Exited Real Estate For Stocks & $10k+/mth for Financial Freedom With Client Tim Collins

What I really enjoy about this podcast is learning about all the different paths to one’s financial goals.

I love reading books about entrepreneurship and investing for that reason however, most of those authors I’ll never get to speak to hence I’m grateful for my friendship with my mentors like Tom and Nick Karadza for real estate and Derek Foster for stocks.

 
 
 
 
 
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By having expert mentors, they’re great for distilling down all the information they’re reading, e.g. Derek Foster being retired and, with his passion for stocks, has the time to read quarterly and annual reports of companies he wants to invest in, including Warren Buffet’s to get an understanding of what the greatest business leaders are seeing in the economy and market.

What’s even better is he’s kind enough to share what he’s buying and selling, and even though he doesn’t move the market as Warren Buffet does, Derek is positive on the year, with 60% cash while the stock market is down close to 20% in 2022.

He’s beating me as well, and my policy is to learn from winners with track history who have achieved what I want. In this case, financial freedom.  That’s the same reason we asked Derek to speak at the Wealth Hacker Conference, as Cherry and I are merely architects; we plan, design and oversee our own investments and for our clients.

Derek is Canada’s youngest retiree for almost 20 years and is our stock hacking expert.

Our conference also features experts in insurance, crypto/blockchain, real estate, cash flow management, and how to access the maximum number of mortgages for income properties.  All in one day. I can’t recommend enough that you bring your team with you: your investment partner, typically your spouse, and any friends and family who’s shown interest in investing and getting ahead in life. 

If you know the children’s game broken telephone, you know it’s best to receive information directly from the source.

If you’ve been around for a while, you know the importance of community in going far in any endeavour. For you, our 17 listeners, we have a discount code “truth” for the best price but don’t delay as the price only goes up the closer we get to the event.  Saturday, Nov 12th, Toronto Congress Centre next to Pearson Airport. Live and in-person only!

Link to discounted tickets: https://www.eventbrite.ca/e/wealth-hacker-conference-toronto-tickets-329788334787?discount=TRUTH

Exited Real Estate For Stocks & $10k+/mth for Financial Freedom With Client Tim Collins

On to this week’s show!

Full disclosure, Tim Collins is one of our longest-time clients hence he’s bought and held properties for several years in order to get rich slowly.

He’s also taken our Stock Hacker Academy courses. He’s switched careers a couple of times from high-paid tech executive to now a Real Estate Agent.  Moved his family from Orangeville, Ontario, to Nanaimo, BC, for warmer weather and a view of the ocean.

Tim is open-minded, successful, wants more out of life and is now financially free and has the option to retire early thanks to his now $10,000+ passive dividend income each month from his stock portfolio. Tim’s mental health is likely better than that of most investors these days.

From my experience working with investors every day, many of you want passive cash flow hence I’m excited to bring you this episode to learn how Tim escaped the 9-5 rat race and golden handcuffs by building wealth in real estate and then pivoting to stocks for greater yields and passivity.

We’re all on this journey of learning together, and what better way than to learn from folks who have what we want!

Announcement regarding Stock Hacker Academy, we’ve completely revamped the course to make it more comprehensive and added numerous modules to aid those new to the stock market.  Plus several value-adds we will announce at the Wealth Hacker Conference.

As always, we believe in and practise continuous improvement, and I’m beyond excited to share with our community the absolute best version of our beginner course at the lowest price anyone will ever see and only available for purchase at the conference.  Just another bonus for those in attendance!

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show. I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and me.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and, more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future, knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you, too, are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so, but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel; we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you by www.stockhackeracademy.ca, where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle, as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full-time musician who just made a 50% return in 2021.  Past, of course, does not predict the future, but if you’d like a free demonstration, go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right and click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration, I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners, and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Greetings, and welcome to another episode The truth about real estate investing show. And on this show, what I really enjoy about doing this podcast is learning about all the different ways all the different paths to one’s financial goals. I love reading books about entrepreneurship and investing for that reason. However, most the authors I’ll never get to speak to never get to meet. Hence, I’m grateful for my friendships with my mentors like Tommy krejza for real estate and Derek foster for stocks by having expert mentors that are great for distilling down all information that they’re reading. For example, Derrick foster being retired and with his passion for stocks has the time to read quarterly and annual reports of companies he wants to invest in, including Warren Buffett to get an understanding of what the greatest business leaders out there are seeing in the economy and the market and for opportunity, of course, and also, you know, when to cut losses, what’s even better is Derek’s time to share but he’s buying and selling with me. Because we’re friends, please pretend we’re friends like to think we’re friends, though Warren Buffett moves the market. Anytime there’s an announcement, we understand there’s information available on when he’s entered a company such as like occidental oil, you know, he really moves the market doesn’t move the market like that. But however, Derek is positive on the year in terms of his investment portfolio, year to date, while being 6% cash and compare that to the overall stock market, which is down close to around 20%. Year to date in 2022. Derek’s beating me as well. And My policy is to learn from winners with track history who have achieved what I want. In this case, I want financial freedom and you know, finished work little less. That’s the same reason why we asked Derek to speak at the wealth hack conference. As Charlie and I are merely architects we plan, design and oversee our own investments and for our clients. Derrick cover is an expert in the area of stocks. He as he is Canada’s youngest retiree for almost 20 years, and is our stock hacking expert. Our conference also features experts in insurance, crypto, currency blockchain, that’s one category, real estate, cash flow management, specific to accounting for real estate, how to access the maximum number of mortgages, real income properties, all the really important things that any sort of professional investor needs. Side Hustle investors as well. Anything a professional investor wants to know side hustlers shouldn’t likely want to know it as well. All this all in one day. I can’t recommend enough that you bring your team with you, your team as in like your investment partner, typically your spouse or your significant other. Any friends and family who’ve shown interest in investing, like include any adult children, anyone who’s interested in getting ahead and who’s open minded and wants to get ahead in life. If you know that children’s game broken telephone, you know, it’s best to receive information directly from the source such as our expert speakers. If you’ve been around for a while, then you know the importance of community as well. Because if you want to go far in the Endeavour, you need a community to do it with you. And it takes a you know the whole saying it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a village to raise a successful investors in my experience. For you 17 listeners, we have a special discount code, which is truth, it’s a five letter word for the best price available. Please do not delay as the price will only go up between now and to the event on Saturday, November 12. Toronto Congress Centre next to Pearson Airport at Saturday, all day roughly, you know expect to shop for nine expect to leave around 530 ish. Of course VIPs will stay a little bit later for the meet and greet with our keynote speaker. And this is live and personally there will be no option to do this virtually getting the discount code is truth five letter word. And also in the show notes I’ve included a link because in my experience, a lot of people have trouble finding where to input the discount code. So I’ve included the link that goes directly to the discounted tickets for you 17 listeners, it’s all in the show notes. So if you’re on my email list, you get the show notes. Also, if you just go to our website truth about real estate investing.ca You go to this episode, you’ll see the link there as well, including all the show notes for this episode, including how to reach out to our deaths. So onto this week’s show. Full disclosure, Tim Collins is one of our longest time clients. Hence he’s bought and held real estate investment properties for several years in order to get rich slowly. He’s also taking our stock hacker Academy courses. He switched careers a couple times from when I first met him somewhere around 2012 ish. He was a high paid tech executive working downtown Toronto living in Orangeville. So he can understand is a bit of a commute. He’s now pivoted, he’s switched careers a couple times. He’s now a real estate agent. He’s also moved his family from Orangeville, Ontario to now Nanaimo BC, which is on Vancouver Island. It’s it’s a short ferry away from Vancouver, the city of Vancouver for the for warmer weather and better view of the ocean. Yeah, better view

