, they’re tripling their money, they’re like, you know, they’re tripling the money. So they’re going, okay, just sign it over to us. Matter of fact, and this is this is literally what happened most deals because I was doing this was they would go to the bar and go, Okay, we’re gonna give you five grand for you to sign over the property give you cash for keys, and they would give them five grand. So the borrower now like, they get five grand, and they hand over the property to the hedge fund, they have no foreclosure, the credits not crushed. And you know, they’ve made a mistake, right. And now the hedge funds now got the property now. So they brought they paid 25 into another into it for 30. Right, it’s worth let’s say it’s worth 100 They would go in putting some paint and carpet in the unit, right? Put it on the market for 100 grand. And now they’re, you know, like I said, like tripling their money today. Let’s see two deaths. What happened, man, that’s how everything got worked through down here in Florida, I think it was it was like the foreclosure capital, if you remember, oh, eight, or nine or 10

 

Erwin  

plots of places in the States.

 

Ryan  

But it was like, No, South Florida was a big one because a lot of people bought him as investment property. Yeah, that was investment property. So this time around, it’s not like that, like, you know, this time around, these people are like paying cash.

 

Erwin  

Who are these people, these Americans, these Canadians, these Mexican law,

 

Ryan  

a lot of people from the northeast, so you have a lot of people from New York, New Jersey, which you know, their real estate prices have done well. And they’re just like, you see, you’re seeing this, this mass migration are going, okay. My house in New York’s gone up in value right now I have a hump house, you know, I’m sitting on a million dollars in equity on this house in New Jersey. And, you know, we want to move to Florida because now you know, Florida has no state income tax. There was some really big political reasons, obviously, with DeSantis, you know, being never shutting down because of COVID, right, and all these things that were in place. And you have, so they’re selling the real estate up there and buying it down here. Oh, they’re moving. They’re moving. They’re moving their whole businesses down here. So just so you know, the last two years, the amount of businesses that have moved to South Florida has never been higher. I mean, literally, as I speak here, I’m looking over here at a class A office building, Goldman Sachs just took a whole floor of it. That fund that I told you that I worked for back in 2009. Two years ago, they took their whole fund from Greenwich, Connecticut, and moved it down here to West Palm Beach. So you’re you’re having a lot of big, you know, businesses now headquarters in south in Florida, instals. For asbestos, specifically, why? Because we don’t have any state income tax, the weather’s nicer, right. And they’re pro business, right? It’s really pro business state as far especially with DeSantis in the political arena down here. So they’re just like, they see a lot less risk here. And I mean, just so you know, like, I’ve had clients move down from the Northeast, and they’ve told me like, Ryan, me, headquartered in my business here. Now moving into Florida, the money that I’m saving from my past state, my state, Connecticut, or New Jersey, the income tax that I’m saving literally pays for my whole cost of living here in Florida. Like, what do you mean, they’re like, yeah, the money I’m saving literally, like, I’m living for free in Florida. So it’s like a no brainer for him.

 

Erwin  

Right? All these boys been like that, or sorry, the least the tax environments, always man attack

 

Ryan  

the tax environments, always been there. But I think there was just a political, you know, environment, too, that really accelerated it and just, you know, opened the eyes to a lot of people, and just, you know, just like anything else, once, you know, you’re working at a company, and you’re seeing, you know, the other company moved to Florida, and their, you know, their employees are happier, and they’re making great money. And it’s like, why am I sitting here, up here in New Jersey paying these huge taxes, you know, in doing that, so, that I think, was a big reason as

 

Erwin  

I hope our government listens to this podcast, and they understand what happens when you overburden businesses, or vilify them.

 

Ryan  

I mean, you look like something’s people in New York, New York, like we had so many people from New York City moved out, and hey, you know, another thing too, that’s, that’s really changed of like, why these businesses should move to Florida is, you know, say what you want, but COVID really accelerated, you know, like we’re doing now and it’s zum zum generation, right, where you can work from anywhere, right? So if you’re a business and most employees aren’t coming to an office anyway, like why the heck would you live in haven’t headquartered in Jersey, you know, or New York or wherever, you know, where you’re paying these taxes. So it’s just like, this remote work culture is accelerated course, all those remote workers that are sitting there all over the United States get on well do I want to live in Wisconsin and work remotely or should I live here in Florida where I could still buy a condo you know, for 300 grand and be less than a mile from the beach? If you don’t, I can do my Zoom meetings in my condo, a mile from the beach and then I can go bike to the beach or walk to the beach after my call.

 

Erwin  

Alright, so Ryan, you probably picked up people’s interests. Tell us more about the 300,000 Are

 

Ryan  

you guys I mean, I’m still very very bullish. Like I call this to like, I really watched the single family home market like last year just really accelerated. I was watching the condo market. I’m like, Wow, it’s so undervalued did the condo market has gone up, but there’s still you can buy condos here, like I said, within a mile or two of the beach, and still get a decent condo for three, four or 500 grand, you know, and have a place here in South Florida. You know, you can rent it out, you know, some of these places down here that I’ve helped with investors over the years, you can rent out monthly. So you could be down here for a couple of months and rent it out the rest of the time. And

 

Erwin  

so Ryan, let me just pause you there. Let’s, let’s restart the conversation. So we met a good friend of mine, a friend of yours to introduce to us because you helped them buy a Canadian. My friend Charles, Canadian, you helped him as his family purchased property in Florida. So So when when when you talk to a Canadian debate tell you, you tell them that

 

Ryan  

no, I’m from South East Florida. There’s a lot of reasons. There are a number of different reasons why, you know, I’m bullish, I’m really bullish on you know, Palm Beach County. Miami is a whole different world. I always tell people think of Miami, literally, it’s a different state. That was almost a different country. It’s a whole different animal down there. Fort Lauderdale.

 

Erwin  

And if you just spend a day there and versus like Fort Lauderdale, it’s not the same place.

 

Ryan  

It is it is and then, you know, and then Fort Lauderdale is very busy. But then you have beautiful West Palm Beach, which is, you know, almost like, compared to like if Miami was New York City, you know, Palm Beach, West Palm Beach is like the Greenwich Connecticut, right. This is where all the wealth is, you know, obviously Palm Beach Island, everybody knows that. That’s where Donald Trump lives. And you know, 33% of the nation’s wealth is a piece of property there. But the cool thing is here, what’s awesome about West Palm, I think it’s a great investment Palm Beach County, is you now have the bright line, okay, which you can take to Miami, which is a high speed train less than an hour, okay, you can be Miami. And number two, it’s just not as populated. So you have, you know, bigger yards, bigger condos, get more bang for your buck, if you will, on buying real estate here versus you know, Fort Lauderdale, Miami, you just it just there’s just more space, you know, you’re not in a parking lot, where everything’s like super close, there’s just more space so you can actually, you know, have a better quality of life. In West Palm weathers the same in West Palm area as it is in Fort Lauderdale in Miami. And then it’s just you know, to me, it’s just a great environment. The other big thing is I’m a big outdoorsman, as you know are one big fisherman. The fish is incredible West Palm it’s actually the closest place kind of on the United States where the Gulf Stream comes to shore. So if you’re an offshore fisherman like catching like, tuna, wahoo, sailfish, Marlin. It’s like, well, this is the top spot for it to be. And then of course, if you have a boat and you’d like to go in and big adventures, the Bahamas are only two hours away. So I like literally take my boat over there on the weekends. go diving fishing in the Bahamas, you know, it’s got all those really nice aspects here of West Palm Beach versus Miami or Fort Lauderdale.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so how about some of the most common Canadian questions, so feel free to throw some in? Because I’m sure hurricanes and financing come up often?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, yeah, people are, you know, obviously Canadians just like anything, you know, say my parents, I’m originally from Minnesota, and just so you know, but I’ve been down here for over like, 25 years, but yeah, the hurricanes, you know, they’re there, they come to Florida, they’ve been, you know, I’ve been through a couple of them. The good thing is, you know, the technology of where it was even five or 10 years ago has come so far, especially the quality of building building materials, they now build these homes, and you can put them in if they don’t have called hurricane impact windows, which are like these high tensile strength windows that are really great. They’re also very energy efficient, too. So that’s big. And of course the technology they know where they’re coming right and a lot more accurate, they know where they’re gonna hit now better than ever, when they’re coming. So those kinds of things are great to know for for hurricanes, you know, as far as like the financial aspects, the finances down here, Florida. I mean, it is you know, for some people that concern you know, as far as like the regulations I mean, would be deregulation here for some people might be concerned but I don’t see it as like a quality of life issue here. I see some really benefits to what they’ve done so far. And that’s just someone that’s pretty middle thrown out of politics, but you know, it’s it’s pretty good there.

 

Erwin  

What are your paying customers doing for for mortgages? Yeah, so

 

Ryan  

I’ve actually had a great lender here that does foreign nationals here out of Miami, they’ve done tonnes

 

Erwin  

so here we’re being called foreign nationals. Foreign nationals are used to pay other people that brush?

 

Ryan  

Exactly. You know, I mean, obviously, you have to put more money down right on the loan, you know, is to a foreign national loan, you might have to put, you know, 30% 30 Yeah, 30% down. And you know, there might be a little bit more you no paperwork involved and stuff like that. But I’ve gotten deals done. I mean, I’ve just just did a foreign national deal with a buyer from Australia. They’re coming to the comment here in South Florida. It’s crazy. Like, it is. It is. Yeah. Now South Florida is, I mean, used to be never to we never got buyers from California, like hardly ever like, but now there’s buyers there people moving here from California. Now we’re getting buyers from California, obviously, Northeast is always that, but we’ve always had Canadian buyers, you know, but now we’re getting people even from the West Coast of the United States by

 

Erwin  

and then rates pot rate wise, what are you seeing what kind of range?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, I mean, you’re gonna be like, in that, you know, for too low fives range. It’s not too bad. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

that’s pretty good. I thought this is a lot better than I thought it would be.

 

Ryan  

I know, I just went through this with, you know, another buyer literally, like just now. So we had none, the rates are pretty good, meaning, you know, having to put 30% down, you know,

 

Erwin  

I have to do my best some of my investment properties, because the bank doesn’t like me. Yeah. And people can do this just personally, or they have to, like start opening a company or something like that, or?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, no, they, it depends. Some lenders, you can do it, dude, personally, some, they want you to open up like an LLC, right? And purchase it that way as well. So it kind of depends.

 

Erwin  

Cool. This isn’t so bad. That’s the nice thing I’d like, you know, to be objective. Like I had this perception. I thought almost everyone had to buy cash unless you’re willing to do like, buy a company, for example. And like, a lot of us kind of wait, like, like, way too much work, real company, and like, make money in it. And then you can qualify for a mortgage. But this doesn’t sound so bad.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, no, it is. I mean, that means still you’re putting 30% down. So the risk for the lender, you know, if you’re

 

Erwin  

right understanding are like a lot of our investment properties are start over 700,000 and then 30%. Down. So we’ve talked about your undergrad condo, I know it’s US dollars. But yeah, that’s I

 

Ryan  

mean, it’s a great opportunity, even like, you know, like our mutual friend that they bought that property, I’d actually just looked at the values on there, they’ve done really well, since they bought it like two years ago, like the price is trumped up very considerably. So I’m sure they’re happy with that. So then usually, you know, if you’re if you’re financing 70%, with the rents the way they are here, like let’s say you didn’t buy like the three or $400,000 condo, you’d still be in a positive cash flow situation. Right. But then of course, your big plays the equity play right. bullish on Florida, you’re bullish on people moving inflation. That’s what I said. I mean, I just read, I don’t know, you can concur with me on this. But it’s like they figure might be like 7%, this year seven or 8%? Inflation? Probably who knows? That’s what they’re saying.

 

Erwin  

We need that terrible war to end in Eastern Europe. You mentioned rents. So like an example $300,000 condo, what would that rent for?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, I mean, if you can do the short term rental, remember, not all condos, can you do the shorter term monthly rentals, but, you know, you’re looking to you could get like, you know, two to $3,000 a month, you know, to rent those out at a short term rental basis. 2020 500 a month, you know, 2000 annual basis. It depends sometimes in the winter, obviously, when you’re doing the short term, it’s even more like I know, here in downtown West Palm Beach to two condos, you know, during the winter furnished, obviously, you know, they’re going as high as, you know, five or $6,000 a month. So it really depends exactly what pocket you’re, you know, if you furnish it or you know, what your strategy is?

 

Erwin  

What about just a vanilla long term rental, unfurnished?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, to to kinda like a $300,000 condo, I mean, you can easily get, you know, to 2020 500 a month. You know, I mean, if it’s decent inside, you know, it has tile floors, stainless steel appliances, that kind of stuff.

 

Erwin  

What are your clients mostly doing? Like, how would you split up what they’re doing? How many are buying for personal or recreational use and how many buying for for investment purposes?

 

Ryan  

There’s a lot of people that are buying here to live obviously, you know, I would probably say 70% to live and then another 30% are investors, you know, that are looking, you know, but they’re like their long term investment plays like I just saw one last week the condo I’ll use this. They’re from New Jersey. You know, this guy’s you know, in his late 50s. Him and his wife in his late 50s They bought a condo on the beach and Jensen Beach, which is great locations just north of Palm Beach County here. Great rental, that they’re getting So on the beach, they bought it. They bought it for like 450,000 you can rent it monthly there during the season furnished rental about 5500 a month off season about 3500 a month, right? That’s what they got. And they’re like, Brian, we’re going to buy this. We’re going to rent it out here for the next about three or four years, get a good return. And then, you know, when I retire, we got a place to go to down in Florida whenever we want. And, you know, I could you know, and I can use it. So that’s happening a lot.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, my wife and I’ve been talking we should hedge and half a property outside this country. Yeah.

 

Ryan  

Well, I’m here to help you, you know, I can definitely help you. I’ve been nice thing. You know, we haven’t even got into my, you know, as you know, I’ve been an agent for a long time. That’s what I’ve done for years and years years. But I started a tech company that we launched, obviously, last summer about called Real trade, which is a social media platform and marketplace for real estate. So it’s just got some amazing features. I tell everybody, it’s a marketplace. So think of it like Zillow, okay, mixed with LinkedIn, but just for real estate. So

 

Erwin  

sorry, Ryan, just for people. Zillow doesn’t have much of a presence here. Yet to explain to a Canadian what Zillow was like maybe another analogy, is it like Amazon, I don’t even know. Yeah, it

 

Ryan  

would be like Zillow, Zillow, or what we are is we’re just an online marketplace for real estate. So we basically in United States, I’m not sure how it works in Canada, but we have these MLS bores that basically agents join, and then they pick their listings and put them on to these MLS boards, which allows another agent to see him that they’re for sale. Other agents could see but then they also take that data and they push it out to these large portals, which are like Zillow, that then take the that data and aggregate it for a place for the consumer to see. So it’s like the consumer, you know, the concern, consumer facing data. So that’s, in essence, what real trade is, it’s like a consumer facing data, where the they can see all the properties for selling in South Florida, like we have all South Florida covered. You know, real trade does. And yeah, so we have a lot of people using it to search for sell the nice The cool thing about about real trade that’s different than like these other online marketplaces like Zillow is, seller can do a lot of good due diligence on not only on the property to getting all the data there directly from the MLS from the source, but they can actually contact the listing agent directly. So they’re not like sold as a lead on Zillow. Got it, I know it’s a different system can but they can go directly to the listing agent get questions answered, they can still use a buyer’s agent, you know, to help them buy but like if they have quick questions themselves, they can, they can get them answered. And then also we have a social aspect where they can actually see on a social feed deals being posted, like coming soon that aren’t even on them quite on the market yet that the agents are sharing to the real trade market. And they can network with other agents. And actually, we’re building an arm right now as we speak service providers. So if they need a good lender, they need a good title company or an inspector, you know, all these types of people to that they can contact those people directly to Unreal trade as well. That’s handy. Yeah, Mark points, things like find good agents, you know, agents that are active right, that you feel comfortable with. You can research them on their, like LinkedIn, you know, but for, you know, for real estate, so we’re getting a lot of traction here. We have hundreds of over 560 agents from 80 Different brokerages on there now. And then we have 1000s of buyers and sellers using the platform.

 

Erwin  

And then there’s blockchain involvement. Well,

 

Ryan  

here’s what we have. So let me tell you this, the blockchain this Believe me, I’m very bullish on blockchain, too. I love talking about it. We have a point system. Before we had our own token on the 1.0 version, we took so far that lived on the blockchain. And now we have what’s called a point system, where basically we track the agents if they add value to the real trade network, which was posting their content, inviting referrals to the network, they gain points, the more points that they have, the more exposure they get on the platform. So we have like suggested pros that properties go up into the, you know, when people are searching for properties or properties go higher up in the results, you know, that kind of stuff. So, you know, the essence, you know, blockchain and what I really liked about it is the way that basically it’s a decentralised system, you know, that incentivize the network as it grows, right to run a transaction, right? That’s the big thing about Bitcoin, a lot of others. So the things they have these miners that are getting rewarded for running the network, right, and doing these transactions, and we have similar that too. We reward the network, the more they help add value to network and make it grow. And as some people’s eyes glassed over when they start hearing about blockchain and how everything works, but it’s pretty exciting, really the possibilities

 

Erwin  

of it. You know, for someone I deal with an old city so for example, if I needed a document pulled on my property, someone literally has to go into like the bowels of the building. To pull off, pull a paper file away. So people who don’t know how it is, maybe they would glaze over. For me it’s worth what why are we there already? Why isn’t this all digitally based?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, exactly. No.

 

Erwin  

I’d be excited for any sort of advancement.

 

Ryan  

I mean, Florida, like we have a good, you know, system here. But then we just so you know, there’s like a startup here, which I actually know the founder. Well, Talia, she started Proppy. And they just sold two properties here in South Florida on NFT tokens.

 

Erwin  

Any tokens? One token,

 

Ryan  

one token, I can I can get in the weeds how this works. Actually, I researched because I’m very, you know, obviously interested. Basically, there’s an LLC that owns the property. Okay. And that’s recorded in the in the county records, right in the state records that owns it. But basically, what they did is they allowed the LLC that owns the property to be put on an NF T tokens. So you’re actually just buying the LLC, you’re not actually buying the property. But that LLC then is transferred ownership to you through the NFT token.

 

Erwin  

Interesting. So why did this individual do it that way?

 

Ryan  

I think it’s like right now, it’s so nice, since I think it’s more like a marketing gimmick, but they they just did two of them. So there’s their two for two, there’s like the only place and I think the world that’s doing it, and it’s happening in Florida. So yeah, I mean, obviously real trade, you know, idea of one time we want to obviously be a marketplace and help facilitate

 

Erwin  

FTEs or any sort of any kind of real estate where there’s no tokenize real estate,

 

Ryan  

fractionalized, tokenize real estate and if T tokens regular real estate, you know, just like traditional regular regular still gonna play a big role.

 

Erwin  

I love the idea of like a fractionalized ownership, and we can use tokens to identify ownership. It has to happen fractionalized ownership of real estate has to happen. Oh, it’s

 

Ryan  

happening. No, it is happening. There’s actually even like, basically, you can take your tokens I just there’s a new startup here in South Florida is working on this and actually collateralize your tokens and borrow against your tokens. That’s a whole nother game. Thanks.

 

Erwin  

Time right. People glazed over like

 

Ryan  

that’s the thing about for this, you know, this is why I’m so bullish guys at Ford. There’s so much innovation happening here. There’s so much exciting things in real estate that are happening here. Obviously people love the weather and all these things. So if I’m if I was a Canadian looking down here at Florida, I think it would be you know, I would be like wow, what a great place to own a second home just joy but much less than investment. That’s great.

 

Erwin  

Before we were recording, for example, the Bitcoin Conference was in Miami in Miami. I don’t know it just keeps coming up and also partly because the the mayor of Miami is such a Bitcoin adopt early adopter, I believe correct me if I’m wrong, I believe the city of Miami already has Bitcoin on their on their balance sheet. Yep. And they’re accepting it as a currency so you can pay your taxes I believe in Bitcoin. And I’m not sure if that exists anywhere else and anywhere. Yeah. So it basically Florida is open for business for cryptocurrency versus, you know, many politicians, many governments, you know, China for example, they they banned a lot of miband miners, and any sort of businesses that are surrounded that whose underlying businesses cryptocurrency and versus like us and especially, especially, especially like Nevada and Florida have been like, we’ll take you all Yeah, yeah. And so So then, you know, you told me because you’re closer to this and then even like Ray Dalio for example said like the greatest threat to cryptocurrency is governments banning it. But then you see like the US government like here come all you all you miners come here, and I Okay, but they turn about and kick them out now.

 

Ryan  

Yeah. Well, that’s to me your what will happen? I mean, this is because this United States, right, so we have the states have some jurisdiction, right of what we can individually so the these other states or the US, you know, says oh, you can’t do that one state I’ll pop up and go yeah, you can. Right. And then everybody will just gravitate towards that state. It look what happened with the COVID. Right. Everybody was like shutting down and everybody’s like, you know, hurting businesses and There comes one state, which gotta give it to DeSantis. He put put himself on the line bucked the trend, but look what a difference it made it down here in Florida. Just there was this huge discovery of all these businesses now just flocking and it just like this like a faucet, right if people wanting to come down here. So I think the same thing point being the same thing would happen if the government shut down Bitcoin there’d be a couple states that be like now, Florida’s very pro crypto same with Wyoming if you do some regulate look into Wyoming.

 

Erwin  

That’s fascinating because there’s a couple of precedents come to mind. Like for example, like for example, cannabis is legal in several states, but federally, it’s not legal. But yeah, unions, for example, you have certain states in the US where unions are not legal. You may not you may not open a union in certain states. Hence, that’s where businesses tend to flock. Exactly. Right. I don’t know if Keynes and again, no politician listens to this podcast, but that’s a reality. If a business unionised is in Canada, that business owner may just relocate to a right to work state in the US exactly like that people need to understand like, you know, make your decision in a wider context zoom out who exactly and decision on that don’t just like, hey, you know, with fight for all rights for their employees, like, but then the next month, they’re all out of jobs? I mean, like, zoom out, look at the bigger picture negotiate from there rather than Yeah,

 

Ryan  

it is. It’s a perfect example, you have to look at look at all different angles. And this political angle is a big one. I actually, honestly until this last couple years that I realised like how much political, you know, arena can have on business. I mean, just incredible. You know, I mean, you know, how much he influenced into, you know, and I honestly didn’t agree with the DeSantis some of his viewpoints, but after having seen and gone through it and seeing what happened here to Florida. Wow. You know, it does make a difference.

 

Erwin  

No one’s perfect. I think, first off, everyone needs to appreciate that. Nobody’s perfect. Nobody gets it. 100%, right.

 

Ryan  

I know. But I’m a I’m a big believer, like, let the market like let the free market dictate as much as we can. discovery of what works and what doesn’t work. As long as you’re not stifling the free market and like businesses, these solutions will come into play. Like I said, I that’s why I think I’ve just so big on Florida, like we’re big on free markets, and we’re big on innovation. We’re like, some good things. I mean, I have a tech company. I’m headquartered in Florida, I went through this accelerator, literally the whole reason my business got built, I went through this accelerator that literally is funded by the City of West Palm Beach. Like they’re a big sponsor for 1909, which is just accelerator incubator here, which allows me as an entrepreneur to come in here and have really affordable space, right to be an entrepreneur and not have to rent rent real expensive office space, and, you know, things like that, like I that’s what I’m trying to tell people like it’s things like that, that’s where people can, you know, it makes a big difference. And that innovation,

 

Erwin  

and that’s a big problem here in Canada is our real estate’s way too expensive if we’re just going to scare away investment. Yeah. And people just think investment means dollars, like no, will scare away people, they can’t afford to live here. Yep. Right. Those

 

Ryan  

entrepreneurs, like those entrepreneurs are so important because they’re the ones are gonna be starting new, best fresh business coming from different angles. Like there’s so many crypto businesses down here that are starting that are so exciting. Like I had a 1.0 version, like I said, But I’m looking at all these other ones. I mean, it’s just, it’s incredible. What’s happening, just take a couple of one or two, you know, that could be the next Microsoft or the next, you know, Apple or whoever it is, you know, I mean, it’s, that’s what’s exciting.

 

Erwin  

And then okay, I don’t know what are the details? What does the Canadians ask you when they first get in touch with you? What else what am I missing? What else do they ask you?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, that’d be they want to you know, a lot of them want to like you know, especially they want to come here and you know, they want to know is it safe in Florida

 

Erwin  

is a crime like the crime like that’s the crime like

 

Ryan  

that’s another thing too I like West Palm Beach is obviously Miami and as we know is different. There’s just more people there there’s like a you know, different you know, like I said almost like a different country so the crime rate is higher there obviously, than Fort Lauderdale and Fort Lauderdale is higher than West Palm, you know, West Palm has a lower if you look to statistics, Palm Beach County has a very low crime rate. So it’s, it’s really, really good here. As far as that lies. Another thing that I want to know like I said about the weather, the weather’s the same. It’s always that you know, it’s almost amazing or it’s like come late November, but mid to end in November. It’s like someone takes a light switch and turns it off. And the humidity is gone. And it’s just nicer than from November, December, January, February, March. And even April, we’ve had beautiful weather all through April now pretty much you know, maybe it starts to get a little bit hot, but like, you know, the only unbearable month I will tell Canadians or anybody here. It is very hot, very muggy in August September, you know, so those are the months that I would say, you know, go travel go do somewhere else. It can get banned in Canada. August is a great like, you know, Want to be up north? Right, September’s beautiful you can come in to start getting in the fall and other fall colours and stuff. So and then like I said, October, you know, starts to cool down and then by November It’s beautiful here. So

 

Erwin  

let me see what else the kids asked and even bring kids with them. They even asked about schools.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, well, I mean, that’s another thing too. Palm Beach County has incredible schools here. Like we have some of the best rated schools of anywhere in the state, both private and public, really good schools here. On the side, he has a lot of activities here. Like I said, they all like Ryan, what about the golf? Tell me about the golf and I’d be like, Okay, do you know where Tiger Woods lives? You live here in Palm Beach County. I’ve been Jupiter by her diet golfer called Jack Nicklaus lives in North Palm Beach. Right? There’s actually more PGA golfers living here in Palm Beach County than anywhere else in the United States.

 

Erwin  

As a golf affordable. Yeah, that’s the thing too.

 

Ryan  

There’s so many courses here. There’s tonnes of courses here. Like you know, there’s so many I think there’s like over 100 different courses here within like a 20 mile radius of West Palm Beach. So you know, there’s tonnes of golf to be had, you know, as far as entertainment. Oh, another big thing here so forth. We love to eat out the restaurants are fabulous. That’s another thing with Mauna Kea exactly what about the you know the dining seafood restaurants incredible very competitive here on this you know, because obviously a lot of people come here vacation they wanted didn’t want to cook so to eat out. So the restaurants here are just another level. And then obviously the fishing the diving big like we have the clearest water because that gulf stream comes so close. So it’s really good diving we get actually oh sorry, explained the Gulf Stream. So the Gulf Stream is like a warm river of currently ocean actually starts down in the Caribbean goes up between Cuba and Hispaniola and through the Bahamas channel and it comes up and then goes skirts through the Straits of Florida and goes right along the coast of Florida. Well, if you look at the map, Palm Beach County bumps out of Florida a little bit so that Gulf Stream literally brushes right through the right at Palm Beach County right at singer island so that water is crystal clear. Like there’s days here or when we have if you’re a diver, we have days where we have 150 foot of visibility. So if you can imagine you’re in 150 feet of water you can see the bottom easy. I know so I’m a big free diver like and I like a set of fishermen so for me like you’re getting all these days of the year like almost 300 days a year but yeah, beautiful this you can feel the fish feel a lifetime there which is great. So the activity wise you know as far as like sports teams, I’m seeing West Palm line of professional sports teams here but again, we have the bright line brings your right downtown to Brickell Miami, you’re literally right across from the what used to be called the American Airlines Arena. You know where the the professional basketball team plays the Miami Heat. Of course, you got the Miami Dolphins, Florida panthers from the I know these Canadians are hockey fans.

 

Erwin  

Were the furloughed Panthers. How far how far to how far we need to adopt a hockey team. Yeah, Tampa is out here is good. Florida is actually playing extremely well this year. Florida.

 

Ryan  

Panthers aren’t they’re like right on the edge of Fort Lauderdale and Miami. A little bit further west. So it’s not far from here like West Palm. I could be in the Panthers arena. You know, like 40 minutes.

 

Erwin  

That’s it? Yeah. fraction of the cost to Yeah, it’s like 30 plus 30 cents of the dollar compared to what we pay here,

 

Ryan  

sir. Well, you guys are awesome. Canadian Canadians are awesome hockey fans. You guys. drive up the price.

 

Erwin  

overpaying hockey fans.

 

Ryan  

Yeah. I grew up like us. I grew up in northern Minnesota. So I grew up playing hockey. Geez.

 

Erwin  

Alright, yeah, your phone’s gonna break when this podcast drops.

 

Ryan  

I’m excited. I mean, like I said, it’s the timings good. Like if I’m an investor looking at like, gosh, these condos and stuff are still affordable. Like you know, they’re still not like crazy yet. And I just I see what’s happening you know, here in South Florida, just so many like I said people coming here what’s happening? And I’m just you know, I’ve been lucky I’ve just had a great I mean for 24 years I’ve had a great life so I’ve met it you know, I know a lot of fun things to do people to meet you know, people have their investors I have you know, my own company like I said real trade can help and then you know, I mean I just just had actually a zoom call with this awesome startup called future state here in South Florida. They literally just headquarter from New York down to here and they help basically short term investors manage their ad, their Airbnb VRBO is everything all from one place? One location, really great software that they have developed?

 

Erwin  

You know, I’m sure hurricane would like to hear well, it’s

 

Ryan  

called Future stay. I’m good friends with the founder. They actually work out of the 99 space here.

 

Erwin  

We’re gonna zoom call with him. You said Yeah, right. Right

 

Ryan  

before this. I was just literally like on a call with them just before this before we jumped on. Yeah. So yeah, because they obviously love, you know, real trade, they want it like, wow, they, they want to go to the network because there’s all these real estate agents that can refer them business right with their investors. You know, because I’m telling the short term investment thing, guys is an awesome way to go. The returns are great. And it’s just like, you know, it’s exciting, it’s exciting, you can make great returns, and you’re getting into the ladder of the real estate market here in South Florida. So,

 

Erwin  

it’s a great way to go. How many buildings allow it versus not allow it? Allow?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, no, I know, the ones that allow there’s not a like, most of them will allow you to do to, to rent most condos will allow you to do, you know, two rentals a year, right. So you can do one short term rental, and then another, another rental over the summer. The ones that are obviously you know, real desirable like that I see right now these ones that can you can do the monthly rentals, you know, where you can rent them out monthly, which are great. And now in Miami, which I have a great contact literally one of the developers is my good friends they built now. And there’s a couple that they’re selling pre construction that are set up for Airbnb nightly rentals. So they’re building the units, right. And they’re literally like, there’s no rental restrictions. You can rent them out nightly for you, they’ll man and they’ll help you manage it, obviously doing the cleaning and everything like that, of course you can put them on the other platforms, whatever you want to put onto that Airbnb or VRBO could partner up with future stay, obviously, they can can help you there as well. You know, make it pretty turnkey for these investors to be able to do that. And obviously, if you get a foreign national loan and put 30% And you know, you have a little bit of cash flow, you got a place to come to Florida, rent it out, you know, nightly, that’s pretty advantageous.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty awesome. Nice to meet, you put me in touch with one of your clients that has one of these places to rent. Clean to

 

Ryan  

Yeah, no, I did one, actually, that most of they get rented out like that. But that one client that just bought that one and veero He’s just getting ready to put on the market. So there will be some time after that. He just he just closed on the last week.

 

Erwin  

So when the challenges of short term rentals is it’s easier if you live there. Well, your investors are not local at all. What are they doing in terms of like cleaning and stuff like that?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, so I have some great partnerships that I have with some management companies that’ll manage it, you know, the cleaning and everything for you of course they take a percentage

 

Erwin  

deserve it.

 

Ryan  

It’s a Yeah, they do. It’s a lot lot of them will manage even even the all the Airbnb accounts and everything, all the posts, even bookings, like, you don’t have to do anything, they’re gonna end, they will do it and including the cleaning to, they’re gonna range anywhere from you know, they’re gonna want anywhere from like, 20 to 30%

 

Erwin  

Oh, that’s worth it for your peace of mind. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. How did you manage like managing more than two?

 

Ryan  

I know. Yeah. Like you said, if you’re here, you can, you know, you can do you could have a cleaning lady that you go goes in there once, you know, once a month or whatever cleans if you’re doing the monthly rental. Remember single family homes you can do most places here like in Palm Beach County nightly as well. But, you know, obviously that’s more detail. Yeah, there’s companies out there that I got even relationships with and again, that’s through you know, real trade, they’re gonna be able to network with people on the platform. It’s literally like a wire built it

 

Erwin  

running out of time, for right before the long weekend. And surprise you booked it for now, because I’m pretty sure you have more fun things to do.

 

Ryan  

I love it. I do. Remember last time we did with it was so much fun. And, you know, it’s just, I mean, look what happened since the last one we had and then and, like what’s happened two years. COVID like this, like, you know, the real estate market getting crazy. Just like everywhere. So it’s, it’s great.

 

Erwin  

When things busy performed the pandemic to they were

 

Ryan  

Yeah, now you’re starting to see things that just this pandemic, this sped everything up, like I tell you and I just I really don’t see this, you know, remote work going away, like I see it even accelerating, even without the pandemic, right. I mean, you know, without, with without it, I just see people like, you know, wow, I can do all this work from home, and then they’re just gonna be like, Why am I living in Iowa? Like, what am I? What am I doing? You know, like, like I said, and so you’re just getting so many people like that, that are moving here

 

Erwin  

to parties, right. And that’s by commercial at all, how is office space compared to like New Jersey, New York? Yeah, so

 

Ryan  

the office space here, you know, is getting more expensive, obviously. But that’s why this these these concepts like I’m at like 99 are becoming so popular, which are great. And it is like you get the benefits of these co working spaces of obviously having an office but then you’re meeting like I met my developer here, right? I met like my marketing team. All these people you may be great con. It’s seriously it’s like I really think is the future of work is these co working incubators, accelerators. Such a cool thing. And there’s enough co working spaces here so you can get well as co working spaces have your own office. You know, for like, 1000, you know, 1000 bucks a month. Have your own office space and everything right there. So, for example,

 

Erwin  

like Goldman Sachs, you mentioned who bought got a floor, like you’re paying less more?

 

Ryan  

Oh, yeah, another pain, they’re paid less, they’re definitely paying less than they would work or anything like that. A lot less, quite a bit less. Yeah, quite a bit less, I would say probably 2020 or 30% less than they’re paying a lot of different places.

 

Erwin  

And people are probably lining up to take, I’ll move, I’ll move. I’ll stop. I’ll stop paying for my bachelor. What’s a bachelor in New York City like 4000 a month or something?

 

Ryan  

1000 a month for like a studio. Which they could come down here and get like, you know, it’s still like, you know, a good like, two bedroom. Like I said, you know, three grand a month 25. Two to 3000 a month, so it’s less right. But then you’re like I said, You’re a mile from the beach. I mean, you’re right here less than a mile from beach. So yeah,

 

Erwin  

crazy. All right. And it was Thursday, but essentially, it’s Friday. Happy Easter, Ryan, you too. Thanks. Thanks so much for doing this. I got a bike Charles. We figured the date. Season so there’s no way I was gonna I was leaving. Charles invited me to Florida but there’s no way I was allowed to leave because we’re in the middle of tax season.

 

Ryan  

I know. We were supposed to get together. We were gonna get together when he was here. Of course. I got so busy too. And I do have a five year old son. But I told him next time He comes for sure.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, it was disappointed camping. Right golf clubs. It’s like a thing. We don’t travel there golf clubs. Well,

 

Ryan  

there’s actually a there’s a there’s a company where you can ship them this you can ship them down here. A lot of people do that. They just ship their golf clubs down. It’s cheaper that way rather than flying with them on the plane, but you might have really nice clubs. I don’t know. And you might not trust somebody.

 

Erwin  

Awesome. Right. Thanks so much for doing this. Congratulations on your success. Sounds like you had a blast through COVID At least you at least business is probably booming through all COVID

 

Ryan  

There was no it was good. It was good. It was crazy. And it still is. But ya know, I enjoy it. Thanks for having me on again. And let’s keep doing it.

 

Erwin  

Oh yeah. How can people connect with you? First, start with the Start with your realtor business. Where can people connect? Where can people follow?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, so the best way is actually you can connect with me is through real trade. You can go on there and we’ll trade real trade.io As a buyer or seller, you can create a profile for free. Okay, and then I want to suggest the pros there so you can connect with me there and follow me and then we can be in contact that way. Another another way just simply email me you know my email is lost or

 

Erwin  

new this is this is the internet it’s forever

 

Ryan  

Yeah, that’s not that’s no problem. So they’re obviously trade a profound real trade. You can follow me there and obviously search for properties use that which is awesome. But then you can email me too. It’s my name Ryan pool. Ry A N P O L E at real trade.io. Excellent. Yep. Real trade dot i

 

Erwin  

o the I O mean something.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, that’s like a real blockchain tech forward. You know, you are. Yeah, you are. It actually means Indian Ocean. But a lot of the developers blockchain guys said input output, which is like a big developer kind of an URL. So it’s actually a lot of startups use that. I got I cool.

 

Erwin  

I might use it for something. Yeah, learn something new every day. Right? This has been a blast. Information overload for the flippin Good. Fantastic. I love the whole foreign nation national mortgages. And yeah, congrats on your success. Thanks again for doing this.

 

Ryan  

Yep, we’ll hope to see you down here soon in Florida.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already signed up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none are limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

To Follow Ryan:

Web: https://realtrade.io

Instagram: @realtrade_inc

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/RealTradeInc

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

Lessons From Managing 2,000 Houses & R.E. Investments On The Blockchain With Moe Hansrod

I trust everyone is enjoying this lovely spring weather! 

I was lucky enough to get in a round with some buddies. I didn’t play great; I shot a 118, but that’s improved from 12 months ago when I shot a 130 for my first round of the season. 

Golf prices are always a victim of inflation, the posted rate for the public is up around 30% higher than last year, and I heard the cost of a bag of fertilizer used by the golf course went up from $38 to $71.

That’s a serious increase of 87%, and I’m sure food prices will be higher since fertilizer is used to grow our food.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

One thing that’s not going up right now is the investment real estate that we target for ourselves and our clients. Some see that as a bad thing, but not our client, as last week, we scored a detached bungalow for under $875k in Brantford. The seller is in construction, so the house is renovated well above rental standards, AND the basement is already a basement apartment done to code but without a permit.  

Our contractor, however, expects we will need drawings, permits and city inspections but most importantly, little to nothing in hard costs as in no renos required.  The big bonus is the ballpark price on converting the garage to a self-contained apartment has the total investment cost under $1M, all in for what will be a triplex.  Early estimated rent is $5,600 per month, plus we have a lender who will provide a construction loan for the renovations.

Two months ago, we would have needed to pay $100,000 more for this house, competing against a ridiculous number of offers, vs. today, we’re competing with less and buying the dip. 

How awesome is it that, while some out there are panicking about interest rates, historically, this is still cheap money to me, and our client will use cheap money to create some serious cash flow.  And who doesn’t want more cash flow in an inflationary environment?!  Technically everyone should. 

Real estate is a hedge against inflation, and if you follow the stock market, all the best dividend-paying companies are trading at all-time highs.  Side note: thank goodness we own some of them. It makes shopping at Costco a little less painful knowing we own a slice of their business excellence. 

Anyways, I hope everyone out there has their finances in order in terms of the mortgage capability to go deal shopping.

Lessons From Managing 2,000 Houses & R.E. Investments On The Blockchain With Moe Hansrod

On to this week’s show!

Today we have an old friend of mine, Moe Hansrod, who’s been in real estate since the early 2000s as both investor and property manager. 

Moe is currently an owner of KW Property Management (KW stands for Kitchen Waterloo, not Keller Williams) with around 2,000 doors and 600 clients, mostly with single-family homes w/ the average investor client owner 3-5 houses. 

Today, Moe is on the show to share some truths about real estate investing, including picking up the pieces after what out-of-town Realtors promised investors in terms of overinflated tenant profiles and rents by as much as 25%.

Moe is also an investor in Realmeproperty, a startup, real estate, and financial technology company offering blockchain-based, affordable investing opportunities in cash-flowing real estate.  Moe’s young friends Akshat and Rishard, who are super bright and going places, are here to explain how their business provides opportunities for fractional ownership of investment properties.

As always, anything said on this podcast is for educational, maybe entertainment purposes and not an endorsement of any investment. For investment advice, please seek professional advice from a financial advisor, which my guest and I are not.

My unprofessional opinion? I’m excited to see where RealMe goes. I’m sure many of you would like an opportunity to early exit a portion of our investment properties one day while offering an opportunity to those with smaller amounts of capital to invest because everyone needs exposure to hard assets.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Hello, welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show. My name is Erwin Szeto and I trust everyone is out there enjoying the lovely spring weather. Fun, useless fact of the day, Denmark is slowing down their vaccine rollout because apparently they have COVID in the control, which is fantastic news for them. Statistically I can verify that they’ve got COVID pretty much under control. And that’s fantastic news for what is probably hopefully to hear calm as well. COVID less of a concern. It seems to be seasonal. I’m not a doctor, folks, please listen to your doctor. Not me. Anyways, but the Yeah, all positive news. Me I’m still planning on getting boosted in the fall. I have too many friends who’ve had bad symptoms several multiple days in bed. I have a low tolerance for suffering personally. So that’s my risk tolerance. Everyone else has their own risk tolerance. I just can’t stand being stuck in bed sick. I have too many things to do. Anyways, I trust everyone’s enjoying this lovely spring weather. I was lucky enough to get in a round of golf with some buddies, my first round of the season, unfortunately, was pretty darn cold. And I’ll use that as an excuse why didn’t play great. I shot a 118. But that was much improved over my 12 months go score the same course, were I shot 130 for my first round of the season. Yeah, my puting was garbage. And I swing way too hard. I swing too hard and lose control. That’s actually a good analogy for real estate. A lot of these companies and individuals who are who are not having a good time investing in real estate, you know, I’ve mentioned some of them the show, oftentimes it’s not because they’re bad people, it’s just they swung for the fences without having a good foundation in place. Anyways, golf prices are also a victim of inflation. Like many things, the posted rate at my golf course is the price of the public is up around 30% higher than last year, which I know it’s upsetting to many people. And I also heard the cost that they’re paying for bag of fertiliser, used by the golf course went up from $38 last year to $71. Last year. So this year, sorry, from 38 last year to $71 this year. That’s an increase of 87%. And I think we all know that fertilizers are used more for more than growing grass on golf courses. They’re used to grow food as well. And sadly, I think we know where food prices will be headed. Since fertiliser is used for going through too. 


Erwin  

One thing that’s not going up in price right now is real estate. And as predicted here, I believe I shared it on the show. And I shared it at at our real estate meetups. Now in real estate meetups hosted by Cherry and I, I predicted this coming we advised our clients that they’re planning to sell within the next year they should be selling early in the year ahead of the interest rate increases and some of them did and did really well for it. Obviously, they’re over the moon having peak. So congratulations to them very happy for them. Actually one of them just told me on weekend at our most recent meeting, but they’re handing me in the resignation this week. There. It’s time for the retirement. And we’ve discussed it, this would not be possible without investing in real estate. So yeah, maybe the lesson would be if you want to have an early comfortable retirement, consider investing in real estate. Let’s be honest, a lot of real estate is coming down in prices. We’re seeing prices down 5-10%. It could go down even more. Some see that as a bad thing. Not our client last week as we scored a detached bungalow for under 700,000. In Branford Zoning Bylaw allows for a basement apartment. And the early quote for converting the garage the existing garage to a self contained apartment was well under 100,000. The early number was like 70. So our client can be all in for hopefully under 900,000. For what will be a triplex early estimated rent would be around $5,200 per month. Plus we have a lender who will provide the construction loan for the renovations. This is all bleeding edge folks. This is probably be only the second in all Branford that will execute with like this with a garden suite in a construction loan. So the something that we’re staying on top of I do believe that garden suites the which would be an addition, or tiny home on the same existing property will basically be the last opportunity for a major value add renovation to a property. So hence you can appreciate that we’re all over this strategy and to know knowing everything we possibly can. Anyways, two months ago, we may have needed to pay easily 5 or 10% more for the same property while also completed competing against a ridiculous number of offers. Because just like most of us, you understand the opportunity here. It’s not that common. So yeah, our client jumped on it. Thankfully we’re in a bit of a dip right now. And because of that, we were able to compete against less properties. And actually, before I go on our our keynote talk for the May iWIN real estate meetup hosted by cherry and I is all to do about garden suiting. So again, that’s an addition or a tiny home, built on an existing investment property, typically in the backyard, where we’re talking about the ins and outs of it at the May Iowa meeting, so you probably want to be attending that at our live and in person meetings again, so we’re only doing live and in person, there is no zoom or recording option. It’s a lot easier that way for us. So how awesome is that? While there’s some people are out there panicking about interest rates and falling right prices. Historically, again, I noticed a lot of people have trouble zooming out, not for all of you, because you’re all educated folks are smart, if you can zoom out. And you will see that the rates right now are historically still really cheap. And our clients will gladly use this cheap money to create some serious cash flow. And who doesn’t want more cash flow in an inflationary environment? The cost of pump gas is just ridiculous. And I think and on my way, driving today, I think gas was approaching $1.90. Our Tesla cannot get here fast enough. It’s funny enough that people keep asking me when the Tesla’s coming. Our current eta is July. It just keeps bouncing around. We were supposed to have it this month or in the next few weeks. But we get pushed out to July somehow. Anyways, technically, everyone should want more cash flow in their lives. It just makes complete sense. Also, on the other hand, real estate is pretty much the perfect hedge against inflation. Preferably our ground on government is best. And if you do follow the stock market, Like I do all the best dividend paying companies are trading at all time highs. So the market is buying companies that cash flow, right? Quick sidenote, thank goodness we own some of these companies. It makes shopping for example, it makes shopping at Costco a little less painful, knowing that we own a slice of their business excellence. Not advice, folks. Anyways, I hope everyone out there has their finances in order. I mean, like their mortgage capability in order to go deal shopping because that’s exactly what Cherry and I are doing.


Erwin  

On to this week’s show. Today we have an old friend of mine Moe Hansrod drawn who’s been in real estate since the early 2000s as both a investor and a property manager, Mo is currently an owner of one of the owners of kW property management. kW stands for Kitchener Waterloo, not Keller Williams, with around 2000 doors under management that includes 600 clients, mostly single family homes, with the average investor client owning three to five houses Moe’s on the show today to share some truths about real estate investing. Hopefully I don’t get in trouble for this. I’ll be sharing some of his experiences having to pick up the pieces after what some out of the term Realtors promised to investors in terms of overinflated tenant profiles and rents by as much as 25%. So it’s not me saying bad things about realtors. It’s Moe. So please, yes, blame Moe. Moe is also an investor in a startup company called RealMe property, a startup real estate financial technology company offering blockchain based affordable investing opportunities in cash flowing real estate. Moes young friends are here with us today as Akshat and Rishard, who are super bright. I don’t need to tell you about you’ll realise that quickly when you hear them talk about their experience and their education. These gentlemen are going places and they’re here today to explain what is a fractional ownership? What is their business, which is surrounds fractional ownership of real estate investment opportunities. As always, anything said on this podcast is for educational may be entertainment purposes. And it’s not endorsement of any investment, no matter what. I’m licenced to talk about real estate. And that’s it. For investment advice. Please seek professional advice from a financial advisor, which is not me nor my guests. My unprofessional opinion. I’m excited to see where RealMe goes. As I’m sure many of you would like an opportunity for potentially an early exit of a portion of our investment properties One day, while offering opportunity to those with smaller amounts of capital to invest because everyone needs exposure to hard assets. If you don’t know what that means, please read Ray Dalio’s principles of investing in the change of world order. I’m not gonna post that here because the book is honestly like an inch and a half thick. Please enjoy the show. 


Erwin  

Gentlemen, Moe, Akshat, Rishard, what’s what’s keeping you guys busy these days? 


Moe  

Real Estate. 


Erwin  

Differently, though, for you too. 


Moe  

Yes, definitely for us, too. 


Erwin  

Because we have a bit of a generational difference here. 


Moe  

Yeah, yeah.


Erwin  

Sorry, Akshat how old are you?


Akshat  

I’m 25


Erwin  

Oh, gee, okay. 


Moe  

Yeah, he’s half our age.


Erwin  

You don’t you can only in real estate. You’re too young, Cause Moe bought it all.


Moe  

Oh yeah, that’s why we’re here. Right. So I actually met one of the people on his team online, actually Facebook. And that’s how I got connected with them. So I can start tell you what I do how I know you. You and I have go back about a decade, that REIN, probably more


Erwin  

Yeah 2008. Yeah.


Moe  

Probably nine up, but I didn’t get into later, right. But I mean, I remember you had the tiger cats jersey. He’d wear it all the time. So he would call himself Mr. Hamilton. And anytime I say I’m going to meet Erwin, or talk to Erwin if somebody knows REIN or knows real estate, I say Mr. Hamilton the guy says Oh him. Okay. So we’ve been part of REIN, you know, acquaintances, and we talk online here and there. And I was with, you know, I would attend with a few landlords and a realtor team. And, you know, we we picked up a lot of business from REIN, it was great. Stop going probably mid about, say like, 14,15 when things changed, and yeah, so we’re still landlords, we’re still investors.


Erwin  

What? You’re not you’re still a landlord? Didn’t you hear the market slowing or something? You know, it’s government has some new plans for I don’t know, whatever.


Moe  

They’re gonna try to slow us down. But, you know, Tiger is not going to change his stripes. Right. So I’m part of kW property management. I had my own company tried to do rentals. I met a girl named Trish Montag, and she ended up taking over my company and I do the intake, new client sales leads for kW property management, and we’re out of Kitchener. And we service about 75 to 100 kilometre radius outside of Cambridge, Kitchener Waterloo, actually expanding into Hamilton and Milton now and some in Brampton, and we’re in Woodstock. Brantford, Paris Fergus, air Trumbo, all those smaller towns outside of KWC as we call it.


Erwin  

He made up some cities there I think, but we’ll let it slide.


Moe  

If you live down there, you’d know them right? So but we’re up to about 2000 doors, mostly single family residential, the majority of our clients have 1 to 3 doors. A lot of our clients are working abroad and don’t want to sell their homes because they they’re unsure of what the future holds and they don’t want to be chasing the market obviously which is taken off down here. Well in kWC anyways and in southern Ontario in general. So we look after it for them we sell the units collect rent to the evictions, if necessary, and you know, your regular Property Management shop so we have an office downtown


Erwin  

Regular means different things to many people. This sounds pretty end to end.


Moe  

Yes, end to end yeah, so it’s a full shop full hands off. We got clients all over the world. A lot of clients we’ve never met before they buy property here we you know, as long as you have a Canada bank account and FINTRAC it, you know, you’re aboveboard, we can deal with you. And so we make it hands off for our clients. We do everything from you know, placing that tenant dealing with them day to day to cleaning, to doing their banking to doing their licencing if the town requires it, etc. And we have a staff of 15 downtown Kitchener, where our office is and we do some commercial stuff like warehouses, medical pauses strip plazas, we even look after shuttered McDonald’s. So if McDonald’s closed the restaurant down within about 75 kilometre radius of our downtown office will look after for them. Right now. We’re looking after one for them beside Google downtown Kitchener. So they’re still undecided what they’re doing with that piece of land because very valuable now. So they’re one of our clients. But our main focus is single family residential, and, to a lesser degree, we have about 5% 7% of our portfolio is student housing, but it’s a lot more work we rather stay with single family and I’ve found it as a landlord myself just to be a better business, less turnover, less wear and tear, less dealing with, you know, students, parents yelling and screaming about something, and children fighting etc. Right. So that’s basically what we do, who we are and what I’m into. And I’ve always been into real estate investing stock market. Now I’m into crypto and I know Erwin is into all these things as well. 


Erwin  

I like making money. 


Moe  

Yeah, exactly. 


Erwin  

And, and we’re not hurting nobody. 


Moe  

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I attended his seminar with Grant Cardone pre COVID. And that was great. And that being said, you know, it’s sometimes you know, I like to dabble in other things. So, I met Amna from x shot and Rishards team of RealMe property, and they will explain what they’re up to. And I’ve joined their team as consultant advisor/acquisition guy I, and kind of help them grow out what they’re trying to achieve. And we’ve already acquired a couple of properties out of town. ones in Kirkland Lake.


Erwin  

How long you been in real estate? I’m still trying to qualify you as an expert. I’m not sure we’re there. 


Moe  

Yeah, actually my first property I bought was in 89-90.


Erwin  

Okay, longer than you two gentlemen are alive. 


Rishard  

Yeah, of course.


Moe  

So fresh out of high school. Okay.


Erwin  

And then, and then how long you been in property management? You mentioned it before.


Moe  

Early 2000s. And then I’ve been with this particular company, kW property management, who took over my business, which was self run, I was running it out of my house. We merged in about 2011-2012. And 


Akshat  

Moe was a startup guy, huh? 


Moe  

Yeah, we’ve been going strong since and we’ve grown the portfolio. From about, like I said, about 150 doors combined to over 2000, and about 600 clients close to 600 from all over the world. So we got a niche market down there, we have a lot of people that come to us for help, advice, consulting, and you know how to help facilitate transactions for realtors, that may want some assistance for their clients. So we’re a full service shop, we do some leasing agent stuff as well, where some people want to be hands off and want us to manage their properties. I mean, just fill their properties and not manage. So I mean, it’s all over the map, sometimes we’ll get clients, they’ll be living in the basement of a triplex and want us to manage the two upper units and don’t want the tenant to know that they’re the owner. Sometimes I’ll get a call from China, you know, fill my unit and email me the lease, and I’ll deal with a tenant directly and I don’t need management, and they’re halfway across the world different time zones. So it’s all over the map, you’d think the person in China would want the property management, and the guy living in the basement, the triplex would manage on his own. But it’s complete opposite. Sometimes


Erwin  

We’ve seen it all then. 


Moe  

Yeah. And we have a mix of business coming in, you know, we have business going out, obviously, because of the sales market’s been on fire. So people that have been long term clients that are cashing out, but then again, I was telling these guys earlier, people that have bought properties, say back around Christmas, have seen substantial gains in their, you know, investments in are cashing out six, eight weeks later, in some instances. So it is what it is. 


Erwin  

But that’s not the norm. 


Moe  

No, that’s not the norm. That’s not the norm. 


Erwin  

So I’d actually like to ask normal questions. Normal questions. Yeah, that did not come out right. So here’s my question, because the show is called The Truth about real estate investing. And thats the thing I like about when gentlemen, like yourself, you have access to a wide database, essentially, yeah, how many of your clients are full time and you call full time investors? In t percentage. You mentioned earlier, your average client has like three to five properties.


Moe  

I would say 75% of our client base are probably investors and about 25% are working abroad or out of town and are just using our services to keep their unit rent in cash flow, make some money, while they’re, you know, either deciding whether they’re going to come back, or they’re going to sell the property at a later date. So I mean, some don’t want to be landlords there is it’s just something that has been thrust upon them because of job change or something like that. But yeah, it’s it’s kind of all over the map. And as I was saying, I do the client intake and half f it is, you know, talking to new investors, first time buyers, and half the business these days seems to be people that have went and did it on their own DIY landlords, got themselves into trouble have delinquent tenants, you know, it’s all over the map.


Erwin  

This sounds like regular people just doesn’t sound like foreign buyers, or, mega multinationals.


Erwin  

So foreign buyers isn’t really…


Moe  

Like, there isn’t like massive foreign buyers showing up, they are there. But I would say the majority of our portfolio are Canadian citizens, even if they’re living abroad. So they’ve bought these properties when they were here and moved abroad. I mean, I do have the, you know, calls once a while from the Middle East, Latin America, Europe, California, China, or like, you know, wherever, in Asia, where they want to invest here and Vancouver and Toronto had arranged now and so they’ve, you know, set their sights on, you know, kWC or other parts of southern Ontario. So, yeah, I mean, if we can, you know, get them to buy obviously, it’s business for us, and, you know, whoever our Realtors are, that were, you know, dealing with at the time. And, you know, they’re looking at all sorts of places in southern Ontario, so they’re looking at London. We really don’t go down there. It’s a little bit far we’ll help a few clients that are good clients. If they really want us to, you know, travel that far. We’ll do it for them. With multiple units 


Moe  

Yeah, foreign buyers, I think, you know, vs. 


Erwin  

I bring it up because they’re now banned. 


Moe  

Yes. Yeah. I mean, they’re, they’re banned. So we’ll see how long this lasts. See if there it makes any difference? I think the government’s gonna find out quickly that there’s just no worries. Yeah, exactly. 


Erwin  

Which is surprising cause it made headlines. Yeah. That’s what you got to talk about in the budget, there’s much more important thing.


Moe  

I think the big thing they’re going to realise, and if they asked anybody that was in real estate, what the real problem is, their policies, obviously, the as far as Ontario government, provincial LTB, guidelines, etc. And a shortfall in new housing. And I just, as I was saying earlier, I just don’t think there’s enough labour to keep up to demand and kids these days aren’t getting into Brick Lane, you know, framing all the things that are needed, because they’re, they’re getting into, you know, computer sciences, etc, to the comforts of Yeah, of not their parents. Exactly. And they’re not prone to physical labour. And I think there’s gonna be shortfall there. And I know, the government has said they want to build I believe 400,000 new units in the next few few years to you know, I just don’t think it’ll be enough. And I just don’t think they’ll reach that number.


Erwin  

Okay. So all right. Well, no, and I want to talk about other things, but I need I need to get one of these bad realtor stories. Oh, yeah. So can you tell me about the bus tour outside of Google.