 

Erwin  

view from Orangeville Ontario. Tim is obviously open minded, he’s successful, he wants more in life more out of life. And now he’s financially free to do whatever he wants and he has the option to retire even. He’s He’s also a successful realtor. So he still likes doing that. So technically he’s not retired but he has the option to retire. Absolutely. Thanks to his now 10,000 Plus passive dividend income each month, more than $10,000 Each month of dividend income. I’m not an accountant. But dividend income is generally more tax optimised than actually it’s usually the most tax optimised source of income typically tends mental health is likely better than most investors these days as well. Tim has exited all his real estate. So interest rates mean pretty much nothing to him. For his own investment portfolio, from my experience working with investors every day, many of you want passive cash flow. Hence, I’m excited to bring you this episode to learn how Tim escaped the nine to five rat race. They call it those golden handcuffs via building wealth and real estate, then pivoting to stocks for greater yields, and passivity. We’re all on this journey of learning together, and what better way to learn than from folks who have what we want. quick announcement regarding stock hacker Academy, we’ve completely revamped the course to make it more comprehensive and added numerous modules to aid those who are new to the stock market. So this is more beginner friendly than ever. Plus, we’ve added several value adds that we will announce at the wealth hacker conference. As always, we believe in and practice continuous improvement. I am beyond excited to share with our community, the absolute best version of our beginner programme at the lowest possible price that anyone will ever see. It’s only available after we announce it at the wealth hacker conference. Just another bonus for those of you in attendance. So without further ado, I bring you two columns. Please enjoy the show. Hey, Tim, longtime no talk. What’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Tim  

Well, my kids are back in school, which is brilliant news. Everybody’s excited about that happening. But yeah, just you know, the usual looking after the family, helping people buy and sell houses, as you know, in the old real estate game, although things have slowed down a little bit. There’s still there’s always lots to do there. Yeah, reading, learning. living my life

 

Erwin  

can be easy. Okay. I know you don’t feel like you said a lot. But I feel there’s a lot to unpack there. Let’s start off with where you live. What city do you live in? You are Canadian, even though you don’t sound like the average Canadian.

 

Tim  

Yes. Yeah, that’s a longer story. But I grew up in grew up in England, currently living in Canada. I was born in Canada, only for the first year of my life, and then grew up in England and then came back in my early 20s. But yeah, now I live on Vancouver Island in a place called Nanaimo, which I ended up here through a real estate investor attending a real estate investing course years ago, at the time, I was living in the GTA, and I just thought, you know, lifestyle wise, for me at the time just seemed like a great move. And I’m still, I’m still loving it. Eight years later, or nine years later, however long that is.

 

Erwin  

And that was quite affordable. Isn’t not? It is yeah,

 

Tim  

it was. It was when I came. Yeah, I think by in terms of by national average standards, people often think of Vancouver as being the most expensive real estate in Canada, which is probably still true. A Vancouver Island, less business here and less sort of going on economy wise tends to be a little bit cheaper. I don’t know what our average house price is at the moment. 900,000 Maybe. But yeah, you can still get a nice, single family home, often with views of the ocean because much of the MIMO is on a hill kind of looking at the piece of Ocean between us and the mainland. So yeah, I still think there’s affordable options. And with the recent pullback in real estate prices, I think there’s there’s opportunities for people to to get involved once again. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

How far do you think you guys are off the peak?

 

Tim  

Maybe 15%? Yeah, yeah, I think pretty typical numbers. I would say, I don’t know if I’m sort of biassed, because I’m a realtor and I live here. But there does tend to be a constant influx of interest in Vancouver Island, because when people retire from the East Coast, or Alberta, for instance, and they want to escape, you know, the frigid winters a lot of people look at Vancouver and said, right, I want to I want to live there because the winters are obviously a bit more less harsh. And some of the nice and you know,

 

Erwin  

you’re being modest. I imagine that you some of the best for the Hawaii of Canada. Yeah, exactly. I think that’s probably the right analogy is you likely have the best weather in Canada.