Moe  

Yeah, I was telling Erwin earlier that. Yeah. So I mean, I think I’ve been dealing with lately is lately. Forever. That’s for the last few years. We’re noticing because of the Toronto prices, invest your money, like you know, especially investors that are reifying to take that money and put it to work in Toronto would just won’t work. And so they come down the highway to Guelph, Guelph is getting out of control. So they’ll come down to Cambridge Kitchener Waterloo, and they’ll think, you know, I was our area experts now. Yeah, we’re getting realtors that Yeah. Think they know the area. Meanwhile, they’ve probably been here once just go through town.


Erwin  

They know Toronto very well. Now they know Guelph really well. Now they know Cambridge really well got it


Moe  

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And some of these realtors are over promising and under delivering. So they’re no, yes, yes, it believe it or not. And they’re bringing their clients down. And they’re telling them, you know, pie in the sky stories of outrageous rents at low prices as far as like, you know, units, they’re acquiring. And when by the time they get to me, I have to, you know, temper their expectations, so to speak. And we, you know, this is a common thread, I’m seeing a lot of realtors come down here. And they know that at the end of the day, once they get the sale, they can move on. And if they find a property manager, like me or somebody else, then you know, the issue is then foist upon myself or the other property manager to deal with. And like I said, there’s sky high expectations coming from these landlords. I was telling Erwin, a story of some Asian investors coming down with clipboards on a tour bus, like the same that would go to casino ramaa, etc. And instead of a gambling, yeah, different type of gambling and even argue it’s better. They were coming down to look at condo projects, downtown Kitchener. And one Saturday morning, I believe the realtor sold about 20 of them to these investors and then passed my number on. And when I finally spoke to some of these investors, they were under the illusion that, you know, the prices didn’t align with what I was telling them the rents would actually be because this isn’t downtown Toronto is not the street. You know, you don’t have guys from the stock exchange renting these places with six figure salaries. 


Erwin  

Yes, that’s not the financial capital of Canada. 


Moe  

Exactly.


Erwin  

Cambridge is not the financial capital of Canada. 


Moe  

Exactly. We haven’t we have to hold on, which has, you know, you know, which manufactures Lexus. So, I mean, there’s some high paying jobs there. There’s Google, but there’s only a few 100 people working at Google, and the majority of those people probably own their own unit. So these six figure salaries, they just don’t exist.


Erwin  

These these landlords aren’t gonna attract that tenant profile. 


Moe  

No, and it’s a blue collar area, even though Waterloo has the universities, the majority of single family, you know, tenants aren’t the same profile. So they’re not white collar. They’re mostly not educated. And the average wage even in the manual, even if you count some of the manufacturing outside of Toyota is still under $20 an hour. So once you’ve figured out the cost of living, there’s not much left especially if…


Erwin  

Wiat these are landlords who put up their money they must have done due diligence and knew this already.


Moe  

No, the realtor does the due diligence is the problem, right?


Erwin  

I’m sure he did a really good job to take care of this client. 


Moe  

Well, we do the clients that do come on, and I can convinced that, you know, you may be underwater, but you’ll make money with mortgage pay down and appreciation. You know, they’re the ones that, you know, after a while they gain our trust. And they understand that, you know, we weren’t the ones to put them in this predicament, but we’re here to help them out.


Erwin  

What was the rent delta between what the what they were sold, and what was reality.


Moe  

Anywhere between 500 to $1,000. So massive discrepancies. And, you know, the numbers just aren’t working anymore, unless you’re getting into bigger multi unit projects, where, you know, the cap rates may be above 4%. But just the prices have skyrocketed


Erwin  

And you can’t do 20 of those in the bus tour.


Moe  

Yeah. And the the lending rules have tightened. And, you know, we’re seeing even banks asking for asking us for like letters of opinion, you know, and sometimes we can’t lie, obviously, I don’t want to get involved in mortgage fraud. So we have to be honest of what we can get in rent. And then you know, you have realtors or mortgage brokers coming back and yelling, oh, you should have put 2500 down for that place. I’m like, you can Yeah, I was like, Yeah, you put up your licence, I said, you know, in reality only fetches 1800 dice. And even if the underwriter does due diligence, they’ll figure out that my number is closer to what he’s gonna find. And I said, it’s gonna be that dumb. They run comps. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And, but I mean, you know, at the end of the day, this is a commission based industry. Everybody’s chasing a quick buck, and they’ll move on to the next deal. And, you know, especially with mortgage brokers and realtors, once their deal is done, they’ve been paid, they wash their hands and let a guy like me deal with the fallout.


Erwin  

And that’s why I love the opinions of property managers. commission based, yes, right.


Moe  

Exactly. We have some commission based, like structure, but I mean, the day to day residual payments we receive, you know, the headaches from that don’t correlate actually, with what, you know, somebody on the other side is being paid as far as their, you know, outrageous commissions. And, I mean, I have nothing against realtors, you know, some, some realtors are my best buddies, but, I mean, their commissions have stayed the same ever since I’ve gotten real estate, which is, you know, half of 5% for one end. And, you know, house prices have, you know, in some instances gone up, like, you know, 500 to 1,000%. But the salaries from, say, 30 years ago, haven’t gone up commensurately. So, you know, these things don’t align. And, you know, but realtors, just because they’re making a lot of money, and the the biggest players in our town in our area, are doctors, lawyers, engineers, they’re not the you know, university educated. They’re actually realtors, some with high school education. And they’re good marketers, good salesmen. And they’re making outrageous sums of money. 


Erwin  

And that’s one of the problems of Canada. 


Erwin  

It is what it is, right? 


Erwin  

And this is part of the bigger problem, because as long as all thhose who are making money in real estate, that doesn’t really help the future of Canada. Which is why I’m guessing we have these young gentlemen here, who are gonna save us all. Yeah, so pay for the bill that we’ve kind of racked up.


Moe  

Exactly. Generation is social media generation, right. And, I mean, I like Gary Vee as much as the next guy. But I mean, the way he promotes things, sometimes it’s like he, you know, he’ll say, you know, everybody can just triple down on what they’re good at, and go make a tonne of money and not have any education, etc. Right. Not that I have an education myself. But I think, you know, there’s a, you know, we need people in STEM, like those areas and subjects and homeowners forward. Yeah, exactly. And yeah, if you can make, you know, or sell something online and use tick tock to, to sell it and promote it, and you know, have a business create good for you. But the majority of people are going to fail. And so I mean, that’s basically. 


Erwin  

All right. Well, I think we’ve qualified you as an expert on real estate. So hopefully, you’ve vetted these guys. 


Moe  

Yes, I’ll let them talk now


Erwin  

Akshat, Rishard. What are we talking about today?


Akshat  

I mean, you know, Moe covered his side of the story. You know, we met more through a social media group, you know, got connected and now we’re looking at the other side. You know, I always look at the older folks the experience folk, as not understanding technology or and


Erwin  

Now we’ve ruined everything for you people. Yes. Young people.


Akshat  

Yeah. But Moe was one of those few people that we really like, you know, we think he’s a great consultant to the team because he brings the experience and he understands technology is something that will move us forward. And hence, that’s why we’re here, myself and Rishard both co founders we met in Waterloo. He’s doing his PhD from University of Waterloo. I finished my degree? BBA at Laurier. This is our second startup. Just a quick background about ourselves. You know, I was running my first startup in 2016. I started, it was in the rideshare space. So basically how helping, you know, the younger generation, let’s say the college students carpool from point A to point B, because Uber is pretty expensive go buses, you know, you have to take multiple buses, whether you’re travelling downtown from Waterloo or Waterloo to say East End to see your parents. So when you start a carpooling platform, you know, using technology where we connected drivers with student riders, and you know, they just have to pay $10 $15 per seat, so the cheaper way for them to travel. 


Erwin  

Okay, okay. Did you make money on this?


Akshat  

So just a little story on that, in 2019, we pitched on Dragon’s Den and that was our, you know, our first go to pitch that came out on TV. And we launched it in 2019, as well, we had around 25,000 users in that year, myself, Rashard, and our third co founder, we sold it to a company down in Toronto. So we got acquired in 2020, just before COVID. And then we worked with that company for I would say, 12 to 14 months, and you know, myself Rishard and a couple of other people. He said, You know, we like the startup space. Let’s do it again. And that’s where we are here. Right. That’s where we started RealMe. I think before we get into the solution, I think the biggest thing, you know, I wanted to talk about is the problem we wanted to solve. People, you know, that are fresh grads, starting their families off, you know, they have, you know, not too much knowledge about real estate, as again, Moe was talking about how there’s, you know, real estate agents, I’m not generalising. But there’s real estate agents that are good salespeople, but they don’t know about the market, they don’t know about the area that someone wants to buy in, you have a lot of lawyers, but again, they’re not very well educated, you know, how to cater to the younger generation. And if you’re looking at from, you know, someone who’s 2627, talking to an agent, or a broker, they don’t even get taken seriously. Because people think, you know, us as a younger generation, we don’t have enough money, we’re just kicking tires, you know, looking for houses. And that’s where we wanted to come in, because we see the younger generation, you know, the 10 20k, they have saved up. So in some cases 50 60k, when they’re starting up their families, they’re investing, they’re investing in stocks, they’re investing in crypto, because it’s very simple. You open up our app, you put in your KYC know your customer details, and you can invest. We got thinking


Erwin  

Gradebook everywhere. Exactly. But then Dogecoin


Akshat  

Yeah, exactly right. Dogecoin, Elon does a tweet, it goes from a less than a cent to 40 cents in a day, right. And the younger generation is acustomed to that kind of technology. They like everything on their phone, everything done quickly, convenient, hassle free. And that was the biggest problem we wanted to, you know, address is younger generation want to invest in real estate, it’s a high switching costs, you got to put in a down payment of let’s say, 90 200k, get a mortgage, go through all the different aspects that the younger generation doesn’t like, and maybe don’t have the money to do so right now because of the house prices going up. And that was the biggest problem. Right? So one of the biggest things we do even before putting up a solution is talk to people in our target market. A lot of people you know, we spoke to they want to invest in real estate, but they don’t know how to, you know, we asked a lot of people, you know, why don’t you invest in REITs 75% of the people we spoke to they don’t even know what a REIT is. And there’s a huge major gap in terms of the you know, the education point.


Erwin  

You went to business school, I went to business school pay ever mentioned a REIT to us? Sadly, no, no. I think you’re on a lunch and learn they mentioned real estate to us. Brokers, brokers came in. Yeah, but there’s no nothing.


Moe  

Nothing on personal finance. I heard in Florida, they’re gonna be doing that.


Erwin  

I still don’t trust them. Like that’s funny, those Florida, I wonder if I’ll mention Bitcoin


Akshat  

We will get to the crypto very soon. I’ll kind of have Rishard kind of handle a solution piece. But I think, you know, that’s the biggest piece, right? Like, I think in the news, I saw, they’re trying to put in personal finance in the grade nine math education. But that hasn’t passed yet. I saw this news two years ago, I know me and Rishard, were talking about it. We’re excited. We’re like, you know, we learned how to do taxes, because, you know, we had our family members, you know, CPAs you know, we we know how to manage money because of that. It wasn’t because of the school education. And you know, that we got excited because we saw the government, you know, posting something like this. But soon we understood as we are growing up and getting more experience in the field, as you know, government will put up a lot of policies, but barely anything happens. And that’s why we wanted to be on the field and try to make a small change for our niche market so that at least people within that age group within that market can see a small, you know, customer gain for the solution that we’re offering. So, you know, I’ll have Rishard kind of handle our solution piece.


Rishard  

Oh, thanks, actually, then more manageable. Again. If you think about the entire In the market, right, the stock market, the crypto market, it has evolved so rapidly. And that’s why you have so many people adopting and coming into the market. For example, with the pandemic, in the last two years, we’ve seen so many people actually coming into the stock market and the crypto market than it has ever been before. But if you look at the real estate market, and if you ask the same target group, they haven’t really been been exposed to the real estate market, just because of the friction associated sure there has been a uptick in the number of people that are coming into real estate. But these are the same people that were already in real estate, not the newer generation, not the younger generation, like myself. And actually, we still have that entry to barrier becoming higher and higher, because with time, only the downpayment that you need to put in has gone up the mortgage, that the amount of income you need to qualify has gone up. So it has become harder and harder for people to like myself and actually to be a part of real estate. So we wanted to create a system that is accessible to anyone and everyone, because right now it’s not. And it is a problem for us, because as much as we love putting our money on stocks and crypto, like you said, it’s diversified, it’s not diversified. And then also, it’s dependent still, it’s in early stages, especially crypto whatnot, it’s it can be manipulated easily, like you, you try putting your money into some kind that was launched couple of days ago, hoping you make 100x 1,000x Like the people might be crazy. And if you really ask that when we did have a customer discovery, we talked to a lot of people we went to miles, we basically gave away Christmas gifts, talking to people understanding their pain points, we went to skating rinks giving away free hot chocolates trying to understand their pain point to a different audience, right, especially the younger generation, no one knew about REITs, everyone has forgotten about owning a house, most of the people at least for the next 1015 years, because they can get into it. But they still know the gains associated with real estate. They’re like, hey, my parents owned a house, they’re looking for another house, whatnot. So they know the importance of getting into real estate at a young age. And they also understand there may be there’s one friend out of their entire friend, group friend circle, someone who got into real estate now has done fairly well compared to the rest of the group.


Rishard  

In case it’s positive can you hand over Moes cell phone number? So they can call? Make a friend? 


Rishard  

For sure. So what we did was, again, for myself, and actually, it just looked at took a step back looked at all the research we’ve done. How much do these people have as disposable income, right? Most of the people don’t have that much as disposable income. When you’re young, you have bills to pay, you have debt to pay, you have student loans to pay. And if you look at the disposable income, it’s always in the range of let’s say, anywhere from even $50 Up until $50,000. Sure there are some people who are outside of those lines. But most of these people fall into this category. With this category you can the current real estate market doesn’t really address anyone within that range. You can buy a house for 50,000, at least internal nowadays, people in other age don’t think like, oh, we have to move to Calgary to buy a house. We still want to live here because this is where our families this is where our work is. This is where we have our friend circle is.


Erwin  

I know it’s cold here, but it’s called. 


Akshat  

Just to add on to Rishards point. I was reading an article average gift sites from parents to their kids, but it’s 130k for a downpayment.


Erwin  

That’s across Canada. What is it for Vancouver, Toronto? 


Akshat  

It’s probably doubled that right.


Erwin  

I think it’s close to 200 or Yeah, exactly. That’s, that’s what the reporting


Moe  

If it’s longer than 90 days in your bank, then it’s just yours not not a gift.


Erwin  

Yeah, so much is missed in the data that’s available. 


Rishard  

Yeah, there’s so much that’s missed. And also, we look at the ones who are not privileged enough to be a part of the real estate game. And thanks to our parents, but now we are privileged enough in a way to be a part of real estate in the real estate game. But use a research show, just talking to people showed us how many these younger people are actually underprivileged and cannot be a part of the real estate game for the next 1015 years. And this was a problem for us. And as being the younger generation we wanted to solve it.


Erwin  

You actually think they’ll be able to get in 10-15 years from now? I don’t know


Rishard  

I’ll let Moe handle that question.


Erwin  

How can you save fast enough to keep up with the market?


Akshat  

I think it’s not saving, it’s investing.


Erwin  

Okay, okay. So if you do the right things… oh my!


Akshat  

because it’s honestly about financial literacy right. From day one. Like imagine being a teen. You know, my dad is a CPA. He’s like, Akshat, let’s get a credit card. Let’s build your credit history. I had no clue what a credit history meant. Oh, because how School doesn’t teach me that. Right and having the privilege as Rashard said, right. Our families were privileged enough, right? These guys are CPAs these guys are business people. They know steps, right? They have RRSP fund for us, everything was set up, but around us and being in the target market where a lot of people weren’t, we could see the problem, we could feel the problem, even as buying, you know, the story us buying the first house was a huge issue, because we were on our own. Yeah, we got the help from our family. But it was a difficult, you know, process because we had no clue how to buy a house. You know, we’re second time tech startup founders, you know, we have a lot of we like, Yeah, this is easy. But as soon as you get in the real estate market, it’s difficult because it’s your major purchase that you’re doing in a tech stock, you’re investing maybe five grand 10 grand in real estate, you’re investing 100 grand.


Erwin  

And if you have known your title mortgage, exactly, right. It’s really it’s a big commitment.


Rishard  

Yep. Yeah. So that, like I should say it again, those were we ended up being we had a roadblock, okay, there’s no solution. It’s just like, Okay, you, you basically put your money in a random coin and hope it goes up by 10, next 100x, in the next 10 years, and maybe, maybe still, I’ll have a chance that real estate, right.


Moe  

I mean, as far as like financial literacy, like a lot of our clients are white collar, very educated, but some of them come in with no concept of how to invest or anything. And, you know, they were these tenants know, landlords, I mean, like, like, you know, some of our clients are doctors, lawyers, engineers, smart, smart people. But I mean, you know, the basic concepts of landlording elude them. And, you know, sometimes it’s like, we deal with people all the time. And sometimes it’s the ones that, you know, that are the smartest that out with themselves. Right? And, you know, I think you’re You told me your dad’s a doctor, too, right? Hey, yeah. So I mean, I don’t know, if you got him.


Erwin  

Yes, he understands a lot more of the poems and why, why we need to invest. 


Moe  

Yeah, so. And as I mean, you’re a father, you got a couple of kids, but I mean, make sure that you know, this is going to take priority, and your kids are going to know this stuff growing up.


Erwin  

We’ve already had discussions with our kids. So first off, my kids are eight and six. We already have discussions with them about what money is, wow. And what fiat currency is.


Akshat  

Because I remember when I was a I know, from mine, and Rashard, that we were outside just playing with our neighbours, that was our only.


Erwin  

Can’t see other people


Moe  

So, his children, it will be the rare circumstance where they’ll either, you know, figure out a way to buy their first property or investment property have their property, you know, I didn’t want to say that he’s probably already got them set up.


Rishard  

I was talking to someone else yesterday. And then he’s into real estate investment as well. And he said, Oh, I’ve already gotten the properties for my kids, but they won’t know until they get married. They will, I will surprise them with the gift, because I know for a fact they won’t be able to afford the house when they get married. Yeah, I’m like, wow, say it’s a you have to plan now, if you are privileged enough so that you can help your kids maybe in 20 years.


Moe  

Yeah, I mean, they’re already SOL, the majority of them coming out of school, you know, married in debt and nobody to guide them. Right. So this is going to be a common theme going forward.


Erwin  

we can blame whoever we want. But from my experience, second generation investors are much better than first generation investors. So who we assign the praise for that. Right there. Parents. All right. Wish, like more were you’ve seen this. You’ve seen second generation investors and how much better off they are? Yeah. Second generation anything second generation cop, Doctor? Teacher? Anything? Yeah. All right. You’re better at you’re probably better than your parents were when they started. Yes, no. So we can blame everyone. 


Moe  

Yeah. I mean, there’s lots of blame to go around. 


Erwin  

But we know that we know the path of success, though. 


Moe  

Yeah, yeah. 


Rishard  

So even so going back to where I left off, even with, let’s say, in our case, we had money saved up and had some help from parents and family too and still then you look at all the debt to income ratio, all of us, like, you know, we have all stepped up and we have a car that’s leased out and you add all that up, you still can’t get into real estate market, even if you have the downpayment, even if you’re making good money as we are both in the IT field too. 


Erwin  

I have both those things, and I had girlfriend, alright, continue that last one that you guys do, so please continue.


Rishard  

Well, so it’s hard. Even if you have the money, you still don’t have an entry point, especially in the in the generation that we are targeting. That’s when we decided together to come build a solution that can cater to the entire younger audience. And it doesn’t it doesn’t start from the younger generation it can It caters to the entire population, like you said more. There’s a lot of these folks who are really smart, who are who are doctors, engineers, who still don’t have that literacy enough to make that right choice. And people want an easier and easiest solution. Because with, with the day and time today, people are used to more of Tap, Tap, Tap Done. It’s even the checkout process, everything is becoming so much simpler, that you take away so much friction. But real estate is one of the biggest sectors in the world, but has remained the same ever since you’ve gotten to the point sure the prices are increasing, but the technology associated with it has stayed the same. That’s pretty bad, pretty bad. And it was outrageous. That’s when we decided to build the system where you can buy fractions of a house, we looked at Bitcoin, we looked at stocks, we look at what Wealthsimple is doing now, you can buy a fraction of a stock, you can buy a fraction of a Bitcoin, you can buy fractions of crypto, but can you buy fractionsof houses? No.


Erwin  

Shipment needs to happen.


Rishard  

That’s when we saw an opportunity. And the need was confirmed by other it’s by talking to people, we need to build this from ground up. We basically said hey, we buy a house, we divided into $50 units, you can now invest anywhere from 50 to 50,000, whatever the number that person wants to now you’re a part of the real estate.


Erwin  

Wait So are you guys capping it?


Akshat  

There’s a cap just to make sure I mean, Rashard, we’ll go into more governance pieces 


Erwin  

Well not for me, right. Yeah, so I’m not Catholic, right. All right. All right. 


Rishard  

Anyone who’s anyone who’s who’s already in the real estate market? I’m sure you are most likely that not an accredited investor.


Akshat  

Yeah, cuz I mean, you have probably two properties is worth more than 3 million.


Rishard  

The record is there, then you’re good. There’s no limit when it comes to that if you’re an accredited, but then sure, we still do have to play by the book, we need to ensure that we are looking at your risk to your risk ratio. And we are giving them advice through our partners. To tell them this is how much you can invest safely in this so that they’re not just taking a random bet on the real estate market. We are also still mitigating the risks through all these other partners that we’ve made. We’ve, for example, like more, comes with so much experience, we want him to advice we want him to tell us if we want him to tell me how much should I invest in this, this particular property, I want to diversify my portfolio as well. For example, we looked at REITs, right? When you when it comes to REITs you’re putting the money on the entire portfolio that they have. But I personally prefer putting my money in each house.


Akshat  

Because you look at commercial REITs right now, last five years, most of them are actually losing 8% Over the last five years, which is a crazy stat. I know COVID is a anomaly where you know, REITs are commercial rates went down because there’s pressure off of space. But you know, the as Rishard talked about, a lot of people obviously first don’t even know about REITs. But when they look at the returns, the younger generations, you know, used to 40 50% return in crypto, imagine showing them REITs they’re like, no What the hell, right. And that’s why using individual real estate, and you know, providing them an actual house $1,000 into this, and you know, we’re gonna maybe finance maybe cash, whatever that is, you’re leveraging your debt as well. If the market goes up by 10%, you’re probably making 20-22 back, depending on how you’re leveraging your debt. And that was the case, right? A lot of folks within the target market wanted to be part of individual fractional ownership, right.


Erwin  

As you just mentioned, something just run a clip, I just want to highlight it, a lot of people don’t understand our returns are so high, because we’re so leveraged   Exactly, exactly, you put on like put down 20% For example, then the returns are basically if property goes up 3%.


Akshat  

Yet, your cash and cash is great, even if the market is going up. 10 15%.


Rishard  

then the point being is that a lot of younger generation, they look at this news, write all that and then they’re like, Okay, it’s 23% 23% doesn’t really mean much to me when I’m making maybe 20% over four months, but they don’t see the leverage piece because you’re putting 10% down, let’s say you put 10% down 90% leverage and then you’re nine times whatever the profit that you’re making, so if it is 10% You’re making 90% on your downtime.


Erwin  

And that is just an example we don’t worry. Yeah. Are you guys actually finding landing for this 90% value?


Moe  

People yeah, like I mean, you know, I get younger generation though, you know, talk about crypto and stocks and you can get a mortgage for that stuff. You know, you can get a line of credit for whatever you want to do. But for you know, mortgages you know, it’s you know, you can’t beat it at night you know, and explain to people bad debt, good debt, etc. Right. And okay, You know, what are you going to do in 10 years? You’re gonna catch it, everything’s there, no, oh, well just stay in debt. The more the more debt you have, the more you make, right? And they don’t seem to get that right and explain to people that, you know, how does this person buy 30 properties while I go, they go further into debt, I said, you know, I tell them, you know, the, these properties, they appreciate the mortgage gets paid down, and you know, their equity increases, they’ll go back to the bank and borrow even more money. And I said, go buy it, and then, you know, rinse and repeat. It’s a common, you know, formula. And that’s just how it works. And, you know, the people that to realise that leverages everything, and this game, they’ll, you know, do better than the person that doesn’t, 


Erwin  

And this isn’t financial advice.


Akshat  

You know, example, like, I know, so many of my friends, they’re like, 2625, two years after university, they have money sitting in their savings account, a 30 40k. Because they’re working jobs, they say they’re making 80 90k in Toronto, they have money saved up, but they’re putting it just in their savings. They’re maybe putting some in stock, some in crypto, but most of their holding isn’t savings. Because they they think saving the money. They don’t think what inflation means, right? Last year’s inflation was what, eight 9% or something, something crazy. And for them another example right for them. There is this year OSAP Bill 30k, I can tell you, like 80% of my graduating class would pay that 30k Right away, if they have money sitting because like, then I’d wait there as long as like, when you look at the interest rate right now. 24, the government’s doing on OSAP it’s close to 1% you’re paying what let them borrow 1% pieces off, like, you know, understanding like from financially.


Erwin  

Like God, I go London. Give me 5%


Moe  

Or 14 for somebody else.


Erwin  

This is not this terrible for the gentleman, please. Let’s go back to the investment though. What is the investment? What is the underlying? Because that yeah, if the underlying is good, that protects the investment, right? Because we’ve seen Epic Fails of not very good investments. So please, what is the investment? So Metaverse is it plays in universe, 


Moe  

It’ll be actual real estate like brick and mortar, right? You know, where someone’s not going to wake up and decide to sell it right away. Right? So, you know, we’re going to do a mix of different things, see what works. You know, right now, it’s, even though myself we’re in kW car companies in kW, see, I would prefer if we bought these properties that we’re going to be getting funding for down our way. But the numbers just unfortunately, don’t work with how prices have skyrocketed. So our first couple of investments have been out of town, and ones in Kirkland lake, the home of Alan Thicke and found a property. And Elizabeth Kelly, I think, you know, her, she or her husband runs a property management company up there. So they’re helping us, we got a great deal. It’s a lower end unit. But I mean, the numbers are terrific for what we’re trying to do. And you know, what would be a down payment here, you can buy the whole unit up there. And then we picked up a duplex in that that one, Kirkland Lake is a four Plex, the duplex that we got off market is in Peterborough. And we’re looking to eventually move the current tenants out after their school term and raise Yes, students and raise the rent, I forget, I think you want us to Stanford for school, and the other unit is vacant, we’re going to be doing some work on that one and try to get top dollar for both units come trespass. Because that’s when that term ends, and you know, have a nice cash flowing property that we can either flip for, you know, a profit or cash flow and hold long term and see what the appreciation is like between two and five years. So, you know, depending on the situation, it’s gonna determine what we do with these properties, right, you know, might be buying hold, it will be the, you know, the majority of what we do, but I mean, you know, if the market dictates a flip scenario, and the money’s there to be made, you know, that’s how we’ll go about it. Right. And hopefully, these smaller investors can enjoy these types of returns, and it’ll be a little while, it’ll be a lot safer than crypto safer than, you know, the stock market. 


Erwin  

Real underlying. Yeah, that’s a real physical asset. 


Moe  

Yeah, exactly. The underlying asset is stable, and you can’t get a better market than Southern Ontario. And as I was alluding to earlier, yeah, Vancouver and Toronto are basically, you know, out of most people’s range, and, you know, so they’re looking at other parts of southern Ontario and we’re right in that area. And I think there’s lots of rumour run. So I think the next five years is when you’ll see another big leg up massive gains. And I think people will look back on this time, like, slightly post COVID, if you can call it that, where they’ll say, You know what the war is going on rate hikes are coming, this is actually a good chance to buy, because these are temporary, yeah, this is just going to be before the next run up. And, you know, even in the last six to eight weeks, because we’re talking in early April of 22, or now, with the difference between end of January, early February to now we haven’t seen the amount of bidding wars that were going on, you know, slowly, you know, conditions and inspections have come back on some properties, especially where we are that we’re doing the same thing. And, but I mean, I think this would be short lived, I don’t think a home inspector should get too cosy, because it’ll go back to the craziest soon enough. That’s basically what we’re doing. And that’s where I’m trying to help these guys. And they’re obviously taking care of the tech portion and the platform, and they have some great developers, and NF T’s will also be a part of it. I have no idea how they really work. So I just keep hearing it, and I’m trying to figure it out. But it’s one of those things that like crypto, I still, you know, understand the basic concept, but it’s hard to wrap your head around.


Erwin  

All security. Yeah. That’s Internet security.


Moe  

Yeah. Blockchain. I mean, you know, I don’t know what these guys have planned as far as the technical aspect. But they’re bright guys. And I believe they’ll have a solution that works. And it’ll be different than someone like Addy, where, you know, they’re looking for I believe, minimum $2,500.


Akshat  

Maximum is $1500. Okay. The holding period, I think, four or five years, okay, you have to hold on.


Erwin  

Folks, we love it, we’re, for sure. Feel free to like, I’m not positive as I don’t know, for sure what the cap is %1500,


Moe  

I thought was 2500. That’s where I got the number of I thought it was credit investment. I know, there’s another platform out there. They’re coming out with Willow, and they have a little bit of a different structure. But this one should be a lot easier for junior investors to migrate. And it will be more along the lines of something like Wealthsimple.


Erwin  

And then so can you describe the investment is a DOW, is it or is this blockchain based?


Akshat  

It will be tokenized, essentially. So you know, just to kind of go into a background about NFT’s right? The last couple of years because of COVID. Everyone’s you know, on their computers and Facebook changing their name to meta Metaverse, and everyone going into buying, you know, land on a server. Right? All the influencers are putting their own tokens out, right, you you look at the note, boys, right? They had a huge token offering for a lot of their followers, they raised $4 million. And the tokens are nothing tokens just provide, hey, the boys minted our token on a on a network and giving it to let’s say, Rishard and me, what this token holds is, let’s say you and they get some free merch, you know, maybe they get like, say meetups, exclusive meetups in Toronto exclusive meetups everywhere. That’s what the token meant, okay means for the influential membership card. Exactly. From a from a digital standpoint, well, how we are looking to use NFTs, and combining it with real real estate is when we buy real estate, we put it under a smart contract. So when we meant tokens, let’s say we’re using Etherium blockchain to make a smart art, get a smart contract together. And mentor token through that, what we’re doing is we’re making a set amount of tokens that are worth set amount of value for the real estate that we have on our platform. So now we are basically using digital contracts in order to give you a token, give Rishard token, you have more token, give myself a token. And when you hold this token, you will get obviously rental income. And when you want to trade it in, you know, we look at appreciation even before the house is sold to give you the appreciated value for token how real estate right now it’s done is I buy a house, I get investors, I sell the house, I give you the profits. But why can we change it how stocks are? Right real estate always is appreciating? Right? 


Erwin  

Not always, depends on where.


Akshat  

long term. You’re looking at, let’s say from 2000 to 2019. It’s in Ontario, it’s gone up eight to 10%. Every year has been a gift. Yeah, no bad performance. But sorry, Alberta. Yeah, you look at you look at from a being a safer investment and a long term outlook. But if you have tokenization and give tokens to let’s say, 100 people, and you provide them a appreciation if they want us trade it in when they need the money, it’s a better angle for them to get into real estate on day one, and try it out for themselves. Right and by providing them tokenization you can also provide governance as you talked about Dow we’re not there yet. But what we’re doing is providing individual decision making, let’s say we have a house in Kirkland Lake four Plex, you know, we want to sell it, we can, you know, send out a quick update on our application. Hey, what do you want to do. So once we have a majority vote, we can sell it. So we’re providing a vehicle, right, as a technology platform, what we want to get into the future is homeowners can list their homes, we’re not going to charge them 5% of the home value. So there’s a huge positive advantage for them. On the flip side, you have fractional investors, people that want to buy this token, this NFT. But now this NFT is backed by an actual physical assets that you can touch. So it provides you the best of the technology world, but also it has good hedges you against, you know, a scam, like how a lot of NFT projects have been. But the technology itself just tied to something in cyberspace. Exactly. But yeah, if the network shuts down, yes, there’s that but then you can back it up. And you can have those things in place as well. 


Erwin  

No, my point is more like a like digital art, like, for sure. Yeah. What is it? Like? How you have that? Fire? Yeah, across the market for it, you know, versus a house in southern Ontario. And so again, like, there’s a market for it.


Rishard  

There’s definitely a market. And then also, we want to be able to if you’re going after the younger generation, who are into crypto and all these other assets, digital assets, we want to be able to talk the same language that they are able to understand we don’t want to go to them and be like, Hey, this is the mortgage, this is the agreement you assign, this is what you’re getting all that stuff, we can still do it i There’s nothing wrong with it. But we we don’t want to reinvent the wheel, if it is already been invented by a different cryptocurrency the digital asset, we’re just building that together. There’s real estate on this side. There’s digital tokens. On the other hand, we are basically marrying them together. And we are basically telling people, Hey, instead of putting your money on an asset and betting on it, why don’t you do the same thing that you’ll be doing with crypto, but instead of just betting on it, why don’t you take a calculated risk with us, you’d not only take precision, but there’s also rental yield that will be paid out to you on a on a quarterly basis, or whatever that we get to that point. And nowadays, if you look at a lot of these crypto projects that are coming up, even even I saw a project a couple of days ago, where they basically the concept is you initially buy into these currencies, the digital tokens, and they want you to hold because more people hold this, this particular the token, the value gets goes up because of supply and demand. Again, just like how it is with real estate, more people holding and don’t want to sell it sell their assets. So there’s less supply on the market. So there’s the value for each token goes up. But now that has no there’s nothing backing it up. It’s just that me buying a digital token and just keeping it up, just because it’s gonna go up, it’s just manipulation of the market, I’ve, unless there’s a real, real utility to it. With our kids, what we are doing is it’s a house, you’re buying a house, and we are going to keep it without selling it. And so you can so can you if you want to sell this completely fine, but you will be losing out on the entire position that we would be benefiting our when we sell the house, but you will still be able to benefit it partially, there’s nothing like that right now you can’t benefit partially out of a position, either you by yourself, right? What we are creating is that platform where you can buy into whenever you want, you can sell whenever you want. And at the same time, if you hold it for a longer period of time, you’re gonna get more appreciation, and also you’re gonna get it rental yield, that’s going to be paid out to you. So it’s a simple system that the younger generations are aware of, and the real estate market not so much, but bringing two together so that now you can invest in real estate without actually having to gain more knowledge. But this will make them research into more into real estate. 


Akshat  

Exactly, exactly.


Erwin  

Something so at least we need the easier starting point than buying a million dollar house. I’m in this business. So I understand how hard it is to get someone off a zero to from zero to a million dollar investment property. Exactly. So you mentioned yield paid for people who are holding tokens is that paid in cash is that paid more tokens?


Akshat  

So that’s something we’re working on it probably wouldn’t be paid in cryptocurrency we can use stable coins which are basically like let’s say USDT is pegged with the USD dollar. So people get digital currency like that. So let’s flip it to cash if they want. They can flip it anytime or they can.


Erwin  

Okay, we all need cash in our lives. No one’s taken my USDT. When I go buy lunch first mind shawarma.


Rishard  

This little piece about that having USD T or digital tokens that that’s pegged to $1 is now you can Do whatever you want, right? You can buy more unit in the same house and you’ll stake it. Yeah, you there’s so much utility to it.


Erwin  

I think we’re not so there’s gonna be a couple people who think we’re not. And we’re talking to foreign language. So I have a few more questions, follow on questions, how does someone exit their investment. So say I buy, say a pub $1,000 bar to buy tokens, I put 1000 hours of fear to buy tokens, how do I exit?


Akshat  

So currently, we have a one year hold period, just so that we get the demand and supply side, you know, getting to a point where we can do the buy sell for now what we’re doing is, let’s say you hold Rishard holds a token for 12 months, he wants to give it back. He wants to make the appreciation. He just, you know, messages the company, we give him the money or the digital currency with a precision back to his wallet account that’s connected with the real means account. So he gets it back, let’s say in 24 hours.


Erwin  

And those are gonna be a limit on how many people can redeem.


Akshat  

Again, right now we are seeing a one year hold period. And the thing is, you know, we have a we have a limit on how much you can invest. Let’s say you can invest 100k 200k On a rainy day property because then when you look at the governance piece, you hold the most value then right? We want to make it truly decentralised where people actually have the voting power, or they feel empowered, let’s say, you know, our limit is 5k. Again, that’s something we’re deciding on and working on, as we


Erwin  

Addy is 15 to distract Yeah, that’s the math 1500 1500.


Akshat  

Yeah, so I think that’s the piece where we where we say, okay,


Erwin  

Sorry, I said that wrong enough is 1500 Yes, 1500 is the maximum,


Akshat  

let’s say our limit is 5000. So when you invest 5000, and you want that money back, it’s easier for us to you know, go to our wallet or our own fund and just give it back to you. Right, but rather than someone investing 100 grand. But now when you make that system, and you have people buying and selling, we don’t even need to be involved, we truly become a platform, you want to sell your token, someone else can buy it at appreciated price, and they can hold it.


Erwin  

Right. So I unfortunately, it wouldn’t be the most liquid thing and the bid ask and probably be pretty wide on it, like years of market makers for this.


Moe  

No, I mean, like I said, he’s gonna, you know, it’ll take a while to get to that point where it’s actually, you know, tradable you know, on a day to day basis, right. But up until that point where there’s, you know, enough users in the platform, you know, big enough, you know, you’re kind of be stuck in it. But the end, the end goal is to make it like basically, well, simple for real estate.


Erwin  

Any like structured exits, for example, like in five years, so we’re gonna sell it no matter what type of thing or…


Moe  

Nothing, nothing. You know, yeah, we’re


Moe  

gonna refi it? 


Akshat  

That’s all decision of the folks that own the tokens, because we let them decide because it’s, like a Dow, exactly. I mean, that’s where we want to get into right, basically, making everything decentralised. Right,


Rishard  

first couple of property properties, people like most gonna make the decisions. But once we get to that point where we have enough users being able to make that decision with still some expertise from people like Moe, we don’t want them just going crazy. Clicking a button. Yes, yes, yes, let’s sell this property to trigger happy.


Moe  

And, like, I mean, you know, like I said,


Erwin  

this isn’t quick money, you know, we’ve been at understand that this is still I mean.


Moe  

If we, if we have a market run, like we did back in late January, early February, you know, that’s where, you know, it could get exciting and, you know, be everybody can decide, okay, yeah, you know, what, the 51% want to sell? And, you know, the other one wants to hold, right. But me, you know, the 51% that sold would have been right, you know, this time around, right, especially with the you know, incremental dip, right. 


Erwin  

So again, it’s purely need to get off zero. Yeah. And if you can afford to buy your own property, you should probably buy your own property. Yeah. Make your own decisions,


Moe  

You know, likely not going to be the case, right? 


Erwin  

That’s not the target investor for this. I mean, I’ll just give a quick example, I’ve been criticised for not doing our ESPs right, because it’s not too much. It’s I have too much going on my life. I don’t have the time for it. Right. My kids already each own a house. So yeah, they’re doing all right. 


Erwin  

Yeah, makes sense. Yeah. RRSPs are RSPs like, you know, a lot a lot of that stuff is, you know, for the working individual nine to five, it’s set up to vote for them. And


Erwin  

RSP is so much smaller than our RSP it’s so small.


Moe  

At least it’s something you know, better than nothing, right? Yeah. But I mean, if you know what you’re doing, you’re just gonna do other things.


Erwin  

Really cool. And can you share what your criteria is for an investment property?


Moe  

We don’t really have a criteria whatever the deal is solar same as like, you know, your realtor, you know, your Realty, taking investors around and showing them places is always just a matter of what works. Obviously, cash flow and future appreciation come into, you know, they’re probably the top Two things.


Akshat  

Two most pointed right. That’s why we looked at Kirkland Lake and Peterborough, because you’re looking at a cap rate of at least seven to 8%. So now you can give some rental yield back to the folks. Because if you buy something in Toronto, it’s maybe a percent.


Erwin  

Yeah, that’s given my credit card. So you can take money from me each month, you know, yeah, exactly. Gonna make it work. Unless you buy cash. So sorry, are these properties that you mentioned, like computer brunkert, like, there’s mortgages on them?


Akshat  

Right now, we it’s all cash offers, you gotta move,


Erwin  

Because how else you’re gonna get more who’s gonna who’s gonna qualify for the mortgage,


Akshat  

Exactly. You have move the model get into the market, or then you can look into, you know, getting some private folks private funds involved, right? Like there is I know, the the pension plan does a lot of investing in real estate. So getting folks like this behind you, so that they can fund your operations, maybe work with banks on the commercial side, right, where we can get some money that’s asset backed, so we can get to 80% and loan 70% and loan that 30% could be people’s money put in. So appreciation could be leveraged as well, over time.


Erwin  

I mean, the structure and the regulation for this investment, does it fall under Securities Commissions or rallies all cities?


Akshat  

Again, we are looking at an LP structure. But if you look into let’s say, a token versus a security, right, there’s four criterias. So again, you know, we’re working through the legal side, we have some partners, but if we use tokenization, it doesn’t fall under securities for now. Exactly. And you look at some of these companies in the US doing it for I think the last two years and getting over 100k users. And there’s no you know, rules or regulations, because you’re basically getting smaller amount of money, you’re not getting 100k from a non eligible investor, you may be getting 5k from that person. So the limit itself is very small per individual. And if you’re tokenizing it and the transaction that happens is done through digital currency to a token, so your security has to be a cash input. So if you can change that, it currently, as of today, it doesn’t fall under that.


Erwin  

I can imagine how long things will take if the government gets involved with security.


Rishard  

If you really think about it also, like if we are truly a platform, at the end of the day, we are not selling securities, like looking at the concept of it. We right now currently, you see people, four people, five people getting together and buying a house. And they don’t have to go through exempt market dealer or trying to understand if they’re accredited or non accredited. When you’re putting let’s say me, and Moe and Asha, then let’s say four of us decide to buy a house together, put, put, let’s say, out of the 10 of 20%, that we are going to put, let’s say each of us take 5%. And 5% means 50,000, or 100,000, doesn’t really matter. No one’s going to check if you’re an accredited, non accredited whatnot, but you are still able to do it. And it’s completely legal. And what we are trying to do is the same thing we are trying to bring into for people, we’re trying to maybe bring 100 people together per property, we are trying to bring 200 people per property, we are not we are we’re basically bringing them together to buy that entire property. So we are truly becoming a platform, a middleman to actually provide, hey, there are these are some great opportunities for you guys to invest. And if and then on the other hand, we are bringing people, Hey, here’s how you can invest using tokens. And we are bringing two together, and then now it’s a close community for that house. But for let’s say for house that we have in Kirkland Lake, let’s say we get 200 investors through this platform. So it’s 200 people closed in and look with that house. They’re married to the house. Now they make whatever the decisions later on to do whatever they want without so it’s exactly how we would own a house. With four of us. It’s now with 100 people with the medium to do that communication. For first we can make easy decisions, right? Right now, let’s say mom wants to paint the house. We all agree we paint the house. But when it is 100 people, you can’t necessarily do it the old way. To make that decision, you need a structure. That is what we are bringing into our platform as well.


Erwin  

 I look forward to and this all works. Because I might want some early exits on some of my properties while maintaining a lot of ownership.


Moe  

Exactly. And I mean, it would be no different than you know, buying a stock and getting something in the mail, like a proxy vote or whatever. That were, you know, they expect you to chime in and you know, like I mean, it may not matter depending on you know who the major shareholders are. But the term we’ve bandied about is democratisation. So I mean, that that’s how we’re gonna look at it and small investors, they, you know, in that 1000 $2,000 range, there’s no way you can get in the market, there’s nothing you can do. You can’t even pay legal fees with that number, right. So I mean, to get up piece, you know, real estate and, you know, consider yourself a real estate investor. You might be the only way to do it,


Erwin  

Right! Could I ever, ever use like RealMe and offer up 49% of one of my real estate properties?


Akshat  

That’s something we looked at. It’s just is difficult because, you know, you probably have to put in a property in an LLC, like if you’re going in the States, and then using that putting that LLC in a smart contract, so that people can buy it. So it’s hard to do fractional we looked into and maybe in the future, okay, because it, it opens up your, you know, where we’re at, and gives you cash right away.


Rishard  

Exactly. So like I said, we wanted to start from that initiative, because we always believe in technology. And we, again, Moe is a great guy when it comes to real estate making those decision. But at the same time, let’s say for us to scale up, right, like, we can be going around trying to find properties every day, let’s say we grow. We want to get into the place of even for a in our case, example, we got a house and I wanted to see if I can sell a portion of it and liquidate that, but I couldn’t, I had to sell my entire property because that’s the only way to get out of the investment. So we looked at okay for us to become truly a platform. And to be able to scale this up, we need to really become the platform that connects the two sides. Right now we are doing this part right now, buying properties and doing all that. But we want to get to a point, there’s technology, you let’s say you want to put your property down, we do the evaluation using all of our the algorithm that’s involved, we say, Hey, this is the price that we can offer you for this many shares. And of course, mitigating the risk at that point as well. And then getting to that point where you can still own 51% 49% goes in here, they own 49%. And when you get to that point, again, this is very long term. But again, that is that is sort of the direction that we would love to go forward.


Moe  

And I recently picked up a triplex that we were going to throw it on the platform, and I was gonna do exactly what you’re saying is, you know, but I think you know, there’s a huge market out there for that. Because I mean, what you’re suggesting is, you know, what, I can avoid going to the bank and doing a refi. And, you know, giving him you know, all that information, I can just go to this platform, raise the money, you know, have it on there, right? joint venture partner? Yeah, so, exactly. And so I mean, but in that instance, you know, then you would have people that own these properties and decide, okay, something happens in their personal life, they need to sell that property, like, you know, what’s the exit strategy, they’re far more invested is going to take the house out, or you’re going to have to basically make everybody hold that investment. And, you know, plus whatever appreciation they have, and then take the unit back. So it gets a little bit complicated. That’s why we’re just doing it in house for now. And then later, as it grows out, then we can, you know, see what kind of model there is for that.


Akshat  

Because in that model, it’s very hard to leverage that as well. If I’m taking, say, 40%, I’m giving you 40% cash. Now, appreciation, how does that work? Do I get 40% off your returns? Or do I get 40% of just the appreciation, right? It gets tricky. And we actually did a couple of test runs. And I mean, we still made money for some of our family and friends that put in money within our first two three properties that we you know, we didn’t launch, we just did test runs on. It made sense. But it’s just that aspect of real estate has always done well with leverage, right. And in this case, maybe there’s a way we can do both so that homeowners happy because it’s easy for them. And then the fraction investors happy as well. 


Erwin  

So we mentioned stocks and shares a couple times and one of the things that shareholders don’t like is shared dilution. So how do you control how many tokens are issued for?


Akshat  

So each property, we’ll have a finite amount of tokens that are issued on day one, so the tokens can increase or decrease? Because on a smart chain, it’s a contract you’re writing. So once a contract is written, you can change it. So it’s, you know, you can say for if it was just a corporation, we can just issue more shares. But on a actual blockchain, you cannot. So the the people that get the tokens, there’s no more tokens that are made by us. But what we can do is these people can buy and sell within a platform or long term.


Erwin  

But this is the same tokens. These aren’t new tokens.


Rishard  

These are not Yeah, exactly. Imagine now once we get to the point where we have that many users, but finite tokens. Now you have that marketplace to buy and sell whenever you want


Erwin  

Like NF T’s and they’re finite. 


Akshat  

Exactly.


Moe  

Bitcoins finite, right.


Erwin  

Fully becoming finite. Yeah,


Akshat  

there’s about, I think 2 million left somebody’s mind. But then I think this crazy number 3 million has been lost by people.


Erwin  

Yeah, who knows how much was lost? And how many people will refuse to sell it no matter what.


Moe  

I lost some, but 100 bucks worth. I lost the seed phrase.


Erwin  

It’s only it’s worth 100 bucks today.


Moe  

It’s probably no it’s probably worth about 300-400 now, but I mean, I contacted


Erwin  

Coinbase Coinbase stuff


Moe  

You know what? I don’t want it to at least give it to charity. They wouldn’t even do that.


Erwin  

No, they can’t access it. It’s gone. They can access it. Yeah. 


Moe  

So just in the ether just sitting there. I stopped looking at it because you know, as can be 1000 bucks now, right?


Erwin  

Yeah, that’s a weird, crazy thing. Yeah, I had a friend who lost a bunch and went to see a hypnotherapist to see that you’ve figured out his password didn’t work out.


Akshat  

That’s crazy. He went to a therapist?


Erwin  

Hypnotherapist. Oh, there was a guy from my tribe members password.


Moe  

I was reading a story some guy from 2010 2011 in England, he he bought pizza with a bunch and he had a bunch of those. He there’s girlfriend threw away the drive that had the password. And he’s still fighting with city at somewhere in England to dig up the landfill. Half a billion dollars or something crazy and go and touch it.


Erwin  

It’s gone. How you find it too? 


Moe  

Well, he’s got all this stuff figured out. 


Erwin  

Yeah, people that would that would help them find it for a piece. Yeah.


Rishard  

So funny faces. I remember my password. But I did invest. So it was at that point when I was in undergrad doing my undergrad 2000 This was back in 2015 14. I think I wanted to test out so I put I think I put one buck or two bucks. And it’s it’s now I’ve somehow I was able to log in few days ago. It’s one buck two bucks. I think it was close to $20 but not so I’m like, only if I had put baby 100,000 or 10,000 Forget about geez, I actually tried it out but of course didn’t keep track of that, but not.


Erwin  

FascinatFascinating. Gentlemen, this is fascinating stuff. I wish you all the best. How can people follow on your journey?


Akshat  

So we have a landing page on real me property.ca So they can join the waitlist. So for the first 10,000 people, we’re going to be launching our MVP like our minimum viable product platform so that they can you know get into the first two investments. So that should be going live in the next 30 days. But you know, they should be able to sign up on realmeproperty.ca through their email and once our platforms live or at least for MVP use, they’ll be the first ones to use it.


Rishard  

Yeah, then they can also follow us on all social media at TikTok Instagram and Facebook as well. RealMeproperty and RealMe.


Erwin  

What do you guys putting on TikTok.


Akshat  

Right now on TikTok is more the education side, okay, telling people but…


Erwin  

How long are the videos? 


Akshat  

15 seconds. You’re giving them that quick word.


Erwin  

Test Moe, 30 years in 15 seconds and we’re done recording. You’re gonna dance your dance while you’re doing.


Moe  

Ssocial media part is taken by anti thing care of by some social media experts, we’ll call them younger people than I asked. Right? So. And yeah, our company, kW property calm. You know, you can find us if you’re looking for a place to rent or you’re looking for management. We have landlord forums, tenant forums and Instagram, Facebook, tick tock, we have kW property has accounts and you can engage with us there as well. And whatever you need, like I said, 75 to 100 kilometre radius, we can manage your investments. And the one thing that really separates us from everybody else is because of all our foreign clients, we do not touch the money that we don’t touch the clients rent. So majority of property managers take the rent, take your cut, give you the difference. Problem with that is embezzlement, fraud misappropriation of funds. I believe there’s a property manager in Waterloo who stole about half a million bucks being charged right now. So that was in the paper. And we have some clients that will have anywhere between like 2030, up to 120 grand storm. And so that being said, our system is different than everybody else’s. And the rent goes from intense chemicals to the clients account. We bill you separately. You can even pay us by credit card. If you click your mouse, we make it really hands off software focused and we can scale. So if you’re a landlord, and you’re looking for a good property management company, we have to be able to take you on.


Erwin  

And then the real estate market is gonna collapse. 


Moe  

No. I said no, no. I just say you know, I mean, like I said it’s that the sky is always falling right and if you listen to these people, they’ll they’ll tell you right you know, stop watching the news basically turn off Fox turn off CNN and every book. Yeah, exactly. Good book. You wonder how the, you know, you gauge the market or news, look at stocks, see how they do and then you’ll figure out what you know, I mean, I’ve been reading about like food shortages and then you know, there’s gonna be a shortage on fertiliser in Russia, etc. And I always tend to go back to the market. Whew, I look at McDonald’s, I look at Weston’s in those talks just keep climbing. So that tells me that the analysts and people following those things, which are huge institutions, are, you know, worried, then I’m not worried. Right. And those are multibillion dollar corporations and costs are just a new high. Yeah, exactly. So I mean, you know, you follow the big money, and that truly is big money. And, you know, you can base your decisions on that. Right. And so that’s a that’s basically it. So thanks for having us on. Appreciate it.


Erwin  

Thank you, you know, thanks for coming in. This is fascinating stuff. Yes, yes, the bail is one of these problems. Yeah. Any final words? Any final words?


Rishard  

No, I think you can make get in touch with us using our website. And of course, we are always looking for ways to improve test and 100% new people join our team as well as we grow. So get in touch with us. If you want to change the real estate game. Join us today. 


Erwin  

I offered my property 49%. Alright, thank you, gentlemen.


Akshat  

Thank you.


Rishard  

Thank you so much, guys.


Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood that my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario, if you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

To Follow Moe Hansrod:

To Follow Akshat and Rishard:

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

From Living in Affordable Housing to Building 400 Units of Affordable Housing with Alfredo Hermano

Greetings, fellow Wealth Hackers!

I’ve been investing since 2005, including through the last recession, the financial credit crisis of 2007-8. With a high probability of a recession coming, I can’t recommend enough that newer investors connect with veterans who have personal experience investing during a recession— the more real estate they had, the better. I personally had five properties with partners, and those were good times. I’ll go more into detail at our real estate meetup in May.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Being back in the gym is so great, especially not having to wear a mask to walk into the gym as I’m often running late, so rushing the kids and me out of the car and into the gym is often… well comical. I have my phone in my hand; I’m pulling my gym bag out of the trunk and trying not to spill water on my stuff while loudly encouraging the kids to move quickly as we are late. Then their gym bag gets stuck in the car’s footwell, and my hands are full… dealing with masks for myself too on top of the kids… well, I’m just glad I have one less thing to worry about.

At our last class, Maz, the owner and lead instructor of the Kick Boxing gym we belong to, welcomed me when I walked in and asked if I had a minute to chat.  He knows I’m late for class, and I’m thinking to myself, am I in trouble? Did I pay our dues? The last thing I want to do is owe money to someone who’s won over 30 professional fights and has a dozen championship belts on display throughout the gym. 

Maz tells me my daughter Robin is doing great in class and is ready to test for her bronze gloves, a two-hour test to exit the beginners’ program, by far the most comprehensive, longest test of Robin’s career.  I’m like, great! So what’s to talk about that couldn’t wait till after class?

Maz informs me that Bruce, who’s 18 months younger, is not ready to test and asks how I’d like to proceed.

First, I ask if the kids will be in separate classes, which I don’t want because that means twice the commuting and time investment on my behalf.  The answer is no, so I say no problem! I teach my kids all the time one gets what they earn, and this is a great life lesson opportunity. 

The heads-up is appreciated, but I wonder how other parents would deal with this situation.  I couldn’t imagine arguing with the head instructor that my son deserves to test when I, too, can see that he’s not ready. On the other hand, Robin is very good, likely the best in her class, and she’s been asked to participate in the recording of demonstration videos.

On the car ride home, it’s just Bruce and me in the car as Robin stayed home with a fever that day (non-covid, I rapid tested her myself). I told Bruce how Robin will be testing for her Bronze gloves as the coach says she’s ready and he’s not ready yet.  I ask Bruce if he’s fine with that.  Bruce asks if he can attend the test with me to support Robin.  That’s the response I was looking for. 

Apologies for the proud parent moment 🙂

From Living in Affordable Housing to Building 400 Units of Affordable Housing with Alfredo Hermano

On to this week’s show!

We have a pretty amazing story of Alfredo Hermano, who grew up in affordable housing, and now he’s building and developing a ton of affordable housing. He’s got three buildings on the go for a total of 400 rental apartment units with rents well below market value and plans to grow that number to ten buildings and well over 1,000 units.  These are investments, and part of the investment was crowdfunded via Addy, which I think is super cool, so even those with smaller bankrolls are able to invest.

On today’s show, Alfredo shares how his company 3H Properties Group is able to work with the government to provide subsidies AND his investors a return.

As usual, none of what is shared today is an endorsement.  Please do your research and due diligence; past results do not predict the future, and please seek professional investing advice. Everything shared today is for educational and infotainment purposes, and I wish you all success in your investment returns!

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Hello, my fellow real estate investors. This is the truth about real estate investing show. My name is Erwin Szeto. And I’ve been investing since 2005, including that much longer recession than the last one. We had pandemic recession. I’m referring to the financial crisis, the credit crisis of 2007, and 2008. With the higher probability of a recession coming, I can’t recommend enough that newer investors connect with veterans who have personal experience investing during a recession. The more real estate they had, the better. I personally had five properties with partners, and those were good times. At the time, yeah, it was a scary, but with a healthy dose of ignorance. We did just fine. And I’ll go in more into detail at our real estate meetup in May. I was I wasn’t that old. So yeah, wasn’t that smart, either. Anyway, so with things the way they are, being back to the gym is great, in my opinion, especially not having to wear a mask to walk into the gym or walking out of the gym, or, yeah, as because I’m often running late, or rushing the kids out of the car into the parking lot of the car and into the gym. It’s often very comedic and slapstick, like i got my phone in my hand and plumbing gym bag and about shrunk and probably tried to shove all this stuff in my pockets in the gym, trying to track down my shoes, and I’m holding my water balls squeezing or an arm somewhere. And while at the same time encouraging the kids to move quickly because they don’t move very fast. And they don’t understand urgency that well. So they often require a lot of loud verbal encouragement. Sometimes their gym bag gets stuck in the footwell of the car and my hands are full. So I’m having to verbally coach them on how to stuck their head stick and stuck and stick through their gym bags, their boxing gloves and stuff in the gym bag. So it’s a bit bulky. And then so on top of that we’ve never had to deal with masks too well, I’m just glad we have one less thing to worry about. 