 

Tim  

I think so. Yeah. I mean, some people think that it rains too much in the winter for them. But again, I grew up in England. So for me, this is pretty close. Pretty close to that where I’m currently living. I’m very fortunate in that I can walk probably about 300 metres, some of which is down some steps, but and then I’m on the beach and the beach is because there’s about 300 steps down to the beach. It’s absolutely deserted. But it’s you could be in a different country. It is absolutely stunning to go there and go for a swim every day in the summer. We go down there so

 

Erwin  

amazing. And then working folks reach out to you should they be interested in investing or moving to Nanaimo? Yeah,

 

Tim  

you can just I mean, on Facebook and Instagram, it’s just Tim JP Collins, or if you want to find out more, I just check. My email address is just Tim at Tim collins.ca.

 

Erwin  

Fantastic. And folks, I’ll have the Tim’s social media coordinates in the in the show notes. Some people are driving your email. It’s just a podcast for yourself. You know, people aren’t done a cup typically listening and taking notes. They’re usually this is the second thing that they’re doing well listening for 17 listeners. I mean,

 

Tim  

interestingly, part of the origin story for living here is that I used to work. I used to live in Orangeville. And I used to work at Yun and the 401. And I would drive that road every day down, you know, along Highway nine, I think it is down the 400 along the 401 an hour anyway, yeah, like an hour and a half each day, probably in the winter even more, and I sat there one day in the car and got the calculator on my phone. And I always justified it by like, Oh, I’m listening to audiobooks and podcasts. I’m learning so much. But I got the calculator on my phone. I was that right? Three hours a day, five days a week, 52 weeks a year. And it was a 20 year career or something that ended up being years of my life. So I just can’t do this anymore. That was a big part of the reason for the move. Now. You know, when I first came here, I was commuting about 10 minutes, and now I work from home. So

 

Erwin  

even better. So what was your day? Like? Then? What time did you leave the house? And did you see your kids in the morning?

 

Tim  

Yeah, I didn’t see my kids when they were young. So I would leave at probably six and I would get home at six or seven at night. So a good 12 hours away from home my company worked for at the time were completely against remote work. And my wife famously reminds me to this day, you know, there was days where it was snowing outside in Orangeville. If you if you know that area is snowbelt particularly

 

Erwin  

bad. Your ski hills in Orangeville. Yeah,

 

Tim  

I live in ski hill and then hopefully Valley, so I bought a Subaru with winter tires, which means you can go pretty much anywhere. But I would go to work when these days I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t go to the end of the road. And I would drive that journey in horrific blizzards in winter conditions and just the obligation to I have to be there because they really want me in the office. And then you get to the office and you sit around and drink coffee all day and talk about non relevant things. But yeah, that was just that was the life right? You just felt like you had to be there. And it’s all part of the journey, so to speak. But I can’t today, I will no way I would want to be in that situation again.

 

Erwin  

Right. And around that time was when he got really motivated around real estate investing. Am I wrong? All right.

 

Tim  

Yeah, that’s right. I mean, it’s all part of part of that story of like dissatisfaction with that commute. And I started having some issues with anxiety around that time, and just being mega stressed out with work and the travel. And, you know, ultimately, I’ve put myself in some in some handcuffs in terms of I had this house, my kids were in private school, I got a couple of cars, I needed that salary to sustain my life. And I started thinking, we’re going to talk about other ways, which I’ve achieved it now. But back then I was thinking right real estate, I’m going to buy a house or rent it out. And through that rental income. There’ll be a generate some some money to replace my salary. So yeah, that’s when I think I literally went on Google one day and typed in real estate investing and ended up finding Julie Broad, who’s a mutual friend of ours. She happens to be in Nanaimo. That’s why I moved in an IMO because I came out here and fell in love with it. But yeah, I got super motivated to take action and control my own destiny and just say, right, I’m gonna learn as much as I can about this. i That’s how I found you and your Meetup. Julie connected this. Yeah. Thank you, Julie. But yeah, she connected us. I started coming to your Saturday morning sessions in Oakville. And that’s kind of how that was, you know how it all got got rolling, you know?

 

Erwin  

And then you bought a couple houses, bought some houses. Yeah, that’s funny. He’s bought a couple of houses. So I remember

 

Tim  

the first time we went on, I think it was I remember in my head it was West Fourth Street near Mohawk College. We looked at this house and I think I paid 274 or 270,000. I said to and always said he was like, Would you do this? You know, like, yeah, it seems like a good opportunity is close to the college and we kind of talked about it and so that was the first one of many that I got involved in her.

 

Erwin  

I started justifies right there. I don’t know if you know, but actually tried to buy it from the person you sold it from afterwards. Oh, really? In hindsight, I regret not buying it from you. Because I was actually trying to end up trying to own that section. The four houses those four houses on at the corner. Yeah, but that’s funny. You asked me what I buy it. I wish I owned it now. Because I was trying to play Monopoly and control a quarter. Oh, yeah. Yeah. All right. Continue.

 

Tim  

Yeah, but I mean, it sounds very romanticised. In hindsight, by the time I got loads of stories about, you know, student Nightmares From Hell, where I’d go in and they wouldn’t have taken the garbage out for a couple of weeks and cockroaches and exterminators and people not paying rent and drugs and balls everywhere. And it was just Yeah, it’s a lot of work. And at the time, when I was knee deep in, you know, with rubber gloves on picking up other people’s garbage and pulling hair out of drains and all those terrible things. I just thought I gotta do this. I got to work hard. I’ve got to get it done. And so I would go around my Hamilton houses and be my own property manager for a while. And then at some point during the evolution, I realised I can’t keep buying houses and trying to find joint venture partners. and do all the property management and so started outsourcing elements of it to other people. But yeah, that was in terms of capital growth, buying real estate was was how I did that. There’s no secret to that. And I still probably remains the best way. Or one of the best ways to make money over time. It’s the kind of the get rich slow scheme, right. So another place they bought in Orangeville, in probably 2010, paid around 200,000 For that sold out for 650 reasonably, and that was like a semi detached house and went in and same thing like bread the carpets out ourselves painted the walls, but in flooring and did whatever we could to rent out and maintain it. And yeah, I mean, lots of people listening to your podcast know how this stuff works? Yeah, it’s been a sort of great journey of, of building those things up and then offloading them as well. You know,

 

Erwin  

for two really quick update on the student rental market. A lot of landlords got out during the pandemic. Yeah. So there’s like, no supply. Right. So bedrooms master for mediocre hosts. Yeah. are renting for 800 a room?

 

Tim  

Very nice Mohawk.

 

Erwin  

I don’t know the numbers, but they have this exact same issue. Yeah, there’s nothing to rent. And they already there’s nothing to rent, let alone student rentals. So rents have gone through the roof. Yeah, so the product rents are probably up around 30%.

 

Tim  

Yeah. Which makes sense. So those landlords probably have to suffer through two years of nothing. Oh, yeah. Yeah, to get

 

Erwin  

payback time. Yeah. So Yeah, crazy, crazy pendulum swings

 

Tim  

is funny how it changes. I mean, there’s, I’m sure there’s people who bought houses and 20 years ago, and they’re just sitting on them. And, you know, they don’t need it yet. But you know, one of the a lot of the bold moves I’ve made in my life have been as a result of conversations with my wife, she normally gets there before me mentally, where she’s like, just go for it, we’ll work it out. And, you know, part of that was, when we lived in Ontario, and I bought some of the student rentals houses, I started doing joint ventures with people where they would, you know, qualify for the mortgage, and I would take care of the investment. And all of a sudden, I decided we wanted to move to the West Coast, I said, we can’t move because I got at that point, 10 or 12, houses, some of them with other people, we can’t possibly leave all this stuff behind. And anyway, stuff my wife is like, well just sell them or tell the people you move in and see if they’re okay with you coming back, you know, once in a while to check on them and manage them remotely through a property manager. And so I say that because I find I speak to a lot of people about their lives. And they often say, Well, I can’t move because of X. And X might be a business that you’re running or family that you have, or whatever it is. And if those things are making you happy, then power to you stay where you are, but I didn’t let that hold me back. And some of the people said, Yeah, I don’t mind you having a property manager. And you know, dialling it in, so to speak. And some people decided they didn’t want to be in those investments anymore. So luckily, thank goodness that we were in a bull market housing wise, during that time and prices have gone up, we sold them they got they made a bit of money. Not as much as we would have expected if we held on to it. But yeah, that was what I wanted to do in my life. And so we just made the move and got on with it.

 

Erwin  

Can you share about your drag patrol experience? Positive or negative? Yeah, hated it.

 

Tim  

Yeah, I had some great, some great ones and some more challenging ones, I would say that, ultimately, it was beneficial to kind of get me where I am today. It’s another one of those things where it was, you know, I studied it a lot in terms of how do I meet people? How do I start conversations around real estate about investing in real estate, learning my market becoming an expert in the area? Yeah, I think like many things in business is just setting out very strong expectations at the start, this is my responsibilities. Those are your responsibilities. This is how we’re gonna we’re gonna work in one of my joint ventures who I did a few deals with was very disappointed when I said, what he said you can move no problem. And then eventually when I said I want to sell he said, Well, I wanted to keep it for even longer. I said, well, great, you know, you’re welcome to buy me out, but it’s time to move on. So again, clear plans in terms of exit, how do you move on, etc. I think it can be very beneficial, but it’s not something done lightly. You need to understand you need to know your contract inside out. You need to know your market. You need to know what you’re up to and what you do if things go wrong, because often they will so so for

 

Erwin  

someone who’s getting into joint ventures for example, do you have like maybe like three tips? Like you mentioned know your market? How would someone demonstrate they know their market or their strategy? For example?

 

Tim  

Yeah, I think you know, if you’re if your market is where you live, then it’s probably easier because you can know them know what’s going on. In my case, my market was twofold. It was Hamilton and slash St. Catharines slash welland but it was also student rentals as a niche within that so then you can get very specific around what are the rents at the moment and what’s you know, what’s happening after the pandemic with landlords and our students to renting houses and start to have a story around that whole area. And then you just going to know more than other people talk to the property managers told To the realtor’s build up your knowledge and off you go. The other thing I would say is don’t do joint ventures with family or friends. Because you know, some people are able to do that. But as soon as you sign a contract, your relationship changes from a friendly one or a family one to a business one. And people are going to be saying, where’s the money if things go wrong, or if there’s a roof needs to be replaced, and you don’t have money in the bank, and you have to do it split the capital expenditure, difficult conversations will arise. So if you can find find people who are known to you, but they’re not like, in your close circle of friends or family, that’s often good. A lot of the time people start with friends and family because it’s obviously easier to ask, you know, a dad, you want to do this thing on me. Great, but I wouldn’t deal with my dad because I love him, but it would change our relationship. And he’d be saying, how’s the house going? Naturally? We need new dishwasher. Oh, dear, that’s gonna cut into the projections.

 

Erwin  

discussion to have the family barbecue.

 

Tim  

Yeah, exactly. So I don’t know. It’s just, you know, being very conscious around how you get into it. And for me, it was learning areas in the community where I could speak to people about real estate, through hockey teams, through sports teams, there’s lots of places where you can start conversations and meet people. But most likely lots of things in sales. It’s you know, lots of coffee dates, lots of conversations, building up my repertoire of expertise, doing some on my own initially before I asked other people, so then you have some stories to tell.

 

Erwin  

Very, very right. Before we were recording, I mentioned something about private lending. My thing is, I generally don’t like private lending for myself, but just imagine the conversation should you have lent to somebody? Yeah. And then the deals going sideways. So you’d like to have flipper flippers or having real challenges right now. And then the conversation after that, like, Hey, where’s my money? Yeah. Oh, you don’t have any money? So I guess I’ll be taking the house from you then. Your friendship be after that.