 

Erwin  

At our last class Maz his full name is Mazimol. But he goes by Maz as the gym owner and lead instructor of our kickboxing gym that we belong to. He welcomed me when I walked in to the gym and asked if I had a minute to chat. He knows i’m late for class. So I do class too. So my kids are on time ish. But yes, he stops me. So I’m wondering, Am I in trouble to pay my gym dues, because the last thing I want to do is owe money to someone who’s won over 30 professional fights and has a dozen championship belts on display throughout the gym. So Coach Maz tells me my daughter Robin is doing great in class and is ready to test for her bronze gloves. That’s so she’ll be graduating from the belt system into what is a 2 hour exit test to exit the beginners programme. So this is again, it’s a two hour test. And my daughter’s never done, probably an hour test. So this is a two hour test. It’d be by far the most comprehensive test of my daughter’s career. And I’m like, great. So let’s talk about but couldn’t wait until after class. So I, you know, because I’m late. Maz goes on to inform me that Bruce, my son who’s 18 months younger, he’s not ready to test and asked how I like to proceed. So first, I asked him if my kids would be in separate separate classes, but you don’t want because that means twice the commuting. I don’t know how you parents do this shuttling around have kids when they’re in different programmes, because you know, my time investment, or at least our children as time investment have to be double, which is a no go for us. We’ll have to do it by mistake eventually. But try to hold off as long as we can. Maz says no, the answer’s no, they can stay stay in the same class. It’s just that they spend 50 minutes of class doing the more advanced stuffs also show them that I teach my kids that one gets what they earn. This is actually a great life lesson opportunity for me to tell my son he’s not getting a grade, which is honest. But Heads Up is appreciated, but actually wonder what other parents would do to deal with this situation. For myself. I couldn’t personally imagine arguing with the head instructor or dude who has 30 Professional wins 30 Plus professional wins, to arguing arguing with him that my son deserves to test for his bronze gloves when I can totally see he’s not ready for it. My daughter is very good at her class. She’s likely the best in her class and not just a my opinion. She’s been asked to participate as the demonstration student for the recordings of her classes. I think they’re making me making an online course or something. But anyway, it’s there, that she’s been there. Their actor I don’t know their demonstration student whatever you want to call it, but we all know that her technique is absolutely fantastic. Warning to all those who are bullies in or race bullies. My daughter will be well prepared. On the car ride home. It’s just Bruce and I in the car is Robin had to stay home that day. She’s She had a fever, non toilet related. I did the rapid test myself. I told Bruce how Robin will be testing for Brahms club gloves, which my son understands. As coach says that she’s ready, but he’s not. I asked Bruce if he’s fine with that. Bruce asked if he can attend the test with me to support Robin. That’s the response I was looking for. Apologies for the proud parent moment. 

 

Erwin  

Enough about me on to this week’s show, we have a pretty amazing story from Alfredo hermano who grew up in affordable housing. And now he’s building and developing a ton of affordable housing. He’s got three buildings on go right now, for a total of 400 rental apartments. With rents well below market, I believe he said 20% below market value for rents. And he’s got plans to grow that number to about 10 prop 10 buildings with over well over 1000 units in the short term future. These are investments and part of those investments are crowdfunded. Via Addy, we’ve had Steven from Addy on the show before, in case you’re not familiar on one of the more popular crowdfunding options in Canada, and I think it was super cool that these options are available to those who have smaller bank rules, and that they’d be able to participate in the real estate investing market. On today’s show, Alfredo shares how his company 3H Properties group is able to work with the government who provides subsidies, and he’s able to provide it to his investors in return. Pretty cool. As usual, none of this that’s shared today is an endorsement of anything. Please do your own research and due diligence past results do not predict the future. Please seek professional investing advice. Everything shared today is for educational and entertainment purposes. And I wish you all success in your investment returns. Please enjoy the show. 

 

Erwin  

Alfredo. Thanks for coming on the show.

 

Alfredo  

No problem.

 

Erwin  

What’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Alfredo  

Well, my businesses my family two young boys three and seven staying active staying healthy. Actually just before this it was nice I I got out on the Bruce Trail to just an Appleton to do a little bit of biking. Right here my head. So that was good. Keeping healthy.

 

Erwin  

Good for you. Yeah, but no golf. You Live on a golf course.

 

Alfredo  

I live right in front of a golf course. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

You could have been Tiger Woods. 

 

Alfredo  

Probably not. Tiger Woods is half half Asian. Isn’t he? 

 

Erwin  

His mother’s Thai.

 

Alfredo  

Thai? Yeah.

 

Erwin  

It’s pretty cool. Because I think Did you watch the last dance with Michael Jordan? 

 

Alfredo

Oh, yeah, that was that was good.

 

Erwin  

And how Phil Jackson teaches like meditation stuff and, and that was a big part of that was I was a part of Tiger Woods. his upbringing as well was meditation and to see a lot of winners who meditate and have strong mental mindsets for it.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, that was me. I mean, he’s he’s so well known for his his mental concentration. Right? Like, I mean, that’s an incredible.

 

Erwin  

Minus one yesterday. 

 

Alfredo  

Oh, really? 

 

Erwin  

Yeah. That’s incredible. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, people are a I think there’s big hype him going into the, into the tournament, right?

 

Erwin  

It could be your kids, man. And they’re both working that day. He just made Tiger Woods money. So we have a lot of talking about today. Cuz that’s what’s fun with this podcast is like I get introduced to all these crazy ideas, like morality and real estate investing. We’ll get there. We’ll get there. And oh, yeah. Oh, boy. We’re gonna get some people complaining about what we’re talking about today. 

 

Alfredo  

That’s okay. Controversy is good. 

 

Erwin  

So you mentioned businesses, how many businesses you got, what do they do?

 

Alfredo  

Mostly construction and development, and GC constructors, three h properties. Wooper. That main business is keeping me busy. We have a few other businesses. But you know, COVID hasn’t helped that and in the last few years, so they’ll resurrect at some point, you know, some online rental sharing programmes and stuff like that. Some some pretty cool stuff. But

 

Erwin  

I thought I was busy.

 

Alfredo  

You’re busy. You’re busy

 

Erwin  

I took four days to respond to email. I don’t know how you manage all the businesses you got. So you mentioned construction. Is that kind of how you got started in real estate? 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, yeah, exactly. I started my first business out of college. Right and, and grew up pretty, pretty aggressively over the last, I’d say, you know, I’m dating myself now and close to 20 years and opened up offices in Washington, Washington State and Texas. We have our head office in Vancouver offices here in Toronto, but mostly focus on commercial multifamily construction, and boom, 2020 COVID hits and $40 million of our business disappears. And so we had to shift to, you know, make a big pivot so, so that’s why we’re doing you know.

 

Erwin  

What were these projects that just went poof?

 

Alfredo  

A lot of our businesses in the hospitality industry

 

Erwin  

Oh mercy.

 

Alfredo  

Exactly 

 

Erwin  

That’s coming back real strong.

 

Alfredo  

It’s unknown when that’s coming back. Right. And so we were building theatres commercial. They called Family Fun centres, family entertainment centres 

 

Erwin  

Like Dave and Busters.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, like those kinds of places, right. And, you know, obviously COVID Hit that. So like a puff of smoke overnight, everything disappeared, and still hasn’t come back. So yeah, challenging times,

 

Erwin  

You were able to sleep at night?

 

Alfredo  

Well, fortunately, I was, you know, when, when all this happened, it was when myself and my sisters had and my mother went to the Philippines for a three week holiday. And that three week holiday turned into five months of being locked down in the Philippines while this was happening, so it was a pretty crazy time

 

Erwin  

Because they’re still having challenges 

 

Alfredo  

still, yeah, yeah. And it was a real, real eye opener to see like how COVID was handled in the Philippines, as you can only imagine with the current president, who built a pretty bad reputation of human rights.

 

Erwin  

Were you able to eat? 

 

Alfredo  

No, no, we were safe. We were, you know, very fortunate. I have real estate in the Philippines. So we stayed at my my place there, and lots of lots of room for the kids to run around. And sort of a blessing. Because, you know, pre pandemic, I was just going bananas with business and hadn’t spent so much time with my kids. And I got to actually slow things down, you know, get a little healthy, and get some rest and spend time spent a lot of time with the kids. But business was just, you know, disappearing, like, you know.

 

Erwin  

What did you do? Like yet you have staff and salary? 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, there was, there was a bit of a tough moment, actually, at one point, when, you know, prior to government subsidies and help, there was a moment where, hey, we didn’t know how long the pandemic was going to be, we actually, you know, funny enough, we were at the house, and I was saying to my my sisters, and, you know, brother in law and stuff like that, and I saying, hey, you know, we got to prepare this is this is like, March, we got to prepare and, and potentially, this pandemic can extend to may. And so, let’s, let’s like settle in, you know, and try to make do with everything and hope. Well, we didn’t get back till August. Right. So, so life was was pretty, pretty different than what we have here.

 

Erwin  

And you weren’t even here and you’ve tried to deal with this stuff at different timezone.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. So you’re trying to try to deal with business checking in with a team, you know, you know, unfortunately, a lot a lot of layoffs had to take place, you had to really relook at the business itself, and like what business you had, and you know, your resources and all those kinds of things and, and try to make the best decision. My My decision was always like, how I built an amazing team overall, with like, very low turnover, totally total commitment, amazing people, family, right, like I consider those that work with me, you know, my business family, and to have to let people go, oh, it just killed me. So I tried to figure out ways as creative as I could, with the resources that I had to keep people as long as on payroll, as long as I could. And, you know, fortunately enough, we kept about 75% of our staff or 80% of our stuff, for the majority of the pandemic post subsidies that ended last October, you know, we’ve had to make a few more changes, obviously, but we’ve kept our staff pretty intact, which is amazing.

 

Erwin  

Slick, the projects that started, did they get finished?

 

Alfredo  

No, they they were all terminated. That’s 

 

Erwin  

Even mid project mid Build?

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, mid Build. Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

So you, you have some like, are they were to frame building more 

 

Alfredo  

They were tapered down, right? Like they, you know, for example, you’re gonna build a theatre 12 auditorium, theatre, they’re only going to do five. And we were, you know, we’d built three of them already. Right, that kind of thing. So, so things really just, you know, took a turn for the worst. And, and I mean, hate and all those businesses are still struggling today. Right. I mean, streaming has decimated the film industry. But we move on. Right.

 

Erwin  

So you mentioned a pivot, I’ll put as a happy ending to the story. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. Yeah, no, exactly. We we three its properties. I mean, we actually launched 3h properties in 2017. But because we were so busy with all our other businesses, we didn’t actually shift to that until about 2021. So you know, we’re still trying to recover From what took place from the start of the pandemic? And also, interestingly enough, 2017 there wasn’t that much focus on affordable housing. And there wasn’t that much 

 

Erwin  

because it wasn’t a problem. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, it was.

 

Erwin  

I’m joking, I joke a lot. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah It and funding and it wasn’t in the public’s eye, right. Like people weren’t really talking about it as much as they are today. Right. And so…

 

Erwin  

The rates have been low as long as I remember. So I’m surprised no one thought about it. I remember when I was doing forecasting around real estate investing, like for interest, like vacancy rates were like, never higher than 3%. That’s probably a problem.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, no, and it was I’m not sure why must have been other policy focuses that the government had, but it was really, at the beginning of COVID, when the significant funding had been, you know, placed in affordable housing, the public’s perception, and public’s concerns about the housing problem had really been exacerbated, right, with people moving from the urban core moving to smaller communities, and those people from smaller communities who had to move out of those communities and all those kinds of things. And so, so for us, you know, the story is positive, because we were able to take all our staff reshift, you know, pivot all their efforts from what we’re doing in the commercial construction stuff, to affordable housing development.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so how do you convince people to invest in affordable housing? Because, as you say, affordable, like, oh, there’s no money to be made? Yeah. I mean, and then investors, that’s like, that’s not what any investor wants to hear.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, no, I mean, like, the way what I always say, when we meet with potential investors, if in and I asked a question, you know, if if you can invest in something that does good for the community, but also where you can do good business? Why not? Right, why not take a look at it? And so that’s what we’re trying to prove out. I mean, were the majority of affordable housing has been carried on the backs of, of, you know, one, nonprofits, cooperatives and government for how many years? And I think the the movement for private industry to get more involved is starting to increase. I mean, the US, which is a little more developed on the affordable housing side, and our first Fireside Chat with Jonathan Rose in March, where he’s been in affordable housing for the last 30 years, you know, these policies and programmes that are in there, you know, and he’s able to the law for the last 15 years, provide his investors, you know, a 6% consistent return with a 15% IRR for the last 15 years, doing 100% affordable you know, so he’s able to He’s proven out our model, basically. 

 

Erwin  

So why hasn’t it happened here? 

 

Alfredo  

Because it’s still it’s it’s still in its infancy

 

Erwin  

But problems pretty bad.

 

Alfredo  

The problem we know infant. It’s a gigantic Brontosaurus. Yeah. All right. Cool.

 

Erwin  

She’s a meat eating dinosaur. Not a vegan dinosaur, but okay. Product stores, like it would appear a T Rex. That’s helped me the problem is.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Hey, I don’t know, I can’t say why.

 

Erwin

 But you know, how we’re getting out of this. What’s that? Say? Again? You know, how we’re getting out of this affordability issue?

 

Alfredo  

Well, hey, there’s movement, let’s say, right? I mean, CMHC has this vision and goal to have by 2030 Everybody in a home? Right? That’s a big goal. That’s, that’s pretty lofty. And I’m on the phone, at least every couple of weeks with folks from CMHC. And what’s great is that you’re hearing a lot of willingness to look at different ways, looking at the housing problem, right? Different ways, investing structures, different innovative approaches, partnerships are key, you know, those kinds of things. So that’s uplifting to see such a, you know, substantial organisation have that interest. So, yeah, I mean, I can’t answer the question of, you know, is this is what we’re proposing the solution right? But I think it’s a combination of of all the things that are happening, whether it be you know, mixed use developments where there’s a portion of affordable you know, whether it’s 100% affordable like our model, it’s nonprofit or you know, there’s there’s there’s all those approaches I think are key.

 

Erwin  

Okay, well let’s focus on one of your current projects.

 

Alfredo  

Sure. 

 

Erwin  

Like the King Street one that’s about that’s like I honestly 

 

Alfredo  

Main Street 

 

Erwin  

Sorry, Main Street obviously lived like 100 metres from that location. 

 

Alfredo  

Oh, you did? Oh.

 

Erwin  

I honestly just lived up the street from there. 

 

Alfredo  

Oh, on Lock street

 

Erwin  

Yeah, just off lock just Street. 

 

Alfredo  

Okay.

 

Erwin  

Yes. Oh, man. I think I sold that house for like 600 something and I saw one of my neighbours just listed for 1.4. And that’s part of the problem like, this is this is crazy. Yeah, this is crazy

 

Alfredo  

Nuts. 

 

Erwin  

So can we use that one as your main street property as an example? What are you doing? So? Tell the listener what what it is you’re doing at? Can you share the address?

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, it’s 405 Main Street, West Hamilton. Yeah, so what we’re doing there, it’s it’s a project 96 unit building seven storeys, our model is, you know, 100% affordable. But the key to our model is we partner with nonprofits to be able to get access to grants, loans of sorry, forgivable loans, exemptions, development, cost, storage, exemptions, property tax abatement, you know, and a whole gamut of things that help our model, make it profitable. And commensurate in terms of investment with, with other real estate investment opportunities. And so for that project, one of our biggest, one of the biggest keys to our model is finding properties that are on it within the within a transit corridor, that are already zoned for our purpose. So we can find properties that are, you know, that allow for six, seven storeys, 100 150 unit buildings that are about half an acre to an acre in size. Brilliant, you know, so we’re starting out in Hamilton with this 405 project, we’ve got three others and development. And our goal, by the end of the year is to have 10 projects in the pipeline, roughly about 1500 units.

 

Erwin  

And then have your investors, they’re open to these opportunities and just the VR.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, I mean, the majority of our investors, our investors who are looking to make an impact, right, they have been involved in real estate, or they’re, you know, high net worth individuals, or, you know, they’re just folks that are really keen on taking their money and making a change in, in our future. And so, you know, one of the biggest problems that we face today, of course, is affordable housing.

 

Erwin  

And then you mentioned earlier with the other gentleman’s doing for his investors for for returns. I know you can’t tell people what the prospect of returns are, but what what idea do you give them? 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, so for for our model, because we try to maximise all the grants and loans and forgivable loans, exemptions, etc. You know, our model is one where we can provide a return of capital, pre stabilisation, post stabilisation, we’re looking at providing a six and a half to 7% return. And then and then the exit strategy is a refi, or a sale of the building. But since our model is one where the refi strategy is key for us, as our main is our main strategic position, we’re going to provide a return that is in perpetuity. So once we provide, you know, capital 100% of capital back upon refi, we’re going to still provide a return in perpetuity. 

 

Erwin  

That’s interesting. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. So it’s a so it’s basically an infinite return. So and I’ve heard it’s called the, you know, the holy grail of investing. Right?

 

Erwin  

Yeah. The rate of return on investment? Yeah. Because we’re returning their capital. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, exactly. 

 

Erwin  

So how do you are you refinancing like everybody else is doing like, you’re going to like, you’re going to a commercial lender?

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. Well, what’s unique is that CMHC also has its own direct lending programmes. But also, it also has a commercial mortgage side, right. And their commercial, their commercial side, they provide insurance to commercial lenders, that will provide terms that are almost equivalent to the direct lending programmes. And so you know, long term member amortisation, 50 year terms, lower rates, then then the market and, you know, combine that with grants and loans. And the numbers make sense.

 

Erwin  

Interesting. No. And all these people hate Justin Trudeau is this wouldn’t be possible without him.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it’s I mean, you look at what’s needed and affordable and government assistance is, is absolutely what’s necessary. That’s the only way the model works.

 

Erwin  

Now, because private people do this, like a regular bank won’t lend you because housing is affordable. Your rents are 10-20% well below market value. 

 

Alfredo  

Exactly. Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

That’s crazy.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. So yeah, we’re our model is a combination of what’s called Deep affordable and market affordable. And so deep, affordable tenants pay around 50% But their rents are subsidy. iodized, and the market affordable is pay, you know, up to about, you know, 15 20% of market, right?

 

Erwin  

Can you give an example? Like, do you know what your projections are for? Like, what are you building? What are you building up the four or five main street?

 

Alfredo  

So this will be a purpose built rental building 96 units, seven stories, it’ll have all the amenities that are, you know, it’ll not any old theatre, you know, floatation? No, no, 

 

Erwin  

I’ve never heard of that Macondo.

 

Alfredo  

But no, it’ll have a gym, it’ll have a community gardens, it’ll have, you know, parking, parking, and we’ll actually, in fact, have a larger laundry space to kind of treat that as a, you know, a community space as well. And, and we have a commons area where can be treated as a business centre for various programmes, or just a place for people to gather. So we’re trying to really create a community in in our, in our buildings, because not only do we want to treat our tenants with dignity and respect, we also want to create, you know, a place where they can call home, you know, because a lot of the affordable housing developments that have been built in the past have this sort of, you know, I don’t know, the best way to describe it, but not very appealing. aesthetic, right, and more of more, more of like a Soviet potentially, you know, facility, right. But there are so now with what we’re trying to do is we’re trying to create design excellence, we’re trying to create, you know, trying to implement ways to make the building look unique, you know, and and, of course, within a budget, because it’s an affordable housing project, where we don’t have the we don’t have the budget that, you know, market projects have. So we try to be creative with with the resources and the budgets that we have.

 

Erwin  

Are you looking for cost savings to via green technologies? Mr. Praveen mentioned, and I’m I don’t think I’ve heard of it before used in Canada. Is he mentioned shower water recapture? Yeah, just to redeem and recapture the heat as well. 

 

Alfredo  

Other than electricity, are you going to try to keep people accountable at all to their water usage? For example, is this one thing and like, I’m like in my condo is people kind of like, because they can’t really tie the expense back to themselves. They they find that condos, they can’t people who live in condos, I find them more wasteful.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, there’s, there’s many technologies, and that’s what’s also really unique about affordable housing projects. I think they’re very, they’re leading edge on that, from that respect, like for 405. We have, we’re trying to aim for a net zero electrical use, and that kind of thing, you know, reduces the long term operational costs of the building, which then helps separate affordable, affordable. Absolutely, exactly. And, you know, and things like solar panels, things like heat pump systems, heat recovery, pumping, nothing, heat pump, for the various units, right? heat recovery systems from sewage, and sanitary, right, and, or, you know, envelope, all there’s so many different, different approaches to ensuring the building is energy efficient,\.

 

Alfredo  

Right. Yeah, I mean, we’ll have we’re actually looking to partner with TELUS Smart buildings, and they have, you know, digital metres that help not only digital metres, but from, you know, a single mobile device, you can open and close doors for viewings you can you have, you know, as you said, water, you know, water analysis, water use analysis. So you have energy use analysis and all these type of things, which I think are important, because you’re right, there is the potential for that.

 

Erwin  

For you just like by mistake, someone leaky toilet? Absolutely, absolutely. I don’t think everyone appreciates, but if you’re if your toilet, you can hear it running. That can be a couple $1,000 a month. Absolutely. Just wasted water.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. So you have somebody helping monitor that. Right. And you have your very various options of and levels of digital monitoring, but you want to cover the basics like that.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. Yeah. And then what stages do you do you accept investor money just at the beginning? Can people buy these units?

 

Alfredo  

So just you know, so our model, I don’t nothing of other questions. Great questions. No. So our model is is all rental. We’re focused primarily on rental there is affordable ownership as well. That’s not what we focus on. We forego focus on affordable rental. And so in terms of investments, you know, we were actually launching a new project, just actually in the next week or so, it’s on Barton Street, and I’m sure you’re familiar with Barton. And 

 

Erwin  

What’s the intersection? 

 

Alfredo  

That’s at Barton Ottawa

 

Erwin  

Yeah, we talked about that. That’s a wonderful location. Yeah. So this sick time for up and coming.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, absolutely. It’s right beside centre, mall, participates Mall. It’s Yeah, exactly. And there’s a lot of a lot of traffic on Barton street foot traffic as well. And yeah, that’s a seven storey building 164 units. Amazing design on that building, we had a little more flexibility. And I think, you know, don’t quote me, but we may be, you know, winning some awards, I think, cool. The uniqueness of our design, shout out to revel house or architectural team amazing design. But yeah, that building has been launched to investors. We did a teaser, just a week ago. And next week, we’re going officially to our investment group, and forever and making the opportunity available. So four and a half million bucks we’re raising and to do 160 in a building.

 

Erwin  

So the raise Okay, actually, the questions to ask. And then your involvement is you you’re also the like, the general contractor.

 

Alfredo  

Term is construction management. That’s we’re primarily a management company, but acting in a similar capacity as general contractor. Yeah. So we have full control. That’s one of 

 

Erwin  

You are big time, because not everyone’s allowed to do this. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, one of the things that gives us that…

 

Erwin  

I’m not allowed to do this.

 

Alfredo  

From your…

 

Erwin  

I wouldn’t be allowed to GC, there’s no lenders gonna let me be the GC on this. Yeah.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. I mean, but we’ve been in the business for 20 years dropping John. So you know, we’re building two condos in BC right now. So, but, yeah, I mean, it’s, it’s something that gives us control over the whole process. So from right from the get go, you know, one of the some some of the problems that that developers face is that they get a building that their architect designs incredibly, and it’s beautiful, but then they are challenged with the budget, because, you know, the architects not focused on that. But because we’re involved right from the get go, you know, we immediately look at our design and how it impacts our budget, and make those numbers work.

 

Erwin  

Reminds me of those condos in Hong Kong, where there’s like a hole in the middle of the condo. People couldn’t live there, man. That’s not practical. It was cool. You throw you throw something big through it, but what 4.4 point $5 million raise. So how are you raising the capital?

 

Alfredo  

So we you go to our existing resource or existing investment group. And basically, we have a structure a GP LP structure, raising the LP funds, and we make it available to them for the, you know, for the next couple of weeks. Right. And, but also what we do with our projects is…

 

Erwin  

Just once like your existing investment group, these are high net worth. But really, really high net worth 

 

Alfredo  

High net worth. You know, in some cases, institutions, pension funds. 

 

Erwin  

Oh, institutions have appetite for this?

 

Alfredo  

Family offices. Yeah. In some cases, you know, institutions have now, you know, a lot of these, you know, I think we talked about it, you mentioned the ESG. Right. And so a lot of corporations have created funds, or have allocated funds to, to doing impact. And a lot of them are interested in affordable housing, because that’s an area that they’re focused on. 

 

Erwin  

Got it. Got it. And this fits their return profile as well. Yeah. 

 

Alfredo  

And you will, a lot of these organisations aren’t looking for huge returns, right. And mind you, a lot of them invest.

 

Erwin  

They’re not looking for huge returns, but they’re usually looking for low risk as well. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, they’re looking for low risk, they’re looking for, you know, stay at stable income. They’re looking for, you know, decent returns. But most of our conversations are about impact. You know, if they had a choice about, you know, if they, they had one investment that provide a decent returns, and they had another investment that provided decent returns and also had an impact, they’re going to choose the the, you know, the ladder, right, you’re saying so, and that’s those are the investors and joint venture partners that we look for, you know, those they have the same vision, they have the same values. And, and there’s a lot of them out there.

 

Erwin  

Because these investors aren’t gonna go, hey, you know, you can get 20% more rent if you rent evict this person.

 

Alfredo  

No, no, no. Okay.

 

Erwin  

All right. We’re out and wait, let’s wrap it up.

 

Alfredo  

I know you are.

 

Erwin  

So I remember reading the article. And that’s how it was when I reached out to you, because you have involved with ADDY. Yeah, because we’ve had Steven formati on the show. Yeah. Super cool concept. And then where does Addy get involved in this process?

 

Alfredo  

So good question and shout out to Addy, Steven and Mitch. So Addy like the same thing. So as soon as we we make the offering to our investment group, they’re part of that Group, they’ll commit a certain level of investment per deal. And we love bringing them in, because what they do is they make investment available to everyone. Right. Right. And right now, our investment community are mostly accredited investors. Right?

 

Erwin  

Very accredited

 

Alfredo  

Majority or all, you know, like 

 

Erwin  

family offices are not just a credit the there multiple times the requirements to be accredited, okay, sorry, continue,

 

Alfredo  

But love the fact that you can get, you know, anybody and everybody involved at at a low risk, because they’re not allowed to invest more than a certain level. And they’re basing it on, you know, the, the majority, right. And, and so, and to have them not only be our partner, but because they’re building a great reputation around, you know, focusing on more on impact. You know, that’s, you know, the same value alignment. So.

 

Erwin  

I remember, I didn’t know much about Adam, and I hadn’t had him on the show. Sorry, Steven. But he told me the max investment was $1,500. Exactly. I haven’t repeated three times. Really? Because the example I’ve given before on the show is, I don’t have our RESPs because honestly, it’s not enough for me to be interested. Right. It’s not an it’s not a significant amount of money for me to be interested in. And then I’m gonna get some hate for this. Like, it’s perfectly I completely understand why it exists and who it’s for. Yeah, it’s not for me, because I have way too much stupid stuff going on. And you know, I got a I got to learn Tik Tok, apparently, yeah. Right. And that’s somehow our priority over an Educational Savings Plan. But not me. Steven Tilly is with investors that are often I’ve seen it taught and understand why they’re often taught, you know, have one partner in a real estate venture. Okay, because it’s too hard to manage lots of relationships. Yeah. Versus and he’s got the exact opposite direction. They have 1000s of investors now was 1000s of relationships on just one project.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, they, I mean, on on 405 main street, they raised half a million dollars. And I think I can’t remember the number of investors that were in there, maybe 2000 or something like that. My work is spread pretty, pretty amazingly. But yeah, I mean, I, you know, I’ve been on I’m also a member of Addy, and, you know, voting,

 

Erwin  

You’re able to invest in your own project then. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, absolutely. And so the whole platform is so frictionless you know, everything that is that is provided to an investor who isn’t, you know, well versed in real estate can really understand it, and then best.

 

Erwin  

Well, absolutely easier than doing cosi property, right? An offer when the damn offer inspections, insurance, get a mortgage.

 

Alfredo  

Up there, so you still have to manage it ensure that the value stays right. Like I mean, it’s like 

 

Erwin  

It’ll Be over five years. Yeah, magazine maintenance tenant. 5, 10 20 years

 

Alfredo  

And anything, I mean, anything can happen in that situation. Right. And it’s challenging, crazy stuff happen.

 

Erwin  

But what again, I think that is super cool. This is not endorsement by any means because they give me nothing for it. But I think it’s super cool. It was a cryptocurrency presentation. And as always, like they can’t tell you how much how much you should own. But the lady suggested by $1 Bitcoin. Hopefully she won’t get sued for giving financial advice. Okay, bye. Bye, everybody point was get off the zero don’t have zero because at least if you like break the seal, then hopefully that opens the door to a greater journey of learning more. Right? Maybe you want to get into construction. You want to get a socialised housing. Maybe you want to be a landlord. Yeah. Right. So but that doesn’t happen until you break the seal. Right. Interesting. Yeah. So very easy way to break the seal. Because my understanding is you can do a minimum of $1. But that doesn’t make any sense. Because the fees,

 

Alfredo  

The fees, yeah, I think the fee is $25 a year or

 

Erwin  

Just a year, not even a month. Yeah, so, so invest more than $25. Yeah. But yeah, that’s pretty cool. Because that is about impact. And that’s why that’s why the dude asked even three times what the maximum investment was. Because it’s hard for me to get a financial impact as an investor when I’m only investing 1500 bucks. But he meant impact more for socialised investing, essentially, yeah, you may leave space for everybody else to build to get in. Yeah, rather than just the big fish. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, and exactly that, right. Because primarily real estate has been, you know, mostly invested in by people that are accredited or people that have wealth and, you know, to get the vast majority to get involved, as you say, you know, get the get your get your foot in the door, basically, you know, starts opening up your eyes to Other things that will help you improve your, your financial situation.

 

Erwin  

Reminds me of one share of Tesla, because it’s too expensive. So just want to share a piece of Elon, all the action, mostly to kill my phone while he wasn’t bought this year. It’s mostly killed by FOMO. Got a piece, I’m in the door. I got foot in the door. We talked earlier before we were recording about book co ops. And it was a it was a presentation that you were giving about around. Sorry, I’m jumping all over. But I didn’t notice it, which is kind of sad that I know this. But you’re talking about in the presentation, how a bunch of affordable properties will no longer be affordable probably pretty soon. Yeah. Can you explain what that is about?

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean.

 

Erwin  

If I didn’t know, there’s probably one person out there also doesn’t know. 

 

Alfredo 

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, this is that particular example was an article that came out in January, about this year, City of Kitchener. Yeah, City of Kitchener. So there’s a cooperative or a bunch of cooperatives that have that own affordable housing. And I think there was a, I can’t remember the exact numbers, I’d have to flip back in my notes, but something around a couple 1000. And so, you know, couple 1000 apartments, apartments. And these apartments were, you know, built about, you know, 4050 years ago, on on long term mortgages, and to be kept affordable for that term. And so now, you know, of course, buildings only, or only have a life around 4050 years, and you know, the changes, major changes need to take place or improvements. And so not only do they face the end of their mortgages ending and, you know, although they have a lot of equitable value in these properties, they don’t have significant cash flow. So, you know, what do you do with these properties? And, you know, the only options are, at least at this point in time is to either sell and then it gets sold to, you know, private, private industry and private industries looking to maximise profits. And what ends up happening is you have displacement, you have all these folks that are that are, that’s a benefit on the street. Yeah, it’s, but it’s

 

Erwin  

But they’ll have stainless steel appliances, and like granite countertops and hardwood floors. And yeah, that’s not a good thing.

 

Alfredo  

No, it’s not good in the sense that you have displacement. Now you have all these these folks. And that’s happening across the country. And, you know, it’s, it’s, I think, one of the biggest problems and opportunities that we have in the future, which is under the under a category called preservation. And so it was, that was what the chat was all about, and with with Jonathan Rose, but yeah, I think there’s, you know, there’s billions and billions of dollars of assets that are all at end of life, you’re hearing some sad stories about rent evictions, you’re hearing sad stories about people being left out on the streets, you’re hearing, you know, rat infested elevators not working and all those kinds of things. And there’s currently today, there’s no solution for that. So, you know, I’m trying my best with my team and our partners to try to lobby government and lobby, you know, various institutions to get involved in trying to find a solution for preservation.

 

Erwin  

Here, you’re just talking about preserving affordable housing

 

Alfredo  

Preserving affordable housing? Yes. 

 

Erwin  

I don’t know many people are talking about this. 

 

Erwin  

No, it’s not. That’s why it there’s not many people talking about affordable housing in general. And but it’s it’s building, preservation is really, you know, it’s more of a might be more more focused on in the future as we get the supply up of affordable housing, because that’s, that’s still, you know, the challenge in the US, the majority of affordable housing development is preservation, you know, out of out of all the projects that that they did, and I think it was, you know, a year ago, they only built like, 50 to 60,000 new units of affordable housing. The rest? Yeah, that’s it. That’s it.

 

Erwin  

That’s nothing. Exactly for a population of 300,000,

 

Alfredo  

350 million people. Yeah. And they have, they have, you know, their numbers are in terms of people like in Canada, we’ve got it. You know, the total waiting list for people waiting for affordable homes is roughly around 300,000 people in the US, it’s like 20 times that it’s like six to 10 million people, right? It’s, it’s a giant number. And so, you know, preserving existing affordable is, is something that they’re focused on.

 

Erwin  

I see multiple challenges. Even for you guys. I like to call you guys. She’s another apology. I’m sorry, folks. When you’re buying property, there’s other people that want the same properties as you. How’s that working out? Are sellers, sympathetic All right, yeah, this one.

 

Erwin  

Actually. And you know, it’s been amazing. It’s been an amazing journey so far, because not only are sellers empathetic, because we’ve got a lot of problems in society today. Right. And that’s another probably podcast for, you know, but the, you know, the sellers are we’re not only not only sellers, but our consulting teams, other stakeholders, everybody is very empathetic to, to the problems and want to get involved and want to help. We had one of our consultants say to me the other day, and I said, Hey, I know you’re busy, Hamilton, Hamilton, you know, construction, and development industry is going bananas right now. And so I said to him, I go, Hey, you know, heads up, I need your assistance on a, on an environmental study on this project and the next week, because we’re, we’re closing on it. And we’re going to do go into due diligence, just a heads up. And if you could fit it in your schedule, please let me know. He’s like Alfredo, because of what you’re doing. Because you’re developing affordable housing. You’re my priority, or, and so that’s pretty consistent amongst the various groups. And so yeah, so sellers are open to finding out a way that they can also have an impact, right. But to our model is one where we’re focused on secondary markets. So instead of paying, you know, 20 25% of our total cost of a development like in the urban core, Toronto Vancouver’s you know, we’re looking at, you know, markets at a, you know, the secondary markets that have a little more affordability and a lot of available land for development.

 

Erwin  

Other than the Hamilton where else are you looking?

 

Alfredo  

St Catharines we’ve looked in places like across the country from Ontario, southwestern Ontario is our is one of our main focuses but all the way to heading west to BC. So we’ve looked at Regina, we’ve looked at Winnipeg, we’ve looked at Edmonton, Calgary, various, you know, smaller cities in BC Victoria and Nanaimo.

 

Erwin  

But you’re starting in Hamilton. 

 

Alfredo  

We’re starting in Hamilton. 

 

Erwin  

Why Hamilton? 

 

Alfredo  

Well, I live in Hamilton. 

 

Erwin  

You didn’t always.

 

Alfredo  

No. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

Like Hamilton, I understand. You’ve had some nice experiences in other parts of Canada.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. Originally from Vancouver. Moved to Hamilton in 2050. 

 

Erwin  

You upgraded I understand. Okay.

 

Alfredo  

I super happy, amazing family community. Amazing place. Still tight and strong ties to Vancouver there every couple of months. Families there. So

 

Erwin  

Yeah, that’s pretty wild. Because maybe it’s the grass is greener on the other side. But you know, I just love Vancouver. And we’re, like, you know, like, we’re going back. We’re going to Vancouver end of May. We’re going to do a real estate meetup, stock hacker meetup. I don’t have all the details yet. My wife put it in my calendar for like, like 6:30. So with the time change, there’ll be 930 our time. Yeah, I’m like, home. The kids can’t be up that late. And there’s we don’t have a nanny in Vancouver. So figure that out. Yeah. I Love Vancouver. 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. Beautiful place, beautiful place.

 

Erwin  

Beautiful People beautiful culture, like people are chill. Yeah. Great to hear.

 

Alfredo  

Well, you know, funny enough, we brought on a new controller just recently, and she’s out of Kitchener. And she was getting on boarded with our team, and in our head offices in Vancouver, and my, you know, Chief of people or is in Vancouver. And so, during this process of onboarding, there is a big noticeable difference between the different you know, from from the West Coast and, and, and Ontario. And so, yeah, definitely, definitely a lot more relaxed and chill for sure.

 

Erwin  

How many employees do you have? 

 

Alfredo  

  1. We used to have closer to 50 pre pandemic, right.

 

Erwin  

And then, but then all the people on the tools they’re contracted out? 

 

Alfredo  

Oh, we don’t have Yeah, so construction management. We only have met the management team, project managers, project coordinators, development managers, superintendents, you know, the rest of the stakeholders are all all our contracted.

 

Erwin  

Parts of the construction industry have bounced back. Have they not like your I still see cranes everywhere. And I understand just from hearing what I hear on the ground, like, they can’t hire enough people.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. I mean, there’s always been a problem with skilled trades in construction. The pandemic made it even worse, because a lot of folks, you know, in the construction industry, the average age is is, you know, over. I think the average age was over 45-50. At some point, maybe it’s changing. These are old metrics. But, you know, with a pandemic, with a lot of people experiencing such despair as particularly in the commercial side of the construction industry. A lot of businesses went bankrupt or, you know, guys are saying, Hey, I just, you know, I’ve been in this business for the last 2030 years, it’s time to get out. Right. And that happened. There’s, you know, a lot of attrition. And so, you know, a lot of a lot of folks. And that’s been one of the problems also that has impacted the cost of construction.

 

Erwin  

We talked about morality and real estate investing doesn’t want in your emails in our email exchanges. Oh, what do we need morality for? So I’ll think I’ve mentioned to you in probIem, the, you know, it’s, I think you’ve, you’ve seen it, too, like the common apartment building investment model is to buy something. I know, many companies like their strategies to buy something that needs not a lot of work that’s being rented for under the under market value. And their goal is to turnover, tenants renovate, raise values. That’s not a moral investment. I don’t mean to push you. So I’ll start off by saying, when people tell me those things, then I’m not interested. So I’ll throw that out first. Versus I have friends who are trying to build something in Waterloo, like, I’m interested, you’re building, you’re creating supply, I’m interested, right? Versus again, buying something existing. And then, however, that are asking tenants to leave, or living whatever, I just don’t know, where do they go? Like someone who’s paying like $1,000? For a two bedroom? Like, where do they go? Right. And that’s why that’s, that’s, that’s for me. That’s my morality issue with apartment building, investing for that style of investing. So that’s why it’s a no for me, right? I’m not judging anyone. It’s just me. All right. What’s your what’s your view?

 

Alfredo  

Well, a little bit, a bit of background, I mean, immigrant family from the Philippines, you know, parents careers had changed dramatically when we first moved to Canada in the late 70s, early 80s. And, you know, pizza delivery driver with, you know, several income, right? 

 

Erwin  

Your parents? 

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. And so, you know, we grew up in affordable housing. And so my, my career has been about, you know, giving back because I saw and firsthand experience, you know, the having a half being in a situation, where paying rent was still a challenge, but isn’t the challenge that people face today, my parents were able to have their kids go to good schools, and then eventually go to, you know, good colleges and universities and do something for themselves and give back to the community. So that’s where that’s where it starts. That’s the base of, you know, my morality. And that’s what backs a lot of my decision making, you know, giving back to, you know, being fortunate to grow up in Canada, you know, and giving back to the community is super important. Yeah, I mean, that’s with the problem of affordable housing, you know, not only are we trying to do good, and give back, but trying to find a way to make it a sustainable profitable business model, so that we can encourage the rest of the private industry to get involved. You know, so, you know, hey, I want to I want to go to sleep at night and sleep well, and know that what I do every day is having an impact. Again, we just have so many problems in society today, you know, why not? Do why not do it, if it’s not going to be me are not going to be, you know, someone else, like, Who is it? Who’s going to be? And then you know, you’ve got young kids, I’ve got young kids, I want to see their futures be different than what we know, right now looking pretty bleak. From an environmental perspective, a real estate perspective, right? I mean, it’s, we got to make changes, we got to do something about it.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. Are your investors public about how they’re investing. I only mentioned it because there’s a lot of rhetoric about, you know, hate for for rich people. And that’s in your projects.

 

Alfredo  

Financialization of real estate.

 

Erwin  

I know that too. Yeah, I’m part of the problem. too. But then my defence is, you know, what else is someone supposed to do? This is the same. Don’t hate the player hate the game? Yeah, the game is central bank, money printing. Inflation. Yeah, we as investors, we get a lot of tax breaks for being investors.

 

Alfredo  

And really, if you’re not investing your money in contributing to the economy, the economy is not going to turn and it’s not going to turn over and opportunities and jobs aren’t created. So they’re, you know, things have to move, you know, and what we’re trying to do is to create a bit of a model that’s sustainable, because just like the Kitchener problem that’s being faced, and we don’t want that to happen, you know, 40 years from now, we’re trying to create a model that is, you know, beyond that, that, folks that had been fortunate enough to be, you know, living in the affordable projects that we develop don’t have to be kicked out at the at the end of the term.

 

Erwin  

Right! What are some of the challenges? Is that city city run affordable housing? What do they face? 

 

Alfredo  

Well, I mean, being government backed a lot of those, you know, the income model, you know, a lot of these buildings have have been affordable for so long. So the so the level of income is so low that, you know, they don’t have much room to, to make changes to make improvements.

 

Erwin  

And keep up with inflation on their rents. No. Oh, boy. Yeah, that’s a that’s a recipe for disaster.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. I mean, so that’s one thing that we do. I mean, our rents are, you know, there’s government, you know, rent control that it’s in place, and, you know, we stay within those guidelines.

 

Erwin  

So, so then your buildings will, I don’t know, if I call it That’s right to call me or buildings, but the rents will be indexed to inflation, at least.

 

Alfredo  

As I said, like, it’ll be to, you know, the the government

 

Erwin  

Got it controlled, which hopefully keeps up with inflation.

 

Alfredo  

Which keeps up with inflation. Absolutely.

 

Erwin  

Because otherwise, otherwise, these businesses, businesses, I don’t know if it’s right word for affordable housing will make it.

 

Alfredo  

No, it won’t. If it you have to be practical, right. I mean, and government money is finite. Right. 

 

Erwin  

I don’t feel that way. Bartenders are getting new pharma plans and child care and dental plans. I’m happy for them.

 

Alfredo  

Yet now in here, that’s, that’s today. Right. And but the you know, I would say that my perspective is that it’s finite. And so if we can find a way to make it sustainable, then that’d be amazing.

 

Erwin  

Any thought to making your buildings co-op? 

 

Alfredo  

No, no, I mean, our buildings are going to be you know, one of the things about real estate as well, and why I’m in involved in construction and real estate, it’s, it’s a great legacy, you know, asset to have, right and, and, you know, I think the goal for all of us is to work hard, and one day not have to work hard. And so I’m just I’m you know, part of our our model is keeping it private, and interesting. So, you know, and by having you know, over my career, develop, develop 1000s and 1000s of buildings, be able to build wealth for myself and my family and for the next generation. And well while giving back to the community.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. Because we talked about earlier about the examples that I shared before we were recording is like two well known coops failed during the pandemic mountain Equipment Co Op, which is no longer called Bad mountain equipment companies.

 

Alfredo  

I don’t know actually, I didn’t follow that what happened with them?

 

Erwin  

The C stands for something else besides coop now, this was the acronym stays, so really stays. It’s no longer coop because it’s not a coop is privately owned. So it’s still MEC. Yeah, so I see okay, and then locally, mustard seed clarity field, and just reading into MEC, like management wasn’t tight, just their inventory control was just poor is a thin the story that was given was I think, certain piece of hiking equipment, they’ve happened to find it in their storage, but it had been sitting there for like three or seven years so actually worked out. Normally you sell you know, when you have excess supply you you know, you heavily discounted put it on clearance, but thankfully, they found it. And there are the sell for you know, full list price, because you know, during the pandemic, but that was more of a an insight into how poor their inventory management was.

 

Alfredo  

How long did you say five, seven years?

 

Erwin  

Yeah, it was it was in inventory for that long. And it was known as lost in inventory loss. And in freight, we found it. I don’t know, because they were looking for stuff to sell. And then just one I have questions and then wonder like, how is quality of management in a coop? Because you don’t get talented people running businesses unless you pay them? Yeah. Right. So like the whole sunshine list thing? And then like, I don’t know, people are Villa being vilified for making what they do like CEOs of hospitals, for example. But my thinking is, you don’t get talent unless you pay for talent. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So that’s part of my where was I going with that? I don’t know. Like do coops and real estate work? Different things? And that’s kind of the kind of what we’re talking about with with city run affordable housing, like in Hamilton, for example, like a bunch of these properties are in house. uninhabitable? Yeah. Yeah. All right. Like I think one project I think 60 or 70% of it was vacant, because people couldn’t live it. They were being kept. Yeah.

 

Alfredo  

Right. Yeah. The the history of of like city housing and Hamilton is that actually it was what I understand it to be is that they were an amalgamation of a significant number of nonprofits that I think were actually going bankrupt. And so, city housing stepped in every day. and took them over. And so, you know, they already started with problems, right financially. But there was a lot of folks that were living there. And so, you know, what are you going to do something had to be done. And so they stepped in and, and came up with that solution. But, you know, is that the solution for the long term? You know, that’s yet to be determined?

 

Erwin  

Because I remember, within two years, I won’t say which political party I’m sure people can guess. But one of the leaders said, I don’t want to see developers making money’s money off the back of Canadians. Right. And then here, we have nonprofits, oh, leaving a whole bunch of problems for the taxpayer. So how did that work out?

 

Alfredo  

Well, not well, because there were billions and billions of dollars spent originally. So if all that gets converted to private, then, you know, look at the the lost dollars there. Right. And, and so, you know, I think that, you know, back to that comment about preservation being a potential, you know, or not potential being one of the biggest issues and, and opportunities, I think, needs to be resolved in Canada.

 

Erwin  

Are you’re working with the city on any existing affordable housing that they own, that they’re operating?

 

Alfredo  

We’re having talks about opportunities to partner up. I don’t think we’re talking about existing properties only, only because the financial model today with grants and incentives and loans, etc, that are there, but won’t support a preservation model. But they do support new construction, new builds?

 

Erwin  

Well, I mean, they should bulldoze some of these places and build high rise.

 

Alfredo  

In some some places. Absolutely. It makes sense financially to do that. And it will contribute back, you know, if you’re demolishing a 10 unit building and put it up, you can put up 300 units that will have a unilateral positive effect. But what do you still do with those 1010 10 families that are living there? You still have to be, you know, fair and find a, a solution for that.

 

Erwin  

It’s more likely three families because three of the seven of the units are in and you can’t live in them. Yeah. But yes, we do have to relocate.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, exactly. 

 

Erwin  

And that’s not easy to do. 

 

Alfredo  

No. 

 

Erwin  

Anything else you want to cover today.

 

Alfredo  

Hey, I mean, I got a few shout outs at the end, or how much time we have left, but…

 

Erwin  

Long enough to show to people you’re showing to the city at all. The city we should shout out?

 

Alfredo  

No. I don’t think I’m promoting folks in the city. But building relationships with the folks at the city. I think, you know, no, no specific names, particularly. But

 

Erwin  

I’ll have to say like the people that people I’ve dealt with at Hamilton, they’re very progressive people. Yeah, you wouldn’t, you wouldn’t know their public servants if you’d write by talking to them. Yeah, they have vision. They’re not NIMBY, right. They want change they want they want density. Yeah. Right. Which is not typical of city. Municipal Employees. Yeah. Sorry, continue. 

 

Alfredo  

No, hey, that’s an interesting comment. Because, you know, that’s one of the reasons why we moved to Hamilton, having grown up in Vancouver and seeing the changes over, you know, the last 30 years and Vancouver, seeing, you know, Richmond from where, which is where I grew up in, you know, from farmland, to giant powers and see, you know, Vancouver and high income area. Yeah, absolutely. And see how, what the impact of the, what it was called the skytrain. The rapid transit, the Rev line, and all these other lines, that had just had a huge impact to the city and its growth. And, and that’s what’s exciting about Hamilton, with the LRT, coming, and all transit, the late trail transit and all the other investments taking place in Ontario, and connecting the whole grid together. I think that’s amazing. And, I mean, it has to be done. Because the population is going to continue to grow. You know, there’s the government’s bringing in, you know, one and a half million people over the next three years. And that’s a substantial increase to the population. But Vancouver, seeing, seeing how it grew, and the type of the type of the developed society, and then the regulations and all that stuff that is now in place is, is what happens over time as things, you know, become more, you know, sort of set up, right. And now, Hamilton, we’re in this growth stage, and other areas in Ontario, and it’s really exciting to see that and to have these folks at the city, be open and be willing and look at innovative techniques, look at partnerships. In all my experiences, all my conversations have been all positive. And even from the administrative stuff, they are very supportive. You know, they’re always you know, attentive to you to your files, and I think it’s been great. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

And are you even talking to the mayor as well, because he’s got to be wanting to, you know, pose in front of your buildings. 

 

Alfredo  

We’ve had conversations with with Fred and other counsellors are very supportive. So we’re getting a lot of support of, you know, whenever I asked, you know, how many private industry developers are getting involved in affordable housing, the name, you know, there’s not you can count more than, you know, the fingers that are in on one hand, that are involved in doing affordable housing. So…

 

Erwin  

I’m not sure if one knows how to give a benefit of a construction business. I don’t know. Maybe come back in another episode on how someone else can start. Yeah, absolutely. I can someone with like three properties start getting into affordable housing? Yeah, well, we’ll chat about that when we’re done recording, because I gotta let you go. Yeah.

 

Alfredo  

But, ya know, I would love to, you know, just share that, you know, we’re launching our Barton through project, I mentioned that just in the next couple of weeks. So if anybody’s interested.

 

Alfredo  

What’s the date? because I don’t know when people are going to hear this. 

 

Alfredo  

Oh, we’re launching that probably around middle of April.

 

Erwin  

Middle of April. Got it!

 

Alfredo  

And you had a couple of shout outs, I’d love to shout out to our official charity, foundations for social change. I think Praveen might have mentioned that when we first chatted.

 

Erwin  

He talks fast, dude.

 

Alfredo  

Foundations for social change. You know, it’s they’re basically a direct giving, giving model. I’m not sure if you’ve ever heard of that. But what they did is they did a trial in Vancouver where they gave 50 People $7,500, no strings attached. And the majority of those folks are, are stable financially. And so you know, and you think that the opposite would actually take place. And so what, you know, you’re, you know, these folks will have the money to buy food, buy their clothes for getting a job, they can now afford some food, and they can now afford rent. And so they’re not no longer struggling on a day to day basis, and are able to improve their lives and get back into the game of life, get back into society. So they’re making some pretty cool headway. And they’ve got this new programme, their Greenleaf programme, where they’re going to be raising $3.8 million. They have a control group of around 400. And they’re getting up giving about 200 of those folks at $500. Each, and and seeing what the impact is getting tonnes of support media wise, getting a lot of, you know, in various institutions interested internationally in what they’re doing. 

 

Erwin  

How you track what they do?

 

Alfredo  

That I don’t know. Yes, so that’s very fast.

 

Erwin  

I have a charity too. And logistically, running a charity is not easy. Handing over money is very easy. Understanding the results.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, there. Yeah, I think I mean, they’re, they’re very sophisticated in their analysis and their studies. But, you know, they are very simple and in the folks that they’re giving the money to.

 

Erwin  

There must be about like a prepaid credit card that they’re tracking or something. I’m not sure. I think there’s no strings attached. Just to track Oh, yeah. Just like I don’t I don’t hang them a stack of cash. 

 

Alfredo  

I know for sure. Yeah. Seriously? Yeah, for sure.

 

Erwin  

Or this is a China we’re using talking about digital currency.

 

Alfredo  

Yeah. No, yeah. So so there are official charity, as shouted out to Addy invest, as I mentioned, we’ll be bringing them into our Barton three project as well. And as well, we were doing our next fireside chat this June. This time, it’ll be with him on Novan of Novan. Developments, a developer out of California, amazing story, you know, similar situation, talking about preservation again, and what they’re doing in the US. Hopefully, we can bring in some of our I’ve been trying to get some or are CMHC partners to get involved. If that’s possible. That would be amazing. Just to get the perspective of what’s taking place in Canada, and how it compares to what’s happening in the US and and if there’s any learnings that we can take please take from that.

 

Erwin  

When you have a third project coming up to and Hamilton. Isn’t there another project as well in Hamilton 

 

Alfredo  

For us? 

 

Erwin  

Yeah

 

Alfredo  

Yeah, we have three projects that we’re working on Bourbon Street, and then we got this Queenston road project that’s taking place. Oh, we’re looking at launching another project in St. Catharines. And, like I said, we’re trying to put 10 projects in the pipeline by the end of the year,

 

Erwin  

and increasing road couple 100 units as well. Yeah, similar idea.

 

Alfredo  

Exactly. Our model doesn’t change, like that’s what we’re being disciplined about is that it’s, you know, 100 150 units, already zoned to six to seven stories, grants and loans are all similar and expected. So the returns are all the same. And so we, you know, try to we’re trying to create scale, basically, that’s one of the biggest challenges that have taken place in affordable housing. Pre pandemic, the City of Hamilton alone had only built 350 new affordable housing units when there’s 7000 people waiting on a waiting list.

 

Erwin  

That surprises that small list will be lot bigger. 

 

Alfredo  

Exactly, exactly. You know, well, that 7000 person list continues or family list continues to grow. Right. And, and so that’s not only happening in Hamilton that’s happening across the country, you know, and so, so, you know, we’ve got to do something about it. And we’re trying to we’re trying to lead by example.

 

Erwin  

And then there’s some of the ridiculousness in the media about all we don’t have a housing supply issue. We have all these houses in Saskatoon that aren’t that are boarded up things. People need to go live there. Okay.

 

Alfredo  

There is a housing supply issue for sure. I mean, you know, statistics I mentioned this during our fireside chat, is that Canada is, you know, on a housing capita, per capita basis is the lowest amongst the g7. And for Ontario, just to meet the national average would have to build 650,000 new units. Well, that’s why we’re talking over what time period? No, no, that just just not not that it’s going to happen. But I’m just saying that to get to the national average, and why are we having this housing crisis? And why are prices so high? Why rental rates so high because of that deficit. Right. So yeah, lots and lots and lots of stuff. 

 

Erwin  

We have a provincial election coming up. Yeah. optimistic. Oh, man. And another, something else to ask? Oh, so I’m trying to be an FAQ for you so that you don’t get like all these crazy emails, other than the ones that I send you, for someone to be an investor. So for someone, so you mentioned that there’s kind of like two rounds of investment. There’s the there’s the one you from your private investor group, what are you looking for there? What is so what does someone have to do to qualify for that?

 

Alfredo  

Accredited Investor? $100,000 minimum investment. You know, obviously, it’s similar alignment?

 

Erwin  

Well, they wouldn’t be investing. Exactly. You’re gonna be asking like, what’s this return? Yeah. Again, like in person? I don’t know. Dogecoin.

 

Alfredo  

And then for for, you know, as I said, we will be bringing Addy on board as well. So make that available to the, to the groups.

 

Erwin  

Amazing. Yeah. All right. Any final words you want to share?

 

Alfredo  

Well, hey, investing in affordable housing is possible. And it’s needed. So you know, if anybody’s interested on on your show, and your listeners know, please get in touch. We’d love to be we’d love to meet you. 

 

Erwin  

How can we get in touch?

 

Alfredo  

They can reach out to by email.

 

Erwin  

Okay, I’m gonna warn you. Emails are forever. This is on the internet.

 

Alfredo  

That’s a good point. You know, I’ll check out our website at 3Hproperties.com. And, you know, we have a we have an email there at info@3Hproperties.com, and you can reach out, reach out to us that way. 

 

Erwin  

Fabulous. All right, thanks. 

 

Alfredo  

Well, thank you very much Erwin for letting me share my story.

 

Erwin  

Cool stuff. You’re you’re doing more to change the world than I am. 

 

Alfredo  

You’re doing lots my friend. You are doing an amazing, thank you. 

 

Erwin  

Thank you. 

 

Alfredo  

Thank you.

 

Erwin  

Before you go, if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

To Follow Alfredo:

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

Interests Up 0.5% & Investing In Belleville With Stephen “HGTV” Phillips

Welcome to another episode of the Truth About Real Estate Investing for Canadians where we’ve been bringing you some of the best tips and past experiences from successful investors since 2016!

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

As I’m recording, the bank of Canada just announced an increase of 0.5% so the overnight rate is now 1%.  This is the first 0.5% increase since May of 2000. 

The bank said it would begin shrinking its holding of government bonds, aka quantitative tightening which will reduce the amount of money supply.

To me, this is a good thing as the pendulum swung so far toward money supply increases during the last two years of the pandemic and inflation needs to be controlled.

These are historic times with a pandemic mostly behind us and war in Ukraine still ongoing.