 

Tim  

I mean, it’s, it’s difficult, right? Very difficult,

 

Erwin  

especially if you like their home like ya know, split secure mortgages on their principal on people’s principal residence. Oh, I guess your home is now my house now. That’s a lovely conversation I do not want to have it’s, I stay out of it. So Tim shows called trust by real estate investing, not here, blow smoke up your ass. As I mentioned, before, we were recording, you’re in a position that many people want the way I phrased it, because I don’t want put words in your mouth way I phrased it was you could give up everything that you’re doing actively move working. If you’re a realtor, successful realtor, like you give that up, give up anything you’re doing actively. And you’ll be I consider extremely comfortable financially. Would that be right?

 

Tim  

Yeah. I mean, that’s kind of long been the goal is to have I mean, people talk about real estate as passive income. It’s not really

 

Erwin  

me owning Enbridge shares is passive, I call that I’ll say that’s my baseline for passive. It’s very different than being a landlord of one property.

 

Tim  

Yeah, I wouldn’t say it’s always passive mentally, because people get a bit funny about checking stock prices and looking at their portfolio too much. But, but you’d have to do anything. Because there’s no you don’t have to phone anybody or unclog any toilets or anything like that. It’s just it just happens on its own. So then it becomes it does become a mental game of like, can you detach from having to check it regularly. And we can talk a bit about the market and stuff and how I used to wake up and before I went to bed, I’d be looking at the futures and I’d wake up and look at the pre market and then look at the post market and all this stuff in between. So I’ve kind of evolved from that as well, in terms of just what’s comfortable for me. And one of the interesting things I learned was that different people have different tolerance levels for risk. And different people have different tolerance levels for like how much they want to be involved in, in making money. One thing I remember this interview I heard on a YouTube video, I think, but this seasoned professional investor basically said, like, the things that make you the most money are not the things that give you the most peace of mind. So choose what do you want most of peace of mind or the most money? Good that I love that? Yeah, peace of

 

Erwin  

mind is inversely related to money,

 

Tim  

or money. So people who want very stable, wake up and know how much money they all the time then maybe they’re in GICs are very low. I mean, at the moment, you’re, you’re a melting ice cube in that respect, because it because of inflation, but you know, that’s the baseline. And then obviously, at the high end, you’ve got things like crypto or very volatile things or, you know, things which, you know, stops or SPACs or whatever the, you know, that sort of stuff is so, yeah, there’s something for everybody. It’s just knowing, knowing where you want to be and where you want to get to.

 

Erwin  

I love it. Because I was literally talking to a friend who’s one of the most successful crypto investors. I know, at the dinner table. Someone actually asked him like, what’s the price of Aetherium right now? So you actually don’t even know I haven’t checked in a month and a half. Even though his investment is highly volatile. He’s not checking in checking the month and a half. Yeah, it’s crazy. Yeah, crazy. No, but your point is actually very healthy. And then I also before we’re Recording is not talked about balance. Yeah. Right. for periods of time, if for if you want to get ahead in life, you will have times of complete imbalance. Yeah, you’ve actually laid that out a couple of times already, and just sharing what you shared so far. Yeah.

 

Tim  

I mean, it’s, it’s absolutely true in terms of I mean, if you look at the fire movement, or, and for people who don’t know, this, you know, financially independent, retire early,

 

Erwin  

that’s you. Yeah,

 

Tim  

I mean, I can qualify for that, although I’m not, I still enjoy what I love real estate as a job, if you will, from a realtor point of view. But that whole mantra is about like, in that case, like extreme frugality, maybe, which I haven’t necessarily done, but they some people do extreme frugality, save loads of money, save 70 or 80% of their income so that when they’re 45, instead of 65, they can choose to stop working. In my case, it wasn’t necessarily the extreme frugality route was just, you know, doubling down on efforts with regard to investing in real estate, I never have the net worth, I’ve got, I didn’t really create that through my job income, although I had salaries in the six figures all the time, that money just gets spent, you know, the more you make more you spend, it’s very hard to stop the creep have a bigger house or a newer car, and all those kinds of things are very counterculture, you have to be very uncommon, as David Goggins would say, you have to be very uncommon to not fall into the trap of trying to kind of grow into income growth. And so for me, yeah, it was kind of like this very, we can talk about the brass tacks of it. But at the very hard work of building up the real estate portfolio, it doesn’t escape me that like, a huge part of building up my nest egg was on the basis that the real estate market has been trending in the right direction, when I started working with you was around 2010, you could have bought any house anyway, and sold it 10 years later and doubled your money, at least, if not more, right? And so, but even then we were even back in 2010, we’re talking about right? The people who do best in, you know, that time real estate, who the people who come before us were people who took action, they said, right, this is what we’re gonna do, we’re gonna go for it. There’s lots of people who came to your sessions, and they said, Oh, I don’t know. And, you know, think about it. And I’d say, you know, $250,000, for a single family home that you can rent out for three grand a month seems expensive.

 

Erwin  

I want a cheaper.

 

Tim  

I mean, you know, I remember people talk about it, and it relates to housing and the stock market and everything, it’s time in the market, not timing the market. And that remains to be true to this day. Because until you actually get some skin in the game and start to work and do stuff, you don’t have any exposure to the upside, which will ultimately come back again. I mean, as human history repeats itself, which it seems to be pretty good at doing, things continue to go up over time. This is obviously blood sweat. And we’re kind of going through one at the moment. There’s lots of times where things slow down. But you know, it was COVID, it was the 2008 mortgage crisis at the moment, we’ve got inflation going on and wars, and they’ll always be something. But if you consistently sort of work during that time, then then you can you can build stuff up.

 

Erwin  

So Tim, you mentioned time in the market. So my understanding is you have nothing in the market right now in terms of real estate.

 

Tim  

Yeah, and and it wasn’t,

 

Erwin  

I’d love to market.

 

Tim  

Grand Design, I didn’t have this grand design. actually weirdly, a lot of it was just like, if you think about like 10 years from when I started, a lot of it was I signed a five year mortgage here renewed, I signed another five year mortgage commitment. And that just came up in the last year or two. And I just thought I don’t want to do this again. And this was with no foresight to rising interest rates on mortgages. So they’re gonna do this again, I looked at the numbers, I was like, this house has done pretty well, I’m just gonna sell it and take the money in many cases, because those houses were in Ontario, and I’m not. So I just thought, right, now’s a good time to sell, you know, the, there’s no mortgage penalty to just sell this at the moment. And so I just started doing that, and kind of putting money in the bank, essentially, with a view to, you know, getting some more ideas. I had a condo in Nanaimo, which did very well. And then, you know, decided to sell that one. And then you’re homeless. So homeless now. Yeah. And then the house we lived in, we did some renovations to it, we decided we wanted to live in a different part of town basically, and have slightly more space. And so again, it was just kind of like, well, the housing markets, good time to sell or sell it. Now, some people might think what I’m doing at the moment is a risky move. I don’t because I feel like it gives me maximum flexibility. So I sold all the houses I had and kind of effectively liquidated all of those went to went to cash. And I’m renting my house that I live in now. If I were to buy this house, it would cost about 1.6 million. It’s a block away from the ocean. It’s a beautiful house. I managed to get I think a reasonable rent price for a couple of years commitment, but I think you know, and then after that people might say well, I want certainty. I want to own my primary residence and great I don’t really care and in two years time when this is up people though I extend it, or I’ll have the beautiful opportunity to experience something new and go and find somewhere else. So,

 

Erwin  

but you have that flexibility because you’re pretty wealthy?

 

Tim  

Well, I don’t know about that. But yeah, I took that, you know, I took the funds that I had from those sales, and then started to look around for like, how do I, I’m still, you know, still have that dream of, you know, the, the cross hairs on my spreadsheet of my passive income is greater than my expenses. That’s all I was really trying to get to. And I use, you know, it’s pretty boring and takes a bit of time. But I log every expense that we have as a family into this app on my phone. I categorise it. And that was our call. Let me just my phone up. It’s just called spending, actually, the apps just called spending, and it’s like a little, it looks like a little wallet. But yeah, so I sit down my wife, we got a budget, there’s how much for rent and utilities and kids sports and going out for dinner and groceries and all that stuff. We have a category for everything. So we know what our budget is, I love all the spending, we sit down every couple of weeks and say right, where are we versus x Oh, we can afford to go out for dinner because we’ve, we haven’t really used that budget enough, or we’re a little bit high on fill in the blank, we need to figure it out. We’ve actually got it down to be of a bit of an art now. But one of the cool things about that app is that it draws a graph for you. So I put it in my passive income, I put in my expenses. And the axes have now crossed, meaning that the passive income is higher than the expenses are which, which, again, back to the fire thing is kind of the definition of being financially independent, because you could stop other sources of income and still pay all your bills, we actually have quite a high burn rate, if you will, at the moment as a family because you know, my kids are two my kids are teenagers, they’re in loads of sports, we want to travel and things are expensive. Life’s expensive at the moment. Right? So yeah, so that’s kind of I went from having the houses and really wanting to get, you know, my ultimate goal in 2010. When I started all this was like how do I, how do I replace my income. So it’s taken me 12 years, but now I’ve replaced my income, or I’ve got enough money to pay the bills. And that we can talk more about how I do that. But ultimately, through one of the courses I took with you, which was around options trading, again, talking about the sort of amount of hands on they wanted to have, I found that I didn’t want to have that much hands on stuff. But I loved the model, I love the model of like, generating premium from positions in the market, whether you’re selling naked puts or doing cover calls. That concept was something I really enjoyed. So I learned how to do that, and did that for for a year sort of solidly through various ups and downs, and had some sort of moderate success, but it took my time away. And so through that I then came across some of these funds, ETFs and closed end funds and various other things which use a covered call strategy. And most of these are available through Bank of Montreal, for instance, as a bunch of these. And there’s various other companies in Canada that do them as well. But they take positions on companies and dividend paying companies and they sell chemicals on them. Yeah, boring stuff. You know, it’s Derek foster stuff is toothpaste and toilet roll. And, you know, like we were talking about earlier Enbridge, all the blue chip stuff, basically, and they sell cover calls against those positions, and they manage it, and they pay you a little fee, but the percentage return you get is net of those fees. And yeah, I just was opened up to this whole world of, Wow, I could just put my money into these. And you know, they’re they’re broadly going to track the s&p 500 and the NASDAQ and the Dow Jones and stuff based on what category they’re in, I don’t have to think about it. And I’d have to look at it. And they just, it’s like this weird magic thing happens where on the 15th of the month, they just put money in my account. And I can either buy more shares, and you know, drip is what they call it dividend reinvestment programme, I can either do that, or I can take the money out and pay my bills with it or, or go on holiday or do whatever I want to do. So I like that. And a lot of the community that I have found through that are people who are already retired. And like you, yeah, and so yeah. And so yeah, I just I’m like I could, this is great. I can just keep growing it and putting stuff in I can take some out. At the moment. I’m not touching it because I’m still doing well with being a realtor and paying the bills that way. But knowing having that peace of mind and knowing I don’t have to is worth his weight in gold, because that’s what I’ve been trying to I’ve been trying to climb that mountain for a long time.

 

Erwin  

So Tim, you’ve shared me in private what what you’ve invested. Can you share how much you’re getting a month in passive income?

 

Tim  

Yeah, I mean, we talked about, you know, north of $10,000 a month in passive income. Yeah, for the listeners

 

Erwin  

better for Tim and I talked about what he what he’s wanting to share, because originally we were gonna say five figures but as to abstract, it can be 90,000 it can be 10,000 but different. There’s just why Have over 10,000 So yeah, let’s say 10 to 15 grand a month. Fantastic. Thank you. So a very tasty six figure passive income. Yeah. And passive by your standards, which I think you probably have the highest standards in terms of passivity, right? Because you know, lots of real estate investors say the farm buildings are passive. Yeah. Well, a friend of mine has tenants protesting outside his father in law’s place of work. Yeah, for peace of mind.