As long as the war keeps going, inflation will remain high thanks to oil and gas prices; food and fertilizer on top of the manufacturing/supply chain disruption.

As inflation remains high, so will interest rates increase, but my prediction is that interest rates will fall again after the war and supply chains are restored. As for when that is is anyone’s guess.

Dr. Sherry Cooper is saying the market predicts the current overnight rate of 1% to rise to almost 3% a year from now and the Governing Council of the Bank of Canada expects inflation to ease from there dropping to 2.5% in the second half of next year than a normal 2% in 2024.

A big caveat again is the BoC misjudged inflation due to the war in Ukraine and again, it’s a big unknown when the war will end.  

I personally expect inflation to remain higher than pre-pandemic levels as governments all over the world realize they are too dependent on other countries for critical goods and look to mine, dig, drill, or manufacture more locally which will cost more. China didn’t become a manufacturing superpower because they cost more.

On top of that, governments continue to increase spending as we’ve seen here in Canada with our new budget including new spending for daycare, dental, and pharmaceuticals.

That and I received a cheque for $120 for my licence plate sticker. I don’t know why I got a refund when I haven’t renewed my sticker in over two years… but yay, free money. Maybe I’ll buy some TD shares with it.  TD pays a 3.8% dividend and the stock’s been beaten up the last few weeks.  As a full-time capitalist, I do enjoy making money but with a social conscience. 

What’s the new interest rate mean for real estate? On the streets, we are seeing showings slow down. We even had a listing in Brantford, a starter home, asking price right at market value of $700,000 received zero showings over the weekend.

As I predicted, buyers rushed out to get ahead of the expected interest rate hikes this spring… the funny thing is if they bought today, they could save 5-7% as that’s what we’re seeing so far in terms of prices.

Note that days on market in our areas are still single digits.  Around 8 days in March vs when I got licensed in 2010 we were 5X higher around 40-50 days on market.

What are Cherry and I doing? As previously mentioned, we prepared for this moment by ordering several properties for refinancing so we could raise capital.  Appraisals were done at the peak of the market two months ago, paperwork is in progress and we’ll wait for opportunities that my team brings me… timing the market is hard and I guess we got lucky this time but having one’s finger on the pulse and read a lot helps.

It’s a substantial amount of capital we will be freeing up and we’ll be adding to our stock hacking accounts too as several companies we like have been beaten up lately to keep our money working for us and generating cash flow via dividends and selling options. A much preferable option for Cherry and me as we want more cash flow in our lives and prefer to be in control of our money.

What about private lending Erwin? I’ve seen too many lose their capital via private lending.  The risk/reward is just not there for me knowing where the risks are and where the market is at. I’ve been around organized real estate investing since 2008 and seen money lost in a multitude of ways hence I’m on the conservative side. 

Hopefully, for my regular 17 listeners, you’ve been following along closely, taking action on what’s been shared here and at our meetups to set yourself up for optimized success.

Speaking of meetups, our next in-person, no to Zoom, live meeting is Saturday, April 23rd, doors at 8:30 am. We’ll be sharing about joint venturing, the latest happenings on the streets, and renovating for returns.  If you’re on my email list, you’ll receive invites to register. If not, go to https://www.truthaboutrealestateinvesting.ca/, input your name and email address and you’ll start receiving email notifications of our events.

Is it doom and gloom for the real estate investor? If you think it is, I highly suggest getting educated and spending more time with veteran action takers who’ve actually invested through a real recession before.  That last real one was 2007-8 and I’ve made plenty of money during that time.

Interests Up 0.5% & Investing In Belleville With Stephen “HGTV” Phillips

Enough from me, on to this week’s guest, we have a real estate investor from Belleville, Ontario located between the east side of the GTA and Ottawa. With affordability being terrible in the GTA and Ottawa, homeowners, tenants and investors are driving further than ever as shown by the Uhaul report listing Belleville, ON as the #2 end destination for their moving truck rentals.  Also, I’ve spoken to several Oshawa investors who have expanded their search to Belleville.  Investors I respect.

Then what do you know Stephen Phillips reaches out to me to say hi and here we are!

Stephen or his business, who’s been featured on HGTV 24 times with Scott McGillivray. More importantly, Stephens’ real estate experience includes managing 1,200 apartment units in his previous career, then going on vacation to Costa Rica and moving there, now he’s back in Ontario for family, jumping into real estate with both feet in 2014, joining networks, hiring coaches like Ian Szabo and Quentin D’Souza.

Near the end of the interview, we get into detail on what current opportunities look like in Belleville and Stephen’s awkward, celebrity fan moment when Scott McGillivray.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Hello and welcome to another episode The truth about real estate investing show for Canadians. I am Canadian. My name is Erwin Szeto. And since 2016, we bring you some best tips in past experience from some very successful investors. And today is no different. I count as half and our guesses counts as a whole. Anyways, as I’m recording, the Bank of Canada just released an increase of point 5% to the overnight interest rate. So the overnight overnight rate is now a whole 1%. This is the first point five increase since the May of 2000. That’s almost 22 years ago. I can’t believe I’m saying that 2000 Seems. Anyways, remember y2k. Anyways, they said it would be shrinking. It’s holding government bonds. So that’s called quantitative tightening. So there’s the opposite of easing, which will reduce the amount of money supply all this is meant to curb inflation. To me, this is a good thing as the pendulum has swung so far towards the money printing money supply increases, which law ever had bap and to save us from the savings from economic ruin from the people from starving over the last few years thanks to the pandemic, and inflation needs to be controlled. These are historic times. With you know, there’s a war going on in Ukraine. We are just coming out with a pandemic oil prices are crazy. And again, thanks to the war, we have oil prices and gas prices to think on top of that food and fertiliser. For example if anyone follows nutrient, which is a favourite stock from stock tanker Academy, they make potash which is a fertiliser anyways, so that stocks been going nuts. And as inflation remains high, so interest rates will increase. But my prediction is interest rates will fall again after the war is over. And supply chains are restored back to some sort of normalcy. As for when that is that’s anyone’s guess. Dr. Sherry Cooper is saying the market predicts the current overnight rate of 1% to rise to almost 3%, just over a year from now. And that the Governing Council of bank Canada expects inflation to ease from there dropping to 2.5% over the second half of 2023, which is next year. And we’ll see something more normal in 2024. So, again, big caveat again, though, is the the Bank of Canada misjudged inflation during the war in Ukraine, I misjudged it too. So I do not blame them at all. I didn’t think Putin would do it. And it’s a big unknown when that war will end. I personally do expect inflation to remain higher than pre pandemic levels as governments, governments all over the world, they realise that we are too dependent on other countries for critical goods. So governments will look to mine dig, drill or manufacture more locally, which will cost more, China did not become a world manufacturing superpower because they cost more, because they cost less. So if you bring some of those things back home, things will cost more to produce. On top of that government’s continued increased spending, as we’re seeing here in Canada, with our new federal budget and provincial budget in Ontario provincially. We’re talking about new spending for daycare. And federally, we’re talking about new dental and pharmaceutical programmes that and from the provincial government, I received a check for $120 For my licence plate sticker. I don’t know why I got a refund. When I haven’t renewed my sticker in over two years. I believe my licence plate sticker still says 2020 on it. So I’m not sure what they refunded. But yay, free money. Someone’s trying to buy votes out there.

 

Erwin  

And I as always a bit of a frugal person that might go spend it. My preference would be to reinvest the money that I got for free. And I’m thinking about my maybe I’ll buy some TD shares with it at the number one share. But TD pays a 3.8% dividend, which is more cashflow than a lot of real estate pays. And the stock has been beaten up for the last few weeks. As a full time capitalist with a social conscience. I do really enjoy making money. But again with the social constraints. So what’s the new interest rate mean for real estate on the streets, people knew this was coming and people knew this was coming. And we’ve talked about on the show multiple times. On the streets. We’re already seeing showings of properties for sales slowdown. For example, we had a new listing come on the market last week and Branford starter home asking price was right at the market value of 700,000. We received zero showings over that weekend as predicted, buyers rushed out to get ahead of expected interest rate hikes. And now buyers are fatigued. And the funny thing is, if folks had just been a bit patient and they bought today, from what we’re seeing prices have already come down five to 7%. So that’s what buyers today are buying to be saving. And that’s as of right now. This gets slipped further, as I mentioned on the show, we could see 2017 all over again, I don’t know, Much will depend on how things go in the next few months. Note that the days on market in our area are still single digits. I think we are looking at around eight days on market, which is absolutely ridiculous. That’s about five times. That’s about five times less. So when I started when this when I started on my licence as a realtor in 2010 days on market, we’re like 40 to 50 days. Today, we’re eight. Alright, so days on market for a property to sell. It took it like five times longer back in those days. And that was more like balanced. What I used to see, this is not balanced at all, this is still a seller’s market. What are cheering doing, as previously mentioned, we prepare for this moment ordering for several properties for free refinancing so that we could raise some capital appraisals were done at the peak of the market about two months ago, paperwork is in the progress. And we’ll wait. I like to sign some cash and wait to see what opportunities that it brings me timing the market is hard. But I would just be lucky this time. But thanks to having our finger on the pulse. And I read a lot, which helps. It’s a substantial amount of capital that we’re freeing up, and we’ll be adding some of it to our stock. I can’t count as some of the companies that that I like I’ve been beaten up lately. And we’d like to keep our money working for us. And generating cash flow of the dividends and selling options for cheering is much preferable option to having cash to sit around. We want more cash flow in our lives. And, as always, we prefer to be in control of our money. What about private lending? Erwin? Oh, who was that? Who said that?

 

Erwin  

I hear that question a lot. I’ve been around. So remember, folks, I’ve been part of organised real estate investing since 2008. I’ve seen too many people lose their capital via private lending. The risk reward is not there. For me, I don’t like the idea of having kept gains. And for me my experience, I know where the risks are. And that’s not enough for the reward for my personal preference. Also, knowing where the market is right now, this is not really a market, I’d want to be private lending. And yeah, maybe I’m a bit too on the conservative side. But again, I’ll just reiterate, I would say my opinion is that you’re the best at managing your money and to manage your money and indeed be control of it. So we can take care and attitude to educate ourselves to control our own money and earn returns. Hopefully for you my regular 17 listeners that you’ve been following along closely and taking action and time the market got lucky timing the market like we did. Hopefully you’ve been attending our meetups in order to continue to set yourself up for optimised success. Speaking of meetups are next in person, zero zoom, we’ve cancelled a large part of our Zoom account. We have a live meeting in person Saturday, April 23. Doors open at 8:30am. We’ll wrap up the meeting around noon and then head to Hilton for a street smart tour of actual physical real estate investment properties. It’s all live and in person, there will be no recordings of these people’s some of these are people’s personal homes. We’re not going to be recording that the tours for educators educational purposes, there is no pressure to buy anything. Honestly that pressure should come from within as to your why why are you invest and your understanding of the world that hard assets will win? Because if you’ve haven’t been paying attention to what what asset classes have been winning, I think you should have a look at that. And that might help motivate you to take action. Those sadly, who do not have our assets are being left behind and where do you think there’ll be in the next 10 years? Do you think those without assets will be ahead or behind over the next 10 years? Maybe by answering that question, you’ll know what you want to do. Investing wise, April 23. We’ll be sharing about joint venturing the latest happenings on the streets in terms of rents and resale prices and renovating for returns. There’s another reason to renovate. I was talking to a friend who wants to take some money, invest some money in the kitchen for her home. I’m like we’re real estate investors. We don’t do that. Or like the shoemakers children. Our homes are last after you make a lot of money. Anyways, if you’re on my email list, you’ll receive invites to register. If not go to www dot truth about real estate investing.ca I should have slower WWW dot truth about real estate investing.ca and put your name and email address and you’ll start receiving email notifications for our events. Is it doom and gloom for real estate investors? If you think it is I highly suggest getting educated and in spending more time around veteran real estate investors who take action those preferably someone who’s actually invested through a recession before the last real one was 2007 and eight. I was personally investing in 2005 And guess what? I’ve made a lot of money since then. 

 

Erwin  

And enough for me onto this week’s guests as we have a real estate investor from Belleville, Ontario that Far East located and for those who don’t know where Belleville is that’s east of the GTA the greater truth Don’t area but before Ottawa with affordability being terrible in the GTA in Ottawa homeowners, tenants investors are all driving further than usual. And that was proven in a report from U haul. You know the truck rental company the moving truck rental company, and it listed Belleville Ontario as the number two and destination for their moving trucks. I’ve also spoken to several offshore investors who have expanded their search to Belleville investors I respect and then when you know Stephen Phillips reaches out to me and says hi and here we are. He’s on this today’s show as far as our guest, Stephen or his business had been featured on HGTV 24 times and Scott McGilvery. More importantly, Stephens real estate experience includes managing over 1200 apartment units. So that’s a lot of that’s a lot in his previous career. Then he went on vacation in Costa Rica and I ended up moving there. But he came back he came back to Ontario like many people do start a family, raise a family and then from there, he jumped into real estate with both feet back in 2014. Joining real estate networks hiring coaches like Ian Zabo and Quinton D’souza near the end of the interview, we get into detail on what current opportunities look like in Belleville. And Stephen tells his awkward celebrity fan moment when meeting Scott McGilvery. Please enjoy the show. 

 

Erwin  

Hello, Stephen. 

 

Stephen  

Hi, how you doing?

 

Erwin  

I’m excellent. Thanks for coming on the show. So what’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Stephen  

Mostly you and my kids and my kitchen business. I got a lot of things on the go man getting older gotta keep busy.

 

Erwin  

Speaking to the like, you already have a successful What do you call it? kitchen cabinetry and countertops?

 

Stephen  

Yeah, we started as like a countertop business. But like predominantly, and then we’ve kind of morphed into kitchens in the last 12 to 14 months with COVID. So yeah, I guess so I just call it a kitchen company now because it’s just easier to define it as that but we do everything. countertops, design and kitchens.

 

Erwin  

And it’s pretty successful, is it not?

 

Stephen  

It’s doing well we’ve we think we’re doing well. I mean, it’s one of those businesses that it’s like you start from a place where you don’t really know what’s well like what I had no idea I got into the business. Quite, quite strange, I guess you could say. We were we moved out to this way my wife and I moved out. I mean, the Quinney west area, Belleville, we live in caring place, Prince Edward County, all of these areas. And so we moved out here, and I meant to like slow down and relax and take a break from real estate. And I got here. And within two months, about a month and a half. We had JV and partner to bought a flip house in Prince Edward County and Airbnb that we were flipping it into an Airbnb. And I had no contacts. I had nobody here I didn’t know what was going on. And then we got to the countertop stage and the kitchen stage. And we shopped around, and I just saw this massive hole, like just, there’s just wasn’t a lot of options. There wasn’t a lot of people here. And there was a lot of people about to come here from Toronto. And so we kind of got in front of that before the people got here and opened this company up and made some made a partnership with a with a really good person who’s an importer, and just kept running from there, man. My wife loves it. Like that’s the reason I got into this business is because I was building a real estate business. And my wife hated it. She hated it. She wanted nothing to do with it. She didn’t like Like, she didn’t want anything to do with it. So renovations. She liked the design, like she liked designing. And she liked that it made me happy. But she didn’t like any of the other things about it. She just wasn’t into it. She’s the daughter of a property manager. So the thought of managing people and property and tenant like it was just the last thing she wanted. Then I had this all those things. I know. But you know. And then I had this like, fear. I woke up one day and I had this fear that if I died tomorrow, my wife inherited my real estate business, she would be very mad at me. So it just worked out that she was into natural stone and into design and into kitchens and into all this stuff. So I took a break and walked away from real estate for a couple years to help her build this business and leave her something that she could run with. And that’s that’s where we’re at today. She’s good. She’s got it all under control now.

 

Erwin  

Right and has. So did you put the investing business on pause then?

 

Stephen  

I really did. Yeah, I wasn’t able to multitask like I couldn’t. I tried at the very start. I was trying to be both realtor and selling natural stone. I mean, that’s what I do. I’m a sales guy. I swear I’ve been since I was probably six years old. And so when I was doing it, I wasn’t able to disconnect my brain. And it just got to the point where I was being pulled to many different directions. And I mean, you know, when you start a new business, you really need to put 120% into that to get that momentum just to make the thing roll. And so it took it was a hard decision, but I did I froze my licence for about two years and stepped away from real estate so that I couldn’t be tempted like by freezing my licence. I couldn’t get these calls, I would still get the calls, right? And people be like, Hey, did you see that? And so this way, if I froze my licence, I can legitimately say like, No, I can’t help you. But I have somebody who can help you and do that kind of thing. And it just forced me to take it really seriously and not get distracted.

 

Erwin  

And it’s been quite the journey has a not. So we have quite a journey to cover. So yeah. Was it your first job at a school you worked In property management? Yeah. So I just didn’t get into isn’t it?

 

Stephen  

Yeah, it was ideal. Man, I got into condos. My father, my now father in law was he’s owned a condominium property management company for I don’t know, since the late 80s. So like, whatever this is now, 40 years, 30 something years. And so when I got out of school, I had really no direction, I’d gone to school for marketing, didn’t really know what I wanted to do. And so he looked at me who’s about to marry his daughter, and he’s like, You better get a real job come work for me. And so I did. And then that led me into managing condos pretty early, and managing a portfolio of like 1200 doors 12 condominium corporations 12 Board of Directors, learning condo law had to learn architecture and design and carry on warranties and reserve fund studies. And just like, wow, it was in over my head really quick. So I learned a lot just by being over my head and having to try to catch up. And so that just talked, it took me down a really cool path and if at the time, so it’s like 2004 2005 by 2006, the condo preconstruction market booms in Toronto, and we just like start taking off, and condos start to just like develop really quickly. And so then I got my licence, my real estate licence by 2009. And started selling pre construction condos at the same time. That, that I was kind of managing them. I had an advantage. I understood a lot of condos when people were still trying to figure them out.

 

Erwin  

2009 That’s a funny time to have the recession.

 

Stephen  

Yeah, but you know, Toronto, it’s weird, right? Because like Toronto in it didn’t blink, like it was so weird. And I think that time kind of led me like I was I was young, I bought a pre construction condo, which is so ironic that I just said I knew what I was doing. Because at the end of the day, I bought a pre construction condo in Durham. And that builder was had this awesome project. Now if you go into Pickering, you’ll see it. It’s like this beautiful San Francisco project right on the goal line. Like it just checked every box growing community, like you couldn’t find anything wrong with it. But what I didn’t put into that is that once you send your money into that trust account, you give it to the lawyers, you can’t touch it anymore, right? I didn’t learn that lesson until I learned that lesson. And the builder ended up getting into a squabble with one of the tenants in the old mall that he had bought that he was going to tear down and rebuild on. And that drew out in a court battle for almost four and a half years, while he tried to evict this veterinarian out of this plaza. And it was a nightmare. And so I got stuck and sorted a whole bunch of other people with like, pretty much all my money, everything I had in this trust account, and I couldn’t get it out to save my life. And so it was a really weird time to Yeah, it was really, really, really stressful time in my life. But I learned a lot I learned a lot about easy. Yeah, it was crazy. It got built, it took seven years to be built.

 

Erwin  

So would it take like two and a half of everything that normal?

 

Stephen  

Should have, like every other project was going up in like a year, right? Like this is the time when like there’s some pretty heavy hitters made their career between 2006 and 2010. Right 2009 It they should have been able to go up really quick. It was just one of those projects. I don’t know, Luck of the dice, I guess. But But yeah, in the end, that actually could have been the best thing that happened to me. It gave me a lot of like freedom. And I learned a lot of things about like making bad decisions and how people are going to judge every decision. And then it just made me a lot stronger dealing with how people judge you and should they judge you and do you care, like at the end of the day? Do you care at the time I did. It led me to leave and go to Costa Rica. That’s how I ended up in Costa Rica. Wow. But essentially, yeah.

 

Erwin  

So you so you were working professionally in real estate during the recession, which is the last…

 

Stephen  

 Yes, I got real estate licence. Yeah, technically.

 

Erwin  

We typically think we technically had a recession for COVID. And we tend to really hit a recession for the financial crisis. We didn’t feel as much in Ontario as the West for example. Can you? Because we may see a recession soon? Like what was your experience like as a property manager for condos like to show you the p&l is handed in there? Oh, left home. And

 

Stephen  

This is the pitch my father in law gave me at 23. And it’s true. He wasn’t lying. It’s true. condominium property management is recession proof. Now, it’s essentially recession proof. Yes. Condo management, okay, you get paid on a contract, the contracts 3060 days, you can get kicked out. Sure. But you’re on a contract that money set. The owners of the Condominium Corporation have to pay their maintenance fees every single month. If you don’t, the only other person who can lien your property and take your property is a condo board. And so they have to pay like there’s no option. And so people were buying condos, they were living in them. They were paying their maintenance fees they had to, and then that feeds the property management company. So yeah, I was sheltered from it, right. Like because I was working in condos and my life didn’t change. All it did was get busier, we were getting more condos, there was more opportunities as these things were being built. And so to me, it looked like you know, I did 22 I was 26. Like, it didn’t even feel like there was such a thing as a recession. You heard it, and I could see it down south in the US, but I didn’t feel the life. Oh, or a West. Yeah, for sure. I mean, everywhere but where we were, which is oddly enough, right, like, so I get into pre construction condos, and we started selling them. And I was working with a realtor was really experienced. He was a really good guy and very charismatic, very super charismatic. And one of the early adapters of pitching the builder to take 50 units. Like at the time that was like boggled my mind, I didn’t think that was possible. But he was very early into that game where he would bring 50 investors, they would all buy a unit or more. And he would clear out a building on his own before it ever hit the market. We were turning renters into multi part a condo unit owners, they wouldn’t be paying 15 to $1,600 in rent, they had a little bit of money saved. And then like you had to keep in mind the condos were selling for like 235 289 really low. And at the time, you can do 5% down deals. Right? And and so 10, 20 30 grand people were just pitching 30 grand out of grab a bunch of units close into the three years. And yeah, man, it was crazy. We watched a lot of people make a lot of money. So that’s how I got into real estate. My first year, I did six figures and lease deals. I did leases for my whole first year. And due to that I would show up, I would show up with like six different rental applications at the bottom of the building. And I’d book appointments all day. And I just keep showing the same unit until I found somebody who took it and then we fill it out, submit it and try to win. And then I would I would do you know, 1500 bucks or two grand off of the half of first month’s rent and a lot of leases, a lot of leases, but it was early and I didn’t know what to do. And so that was the best way to learn.

 

Erwin  

If these are solid units.

 

Stephen  

Well, I did that too. But but you have a trustworthy, right? Like you’re 2526 like what do you know about real estate and a lot of people are telling you that and so it was hard. It was hard for me to and I like to save a baby face. Like I like to think that I look young. And so it was hard to get a lot of confidence early on when I was a realtor from other people. So it was a challenge.

 

Erwin  

So you say you don’t need to retire to Costa Rica.

 

Stephen  

So I go to Costa Rica to vacation, I take a vacation, I’m making some good money, I’m doing some good things. I take a vacation with a buddy of mine and his girlfriend and my wife. And we go down and we essentially booked one place we were gonna go for like three weeks. I had one hotel booked and it looked like it was only like, you know, three inches away from the on the map from the airport. That’s got to be easy to get to. So we rented a car we start driving through. Turned out it took us 12 hours to get there on some like washed out roads. And we ended up getting there seeing most of the way and had a great time and just like loved it and had this amazing trip, right? I come back and I tell this story often but I come back and it’s midnight or one o’clock in the morning our time to dark I’m at the airport, I go to pick up my car from the rental place. I go to the gas station, and there’s nobody to abandoned right by the airport. And I’m pumping gas and this guy across the way from me on this other pump just starts kicking the pump like booting it like like just stomping on it. And I literally looked at when I looked over at my wife in the passenger side. I said we’re out of here. These people are crazy. Costa Rica was so much better. We’re out I’m gone. I’m not staying and six months later, we sold pretty much all of our little furniture and possessions, a car and some other things. And we cleared out. And we moved to Costa Rica and ended up staying there for like a year and a half.

 

Erwin  

All because of a pump!

 

Stephen  

Just because it just it was like this. It was like the epitome of madness, right? Like, it was just crazy. You have everything in this world. You’re so privileged, and yet you’re mad at a gas pump, you know, and, and the prices weren’t even half as high as they are now. Right. So it wasn’t about price. It was just like it wasn’t working. So yeah, so I, I went down there. And again, very little planning, I just went and within two to three months got pretty bored of sitting on the beach every day and trying to pretend like I could surf. And so we opened a business there and we started we walked around the towns, right, we looked around and everybody had a restaurant, the only one I couldn’t find was Pita Pit. So I ripped off Pita Pit and made a little rap shop that we call wrap it up. And it was a little chicken and barbeque chicken wrap shop and we serve them surfers wraps at sunset.

 

Erwin  

And I’m only doing that?

 

Stephen  

Of course not. But I survived. I survive. And I thought I was marketing genius. You know, like you have to leave Costa Rica every 90 days to because you didn’t have a visa, right? So I didn’t have a visa so we had to leave every 90 days. So I flew into Florida because it was dirt cheap to go for three days. And I had family there. So I go into Florida and I go into Dick’s Sporting Goods and I buy a hockey stick and an orange ball. And it cost me like 20 bucks for a hockey stick and an orange ball. And then I go back to Costa Rica and I’m bringing it with me through the airport. And Costa Rica is 100% tax, whatever you’re bringing in, they just charge you 100% tax duty on whatever your value of the thing you have. And so at the time, that’s what they were doing. I don’t anyways, so I bring this stick and this ball in and literally 10 Costa Ricans are sitting around trying to figure out what it is and what is what’s the value of a hockey stick. And so essentially, they charged me $60 of tax on this stick and ball. And it was twice as much as I paid for the damn thing. So I had it in the country. My wife said you better use this. I don’t know why you brought this here, we’re in a tropical place. But in front of our shop was a concrete wall and a concrete parking spot. And so every day at about like 2:30, 3 o’clock, it’s like siesta time sleeping, everyone be sleeping or resting in the sun’s hot, I’d go out and shoot the ball off the wall, and then like, boom, boom. And it was like, I don’t know if it was like a smoke signal to Canadians, but all the Canadians would come out and they’d be like, that’s the last thing I thought I’d see in Costa Rica. And I’m like, Yeah, well, it keeps me busy. Maybe like, well, what are you doing? So I’m just having some fun waiting for the surf. Hey, are you hungry? And they were like, Yeah, I’m starving. Like, you should go in there, man. They make a great wrap right there. They’ll get you a wrap take care of you go in and say that you know me, they’ll take care of and they’d walk in, they’ve talked to my wife and my employee there and they buy a wrap. And I just keep shooting the ball. And every day I attracted Canadians from all over Calgary, Vancouver, I met a whole bunch of people just because of a stick in a ball. So yeah, man, that was a marketing genius.

 

Erwin  

And then, You left paradise….

 

Stephen  

So then my wife gets pregnant. We’re having our first child who’s my daughter, Mia. And at the time, we thought we were gonna stay because there’s a way to get citizenship if you have a child in Costa Rica. So we’re like, all this is. This is a way to get our residency. But then my family starts talking like you can’t have a child there, like you don’t have anybody. How are you going to do this? And so my wife, I guess, fell for that. And she’s like, Alright, fine, we’ll move back. And so we moved back, we moved back to Toronto. And yeah, and I stayed in Ottawa for a couple of months while we were first got home, to re-acclimate. But it’s funny, because when I was in Costa Rica, I was talking to a bunch of people down there. And like, 2009 hit them hard, like hit them hard. Like they were Hatfield condos everywhere, like, just destroyed. And I would talk

 

Erwin  

There’s crazy money flowing, right?

 

Stephen  

Americans, the Americans were coming down from California and all over and then buying all these things, pre construction, and then when the market tipped, they all took off and just like abandon the place, right. And so I’m talking to this guy, I’ll never forget him. His name was Hans, he was Italian. He was a realtor in the area. And he’d be like, Steve, where are you from? And I tell him, and I’d be like, Hans, it’s crazy condo market, and they’re building condos everywhere. It’s amazing. Like, they put them up and they sell them out in hours and blah, blah, blah. And he looks at me, I’ll never forget the day looks at me and goes, Steve, what are you doing here? And I said, I don’t know. I really don’t know. I guess I’m missing a really good opportunity back home. He’s like, I haven’t seen a buyer in six months. You should go home. Yeah, I guess. So. That kind have fed into it too. And yeah, and so we came back home and we got a pretty good thing going in Toronto here. I guess I should go back and try to take advantage of it. So yeah, so that led me back into Toronto. I got back into property management again, first things you’re having a kid you freak out. So what am I gonna do, I need a real job. And I don’t want to start being a realtor again from scratch. So while I’m waiting to do that, I get the job as a condominium manager. And I started managing Maple Leaf square, which is right across from your canvas centre. And at the time. At the time, it had just been built lanterra and just bought it I built it. It was in its first year Terry on on it’s it’s just in may have the bottom 10 floors are Cadillac, Fairview runs those and commercial and the top floors 80 to 90% of the building was tenanted, and there’s not like defects, but there was defects. And so there’s a lot of work to get kind of fixed. So that’s where I landed.

 

Erwin  

Were investors renting them out, or was that a rental builder?

 

Stephen  

Yes, a lot of the building had been sold to investors in two major countries, I think you can guess which ones in here, those maybe not here. None of them were Canadian. And a lot of them were foreign buyers. I was a legit foreign buyers when they were there. And so the foreign buyers owned them, and realtors would represent those buyers in the purchase. And then they kind of be like the property manager, like the pseudo property manager when you take over, but as a condo manager, you had no context, you didn’t know who any of these owners are. And most of them never knew where their units were. So it was like, at least once a month, once a week, the elevators on the 10th floor would open. And then somebody would walk off, and you’d be standing there with security. And they’d be like, Yes, can you take me to my unit? You’re like, what unit? Is it? I don’t know. Where is it? I don’t know. I just know I own two of them here. And you’d be like, okay, you’d have to go and track the unit and you take them up there. And sure enough, they don’t know. And they’d be vacant or rented whatever. And so it was crazy. And yeah, and then in 2012, I remember my daughter had just been born in March, it was April of 2012. I’m getting ready to get on the go train to go down at seven in the morning. And cp 20 fours on in my house. And all of a sudden, my dad building Maple Leaf squares on the news and smokes bellowing out of the window. And I’m like, Oh, that can’t be good. That should be a good day. My phone starts ringing and it’s my head of security. He’s like you got to get down here in the next 30 minutes. We just had somebody jumped out of the 47th floor, they set the unit on fire before they’ve left 12 floors up, have smoke damage. 20 floors down have water damage, and we don’t know what to do. It’s chaos. And so yeah, so I just want to go down and and it was the craziest, craziest thing ever. It was foreign. It was foreign students. There was no visas, there was no lease in place. They were Korean students. They were just here for U of T. The people on the lease had sublease to these three guys. Nobody ever collected their information. So nobody knew who they were the the owner of the units. dad lived in a foreign country. She was going to school at Waterloo. So I had to call him and he came down. And he didn’t know where his unit was. He’s on the hook for a $25,000 deductible for the insurance claim. And he goes, What do I got to do to get out of this? And then the tenants look and they go, What do I got to do to get out of this? And I’m standing there, like somebody’s got to pay the deductible. The tenants went down to the basement to the TD Bank, they came back up with a cashier’s check. They gave it to the landlord for 25 grand did like are we good? And he’s like, I guess so. And they left and they were never seen again. And the landlord gave me the check. And he was my good. They said I guess so. And the units. It was just madness. It was crazy. It was crazy. It was crazy.

 

Erwin  

That’s okay, that’s truth about real estate investing that can happen with a condo like I’ve had I’ve had family and friends affected by fires, floods that weren’t didn’t originally from their condo, right?

 

Stephen  

The crazy thing about that, and so the deductibles 25 grand, right? How did we get to a deductible of 25 grand, there was a pipe that kept bursting in every unit behind the laundry. So every time the washing machine pipe would blow, you’d have water come out, and it would take out like one or two units. So that happened maybe 3040 times like I can’t remember the number but it happens so frequently, almost every other day, it would happen and we’d have to go fix this. And over time we got so bad that you just you couldn’t even put in insurance claims anymore because the deductible just kept climbing and climbing and climbing and climbing. And by the time when they actually needed the deductible to be low. It was 25 grand and things like that, like, those are crazy condo stories. But they happen, right? They’re not the norm. But once they happen, it’s really hard to get insurance again, like there’s a lot of there’s not a lot of insurance providers for condo corps. And so crazy stuff happens. And then you’re kind of just caught up in it as an owner. In one of those buildings. The hardest part for me was like everybody dumped out because the smoke alarms were going at seven in the morning, and they all fell like they all came out the same door, which is like river the ramp goes when you’re watching, like ACC or whatever it’s called that switch. When the players come out the back ramp that goes to the guts of the building. That’s where the body felt, that’s where the person felt, right in a car and the coming up the ramp actually ended up like driving onto them and staying there. All of the people dumped out of that building and had to walk past that scene. And all that we had was a $12 an hour security guard fresh into the country barely spoke English. And he was trying to like steer traffic away from this thing. And you’re trying to you feel so bad for all these people. And there was chaos. It was chaos. They didn’t know where to go. You’re right at the Gartner it was mayhem it was man. So that’s when I left condos. That was the day I was pretty much within the next two months, I went back to real estate full time I was like this is it’s a lot easier to sell them than to manage them. This is too much. So there’s lots of job opportunities and condo managers. There’s significantly not enough managers to to meet the demand of how many managers are needed. But it’s just a tough job, man. Nobody calls you to say hello and no there’s no glory. There’s never a good, like happy day. It just doesn’t happen. So you ended up in some really negative negative vibes. negative vibes. Okay. Yeah. So we’re talking about condos, right? Like I’m biassed, I don’t know I like pre construction condos. I’ve seen millionaires get created by creating pre construction condos but I’ve had another vision like a version of it and I met a lot of people from the inside out. And it’s just it’s a good business it’s it’s a need you need to have them but it’s a tough it’s a tough sled man. It’s a tough sled. So so that’s how I ended up into real estate again in by 2014. I was back into real estate full time.

 

Erwin  

And then what was that like?

 

Stephen  

That was like I better learn something.

 

Erwin  

How did you start learning?

 

Stephen  

I started learning the way that I think a lot of people try to learn I read books I did. It wasn’t as many big podcasts like 2014 There’s no pod I still listening to Sirius Radio. There’s no podcasts like Joe Rogan was an epiphany that hadn’t even been thought of yet. I was basically like going to meetups, I became a member of Durham Rei, and which is a real estate networking group in the Durham Region. Actually what ended up happening is I started learning from multiple different meetup groups. I went to a seminar like all people do, I went to this seminar, I was just actually telling James about this. I went to a seminar and 2013 2014 I can’t remember the company that did it. The gentleman that was there was from Calgary, and he was like an expert rent to own guy. But he did sandwich lease options. So like, you don’t have money sandwich lease option. So I’m like, Wow, that’s crazy. Like, how does that work? So he teaches me sandwich lease options. And so in a room full of people. His pitch was he would call Kijiji rental ads. And people that were trying to like landlords trying to rent out their unit and be like, Can I show? Can I come see the unit? Does it have to die? Yeah. And then when he had him on the phone, he’d be like, so when do I rent to own or something? And he would just keep saying that until they were like, I don’t understand you come and see the place and we’ll go from there. And he would just play country dumb and so I learned this thing. So I actually got into try to do sandwich lease options. I thought they were crazy and got in got a couple of them and made them kind of work. You know what’s ironic? My first one was in Wellington, Ontario, which is in Prince Edward County, which at the time I had no idea where it was. I just knew the Trenton army base was there. The house I got the house for like 220 I think I did it with $100 bill as my holding like guys my deposit. It was crazy, man. Yeah. So that’s kind of how I got into that just trying to do like everybody does, like go to the seminars, they teach you something. I just wanted to be the action taker. I always wanted to be an action taker. Like I always wanted to be the guy who did something to just waste my money and listen to somebody and go home. So I would try whatever they said I would try it at least once and see what happened. And after trying a couple of these crazy ideas. I was like I gotta learn from somebody. Really good. I got to figure this out. I got my real estate licence back I had put an option or got a property in Oshawa, that in hindsight now was just glorious, but at the time wasn’t a great deal. But I had two houses side by side that were on the market and their total frontage was just it was up from downtown Whitby actually total frontage, like 150 feet, and massive lots together. And I had them under contract, but they were like the old wartime houses, you couldn’t really duplex them. And I was trying to find a JV partner to do this deal with. And so I called the desperate effort I called number on the sign, you know, like, you call the sign like that guy buys houses. You probably want to buy this house, so I called it and on the other line was quitting D’Souza, which was my introduction to one of the greatest real estate coaches I’ve ever met, and was amazing. And so I pitched him this deal. I told him and he’s like, like, No, I don’t want that deal. I don’t want that deal. I can’t do Plexes. I’m in the duplexes. I stay focused. I only do duplexes. I don’t want that deal. I said, Oh, but he knew so much. So I’m like, How do you like who are you? Who are you who is this Quinton D’Souza and he said, he goes, Well, I have this group, maybe you should come to it. And I’m a coach, and I can maybe teach you some things you should come and I said, Okay, and so and so that brought me to Quinton D’Souza. It was also the hardest real estate deal I ever had to do. Because I never found a JV partner. I had the deal under contract. I couldn’t close on it. I had a deposit in place that couldn’t close. I was by myself. And I had to go back to the sellers. And the seller was a eighty year old man and his wife and his kids. And I had to tell him, I couldn’t close. And I had to sit in their living room and tell them face to face because I couldn’t do it any other way. I had to face it. And I walked in and I said, Look, man, I can’t close. I’m really sorry, I bit off way more than I can chew. And I’m, I’m sorry, I’m sorry, I did this to you. And I’m sorry, I did this. And it was a terrible, terrible feeling at the time. And he was really cool about it. He just said to me, he’s like young man, you’re gonna make a lot of mistakes. It’s terrible. You did it to me, you’re gonna make a lot of mistakes. Just don’t ever do this again. And I really took it to heart and I feel like I think like I believe a lot in all these things. I’m a person where nothing happens by accident. And it brought me to Quinton D’Souza. And it brought me to that real estate group. And that’s when I just was like, I gotta learn, I gotta learn something, I can’t do this without learning. So I became when I joined the mentor programme with Quinton D’Souza, one of the early ones, I think, third or second into his coaching programme. And I spent six months with some really, really cool people who are now like in the industry titans in their own regard. But at the time, we were just, I think we were like the second wave like, I came in with Ryan Carr. And a lot of those guys like we were young at the time. And like you and Quinton and Zappo and lawfare. And all these guys had already been doing it for a while. And so we were just trying to learn from everybody around and I was in that group. So I was surrounded by some really smart people at the time and could absorb a lot of information from smart people really helped very much. 

 

Erwin  

And then you quit?

 

Stephen  

Why didn’t quit right away? No. I then got into it full full bore, like so from like, 2014 through to like 2017 Four years. Yeah, like I did a lot of deals like, you know, I think so I was pretty good. Like I wasn’t, I wasn’t a slob and and I put myself around good people. And I’ve heard I harassed Dabo until Ian would, you know, let me hang around and learn some things from him. And then I learned a lot from him for about a year and a half, two years and I got to be around people that you

 

Erwin  

Just to backtrack, Quinton is one of the best coaches in our community. ultra successful investor has since moved on from duplexes to only does apartment buildings, it seems. Yeah. 

 

Stephen  

And quote, sorry, just to cut off, but like one of the most humble people I think I’ve ever met, and very much and although he answers questions very truthfully, and honestly and bluntly, he puts you in a position where you have to ask a good question. Like, if you don’t ask a good question, then you know, you don’t take anything from it. So you’re in a spot where you really have to be a good learner and be wanting to learn and want to teach yourself. So yeah, really, really, really just a really good person. And I was really blessed to be around that at the right time. learn a lot from people.

 

Erwin  

Shout out top teachers, Teachers seem to be really good investors.

 

Stephen  

Yeah, because they know how to deal with stupid kids, I guess, right? Like I say that about myself, right? Like I was the class clown. So I know that I put a lot of stress on a lot of teachers. I think when you’re used to dealing with that kind of stressful environment. You can like a contractor and a project management scenario. I think you can handle it. I think they don’t think they can but they actually can cause There’s a lot of similarities there.

 

Erwin  

And then shout to Ian Zabo, who’s, you know, have many, many obstacles, and he’s done very well for himself. He’s written two books, I think. 

 

Stephen  

Yeah, Ian is, is just one of those guys that, you know, he taught me more about people, a lot of people. And when I approached his apple, I was trying to learn about real estate. In the end, when I looked back on it now, he taught me more about people than I ever really expected. He taught me how to be empathetic. He taught me how that like you’re in a real estate transaction. But there’s people involved here, like, it’s not numbers, it’s its people. And you need to figure out how to communicate and solve problems for people. That’s how you get good deals. And it’s not about how many doors you can knock on and volume, it was about how many relationships he would always amaze me, like he wouldn’t have to do is he did have to work in like, he worked really hard. But he would be able to knock on like three or four doors, he would be able to talk to like three or four people and convert to all these deals. And I was like, how do you do that like, and the way he did it is just, he’s just a really, really, really good person. And he would take time and listen to people and then he he’d hear things, and he’d solve problems for people. And that’s a really valuable skill that I think a lot of people don’t, they get caught up on spreadsheets. And I think there’s more to it. There’s more to real estate than that.

 

Erwin  

He gave a lot in his business by renovation business. He gave a lot. People were Yeah, we’re lucky to have him.

 

Stephen  

On I’m one of them. I count myself as one of those lucky people to have him and to be around him at that time. I mean, I’m blessed. That was it. It was a great, it was a great experience.

 

Erwin  

And then you started the kitchen business. 

 

Stephen  

Oh, and then I started kitchen business. Yeah. And then and then 2016 2017, very similar to now the market was crazy. And it was very stressful as a realtor and very stressful for investors prices are going up every day multiple offers, things were happening that were new at the time. And then like I said, my wife didn’t want my business. And so I had to figure out something else. I had two kids now. And by that time, I had a daughter and a son. And they were getting ready to go to school. And I wanted to make sure I brought them to kind of a smaller town, a smaller community slower vibe. And so we moved to Brighton, Ontario in 2017. We came out here we looked at one house on a Tuesday and bought it on a Wednesday and we moved out here. And so the story goes, and then we and then we started our kitchen business. And then to start our kitchen business, I had to get a building because I had to put the stone somewhere. And so I found a commercial property that’s out here at the gates of Prince Edward County that nobody else really wanted. It had been up for sale, I drove by it every day as I was going to my Airbnb project. And this simple 6500 square feet was an ugly building at the time, but had a big lot. And it was right that you had to drive by it to get into the county. And so I drove by it every day, and nobody bought it. And so one day I called the guy up the real estate agent, I’m like, I want to do a rental and or something. So I ended up ended up doing that deal as a rent owed. So I use that skill again, we locked up the property in 2018, we did a rental, we closed on it crazy enough in the middle of COVID and March of 2020. Which made it really hard to finance because nobody wanted to touch commercial property at the time. But we figured it out. We got the deal done. And we bought the building. And it’s been it’s been been going ever since.

 

Erwin  

You actually just raised a really good point is like real estate investing is deal business. It’s all business. These are business relationships and business skills you have to develop and they can translate into other areas of business. Just like you said, right? For example, a friend of mine who bought a business in Canmore, Alberta. She hated VTB to buy it. Right, right? Like the business, the business have failed. And and here’s here’s the second one in so he’s buying that business. And he’s like, Well, I don’t have all the capital, can you? Can you like loan it to me? Can I work? Can you lend it to me? Right? I’ll do that. Yeah, so use the real estate strategy in buying a business, right, these things apply.

 

Stephen  

It applies. I think what you get when you get to be into like into the trenches of real estate is you get to get a thicker skin that you can ask questions like if you don’t ask, you’re never going to know. And if you know the strategy and have the tools to know how to structure it and know what to ask for. Yeah, it’s very, very versatile. You can figure out how to use it in multiple ways. So I try to learn skills that I can use different ways because I just I don’t ever want to learn something and then never use it again. I think that’s a waste. I would rather use something that I’ve learned. I can

 

Erwin  

Okay, so I’m actually trying to think so everyone, everyone on our team has a nickname There’s just HGTV So Ryan’s out of the bag now he’s gonna know HGTV. But my understanding is

 

Stephen  

I didn’t say that card, it wasn’t me.

 

Erwin  

He posted on Instagram last night. It’s all good. He posted it first, I’ve bitten my tongue for over two years.

 

Stephen  

Exactly, exactly. So how did I end up on HGTV?

 

Erwin  

So first off, you’ve been on HGTV more than anyone I know personally.

 

Stephen  

Well, yeah, you say that. And then it makes me hungry. I try to be humble. And when you say that, I feel like right away your Hollywood. Right away, I feel like I should, I should stack this and put it into context. My company, our company did 23 episodes of HGTV Scott McGilvery vacation house rules. My wife and I heard. Yeah, my wife and I were on three, two episodes, three episodes, one in the first season two in the first season and one in the second season. And then they shot in our shop. In the second season, I think episode six, and they shot in our warehouse in episode season one. And then they we were on site, and I did the walkthrough at one of the instals and season one with Scott. So yeah, okay, at times.

 

Erwin  

That’s all the TV time you get when you product when your products and services in the in the building?

 

Stephen  

Yeah, man, that’s that’s what you get? Well, you don’t actually they put our if you go back and watch this season, and I encourage everyone to do that, because it helps everyone. There’s our logo soulstone by GMI will come up at the very end. And we got like in the credits actually logoed in the credits. So yeah, I mean, that’s, that isn’t given out to everybody. That’s, that’s a unique thing. Because we worked really hard for those guys and did a lot of good work for them. So so they were able to put us in on the credits, and then have us included on the show.

 

Erwin  

So how does one get in on HGTV on an HGTV show? And is it beneficial?

 

Stephen  

As a contractor, I think it happens one of two ways. Either one, they do a call of action, like they’re coming to an area, they do a casting call for contractors to come and do the work. And you kind of figure out if you fit and you go in there, right? That’s not what we did. We didn’t do a casting call. We didn’t respond to them. Essentially, the way we got in is we’re out here in the county, right? My wife and our team put a lot a lot of effort into our Instagram account and our social media. And so our Instagram was doing really, really well we we were very good at it. They were very good at it. I was just sort of along for the ride. And as a result from that, one of the producers and the designers of the show, found us on Instagram. And so soulstone by GMI shout out shameless plug at soulstone by Dubai, we ended up getting picked up through Instagram. So we had seen a lot of our content, seen a lot of our stuff. And again, they had to drive by us to get to their projects as they were scouting out houses. So they kind of connected that the building was cool. What we had done was cool. I have a 1947 old Mercury flatbed like farm truck, I call up here. And it’s parked out front, and it’s bright red, and it has a stone on the back, right big slab on the back. So there’s like a lot of like cachet about it all. So they were they were interested, they’re interested in using us for the jobs, especially in the county, they wanted us to do the first three episodes in Prince Edward County and season one. We did those episodes. And it just so luckily happened. They were the first three to shoot. So once we did those, those were free. So that’s how they start the conversation. We need you to do this for free, can you? And it’s like, I don’t want to what do I get? And basically you get you get the ability to say you’re on HGTV, do you still want to be part of it? And I said, Okay, well, I have a condition I’d like to put in there. And they said fine. If I’m going to give you something for free. I don’t want it to be plain white quartz or any quartz. Because everybody does quartz countertops. There’s they’re everywhere. We have a product that we use that we’re really big on which is quartzite, which is a natural stone comes from Brazil really, really pretty. We would only use quartzite. If you’re going to have us on the show, it has to be quartzite because I know that nobody else has those stones in my area. So if you see me on TV, and you like the countertop, there’s only one company out here that has it. So at least it gave me this like isolation that I could protect. And they were like okay, well it’s, you’re paying for it. If you want to do it. Go ahead. And so we did. First three episodes went well. Then that turned into my encounter with Scott at the shop. And then that led into us being asked to do the rest of that season. And then the following season, which was actually right in the middle of COVID. And then they change the structure Once we did enough of those episodes, they changed the structure so that we didn’t have to do it for free anymore. Oh, good. Yeah, they would cover cost and like the homeowner would pick up the cost because they could see the value of the product was really, really good. So we gave them a really good discount on it, but at least broke even and homeowner got the benefit of the renovation. And we just didn’t have to go out of pocket for the rest of the season. So it worked out really, really well. And I think ultimately, I would I would do it all over again. Like it was a really, really good experience. He, that whole crew worked so hard. And McGilvery is one of the smartest business people I’ve ever been around. So just getting to talk to him and kind of absorb little things and not even just sort of seeing how he’s built his his structure of that. I mean, it was it was like paying for mentoring without having to pay. It was crazy.

 

Erwin  

I’m on their Instagram, and yeah, I haven’t seen stone like this before. Right? is it a quartz or It’s natural?

 

Stephen  

It’s quartzite quartzite. So quartz is the derivative of quartzite. So you The story goes that there’s these guys with like the quarry owners have all this quartzite that they’re cutting. quartzite is like a sandstone based or it’s crystal quartz quartz mineral. So it’s like translucent. So a lot of these quarries have all this product, this remnants dust is about 1020 years ago, they have all this dust and they don’t know what to do with it. But it’s really hard to sell natural stone because once you sell the block, it never go, it’s never going to look like that again. That’s why you hear the horror stories of people going into the builders picking from a sample, then they go into the house and it never matches is because it could never match like the blocks are always different by piece. Yeah, exactly. So courts was that answer, like they could take the dust of a natural stone, combine it with a chemical binder like a glue, and then put a pattern into it and print it off. And they could reproduce the same image multiple times 1000s and 1000s of times. And so then quartz takes over because it’s easier to sell internationally. People like working with it because it’s easy to hide seams. So all of those things kind of pick up. But quartzite is the natural stone, my importing partner from GMI. They have contacts with the quarries. And they tend to do a lot of the deals directly from the quarry. So people will spotters that are in the quarries will walk around on WhatsApp and video blocks that are coming out. Really you want this? You want to buy it? Yes. And then you fill a container. You stuffed that container up and put it on a boat and you ship it up.

 

Erwin  

So I’m actually on your Instagram and I am scrolling. I still don’t see one picture of Scott.

 

Stephen  

He’s there. Yeah, he’s there. My they’re pretty busy though. My my team and my wife are pretty active. So it’s, you’re gonna have to scroll quite a ways. Not every third one. That’s for sure. I know you. I know. You’re gonna tell me that’s a mistake. It probably is. I shouldn’t have there. Somehow subbing can be into every image.

 

Erwin  

Was it hard to get a procurement? 

 

Stephen  

Ah, so that story so he showed up with his with his producer, kind of unannounced one day he was in the county and kind of just dropped in and his big truck drives into the lot. And he comes walking up to the door. And and right away. I’m kind of shocked. Like, I was kinda like, Is this really happening? Like, what are you doing here? So when I opened the door, like hey, man, he’s like, Hey, is this soul stone? Yeah, it is come on in. And so he ended up having to talk with us for the day like for, you know, half hour an hour or whatever, walk through our showroom, looked at all the different materials kind of got a good Bible, what was going on. And he was really, really, really quiet. He was actually really quiet. And he didn’t talk a lot, which made me incredibly nervous, right? Because like, the perception is that this guy is going to be over the top and very boisterous and outgoing and extroverted. And he really wasn’t, and so made me nervous. But it was cool. And so his producer or his designer that was with them, we had been in contact with many times, I was friendly with him. And so he was kind of filling the void and talking to us. And so when we’re done the walk, we’re coming outside to go out and buy his truck. And I’m waiting for my wife, Laura to be like, Scott, can we get a picture? Can we do a picture because she’s running Instagram and she wants my accounts and she should be thinking, but my wife is so cool that she’s just like, alright, well, we’ll see you later, you know, thanks for dropping in. No big deal. See on the other side, and so I got off fanboy Yeah, it’s I got all fanboy. I’m like, Please, can we get a picture? And then it got awkward. He’s like, Sure. And I’m like Okay, thank you. So now I’m trying to get him to like, stand up beside us. And then I’m trying to do a selfie, but I can’t get the selfie right and get my symbol and my sign in the back. And so then I asked the producer, can you take the picture for me? And he’s looking at me like, are you serious, man? Like, we’re just I’m like, Yeah, please. And so he’s like, Okay, sure. So now we’re taking the picture. And Scott standing beside me. He’s a little bit shorter than me, but not that much. And, yeah, yeah. And, and his hair is like, perfect. And he’s got great white tea. And he’s got this, like, beautiful cologne on and I’m standing beside with my wife on the other side. And I’m like, I gotta look good at this picture. And I ended up completely blowing the picture Ed, like, doing this weird, sucked in got tin face thing. And it’s probably the worst picture I’ve ever taken in my life. Not to say that I have a lot of good pictures, but it was a terrible one. And that’s the one that we got. And he walked away, and he got in his truck. And that’s all I ever got.

 

Erwin  

Footage of you on the show? So 

 

Stephen  

Yeah, we have footage. And we can use sparingly, right? You can use something. There’s rules. There’s rules. Well, there’s rules, HGTV, and, and McGilvery. Is production company, you know, they they own the rights to all of those episodes. And so you can get away with a little bit but you can’t you can’t run the you can’t run big clips. So you do little clips. And you can kind of put it in here and there. But they’ve been good to us. They never called us or or said anything. But you never want to really push that envelope too far.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. You can’t see if these guys endorse us. Like that’s not 

 

Stephen  

Yeah, exactly. Because he has other contracts, right? There’s people paying big money for to be in relationships with him. And so make sense.

 

Erwin  

Cool, cool. And then you got bored with this business? Or you thought you felt you know, this real estate market is hot. 

 

Stephen  

I started to see a pattern here by my psychiatrist told me something, right? No, yeah. So then like, I don’t know, towards the end of last year 2020. Like COVID has been for contractors. It’s been incredibly challenging. I can only speak for myself. But I’ve seen a lot like we’ve done about 700 Plus countertops in the last three years. Dozens and dozens of a day. Yeah, it’s crazy. And we’ve done dozens of like kitchens, right? Dozens and dozens of, and in doing that I was doing all the appointments. So I would meet three to four people a day. So I’ve met and talked to about renovations with like, I don’t know, somewhere between 15 102,000 people, you don’t win every job, right? But you talk to them and you pitch them and you try to get the right material to match what they’re doing. And so you just talk to all these people. And COVID is like, it came in and it changed the game. And then it threw off all the timelines. And we’re the last people into the job. My crews are the last guys that get there. So at the start of COVID, everybody’s excited. They got tonnes of cash, because they didn’t go away on any holidays. They feel like they need to do something they need to change, they need something. And so they start renovating their house. contractors get inundated and overwhelmed with work. A lot of contractors can’t scale, right. Like they have a lot of trouble scaling because it’s them and like two guys or whatever. And so they get like overworked the prices start climbing, the timeline start extending. And by the end of last year, people were just fed up like they’re absolutely fed up with renovations. They didn’t want to they were in it, they started it they had to keep going. They didn’t want to people had already ripped them off by the time I’m getting in there. So they’re angry and cranky, and you’re dealing with a lot of stress. And so we had a good system. Our system is built to scale. We run for five crews, our teams go from Kingston to London. We base ourselves out of our Markham warehouse in the middle, and then we kind of expand out from there. And so we’re able pre COVID We would be we would measure on a Monday and stall on a Saturday. Like we were very efficient. Once COVID Hit we could keep going efficient. But then you have breakouts and like lock downs and like if you get too many guys in a space at the same time it becomes reckless in a household right? So then you have to adjust to that. People forget how heavy stone is. I don’t know how many people I get hurt with. You lose fingers like a mistake. You lose fingers and toes or you go like bye bye. There’s no gaps, right? And so for some reason, really big islands became trendy. So like 12 and 15, and 10 foot islands become trendy, and nobody seems like nobody wants seems. So now you’re carrying a piece of stone that’s like 10 feet by five feet four feet. What’s that weighs 2000 pounds on wet night, like, anywhere from 1500 to 2000 pounds, depending on how thick the stone is how dense it is how old it is, like the black ones are heavier than white ones like it’s because they’re just denser, darker, heavier stone. So you’re carrying these things into people’s houses. And it’s crazy, right? And so you needed eight or nine guys to do something like that. And when you start doing that in COVID, it becomes really, really difficult to put that many people in the same room in the same place at the same time. Yeah, so it was a challenge. So by the end of last year, we had figured out pretty much everything that had been thrown at us. We were still scaling, we were still able to do it. We’re still, you know, marketing wise handling it all. And I was getting kind of bored. So we Yeah, I love. I love real estate. I never knew how much I loved it until I took those couple of years away from it. I kind of like tell my wife, it’s like, you know, like when a football player or an athlete retires early, and then they realise like, oh, I shouldn’t have done that. I gotta go back. That’s what it felt like it felt like that, like, I gotta get back into it.

 

Erwin  

Right like Tom Brady. You’re just saying you’re Tom Brady. Got it? Of course. I’m Tom Brady. I’m gonna go yes. Tom Brady of real estate.

 

Stephen  

I feel like Yeah, it’s hard to walk away man. It’s hard to walk away from something you love doing. And it was probably in hindsight really, really hard for me, but I’m glad I did it. It gave me perspective. Maybe a lot more insurer. I don’t know what the word is. I think a lot more in terms of, of lessons I’ve learned in the past that I might have been taking for granted when I was in the mix or in in the in the trenches of real estate before.