 

Tim  

I mean, because of the, you know, the apps we use and the technology is amazing. Now, you can trade stuff on your phone, or again, you can like with any with all these brokerages, you can just turn on the reinvesting programme. So when your shares get paid out, whatever your dividend is $100, or go and buy you 10 more shares in the company. And that will just rinse and repeat. And by the wonder of compound interest, if you make a 10% return your money doubles every seven years, which is absolutely crazy, right with just how it works. And so I was recently went to the UK for three weeks on holiday, the longest hole I’ve had in years. And on the middle week, we went to this little island called Lanza rotting, which is owned by the Spanish I suppose. But off the coast of northwest Africa is in a bit of a weird spot, the Canary Islands, and I remember sat on a sat on the lounge one day and I pulled up the app on my phone, I was like, Oh, the dividends just came in and dropped a few $1,000 in my account. And I was like no, I’m gonna reinvest that. But it’s that’s you know, is the sort of passive side of dividends is a is a beautiful thing, which I know you’ve talked about before with Derrick Foster, and some of the companies you can buy directly and get dividends. And then there’s these other funds where you can buy the ETF and because they use covered calls, they get a little enhanced amount of dividend.

 

Erwin  

And we realised but yes, tax optimise

 

Tim  

tax optimised, obviously covered calls and options trading in general is benefits from volatility. So like in the current market, we’ve got them, no doubt their premiums are pretty good. So but yeah, it’s kind of one of those, for me, it’s like a long term buy and hold, set it and forget it, I don’t need to look at it, it just you check your account once every couple of weeks. And there’s there’s money in there. Because it just, it just works like they pay when they say they’re gonna pay, you know, chasing people for rent, like these big, multinational companies, and they just put up the money in your account, you don’t do anything. So I don’t know what could be more passive than that. Like I said, the only non passive part of it is for people who get a little bit in their head about checking their portfolio, and what’s the portfolio value, and oh, my god, the market is down 2% today, so I’ve lost this much money. Well, no, you haven’t because it’s unrealized. So you just, you know, I was reading this book the other day, by a guy called Andrew Hallam. And he was basically saying that the best investors in this study who did the study, but the best investors are either dead, or they’ve lost their login details for their account. And what that means is, is that, you know, human interaction as it relates to tinkering with your portfolio is going to make you do worse, not better. If you’re buying like an index fund, like a vfv, or something which tracks the s&p 500. You just like, buy it, and then don’t touch it again. Whereas people want to think that they can beat the market or tinker around too much. And they just end up making mistakes. And that’s kind of one of the odd things for me as a previous real estate investor, you don’t get rewarded really for taking action in trading. In the method, I’m doing it you get rewarded for patients, you get rewarded for doing nothing like them. Just don’t, don’t touch anything. Just collect the dividends, reinvest them, spend them, do whatever you want, but then start trading in and out of things because they’re having a bad day or a bad week.

 

Erwin  

Well, it’s a bad year right now, but your, your doesn’t bother you?

 

Tim  

No, I mean, actually, like dividend investing is ideal for a bear market. Because whilst everybody else is like, Oh, my God, my portfolio is down 20%. Well, mine might be down a bit, but I’m getting paid every month. So then when I take that bunch of money and buy shares, and actually buy more shares at a cheaper price, because the market is down, so when it eventually recovers, then happy days. So actually, I mean, you know, I can’t remember the name of the person who said it. But some old wise man said that, if you’re young, and you’re still in the building phase of your investment portfolio, you should get down on your hands and knees and pray for a bear market. Because it’s the best possible opportunity to build wealth. You’re not gonna build wealth with like 2021 highs, because you’re buying at the at the top you wanted to be like, I mean, look at the people who bought at the crash of 2020. If you’re somebody who bought the bottom of that valley, by some kind of miracle, and just sat on it, you’d be, you know, double, triple your money or whatever it is.

 

Erwin  

You’re laughing. Yeah. So I don’t know if I told you but I’m incredibly proud of you. Thank you,

 

Tim  

you and my mom.

 

Erwin  

I haven’t shared this with you, but we’re always changing stock hacker Academy, when we’re doing even more things within it, to try to encourage people to have your kind of your kind of results. Right? I don’t know how to explain it. Yeah. Well unveil it on number 12. Yeah, it just again, understand your journey or gave us ideas on things what we should highlight more in the course and spend more time on it. Okay. So for example, Derek, Derek is involvement is greater than ever. And also, Derek’s actually positive on the year if you can imagine that. Yeah, it means invest in retired 20 years successfully. And I’m really excited to see to share with with our community the new product that comes out number 12, that we announced in November 12. Yeah. So actually, you have a podcast or on anxiety. And you talked about anxiety earlier? Is that part of the reason why you wanted something in investment? That gives maximum peace of mind? Yeah,

 

Tim  

absolutely. Like, I know, my own mind in terms of worrying and trust me, like, I don’t even look at the news on my phone, or on my computer, I don’t have Facebook or Instagram on my phone anymore, because I don’t realise that those things trigger me as a person. And of course, everybody’s different. But I think that peace of mind is worth for me not having to check those things. And knowing that I could literally like, you know, go on a silent meditation retreat for six months and come back and everything would be fine. Makes me feel really good. I’m still there’s still things I want to achieve in financial terms and things I want to achieve in life. But I’m sort of acutely aware of the fact that we only have one life in terms of amount of time to spend or put things to put attention on. And at the moment, my kids require a lot of my attention. So it’s nice to be able to give it to them. And and so yeah, through my podcast, the anxiety podcast, I talk about financial stuff on there sometimes but but yeah, for a style is definitely something that fits well with with me in terms of not having to be plugged in. Because if you look at CNBC or any of the financial websites, they are, there’s red tickers and crazy things going on and flashing lights, and it’s designed to make us scared like the the fear and greed index is a real thing and angry to make you Yeah, the trigger. And we yeah, we know that the financial experts are correct 43% of the time, so you’d actually be better off flipping a coin to decide what the future is going to be like than asking a financial expert on TV. So yeah, based on all those things, it’s kind of like, what’s the point of looking like for to have somebody’s opinion on whether inflation is going to get better or worse, or the stock market’s going to crash worse than ever, or this is the bottom is gonna bounce and go up. Like, it’s just all completely irrelevant. If you’ve got dividend money coming in, you’re reinvesting it or spending it, you’re in things because you know, we’re going to be around for the long term, like, you just don’t need to, you don’t need to engage in that.