 

Erwin  

Right. Now you’re in Belleville, which is like

 

Stephen  

Now I’m in Belleville that was awesome in Belleville is blowing up that was blowing up delvers. Awesome. People from Belleville would challenge what I just said but Belleville is awesome. If you have seen this story play out before. So like, for me when I’m talking to new people about Belleville I’m telling them it’s like taking a time machine. It’s like going back into Oshawa or maybe like I don’t know the West well enough to say it but it’s a ticking time machine back three to three years, right? Like the prices are more in line to that the markets more in mind to that the local realtors are kind of figuring it out the game like every time we talk to a realtor like it’s crazy. This is crazy. Do you understand it? And? Yeah, I’ve seen this before. I’ve seen it play out before. And so when you know what the last thing did, it makes it very like very, very appealing to be in this place at this time watching what is going on right now. It’s a city that is expanding. It’s a city that has no choice but to grow. It has no choice. It’s been squished by Kingston, and by Toronto. And it has the last, the last real bastion of good prices. And as well not just in residential, but commercial like like warehouses and industrial spaces. And like there’s a lot of square footage 1000s and 1000s of square footage of manufacturing being built here. warehouses that need tenants. And so those tenants are coming from very far, because they’re they’re getting incentivized to come here. So if you can look out and have a long vision, Belleville is awesome. It’s an awesome place.

 

Erwin  

Do you need any vision? Yes, you already get pretty good cash flow there?

 

Stephen  

Well, yeah. Yeah, I mean, we do. But I think that, you know, cashflow is an equation and the more money you put in, the more equity you have, the better your cash flow is. And I think prices like like help when there’s still six hundreds and five hundreds and three hundreds. And I know there’s a whole bunch of people are going to get mad because that’s not affordable housing, but it’s the reality of the market. And if if it’s if you’re able to contribute and produce more housing to a marketplace that needs it, we need it. We have zero vacancy. We need more units here. It’s really the best thing to have. And I think here we’ve been dealing with short term rentals, right? It’s been a really big part of the economy here for a while. Big vacation area, very, very tourist driven. And when you’re just strictly tourist driven, you’re very handicap like you’re you only have one lane, you only have one rudder for how the economy grows. And so that just equals taxes that just equals more taxes and And you know, they’ve contemplated putting a toll on the bridge as you entered Prince Edward County, so that you have to pay $1 or $2. Every time you come into the county. Well, why, right, because it’s just easy money. My shop where you drive past my shop, they put a road ticker to tabulate the traffic. And three times they had, they would go and it would reset, it would go back to zero. And they would think that thing was broken, and they come back and they’d set it again. And then to do it again. And really what was is there every Thursday and Friday, for pretty much June, July and August. Every Thursday, Friday, we get 25 to 30,000 cars going past us. And every Sunday, you get 30 or 35,000 Going back, and they do a big loop over the Bay Bridge, which is highway 62. And then they come back up right in front of my shop. I’m 33. And so they do this big loop and wrap around as they come into the county from either Montreal or Toronto, and they fill the whole place. It’s incredible, incredible amount of traffic here.

 

Erwin  

Crazy. And then 

 

Stephen  

Which means that I can’t go to a restaurant.

 

Erwin  

Why too busy?

 

Stephen  

Yeah, like you end up living like, like your shoulder seasons like I go to, I go to the cool restaurants and we’ve got all these cool places, right? Like tonnes of restaurant tours come here to either retire, or to do something they’ve always dreamed of doing. You have like a very good friend of mine has a food truck here, just as floss and sandwiches just as sandwiches. It’s amazing sandwich place, right. And he’s just this food truck doesn’t sandwiches. He’s one of like, probably three dozen, two dozen people out here, just living that dream, just chasing that thing, right. And so as a local, I can only go there like this time from like, March to May, after May, there’s no way I’m going into the county, it’s way too busy. I’ll be standing in lines, and it’s mayhem. And same with the beaches and all this stuff, right? So you can only really enjoy it on the shoulder seasons.

 

Erwin  

So it sounds like there’s Airbnb opportunity.

 

Stephen  

994 Airbnbs in this market, and just in Prince Edward County, there’s only there’s less than 8000 houses. So it’s a tonne of the the there’s a tonne of the market in the county is Airbnbs. There’s opportunities, but quite frankly, if somebody’s asking me they want an air b&b, I think you’re a little late. The best opportunity is about three to four years ago, the rules and the way that the game is set up right now for the by the politicians, it’s challenging, it’s going to be hard to get in, you have to buy a pre existing one, which isn’t cheap. So you end up you end up paying for that opportunity.

 

Erwin  

Good to know. So then what opportunities do you like for investors?

 

Stephen  

So I’m a big fan of the long term rentals here. Because I know that the politicians and the community wants that, right. So I don’t ever want to be in a position where I’m going against the tide, really, I mean, personally, I kind of like to go with the flow of what everybody’s into. And they’re into long term rentals. So they need more of them. The businesses need more of them, the the community itself needs more of them. So I think long term rentals are really going to be a big player out here. We have a lot of multi units like multi RES is eight plexes, five, six plexes. And I get people reaching out and inquiring about them, because they’re fairly cheap, considering like price point wise compared to the rest of the province. But I think the community itself is into more of a lifestyle where they’re looking for their own house. And so there’s a lot of independence here. There’s a lot of people that have been here for a long time. And the other thing about this place is like as these bungalows that we’d love to buy the 60s and 70s bungalows. As they’re being sold back into the market today. The thing that a lot of people don’t take into consideration is that the people selling them aren’t necessarily buying the brand new builds from the builders hear. They tend to want to build their own house. So they’re buying land and building their own new version of their own house. A lot of my kitchen business is done in new new development, but I don’t do any major builders, like no builder work, just custom builds. And so there’s a lot of that market out here. People generally, generationally get handed down land, or they get it through like relatives. So it’s easy to get an acre two acres or three acres if you’re from here for a couple generations. And so they’ll build their own house that way. I think the opportunity here for the bungalows and the birth strategy is significant. I think that in time, the comps of a well finished duplex will start to sell they haven’t sold here. You very rarely see a converted duplex that’s done to the level that I’m sure most of your listeners are accustomed to seeing. And like other areas, we don’t see a lot of those hit the market, a lot of them are really rough. The multi units have really low rents, a lot of that stuff. So opportunity is kind of wherever you want to see it. The other thing I like is little house, big land, Big Lots 70 and 80 foot lots, by 130 140. With a little tiny house on there. There’s a lot of opportunities like that still available, where those things are, are under 500,000, you can buy that for three for 380 to 450. So that’s a good price point for some people to even almost breakeven or be a little bit negative on the cash flow. But they can they have a big opportunity with land in the next three to five years with something to develop.

 

Erwin  

Sorry, Steve. That’s that’s small single family home, what is it rent for?

 

Stephen  

It’s depends on the area, I would say 1800 At the very low end 1800 Plus utilities at the very low end. I’m seeing upper floors of bungalow duplexes starting to get 2000 to 2100 a month. That’s just the top floor of the bungalow. So I think that for a full single family house, that’s not unreasonable either. But I think the market is so desperate for inventory and rentals that it’s hard to say necessarily what that we’ll get in a couple of months from now. But I think that ultimately, that’s a more of a longer term play for developer people. You know, we’re talking about car like, I mean, guys like that, who have long vision, know that those lots become valuable, the more the more the game, or the market kind of plays out.

 

Erwin  

Right. But it sounds like today, someone could do a duplex conversion and do quite well. Yes. Yes, they can. The duplex what would the downstairs rent for?

 

Stephen  

You know, I just was in one today and they’re getting 1800 in the basement plus utilities, which is one of the higher prices I’ve seen. I’m more comfortable telling people 1600 1550 Plus utilities is a standard conservative number. But I’m I did see the unit today that is getting 1800 So

 

Erwin  

That must be must be really nice.

 

Stephen  

Three, three bedrooms, right three bedrooms for sure. Wasn’t really nice. It was big though.

 

Erwin  

Got it. And then what does it cost for someone to get into a duplex?

 

Stephen  

Price point right now for those bungalows is somewhere between 640 and 680 Depending on where the area is, the certain parts of the market towards the hospital side are very attractive East Hill oldies Hill is a really nice it’s a nice market like a nice little pocket. And I think some of those areas are highly desired. But you can also you know, Belleville has outside markets, right? So Trenton is just down the road. Brighton is just down the road. Those are very, very sought after kind of communities for Belleville residents as well. You can work in Belleville and live in Brighton it’s really not that big of a deal. A lot of people do. And Brighton is a smaller community with a little bit more of a of a lower pace, slower pace, again 600,000 anywhere from 580 in the Trenton area up to about six 650 If you’re going towards the Brighton area. That’s a pretty steady, steady price. 

 

Erwin  

And all these areas are benefiting from the ridiculous prices in Toronto. You and I follow these numbers but the Toronto is shrinking in terms of the number of families that live in there. And I saw a chart yesterday from Dr. Mike Moffitt, you’re sharing a number of children under the age of five is like falling off a cliff in Toronto, right? Because the families moving out of Toronto and so places like Brighton, Trenton Belleville, they’re all benefiting.

 

Stephen  

 Ithink so i i can tell you for lifestyle for having two kids. I have two kids 10 and six. They go to a school here that’s called a tree school. That’s not like pre like tree TREE The school is on 10 acres of land. It’s like old Scott old school, old style of schooling. All the kids there’s only 35 kids in the school, all grades kind of are in the same areas. There’s five teachers to 35 kids, and they all get individual time and individual work. And two days out of the week they spend at least the entire day or more on out in the in the forest. So they’re in like nature, learning how to build shelters and fires and camps and learning about biology with trees. I think it’s it’s that kind of a setup. That lifestyle is what brought me here. I know that there are other people that are doing the same thing because there is a opportunity for people to kind of have their kids in an environment where they get to see nature again. It’s all lifestyle that way. So I definitely think it’s one of the highlights of why I moved here. And I’m quite happy with how that’s worked out for my kids.

 

Erwin  

Sounds like you can get a house in a good size lot for the less than the price of a one bedroom condo in the GTA.

 

Stephen  

Yeah, yeah, it’s kind of scary. But I mean, like you do have. The other challenge here is you do have some really, really nice houses that are selling for a million dollars or 1,000,001. But if you pick that house up and bring it to your market, it’s not a million 1,000,001. It’s much more, but but, I mean, that’s the market. Right? That’s, that’s what’s here. So it’s not like we’re all living in $600,000 houses. It’s not that way. But we do have opportunities at that price point and really nice houses, right.

 

Erwin  

So different than Hamilton, you know, the stuff I correct, you know, 100 $100,000 and just James MBM access house $2 million, not far from each other. It’s only 10 minutes apart from each other. If you have high end areas, we have middle class areas, we have low end areas that we don’t we don’t buy property.

 

Stephen  

Correct. That’s exactly the way it goes. Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

That sounds like Toronto.

 

Stephen  

Yeah, no, I think so. I think like the every city thinks their city’s special. But I think the more you get out of the city, you start to see a lot of the similarities of each city. And yeah, I think I think that’s the other advantage for people that are outside of this marketplace. Coming here, right? When I bought that Airbnb in Wellington, four years ago, we paid three 343 40 for the house, right? Literally, for the whole first three months that we were doing the renovations on that house, every almost every day, somebody would walk into our house, like no knocking, they would just walk in because this is a small community. We all know each other here. This is how we live, right? They walk into your house, they’re like, Are you the guy who bought that place? This place? Like yeah, like, wow, did you get ripped off? paid way too much money for this house. And I’m coming from Oshawa, wimpy and I’m like, man, like you have no idea. You have no idea what I would be paying for this house somewhere else. And today, the house is a million dollars. And so did they? Did they predict that? No, because they were here. And they kind of only knew the market that was here. They didn’t see the forest through the trees? Of course, right. And so I think the guys, oh, and the people that get out and start to spread your wings as an investor and get out into new markets and new communities, you’ll be able to spot the signs, you’ll be able to see things that are like you said the quote the other day, right? History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes. Right? Like, that’s real start to see. That’s right, like you’ll start to see, you start to see all of those same similarities. And you can start to kind of guess where you want to be in which one do .

 

Erwin  

You should have told that neighbour in your house you want, you want to rip me off too. And I’ll make you rich, some of your…

 

Stephen  

Buddy, I tried. I tried so many times. The door, I was introducing myself as the guy who just got ripped off. Like I’m the guy who just got ripped off, do you want to sell and none of them wanted to sell? And none of them wanted to sell and it was hard on them. It could just be talk.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, Robo crash versus a crash. Like, you know, I’ll save you some of your home. And I want to know exactly what you’re not willing to put your money where your mouth is?

 

Stephen  

No, I, you know, at the time, when I first got here, maybe four or five, six years ago, there was very, very, very, very little inventory in the county. A lot of the inventory was in Belleville and now it’s kind of shifted like there’s a lot more inventory in the county than I think then for a very long time. It’s expensive, but there’s a lot of inventory. Belleville is kind of dropped, right? So it’s interesting. It’s interesting how it’s worked.

 

Erwin  

So Stephen, how are you doing? How are you doing? Are you showing property in Belleville for people that are just Okay, so we have people that want to learn more. And then I have people that are wanting to jump in with both feet? What do we do with people who just want to learn more information on Belleville.

 

Stephen  

So when they want to learn more, they set up a one on one call with me they contact our team. They talked to Fiona or somebody on our team and set up a one on one one on one call. And basically, I’m just here to answer and give you real life stories and go through listings and show you and teach you what’s happening and figure out within your strategy, what you’ve already had success in and then try to apply it here. If you’ve had that success, right? Like I don’t want you to try to learn new tricks. I just want to bring you into something that you you’re comfortable with and find the opportunity here.

 

Erwin  

Because we literally it’s in Hamilton doing exactly that there. They exit their property in Hamilton, they’re looking to redeploy that capital in Belleville.

 

Stephen  

That’s right. That’s right. And they’re getting more bang for their buck off of that capital that they’ve earned and they’re able to get to a new opportunity. So yeah, definitely that’s that’s what we’re doing with that. When it comes to people that are ready to pull the trigger, or ready to get into something with two feet like He said, What I tried to do is you have a long drive right for me to you is about two and a half hours. Most of the time, if you’re past Oakville, Burlington way, like you’re three hours plus on a good day with no traffic. So what I do, never. So what I do is, I use a lot of video apps, FaceTime and things like that to start the process. I don’t, we don’t, I don’t ever encourage somebody to buy a property from the video, what I encourage somebody to do is to save time and know if it’s something for you or not for you. If it’s not for you, it’s totally okay, then we start to narrow down your selection and kind of narrow down what is exactly what you’re looking for. I can send those videos and save you a drive out to be disappointed, right, I eliminate the disappointment drive. So we go out and we scale. Me personally, I’m looking at five to 10 properties a week. And my mind I like that’s what I’m trying to accomplish, as long as the market is, you know, yielding that many opportunities, but we’re out to look as much as I can. And then I’m scouting and if if, if it isn’t a good lead or a good opportunity, I don’t bring it to people’s attention. So I’m trying to narrow down their their purview and so that they just see good things good opportunities. When they’re ready, we set up an appointment, everybody’s holding offers, still, for the most part here, very few are, you know, running the gamut and trying to list that value. Some are but even then they’re sitting a little longer, set up an appointment, come out, walk the property, walk the property, and then you get almost like a mini streetsmart tour because you get me showing you around Bellville one on one for the day and the hour or however long you want to wait out here for and then you get a full surrounding, and you get to understand everything. So now if you don’t buy that house totally good. Because you’ve now learned a lot more about the area by being here. So now when I send you back if I now if I tell you the house is on an street, you kind of know that neighbourhood you know what that is, you know what’s around there. And so it makes a comfort level go up, it builds you as an investor and get you ready to make more transactions and take action.

 

Erwin  

Fantastic. And then how can folks get a hold of you?

 

Stephen  

So you can reach out through the team, you can find me on Instagram, I went on the east side, I went on the east side. And you can you can come and see me at an event. I think that’s the best place if you’re gonna come to anything, come meet me at an event that we do with the island team. I’m out and I make the drive to you. And then I I’m there, I have to get a hotel when I come out there. So I got nowhere to go. But to talk to you guys. So come loaded, see me there and take advantage and kind of pick my brain and make that happen.

 

Erwin  

Fantastic. And I’ll have all Stephen’s contact information in the show notes, folks. All right, Steven, any final words? How happier to be back in real estate? Other than that, no, give me give me your own. Give me your own final words.

 

Stephen  

I’m so happy to be back in real estate. No, I am happy to be back in real estate. I think it’s a great opportunity for people who think that they’ve missed their opportunity. Like I don’t know, I’m one of those people like I’ve told you personally, I had trouble kind of getting over this hurdle. Like I might have made mistakes. Or I’ve even used the word imposter syndrome. Like I’m trying to figure out myself in real estate. But I think that I know that I’ve done a lot of things in this game in this industry. I’m really glad that I can get back in and started learning and continuing to grow within this industry. I purposely sought out the best. Like if I’m gonna get back in the game, I want to be on a good team, I want to be around good people. I never have given away that strategy. I never stopped doing that strategy. So being around you and the rest of the team has just elevated me and hopefully just continues to make me better. So I’m trying to. I’m just trying to embrace that. And I encourage other other people to kind of embrace that. Let yourself go through your own journey and take it on and keep pursuing it. Right. It’s not over till you’re done. You’re not dead till you’re done. And if you’re not done, it ain’t over. So keep going.

 

Erwin  

And hang out with good people.

 

Stephen  

Hang out with good people. Yeah, they make you better. That’s for sure. 

 

Erwin  

At some point, hopefully people can buy a property without seeing them because I’ve bought property without seeing them. I’m not saying everyone can do it. I’ve done it because I don’t have all the time in the world.

 

Stephen  

I’ve done it but I think you have to build trust right? On the first day. No, but I think if you can build trust with people then Yeah, absolutely. You can do that. But I think it’s just about dancing a little bit. Get to know each other. Let’s talk. Let’s talk first.

 

Erwin  

All right. Thanks for doing this Stephen

 

Stephen  

Thank you for having me, man. I really appreciate you. Thank you so much. 

 

Erwin  

Awesome.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lamps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

 

To Follow Stephen:

Email: steve@infinitywealth.ca

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/iwin_on_the_eastside/

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

“I Won’t Live My Life A Victim” From Growing Up On The Reserve to Golden Handcuffs with Jules Mckenzie

Greetings, friends, all 17 of you! 

I hope you’re all taking the time to connect and network with fellow like-minded investors; I do the same as often as possible. My mom, dad, and brother are all investors in real estate, stocks or both.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

My teams at Stock Hacker and iWIN Real Estate are all investors in stocks, real estate, and cryptocurrencies. Life is short, so I’m trying to be efficient with my time, spending it with people I can learn from and inspire me.  Luckily I married Cherry Chan, so I don’t have to go far for mental stimulation. We even have an informal book club, and we’re both reading Ray Dalio’s Principles for Dealing with the Changing World Order.

Most have no interest in such subjects or call us conspiracy theorists…. However, those same people could read a bit more about the history of the world to understand where it’s going to prepare them for what’s to come.

Cherry and I will of course do our part to share what we’ve learnt as to the best practices to prepare for all the government banks like the Bank of Canada and the US Federal Reserve to continue to create new money to fund more spending to the benefit of those with assets while sadly destroying savings and making houses more and more unaffordable to those without assets.

We cover this all in our live and in-person events.  Yes, that’s right, we’re back to live and in person, and it feels so good.  By the time you listen to this, we’ll have hosted a few dozen investors on an investment property tour in Hamilton to touch, feel, and smell some investment-grade duplexes at different finish stages. One has not been renovated, one has just been renovated, and an existing duplex.  Thank you to my team and clients for making this happen!

On Saturday, April 23rd, we will have our real estate meetup where we will be sharing how to renovate for ROI – return on investment, a recent experience on how we won a multiple offer scenario for a client to purchase their new house at a great price.  Plus, we’ll announce details about our new joint venture matchmaking program. You don’t want to miss this.  Our March meetup sold out as we were at room capacity, and we ran out of chairs, and it was standing room only.  So don’t delay; registrations will open shortly for those on our email newsletter.

This past weekend, I had a night out with my investor buddies in downtown Toronto. A group of eight guys like to have fun, eat great food, drink excellent wine, and do fun stuff. We make the time to hang out once per quarter. We didn’t all make it, but six of us did.

We started the night grabbing some drinks and then escaping an escape room with five minutes to spare! This is my first escape room since the pandemic started, and we did awesomely.  Time goes by fast in escape rooms and even faster when you’re allowed to enjoy adult beverages and order more while within lol.

Next, we have a fine dinner at Kost, a restaurant on the 44th floor with panoramic views of the city.  The food and wine were excellent.  From there, the details are hazy but just know fun was had. We chatted a lot about investing in real estate and cryptocurrency.  From this night out with the guys, we’re making plans to visit a city in the US to scope out investment opportunities.  Nothing wrong with a little diversification south of the border with highly talented investors like my friends.

On to this week’s show!

“I Won’t Live My Life A Victim” From Growing Up On The Reserve to Golden Handcuffs with Jules Mckenzie

On to this week’s show! I’m super excited to have back on the show my friend Jules Mckenzie who I find super inspiring! Unfortunately, I’m just going to warn some of you now, he is a super successful real estate investor, having owned a lot of properties and raised millions and millions of capital to buy real estate in Barrie and Orillia, but he’s a Police Officer with over 30 years of experience, and I know some of you won’t like his opinion about the protests in Ottawa.

Jules shares how he too protested at Parliament Hill, and his experience was very different than what happened earlier this year with the trucker and anti covid mandate protests.

We talk a lot about real estate on this show on tips and tactics, including previous interviews with Jules so feel free to go back and listen to those. Today we focus more on the obstacles Jules has had to overcome being an indigenous Canadian, growing up on a reserve, substance abuse.

If you’ve ever met Jules, you’ll know he’s one of the happiest people you’ll ever meet and have no idea about his tragic past. Still, he refuses to live his life as a victim and is living proof of how important mindset is as Jules has achieved immense financial success.

If you do enjoy the show, which I think you will, please look up Jules Mckenzie on Facebook or Instagram and send him a message letting him know you want to read his book. I don’t think he needs the encouragement, but just in case, as I believe his book will help many people. More than just our 17 listeners, for sure.

Please enjoy the show

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Greetings friends, all 17 of you. This is the truth my real estate investing show for Canadians and I too am Canadian coming to you from Oakville, Ontario, just west of Toronto. I hope you’re all taking the time to connect and network with fellow like minded investors, weather’s getting better things are opening up, I don’t know actually what’s closed anymore. I do try to do these things as often as possible; to you know, spend more time around like-minded people, because you never know if things are gonna go bad. So you’re gonna need people who are like minded, have friends, so that you in case anything goes bad, you know who to lean on for support. My mom, my dad, my brother, they’re all investors in real estate or stocks, or both. I have a whole bunch of buddies plus my teams, both stock hacker Academy and iWIN real estate, they’re all investors and stocks options, real estate investing. Of course, in cryptocurrency, mainly Bitcoin. Life is short. Hence, I’m always trying to be efficient with my time and spending that time with people I can learn from or inspire me. Luckily, I’m married Cherry Chan. so I don’t go that far, to get some really good mental stimulation. We have an informal book club. For example, we’re both reading Ray Dalio’s principles for dealing with the changing world order. We’re almost done. I think we’re both almost done. I’m almost done; on the last chapter. Most people out there, they have no interest in these subjects. And they’ll call us conspiracy theorists. However, those same people could, you know, to do better off reading a book, maybe around history of the world and not just go back the last 100 years, maybe go back last like 300 years. And you’ll see that things are cyclical, and it might help prepare you for what’s to come. Cherry and I, of course, do our part to share what we’ve learned to the best that we can let the best practices are to prepare for what all the government banks are doing, like the bank of Canada, the US Federal Reserve, they all continue to create more money out of thin air, not tied to anything, not backed by gold or anything like that, just to fund the spending that they have and sadly, assets will grow in value. Something I have a lot of. At least, I think how long I can always use more. And on the other hand, they’re sadly destroying savings, people’s savings and making housing as an example more and more unaffordable to those who don’t have assets. 

Erwin  

We covered all this in our live and in person events. Yes, that’s right. We’re back to live and in person and it feels good. Feels good to be dialling back my zoom expenses. We just cut one of my Zoom accounts, we cut we cut it down by like 80% in cost or since we’re back to doing in person events. By the time you listen to this episode, we’ll have hosted a few dozen people on the weekend on an investment property tour in Hamilton to touch feel and smell some investment grade duplexes at different stages of finish. This is in Hamilton, Ontario, if I didn’t mention that. One property has not been renovated. It’s been it was just recently closed on one has just been renovated. And it was just staged. I’m recording this on Thursday, I think it was just staged on Wednesday, pictures are done. And one is an existing duplex. like to say thank you to my team and my clients for making this happen. Only one of these properties is for sale. And we used to do tours of mostly properties that were on sale but because of the way the pandemic is not all sellers want us to have a couple dozen investors run through their properties. So thanks to my network and my my team and my clients for making this event possible. Also, they’re going to have lunch together. So isn’t that nice? To have lunch with like minded people. And I don’t know if it’s just me, but I’m like super grateful and like almost like nostalgic to be able to, you know, hang out with groups of friends again, be in busy restaurants. 

Erwin  

On Saturday, April 23. We have our next real estate meetup; Cherry and I’s real estate meetup. Our topics include how to renovate for ROI that’s return on investment. We have a lot of experience doing that. A recent experience on how our team won a multiple offer scenario for a client to purchase a new house integrate at great price. Plus, we’ll announce details of our new joint venture matchmaking programme. You don’t want to miss out on that, especially if you’re a newer investor, you definitely want to see the details on this. And no, I’m not looking to raise capital. I’m just looking to help people to find resources so that they can get into investment property because I don’t know a better investment for the long term and the way the world is, again, you don’t want to miss out on this. Our March meetup did sell out our first live only only live we had no virtual option. We weren’t recording it. It’s a lot more production for us to have to record anything. So we did not record it. So don’t delay registrations will be open likely shortly for those on our email newsletter. So yeah, so if you’re on an email newsletter, just check it out when we have when we announced the event and then make sure you register. 

Erwin  

This past weekend, I had a night out with a young investor buddies in downtown Toronto, a group of eight guys including myself, who like to have fun, eat great food, drink nice wine and do fun things together. We hang it up at once per quarter. We’re all investors in again Real Estate Development, what name it, just name it stocks, of course, again 6 out of 8 of us made it to this event. We don’t always make it is you know, life gets in the way, especially those with young kids. But six of us did make it out and we had a lot of fun. We started the night grabbing some drinks and then escaping an escape room have five minutes to spare the escape room allotted 45 minutes, we got it and 40 we did take one hit though, that might have been my bad. This is my first, if anyone doesn’t know I’ve done a lot of escape rooms. But this is the first one I’ve done since the pandemic started. And we did awesome as a group. Time goes by fast in escape rooms. If you’ve ever done these before, if you haven’t, I recommend it. Do it with some friends, do with some family do with your older kids. Time goes by fast when you are in an escape room. Since it’s a timed event. If you run out of time you fail to escape so nobody wants that. So time goes by fast and time goes by faster. And you’re allowed to bring adult drinks inside the escape room and even give us walkie talkies to order more Transpower within also to you know, ask for help and ask for tips. But yes, we can also order drinks, which we may have done. Next, we had to find dinner at Kost. It’s a nice restaurant downtown Toronto on the 40th floor. So it has features panoramic views of the city. When it’s warmer, there’s a pool deck as well. Food and Wine was excellent. I include some pictures on my Instagram that’s included in this post. From there on after that the details are hazy, so I’m not going to try recount any but much fun was had. Well yeah, of course, being who we are, we chatted a lot about investing in real estate cryptocurrency, how much cash we should hold, gold everything from this night out with the guys actually. So because of this night out with the guys, we’d always get together. So it’s not it’s not easy for us to coordinate make plans. But from this event, we did make plans, we’re going to visit a city in the US to scope out further look at some small development opportunities on the other side of the border. So pretty cool. For me, I think most folks know I’m heavily invested in Ontario, specifically Hamilton in St. Catharines. In Toronto, I have a property in Toronto and for for Cherry and I, there’s nothing wrong with a little diversification south of the border. And the group of people I’m going to be investing with, they’re pretty talented people, and morally and ethically solid people. So I’m excited for this. 

Erwin  

Onto this week’s show. I’m super excited to have back on the show my friend Jules McKenzie, who I find super inspiring. And unfortunately, I’m going to warn some of you right now, he is a super successful real estate investor, having owned a lot of properties way more than I did. And he’s had over 20, 30 I forget how many property over 50 properties I think. He’s trimmed that down significantly as he sold some off and paid off debts. But he’s got a good number of keepers. He’s raised millions and millions of dollars of capital to buy real estate and Barrie and Orillia, but here’s the boring part. He is a police officer with over 30 years of experience. So I think that categorises him as a legal expert. And some of you are not going to like his opinion about the protests that went happened in Ottawa. So I’m just gonna warn you that now. But if you want a professional legal opinion, his opinion on what happened there, maybe you want to listen to that part. I personally I’m open minded. I don’t care if I don’t get offended easily. Personally, I don’t get offended easily. But I know some of you out there will. Jules does share how he how he too protest is at Parliament Hill at a different time, but he protested to Parliament Hill. And his experience was very different than what happened earlier this year. With the truckers and the anti COVID mandate protesters and whatnot the occupation, what was deemed an illegal occupation. Anyways, we talked a lot about real estate on the show and in general on general, we talked on the show a lot of tips and tactics, including previous interviews I’ve had with Jules Jules is back for the third or fourth time I’ve lost count. So feel free to go back and listen to those if you’re looking for tools and tips and tactics. Today, we’re gonna more focus on the obstacles that Joe’s had to overcome being an indigenous Canadian and growing up on a reserve, substance abuse. If you’ve ever met Jules, you’ll know he’s one of the happiest people you’ll ever meet. And you’ll have no idea about his tragic past. But what I find inspiring about Jules is he refuses to live the life of a victim. And he’s living proof of how how important mindset is, as Jules has come from tougher upbringing the most and has achieved immense financial success. If you do enjoy the show, which I think you will, please look up Jules McKenzie on Facebook or Instagram and send him a message letting him know that you want to read his book, Jules is on the fence about writing a book. I don’t think he needs the encouragement, but just in case, as I believe his book will help a lot of people, not just young Indigenous Canadians, but I think he’ll help a lot of people, people who have come from who have obstacles that they think they can’t overcome. Some of them are Yeah, some of them are terrible, near impossible, but it really does still always start with believing in oneself. So I think his book will help more than just our 17 listeners. And if you agree, if you could be so kind to drop him a message. All right, please enjoy the show. 

Erwin  

Hi, Jules. 

Jules  

Hi, Erwin.

Erwin  

What’s keeping you busy these days?

Jules  

Oh, geez, I wouldn’t know where to begin. So I just finished a course at the Ontario Police College. I’ve been promoted to Detective; I didn’t even show you my badge. 

Erwin  

Oh, cool. 

Jules  

It was so cool. Because I’m not the first one to be in that position. But I don’t know. I just think it’s a it’s a really nice badge. That’s a Rhema police detective badge.Can you believe it? 

Erwin  

Wow, well, detailed. Oh, it’s really pretty.

Jules  

See that? Anybody can be the detective Erwin.

Erwin  

I’m not going to talk to that. You just had such an easy life. Born into a life of privilege.

Jules  

I was definitely privileged, my daddy gave me everything.

Erwin  

We’ll get into that because we’re not letting you off on that. But you are tanned so things haven’t gone that bad.

Jules  

Things have gone pretty good. Oh, man it was so so good to get away? We were down in Bahamas and NASA for a week.

Erwin  

Just a week?

Jules  

Yeah, just a week.

Erwin  

Was it hard coming back?

Jules  

Still got stuff to do. Like I still got a life to live.

Erwin  

Which is interesting. Because you do quite well. Yeah. Right. You don’t have to work? Well as financially you do not. I don’t think you have to work.

Jules  

We thought about I thought about cashing out a couple of times. But my chief, you know, my police chief promoted me into this position. They leased a car. I got I got an expense account and a credit card. I got a clothing allowance. And just like you keep doing this to me are making it hard for me to retire.

Erwin  

Golden handcuffs. Yeah, so funny.

Jules  

I never thought it would happen to me. Oh, if my mommy could only see me now.

Erwin  

You have an unmarked car which just so cool. Because I asked him like if so you pointed it out to us because like, oh, yeah, I’ve seen unmarked cars. I know when it’s a cop. I know I see them. I see them every rear view mirror, I see when I pass an unmarked car like but that you that yours doesn’t look. 

Jules  

There’s no way, No. That was based on CI so research that it’ll blend in. So Oh, it’s a car that I would not purchase. And it’s a car I’m not particularly proud of. I’m allowed to take it home but I don’t, I have a big beefy Dodge Ram pickup truck.

Erwin  

Well, you’re huge. Yeah. What are you 6’3, 6’4? What are you?

Jules  

Probably Probably 6’3. I think I lost an inch, maybe a half an inch off my height. As I get older.

Erwin  

Whoa, heavyweight? You’re lifting forces. It’s extra compressive my spine? Yeah. And while you’re everything else and probably don’t even have any have much knee cartilage left or whatever.

Jules  

Well, the one knee there’s no cartilage left. The other one. I just got the back half of the meniscus left. So I gotta I gotta watch that every once in a while. Yeah.

Erwin  

Cause I remember, I remember I hurt myself enough times doing whatever, mostly basketball, I’d rolled my ankles enough. And then like, enough of that for myself. That’s when I started my CrossFit journey. Thanks to some friends including like Nicaragua. And it because it’s so linear. Like, it’s like no one’s touching you first off. And again, everything’s in one direction basically. Right? either forward or backwards or sideways. Whatever. Pretty controlled. Yeah, compared to playing a sport. And I remember you telling me that you were running and I knew you had bad knees and that pained me. And I’m not gonna say anything. Right? Because you don’t tell anyone what to do. Yeah, right. Because you enjoyed it. You loved it. But would you do anything different?

Jules  

Well, funny. You mentioned that because I remember we were talking off off camera about the podcast you did with the individual from.

Erwin  

Cowan, Yeah. 

Jules  

What’s his name? Callum?

Erwin  

Callum, Cowan

Jules  

Callum Cowan. Okay. Yeah. From phenom highperformance clinic. And at the time, you were pretty heavy into the CrossFit stuff. And I was just starting in CrossFit. But I was frustrated. I didn’t feel that I was achieving the results that I should be achieveing. 

Erwin  

You were doing fantastic. I saw your videos, you’re doing pull ups like like a madman.

Jules  

But I was still seemingly overweight; I was 268 pounds at the time and felt heavy, felt sluggish, lethargic. And you know, it came down to the diet. And I remember having this conversation with my coach, my crossfit coach and I said what do I got to do to change and he just kind of sat down in front of me and the kneecap to kneecap says Jules, if you really want the results, you’re gonna have to change everything. And I said, What do you mean change everything. You have to change the way you train, you’re gonna have to change the way you eat. You’re gonna have to change the way you sleep. Because this is not serving you. It’s not it’s not going well. And I was I left that meeting equally frustrated and then I was listening to your podcast about phenom, the ketogenic diet and chain making all those kinds of changes. So I got in for an appointment with with one of the doctors there, a naturopathic doctor, we did some food sensitivity testing, and I found out I was sensitive to a lot of things.

Erwin  

And do you remember what were some of the highlights. What were you sensitive to?

Jules  

So potatoes. Big one The pastas, anything refined. I was like, essentially all the all the things we’re not supposed to have on keto, I was, I was sensitive to, for a brief period at the beginning I was I was sensitive towards eggs as well, which was torture, because it was just a steady diet of meat and vegetables. But I lost so much weight so fast. I lost a lot of strength with that as well. And I was kinda that was kind of frustrating, but, you know, it’s still slowly starting to come back now. You know, I did a one rep max 255 Back Squat, which was a lot for me. When I first lost the weight, it was relatively fast. So I’d say in about three months, I was down 40 plus pounds, and I could barely back squat 75 pounds back it was it was to the point where it’s just embarrassing.

Erwin  

Wait, wait, wait, so pre ketogenic diet, how much you could back squat?

Jules  

Pre ketogenic diet, I was back squatting, I think my one rep max was 275. Okay, yeah. And then when I lost my weight, I could barely lift off 75 pounds. But in addition to that, you’re aware that I had my knee surgeries, I have terrible meat. Well, it’s not so terrible. Now, because I got my diet under control. I don’t have as much inflammation as I did previously. And I lost a lot of strength. And I was wearing these carbon fibre braces to keep my knee stability in place. And I was having difficulty with my knees because the knee pain was was not subsiding. But I went to a really sports medicine and got hooked up with a doctor there Jason Pour. And it was kind of like threefold so I got involved with them as well, in addition to being involved with phenom for my diet, but he gave me diet counselling because it was hard to get on the ketogenic diet, because I was grazing all day long. If not into the evening, if not both.

Erwin  

On things you should be eating or things you shouldn’t?

Jules  

Things I shouldn’t. of course, come on. You know, police food. I was eating a lot of police food. Doughnuts. Oh, man, I had a reputation uphold. So working with Jason, he got me on some diet counselling. So all it all really was was I read a book by Dr. Jason Fung, who’s Oh, yeah. Oh, so. Yeah. So the obesity code. Yeah. And then he says we’re going to adopt fasting into your life. And at the time, he says.

Erwin  

That’s the name of the book? Obesity code? 

Jules  

The obesity code by Dr. Jason Fung. Excellent guy. He has got some really you got to mean. 

Erwin  

You worked with him directly? 

Jules  

No, I didn’t work. Well. Not at all. I don’t think I’ve ever met them. I might have met him at a REIN meeting. I have a memory of that.

Erwin  

You kidding me? 

Jules  

I’m not kidding. 

Erwin  

He’s famous now because of George St. Pierre. 

Jules  

Absolutely is. Yeah. But I believe I’ve met him at rain mean, if Dr. Fung if you’re out there, please don’t hesitate to give me a call sometime.

Erwin  

What a small world.

Jules  

I want to extend my gratitude. But I learned about intermittent fasting, I started to implement it in my life. And it was hard like anything, you know, you have the Keto flu. You’re you feel hungry all the fucking time. You know, you’re pissed off and edgy. But then eventually, things start turning around for you, right? Like you get you get over that hump. And I remember my first fasted workout where I could actually feel like I was just so energised and so charged. And it wasn’t so much to weightlifting, but my gymnastic ease type stuff. My callisthenics just took off. Like I was able to burpee like a madman was able to continue to do pull ups. You know, those kinds of things really took off and I just felt so so charged up and energised that now nowadays if I work out after I’ve eaten something then I feel like what I used to feel prior to all this stuff sluggish slow, kinda sleepy you know but if I go go workout fasted even if it’s a 36 hour fast like I just you know you start out and the way my coach is doing it now so I got a different coach. She’s coaching me to do some heavy lifting for a brief period of time maybe 5,10 minutes of some lifting five by five of back squats or front squats or combination of clean and jerks are power, snatch whatever the case may be. Then we take five minutes and then we go into the workout of the day, you know, which could be anything but now I do that if I do that fasted, it’s just phenomenal. If I do that after a prolonged fast and for me a prolonged fast is 36-40 hours, which is a lot. Yeah, I just I know that I’m I’m positively influencing my body’s natural testosterone level and the strength just takes off. It’s terrific. Oh, it’s just, it’s just so awesome. 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. 

Jules  

Yeah.

Erwin  

And just to backtrack, Dr. Jason Fong is he is.. isn’t he a kidney doctor?

Jules  

 He actually, as far as I understand he treats a lot of patients that suffer with diabetes.

Erwin  

Yeah. Yeah. So he actually went he or she tried instead of trying to fix people’s kidneys, he went to the source problem. Yeah. Which was they are overweight.

Jules  

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, you don’t need to take well, I guess you could take drugs for that. But that’s, that’s not the best solution. 

Erwin  

There’s more gentle, we can Well, I’d say it’s more gentle solution to be to be intermittent fast. And to want a vacation. 

Jules  

One of the best things about this lifestyle is fasting is free.

Erwin  

You save money you saved and you save time.

Jules  

You save time, too. I love it. Yeah. So if you skip a lunch, yeah, that’s an hour extra your day that you can just, you know, be productive.

Erwin  

For me, what I love is because my kids are young, so the mornings are a rush to get them at the door. But I don’t have to worry about my own eating. So I have all this extra time to like, you know, help my kids with homework or brush my daughter’s hair. Like it’s just nice, especially at that time when it’s usually hectic for most households. Yeah, yeah. Oh, pretty cool. That’s pretty cool. Obesity code. Yeah, no, he’s definitely my to read list is Hi. I’d love to get to it. But yeah, I’m already implementing a lot of this stuff. I can’t fast as long as I’m more of a more of a morning fast kind of guy.

Jules  

Yeah, I’ll do that 36-40 hour fast at least once a month, and then a couple times a week, I’ll do a 24 hour fast. So I’m basically my eating window is condensed down to six hours, sometimes eight, depending on what I got going on at work. But yeah, that’s, that’s kind of how I do it now, basically, two meals a day, sometimes one, sometimes none. And mentally, I just stopped making a big deal out of it. It’s like, yeah, so what.

Erwin  

Do you know how many calories you’re eating the day then know when you’re not roughly ballpark?

Jules  

No, I don’t count macros. I just know enough that it’s not so much the time I spend eating as much as the time I don’t spend eating. The biggest thing that scared me is because of my indigenous background. I know that a lot of my relatives have diabetes, and suffer from obesity. So I knew that every time you eat something, whether it’s good for you or not, you spike something in your body called insulin. You get enough insulin spikes, that hormone is going to take the food you just ingested, and turn it directly into body fat. So you gotta be aware of that.

Erwin  

When you do have a meal. are they bigger than what you used to eat before?

Jules  

Yeah, in some cases, yes. Okay. Yeah. Fine.

Erwin  

I’m trying to paint a picture for the listener, but you’re not starving yourself? 

Jules  

Absolutely not. No, some people look at me, it’s like, holy shit. Like you’re eating two breakfasts.

Erwin  

Yeah, yeah. So you’re kind of like you’re almost making up the calories in a single meal or two versus versus spreading it through the day. 

Jules  

That’s right. Yeah. 

Erwin  

Okay, awesome.

Jules  

So and then, and that’s predominantly to prevent insulin spikes, which is a hormone that’ll make you gain weight.

Erwin  

So Jules, you are on the show. Within two years. We’ve talked a lot. This is the third or fourth time on the show. We’ve talked a lot about real estate. Can you share what your current holdings are?

Jules  

Yeah, I can. We’re holding 11 properties. One is Angie’s beautiful bed and breakfast type property. The Kavana House; Kavanahouse.com. It truly is a bed and breakfast.

Erwin  

As in you serve breakfast. Yes. It’s weird to say Airbnb. Like, let’s remember what the last B stands for. Yeah, but no one serves breakfast at an Airbnb. 

Jules  

No, you attend this anonymous place, get your keys anonymously through a key code.

Erwin  

Sometimes you can’t tell you when the that’s why you’re there.

Jules  

Yeah. So I don’t know if that’s if that’s the kind of experience you want, have at her but you know, I know. I know. I like having breakfast. You know, getting breakfast served to me, if I’m staying somewhere nice. And this place is beautiful. So Angie got this vision when we’re down in. We went to Las Vegas. I can’t recall which anniversary it was. We were down there for four days. And we were on our way getting ready to check out and head head home and it’s like I gotta I need some more time. So we rented a car and we drove down to Phoenix, Arizona. And we stayed she found us this online Bed and Breakfast. She said let’s instead of staying hotel, why don’t we try this bed and breakfast and the host was terrific. It was a beautiful house in the suburbs of Phoenix, Arizona. And she was also a great tour guide. So we went to the haunted hamburger in Jerome, Arizona, which is essentially a little formerly a copper mining town on the side of Mountain.

Erwin  

Is that the name of the place? 

Jules  

Yeah. Jerome.

Erwin  

It is not a restaurant then?

Jules  

No, the restaurant is called the haunted hamburger. It’s in Jerome, Arizona, okay, if you get a chance to you gotta go. It was terrific. And it was such a fun little town to be walking around. And but yeah, that’s where she got the idea for the bed and breakfast. And we executed that during the pandemic. That was fun. Good timing. Oh, man. We had everything lined up. And then, you know, once it came time to execute, we closed our purchase at the end of July 2020. The contractor says, Yeah, we got we’re gonna have to delay this a couple of months because we can’t get materials.

Erwin  

Lumber, drywall.

Jules  

Lumber, drywall, Yeah, you name it. We couldn’t get it. Yeah. But we get we managed to get through that.

Erwin  

You wouldn’t have guests, so anyways, right? 

Jules  

No, yeah. No, no, we didn’t. I think we had our first guest early last year. And it was a doctor that was working overtime at soldiers Memorial Hospital, because we’re about 300 yards from the hospital. I remember the doctor showed up. And he said, well, where’s the hospital? And I pointed down the road. And I said, it’s 300 yards right down there. He says, oh, so I can leave my car here. So yeah, absolutely.

Erwin  

Was he just trying to stay away from his family while you work? Or was he visiting from out of town? 

Jules  

No, he was from he was from downtown Toronto. So he’s a doctor at one of the hospitals in downtown Toronto. And he was a fill in for somebody who had to take some leave some time off. And that particular doctor, which I am sure you would prefer to remain anonymous, he has stayed with us a couple of times now, along with a couple of or a another medical professional, who’s come to stay with us as a result of this doctor’s experience with us. So it’s pretty good. It’s like the Ultimate House hack. 

Erwin  

Yeah, cause you sold your home to move into this property. Yes. And you mentioned you before we’re recording, you mentioned Victorian, how many square feet? What year was it built?

Jules  

So it’s about I think it’s about 2500 – 2600 square feet.

Erwin  

Right? And how much how much is your space?

Jules  

Our space is small, but we don’t know. It’s just the two of us. All right. We’re empty nesters. So we built an addition on the house with a garage so I can have all my fitness equipment there. And we just live in the back. And we actually manage Angie’s really got a good vision and an eye for this stuff. She’s really turned that place into, you know, just a comfortable place to hang out. We have our own side porch. In the summertime, we could sit out, have coffee and enjoy the outside. If it’s too cold. In the wintertime, we have a gas fireplace in our living room, we just turn it up. It gets it’s actually really good. There is an aspect of my personality that’s introverted. Angies, you know, not a total introvert. But she likes to she likes more peace and quiet and nobody around than she does having people around.

Erwin  

Which is funny because you’re very close to your guests. Yeah. This property. Yeah. Versus your home at no guests.

Jules  

Yeah. So, you know, being cooped up and locked up during the pandemic, you know, in a beautiful Victorian home, you know, it’s kind of nice, actually.

Erwin  

Nice. Yeah. Nice.

Jules  

I almost I almost felt bad. That when it was time to start churning out guests and accepting guests. It’s like, I don’t really want to share this place. It’s too it’s too nice.

Erwin  

You will likely be slammed this summer.

Jules  

I would assume that we will be. Yeah. Any book No bookings next week for March Break? Um, I think we do have some bookings. I haven’t really checked in with Ange. See. That’s more her side of the business. Operating that.

Erwin  

Cool. Very cool. Oh, then what? Have you sold anything off? Because I think you used to have more properties. Didn’t you have 17 Last time you were here? Because she must have turned some over?

Jules  

Yeah, yeah. So it was it was 20 or 19 properties when I last was on your show. So we sold off most of our single family residential property. So all the townhouses are gone. They basically tripled in value from the time when we purchased them get profit, to the time that we refinanced them and paid out our initial investors to the time that we sold them and paid ourselves out, you know, it’s pretty good. That afforded us a really nice Victorian home and, you know, all the renovations that went into it, because it was it was substantially more expensive during pandemic to get those renovations done than if it wasn’t, but that’s okay. You know, when you have a vision, you have a clear vision for yourself and your spouse, what’s happening externally, like a pandemic, it doesn’t matter. It really doesn’t matter. So that’s one thing I learned. If you have a strong enough belief in your vision, for the both of you, there really is no hurdles or obstacles or red walls in the way you just bust through that stuff.

Erwin  

You take no prisoners. Yeah, you have no, you have no experience with being written about being resilient to you. We’ll get to that.Cause I’m not letting you off the hook. Now I asked you if we could talk about this before about the law. Yeah. because there are some in our community who have different opinions on the law. Not everyone can have an opinion. I’m not taking, I mean, turn it around. I’ll take my lawyer’s opinion. Or I’ll ask the police officers opinion on what the law is on what what a peaceful protest is, for example, right now, I’ll just let you What would you like to say is you’ve had experience with protests. Alright, you’ve, I’ve watched TV, I’ve watched lots of…

Jules  

Let me… how do I go about explaining this, I have to keep in mind that I am a law enforcement officer still active as a law enforcement officer. 

Erwin  

So that might qualify you as a legal expert.

Jules  

It might might it might.

Erwin  

Right versus someone on Instagram.

Jules  

But I will just I will just say it like this. I’m an indigenous person. And I watched my dad fighting for Native rights pretty much my whole life, you know, before he passed, he was the vice president of Indians, the Quebec Association. He was locked up during the brief period of the first Quebec referendum because the Quebec government didn’t want him influencing anybody’s decision on the yes vote the separate. That was terrifying. Watching my dad being arrested by a couple of key VP officers. And, you know, he was he was released on without charge later on. 

Erwin  

They hold them when they’re charging him?

Jules  

Yeah, of course. 

Erwin  

Oh, okay. Yeah, that’s normal. Right. Today’s world?

Jules  

Absolutely Normal, Yeah, like you’d be better be careful Erwin, You walk outta here. You might be arrested without charge for in hell for you know, a 48 hour period. I’m being facetious listeners. This was the environment that I grew up in, followed in my father’s footsteps a little bit. We were protesting some amendments to Bill C 31. During the mid 80s, when I was going to Cambrian College in Sudbury. And there was about 80 of us from I think it was from North Bay, Sioux Sainte Marie, and I believe even Trent University. There was a large Native student population down there. We went to Ottawa, to make this protest at Parliament buildings.

Erwin  

In Ottawa.

Jules  

In Ottawa.

Erwin  

On Wellington street?

Jules  

On Wellington Street, and we walked on the grass and we walked up towards the doors. And we were greeted by a whole raft of RCMP officers with their shields and their batons and they beat the shit out of us and pushed us off the lawn.

Erwin  

They came dressed and ready for you. Oh, yeah.

Jules  

We barely got set up. We barely got set up and we were pushed, physically pushed off. I remember, you know, oh, I skipped that stair. But I’m hitting this stair. I’m falling flat on my face. Here I go. And we’re more or less, you know, forcibly evicted off of the the the grounds of the permanent buildings.

Erwin  

How long were you only along were you on the grounds for I would say how long we did you set foot on the grounds until you were met with police force. 

Erwin  

This was planning of about a month in advance to I wasn’t one of the planners, but I got caught up in this thing. And I knew they were planning and for about a month, we went down on a bus with somebody. We raised enough money to rent the bus. We went down there. We probably lasted from the time we arrived till the time we were forced off probably about 90 minutes. Yeah. It was pretty quick. It was pretty brutal.

Erwin  

So we did have to go before we’re like parliament that this was not legal. So in those 90 minutes time, like they there was like, you know, I went through all seven levels of government to say that you guys shouldn’t be there. 

Jules  

It must have. Because we were threatening. We were such a threatening group of, you know, these skinny little Indigenous students that you know, had placards and phrases drafted on signs and whatnot. And we didn’t even I don’t even think I got my sign up in the air.

Erwin  

This is I’ve watched a lot of TV and I think from this the trend I noticed is that treatment of protesters have gotten softer and through the years like I literally worked at Queen’s Medina and I was still going to the office. I’m not the brightest person you know that but during during 2020.

Jules  

But dude, that was that was they didn’t take it easy on them. 

Erwin  

No, they didn’t. They didn’t. 

Jules  

There were some of them that just got clobbered. Right.

Erwin  

So that’s my context. And then I see what happened in Ottawa. Right.

Jules  

I was brutal. I mean, you know, I don’t want to speak badly about certain police leaders, but to say something along the lines of they’re too well organised. Their trucks are too big and heavy. There’s too many of them. Like, give me a break. Like there’s an obvious double standard that still exists, you know, in society, maybe just the government. I don’t know. But I know that this still is the most beautiful richest freest kind tree in the world, when an indigenous person from my backroom, you know, can amass millions of dollars in real estate, and have a beautiful lifestyle, you know, I’m still a big believer in it. It just kind of irks me that, you know, I know what happened when I went to protest in Ottawa, it wasn’t pleasant at all. And then, you know, the poor people in downtown Ottawa, had to endure, I think it was 21 days of this, you know, honking and the streets blocked and the bowling people in, you know, bouncy castles and hot tubs and just this total disregard for public order, and the law and other people’s right to enjoy their property and their businesses and their freedoms. You know, I don’t know, I was kind of I was kind of disappointed with the, the way that whole thing went down. I mean, all the prime minister had to do with this, give them 15-20 minutes of his time. Let them vent, they probably would have moved on. I don’t know, maybe.

Erwin  

I’m empathetic, both sides to because I can. We both know, people that were affected really poor, badly by the pandemic, and mandates and stuff like that. And also, like, like I was saying, before, we’re recording as a landlord. It’s, you know, part of our mandate as landlords is to provide our tenants with the quiet, peaceful enjoyment of the property. Yeah, right. That wasn’t quiet and peaceful. It definitely was enjoyment of people’s property. Who live downtown Ottawa. All right. So yeah, yeah. People aren’t punching each other in the face. But that’s not that’s still not peaceful. It needs to be more comprehensive. Yeah. Right. Honking Yeah, parked cars. Yeah.

Jules  

Impeding other people’s right to be mobile, you know, in their within their surroundings. Like, there’s people that couldn’t get their cars around downtown Ottawa, because there’s these giant trucks blocking it.

Erwin  

I don’t know, I think the lesson is, then some of these, these leaders actually thought that I don’t know if they’re serious or not. But they actually thought that because they were being peaceful. They weren’t breaking the law. 

Jules  

They knew, they knew they’re breaking the law. We know they were breaking the law, but…

Erwin  

They are telling their followers, this is okay. Hold the line. Right. If you know what you’re doing is illegal. And you tell people to hold the line, then you’re telling people to do illegal things? 

Jules  

Yeah. 100%

Erwin  

Maybe get some good legal advice.

Jules  

I remember back in the day, when I was on a line similar, there was nobody yelling hold the line. Hold your head. This isn’t gonna hurt. 

Erwin  

Mercy, or this move on from the it’s so sad. It’s yeah.

Jules  

One things is, you know, the, the, the opinions. So I don’t know how to articulate this correctly. So. And I realised that we’re on a public show, but it seems to me that with social media, the media in general, there were some people that were thinking, you know, this is not right, this is against my rights and freedoms. And there was just a select few that were thinking that but once one or two, were able to get that out vocally in the public, then other people quickly jumped on board. You know, and it created this very divisive, you know, almost like Fox News versus CNN kind of polarisation of opinions. And, you know, some people really jumped on that, like, my, my, my previous crossfit coach, you know, I feel I feel so my heart goes out to him because he didn’t want to get vaccinated. He was a successful firefighter, worked hard to get it to that position. But, you know, his premise for this was that he was a tutor, Afghan war veteran, and he earned his right, you know, to express his freedom. And yeah, he probably has, but you know, at what cost? He’s got two little kids. He’s got a beautiful home and a beautiful wife lost his job and now lost his business. You know, was it really worth it? I don’t know.

Erwin  

So I want to go I want to change things a little bit. So one of my early mentors he told me about a friend of his who was really rich right. This is how rich he was; he bought… his kid needed a car. So he bought him a seven series BMW. So my mentors asked his friend, you know, they have three series, right? And then the dad said, Why am I want to drive it once in a while? I can’t be seen driving a three series. Right, he’s that rich. And then there’s another story we asked him like, Hey, you are your dark skinned complexion, other people with that complexion, wear the headdress, where is yours? And he said to my mentor, this is Canada. That’s I want to be successful in business. I need to look more like people who do business here. Alright. He’s willing to make that sacrifice. I’m not saying right or wrong. I believe in freedoms as well. Yeah, yeah. I believe everyone should have the freedom to choose us willing to make that that sacrifice for his freedom and to become better financially successful. And that’s always stuck with me in that, what are you willing to do to be successful? I’m willing to do a lot for my family. Right? And so yeah, to each their own. 

Jules  

Yeah, absolutely. 

Erwin  

Crazy. Damn. Could you imagine if not it’s a terrible question? I’ll ask it anyway,

Jules  

No, ask it anyways, let’s do it.

Erwin  

Can you imagine if no, it’s too bad, it’s come to terrible, it’s terrible. I’m not going to ask you this.

Jules  

I will say this, the growing up that I had, and watching my father fighting for indigenous rights back in the day, you know, I heard him say phrases like, well, that Canada US border doesn’t exist for us. You know, when I can remember a couple of occasions, we’re going down to Syracuse, New York, and my mother telling my dad, be polite with the Border Services guard, so we can cross and have a peaceful afternoon

Erwin  

May kick your ass? 

Jules  

No. not my dad, no, he had to express his opinions. And guess what, it was a quiet, quiet, quiet ride home after the fact. But, you know, I recognise the fact that, yes, indigenous people, you know, essentially, we’re here first, we have a right to be self determining, self sustaining, and a right to our own independence. But essentially, isn’t that what I’m doing now? I’ve amassed a portfolio of real estate. I’ve taken your stock hacker course. So I’m learning how to how to do that. I’m essentially self determining my future. And I’m making our family financially independent, and self sustaining. You know, and I didn’t have to impose, you know, at the time, my personal views and political views on others, to the point where I want you to have the same opinion as me. No, I was trained through the trainings that you and I have had to create situations where people can win, win win situations, and make deals, and not just make deals where one person wins, or one person loses, just making Win-Win deals, you know. So that’s the big difference between me and my dad, I don’t even know where that came from Erwin. Holy shit, you just drew that out of me. I’m not a I guess I’m not a radical indigenous rights person. I do respect that. And I do. There are still some beliefs and values I have around that, you know, but they mostly are around an indigenous person’s right to hunt and fish, I still very much believe in that. 

Erwin  

Those rights being taken away? 

Jules  

There, they had been threatened in the past. And as far as I know, they’re they’re not being threatened right now. But I still believe that indigenous people should, you know, engage in those activities to to maintain that tradition.

Erwin  

Why shouldn’t they? Yeah, you all need to eat. Yeah. And so many laws in this country are designed to protect your ability to earn an income and so like, which is like the part of eating.

Jules  

One of the things that happened that caused my dad to act the way he did in the late 70s, early 80s Was that the, in Quebec, the forestry officers were attending the homes of indigenous people and pulling out moose meat, and fish and other things because they didn’t, they were hunting and fishing without licences, when previously, we did not require licences, to in order to do this, nor were we subjected to, you know, losing all our sustenance for a year. Because essentially, we would go out in the fall, get enough meat to last the whole year, until the subsequent fall, I mean, that they do these things for conservation reasons. Indigenous people have always been, you know, had conservatory values towards the land, and the animals and the resources on it, in it. Anyhow, there I did digress a little bit. 

Erwin  

There’s some interesting people.

Jules  

But I still love the culture. I’m still a part of a small traditional drumming group. We do a ceremonial drum. We attend certain indigenous events and we certainly like to sing songs and honour those war veterans that have gone on before us. 

Erwin  

What was it like growing up?

Jules  

What was it like growing up!

Erwin  

What was the name was there is there a category for the name of this the type of school you went to?

Jules  

Just Command public school? 

Erwin  

Okay, so we’re trying to get to is like residential schools has been making massive headlines as it deservedly so. Yeah. The school that you belong to is that can’t be categorised as a residential school?

Jules  

No, sir. I was I didn’t. I wasn’t subject to that my parents were and unfortunately, my parents were from the generation where you didn’t talk about those kinds of things. Just As a listener may have a grandfather who was in World War Two, who didn’t share any of his war stories or experiences while he was overseas. 

Erwin  

So your parents never told you about it? 

Jules  

No. My father never never talked about those kinds of things. 

Erwin  

Dark days, eh?

Jules  

Yeah. So I’ve heard, I’ve heard stories from other relatives where, you know, yeah, our auntie and our uncle are buried buried in a mass grave in behind the traditional church or the church by the trading post. I’ve heard those stories.

Erwin  

Jesus.

Jules  

But I’ve had relatives that have gone to residential school. And, you know, right or wrong. That’s our history. That’s, that’s what’s happened.

Erwin  

So we’ve detailed I don’t want to bring it all back up, because I know it’s not the easiest. You’ve been through some shit. 

Jules  

Yeah, I have been, but I’ve also personally and grown and developed myself to the point where, for lack of a better term, I don’t hold resentment. I don’t hold a grudge. 

Erwin  

You’ve gone through an education system that was very not for you. Yes, absolutely. Remember, I recall someone pulled a gun on you and your home? Yep. All right. It’s threatening you in front of your father. Recall, you’ve had some substance abuse issues. Yeah. Which is not surprising being confirmed. Consider what you’ve gone through Policing is not easy today. I can’t imagine how easy it was for you and your community when you started. Right. So none of this was easy. 

Jules  

No. So then, none of it was I think that, you know, reaching out for help, and being courageous enough to reach out for help was my saving grace. You know, I seen other of my peers that had a seemingly calm, reasonably successful lifestyle. They were healthy, they were happy. And I just reached out, I said, Well, how did you do that? What are you doing that’s so different from what I’m doing? And one of the things was, well, I don’t drink. 

Erwin  

So you’re unlimited introvert. And you still reached out and asked the question. 

Jules  

Yeah, I did. 

Erwin  

But to ask the question, you have to admit, I have a problem. 

Jules  

Yeah. That was hard. 

Erwin  

You did that.

Jules  

I did that. Yeah, absolutely. I did that. It was shortly after I got on my career with the opp. I joined the opp when I was 21. And I was far too young to be a police officer.

Erwin  

And then to see what you would see. Yeah. Oh, man. Oh, yeah.

Jules  

Because it was essentially my life on repeat. Because I was put into a predominantly indigenous community in Northwestern Ontario, to be part of the police department where nobody in a community trusted the police. And then my peers in the police department didn’t trust me because I was I looked a lot like them, like the people that were serving. So my whole past has blew up in my face again. Of course, I turned into a raging pissed off alcoholic.

Erwin  

Right, because who are the people you’re arresting? Yeah, who who filled the prisons and the jails? Yeah.

Jules  

And I had to add to fit in with, with my peers, you know, and do what they were doing. And I didn’t feel too good about that. But there was these three guys from the Galway police, First Nations indigenous policing. And they had this twinkle in their eye. And they had this message about, you know, living a clean, sober lifestyle. And I just remember asking them, well, how did you do that? How does that work? And in their own way, all three of them took the time to express this to me and gave me that message of strength and hope you know that I could. I couldn’t do it if I wanted to. And yeah, that was my my introduction into Alcoholics Anonymous.

Erwin  

And so are you completely sober you don’t touch this stuff at all. Don’t touch.

Jules  

stuff at all. 30 years, continuous 30 years continuous sobriety see that anybody? If you get 30 years.

Erwin  

30 years, people can do a month, people can’t do a weekend. 

Jules  

I was just on a course at the Police College. And we were staying at a hotel in London. And we went the one night we went to a place it was just this Roadhouse bar kind of thing. And they were all drinking. And I never said oh, I’m beyond that. I don’t drink. You know, I didn’t do any of that. I just I had my, my glass of water with lemon and a coffee and a big vat of chicken wings. And I just joked and laughed and had a good time like everybody else. And a lot of them didn’t even notice it. There was one that did notice  and ended up buying my supper for me. They said well, we all we all put in 20 bucks and I put in the 20 bucks as well, because there was I think there was 40 of us. So I threw my 20 bucks into the pot because they were having this big brouhaha when we’re done our course. But they said no, you you’re not drinking It’s only fair that we pay for your meal. So they, they bought my my chicken wings and my, my salad and my dessert. I did cheat a little bit, I added dessert last night Erwin.

Erwin  

I too would rather take my calories as food and through drink. Yeah, just as a generality. Like, I enjoy eating food over drink. Yeah.

Jules  

But I’ve been sober, longer alive now that I don’t even remember what the compulsion was like to want to drink. I don’t even remember what that was like now.

Erwin  

So in the past episode, you said something that was really powerful for me.

Jules  

What would that be Erwin? 

Erwin  

You don’t remember? 

Jules  

No, I’m sorry. And please, please don’t take this wrong. Wait. Like, because I seem to I seem to have this happened to me a few times. So my friends as you have a conversation, a conversation with me, after some subsequent significant events and success in their lives. And they say Jules, thanks a lot, you remember that thing? You told me? I did exactly that, and it worked out really well. So after that conversation, I’m kind of sitting around saying, Wow, what the heck did I say to them? What did I say to them that, you know, help them step over that hurdle or break through that brick wall, whatever that was.

Erwin  

It was one of your conversations with maybe it was a like you’re AA partner some like that along those lines, someone who is coaching mentoring you, you were telling them, like what your life was, like all your problems? And I think they said to you something like, wow, you sound like a victim? 

Jules  

Yes, that’s it. That was it. So the guy that I’m working with now. And he’s, he’s a, for lack of a better term, He’s a giant in personal finance and wealth planning. With one of the big banks, you’d recognise his name immediately if I shared that. But we both have an agreement that, you know, our sobriety and our personal anonymity go hand in hand.

Erwin  

I’d like to meet them. 

Jules  

So this is who I’ve been working with since and he was part of a small group in the mid 90s. That went to lamonta. Oaks, a suburb of Chicago, Illinois, and brought back a series of the 12 steps from the founding fathers of Alcoholics Anonymous. So we’ve been doing the 12 steps as they originally intended to be done, which is a very deep searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. When he said, You need to stop acting like a victim, or stop portraying yourself like a victim. He knew what he was talking about. And, you know, I had to inventory a lot of things, and deal with them and get rid of them. How do you do that? Well, first, you got to admit that there’s a problem. And you’ve got to admit defeat. And then you got to be willing to change and admit that there might be a power out there greater than yourself that could restore you to sanity, because of the insanity of whatever this thing is, that is defeating you. And once you’ve got that done, then you make a decision to turn your will and your life over to the care of that power, be it God or a power greater than yourself, as you understand them. Not as the Roman Catholic Church understands them, not as a spiritual, indigenous medicine man understands him or her. But as you understand this power greater than yourself, you turn your will and your life over to it, then you get the work. And step four, and five, you’re doing a certain and moral inventory of yourself, you’re learning certain facts about yourself, you’re learning that there’s certain defects that these resentments have activated. And then you, you learn what part you played in that. So in some cases, it was easy for me to say, well, they don’t like me, because I’m an indigenous person. And that’s why I didn’t get the promotion. They didn’t like me, because I’m a police officer, so that’s why I didn’t get that real estate deal. You know, stop that friggin blaming, it’s not serving you. Well, you need to overcome that you need to find out what it is in yourself that’s holding you back, and overcome it, and inventory it and deal with it. And then in the subsequent steps, we learned, you know, what our defects of character are. And then we make a promise to the God of our understanding that, you know, we’ll endeavour to do the opposite of them, and carry on, you know, during the day, I will do a quick step one to nine if something comes up. And what I mean by that is, you know, you get the phone call, or somebody does something or something happens to you that activates those is the feelings that get activated. And when the feelings get activated, certain defects get activated. And that’s when you have to watch yourself because that’s, at least for me, that’s when times I’ll say something that’s awkward or aggressive, and I got to go back and apologise later So instead, in steps, nine and 10, I will pause and I’ll ask, ask what? I’ll refer back to that power greater than myself that restore me to sanity? And then I’ll just listen listen for the answer. And if I if I calm myself enough, the answers will come and I’ll do the right thing as opposed to blaming and being pissed off and jaded and all the rest of that kind of thing. It’s an awesome lifestyle and then in subsequent steps, I continue to to meditate and pray and grow and develop and take all those things that I learned in step 12 And share it when I can you know, maybe one of your listeners is feeling hopeless and down and jaded and pissed off you know, if they think that a lifestyle like mine can can help them I’m happy to to sue them in the right direction. I mean, one of our since the pandemic we’ve been doing our step studies on Zoom and we’ve had people on our steps studies right across the country it’s been it’s been tremendous.

Jules  

As much as I’m tired of zoom it’s kind of nice sometimes too.

Jules  

It really is.

Erwin  

Yeah, we could have zoomed if you wanted to.

Jules  

No, I prefer meeting you in person. I know we can zoom, I know that.

Erwin  

Speaking of, because you’re a big guy 

Jules  

Kind of big. 

Erwin  

I can’t imagine someone saying Jules, you sound like a victim.

Jules  

Though the guy that the guy that I’m mentoring right now he’s he’s got a martial arts background. So you know, and we’ve sparred, so I hope I was all bruised up. I had the time of my life. It was fun. But, you know, he’s kind of a Tai Chi, martial art type guy, very subtle. He moved in some high, high moving networks, in training, Special Forces type people. I’ve really had the benefit of some of that, as well. 

Erwin  

But someone called you out.

Jules  

Oh, well, he was he was the right guy at the right time. I mean, the old saying, so. Yeah, he’s still right. I’m still alive dude.

Erwin  

You mean you didn’t kill him? No, no.

Jules  

I’m not sure that I would win that one. But the saying goes like when the students ready the teacher will appear. 

Erwin  

That’s crazy, man. 

Jules  

And when the students ready, the teacher will appear.

Erwin  

Because I bring this up, because so many people have suffered last two years. And then you’ve suffered a lot.

Jules  

Wow, it’s not in recent history.

Erwin  

Oh, come on. Who do you know how to? So a lot of people have bad last two years. Yeah. I’m sure you’re good. Two years before you’re 18 years old. We’re probably worse than their bed these last two years.

Jules  

It was rough. Yeah. It was rough. No doubt about it was rough growing up. 

Erwin  

What would you say to those people? 

Jules  

I hope that things are better. I hope things that are are peaceful. And I hope you’re surrounded with those that you love, and you’re not harbouring any resentment or discontentment in your life. Because I know what it’s like for me to do that. And I don’t wish that on anybody.

Erwin  

How often are you working on this?

Jules  

Ah, we do studies in the fall. And then we do another one in spring we are spring one is going to start up near the end of April. So I facilitate the zoom and the technical side of that. And my mentor, our sponsor, he does heads up the study. 

Erwin  

Sorry, what does the sponsor mean in this context?

Jules  

So in a context of, for me, so my guy more or less says that, for him the in Alcoholics Anonymous, you have to get a sponsor. So this is somebody that you call on before you drink. That’s what, that’s the theory behind it. 

Erwin  

Got it. the opposite of your drinking, buddy. 

Erwin  

Yeah, completely the opposite. And there was some sort of a hierarchy approach to this. So your sponsor is up here, and you’re down there. And that’s who you look up to? Well, he didn’t want that. He said, that’s, that’s not going to work for me when I met this guy, and actually met him through a contact that I had in REIN. You know, he said that that doesn’t work for me. He said, you and I can walk a distance together. As long as you walk with me, we can immerse ourselves in doing step study work. So as soon as you stopped doing step study work, this whole deal is done. We’re done working together. So it wasn’t a condition of working together. But, you know, as I continue to learn about myself and grow and personally develop, doing the steps, more is revealed, Erwin, like more is revealed more what more of my past things that need to be inventoried and dealt with more talents and opportunities that I have to bring good into this world. You know, just more, more realisation of how much I love My beautiful wife, you know, and and want to respect her and bring joy into her life, and all those kinds of things.

Erwin  

So I’ve done some digging around on my own past, and then unpacking some things. So like, one one is like, you know, I’m Chinese, I’m a child of Chinese, you know, I thought, oh, my gosh, should I touch Chinese parents? Oh, there we go, you know, you bring home a 95? Like, where’s the five? Right time, that type of stuff stuff? And so and that’s partly what drives me. Yeah. So I understand where that’s from. Right. So when you’re talking to people, do people know, understand where they come from? Like, how they unpack their past? You know, I mean, are they even looking in their past to determine like, why why they are the way they are? 

Jules  

Which people are referring to?

Erwin  

Anyone, like these people that that are part of these semi annual events.

Jules  

Okay, so the people that get involved in a study, for example…

Erwin  

Because where I’m going is, I don’t know, if enough people like actually look at themselves a lot enough?

Jules  

No, I would, I would venture to say that you’re right

Erwin  

Because one of the biggest problems for people stopping them from being successful is their own self doubts. So like, go dig into what those self doubts are, where they come from.

Jules  

I also think it’s fear. Before there’s a breakthrough, there has to be a breakdown. So essentially, that’s what we’re doing when we’re doing steps study work.

Jules  

Painful, isn’t it? 

Jules  

It’s horrible.

Erwin  

Telling people you’re being evicted? 

Jules  

Yeah, that can be tough. And as I said, you know, I learned that from who I’m working with, you know, he says, I said, I’ve been really having a hard time inventoring, this stuff from my past. And he says, Jules, ultimately, there has to be a break down before there’s a break through. So that’s, you know, it can be unpleasant. But the rewards on the other side of that are tremendous. And you know, things things like, you know, selling properties at triple their value, things like getting promoted at work, your boss getting you a company car, and an expense account and a credit card in your own corner office, you know, those kinds of things started happening as a result of inventory and then dealing with you’re dealing with your ship for lack of a better term, right.

Erwin  

And that’s what I wanted to touch discuss on the show, because so many people, they don’t do it. Yeah. So many people have failed to start. Yeah. Like, I meet so many talented people all the time. And they say, I can’t do that. Yeah. Do what you do.

Jules  

Yeah. self doubt. Yeah. Unnecessary self doubt at that.

Erwin  

And I’d hazard a guess most of them didn’t have as hard time as you did. 

Jules  

Probably not, No.

Erwin  

Like, I’ve never had a gun pulled on me.

Jules  

Yeah. And Erwin, if you’re content with a mediocre lifestyle, then good on ya? That’s your choice. 

Erwin  

Yeah. It’s nothing wrong with it. 

Jules  

There’s nothing wrong with it. But if you want what we have, then you have to be willing to put the work in and overcome certain challenges and obstacles because everybody goes through them. Nobody is exempt. This was not handed to us. We had to work our tails off to get it.

Erwin  

We say we but you had to work harder. I’m a son of a doctor.

Jules  

Yeah, but he didn’t buy you your investment properties. He didn’t lease this or purchase this beautiful office space for you or organise what you had to get organised in order to put this show on. You did all that? 

Erwin  

Yeah. It was so much easier. You know, having my university education paid for, for example.

Jules  

 You know, as good parents should?

Erwin  

Oh, can you share what you did for your kids financially? Because they went to school…

Jules  

They went to school, so I didn’t push them. I didn’t look for the 95% and ask them where in the 5% was I didn’t push them that hard on academics. But what I did do is subject them to the audios that I was listening and read the books that I was reading and we played that cash flow board game by Robert Kiyosaki. Yeah, so yeah, cash flow, not the kiddy version. I’m talking about the regular version, and even 202 we played.

Erwin  

Oh, when did 202 come out? 

Jules  

Yeah. 202 came out around 2001 2002. Like, it was a while ago. But I didn’t push them hard on academics. And I was conflicted about that. But I see as I see them starting to develop their own path. I realised now, if I would have pushed my son, for example, you know, every every cop wants their son to become a cop and carry on this legacy of being a law enforcement officer. Because we’re a law enforcement family. And I knew, you know, from our our training, and my own personal growth and development journey, that that’s bullshit. My son is a beautiful man. beautiful, powerful man. And he’s got to contribute his gifts and his talents to the world and leave his own mark and make this a better place just as we are. And I realised that it’s not going to look exactly the way I did it. And it’s certainly not going to include pushing a cruiser or wearing a uniform.

Erwin  

Sorry, you mentioned books and audios. Can you share what those are?

Jules  

Man, I wouldn’t know where to begin, like, just looking around in this office here. I mean, I’ve read a lot of these books, just as you have. 

Erwin  

They’re just decoration. Yeah. 

Jules  

The 10x, by the way, is 10x. listening to audio word grant narrated, it’s really entertaining. I had such a good time listening to that. It was awesome.

Erwin  

He’s a wonderful speaker.

Jules  

Stephen Covey. 

Erwin  

Yeah, that’s a good one.

Jules  

Of course, I didn’t read they never read the real estate cycle book. I don’t know if they could digest that one. But, you know, they did real estate investing in Canada, my beautiful wife still hosts book club. So we do a book club one book a month, and with the kids. And now while now it’s mostly her friends, so Angie has her friends come over once a month. And they’re reading a book about something and discussing it. And it so far, it’s it’s evolved into women only. Which is fine.

Erwin  

Any recent books you like?

Jules  

Let me I was just talking about this last night, I was at a dinner after our course. And the guys were asking me what I read what they were asking me well, what’s Why are you so different? Why do you have this glow about you? And why are you still here working when you could have retired? And all and the truth is, I still really enjoy what I do. It’s a cool thing. Like I liken it to my childhood, and wondering how I could be my hero, Batman, you know, so essentially had the kind of Batman lifestyle during the day, um, this, for lack of a better term, this rich real estate investor, and a family of that has a legacy of real estate investing. And then at nighttime, I dressed in my uniform, and I’m suited up and I’m going out, you know, catching criminals and breaking down doors and seizing drugs and all that kind of stuff. There. I digress again. Oh, yeah, right here. Rethinking humanity is a book that I’ve read, I have to read it again, because very detailed, but essentially, it’s five foundational sector disruptions, the lifestyle of civilizations, and the coming age of freedom. And, for me, the author is James Arbib and Tony Seba, and it was published in June 2020, during the pandemic, and it’s their vision for what’s what’s coming. So things like autonomous vehicles. Cool. You know, this.

Erwin  

Wasn’t this guy. On on REIN recently. 

Jules  

Yeah, he was. Yeah. So I read I read the book. There is a lot of detail in it. So I have to read it again. It takes me a little longer to absorb you know, this information than the average but once I get it, man, I got it.

Erwin  

Cool. No, I started watching the, the the interview. My Tesla’s coming in June. 

Jules  

Nice. So I am allowed to buy a Tesla truck. cybertruck when it comes.

Erwin  

We don’t know when it’s gonna come out. 

Jules  

We don’t know when it’s gonna come out, But chances are sometime after June 30 2023. They will come out.

Erwin  

Maybe? I hope so. They’re still busy making the other ones and also the price. Cost materials has gone up so much. Yeah. So why wouldn’t they sell it for like 40? Grand us? Yeah, they can’t make it for that.

Jules  

I doubt very much that they will be.

Erwin  

We’ll see. So the reason I asked all these questions about like, you know, like, you sound a lot like a victim, for example, is could you amass the wealth and success that you had?

Jules  

Not blaming other people for my woes? No, there would be no way you because you’re constantly making excuses. Well, I can’t do that, you know, because people don’t like me, because I’m an indigenous person. Well, I say no, that’s not true. Like this. It’s no view to have because, you know, we both know that that’s not true. 

Erwin  

But what even like knowing you, I didn’t know until like years into knowing you. Yeah, right. I’m just ignorant. I don’t care. 

Jules  

And that’s the truth about it. Like nobody cares. Like, you’re Chinese, and nobody cares. Because really, people come to you to get mentored as an expert in real estate investing and stock hacking. You know and you just happen to be Chinese. Still don’t care.

Erwin  

Don’t care as long as you’re a good person. Yeah.

Jules  

As long as you’re a good person, you’re making a contribution. You’re doing the best that you possibly can. That’s what that’s all what real people really care about.

Erwin  

So what’s the future of your investing? We’re talking a bit about that. I know I got before we were recording.

Jules  

So I did to kind of take a step back so I don’t know if you remember to teach because of Dr. Paul Stoltz.

Erwin  

Oh, it’s been a while since I know.

Jules  

But it was impactful on me. So he talked, one of his teachings was about climbing, and then camping, and then climbing or your climber or that camper. So, Angie and I liken that to, we’re gonna camp for a little while. So, my boss, I was taking a lot of time off to attend real estate events, and do cool things and meet investors and hold events and all that kind of stuff. But my boss kind of says, well, I need to pull you back, you know, he can’t take all this time off. So I kind of went back and concentrated on the organisation.

Erwin  

Just tell him you are looking for white collar crime.

Erwin  

Or five years from now. 

Jules  

And I could do that. I have an interest, I have an unusually high understanding of those matters. But anyhow, there we go again. Yeah, I don’t Oh, man, I’ve got 16 months to go in policing.  That’s it. I’ve lied to myself saying all these years, I’ve, since I became into this realm of investing, I’ve been saying, Oh, I have this great deal is positive cash flow. Oh, by the way, I’m a police officer as well. So you got that added security. But that job doesn’t define who I am as a person. While you know, that lie is is just that like, Yeah, I’d still do very much identify as myself as a police officer, you know, sworn in to uphold the law, protect the public, be the best I possibly can be mentor, rookies coming after me. You know, and just all around, do my part to support the team that I work with. So not really sure, well, I know that I can comfortably retire my badge, and my gun and walk away from it. I know that financially, that’s, that’s not the issue at all. But there’s a side of me, that’s going to have to reinvent myself. And I don’t know, maybe it’s doing what you do, you know, owning a big real estate firm and employing lots of people and making multiple transactions and having a show and hosting courses and whatnot, maybe it is I don’t know, or maybe I take some of those CCIM courses, and get my licence and lease or sell commercial real estate, because it’s something I’m really interested in, I really liked the idea of triple net lease, I know that there’s not a whole lot of experts in the geographical area that I’m in, in Orillia that do that kind of thing. So maybe there’s an aspect of that I can do. Or maybe I just continued to enhance my new skill that I learned from from your organisation in stock hacking, you know, because I take that much lead now. And I’m starting to realise that this probably was probably five minutes this morning to you know, to place a trade that I that I did didn’t execute it. I think it got executed. I don’t I didn’t even look. It was before trading hour started. So I just did my thing, did a little bit of research last night and executed my trade this morning and just left it. I may look at it on the weekend. I may not I may look at it, not till Monday.

Jules  

Or five years from now. 

Erwin  

When it turns into a million bucks.

Jules  

Yeah, so who knows? I know that the idea has been pitched to me several times about writing a book. Oh, yeah. Not really sure what that book would be about other than my personal experience and story. 

Erwin  

You inspire a lot of people. 

Jules  

I hope so. 

Erwin  

I think it’d be a disservice to the world if you didn’t.

Jules  

There it is. You do what you do best day. You challenge people. You see, you see, you recognise the attributes that they have you challenge them to offer them to the world and be a better person.

Erwin  

Oh, if you’re interested in the greater good. You want to be Batman? He’d do it.

Jules  

He would definitely do it.

Erwin  

Yeah. All right. All right, man, a date on it.

Jules  

Oh, do you want a date on that too?

Erwin  

Two years, two years, two years from now? Sure. 

Jules  

Okay, that’s good. That’s good timing.

Erwin  

March 11 2022. 

Jules  

So I gotta have it ready to go to the publishing in March 11 2024.

Erwin  

It’s very reasonable for you to write a book in a year. Jocko Willing says he writes an hour a day, especially for the for the importance of what what it would mean to people.

Jules  

Yeah, I’m gonna have to do some mind mapping and figure out what what this would be about what I would have to offer. And I wish I could remember some of the things I’ve told my peers over the years that they have to come back and tell me I’ve been so successful. You remember that thing we talked about? I did that. 

Erwin  

We can have that chat, another time. We didn’t talk about multilevel marketing today.

Jules  

Oh no, we didn’t, but I can honestly say that what multilevel marketing did for me was get me into the habit of reading nonfiction books, listening to audios, I mean, they were on cassette tape back in the day, and attending seminars full of like minded people. That’s what multi level marketing did for me. So while I didn’t make a lot of money in multi, I didn’t make any money in multi level marketing. What it did was create those attributes that you need, you need to learn, you need to study, you need to open to change, and you need to be a leader in those things in order to, you know, money first appears as an idea in your brain that you’re going to in order to manifest that it’s going to take a lot of education. 

Erwin  

And to get out of your comfort zone.

Jules  

And get out of your comfort zone. Absolutely. I was naturally an introvert, being a police officer.

Erwin  

And get to ask for sales. 

Jules  

Yeah, you got to do the ask. Sorry. Sorry, listeners, it really comes down to it, you’re gonna have to do the ask, you’re gonna ask have to ask that person to be your co venture partner, you’re gonna have to ask that seller to take your ridiculous offer. You’re gonna have to do those things.

Erwin  

There’s ask yourself what your what are you willing to do to be successful? 

Jules  

Yeah. Yeah, morally and ethically. 

Erwin  

Oh, yeah. Obviously, they won’t be listening to this show otherwise. 

Jules  

Yeah.

Erwin  

Jules, thanks so much.

Jules  

Hey, Erwin. It’s always a pleasure, man. Thanks for having me.

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lamps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

Epic Fail, 500+ Home REI Company Collapses, Tens of Millions Lost

Greetings,  my fellow Wealth Hackers!

I shared an article on my Facebook and Instagram last week from the CBC about Epic Alliance’s collapse. 👇👇 

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Here’s the link to the article: Real estate company collapses, 500 homes affected, $10M from investors across Canada missing.

If you’re unfamiliar with the story from the article:

  • Founders of Epic Alliance, Rochelle Laflamme and Alisa Thompson
  • They were everywhere: podcasts, webinars, real estate investment groups (side note, they were never featured on anything Cherry or I have hosted. I agree they were everywhere. I try to be different on this show, so I don’t book guests who’ve been everywhere. That and I reference check anyone I don’t know personally)
  • There’s mention of affordable housing in Saskatoon…. Which I find odd. From Reddit, I’ve seen examples of rents over $1,500 per month on a house worth around $200,000.  Sounds great for the investor and not that affordable for the people of Saskatoon…
  • In January, the founders hosted a 16-minute Zoom call to investors to let them know the business had collapsed and the privately borrowed money was gone.
  • The provincial securities commission issued a cease and desist order in October 2021
  • An Accounting firm has been appointed to investigate by the courts and will present their findings in court in late April.
  • Over 500 properties affected; numerous out of province investors.

I first learnt about issues at Epic Alliance back in December when we had the guys from the Financial Independence Garage on the show. The Mechanic, a pseudonym to hide his true identity from his employer, shared there was a hiccup with his investment with Epic Alliance.  He didn’t want to get into details which is fine, and I put that away in my mental database for red flags.  

Personally, I’m very risk-averse, I have new opportunities coming my way every week, and knowing how the best of the best invest thanks to my decade-plus of networking, interviewing successful folks here on my podcast and masterminding with 7-8 figure entrepreneurs and investors with 8 figure net worth… you come to realize “it’s all relative” after looking at a lot of deals like I have since 2008 being a part of organized real estate.

Since 2008, I’ve witnessed several epic collapses of real estate investment companies. Some small, some still in court for hundreds of millions. Several private lenders, even mortgage brokerages who originated the private lending, have deals go bad. 

As Warren Buffet said, “only when the tide goes out do you see who’s swimming naked.”

My first exposure to an epic collapse was a husband and wife investor who taught about joint ventures and was promoted by an organized real estate networking group. Let’s call them “Mark.”  Mark had over 50 properties with joint venture partners; he would speak from the stage of his experience and how to raise capital.  Mark contributed to the organization’s joint venture education program.

Then as Warren Buffet describes it, the tide went out in 2009 during the financial and credit crisis and recession. The naked moment was Mark had taken out a blanket second mortgage of many of the investment properties, and he used the lawyer who was a sponsor of the organized real estate networking group. This was 2009.

I started taking real estate very seriously in 2008 after already owning a couple of houses with partners. However, this event opened my eyes to how even influencers can not be trusted.

In speaking to friends who had invested with Epic Alliance, the passive investors are now actively scrambling and taking over control of the properties, their experiences working with Mark I’ve seen repeated many times since then.  Investors and business owners have great ideas and visions; executing small like 5-10 properties goes fine, scaling beyond gets progressively hard with more variables like tenants, contractors, staff, etc.

Each of those variables is a challenge in itself. 

Add to that time and cash flow pressures, e.g. if you are a private borrower, some have made the mistake of starting the clock on interest payments when the private mortgages are signed. This places pressure on the borrower to be doing business. No different than having salaried staff.  

The lesson is to only start the interest clock.

Many bigger investors have shared with me the pressures of needed constant deal flow of investment properties to keep their salaried staff busy. Some even take on break-even projects to keep their staff busy so they don’t seek work elsewhere.

Add in tenant problems, a pandemic and a 500+ property portfolio like Epic Alliance’s, you have many moving parts.

I was chatting with a flipper client of mine in Hamilton about Epic Alliance on the weekend and how Rochelle, one of the owners of Epic Alliance, shared on her Instagram that she bought 10 houses in a single day.  My flipper friend who flips for a living had trouble getting his head around how many trades he’d need to pull that off.

The thing with tradespeople is, we’re in the middle of a housing boom, and they are in high demand and can get great jobs and benefits working for the union.

Note these are not turnkey houses. I’ve read and heard from those invested these are rough properties; many are boarded up in a not-so-nice part of town.

Not saying it’s impossible. I just don’t know anyone who could pull it off, and I know quite a few people… operational excellence would be needed, which is rare without high-priced talent.

From friends who’ve shared their experiences with me, one sold Epic Alliance a house for under $200,000. Then, out of curiosity, they pulled the title to find three mortgages that totalled just over 30% more than he had sold the property to Epic Alliance for.

Sounds like a red flag!

Another client of ours, a new Stock Hacker, shared with me that the house she joint-ventured with Epic Alliance on and felt deceived by the appraisal she received that was 20% above market on a house that’s boarded up, not tenanted and needs a lot of work. So now, she has to take control of a property in Saskatoon, which she’s never been to before.

Not the easiest thing to do as the articles I’ve read state there are around 200+ properties that are not tenanted within this portfolio, so it could be months if these investors are lucky to start seeing some rent come in.

Now there are many lessons to be learned from here and questions. I do believe in innocence until proven guilty, but one red flag is enough for me to say “No, thank you” to even learning more about an investment.

Like Warren Buffet says, it takes a lifetime to build a reputation and mere minutes to destroy it.

Now, my questions are as follows; 

Securities laws are quite clear around not soliciting investment from the public; speak to your lawyer about this.  How is a company with 500+ properties not listening to sound legal advice?

How many investors have never inspected their properties ever? For example, I have passive investments in a REIT, and I personally toured three of their apartment buildings, and that’s after being friends with the owners of the REIT for over ten years.

I’m told many of Epic Alliance’s properties were transacted privately, as in not on MLS nor Realtor.ca, which can be great for saving commissions. Still, those who participate are doing so without licensed professionals representing their best interests.  Not just Realtors, but what of the appraisers? When I get a mortgage with the bank, the bank chooses the appraiser.

In these private deals and private borrowing, who chose the appraisers? I know if I wanted inflated appraised values, I would hire an appraiser who would work with me.

I don’t have all the details, but there are definitely more than enough red flags for me.

For Cherry and me, our investing will remain the same, boring and predictable. We’ll own mostly duplexes ourselves without partners, some passive investments in our registered accounts in land development and apartment buildings REIT.

Stock Hacking for cash flow as our students in 2021, if they followed the shared trades to the T, would have achieved between 12-15% cash returns.  Past, of course, does not predict the future.

I know it sounds slow and boring, but I’ve never found a more repeatable path to getting rich and retiring comfortably.

If you’d like to be educated on the slow, best practices to getting rich, I can’t recommend you be on our email newsletters and attend our real estate or stock hacking events. Simply go to www.infinitywealth.ca/events to sign up!

Your future self will thank you!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you by www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full-time musician who just made a 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration, go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, and click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration, I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Hello real estate investors! This is Erwin bringing you the truth about real estate investing show and this is not a normal episode either; This is a solo podcast. Unfortunately, you’re stuck with just me today. I wanted to do solo because I shared an article on my Facebook my Instagram last week from an article from the CBC about epic alliances collapse. The link to the article you can google real estate company collapses 500 homes affected 10 million from investors across Canada missing. Again, it’s an article from the CBC. If you’re unfamiliar with the story, here’s some points from the article. The founders of epic Alliance, Rochelle aplomb and Lisa Thompson they were everywhere podcasts, webinars, real estate groups, real estate groups you and I know I don’t belong to you, either of them. I know many people that do. Quick side note. Neither Rochelle or Lisa has been featured on anything that Cherry and I have hosted not my read up groups moment not my podcasts ain’t like that. I agree. They were everywhere and on the show. We I do I put my own guests and I deliberately don’t book guests who’ve been everywhere. Bad and also I reference check everyone that I don’t know everyone that I know personally. In the art world has mentioned of affordable housing in Saskatoon which I find odd. Again, side note, there’s a pretty decent size Reddit string on on the on the story of a client’s one person’s example is to achieve the cash flows that they’re promising. The rent would have to be over $1,500 month on a property worth just over $200,000. So it sounds great for the investor. I’d invest in stuff like that doesn’t sound exactly affordable for the people of Saskatoon. In January, the whole founders hosted a 16 minute zoom call. So January this this past January, they hosted a 60 minute zoom call to investors to let them know the business have collapsed. And the private the borrowed money was gone. And blaming the local Securities Commission the provincial Securities Commission for further reason that the money was gone. Provincial Securities Commission issued a cease and desist order. It was temporary back in October 2021. And accounting firm has since been appointed to investigate. They’ve been appointed by the courts and they’ll report their findings later this month in April, over 500 properties are affected. I see varying numbers, just over 500 Some like five or 20 or so properties, it’s a lot of properties. And there’s numerous out of province investors involved again, again, this is me not only articles, they I know which organisations they were close to the theme of real estate. The event organised real estate investing is I find most people, most people generally stick with the groups that were they learned how to invest. So if he had sampled the popular groups would be like, No, this is Rich Dad, there’s T spire there’s rain, there’s Rockstar, right? There’s all these communities that are out there and in most stick to their own groups. Just because that’s you know, those the people they came up with I know epic Alliance was promoting it one of the other groups as well. And they’d likely got a lot of their investors. They’re very, very sad. I first learned about epic alliances, public alliances problems back in December. So if you follow the show, you’ve learned something good. On December in December, I had the gentleman from the financial independence garage on the show. If you heard that show, I had the mechanic and the accountant on I can’t remember which one of them one of them so they have pseudonyms, right? You saw the names because they still have day jobs so they don’t want their employers to know that they’re about their investments. And so anyways, they want privacy. But one of them did share with me how they were having issues with their investment with epic Alliance. He didn’t go into details but just didn’t go into details which is fine. But I put that away in my mental database for red flags, red flags, hopefully all 17 of you listeners did the same thing. Because personally, I’m I’m extremely risk averse. I have new I have the luxury of having opportunities come my way every week and I’ve been around for a while I know exactly how the best of the best invest thanks to my decades plus some networking interviewing a successful folks in the here on this podcast you know I mastermind a lot with other six eight figure entrepreneurs investors with a eight 910 figure net worth. Remember, I had Grant Cardone on the show, I’ve looked at his CARDONE CARDONE investing model. You know, I’ve had some great apartment building investors on the show.

 

Erwin  

You know, when you’ve looked at a lot of things, the term, it’s all relative, it means something, because I’ve looked at a lot of deals. And I’ve looked at a lot of deals since I started being a part of organised real estate since 2008. And I’ve, so I’ve looked at a lot of deals, and again, it’s all relative. If you look at a lot of deals, you’re not gonna do them all you’re gonna do, you’re gonna cherry pick the best ones. And that’s kind of what I felt I’ve done. Anyways, since 2008, I have witnessed some epic collapses of real estate investment companies, some small, you know, to be an investor with like 135 properties. Sometimes even one I’ve seen, I’ve seen Yeah, in this real estate market, can you imagine still failing on a single property, there’s gonna make mistakes. People can be blinded by greed and make mistakes. Some of these, some of these collapses are still in court for hundreds of millions of dollars being deemed it’s being disputed and hopefully can find it. There’s several private lenders out there. Even mortgage brokerages who originate private lending have had deals go bad. I know people personally that are problem. Which leads me to think of the Warren Buffett quote, only when the tide goes out. Do you see who’s swimming, swimming naked? So my first exposure to an epic collapse was a a husband, wife, investor a couple. It was mostly the the husband that was driving that business. So we’ll focus on them. We’ll name him, we’ll call him Mark. Mark had an over 50 property portfolio with mainly almost entirely with joint venture partners. It’s hard to have that many properties on your own. I’m sure over 40 of them were with joint venture partners, Margaret speak from stage of his experience and how to in raising capital and investment. This was in Hamilton that he was investing in our contributed to an organization’s joint venture education programme. That organisation sold a binder and educational binder with lots of materials and samples. Mark’s own materials were featured in that doc in that binder. And it wasn’t very expensive. So it was more of like a volunteer thing, I think. Anyways, then as Warren Buffett describes it, the tide went out. This was in 2009, during the financial and credit crisis in recession. That then the swimming naked moment was what everyone found out, sadly, was market taken out a blanket second mortgage on many of the investment properties. And he used the lawyer who was the sponsor of the organised real estate networking group. Can you believe that? You believe what a what a violation of trust that was. So this was 2009. So pretty early in my career of being a professional investor. I started to invest in real estate started investing really seriously in 2008, even though he owned a couple properties with my partners. This event opened my eyes to how even influencers cannot be trusted. Right? Like I’ll listen and listen and again. So it’s not all sunshine and roses. I don’t think everyone tells the truth on our successes and losses. In speaking with friends who hadn’t personally invested with it before it’s the these these passive investors are now actively scrambling to take control of their properties, their experiences working with sorry, so back to back to Mark’s story. The passive investors they meant they didn’t have to scramble they had they have their own title as per being joint venture partners. So the the mortgage money probably all went bad partner that was paid and their experience in But then semesters shared me with working with their experience working with Mark was. And I’ve seen it repeated many times, investors and business owners, business owners, lots of great ideas and visions. Executing small, like 510, even 20 properties is doable. Obviously, the bigger you get, the harder it gets. Because you add tenants, you add contractors, you add staff, or each of those variables are a challenge in itself. It’s not easy to be a general contractor, it’s not easy to be an employer, it’s not easy to be a landlord of 510 20 different tenants. Add to that the time and cash flow pressures. So for example, if you are a private, but if you are a private borrower son have made this mistake of starting the interest payments, starting the clock for when interest is starting to be earned. When the private mortgages are signed, that places a lot of pressure on the borrower to be doing business. That’s no different than having salaried staff or salary contractors. The lesson is to only start the interest clock, when there’s actually a deal in place.

 

Erwin  

And I’m sure all general contractors would like to do the same thing. They’d like to have their salary staff start getting paid once there’s actually a job to be done. So yeah, not the easiest thing to do. Put yourself in the place of a private bar, private borrower. Understand like, you can see the pressures. There’s many big investors that I know they’ve shared, shared with me the pressures of needing constant deal flow, constant properties that they have to work on, so that they can keep their salaried staff busy, their salary contractors. And some of them will even take on a break even project just to keep their staff and to keep them busy. So that they don’t leave, they leave their teams go working elsewhere. Right. That’s just the reality of things. That’s the truth about real estate investing. This is the truth of having a scale where you actually have employees doing work for you. And add in, you know, it’s not like it’s been easy to last two years adding tenant problems and the pain related pandemic tenant problems and supply chain issues. And think of how it would tell it would take to scale to a 500 plus portfolio property portfolio. Like epic alliances, you have a lot of moving parts. In chatting with the with the flipper client of mine, he flips in Hamilton, he flips only a handful of properties like less than six in a year. I told him I was telling him about epic alignments. And how Rochelle, one of the owners of epic line shared on her Instagram, how in one day, she bought 10 houses in one day. I flipped her friend could not wrap his head around that. And he didn’t given he flips for a living. So he makes a living. You have trouble getting his head around how many trades you will need to pull that off. If you’ve never done before, it’s probably not that easy to understand. But if you’ve ever done a significant renovation before, like say like your kitchen in your house and see a tent never had any of 10 kitchens to renovate, how easy would that be? And the thing with tradespeople are? If you haven’t I think everyone almost everyone has had had trouble hiring people for anything. For anything landscaping fence deck anything trades people were in the middle of the housing boom, this housing booms are going for a while tradespeople are in high demand. And they can go get great jobs with great benefits working for any union, any local union. Right? It’s not an easy time to be a general contractor. So Oh, and also just to note, this property is that epic Alliance, they’ve advertised that they’re usually need work. From the articles I’ve been reading some some of these have been boarded up. Right, so they’re not even occupied. No one’s taking care of them. They’re not tenanted either. No one’s paying rent. So I’m not saying it’s not impossible. I never want to step on anyone’s dreams. Maybe you can be the one that go do it. I just don’t know anyone personally who could pull this off. And I know quite a few people operational. Needless to say, operational excellence would absolutely absolutely be needed. And that’s rare to have without exceptional talent, often high priced talent. I know because I pay these high priced out. If anyone wants to trade places with me, I pay several six figure salaries on this from operating this business. So from friends who’ve shared with me their experiences, working with epic lines, one, one investor sold a property to them. They sold it to them privately for under $200,000. And then add a Curia curiosity, they wouldn’t pull title to find three mortgages that total to over 30% more than he had just sold the property to sell the property for two epical lines. Sounds like a red flag. As an investor that’s enough for me to know I don’t need to learn any more. I’m not I’m not. I’m not saying anyone’s guilty of anything. I believe in innocent till proven guilty, but for me too. You know, spend my time to research and investment or to put up, let alone put up money. This is that’s enough for me, another client of ours, a new stock hacker, she shared with me that she had joint ventures on a house with epic lines. And then when, you know when the tide went out, she felt deceived by the appraisal that she had received. That was 20% above market value on a house that was boarded up, non tenanted needs a lot of work. She’s now having to take over control the property in the town of Saskatoon where she’s never been before. Not the easiest thing to do. And again, there’s, I don’t know for sure, but from the articles I’ve been reading online, there’s 200 or more properties that are not tenanted within this portfolio, and they’re all pretty close together. And understand like Saskatoon is it’s just over 200,000 population. So it’s not even that big a town. So to hire staff to take care of all this, the hire contractors take to take care of the whole this will not be the easiest project to do.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, so now there are many lessons to be learned. And questions. I always have questions. That’s what keeps me up at night. I always have questions. I do believe again, I do believe in innocent until proven guilty. But again, one red flag is enough for me to say no to learning more about an investment, let alone invest. So like, like Warren Buffett says, this is a different quote, I promise. It takes a lifetime to build a reputation in mere minutes to destroy it. Some of my questions we get would be as follows. securities laws are quite clear around not soliciting investment from from the public. Unless you’re licenced. Right? Speak to your lawyer about this. And then the next question is, how’s sorry, the question is then how, as a company with 500, plus plus properties, not listening to good legal advice. I imagine that a lawyer must have said something. And if it didn’t, if not the best lawyer, maybe a different lawyer. How many investors have never inspected these properties. So I’m not going to poopoo just on Epic alliances, the investors at the do level of due diligence as well. So how many of them out of these out of how many of these out of province investors actually went to see the property. I personally have passive investments. I invest in a REIT using registered funds. And I personally toured three of their apartment buildings, I think they only had 11. At the time, I knew where they all were to because they’re mostly in Hamilton. I personally toured three of the buildings after I’ve been friends with the owners for over 10 years. That’s, that’s my level of trust. And also, I only invested what I was willing to lose. I’m also told that in epic lines advertises This and other marketing as well, a lot of the properties that they do that they transact on they’re done privately, as in they’re not on MLS or realtor.ca, which can be great for saving commissions. But those who participate are doing so without the help of licenced professionals represent who represent their best interest. So not just realtors. But what about the appraisers? For example, when myself or my client goes, goes to a mortgage gets a mortgage from a bank? The bank chooses the appraiser. And these private deals and private borrowing, who chose the appraiser? I don’t know the answer. But I think someone should look into it. And also, if you ever dove into one of these deals with private lending deal, which was the appraiser can you trust them? Can you send your own? If I wanted to know, for example, for example, if I know so I’ve hired a priest, you know, I’ve had appraisals done on brown properties. And the bank never lets me choose. And that’s for done for a reason. Again, I don’t have all the details. But there’s more than enough red flags for me to ever invest in a project like this, any of these projects like this. And again, a lot of due diligence needs to be done. Over this, many of the people learn their lesson here. As I said, if repeated several times for charity night, our investing will remain the same boring, predictable stuff will mostly own duplexes or sells with or without partners. Cheering I have enough clients in our lives. We don’t need investment partners to be married to some we have some passive investments in our registered accounts and land development and apartment buildings. We stock hack for cash flow, we also invest in dividend stocks, dividend paying stocks, for our stock hackers in 2021. If they’d followed the shared trades to a tee, they would have received between 12 to 15% cash on cash returns, as of course does not predict the future. But that’s pretty safe, boring stuff, especially in relation to a lot of real estate stuff I see out there. And also this is not the market. I really won’t be over exposing myself. I’m already very exposed to the real estate market. If you see any sort of if you see any sort of slowdown, it’s not really a market. I want to be getting to For private lending on flips, I know this all sounds slow and boring. But I’ve never found a more repeatable path, repeatable path for myself and my clients to get rich and for retiring for planning to retire comfortably. If you’d like to be educated on slow, best practice, best practices to get rich, I can’t recommend I recommend enough that you’ll be on our email list newsletters, and attend our events, real estate or stock hacking. Take your pick your future you will thank you. And that’s enough for me. Hopefully, it wasn’t too boring. And if you don’t like these shows, we have plenty of more interviewed guests coming up. And if you’d like to hear something else, or you have another show topics you’d like to hear me talk about, reach out, and we’re happy to do it. All right, stay safe out there.

Subscribe on Android

 

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

From Service Technician To 10 Apartment Buildings or $25 Million Under Management with Cory Sperle

Did anyone else catch the slap at the Oscars heard around the world? Yeesh! 

I use moments like this to go over self-defence with my kids. Should anyone approach them aggressively, control the distance, get your hands up, use your words “no” and “stop!”, get out of there if you can and remember your training.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

I can’t predict, but I’m guessing Will Smith might have thought twice about slapping Chris Rock if Chris had a black belt or two in martial arts. But, of course, that’s not an excuse for Chris’ joke directed at Jada but hitting someone is inexcusable. 

Self-defence talk on a real estate show… I hope you 17 listeners allow me some leeway as there is some method to my persistent madness as I have a point.

Friend of the show Emmett Kelly, husband of well-renowned investor and coach Elizabeth Kelly, was assaulted by multiple tenants in his office after a dispute over damages to be paid.  I’m not here to scare anyone but rather to learn from the lessons of others, so challenges are not repeated. 

My general outlook is caution while generally believing that people are doing the best with the resources they have.  But to also be prepared.

Right now, I’m preparing for what could be a recession if the war escalates in Ukraine. Still, I’m optimistic about returning to regular inflation of central banks’ printing of money and my real estate and stocks slowly growing as planned.

On a personal note, Cherry and I have postponed our trip to Disney and replaced it with a family trip to our favourite city in Canada, the beautiful City of Vancouver.

With all the covid measures in place for travel and at Disney, this didn’t seem like the best time for a massively expensive trip to the most magical place on Earth. So, we’re going to hit the Capilano Suspension Bridge and eat lots of wild salmon sushi.  

Cherry and I are arguing over who will take the stairs at the Grouse Grind.  Cherry doesn’t listen to this podcast, unlike you 17 listeners, but I used reverse psychology. I don’t want to do the stairs, so I pretend I want to do the stairs, and Cherry can ride the gondola up with the kids.

I think I’ll save $20 by Cherry taking the stairs 😉

On to this week’s guest!

From Service Technician To 10 Apartment Buildings or $25 Million Under Management with Cory Sperle

The path to success is not a straight line, and this week’s guest, Cory Sperle, is a perfect example.

Having begun his career working in the oil sands, he invested in Alberta in pursuit of cash flow instead of close to home in Kelowna, BC, through the peak and collapse of oil prices and, with it, real estate prices. 

We talk about the differences in investing between Saskatoon and Edmonton, Cory’s experience investing in 10 apartment buildings, six of which other investors put up the capital.

Cory is kind enough to share his truths about real estate investing, including working for free and even coming out of pocket during the down years of the Edmonton market. 

Cory is a multi-family educator with his 6 Pillars of Multifamily Success program, and he’s getting into events and hosted in March called the real estate outlook – 2022 and beyond.

We go into detail on how he structures joint ventures near the end and the lessons doing so, and you don’t want to miss it!

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you by www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full-time musician who just made a 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration, go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, and click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration, I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

 

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Welcome everyone to another episode of The Truth About Real Estate Investing Show. And almost people talking about the, I’ll get to in a minute. Everyone’s talking about the slap at the Oscars. But even before we get to that, I’ve been following the story for quite some time. I know some people that have been are personally affected by the collapse of the real estate company called Epic alliances. I’ll actually do a solo episode after this one. So after this episode, I’ll release a separate podcast specific to my thoughts around epic alliances. Not my words, epic fail. Those are the words of success. spittoon mayor, but yeah, I’ll do a separate podcast just about learning lessons. And my past experience of seeing major collapses of real estate companies, and how one may avoid such problems going forward. But yeah, Sunday night, I saw the headlines about the the Chris Rock slap as well, like everyone else did, I thought was clickbait. You know, I thought it was all fake. Just do a gag, not fake, but I thought it was a joke. And then I saw the unedited footage and holy cow. And, as usual, any information I take in, I always look for one of one of the little learning lessons, what do I teach my kids about it? So I go over self defence with my kids, and I teach them show them; Should anyone approach you aggressively? Control the distance to your hands up, use the words No, and stop. Get out of there if you can. And remember your training. The important thing is that you’re trained for these situations. My kids are going through extensive training for for good reason. So I can see. All you fathers of daughters out there know exactly what I’m talking about. I can’t predict. But I’m just saying Will Smith might have had thought twice of slapping Chris Rock if Chris had a black belt or two under his belt. black belt in martial arts that is that’s not an excuse for Chris’s joke directed at Jada Smith. But hitting someone is just inexcusable, especially in such a public forum. Self defence talk on a real estate show a and sure I’m probably gonna lose some listeners. I hope you 17 committed listeners allow me some leeway as there is usually some method to my persistent madness. As I have a point front of the show Mr. Kelly has been a well renowned real estate investor and coach Elizabeth Kelly, she shared on the show around Christmas time was it that her husband was assaulted by multiple tenants, I believe it was three in their own property management office, it was pretty serious. And the dispute was overstating minor, simply monetary damages, to be paid for damages to the property to the property that these tenants have made. And, as always, I’m not here to scare anyone to show us about the truths. So I’m not pulling any punches. These are the truths about real estate investing. Not everyone’s reasonable and how they behave. And to not learn from these lessons so that these challenges are never repeated. My general outlook, as always is caution. That’s both in life and investing. I generally believe that people are doing the best with the resources they have. Sometimes those resources aren’t the best, and they behave accordingly. And for myself and my family to always be prepared for whatever is happening. As for example right now I’m preparing for what could be recession if war escalates in Ukraine, if interest if inflation continues out of control, but I am optimistic, cautiously optimistic, as I’m hoping we can return to regular inflation. The regular inflation of Central Bank’s printing money, and my real estate and stocks go up slowly as planned. I honestly think that the the war in Ukraine should hopefully go to peace, hopefully soon as both parties it’s a pretty sweet stalemates. Russia’s not doing that. Well in the war. Ukraine has done the honestly incredible job of holding their ground and rock and receive any significant outside help. So I think both parties know where they’re at. So hopefully we can have peace. 

 

Erwin  

On a personal note, Cherry and I have postponed our trip to Disney in May and replaced it with our family trip to our favourite city in Canada. No, it’s not Edmonton, it’s not Hamilton neither a beautiful city of Vancouver, British Columbia with all the COVID measures in place for travel and at Disney specifically didn’t seem like the best time for a massively expensive trip. And pretty much sure you cannot hug Mickey Mouse. So why would we drop all this money for the most magical place on the earth? So we’re gonna hit you know, Vancouver do the touristy thing. CapitaLand no suspension bridge, right? I’m gonna eat a bunch of wild salmon sushi. I don’t know if the kids are gonna do that’s okay. Save money. They can have chicken teriyaki, whatever. And Cherry and I are arguing who’s gonna take the stairs up for the grouse grind. So Cherry’s actually next door so I can’t speak too loudly. I don’t want to do the stairs. So I pretend I do want to do the stairs and take the gondola right up with the kids. That’s what I told her. So She made me said no, I’m going to take the stairs and you take the gondola with the kids. And just think of all the money I’ll save. I’ll probably say at least 20 bucks by cherry taking the stairs and not spending on the gondola. And you suspect that they Oh, and we’re going to be there late May. So if anyone else has suggestions on things we should be doing, we are all yours. As you know, we are pretty open minded folks. 

 

Erwin  

On to this week’s guest the path to success is not a straight line. I hope no one ever thinks it is. We’ve had plenty of guests on this show to explain it’s not. And this week’s guest is no different in  Cory Sperle. He’s the perfect example of having started a career. He worked in the oil sands. He invested in Alberta in pursuit of cash flow, instead of being close to home in Kelowna, BC. So for those of you who’ve been around, know the economic challenges of Alberta, and hopefully you know how well Kelowna BC is done. And Cory invest in Alberta, all we riding up the peak, including buying at the peak, and then the eventual collapse of the oil market. And the real estate prices with it. Of course, things are rebounding. Oil is cyclical. I can deal with that kind of drama, cyclical real estate market like they do. We talked about the differences in investing between Saskatoon and Edmonton, Corys experience investing in the East invest in 10 apartment buildings, six of which are with other investors, with having other investors put up the capital, Cory is kind enough to share his truth about real estate investing, including having to work for free because he bought real estate at the peak and things didn’t go as planned. He even had to come out of pocket during those down years in the Edmonton market. I’m sure the Saskatoon market as well. Cory is the multifamily educator with his six pillars of multifamily success programme. And he’s even getting into event planning. He hosted a virtual conference called The Real Estate outlook 2022 and beyond. That was back in March. And we go into detail how he structures joint ventures near the end of the show. And the near the end of interview and lessons doing so. So you really don’t want to miss it. Especially with all the turmoil going on with other investors. Unfortunately, doing things the wrong way. Please enjoy the show. 

 

Erwin  

Cory, what’s keeping you busy these days? And thanks for coming on. I know you’re busy guy you have all these things going on. But yeah, but what is keeping you busy these days? 

 

Cory  

Well, thanks, Erwin. You know, living in Kelowna. Right now. It’s spring break. So you know, between juggling kids and business, I’m still working on multifamily. I manage. You know, I manage six apartment buildings right now, you know, with partners. And I’m also actively involved in doing a real estate Summit. It’s my first time I’ve ever put together. So we’re, you know, we’re getting professionals from across the country to get their opinion on, you know, the real estate outlook for 2022 and beyond. So, that’s been a busy project. But you know, it’s it’s going very well. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

That’s fantastic. You weren’t busy enough?

 

Cory  

You know, I decided to hire, I hired a coach to help me out when I was, you know, I was starting to get into education and coaching. So then, oh, let’s just do a summit and do a webinar. I didn’t know what to someone or how to do a webinar. It’s like, yeah, no big deal. Piece of cake. Yeah. But then once I got into it, and realised how much work it was, but you know, it’s been it’s been fabulous and rewarding, but it has been a lot.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. Because, again, your time must be valuable. I’m sure it’s very expensive. I’m sure you pay a lot of money to save your time. Yeah, you’re going out of your way to get the word out. Yeah. Oh, fantastic. And before we started recording, we’re going over the history of your name. Sperle Right. Can you share the heritage of that name?

 

Cory  

Yeah. So I just talked to my, my 97 year old grandfather, you know, in Saskatchewan, you know, most of this Burley’s they immigrated to Regina, Saskatchewan. And I just learned that both of my grandparents, you know, actually came from Odessa, you know, around 1910. So they were fleeing the First World War. So, you know, after I learned that I realised my, you know, my grandfather who speaks German and not Ukrainian, so I always thought I always just assumed that German heritage, and yeah, to learn. So he’s, he’s really following it. And you know, at the 97 year old, he’s still you know, very much retains every memory. Yes, you know, of childhood. So I found that very interesting. And it was very personal here that right.

 

Erwin  

Crazy. Yeah, if he didn’t flee, you might not be alive.

 

Cory  

No, definitely be in a sticky situation right now. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

How grateful is he to be Canadian? Yeah, very. That’s crazy. So you live in Kelowna? BC, correct. Yeah. And it’s pretty nice place I understand.

 

Cory  

Yeah. We, I moved from Edmonton back in 2014. You know, the, the real estate market was the opposite. It was booming in Edmonton, and it was dead in Kelowna. So it was an economically cheaper move to move here. It’s the complete opposite now. But yeah, I mean, it’s a vacation destination. It’s a retiree destination. I think it’s in the last two years since the last census. It’s probably one of the fastest growing cities in the country. So it’s a little bit nutty. But yeah, it’s a beautiful place for sure.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so we’ve talked on the show quite a bit about Alberta. What caused the boom for Kelowna?

 

Cory  

You know, I think the last couple of years, I think it’s just been there’s been a lot of Albertans moving out here. You know, a lot of people were just shift work. And since the pandemic, everyone has a lot of work from home, so a lot of people are moving from like all across the country because, well, if I’m going to set up shop, I might as well be in Kelowna, that people in the Lower Mainland, you know, cashing out, you know, they have one, two and a half million dollar houses, you know, that are falling apart so they can easily cash out, throw a million bucks in the bank and buy something here. So that’s, you know, further afield the market so at least that’s kind of the opinion of the local real estate agents when I talk to them. 

 

Erwin  

Right. And so is it crazy in Kelowna? Like prices are the up like 30%?

 

Cory  

Oh, yeah, it’s not like, that’s, that’s it’s multiple bidding wars on everything. Probably not. Not uncommon to the market that you’re in right now.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, we’re doing this on March 11. But yeah, we’re starting to see some slowdown. Oh, yeah. Just just before it though, you know, eight to 30 offers was normal.

 

Cory  

It’s just a horror story for I just feel badly for these, you know, people trying to get in right now. It’s part of the reason why I’m doing this summit. Because, you know, a lot of people have just lost hope of ever owning a house, you know, especially like, first time buyers are millennials. Man, like, how do I even do this? So that was part of the motivation to do the summit.

 

Erwin  

In the areas that you focus on? Do you see the same challenges? So for example, in Ontario in Toronto, we have, you know, they must be a local phenomenon. We have this thing called NIMBYs. It’s like, it’s a local species. I don’t know if they propagate themselves to your areas. Do you have similar issues where locals are basically obstructing new developments?

 

Cory  

Yeah, definitely. Definitely. in Kelowna, it’s very, very territorial, there’s a lot of communities, you know, they’re, you know, resisting development. I mean, the mayor of Kelowna, Colin bas. And he’s decided to take the densification road versus, you know, urban sprawl in Calgary, where they just, you know, chop up huge swaths of land, you know, which is a good idea, but it obviously has huge impacts on you know, local traffic patterns and stuff. And, you know, when you can’t please everybody, you know, when you’re trying to trying to grow a city, but I mean, in the markets that I invest in for my real estate holdings, Alberta and Saskatchewan, not so much, you know, they’re a lot more, you know, I guess, welcoming of development, you know, from my experience.

 

Erwin  

So why did the decision to invest away from home?

 

Cory  

Yeah, so when I, when I moved here, had most of my, well, all of my real estate holdings, you know, we’re in Alberta and Saskatchewan, I own some single family and multifamily apartments. And it was mostly because of economics. I mean, incomes were higher, and housing costs lower than they were in British Columbia. And, you know, plus BC has rent control laws, which makes it more difficult to be a landlord, you know, get your rents up, you know, etc. And, you know, since I moved here, when I moved here, the market here was low in 2014, housing was significantly cheaper than Edmonton. And today, it’s more than double Edmonton. So, you know, in that, in that eight years that I’ve been here, you know, it’s done a complete reversal. You know, the Edmonton markets been either flat or declining. You know, it’s just kind of it’s going back up now, the last year, especially in Calgary, but, you know, the last seven years prior, it’s just been flat or going down. And you know, Kelowna, Victoria, Vancouver has just been going straight up. So I’ve kind of been sitting here watching, you know, wondering, Well, should I should I invest in Kelowna, but it’s more of a speculative nature. I mean, I always invest on fundamentals and cash flow and actual, you know, more more along those lines, then getting getting into speculation.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so again, it’s March 11 2022. What kind of investments were you looking for now? Are you adding you divesting? or holding steady?

 

Cory  

Yeah, so, you know, short answer all of the above. I mean, we just sold an 11 unit apartment building in our sorry, 12 unit in Saskatoon in November. And it’s simply because, you know, the holdings that have I bought with in joint venture agreements, you know, we had predetermined exit points. And when we’d hit, you know, either five years or so much percent return on investment. So yeah, we pulled the trigger on the sale. I’m wishing we hadn’t sold that one now. Because, you know, right now, there’s a lot of interest in multifamily, especially on the prairies, we’re seeing a lot of interest coming from, you know, places like Ontario, the Maritimes, and BC, you know, and even Alberta, so we have two more buildings, three more buildings that I’m planning to sell. So I’ve compiled a buyer’s list. You know, a lot of people have contacted me wanting information. So I’m putting packages together. But I’m kind of like, well, I want to go back to my investors and say, you know, guys, this is starting to look like 2007, you know, maybe we should hold for another year, because we’re seeing a massive increase in prices and rents. Because vacancies are coming down for the first time in like six years, to a point where we can raise rents. I mean, I haven’t raised rent on a on an Edmonton unit in over seven years. So for some people, that’s unheard of, you know, we’re given like month to month incentives just to fill units. Yeah, so selling on that point, because, you know, we’re at the joint joint venture and holding some because I have a couple of really good assets that our partners are just dead set against selling so we’re just gonna hold those and then you know, with my partner and I, you know, Mike bug, we just bought another we just purchased the seven and a 17 unit building in LaDuke, Alberta, which Edmonton, essentially by the airport in November, and I’ve been writing offers probably two offers a week ever since looking for more projects. And, you know, I’m hoping to pick up two or three apartment buildings this year for sure.

 

Erwin  

And how active is it? I mean, offers are you up against or if any?


Cory  

I try not to compete. So my strategy is kind of unique. I don’t get into bidding wars. You know, a great example of that is there is someone asked me on my I did a webinar last week on the seven types of multifamily and somebody asked me about judicial listings, you know, what about foreclosures? I said, forget it, because it’s it’s public, everyone knows about it, it turned into a bidding war and an unconditional offer way more than I would ever pay. So, you know, I, I go back to stale MLS listings, people stay off MLS, I look for motivated sellers, eventually they overpriced the properties, you know, three months, six months, they might have 2,3,4 offers fall apart because they can’t get financing. And then I put in an offer what I think is fair, and you know, at least for apartment buildings, you know, two or three, six months later, they come back to me, you know, at the price I offered. So I’m more weight, I’m much more of a patient strategy and systematic strategy, and it’s worked well for me.

 

Erwin  

And then what but your experience when you sold your 11 unit building? Was there much interest?

 

Cory  

Yeah, you know, that was that was kind of towards the end of 2021. You know, when I started marketing it, I started marketing it early in the year because I wanted to give potential buyers a chance to qualify for CMHC. Because I know the you know, the terms of CMHC are were outstanding at the time. I mean, from a period from basically from March of 2021 to or March of 20. When pandemic started to February of 21, you could have got a interest rate on a multifamily like less than one and a half percent. So that’s when people owners were refinancing their buildings like crazy, pulling old equity redeploying it. So that was the time I was I was marketing that property. But I think that maybe just Saskatchewan just wasn’t on the radar yet. I wasn’t able to generate, you know, the amount of interest I was hoping to. I hired a local realtor. I still did. Okay, I mean, we bought the building 100,000 A unit in 2016. We sold it for 123,000. So, you know, was a decent lift in five years. So it was a decent return on investment, for sure. But um, you know, you always hear people I wish I hadn’t sold that building. You know, usually hear them say, I wish I hadn’t bought that building. You know, I mean?

 

Erwin  

Well, you mentioned there were tough times, or you mentioned earlier like There’s yours that you can raise rent for the listener doesn’t know, actually, I’m sure many people don’t know what caused the economic hardship.

 

Cory  

Yeah, and this is a story I love to share. Because I’ve been through cycles, you know, I was pretty bloody. I’ll say I was arrogant and cocky when I got into multifamily. I was in Alberta 2004 to 2010 where you couldn’t go wrong. You know, everything you bought was going up. The Alberta market was going up. I bought my first building in 2008. And then I changed niches. I moved to Saskatoon in 2016. Because, you know, the rents had gone down a little bit from the oil, you know, crash, but I thought up no problem. You know, but I didn’t realise they had overbuilt like crazy in the city vacancy rate, and Saskatoon went from 5% to 20%. This is exactly what happened. And I almost went I almost went bankrupt. And I was going back to my investors and I had to eat crow like crazy. And I learned so much from this, I blew through my entire reserve fund, because a pitcher this so there’s a new build, you know, kind of in a neighbourhood close to me, they had underground parking ensuite laundry, they’re renting for like 2000 When the vacancy hit, all of a sudden they dropped the rent to $1,000. I was renting units for 1200. All of a sudden, all my 10 is left to go to these really much nicer units. And I had to spend 10,000, fixing my suite and we rented for 800 and that went on for two years. So I basically turned over every single unit. And I was doing this for three buildings and working a full time job. So every money all the money I was making at my job was going into subsidising these buildings, praying for things to turn around and swearing to myself I would never make, you know, honestly, looking back, no matter how much I planned, I couldn’t have planned for that kind of event. I mean, potash, oil, uranium, you know, the job market all caved all at the same time. Right? Sure. All fans that are in demand right now. Yeah. So I mean, it’s swinging the other way. So the benefit is I survived through that. And now I have a newly renovated building that’s performing well. So many of my peers. I know a lot of guys that went into Edmonton 2014, their mortgage just came up in 2019 with negative equity. So the bank said, Okay, you got to give us 300 grand to pay the loan down or sell at a loss. So there are owners that are still doing that. So people that took second mortgages are over leveraged, you know, so what I thought was an extremely conservative strategy at the time, you know, barely got me past. So, you know, since then, I’m always, you know, return return of investment versus return on investment, you know, so that was a very humbling experience, but I’m glad I’m glad it happened. And that was is one of many in the past 22 years of my career, so it’s one I like to share for sure.

 

Erwin  

I’m sure some are feeling the same thing and like the stock and crypto world, you know, I think I think the greatest lessons are learned from losses not from from winning.

 

Cory  

And it’s interesting you bring up crypto because I have a lot of friends that just swear by that they’re into that, and these are really sharp people. But honestly, Erwin, I just, I just don’t understand it. I mean, I don’t invest in something I don’t understand. I understand that governments are corrupt, and they’re all trying to take over and all these other things. And I’m not necessarily define that that’s true. But I mean, multifamily real estate is always in demand, I think it’s inflation proof, for the most part, you know, is as received, if rates go up really high, and housing becomes more expensive, more and more of those, more of those owners will turn to renters. So it kind of balances out as long as I think you buy at a decent price and have a healthy reserve fund, you know, I think it’s an investment that’ll keep chugging along.

 

Erwin  

You’ve got real estate if you got real estate, your investments are similarly aligned with like Bitcoin, so I’m sure you’ll be okay. Same thing with the rest of the investor community out here, many people are actually surprised the participation rate into cryptocurrency, specifically Bitcoin among the real estate investors because real estate investors are historically I want to be able to see and touch it. So I always make the joke like, Oh, you’re gonna pay me the Bitcoin you whip out your wallet and pay me with bitcoins?

 

Cory  

Well, your market, your multifamily market out there, I did a podcast, you know, last week with the peak multifamily guys. And you know, that the prices per door and the cap rates out there that they were telling me about. And it’s like, it’s almost like, we wish we would have paid, you know, six months ago, because now it’s even crazier, even though that number didn’t make any economic sense six months ago, and from, you know, just a simple return perspective. So it’s completely different.

 

Erwin  

It’s good to bring it up, because like, back in 2017, when we had our little housing correction here, financing became a problem for people, for homebuyers, right. A lot of people that were had jobs in industries that were affected by the pen. Sorry, let me just go back to 2020. That’s why I was trying to refer to does you saw it right, there was no effect on the ability to finance a multifamily in the spring of 2020. versus, you know, we were people who say like, Oh, it’s so easy for real estate agents back in the spring of 2020. We’d have to sell a house several times, or one house with a sell at four times. Twice it fell through on financing because the buyers had their jobs had exposure to you know, like airline or airline industries or hospitality.

 

Cory  

The way your internet was mostly affected. No, no, not to the extent the only thing that happened with Multis was the rent freeze. So we had government jurisdictions, we had a lot of politicians saying things they shouldn’t have, like, don’t pay your rent, you know, things like this, you know, this rent freezes, you know what I’m talking about there?

 

Erwin  

And Doug Ford said, Yeah, on the day, he said it too.

 

Cory  

Rent free. So suddenly you say you can’t evict your tenants, then what did they do? They stopped paying rent. But it’s interesting. You mentioned the housing because I I coincidentally just sold my house in Cologne in March because CMHC at the time was saying, it’s gonna drop 10 20% You know, so I was like, panicked. And I had a house here and I sold it. And I ended up getting what they wanted. But there was very, there was almost nothing else for sale, but nobody was buying. And immediately after that, that’s when it started to go gangbusters. So it did the exact opposite of what CMHC predicted. But imagine for a realtor at the time, if you had offers and, you know, pending deals and all of a sudden people’s incomes were affected as businesses were shuttered. Yeah, that would throw rica recap is tricky. 

 

Erwin 

It’s the same house that’s made to sell four times it to really young kids. Yeah, it’s here. The sellers are playing a pet too. So like, No, it looks easy on the outside.

 

Cory  

No, no, no, not at all.

 

Erwin  

So you’re sorry, Cory. You said you sold a house in Kelowna? Was that your home? Or is that was an investment property?

 

Cory  

Primary residence. 

 

Erwin  

Oh, man, you sold your home. 

 

Cory  

Yeah

 

Erwin  

You were homeless?

 

Cory  

No, I Well, almost. I’m actually I’ve been I’ve been renting ever since waiting to buy something else. It was a downsize move. But now I’m kind of, you know, in that position where I’m kind of, I wouldn’t say that I’m stuck because I feel that markets are gonna correct. You know, when I see what’s happening here, it’s very much like it wasn’t in Edmonton in 2007 I don’t know if you had the same boom out there in 2007. Everything went nuts. And, you know, it eventually works. It’s up works itself out. But I mean, timing wise. It was a house they didn’t really want anyways, it was a money pit. You know, some people think, Oh, I’m just gonna get a house because it’s keeps going up in value, but I don’t think it’s an asset. I think it’s a liability. I think it sucks money from you. And if you make workhouse, it sucks a lot of money from you. So, you know it was I don’t regret the move, but I sure as hell wish I would have held it for a couple more years.

 

Erwin  

So you mentioned problems that millennials and first time buyers and immigrants are facing. What are these problems?

 

Cory  

Well, kind of from the outside looking in. I mean, I’m essentially in the same boat now, because I also don’t own. It’s a matter of qualification. You know, I’ve talked to some people about different strategies like rent to own, for example, which I don’t I’m not too familiar with that strategy. But I think you need you need the qualifying income. So if someone’s just coming into Canada, I think they need two years. It’s either two years or four years to prove 

 

Erwin  

Usually about two years of income for credit purposes. Yeah,

 

Cory  

Yeah, that they’ve added this, you know, stress tests, all these other things. You know, a lot of millennials, they have the Bank of mom and dad to help them out. You know, I found a talk to a few of my neighbours, and they just decided to give their inheritances to their kids now, say, here’s the down payment for your house. And I think it’s kind of, you know, affects on that it affects keeps the housing market going up, but it’s a way for them to get in. I mean, even even Millennials now are starting young families. I’m even looking at like my daughter who’s 18 and she’s in college. You know, how the heck is she ever gonna? I mean, oh, and something. I mean, should I be buying a condo now renting it out? So things I didn’t really think about, you know, talking to him. But talking to Mike bug last week, he’s selling one of his properties in Saskatoon, his first rental property about 10 years ago. And I think it’s maybe gone up 10% in value in 10 years, which is kind of normal for how I’ve seen real estate appreciate. Like, I haven’t seen jumps like this that go 30%. So I know, I understand from the buyers perspective, I think the biggest thing they’re faced with is fear of missing out. You know, I don’t get in right now. Oh, man, next year, it’s gonna be even more. But you got to just you got to get around that right when you got to buy for what makes sense. I mean, you don’t want to buy a $800,000 townhouse in Kelowna, that was 500,000 last year. And when you tell people this thing could drop in value. They just look at you like your promoters crazy. No, no, it can never drop. What are you talking about?

 

Erwin  

Haven’t you been around the last six months? You know, I remember drop. 

 

Cory  

Yeah, exactly. 

 

Erwin  

But you actually said it, though. Already. In your in your sharing. You saw FOMO buying? Yeah, was it 2014 In Alberta? And? Yeah, that’s probably the ultimate FOMO buying, like peak FOMO buying ish.

 

Cory  

Yeah, well, we I sold, we sold the house in Edmonton 2014. It was 10 offers very similar to what you’re seeing in Kelowna here and 2007. I remember watching people bidding on I mean, I’ll just take multifamily. There was a condo conversion craze also, but multifamily buildings went from 60,000 units in 2006 to 140,000 units within a year. And it was just nuts, because they were stratifying them and selling them off to investors. Now, that’s proven to be the worst investment in the history of real estate, those individual condos in those old old walkups.

 

Erwin  

At the time it sorry, what did the investors pay for the condos? Do you remember

 

Cory  

At all? Yeah, they were paying like around 100? Well, if the buildings were selling for 140, they were paying 160 to 180. And now those condos aren’t even worth 60. So there’s companies that are actually reconverting these apartments, they’re buying up all the units from the owners and flipping them back to buildings, which is a complete reverse. You know, what was happening before so funny things happen when you get nice frenzies. You know? So don’t get swept up in FOMO. For sure.

 

Erwin  

So what would you tell… What would you tell a first time buyer today then they avoid FOMO?

 

Cory  

Yeah, I’d say just be patient. You know, and I’d say there’s nothing undignified about renting. You know, I think a lot of us in Canada we’re just so spoiled to think that we have to own, we don’t own something we don’t we don’t own a house somehow it’s beneath us or something like that. And you know, I understand being in markets like Kelowna, if I suddenly had to leave this rental I’m rents have gone up here 40%. So it’s, I understand the the anxiety for renters as well. But I mean, I go to markets like Edmonton, I could rent a two bedroom, apartment all utilities for $900 with you know, income significantly higher than the RBC. So for a lot of like, you know, new immigrants, people come into Canada, they flock to the prairies because they can set up businesses, they can make a lot of money and it’s really cheap to live, whether they’re buying or renting.

 

Erwin  

Is that what you’re seeing? You’ve seen a lot of immigrants coming into the prairies. 

 

Cory  

So my property manager in Saskatoon, Shanta, she says, you know, we have a lot in our building, the one we just sold actually, we had a I think they were maybe from Syria, but it was they had their own community. So actually had a waiting list for this building. It was fabulous. And Saskatoon has always been, it’s been always a place where we’re like new immigrants come, it’s got the university there. You know, they’ll tend to land in Quebec, but then they’ll make their way to the prairies. And especially like in Alberta, in Edmonton in places like this. I think just the taxes are maybe lower the business, you know, the business climates more friendly. But, you know, talking to Shanta, the past two years, obviously, that slowed down, because, you know, the pandemic and you know, people haven’t been able to come, but she’s saying in the last couple months that’s really been picking up. So, you know, I anticipate massive growth on the prairies, especially like in the City of Saskatoon, and a large part of that is from immigration, for sure. 

 

Erwin  

Good to hear. This whole great resignation thing. There’s a million fake job vacancies in Canada and going up, right? So for anyone who doesn’t think we need immigrants…

 

Cory  

Is it job vacancies or is it just people that don’t want to work. Are they still on pandemic relief? No, employers aren’t paying enough.

 

Erwin  

A combination of all the above. I don’t know how many people are sitting in this out. I don’t know anyone personally sitting out the job market. So I don’t have any tenants sitting up the job. No, not really. Yeah, yeah. So like, there’s talk about it. I hear of like, friends of friends that do it. But I don’t know anyone personally, who’s sitting this out because of whatever. But yeah, point is, though, we have vacancy, we need someone who’s willing to work. Oh, we sure do. And to pay for this people that don’t want to work.

 

Cory  

Yeah. Well, even Alberta that was had, they’ve had their job market gutted with the oil industry, you know, in the past, like, six, seven years. Now all of a sudden, they’re screaming for work. A lot of these projects are coming back on again. That’s why you’re seeing a lot of our investors and a lot of people are buying in Edmonton Fort Saskatchewan in these places now because I mean, also because oil prices are so high. It’s interesting because the Canadian dollar used to always be pegged to oil you know, it used to go up when when there was an oil boom, but that’s not happening now. And I think it’s a lot of the reason is because a lot of the capitalists fled to the states you know, are the loonie is not pegged oil anymore, because oil is going gangbusters and our you know, our loonie stayed the same, which is kind of added to the inflation problem. I guess that’s not the next thing that the government has to try to deal with. But yeah, yes, absolutely. There’s huge shortages and jobs.

 

Erwin  

It’ll make our oil cheaper and $4 low. Yeah, this is what the war going on flight to safety. Yeah, it’s funny to say that people but the US dollars the flight to safety.

 

Cory  

I can imagine what it’s like to imagine the cause of financial advisors are getting right now from their clients with the situation going on.

 

Erwin  

US dollars. What’s this Bitcoin stuff? 

 

Cory  

Gold Gold. 

 

Erwin  

Advice is not gonna be telling people to get buying gold. Actually, they probably will. But like, you know, if I’m buying gold, I buy physical right

 

Cory  

Now get an EFT or I can make some fees off of it.

 

Erwin  

Exactly. It’s crazy world out there. Yeah. So what about investment wise for like a first time homebuyer immigrant? Here’s an example. I finally have a family member who did rent because they live in Toronto, or it’s crazy expensive, but they own an investment property. So someone else’s payment for that. That’s not accessible to everyone. What would you say to like the newer investor, like someone who says who say has like 100 grand to invest?

 

Cory  

Well, I mean, I would just I would say the best thing is how I got started, and I house hacked, you know, I bought a, I lived in the upstairs and I rented the basement, get as many units as he can, I mean, if you have 100 grand if you can qualify for CMHC 5% down, get a duplex or a four Plex rent out the units and live in the other ones. That’s the best way to get started, you know, or use that to move in. And then after a year, I know the government’s kind of maybe changing the rules, but you can live in a place for a year moved somewhere else to keep that as a rental. And you know, move every couple of years if you don’t mind doing that. But definitely a house hack, if you can. I know there’s like generational housing now to where you know, people’s parents are moving in my neighbour here, the parents just moved in with them. So you know, we’re seeing a lot more of that as well. But yeah, for someone just coming in, and don’t rush to just buy something, buy something that you’re going to want to stick around. You know, I bought houses before it’s like, well, I just bought this because it was a hot market. I didn’t actually really want this place, you know, so be sure what you’re buying. I mean, townhouses are a good start because they’re low maintenance. You know, you don’t have a yard to look after thing, you know, things like that. The strata fees are generally lower. But, you know, condos I’ve heard a lot of horror stories about special assessments. You don’t want to buy a condo then get you know, whacked at the $50,000 expense. You know, I’ve heard a lot of stories like that. I’m not saying that’s going to happen with every condo, but definitely like I would buy a single family home that has a sweep. If I was coming to Canada right now, in not necessarily in the major centres like we’re at Toronto, maybe go someplace a little further out, like Kingston or something. Maybe it’s a little cheaper. You know, that’s definitely what I would do. 100%.

 

Erwin  

Amazing. It’s funny because house hacking, the term only came up. I only learned about the term maybe two years ago ish. And then not many people talk about it, but not before social media and YouTube and all sorts of stuff. It’s not like a housing affordability was much easier ever. I think everyone always felt the pain of it. But it just seems to be more of a common thing when people talking about it is I’ve heard attack before too. I’ve rented out my basement. The first home my parents bought, my mom was was operating a mountain air b&b, but a bed and breakfast. Right? Not illegally of course. But we had three mortgages you do what you do to get by? Yeah, right. Is this weird though, but again, I didn’t think about it. And but now it’s being talked about more house hacking. 

 

Cory  

You know, honestly, I just heard that expression probably three weeks ago for the first time. Someone mentioned it to me and I what do you what do you mean like the term itself almost Sounds kinda has a negative meaning to it, you know, and I don’t use the BRRRR one too it’s I always say value add, because that acronym just annoys the heck out of me too. So I don’t know where these I don’t know where these acronyms or words come from but I guess everybody’s using them so.

 

Erwin  

Oh this will know you further than the crypto currency when they’re making the noise of the money printing machine they say BRRRR as well. So as it has different the birth as different connotations for different for different groups of people. 

 

Cory  

That’s crazy. 

 

Erwin  

So Cory, what are you working on now these days just buying buildings? Are you buying with your own money? You buying with Michael bugs money?

 

Cory  

You know, we’re trying to, we’re actually trying to make a decision here. I’m doing education. So I’m doing private coaching in multifamily. As well, I have a I have a six pillars of multifamily online course I’m enrolling it’s coming up. April 4. I did a seven pillars course last year, great success. You know, my students, most of them, a couple of them already have bought buildings, you know, almost all of them have made offers on buildings. So I mean, I like education, I like giving back. But I want to keep buying I mean, I’m in I’m in the business, I’m not, I don’t want to I make my living, investing, not not teaching teaching is my passion. But yeah, Mike and I just bought another building, he’s we’re looking at different models, we’re looking at private money right now. Because, you know, we’re finding a lot of a lot of people have, you know, a lot of cash sitting around. And with rates as low as they are, you know, they’re not afraid to lend at four or 5%. So we can sort of bypass any conventional bank, and basically go and submit cash offers. So we’ve actually tried that a couple times, we haven’t landed a deal yet. So Mike is more of the capital guy. You know, being a doctor veterinarian, he’s got a lot of colleagues that have a lot of interest in this. So I’m more of the deal facilitator, I’m more of the acquisitions guy, I’m really good at finding the deals. But we’re also looking at going larger, doing a limited partnership, or even a REIT, because I have a lot of existing assets. You know, I have seven buildings right now we’re looking at maybe spinning nose, actually nine with his buildings, we’re looking to spin the nose into a REIT. You know, I know how that’s how boardwalk got started. So, you know, we’re looking at different ways of doing of scaling up, you know, the business that way. So we definitely want to keep working together, we want to keep buying apartments, we’re just not sure of the actual model that we’re going to go with yet. 

 

Erwin  

Question on the private the private borrowing, or private lending, or whatever. One is for 5%. Get I’m the second mortgage is that third mortgage?

 

Cory  

No. And so it’s a first, you know, we’re buying the whole thing. So it’s basically secured as a first mortgage. So this is kind of how we’re doing it. This securing it is, is a little bit trickier. I know a lot of people use promissory notes, which you know, that’s doesn’t it’s not really the same securities, registering the mortgage on title. I’ve done second mortgages on title on, you know, vendor takes with apartments. So, Mike has sort of been working with the people setting up the actual how it’s gonna work. So it’s either it’s either debt or equity, I’ve always usually just done done equity on my joint ventures, like with my partners, is it’s like, hey, look, I’m not going to pay make you guys payments, but you know, you have a percentage of the equity. So we ended up we find, we end up giving a massive amount of equity. So you know, if Mike and I can find, you know, a decent deal with this value add, we can borrow, you know, in some cases, if we’re buying it at $1, we can borrow up to 100% of the money privately, and pay out that loan in a year to 18 months with new financing. So that’s the model that we’re looking at right now. And even the deal that we just we just sort of loaded our own cash and on the Duke, we only paid 86 a door. We’re almost done. We’re in the refinance process. Now. We’re probably going to relearn a refinance at 125 door. So we’re going to be able to pull all our all of our own equity out and redeploy it into another building. So it’s the power of multifamily. It’s one of the reasons why I really enjoy doing this. 

 

Erwin  

So how do you manage this when you’re when you’re out of market? Because I don’t think Mike’s in Boise can’t be in all those markets either. Because, like, we take Luke for example. Did you have existing investments there before?

 

Cory  

Yeah, so my, that’s a great question with with niche because my niche, my primary niche was always Edmonton, I moved to Edmonton 2005, Braden equities, my property management team there who does everything from helping me to find buildings, doing walkthroughs they’re also owners so they know exactly what the price per door is, you know exactly what the repairs are. They know what COVID pricing is for materials. They do all the renovations just charge me a project management fee. So yeah, I really stick to that niche Edmonton and area. We they do manage in Red Deer and Saskatoon, we don’t have Mike and I have the same property manager in Saskatoon. They’re not nearly as strong as our Edmonton team. So that’s the main reason why we’re going there. So I still considered that my home market. It’s new to Mike so I’ve got him embedded in there. Now I’ve got him convinced this is it’s a it’s like, four times larger sandbox in Saskatoon. There’s a lot of multifamily players in Saskatoon and not very many buildings. So at Edmonton, the vacancy rates are higher. So there’s more motivated sellers right now. So this is just the location where we’re finding the deals.

 

Erwin  

I’m always hesitant to buy outside markets that I’m familiar with. Yeah, and what I mean, I’m familiar with, I mean, my team is strong. Yeah. It’s not just knowing the streets and whatnot. But if your team isn’t strong, you’re gonna be in a lot of trouble. Unless you’re willing to be an active manager, which I’m not. Is that your experience?

 

Cory  

The people, the first thing they tell me with multifamily is okay, I got all these listings. I got one in this town, one in this town, should I make offers on them? And I say, Well, what on earth are you going to do? If you actually buy that building? How are you going to manage it? Who’s gonna manage it? My first building was in like my hometown to unity 400 kilometres from where I was working. I just had a new baby. And I just started a new full time job. And it was a complete guide of a project. And I don’t know what the hell I was thinking. But I somehow managed to turn it around and make a profit. So team, yeah, I would not invest anywhere, right, didn’t have a team. And another example when I moved back to Saskatoon, because I had done very well in single family. I thought, well, I know everything I can go into Saskatoon, it’s my home market, you know, everything’s gonna be rosy. So I didn’t do enough due diligence, I started a brand new team, I had a bad property manager, you know, even my inspectors, the renovation guys I had, I didn’t know them. So it turned in, I ended up being active and hands on moving to a niche that I thought I knew very well. So I can’t stress that enough. Your your team is everything. And especially if you’re trying to, you need a very good reason to move outside of where you’re comfortable. Like you’re saying, if I was going to tell you when I want you to invest in Edmonton or Cold Lake, Alberta, you’re gonna be like, Oh, well, I need a bloody good reason why I’m gonna do that. Right? 

 

Erwin  

What? Borrow someone’s team versus Yeah, I have some friends who went to they went to Sudbury because the fundamentals are booming now because they have their major industries nickel mining. Right? We have just when the price went through the roof. Yeah. So fundamentally, there’ll be they’ll be doing great. But if you don’t have a team,  so like, literally, I have friends whose whose contractor coats have like doubled, right? These are new teams for them, even though they have team but less that that’s part of the I find too many people are think think everything in black and white, right? It’s either yes or no. Like, my car has GPS in it. Yes, check. Is it better than Google Maps? No. What do you think I’m using, right? So I paid all this money for what? Now the same thing, just because you’ve gone in Sudbury doesn’t mean they’re any good.

 

Cory  

And it takes years to get that relationship like it took me almost 10 I started working with Brayden in 2010. It took me you know, almost 10 years to realise how to fully utilise his services and the value that he could provide to me and given me rental surveys, you know, for example, telling me what this price of this building what these rents should be, versus believing what’s on the realtor pro forma. I’m not seven realtors, I’m just saying, you know, the property manager knows the market. But you can’t magically, you know, start a team or takeover and expect results instantly know for sure.

 

Erwin  

And then rinse and repeat rather than going to go try to create a new team in a different market.

 

Cory  

You’re better to find a building or a piece of real estate that’s not as good in an area where your team is then to try to go somewhere else for sure.

 

Erwin  

This is what I call confirmation bias. We disagree on everything. I’m interviewing the garbage. I’m sure you find something we disagree on. What’s your what’s your outlook? What’s your so you’re investing heavily in Edmonton. What drives the fundamentals these days? What’s what’s different? Is it still oil based? Is it I hear tech jobs are moving in?

 

Cory  

Well, yeah, that’s it. I think Alberta is finally got their act together and started diversifying away from oil. You know, tech is big in Calgary, Calgary market. I mean, the office space downtown is the towers are still 30% vacant, which is unheard of, if you can imagine that, that every third building is sitting empty, especially in a pandemic, who knows where that office space markets gonna go? Yeah, yeah, so I’m still in Alberta. I like Saskatchewan. I, I think Saskatchewan overall, probably has a little bit more going for it just because of the potash and you know, the world, you know, the world population and you know, having to feed the planet, you know, and Alberta is more centred on oil, but they are diversifying better. But I like those two markets because they’re high growth or high growth markets. They’re not the most desirable places to live people don’t go there because they go to there where the jobs are and you know, when I think of housing, you know, people tell me Oh, Cologne is never going to go down because it’s a desirable place to live. Well. I put lifestyle is number three, the number third reason why people choose to live where they live. Number one is employment. Where can you go to have the best quality of life which is the income. Second is family. You know, a lot of people they’re not going to pack up from Edmonton and move to Cologne and leave their, you know, their aunts and uncles and their parents behind in Edmonton. And you can’t move everybody. So you know, family’s the second one and lifestyle is the is the third? Sure if you’re retired or you maybe you hate your family or you know, you don’t mind you just want to get away then. Sure. But I think the outlook for BC, I think it’s going to slow down here. We’re not gonna see 30% year over year, I don’t think you’re gonna see a massive correction, no matter what happens to interest rates, I think it’s gonna pretty much stay the same or go up. I think. I think we’re gonna see about a 20% increase in residential in Alberta in the next year to 18 months. That’s my prediction. And I think multifamily is gonna go even higher, probably 30%. 

 

Erwin  

Crazy. 

 

Cory  

Yeah. Just to catch up to everywhere else. Right. 

 

Erwin  

And then so if is the diversification going to support Alberta long term? Or is it also one of the fundamentals of oil? And how important is the oil in the future for Albertas economy?

 

Cory  

Yeah, you know, I was just in Jasper on the weekend, and I drove drove basically from gas Moodle. Yeah, I went there to get freedom because in BC, we’re still full restrictions here. Pandemic in Alberta, there’s nothing so it was a nice vacation. But just right on that drive. From there to Kelowna, we drove along the trans mountain pipeline. So you can see the amount of construction that’s going on there. I mean, I don’t think the world can transition off of oil right away, I think especially what’s going on right now, if the situation with Russia, people are realising that Canada has a safe, safe supply of energy, if we can find a way to get it to market. I look at the oil sands because I worked in the oil sands, I worked in the oil industry, I drove a service truck. That’s what I did while I was living in Edmonton. So I worked there, I went to basically every oil sands site, we’re talking about a trillion dollars of investment up there. Now, if you put that in perspective, it’s about the same as the entire Apollo space programme, or the entire interstate highway system of the United States. So that’s the scale of the of the size of investment up there. And as of a few years ago, a lot of those projects, they hadn’t even started chugging no oil yet, you know, some course, you know, their their new their newest mine, and some of these, a lot of them scale back. A lot of them sold out. So now we basically you’re down to three owners you have well, two, I think it’s just Suncor and CRL, which have basically kind of conglomerated on everything. But if that starts to produce it the potential that it can, it’s it’s absolutely enormous. I mean, I don’t I don’t think they’re going to revitalise Keystone. That’s a very political issue in the States. But obviously, you know, you can hear Joe Biden, now they’re talking about buying from Venezuela, and Iran, Iran, and all these other countries, you know, instead of Canada, you know, the he ripped up the contract for Keystone on his first day in office. So I don’t think oil is going anywhere. anytime soon, I think LNG is going to be big LNG is going to start, you know, really growing in the next few years. I mean, LNG Canada off of BC is going to start going, they’re going to start on the East Coast. I think it’s gonna be a good replacement, you know, energy. And I think nuclear, too. I think you’re gonna see a lot more nuclear, especially now in Europe, trying to get off energy dependence from Russia, I think. And that’s going to play well in Saskatchewan, because they’re the largest uranium suppliers in the world. So Commodity wise, I think, Canada, we’re still going to have that shovel economy. I think the oil industry is going to add to our Papa, we’re not going to be as reliant on it before. I think Alberta has diversified enough. But I think in the next 10 to 20 years, I think oil still gonna play a very vital role in our economy.

 

Erwin  

It definitely doesn’t change overnight, especially if it’s cheaper, especially if train gas and internal combustion engine cars are cheaper. Yeah. Cory, sorry. You mentioned you drove service trucks and the oil sands. And now you’re a full time apartment building investor. Yeah. So that’s the best path.

 

Cory  

Well, I’m an instrumentation technician by trade. So I worked. I worked in uranium mining, kind of from 1998 to 2004. I worked in I worked at a gold mine overseas in Central Asia. So you know, I did a lot of shift work. And up until 2019, actually worked in the diamond mines up north. So I worked in the diamond industry for eight years. But my my time at Spartan controls from 2007 to 2012 was interesting. The oil industry was very, very unique to work in. It was interesting, for sure. 

 

Erwin  

And then why the transition?

 

Cory  

To real estate?

 

Erwin  

You worked in Gold and uranium, those industries paid well, don’t they?

 

Cory  

Yeah, so yeah, I got away from gold’s. I mean, I was working a four week on four week off shift in Central Asia, I was working, you know, 4000 metres above sea level. So I developed you know, health issues with altitude. So, you know, I was forced to leave that job. And then, you know, I just moved to Edmonton. So naturally, I wanted to, you know, to be closer to home, so I took the job, you know, service truck, because I was home for the most part, I was home every night. I wasn’t gone for weeks at a time, which was better on the family. So that’s how I got into the oil industry. But all through it, I use my same trade my same ticket. I just got to work in a variety of different industries. So and then what got you started into real estate? Yeah, I mean, Have the people interviewed yesterday? It’s funny. Yeah. How many how many of us read the dreaded purple book? You know, rich rich dad poor dad Kiyosaki, right? The older you. Oh, that was 2001. So I would have been 2728 Not sure when the book was written. But yeah, so I had already house hacked. Then I bought my first uptown duplex, well single found with the suite in 2000. That was my first investment 22 years ago. And then I read the book and I started to get into multifamily passively because I was working overseas, I was live actually moved to Central Asia, I moved to the Kyrgyz Republic. So I just started investing in other people’s joint ventures in in Edmonton, and that’s how I got into multifamily. And then it just grew from there. Till I bought my first building in 2008. Then about another one in 2010, first JV in 2012, another JV in 2014. And then I think six buildings after that, and then just investors just became repeat investors and brought new ones in. And that’s how it really started to grow.

 

Erwin  

Can you share with the listener? What, what’s the size or portfolio now? Doors or dollars? Whatever you prefer? 

 

Cory  

Ah, yeah, so I guess the total was 10 buildings over so it was like, basically 25 million, I think I raised something like a raise something like 12 million from from investors have private money. So six of those buildings that didn’t put any of my own cash in. So we still own six buildings, no five buildings today. So we’ve we’ve sold off, you know, about half of them as, as the joint ventures have come up as we’ve reached our exit points. You know, I know a lot of these syndications, they don’t have an end date, they don’t have a divorce. They just keep keep chugging along. But you know, for me, it’s important that there’s a divorce because you know, people’s needs change, they want to buy a house, get married, go on a trip, whatever. So retire. Yeah, retire. So I think the exit strategy is very important.

 

Erwin  

Can you give some ideas on what their structures are for joint venture partnerships. Yeah. So anywhere, because often beginners need to do the need to offer equity to raise capital.

 

Cory  

Yeah, so what I did, I can say what I did, and what I would do now, if I was doing one on one deals, you know, keep it a simple Corporation, a unanimous shareholders agreement, basically, you know, it’s a 20 page document, you know, with all the clauses of what happens if a partner dies, you know, how do you sell your shares, you know, all these, all these kinds of things. So, you have that. And then you basically by the, by the building, you have Class A shares as as the owner, and then you have Class C shares, which are non voting for the investors, and then you split the equity that way. So I didn’t take any fees. You know, I felt that all the money had to be out there working hard. And I would, I would take it at the end, I would get paid on the back end for doing a good job. And, you know, I thought if I did a poor job, I would make nothing but did a good job, I would do very well make a lot of money.

 

Erwin  

Sorry, I’m sorry. Yeah. You got paid nothing during the deal to the to the end?

 

Cory  

No, no, none of my joint ventures I was working at the time I had a job. And I just thought, you know, I looked at some of these syndications that, you know, they’ll take a 3% acquisition fee. But then if you look at that on a on a thorough four levered investment, that’s 12% of the funds raised. And the investment has to make 15% return just to get back to zero. So I thought, I’m not going to put us underwater immediately, because we already have to spend 50,000 to close on this. So that’s, that’s cash, we have to make back to just to get back to zero. So I thought, you know, in order to meet upstanding investors, we can probably do 50 to 100% return in five years, that was my prediction. And I’ve been able to deliver that so far. And a big part of that was by by not taking fees. But today I’m saying you need to at least take a 1% fee, and take some kind of annual management, because you have to get paid something because the amount of work to find a building to buy a building, get it under contract, get a management setup is enormous, right?

 

Erwin  

I’m sure you’ve probably lost some sleep along the way. Over the years as well.

 

Cory  

I just told you what my 20% vacancy Saskatoon experience, and I was. And not only that, not only I wasn’t getting paid, I wasn’t going back to my investors cash calls. I was putting on my own money that I wasn’t making any interest on. So I took it even a step further. So that was some it was some stressful times. I’ll tell you,

 

Erwin  

Your wife couls have been happy. 

 

Cory  

No, no, but we survived, 

 

Erwin  

Man. So I always say I make the joke. And I’m semi serious when I say you have a little bit of ignorance going into real estate investing, because he knew everything you might not do it.

 

Cory  

No Exactly. And you know what every everyone if you’re in real estate long enough, it happens to everybody, you know, markets Correct. something bad happens. You have a deal that goes bad one of your investor partners wants out. It’s inevitable. It happens to everyone, no matter how much you prepare for it.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, I think that’s part of it. To add to that, I think part of it is that you have to you can’t just bank on one property or bank on one tenant. Like you need lots of you need a larger portfolio with some scale in order to absorb losses. Right.

 

Cory  

Yeah, that’s that’s a good point. And one of the mistakes when not mistakes, but one of the strategies I have going forward is I’m going to get more singles in my portfolio right now, I don’t have any because you can’t just all of a sudden sell a multi if you need money, you know if I owned a few townhouses if I, you know, short I could just sell off one of the townhouses, you know, to pay my bills. So that’s important to diversify, not diversify too much. You want to keep your eggs in one basket, but not that many eggs, right?

 

Erwin  

So you’re gonna buy things that you’re gonna buy single families for cash flow purposes.

 

Cory  

I’ll tell you in looking at in Edmonton right now where I could buy a condo, the townhouse I’m sitting in right now is worth 800,000. I can buy the same townhouse in Calgary for 200,000. And it can it’ll it will cashflow very well so I can build it for that. I hear ya. I just looked on MLS the other day. And that’s you can buy a nice townhouse for 200. And, you know, I have a buddy, he just built a brand new single family house with a garage suite. So this is a new phenomenon in Edmonton. So get the house, you get the detached garage, then you have a suite on top of this, though, I think he’s getting like something like 4000 a month for rent on this thing. And the whole build everything to build it was around 500,000. So very decent cash flow on a new build. 

 

Erwin  

So hang on 4000 for the whole thing? 

 

Cory  

Yeah, I think he’s getting something like something like 2500 for the house and then 1500 For the garage space. 

 

Erwin  

Got it. 

 

Cory  

I’m not sure if he’s renting the garage space separately, but it’s for the whole basically lot with everything right. But he can’t find cashflow deals like that in Kelowna. You know, it’s our it’s very difficult. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah. From what you tell me a Kelowna it sounds a lot similar to the Greater Toronto Area. Yeah, it’s tough. It’s really tough to cash flow. Yeah, very cool. Well, Cory, thank you so much for your time, and anything else to share or other recordings available for your conference? Yeah, so unfortunately, for listeners benefit, like Cory mentioned, by the time this comes out, this will be after after Summit.

 

Cory  

There’s definitely going to be recordings available. So I’ll make sure I have the link for you. It’s just, it’s just the real estate outlook.com is where you can go to find it. So the replays are going to be available. And yeah, so there’s gonna be a lot of good speakers. So anybody if they want information, or if they’re curious about where the housing market is going, I’ve got 12 Great speakers, 12 different, completely different perspectives on where the housing market is going to go in different strategies, you know, all the way from, you know, from rent to own, I got people doing new builds, I got presale pre sale construction, some people are getting in pre sales, because that’s another way to get in, you know, creative, you know, be creative is the is the advice now, you know, it’s you’re not just going to go to MLS and, you know, find a property, there’s definitely different ways to go about it. I still believe hiring a realtor to represent your best interest is the best way to go when you’re looking. But I mean, you have to be creative these days. You know, it’s not the same market as it was. 

 

Erwin  

You have anyone bearish on on the market, among your speakers, maybe you can find CMHC maybe you can go get the unsettle president of CMHC they’ll tell you what’s what.

 

Cory  

Yeah, no kidding. They’re all pretty pretty bearish, actually. Mike, Mike is Mike is really bearish too, especially on Mike bug on Saskatchewan. Definitely. But I mean, Rachel Oliver, she does rent to own in Ontario. And she’s very bullish on the market as well. You know, nobody thinks we’re gonna see an outright crash. We’re gonna see things change, just because we’re expecting so many new Canadians to come in Looking for housing, 

 

Erwin  

Million job vacancies? 

 

Cory  

Yeah, yeah, exactly. That too.

 

Erwin  

And rising a million and rising for the next 10 years. Yeah. Yeah. So so when people? Yeah, so even your circles when people complain about immigrants, like, you know, you know, when you go to the hospital, they don’t have enough staff? You know, that’s problem. We’re gonna find these people, right? 

 

Cory  

Well, the government needs to do more to recognise their, their foreign credentials. You know, like, yeah, that’s crazy. My wife went through that she she actually got her, she came from the centre of Central Asia, and she got her certifications recognised, and then became employed with the Alberta government, but a lot for a lot of careers. If you’re in the medical industry, for example, it’s it’s very hard, you basically have to take your education, you know, all over again. So I think the government has to really step up and start recognising foreign credentials if they’re going to fill these vacancies. I think that’s a huge problem.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, for example, like a 20. Year nurse, I think we need to teach them your processes, but the stuff that different. Yeah, right. 

 

Cory  

Now, good example. 

 

Erwin  

Maybe they could learn a little bit on the job. Maybe they can have some less sensitive jobs, and then our Canadian Nurses can have the more sensitive jobs.

 

Cory  

Yeah, yeah. Definitely huge shortages there.

 

Erwin  

It’s not going to change until we have immigration. And yeah, you know, it’s called The Great resignation. I’m sure some people are sitting at sitting at the south sitting out the workforce. But yeah, the lack of immigration over the last during the pandemic, I think is what really hurt us. And then hopefully, I can catch up. Calm down some of this inflation, 

 

Cory  

A great resignation. Let’s get right to it, doesn’t it?

 

Erwin  

Yeah, sounds so dramatic.

 

Cory  

But the great reset

 

Erwin  

Oh, Let’s not go there. Actually, do you want to talk about that your Summit? Sorry, is there any talk about great, great reset at your Summit?

 

Cory  

No, no, we’re just, it’s basically, you know, how we how we give people hope, you know, and I talk about people’s the success they’ve had in the last two years, because a lot of people don’t know other people’s stories. So everyone has had a lot of success in real estate doing a variety of different things during the pandemic. So it’s okay, what have you done? And what would you suggest to someone just coming in now, what would work either to get into the housing market? Or what would you invest in? So that’s kind of what it’s based on? Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

Anyone who just held a piece of real estate should have done pretty well. Anything, anything, you had to be better than nothing.

 

Cory  

Yeah, I think that’s great. I mean, I wish I would have done that here. But I mean, the advice going forward, I don’t know if that’s gonna work out at least as well as it has. But who knows?

 

Erwin  

Cory? Have a great weekend. Thanks again for doing this. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, thanks, Erwin. And I appreciate you having me on your show. 

 

Erwin  

Thanks again.

 

Erwin  

Before you go, if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate from cash flow, but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell, I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

 

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

Trading Condos for Multifamily Rental Properties with Georges El Masri

Greetings friends!

Since 2016, I’ve invited investors of varying success onto this show, the Truth About Real Estate Investing Show, including some mega-successful like Grant Cardone, Don Campbell, Dmitry Buterin and several everyday investors; Some just starting out, some our clients and many were able to create 7 figure net worths.

 
 
 
 
 
View this post on Instagram
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Apologies for my ramblings; by the time you listen to this, I will have turned 43 years old. It’s my third birthday since the pandemic began and the celebrations will remain muted, which is fine by me. 

We had a family dinner that was a bit over the top – Peking Duck and Portuguese scorpionfish and lobster and steak. 

Cherry paid for an Apple Watch and let me pick it out. I’ve always wanted one but could never justify spending that kind of money. To me, those are the perfect types of gifts, stuff people want but wouldn’t pay for it.

My brother is also taking me to the Leaf’s game vs. the New Jersey Devils, but what’s super awesome is Mark Giordano, our new deadline trade acquisition, will be making his debut which is exciting.  That reminds me, I need to make dinner reservations. Lol.

Yup. I don’t need much. 

We just returned from a March Break ski trip in Muskoka, and we all had a blast.  Andy Tran and family joined us for a couple of days, and it was great to chat with someone so like-minded about what’s happening in the world and how we investors should prepare for it.  

It’s no secret either, there is a method to my madness in the guests I’ve hosted on this show and Cherry, and I are quite transparent with our investments.

Andy even updated me with the latest on garden suiting, aka building an addition or separate tiny home in the backyard of our investment properties to rent out as an apartment. This is what I’m advising my team and clients as the next leg up in real estate prices, as we saw in Vancouver when laneway houses were first approved.

It’s not all roses, though. The real estate market looks like it’s taking a pause or a breath. More listings are coming out, fewer of them are holding offers, some that did remain available after offer dates. 

We could see a dip like 2017, which will present a great buying opportunity.  We’ll go into more detail are our monthly real estate meetups. We are back in person, meeting up, so you don’t want to miss out! 

If you’re on my email list, you know how to register. If you’re not, well, that’s just silly. Go to www.truthaboutrealestateinvesting.ca, enter your name and email address, and you’ll be good to go!

Trading Condos for Multifamily Rental Properties with Georges El Masri

Georges and I used to work at the same real estate brokerage called Rock Star Real Estate, owned by my good friends Tom and Nick Karadza. Although I’m still at Rock Star, Georges has moved on to Keller Williams.

He’s on the show today to share his journey from getting fired from his first job out of University and transitioning into real estate full time.

He’s hustling, as you’ll hear from the interview.  He’s driving around and targeting small multifamily properties to acquire with partners. He shares how she sold his wife’s home, a condo, during the pandemics and used the proceeds for two multifamily properties.

Georges also shares how he’s finding deals, the strategies used and the success rate.  

No, it’s not easy, even though Georges makes it look easy, and that’s what this show is about, sharing the truths about real estate investing. 

It’s not all roses, but those with the hustle and resiliency will win out.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

 

Audio Transcript

Erwin
Greetings friends welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show hosted by me Erwin Szeto. Where since 2016, where we’ve invited on the show investors of varying success, including some mega successful folks, like Grant Cardone, best seeling author, Don Campbell, Dmitry Buterin and has recently and several everyday investors as well. Some just starting out some of my clients, many of whom are were able to create seven, seven figures of net worth.

Erwin
Apologies for my ramblings, second time you listen to this, I will have turned 43 years old. This will be my third birthday since the pandemic began and celebrations will remain muted, which is fine by me. We had a family dinner that was bit over the top in terms of what we get back Portuguese scorpion fish, lobster and steak yes all in one seat. Cherry paid for an Apple Watch for me for my birthday present. Actually, let me pick it out though because I’m picky. There’s a lot configurations to choose from. I’ve always wanted one an Apple watch that is can never justify paying that kind of money for what’s mostly a toy. That to me, those are the perfect types of gifts. Stuff People want to pay money for. Speaking of my brother, he’s taking me to lease game versus the New Jersey Devils. But what’s super awesome is Mark to Dino our new deadline trade acquisition, we making his debut which is exciting. That reminds me I need to make your dinner reservations. And yet the rich food court keep things simple and cheap. I don’t need much. We did just returned from a March Break ski trip in Muskoka. And we all had a blast, Andy Tran and his family joined us for a couple days. And it was great to chat with someone who’s so like minded about what’s happening in the world, and how investors should prepare for it. It’s several ideas several crazy interesting and likely quality ideas. It’s no secret either. There is a method to my madness and the guests that we have on the show and Cherry and I are honestly quite transparent our investments are doing with our money we think the best thing to do is a crazy thought in training even updated me on the latest in garden suiting during our trip a building in addition or tiny home in the backyard apartments and properties to rent a separate apartment apartment. This is what I’m inviting my team and my clients is the next leg up real estate prices like we saw in Vancouver with laneway houses were first approved. It is not all roses out there in the real estate market though, it does look like we’re taking a pause or a bit of a breath here. More listings are coming out. fewer of them are holding offers because some of them remain on the market after offer dates, we could see a dip that 2017 Which to me is just presents a great buying opportunity and likely the only buying opportunity would get for the next 5,10 years beyond that. We’ll go into more detail at our monthly real estate meetups as of course. We are back in person meeting up so you don’t want to miss out from my understanding people are tired of COVID and what to do back to back in person meetings. If you’re on my meal email list and you know how to register if you’re not well, that’s just silly. You can go to www.truthaboutreal estateinvesting.ca. Just enter your name and email address. You’re good to go!

Erwin
On to the show, George and I used to work at the same real estate brokerage called Rock Star real estate owned by my good friends Tom and Nick Karadza. I’m still a rock star and George has since moved on to Keller Williams, which is totally cool. He is on the show today to share his journey from getting fired from his first job out of university interested in transitioning into real estate full time as an investor and realtor. He’s hustling and you’ll hear from his interview, he’s driving around and targeting small multifamily properties to acquire with his partners. He shares how he sold his wife’s home, which was a condo during the pandemic and use the proceeds to buy two multifamily properties for a total of seven doors in St. Catharines, Ontario, Jordan shares how he’s finding deals, we get really specific specific, because you know, the point of the show is learn. So I’m going to ask detailed questions, how he do it, so that we all repeat the same success. And yeah, this is the show The show is about truth about real estate investing. So I do ask himm about success rate as well. What kind of success rate in the strategies so that we only set reasonable expectations? No, it’s not easy, but it’s worth it. GEORGE does make it look easy, though. That’s why he’s on the show. Sharing the truth about real estate investing. Again, it’s not all roses out there. It’s not easy money by any means. But with hustle and resiliency. You know, like, please enjoy the show.

Erwin
Georges?

Georges
Georges. Yeah, sure.

Erwin
We spent some time working on your name before the show.

Georges
Yeah, no, it’s not. It’s not the simplest name, I’m sure.

Erwin
Oh, dude we look you’re talking to me? It’s always been a thing a thing for me too, because it’s in the book, Win Friends and Influence People get people names right? Yeah. Right first of all know their name. Yeah. And then even better said how they say it.

Georges
Yeah. Well, just to clarify for anyone listening if you ever meet a George and there’s an S at the end it’s silent. It’s the French spelling.

Erwin
Right? Let’s American then. Yes. I don’t like he’s we’re talking about like Georgia St. Pierre like, Yeah, I’ve seen American St. Georges. us know, I’ve seen saw seen lots of people.

Georges
Yeah, which is incorrect. Yeah. And whether you’re American or anything else, that’s not the right way to say it.

Erwin
All right. So how do you say your name full name?

Georges
Georges El Masri is the way I would say it, I don’t know if you want to hear the Arabic version of it.

Erwin
I like the Arabic version.

Georges
The Arabic version if you were to say it legitimately would be Georges El Masri. Don’t Don’t try to search for Romania. George, yeah. Yeah. I’m named after my grandfather.

Erwin
This is the same grandfather we were talking about?

Georges
No different

Erwin
Okay. We’ll get to that. Yeah. So what’s keeping you busy these days?

Georges
Keeping busy we have a baby at home. So I’m a new dad just getting used to all that getting back into working out to had a little little break from that when he was born. It was kind of hard to to have the energy to do that. But yeah, been running a little bit set up a little gym at home, going back to lifting and working hard on on the investments. We’ve got a bunch of renovations happening. We have some some townhomes that we tied up in welland that we have under contract. So bunch of stuff.

Erwin
So you had I was doing the math in my head. That’s when he was my shop. So give it a pandemic, baby.

Georges
Yeah, we did. Yeah.

Erwin
How is having a baby in the pandemic?

Georges
For the most part, it was fine. The only thing was the hospitals really short staffed. So when we were when my wife was in labour, she didn’t get like she didn’t get the epidural right away. They had to kind of wait and then it was painful for her. And you know, it’s a little bit more challenging when the they’re short staffed. Right.

Erwin
I remember when Cherry before she got her epidural, she had my hand for our first child when Robin was being born. As wear my wedding ring I don’t wear I rarely wear just for I have eczema. So that’s why I can’t wear a lot of jewellery. She had it, she got a hold my hand, the contraction came and she found the way to manipulate my hand to make to maximise the pain. And I was not going to say anything. Yeah. Cuz I did not deserve any empathy.

Georges
Yeah, for me was a little different. She was like, in so much pain that I felt bad for her. Yeah, like, I wasn’t even worried about anything other than like, Oh, I hope you’re okay, you know, this looks like it’s really excruciatingly painful.

Erwin
I remember being at the the prenatal classes where they teach you like breathing technique and stuff for like, natural birth. And then I was like, I put my hand up. Because, you know, I’m not the brightest. So I have questions. So I asked the nurse who’s given the lesson? How many people get the take the epidural versus natural? She was over 90% of the epidural. Yeah, like, Okay, well, we need to pay attention, just like the epidural.

Georges
We can hear women from the next room screaming. It was the loudest scream. I’ve heard from like three different women after our son was born. And it was obvious they didn’t have the epidural. It was crazy.

Erwin
There’s no doubt to me with the stronger sexes. Happy International Women’s month this is. So how’s the investment going? Can you start with? What was your motivation? So I take us back to the year you started getting motivated to buy real estate.

Georges
Yeah, I think I’m going to start a little bit before that because I think it’s a kind of cool part of my journey. But when I was studying at U of T, I had this part time job. I was working for a tech company called Flip. I don’t know if you’ve seen it, you know, the app where you can kind of like, look to see what’s on sale at different stores, whatever. So anyway, I worked for them.

Erwin
And oh, cool, like a retail Groupon.

Georges
Yeah, it’s similar to that. But like, let’s say you’re looking for a chicken that’s on sale at different grocery stores. You just pop in chicken, and then they’ll show you all the stories that have been on sale that week.

Erwin
Are they still around?

Georges
Yeah, yeah. They’re one of the top apps, I think, on the Apple App Store or whatever. But anyway, after graduating, I just took the easy route. They offered me a full time position accepted, even though I didn’t really like what I was doing. The company’s great, but I just wasn’t happy. And after working there for a couple months, I think they noticed that I wasn’t too happy doing what I was doing. And they called me in 4:55pm on a Friday. Oh, no, I get the phone call at my desk. And I’m like, Okay, I know what’s about to happen. I walk in the lawyers there. He’s got the documents in front of them. The managers there and they very nicely, let me go. So I felt like a huge like weight off my shoulders. I just felt although I was kind of you know, nervous about not having a job and whatever. It gave me an opportunity to really reflect and think about what I want to do and it took me a couple months but I realised I wanted to be in real estate and my intention was to invest. That was always kind of like since I was a I had this idea of owning homes and renting them out and whatever. So, yeah, I got my licence. This was in 2013. And I started in I think 2016 really considering buying because I had some income now and a bit of a track record. So I just reached out to a bunch of people, like I Googled, we buy houses, whatever, I was just trying to get in touch with investors. I called like, 10 people, they all turned me down. Nobody wanted anything to do with me, except one person. I had lunch with that person, hs named Sandy Mackay, by the way. He he was nice enough to like, sit down with me. And tell me about the BRRR strategy. And from that point on, I was like, Wow, this makes so much sense. I’m going to do this. And I bought my first rental in 2017 and Hamilton, little fixer upper for 215,002 and a half storey detached home, still have it to this day and kind of just kept going from there, refinanced it and moved on.

Erwin
Who gave you the idea, like not many kids think about owning real estate?

Georges
My mom, my mom, I remember as a kid, she just said, Hey, did you know that some people buy homes, and then they rent them out and the rent they get covers the mortgage payment? Really, you can do that. Cool. And then I just kind of you know, let the idea slide and later on, ended up doing that, right.

Erwin
Did she own investment property?

Georges
No, my parents never owned a rental. Actually sorry, no, they they had they bought a condo in Lebanon at some point, which they were gonna they were thinking about, like maybe moving to when they retire or whatever. And they rented that place out. But that was the only only rental experience they have. Right? Yeah.

Erwin
So you have your roots in Lebanon. You’re not just like, you know, OG Canadian. But the name like alabaster?

Georges
Yeah, yeah. So I was born here, born and raised in Canada always lived here. But my parents left because of the conditions in Lebanon back in the civil war broke out in 1975. And my parents were both really young at that point. It was really tough for them. Like they grew up with people killing each other, and missiles going off. You know, my mom lived close to Beirut, close to the Capitol. And it was really tough for her as a kid, she I think she still like has trauma from her childhood. So yeah, they decided to leave in 89 came to Canada, and I was born a year later.

Erwin
Any parallels to what a route was like to today’s world?

Georges
You know, I don’t really know like, personally, I don’t I it was a political thing. There were political parties that were, you know, going to war with each other. And there was also some religious aspects to it. So I guess there would be but I’m like, I’m not really a political person. I don’t I don’t understand too much of what’s going on today. I don’t I don’t read too much about it. So I can’t say other than what I just shared.

Erwin
So So Civil War, so his fellow country people, yeah, fighting because they have different ideals in religion?

Georges
Different religions, different political beliefs. So yeah, like, it got to a point where, basically, if you entered, sir, because they have checkpoints in Lebanon, and that they’re short soldiers that are carrying like these rifles and whatever. I think my dad was telling me that at some points during the war, if you went to certain pockets in Lebanon, and you said your name, and let’s say you had a Christian name, then you might get killed. Right there. You know, it’s it was crazy. Like, just to just to think.

Erwin
Seems like a nice place to raise a family.

Georges
Yeah, definitely not.

Erwin
Lucky for you to be Canadian.

Georges
I’m definitely grateful. Yeah, it’s, it’s totally different. I never had, I mean, the only experience I know I’m kind of rambling here. Just let me know if I’m talking too much. But um, the only experience I have that’s somewhat related to my parents experience was we went on a trip on a vacation to Lebanon, I think it was in 2006 or 2007. And a war broke out between Lebanon, Israel. So there were actually like missiles launched towards Lebanon, and we would hear them and we were terrified because I was a young kid. I was like, I don’t know. 15,16 years old. Yeah. So I remember we had to take a, like Canada, the Canadian Embassy sent a ship to take us to Cyprus to evacuate us because they had bombed the airport, we couldn’t fly out. When we went to Cyprus. At one point, we were staying in this place with a bunch of other Lebanese Canadians. And the lid of a garbage bin dropped. And it was a loud sound. And I just remember kind of being scared like, oh my god, or there are the bombing this area too. So that was like the only traumatic experience that I had, that I can kind of relate to my parents. But that was it. Nothing, right. Like in Canada, you don’t ever experience anything like that.

Erwin
I had my air pods in the other night. And Putin had just declared war on Ukraine. And then I don’t know what time in the morning, but that emerged another emergency, you know, Amber Alert. Yeah. And that’s all I hear like, Oh my god. Putin’s probably doing some shit. By launching a missile, because you know, you get waking up at 4am in the morning, you’re from a deep sleep. You’re not rational. Yeah, for sure. That’s That’s my closest to so grateful to be living here.

Georges
Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Erwin
So you shared before we were recording you talked about your your grandfather still lives in Lebanon.

Georges
He recently passed away. But yeah, yeah, he was there his entire life. Yeah. Right.

Erwin
And he had saving his life savings were in the local currency.

Georges
Yeah, yeah, that’s crazy. My grandma used to be a saver, she saved all her life. And they were living off of their savings. So they were, they had their money in the Lebanese currency. And they were earning an interest. And I think they were living off the interest that they were earning. But Lebanon experienced hyperinflation, I think around two years ago, it started. So whatever money they had, basically became worthless, almost worthless. So my grandfather who was counting on this money to live out the rest of his life, now everybody’s worried, is he gonna have enough, you know, cuz he’s only got like, maybe he was able to survive for five years from the money before 5,10 years. But now he’s only got a couple months left. So it was a very scary thing and makes you realise how important it is to have assets have something to counterbalance against inflation. I don’t know if we would ever I don’t know if we would experience hyperinflation here with the Canadian currency, but you never know. Right? You got to protect yourself right?

Erwin
Before recording, we’re talking about like hyperinflation versus inflation. Yeah. Because, you know, Canada’s law, we’ve spent a lot in the pandemic, I think, rightfully, and then we’re gonna experience inflation. And I keep reading headlines that we’re we’re investing or donating military resources to Ukraine. This is all gonna cost money. Yeah, someone’s got to pay for it. Yeah. Right. I’m not gonna argue right or wrong. But just, there’s going to be inflation, more than ever. And, yeah, so of course, no one gets their questions in advance. Yeah. How would you advise your grandparents to invest?

Georges
I don’t know. It’s, it’s a little bit tough for me to say what they should have done over there, like, or even translate the other way.

Georges
I always like to translate. The usual question I usually ask is, What are you teaching your kids? Yeah, I know, you can’t really have that conversation today. But looking back, before I’ll answer your first question, looking back, I think they would have been much better off had they converted their Lebanese currency to US dollars, because US Dollars are accepted in Lebanon. So that would have been a lot safer for them. I don’t know. Maybe they couldn’t have invested the US dollars in Lebanon turn an interest? Maybe that’s why they didn’t do it. But the treasury bills 2%. Yeah, yeah, anything would have been better than what they had. But for my kids, I mean, I just have the one the one right now. But I want to make sure he understands that saving for your entire life, and then living off those savings. That’s not a very strategic way to live in this day and age. And you have to get creative and find other ways. And don’t worry about what most people are they’re doing or what most people are doing. Just do what is strategically make sense for you and maybe follow our model, right? Because we’re we’re doing pretty well with our investments. So yeah.

Erwin
Statistically, most people won’t be able to ever retire. Now, if you don’t have a pension, then then there’s different quality of pensions. So not all pensions are good. But yeah, statistically, I think it’s somewhere around two thirds, two thirds of teens will never be able to afford to retire. So don’t do what most people do.

Georges
Yeah, for sure. For sure. I don’t know why people just like if most people are doing it, you just feel like it’s the right thing to do kind of like what you said, when you said 90% of people are getting the epidural. So you’re like, oh, okay, let’s do it. That’s a different situation. But when it comes to finances, that’s not not a very good way to go about it.

Erwin
Well, the I brought up the epidural thing is like, I don’t think most people know what most people do. Yeah. So ask questions. Yeah. And like, for example, if you want to be rich, find out what rich people do. Yeah. Yeah. But we talked about most people, most people say they want to be rich, they’re not willing to put in the work.

Georges
And it’s not just that, I think a lot of times fear gets in the way because you have to take a risk when you’re investing. And I guess maybe sometimes people need more a lot of information before they can take action. And one thing that I think I’ve been either lucky or stupid and doing is that I don’t I’ve never had too much information that I was just reflecting on this but every single real estate investment I’ve purchased so far, I felt like I wasn’t ready for it in that moment. You know, like you’d never be ready yeah, you just you just do it and it somehow doors open. Like I’ve experienced it so many times where I didn’t feel like I had everything in place but I committed to it and like the doors just open for me. Obviously I took took action but it just works out all right.

Erwin
The analogy I give is no different having your first kid. Yeah, you’re never going to be ready. Yeah, you know, I’m talking Yeah, you’re sure you’re never be fully prepared.

Georges
You can read all the books you want when that baby comes There’s gonna be a lot of surprises yet…

Erwin
You can be as rich as you want, you still won’t be fully prepared. Yeah, that’s true. She’s things do not go smoothly. Yeah.

Georges
But that’s that’s what separates people being able to figure it out. I think that that makes a big difference. Like if you have obstacles in the way some people might walk away or might be afraid, but I think people who are successful, take on those obstacles and just move forward. It’s not just being just not knowing that you can take it on. It’s also knowing that you’ll figure it out.

Erwin
Yeah, just no different than the analogy of having your first kid. You’ll figure it out. Yeah. It’s not like all these booklets, not like all these people have failed as parents. Yeah. It’s not rocket science. You will figure it out. Yeah. And how did people figure it out? It takes a village. Yeah. That’s the beautiful thing about the investor community. Like we are a village and we’re very open. You have a podcast, I have a podcast. Like when we started, there were no free resources. Yeah. That were quality. You still You said you’d all these people turn you down to teach you. Yeah. Versus we just give the stuff away for free. Yeah.

Georges
And yeah, that was funny. That reminds me one of those guys I think is like website was Mr. Nice Guy, real estate buyer or something. And he yelled at me because I called him he’s like, Do you have a house to sell? I was like, No, I’m just trying to learn for you. Is it good? Don’t call me again. He just hung up on me. I don’t remember what it was. Exactly. It was something along those lines was the nicest salesperson.

Erwin
I know who it is. Do you know who it is? Or not?

Georges
I don’t even know who it is. So I never had I never spoke to him again.

Erwin
Okay. Yeah, I think I know who it is. False advertising. You want to talk about your wife’s condo? Yeah. Tell me Tell me about your wife’s condo.

Georges
Yeah, she she bought a condo few years ago that she lived in. And North York by the subway line. Nice building nice place. When we moved in together. She rented her condo. And then when the pandemic hit, I don’t know if you remember this. But there was a time where rents just dropped in Toronto. The drop significantly. So the tenant that was there was like, hey, I can just move to another building down the street or even in this building. Yeah, yeah. And pay like 600 bucks less a month. So I’m leaving.

Erwin
What percentage? Is that? Like a like a third. I didn’t drop.

Georges
She had it rented for like, 2300. And they went down to like, 1700.

Erwin
That’s pretty good. But yeah, big drop. Yeah.

Georges
So yeah, he left and then we just got together. And we’re like, hey, what do you think we should do? Because if you’re renting right now, for 1700, it’s gonna cashflow negative, we’re gonna have to be paying out of pocket and who knows what’s gonna happen with the market. So we decided to let’s sell it. So we put it on the market, got a decent price for it. And we took that money. And we bought a four Plex in St. Catharines. We ended up doing really well on that four Plex, we also used some of the sales proceeds, and we put it into a triplex and Hamilton. So we basically were able to take her her condo, and essentially turn it into seven units. And that was so beneficial for us. So I think it’s just, it’s just an idea for some people who might have a rental condo. I think if you keep an open mind, you can end up doing a lot better by reinvesting your funds into something different. Everybody’s different, but that was our experience.

Erwin
So this is a conversation I have with many new investors. Yeah. I think part of the first level of challenge is often that, let’s let’s take a step back in my own head. Sorry, there’s a lot of realtors who just focus on pre construction condos, because to be honest, they pay very well. And you have a large supply of them to sell. Yeah, right. Which versus when we do regular real estate, there’s not much supply. No, right? It’s a very, it’s a very lucrative business. Most of the most successful realtors are in the industry. For like you and I, we want scale. So we’re often having to educate investors around that, including my dad, who does buy new construction condos. So when we’re comparing investments, he says, oh, like my condo did just as well as your duplex, like no dad. Because I get all this extra rent. I can refinance that house and go buy another Yeah, you will never be able to do that with your condo. Yeah. And then also my next leg up is I mean with the guard, maybe the garden suite, some of these duplexes? Yeah, yeah, right. I’ll be able to add more more value to it. I’ll be able to cash 1000 bucks a month. Now again, my credit will look better. And I can go buy another house. Yeah, right. You can’t scale your new construction condo portfolio. Right. And you’re just your example exactly that because what could you have done with that condo? If you held it? You just wait. That’s it.

Georges
But yeah, you’re waiting but like in that situation? We’d be we would have been short 200 bucks a month. Yeah.

Erwin
You would have been fine. Yeah, we would have been okay, I’d rather but you did. Yeah. Uh, yeah, if you run for the person who’s willing to hustle, right? I always tell people there’s nothing wrong with owning preconstruction condo. And if that’s your goal for someone wants to hustle and scale, then that’s not going to work.

Georges
Well also if you want to compare values, so let’s say that condo today, okay, she sold it, or we sold it, I think for 530 or something at the time lesson a pretty nice condo. Yeah, yeah, it was one plus 10. And then we bought the four Plex in St. Catharines. For 465. The legal fourplex we refinance that four Plex a year later for 840. So we did some work to it. Like we renovated two of the units, actually, sorry, three of the units we renovated. So we put some money into it. Yeah, 840. If you look at like even today, I don’t think that condo is worth 840 Today, I think it’s worth less it’s probably worth 750 would be my guess somewhere in that range.

Erwin
Can you rewind the condo? Can you share what you originally paid for it?

Georges
I think she paid maybe 425 or something in that range.

Erwin
So still fantastic investment.

Georges
Yeah.

Erwin
Alright, so just to recap the condo north, you’re paid around for 25 as a pre con pre K.

Georges
No it wasn’t pre con it was like Sorry, relatively new was like three years old. Just kidding at the time.

Erwin
Yeah. Yeah. Nice. Time to get it.

Georges
Yeah.

Erwin
So bought 425 sold for 530. Yeah, in a pandemic.

Georges
In the pandemic at the height, like just maybe three months before we sold it. It was worth like, 570-560-5570 came down. Yeah. Yeah.

Erwin
And you decide to put more money in the real estate market?

Georges
Yeah. Yeah. Cuz I had seen what was going on, because I had sorry, and we’re kind of jumping all over the place. But I had bought a place in well, and that did really well as well. So I’m like, Hey, let’s just take this money, put it in that area where we’re doing well, there. So but yeah, anyways, keep going with your numbers.

Erwin
I think I’m good. So I paid 425. It went up in value to 570. Because the market was hot. Yeah. And pandemic hit. Yeah. But yeah, condos were among probably the worst performing asset during that time. And then for anyone who listened to me, I was saying, you know, while we’re early pandemic, like, to me the best investment is condos and student rentals. Yeah. And even if you can’t buy a condo, if you’re a renter, like go rent something, lock it lock up that new rent. Yeah. And that would have worked out well. Because if someone who rented if someone got that rented your condo for 1700. Lock that in?

Georges
Yeah. Yeah, we would have been stuck. And that tenant probably wouldn’t leave me to see what rents are now. Yeah.

Erwin
Wouldn’t for the tenant. Sucks to be because the market rent was likely bounced back.

Georges
I think it has Yeah, yeah. I’m pretty sure like, I don’t really monitor that area too much. I’m not really in that market. But last time I checked, it was a lot higher than 1700. or

Erwin
Pretty close to previous.

Georges
I think so. Yeah. I think it was in the mid 2000s. Maybe low to mid 2000s. Yeah.

Erwin
Because we’re seeing it now. I’m seeing a lot of headlines about the back to work. Yeah, people are being asked to go back to work. Yeah. So let’s see lots of pain on that.

Georges
Oh, yeah. And condos are hot right now. Like we had a client that was looking for a condo we looked in Vaughan, Mississauga, Oakville, everything had multiple offers on it. So we know that that condos are back now is just, you know, like for our model, we prefer these multis, it’s it just works better for us.

Erwin
Yeah, again, is I need I need higher rents to in order to be able to get refinancing. Get more.

Georges
Yeah, it’s more sustainable over time.

Erwin
For growth.

Georges
Yeah, right. Yeah.

Erwin
Yeah, cuz the condo models not gonna work for growth unless your your income is exponential, like our real estate is.

Georges
Yeah. Yeah, that’s true.

Erwin
Cool. Cool. What’s your wife think about all this? She’s supportive. Imagine Yeah, she sold her house. She sold her home.

Georges
I sold mine too, by the way. Just just to be fair to live in the triplex four Plex? No, we don’t live in it. I sold I had bought this little bungalow in Hamilton in a pretty bad area. North End. But yeah, so I had this place and I had it rented for 1350. Then we were just kind of looking over everything and I’m like, Hey, I lived in this place for a bit but it doesn’t really make sense for us to keep it as a rental anymore. So ended up selling it got a good price and dumped a bunch of that the sales proceeds into a renovation that we had going on I one of our multis, so I’m not just telling her what to do. I’m kind of doing it myself, too. So yeah,

Erwin
Where do you live now?

Georges
We live in Brampton.

Erwin
Bounced around.

Georges
I grew up in Brampton, my wife’s family’s in Woodbridge. So she wanted Brampton because it’s close to my family and close to her family. I didn’t want to be encrypted. If it were up to me, I would have been in Oakland.

Erwin
Not bad. I’m obviously biassed. Yeah. So what other investments do you do? Actually, let’s go let’s killing to deal with this with this real estate. So what’s the plan now? Are you looking to buy more Multis?

Georges
Yeah, the goal is to buy some more Multis. We have a cash flow goal that we want net cash flow.

Erwin
Would you share?

Georges
yeah, our goal is to get to 15,000 a month in net positive cash flow.

Erwin
Can you share where you’re at now?

Georges
It’s kind of hard to say we’re not because we have a bunch of vacant units. Like we I have one building a five Plex that’s completely empty because we’re renovating it. We have a triplex that has two empty units. So if I gave you what our cashflow is now owed wouldn’t be terrible.

Erwin
In the last year, well, thanks. Appreciate sharing, because that’s the reality of a growing portfolio. Yeah, no, definitely like a growing growth stock. Like, say, robots, for example. They don’t make any money. Yeah, they’re supposed to grow. Right? Like you’re just doing your growth stage not expected that cash flow.

Georges
Not right now.

Erwin
You’re speaking to negative cash flow?

Georges
Yeah. Yeah. It’s kind of challenging in that sense. Because like, when you have a five Plex that’s totally empty for months and months, because you’re renovating it. It’s not easy. But you have to set money aside for that kind of thing. Right. But yeah, I think it’s important to say there’s all this glamour around having cashflow. And some people think, well, I’ll just replace my income right away. I think it takes a couple years before you get to that point. And you’ve got a depends on what kind of properties you’re buying, but we’re buying fixer uppers and those ones, it takes a few years to really get them to perform at their highest level. So something to keep in mind for investors.

Erwin
Can you share how you you’re finding these deals?

Georges
So some of the ones that we found a couple years, two years ago, roughly, I did a marketing campaign directly to owners. And we picked up the the five Plex that I just mentioned in well in we picked up the four Plex in St. Catharines. That way, sometimes we find deals straight off the MLS. And recently I actually picked up a nice deal off another realtor, an exclusive or a pocket listing. I got four side by side townhomes freehold with a 73%, VTB 1% interest.

Erwin
Sorry, he owned these who did the realtor own the more and all his or her client? Yeah. And they’re willing to give up the VTB. Yeah, in this market?

Georges
Yeah. Yeah, that’s pretty crazy.

Erwin
What was the motivation that they would take a VTB?

Georges
The rents were really low. And the owner owns a lot of real estate. So he understands the game. And he just said, like, I’ll do it for one year. I’ll help you out. Because I know there’s a lot of work to be done here. So I think that was the motivation. He was kind of helping out. Your fellow investor.

Erwin
Isn’t it nice to work with people to speak the same language?

Georges
Yeah, it’s awesome. I love it.

Erwin
And let’s just let’s, let’s give some context. How you Realtors you think know what VTB is level negotiate? One? I’ve actually negotiated.

Georges
I think a lot of them have heard of it, but they don’t understand it. I’d say like 95% of Realtors don’t understand it yet.

Erwin
So they’re naturally going to be afraid of it.

Georges
Yeah, for sure. They’re gonna, they’re just gonna say no, you’ll be like, Have you even discussed this with the client?

Erwin
Lawyer and the lawyer is gonna say no to yes.

Georges
It’s true.

Erwin
That’s awesome. Sorry, when you mentioned them, when you send the marketing campaign to owners of fire. Google AdWords.

Georges
It was a flyer.

Erwin
So very targeted, like you dropped people in the door.

Georges
Like, yeah, actually sent to in the mail. Yeah. So what I like to do sometimes I used to do this, maybe more, but I would just drive around, pick out certain properties that I liked. Either drop off a flyer or mail it to them.

Erwin
Driving for dollars.

Georges
Yeah. Yeah. So that I’ve had some good success with that kind of thing. Nice. Yeah. Cool.

Erwin
Do you do this for clients too?

Georges
No.

Erwin
That’s what people need to understand that how much work this is. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Because you’re investing a lot of time. Yeah, to do this. And then it’s not like these deals match to this happen. You someone flyer doesn’t deal with this happen. Right? Like, how long does it take to do a deal? Can you share some metrics? Like how many flyers yet? So you’re driving for dollars as a highly targeted?

Georges
Yeah. Even even with that I still get depending on the campaign, a one or 2% response rate? Yeah, even recently been on the direct flyer. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, yeah. So one to 2%. And then out of those I call, I might get, like, one out of five of those calls, leads to an opportunity because four of them, either the owner is not that motivated. They’re overpricing it, or they’re just curious to know what you’re gonna you know what what price you want to give them tire kickers. Yeah. And then you’ll have that one out of five that’s like, Hey, I’m actually thinking about selling. So yeah. And then you might go over there. And you might see like, this place is in really, really rough shape. And I just, I don’t see how this doesn’t fit my, my portfolio. So it’s pretty rare. Like it does take a lot of work and a lot of screening to get to that one property that you’ll actually buy.

Erwin
So I can’t just offer to pay you a commission and you do this for me.

Georges
I mean, I would do it but I’m not that focused anymore. I’m not as focused on like, just finding deals for other people at this point. I’m finding I’m just reaching, trying to reach our goals for now and I help people along the way, but yeah, it’s kind of a different phase of my life at this point.

Erwin
That’s pretty cool. happy for you guys. I tell I tell beginner Realtors all the time, like people who are interested in getting in. I always start off with, please understand investors make more money than realtors. Yeah. Right. Yeah. If you want to be a realtor, it’s purely cashflow play. Yeah, right. It’s a job. Yeah, it can be very lucrative. But I know lots of real estate investors will make more money than us for sure.

Georges
Yeah, that’s really important to know. Like, I wish more Realtors would understand this and spend more time investing because it’s going to change their lives. I know tunnel.

Erwin
We don’t want them to do that. Then there’s some competition for us.

Georges
It’s yeah, yeah, maybe maybe stick to the north there somewhere like Barry or something. No, I hear all these great things about Sudbury. So yeah, North Bay. But yeah, it kind of makes me sad to see that 75 year old realtor that’s still working because they have to, you know, it’s you’re in the industry, you should be investing at least by one one rental property. But again, it’s harder than it looks like dealing with tenants. You know, we all made mistakes. When we started investing. We’ve all got, we’ve all put ourselves in a position where we had a crappy situation. And it was stressful, and you have to dish out a bunch of money. And then you never make that mistake again. It’s just part of life, right part of investing.

Erwin
Yeah, I have conversations with all these people that want to be entirely passive. So they’ll tell me about, Oh, this guy’s offering this and he’s guaranteeing that rent for however long and I’m like, I don’t trust that guy. Want to just buy a property yourself? buy anything? Yeah. Right? Because I wanted us to call me. Like, do you understand that your worst case scenario versus losing your investment is my worst case scenario? Yeah. If you invest with someone else. Yeah. Like, people just don’t want to put in the effort. Yeah, yeah. The worst case, which is possible, you and I know people who’ve lost all their money on passive investments. Like that doesn’t sound worse than attended calling you. Yeah. Yeah.

Georges
Yeah, they’re both stressful, obviously. But one is worse than the other. But, I mean, you could you could lose everything. If you make big mistakes in real estate investing, like we’ve gone to the tribunal where we’ve experienced a guy who had three separate cases with tenants. And among the three or across all three, he was owed over 100 grand in rent. Like that’s, you’ve gone way too far. If that’s how much rent the tenants oh, you should have filed and hired a paralegal and done it properly. Way before. Don’t let yourself get to that point.

Erwin
But you said it though. Do it properly. Yeah. Yeah. If you’re exposing 200 300 grand, isn’t that worth doing it properly? Yeah. Pay pay a paralegal three grand or whatever. Hire property managers, screen tenants. Yeah. Use. Use landlord credit bureau to screen tenants. Yeah.

Georges
And I was I made that mistake when I started. When I bought my first property. I found the tenants and I did a terrible job. I found really bad tenants. And I had to go to the tribunal and lose 1000s of dollars. And it was part of the experience and I never made that mistake again. I use a property manager now I work very legal. I do everything the way you’re supposed to do it now. And we it’s been so much better, obviously. Right.

Erwin
Sorry. You share you live in Brampton, your property sound like they’re all Hamilton further west of you.

Georges
Yeah. Niagara.

Georges
And so they’re all under Park Management. Okay, so we’re high managing the ongoing stuff, but we have a property management to fill our property manager that fills all our units. Yeah.

Erwin
Anything else you outsource? Are you unplugging toilets? And oh, changing them?

Georges
No. No, I don’t do any of that. We’ve got plumbers, electricians, everything. I don’t want to drive out to well, and to fix it to I don’t even I think it changed the toilet once. It did a terrible job for you if it was in my own house. I put the bolts in the wrong place. And the tank was leaking. And I had spent so much time trying to fix this that toilet. So after that, I said I’m paying somebody to replace toilets for the rest of my life. Never doing it again.

Erwin
Yeah. Anything plumbing related to our high risk if you do it wrong. Yeah. Well, you know, in families, I’ve had leaks and properties that can cause a lot of damage if done wrong. Yeah. Yeah, that’s fine. Don’t mess with it. No, for even in my own home. Maybe if it was in the basement, so like, you know, so it’s near. It’s not that far from a floor drain. Yeah, dare risk it, doing it myself. But yeah, I categorise that with electrical. The worst case is just too much for me for sure.

Georges
Yeah, yeah. But I thought changing a toilet would be easy. And I was like, Hey, I just want to learn how to do this. That’s why I’m just curious. I want to see how hard it is to change a toilet. Right? I don’t want to do it every day.

Erwin
Just watch YouTube.

Georges
Yeah, you can watch YouTube but the bolts I don’t know, it was just too similar bolts. I put them in the wrong place. And it caused the leak. So I have to pay someone like 200 bucks just to replace the bolts later because I rented the house after and the tenants are like, hey, it’s leaking. Okay, so I got to spend 200 bucks on where I could have just done that originally.

Erwin
Wherever you’re lucky as always. 200 even cause any damage. Yeah, like a ceiling leak or something. Yeah. Inexpensive, inexpensive problem. Anything else you wanna chat about?

Georges
Anything else?

Erwin
I want to ask is your realtor. Yeah, we used to be along the same one. Yeah, you left not me because people always ask me if I’m still at rock star. I think you own rock stars. Because of stuff that I’ve said, that implies that I own it. I’m gonna go home rock star real estate and you’ve been to different real estate brokerages. Yeah. So I only bring this up because I know there are aspiring realtors who listen to the show. How did you choose? Where have you been? And how did you choose?

Georges
The first office I went to I picked it. It was a real page office because it was a nice office. They had like glass doors, and nice little offices, whatever. So I was like, Okay, this looks like a nice place to work. I’ll work here. Second place was Rockstar. And I picked it obviously, because it was investor focused. And that was my goal. And I had to fight to get in Nick didn’t want me. I was like, Nick, I’m not taking no for an answer. I just kept pestering him until he said yes. And then I eventually switched because there was a an investor at KW. That was like, recruiting me pretty, pretty heavily. And I really respected this investor. So I wanted to learn from him and be close to him. And that was the reason that I left and then I stayed. I’ve been with kW ever since my wife and my mother in law, they’re both realtors and we all work together and word of the kW and Vaughn. So that’s the reason. But to be honest, rockstars one of the better experiences that I had, I loved the morning meetings, just talking to investors all the time making Tom and Nick’s brains on marketing. They have so much knowledge. It’s an awesome place.

Erwin
Yeah, if you’d stick around, you’re playing some bitcoin.

Georges
Yeah, probably for better or worse. I know. Yeah.

Erwin
Yeah, I appreciate being around Rockstar. And to add to that, you know, be able to talk about economics with Tom and Nick time, you talked about being a business owner with them as well, and then even talking to like, the other successful realtors that are around what they’re seeing in the market. And I don’t have I don’t know what it’s like in other brokerages. That’s why I ask people like yourself, you know, what is the grass really greener on the other side?

Georges
Well, if your goal is just to sell homes and not work with investors, then maybe Rockstar is not the best place like you can find another brokerage that’ll serve you better. But for investment focused, I don’t know if there are too many brokerages that focus on investors other than Rockstar.

Erwin
Maybe small ones that are started by people that we know.

Georges
But yeah, yeah. There’s a couple of maybe I’d Yeah, it’s this one. No, yeah. Cool.

Erwin
And then oh, the your, your wife and your mother in law. Was that more recent? Were you the agent first? Or were they first to be licenced?

Georges
No, they were. They were licenced before me.

Erwin
Oh, you’re recruited these people?

Georges
Yeah. Yeah, they were they were looking for a change. We were all gonna join forces. And yeah, I just told them kW has been good. And I think it offers room to grow. And at first they were so against it, because they were Remax. And, you know, ReMax is all about the marketing and whatever. And they’re like, we can’t change, people aren’t going to work with us anymore. And whatever. And we went had the meeting with kW, and they they liked it. And so.

Erwin
Yeah, that’s interesting, because I mentioned to my marketing team, that we have to push a personal brand. Yeah. Right. Like people don’t even know I worked for a rock star. Yeah. And then some people actually think I own it. That’s a much smaller number. That’s the only thing it because I haven’t heard of it before. Yeah. So it’s the first time you hear it, they think that you own it. Right. Right. That’s my experience. When I mentioned I were a rock star like, oh, I never heard that you own it. You’re a broker? It’s like, No, it’s not my brokerage. Have you never heard of it before? Yeah, but because we’re small. Yeah. And the goal is never been to make a huge Yeah, I can’t speak for them, because I’m not an owner. But again, the point was, their focus is investors. And it’s not for everyone. That’s true. Because, you know, investors can be hard to work with. Yeah.

Georges
And you’re always on the buying side with investors, right? For the most for the most part, like Yeah, you get some listings, but in a market like the way it is now, it’s a little bit tougher for buyers. So you face some challenges in that sense.

Erwin
Yeah. Yeah. That’s like doing someone who’s interested in getting their licence just yesterday. Just you know, like, I love investing in laptop investing. Good. Lots of will do. And lots of investors will take your time and they’ll be nothing in it for you. Yeah, they’ll gladly waste your time because people don’t have to invest. Part nearly as motivated. Like when people when you work with homeowner homebuyers, for example, they often have a really motivating reason, job change. They need to upsize because there’s a baby on the way you know, you know, the feeling. Yeah, right, versus an investor’s. It’s really, you don’t have to do this It’s true, right? At least bless the masses think, like from from from your background like, like knowing what inflation hyperinflation looks like. To me, that’s incredibly motivating. You have to do something to hedge against inflation.

Georges
But that’s the nice thing about working with investors. If you get that one investor that’s driven, you might do five, six deals with them in a short period of time. Right? So you’re not maybe not working with as many people, but you can group them all. Or sometimes it’ll buy a full portfolio and you just do like five transactions at once.

Erwin
Yeah. And then if you have other investors, like they want to buy when, so I have investors want to exit because I’ve been around for a while. So they’ve gone they’ve aged with me. So now they’re exiting. Yeah. You know, taking some profits too. Cuz they’re near retirement age. And then we have clients that will buy them. Yeah, nice.

Georges
Oh, yeah. That’s awesome. Yeah, you’re a good person to be in touch with for that.

Erwin
Well, yeah, like you said, like, you had to do a pocket deal to do an exclusive deal. Yeah. Do you know wants to fight over property on MLS or realtor.ca?

Georges
And I wouldn’t have gotten a VTB if it was an MLS deal. Most likely?

Erwin
Yeah. Yeah. That’s the wild part. Yeah. For me, I always try to list everything on realtor.ca. I don’t know.

Georges
I didn’t ask him any questions.

Erwin
Of course not. To deal. Yeah. Yeah. What some? I’m always I’m always it’s I think it’s funny. Why. Yeah, there’s pluses and minuses, because if you put on realtor.ca You’re gonna have a wave of people going through that those four townhouses? Yeah. So were they all rented?

Georges
Yep. They’re all rented.

Erwin
Okay. Yeah. I don’t know if people appreciate how hard it is to show property that is rented. Yeah, that’s right. The tenant has no motivation to allow people in

Georges
Actually not during a pandemic or during whatever, right. Like, yeah.

Erwin
We have a high incidence of properties that were trying to sell attendance, high innocence, they already have COVID. And they can’t allow showings.

Georges
So I find some tenants say that, like, there is one tenant I had in my building every single time I’d see him. He says, no, no, don’t come close of COVID. And this was like, you know, every couple of weeks had seen him. I think part of it was lying, because he didn’t want anyone to enter his unit. But whatever.

Erwin
Yeah. Having tenants does not actually help resale value. No. But yeah, it sucks to hold a property that’s not as vacant. Yeah. So why did you choose these areas to invest? What markets are you looking to expand in now? You mentioned Hamilton, St. Catharines? Niagara, welland?

Georges
Yeah, just Yeah, well, in St. Catharines. And Hamilton, those are the three areas I don’t really think I’m going to go anywhere else. I don’t want to. If I have to funk driven out for whatever reason, then yes. But yeah, those are the areas I like and really well into was introduced to me by another investor. A few years ago, he bought an apartment building there. And he bought it for like a million bucks. It was 21 units. So that was my first introduction to Welland. And I went to see this building. I’m like, wow, this is nice. This is like I can see this area kind of growing. I understand that it’s close to whatever this and that and, and then, yeah, I started exploring opportunities.

Erwin
A million bucks is hilarious.

Georges
I know, for 21 units crazy.

Erwin
How’s it? Is there any way? It’s not under over $2 million?

Georges
I don’t know. So it’s got to be probably a 3 million I would guess.

Erwin
That’s pretty good.

Georges
Yeah. And this was, I think, around 2017, that he bought it.

Erwin
Oh, during the correction in 2017.

Georges
I don’t know if it was an off market deal as well. So yeah, I don’t know. I don’t remember. But the correction was mostly for like residential homes. Right? Because it was the first time buyer. They hadn’t they had put in the stress test. Right. Yeah.

Erwin
It doesn’t take much to spook the market. Because neither of those things bothered us. Yeah. So actually looked back. And as a business, we actually did left way less transactions after the fair housing plan came into effect. And the stress test, even though really didn’t change anything for 99% of our clientele. Right. They just got spooked.

Georges
Yeah. And it also kind of could trigger some people to sell. Like, we have some clients now because of this interest rate hike, which was almost nothing, point two, five, and this lady calls us and she’s like, I think it’s time for me to sell this. I’m kind of worried that this interest rates going to impact the market. Okay, that’s interesting that like that tiny thing caused some people to sell their homes. But yeah

Erwin
We’re seeing some softness now. Yeah. So I’ve told our clients if you have plans to sell them in 12 months, next 12 months, this would be the time Yeah, right. Just in case we have to 2017 is it’ll take some time for the market to recover. So for anyone who’s buying holding long term like I am, yeah, yeah. Holding stuff for my kids, right. Like, I plan on holding stuff for like over 10 years. So this doesn’t faze me. You’re not selling anything. Yeah, yeah. But if anyone, like for example, I have a client who has a flip. I’m like pushing them. Get it. Get it ready. Yeah.

Georges
Yeah, that makes sense. or maybe for some people who are downsizing it could make sense. capitalise on the market now and yeah.

Erwin
Or even the refi is done now. Yeah. Right. Like, take advantage of this. The worst seller’s market I’ve ever seen. Yeah, get your reifies now get your appraisals done now at these all time all time all time highs.

Georges
Yeah. Crazy Crazy

Erwin
And be ready for in case it does dip has metadata available for sure. George, anything else you want to cover?

Georges
I don’t think so.

Erwin
You don’t ever look.

Georges
I don’t have a book. No, I have a podcast.

Erwin
And it’s called the well off podcast.

Georges
You’ve been on it.

Erwin
Thank you for having me on.

Georges
Yeah, my pleasure.

Erwin
Hopefully people aren’t worse off for having listened.

Georges
I doubt it.

Erwin
Where can people find it? Welloffpodcast.ca, Spotify, Apple podcasts

Georges
Would you recommend Realtors do so what is your goal with the podcast?

Erwin
Actually, I really just want to like motivate people and and help them improve their lives by investing not just sitting on the sidelines.

Georges
So you think people should still get in? Interest rates are going up? Absolutely. Absolutely get in. If you can get in you won’t regret it and 5,10 years.

Erwin
Do you have a lot of people that challenge you on that opinion?

Georges
No, not really.

Erwin
Yeah, even newbies?

Georges
Okay. Yeah, sorry. I shouldn’t say that. I think some people, they create these excuses for themselves. Like I’m not going to invest now. I’m just gonna wait because I think the markets gonna dip. I think there’s gonna be a correction, I’m just gonna win. That I don’t know, they wait a long time. And by that point we’ve made how much in equity and cash flow and all these things. So I just don’t think it’s a good strategy to just sit and wait.

Erwin
The reason why I mentioned that. When I look back at our stats for 2017. A lot of people did not buy the dip. Right? They actually waited to the market recovered. We sold way more properties till after the recovery was done. Yeah. Right. So all this dip buying in reality people say it. They don’t actually do it. Right. That’s true. That’s true. True. Oh, we’re gonna wait for the dip. We for the dip. The dip comes. And you find another reason to wait. Yeah. Then they get cold feet. Not not. Like, I understand. No one knows what the bottom is. Yeah. But my point is, they don’t do it.

Georges
Because you start building a habit of waiting. And then, you know, the people who are buying they build a habit of buying. So they’re buying before the dip they’re buying during the dip. They’re buying after the dip. And they’re just their portfolio is growing.

Erwin
I have no interest in showing off to anyone. Yeah, I bought two houses in 2017 in the fall near the bottom of the dip. Yeah, right. In the pandemic. We bought two houses last year, like well into a dip. Yeah. Very well for us. So even in the stock world we teach I teach people that you need to exercise that muscle of buying dips. Even if just one share. Soon as soon your favourite. You have an iPhone, you have an Android or an iPhone, iPhone. So you’d like apple?

Georges
I do.

Erwin
So my suggestion to someone would be buy one share of Apple during this dip. Yeah. All right. If you don’t if you start that still doesn’t make you feel comfortable. Do it on paper. Yeah. Right. So then you you build that muscle. And then at least you’re not waiting. Yeah, right. build that muscle being an action taker. Yep. And then then look back. How did it go? How did it feel? You regret it? Are you happy with it? And then learn from that move forward? Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I want to buy some bitcoin this week. We’ll see if I regret or not. Yeah. Adam Bitcoin time. Oh, yeah. This is not a financial advice, folks. Please. This is just our experience and some really idiotic ideas. If you’re licenced, or licenced, George and I are licenced in real estate. We didn’t talk about real estate all day. So you’re not you’re not capital raising at all?

Georges
Yeah, yeah. I am. Like these townhomes. They have individual titles. So I was able to get separate partners for each nice. I have one left that I don’t have a partner on. But I have the three of them with our partners.

Erwin
Fantastic. Yeah, they have to be happy.

Georges
Yeah. Well, I think it’s pretty good deal.

Erwin
May I ask did you based on? So did you have to sell it to them? Or before the deal closes? They got put on title type thing?

Georges
Oh, it’s a VTB. So okay. Yeah. So like, I’m on title and the owners trusting me. Right. So I’m not gonna start like swapping names and doing this and that. So yeah, we just have a co venture agreement.

Erwin
Got it. Yeah. And then for that CO venture did did the price go up for each individual unit? Or did you just give them a deal at the same? Yeah, the same that as a sweetheart deal.

Georges
I got a pretty decent deal on and two, I think like there’s a decent discount on on the properties.

Erwin
So these properties built up equity on day one. Yeah. They made money on the buy. Yeah, it’s pretty sweetheart deal. Because I bet you most deals like this do not happen like that.

Georges
Yeah. I never even thought about increasing the price on our agreement. That’d be pretty smart. Actually.

Erwin
I’ve ruined George for everyone. Oh, I bring I bring it up because other passive investments I’ve looked at, that’s what they do. Yeah. Right. All the power to them. Like, I’m a bit of a capitalist as well. If you can do it, why not? Yeah. Right. So, you know, make your money. So you have money for rainy days. Yes, there will be other there’ll be other rainy days going forward. Yeah, for sure. And yeah, you bear lots of risk. Yeah. Do you on the BTB? Right. So you’re bearing lots of risk. Cool. George, something to think about? Thanks. I always want to allow my guests to have some time to share what it’s like to have an open mic. Yeah. That’s the first time I’ve called it that. Any other final thoughts? Maybe something for beginners? Maybe something for people afraid of? Anything?

Georges
Beginners, don’t overthink? You’re not going to have all the answers. You’re never going to have all the answers. We talked about this earlier. Every single purchase I’ve made so far. I felt have never felt like I was 100%. Ready. So if you’re gonna wait for that time, it’s probably too late. So just go just go for it. Do something. Don’t wait.

Erwin
So I have this habit of always thinking overpaid on every single deal. Yeah. And so as a team, we do a well over 100 deals every year. I think we overpaid for all of them. Yes. It’s It’s laughable. But you know.

Georges
I feel that way too. Yeah. And then I look like we bought a place in September at the time I thought. I was like, oh, man, I kind of think we overpaid for this. It’s gone off like 300 grand since then. Did so I don’t think we overpaid anymore.

Erwin
Yeah, we’re paying around 840 For duplexes last fall. And they’re all over a million now. Yeah, very between 1.1 1.2 Yeah. Right. So yeah. I thought, well, I can’t go any higher. I’m not saying people should chase prestigious appreciation. But I do think there’s a chance of a dip, there could be a great opportunity. And that can be the life like since 2017. It’s been five years. Yeah. Right. Who knows when the next opportunity to buy is. So this, you know, I’m preparing our clientele and our team. But you know, this could be the next buying opportunity and buying opportunity for the next person the next 10 years. 5,10 years. Right? It’s true. Because immigration ain’t going nowhere, right. can’t build nothing.

Georges
Yeah, it’s not like the supply is increasing. At a very slow rate.

Erwin
I actually saw this I went to a presentation this week. So it was never explained to me this way. I actually don’t know why I didn’t know this number. But we have over 1 million job vacancies in Canada. How do you fill that? Right. And so you have no option but immigration? Sure. Right. So yeah. So then if we know we have to have immigration to fill these job vacancies, and we know the government, what the government’s plans are, where these people are going to live, right? Crazy. Yeah. Magic grandpa saw you now forming all these hard assets?

Georges
Yeah, I don’t know what he would think. I don’t know. I know my parents are happy.

Erwin
That’s pretty awesome. Yeah. This is not like didn’t go through a lot to get here.

Georges
Yeah, for sure. My life was a lot easier than theirs. That’s for sure.

Erwin
Pretty cool. All right, George, thanks for doing this.

Georges
Thank you appreciate the time and you have me on.

Erwin
Don’t be a stranger.

Georges
All right, cool.

Erwin
Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate from cash flow, but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

Subscribe on Android

 

To Follow Georges:

Podcast: https://welloffpodcast.ca/

FB: https://www.facebook.com/georgeelmasriWO/

IG: @welloffx

 

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

When To Hire A Property Manager

Property Manager - Duncan

Hello, real estate investors! I get questions from folks on social media from time to time… the most recent, about hiring a property manager, which we’ll get into shortly. I don’t mind them; I feel this is one way to give back to the community that means so much to me, and has led to Cherry and I building a seven-figure real estate business and eight-figure real estate portfolio.  

My real estate business, iWIN Real Estate, transacts on 100 properties per year, 90% of them are for investment purposes. If you know us, we’re very close with our clients since we provide coaching services to ensure their success.

Investing-wise, I’ve had personal interests in over 40 properties since 2005, so while I don’t know everything, I know a little enough to be dangerous and happy to share my experiences if that helps.

This week we have Duncan, who asks: 

“When in your real estate journey did you decide to engage a property manager to be able to focus on other aspects of the business and investing?”

When To Hire A Property Manager

In 2005, the early days of my investing, we self-managed, and my ex-wife was the point person. She and her family owned a plumbing and renovation company and five investment properties, all very close by the reno company in a suburb of Hamilton. So, property management was in-house.  

As I worked downtown Toronto, analytical by nature and enjoyed geeking out on the business of real estate, I would do all the virtual stuff: financially analyzing properties, writing rent ads (I got pretty good at it as I used those same skills to write my online dating profile that got Cherry’s attention), review credit checks.

After the divorce and my great reset of the real estate portfolio, I immediately hired help to maintain our properties and boots on the ground. My handyman contractor became my property manager of sorts, who we paid a monthly retainer to maintain the property and provide customer service to the tenants.  Cherry and I will still run ads, screen tenants, deal with rent collection issues.

My clients who have the time and skill do self-manage, but they are a minority among our clients. Maybe 10%.

The rest use full-service property management and not just any; they work with the best in the cities for which we operate.  

Before anyone asks, our Niagara and Hamilton property managers operate on referral only as they prefer our investor clients.  Folks who invest the right way, not slumlords.

It’s not easy working with property managers either. A couple of them closed their doors only recently all over Ontario. One in Barrie, Adam Kitchener, one in KWC.

CLICK HERE listen to my interview with Adam on why he’s quitting project management, but not real estate investing. I’ve personally hired and fired 4-5 property managers over my career.

Duncan is also worried about cost overruns.  

As a professional real estate investor and ex to a renovation company owner, I know my renos quite well.  A good property manager will save you time and money.  Mine have internal staff for handyman stuff, so turnaround time is fast and often cheaper as we don’t need a licensed professional, e.g. a plumber for a leaky sink.

To save us all time, I’ve instructed my PMs if the cost is under $300 and makes the tenant happy to go ahead.  This saves me from having to approve pest control, gas leak, broken door locks service requests.  I tell my PM in no world can I say no to these requests, and if I did, I would expect to be fired as a client.

On a Monday morning, we received a text from my handyman stating, “there was a mice problem at X property and gas leak at Y property on the weekend, but I took care of them.”

Providing basic services to one’s tenants does take time and money, but my weekends are packed with kids’ stuff, so I don’t have time to deal with low-paying tasks I don’t have skills for.

I hope that helps Duncan a couple of you out there. 

If you enjoyed this episode, kindly leave me a review stating so, and I’ll keep doing these episodes between our regular weekly interviews!

Till next time. Hard Assets FTW!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

 

 

Audio Transcript

Erwin  

Greetings real estate investors!

 

Erwin  

This is Erwin Szeto bringing you the truth about real estate. And I got a question from the social internets. I get these questions time to time. I don’t mind them, I feel this is one way I can give back to the community that’s meant so much to me. And it’s let Cherry and I to each build a seven figure real estate business, hers mine in real estate. You know, I have a practice of six Realtors now. And Cherry obviously has an accounting business that lottery focuses on real estate investors and realtors. It is called Real Estate Tax Tips for a reason. And aside from that, we also own a bigger real estate portfolio. My real estate business that iWIN real estate transacts on over 100 properties per year; 90% of those are for investment purposes. And if you know us, we’re very close with our clients. Since we as we provide coaching services to ensure their success. The point I’m trying to make is we’re we have our fingers on the pulse of the real estate stuffs. Investing personally, I’ve had my personal interest in over 40 plus properties since 2005. So while I don’t know everything I know a little enough to be dangerous and happy to share my experience in case that helps anyone out there. 

 

Erwin  

This week we have Duncan who asks, When in your real estate journey did you decide to engage a property manager to be able to focus on other aspects of business and investing? 

 

Erwin  

So my answer is long. This is a podcast it’s a bit longer format, which hopefully you will allow. This won’t be the hour long format interviews that don’t really do this only took a couple minutes. So let’s start off. 

 

Erwin  

So early days 2005. Because he asked about my experience. My experience is back in 2005. We self managed, my now ex wife was our point person, her and her family owned a home renovation company and we had us not a big portfolio, we grew to five investment properties. But they all happen to be very close to where the rental company was situated in the suburb of Hamilton. So property management was done all in-house. Because again, proximity was close. We had the skill sets all in-house. And because we could do it all in house, it was cheaper than going external. As I worked downtown Toronto at the time, and based on my own skill set. So I’m naturally analytical. And I enjoy geeking out on learning about the business of real estate economics, those sorts of things. So I do all the virtual work. So, for example, I would do all the financial analysis of properties, I would rate rental ads, I’d help craft offers, I should know I did most of the work for crafting the offer. Because our realtor at the time did not understand investing. So I had to write the offers in terms of getting terms that were favourable to an investor. Again, I would review tenant applications and of course, credit checks. Because back then like like we’re talking, you know, mid late 2000 credit checks for like the old way. So it’s all codes. It’s not it’s not easy, like it is today, where things are coded colour coded, you’re given just a number, which makes things really easy. And then after my divorce, which was around 2010 ish, somewhere around there, apologies. I have my own personal great reset and my real estate portfolio. And so I no longer had all those resources available to me in terms of skills and skills and resources. So I immediately hired outside help to maintain properties and to have boots on ground. For example, one of the first properties I bought during my own recruit reset, I just stopped using great reset, and the reset of my portfolio was in St. Catharines. And at the time I was living in Hamilton. So that’s an over half an hour drive. So to me, that’s a little on the far side. So what I did was I was referred to handyman, who was a very, very good handyman. He did many things, contracting for me, and he became my property manager of sorts. We paid a monthly retainer to a property management fee. Not too much. It was under $200 a month to maintain the property and to provide customer service to our tenants. Cherry and I based on our strengths we found that our our handyman wasn’t qualified, nor did he have the skillset to do the right ads and tenant screening stuff like that. So we still did that. Mainly me because that’s what I was good at. And Cherry would deal with the rent collection issues.

 

Erwin  

My clients who have the time skill they do self manage. Understand that they do Have a time as in one of the so often my clients are married couples. So 1 of the one of the partners in that relationship doesn’t have a full time job. So that’s why they would have time. And they just haven’t behind us paying the people as well. So they so that’s the profile my clients who self manage, who still self manage, after like 5, 10 years, but they are the minority among my clientele. So that’s not not even 10% of our clientele, the rest of them, about 90% of them use full service property management. And don’t just use any property manager. They will they generally take our referrals, we let them know who that we use personally. And those property managers in my opinion, are the best in that operate in our cities that we operate. In before anyone asks Are Niagara in health and property managers operate on a referral basis only. And they’ve actually specifically requested to only work with our investor clients, folks who invest the right way. Not slumlords far from solid words to people. If you need Kitchener or Waterloo referrals, no problem, happy to recommend you to Diane de Dominica. It’s not the easiest to be a property manager and either a couple have recently closed the doors. I know a couple who have sold off over the years. And then just recently, one property manager and Barry closed the doors. And I’m Kitchener, who was just on the show, closed his doors, and another property manager in Kitchener Waterloo, Cambridge, I’ve personally hired and fired over four, four or five property managers over my career. And that’s just in Hamilton. So it’s not easy. And before you invest in any city, make sure there’s at least three high quality property managers, that’s this is my own opinion, in my experience, I wouldn’t invest in the city unless there’s at least three quality property managers, that would be happy using because again, in my experience, you’re not going to stay with all of them. Back in the again, he asked some more questions, he’s worried about cost overruns, as a part. So again, from my experience as a professional real estate investor, and my ex, you know, I wasn’t like I’m an ex owner, somewhat, you know, again, my ex wife owned a renovation company. And so we did lots of significant renovations to our properties at a very high standard. So I know renovations quite well, and what they cost because I’m in the busines. A good property manager will save you time and money. Mark, the property manager I use they have internal staff internally that are on salary. So they’re handyman stuff. The turnaround time is fast. And it’s often cheaper because again, their salary people and often these are not licenced professionals. For example, if I have a leaky tap, I don’t need to send a licenced plumber for that a handyman can often deal with that for a fraction of that cost. So again, I’m going to save on time and money. And simplicity as well, in terms of booking someone to go fix stuffs my attack from my tenants. So then everyone’s happier, right? No one, I think everyone wants repairs done sooner than later. To save all time, all parties involved included. So that’s myself a tenant in my property manager, I’ve instructed my property managers if the cost is under $300, it makes the tenant happy and to go ahead and do it. This saves me from having to be a bottleneck to approve really minor things such as pest control, or a gas leak. Another business outliner but it’s it’s an odd thing to have to be to have to authorise dealing with a gas leak, broken door locks, types, those types of service requests. I tell my PM,  property manager, in no world can I say no to these requests. And if I did, I would expect to be fired as our client. We’ve literally received a rule a couple of years ago, was on a Monday that our property our sorry, our handyman/property manager, which he texted us, called there was a mice problem at x property and asked me to buy property on the weekend. But I took care of them. Right? That’s so he took care of them without asking us, which is what I expected. He told me on Monday that everything’s taken care of. Isn’t that perfect? To me, these are provide providing basic services to one’s tenants. It does take time and money. So you can choose to do these things yourself. I choose not to because my weekends are packed with kids stuff. So I don’t have the time to deal with these low paying tasks that I don’t generally have skills for, you know, I can pay between 20 to $80 an hour for these types of tasks to deal with. And again, I don’t have the skills to deal with these problems.

 

Erwin  

So I hope that helps. I hope that helps Duncan and a couple others of you out there. If you enjoyed this episode, kindly leave me a review stating so. And I’ll keep doing these episodes because between in between our regular weekly interviews, because this is a bit of work for me to do, I don’t mind answering questions. But it’s not a value that No, I’m not gonna do it. But if it isn’t value, then let me know, right? Drop me a review on Spotify or iTunes, or even shoot me a DM on any social media platform. Alright, so next time, hard assets for the win. 

 

Erwin  

Thank you for watching. If you want to learn how to invest in real estate from scratch, my team teaches beginners how to use the number one investment strategy that I personally use in a virtual free trading class every month, go to investor training.ca/youtube To register for our next class. That link is also in the description as well. I publish at least two to three videos a week here. So subscribe if you want to keep learning from seasoned investors like myself, my guests, And if you’re just starting out, feel free to ask questions in a comment below. And I do my best to answer each of those comments and questions myself. Again if you’re ready to learn the nitty-gritty about real estate investing from a professional investor register for our next virtual class at that investor training.ca/youtube Thanks again for watching. See you in the next video.

Subscribe on Android

HELP US OUT!

Please help us reach new listeners on iTunes by leaving us a rating and review!
 

UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already,