 

Erwin  

So you’re just for kind of an extra anxiety, I’d imagine a lot of people have anxiety did a lack of money. But it’s funny, like, we have to be able to tolerate a lot of anxiety, being professional investors, in order to get to where you are, which is like no anxiety.

 

Tim  

You never really escape it completely. I think it’s a human emotion. Weirdly, when I started the podcast, I feel like anxiety was a much more stigmatised word. But after the pandemic, everybody seems to relate to it in some way, in terms of like, uncertainty around the future. But yeah, I think, I think it’s definitely finding something that people without a lot of money are more anxious around me and their basic needs, you know, they might think of retirement as like a luxury that they can’t get to. But that’s just when the work comes in. You know, that’s when you just start putting away wherever you can, and start building up the snowball wherever you can, and getting it rolling. And if that includes looking a bit harder or working on, you know, purchasing a house, and again, some appreciation that way. That’s the way it goes. You know, sometimes you’re not opposed

 

Erwin  

to people taking on more in order to get ahead. But back at some point,

 

Tim  

yeah, I think there’s times in your life when you need to sprint based on your age and your circumstances, there’s things I wouldn’t do to get ahead. Now I might have done in the past, but you know, people are often talking about, I’m going to take a look at home equity line of credit, not quite as good these days, because interest rates are bonkers. But people historically might have taken a home equity line of credit invested it, you know, borrow that 3% invest in something making 10% and then arbitrage money that way. It’s nice not to have to do that. It’s just weird being at this stage in my life, where it’s the first time I’ve ever not had a mortgage or a car payment or any commitment beyond just you know, basic living expenses, that’s probably the best feeling to have is that I could save money based on our expenses or at the moment, we just don’t need to at the moment, but if I had to sort of tighten the belt a little bit, for whatever reason, we could do that. I mean, there’s even with dividend paying stocks, you know, in extreme circumstances, they do sometimes reduce the dividend a little bit or stopped paying him for a couple of months but it seems to take very, I mean, there’s lots of in a dividend aristocrats or companies have been paying dividends monthly for 50 years. As you know, so if you think of everything we’ve been through, it’s going to take quite a lot to upset that applecart.

 

Erwin  

If something really bad happened if like one of our banks stopped paying dividends, from

 

Tim  

Canada with all banks and utilities, companies and stuff is extremely strong. And then obviously a lot of these funds will then invest in like the NASDAQ or tech companies as well. Tech companies are obviously recent, all time lows at the moment. So it’s good to undertake some up but yeah, that’s the the other thing about the mindset is, is that you get into this mindset, like Green Days are kind of nice in terms of the market, because we’re all is happy and things are going up. And then red days is like well, this is an opportunity to in a dividend paying stock world. As the price drops, the yield gets higher, assuming the dividends stays the same. So ones where they’ve you know, there’s there’s a fund in Canada called ei t, which is a canoe fund has been around since 1997. It pays 10 cents per share per month. And it’s it goes through lots of periods of time where it costs you around $12. So you’re gonna get 10% per thing that’s been paying out 10% since 1997. Seems pretty good. Right? And they hold if you look at what they hold on hold like Bell Canada, and Ambridge isn’t Johnson? Yeah, they actually don’t have a very light on tech actually, which is why they consistently do well. But yeah, they’re basically very much in the staples in the staples game. So that is an example.

 

Erwin  

It doesn’t move much. But but but it because it pays. Yeah.

 

Tim  

And again, it’s a mindset change from growth investing where you buy Tesla, and it goes from 200 to 1000. And or

 

Erwin  

even buy houses argue that this is a bit of a growth strategy. Yeah,

 

Tim  

the dividend stocks, a lot of them are just like flatline. Price wise. They go up and down with the with the turns, whacked the banks have been whacked lately. Yeah, but you have to in order to look at the real return, you got to factor in the dividend return. And if you factor in 10% a year and compounded over time, then they may not make quite as much as the growth model as in just investing in the s&p 500. But it’s pretty close. And it’s way less stressful. So if you made like nine and a half percent instead of 10 and a half percent, but you get there’s something psychological about getting paid every month, because we’re so culture to get wages and salaries and all this stuff from our whole lives, see him money get dropped into your account every month for me, it just makes me feel good. Versus riding the growth train, which might make you more money in the long term. But it’s just a personal preference, right? You can’t put a price on mental health and how you feel about things.

 

Erwin  

Tim, apologies for being nosy, but probably about two of our 17 listeners will want to know how much does one need to invest to, to generate 1210 to 15,000 and passive income a month get accounted for you want to see it?

 

Tim  

Well, if you think about the $4 million, right? I mean, if you think about percentage returns, then my portfolio maybe averages 10 or 11%. So you can reverse engineer them out from there. Some of these very safe and steady. I think he it is like pretty much a golden goose as it relates to the type of thing I’m talking about the canoe Fund is a great example. But if you buy the right time, like I did, it pays 10%. And a lot of people would think that’s like a lot of old school people think 10% is a very aggressive, great return. The other beautiful thing about dividends depending on your province is they’re taxed extremely efficiently. If you live in, you know, Ontario, British Columbia, for instance, you can make like 100 grand of eligible dividend income and pay by a small amount of tax on it as it relates to, you know, employment income. So there’s things like that as well. And if you share it with your spouse, and there’s all sorts of other cool stuff to check out, but But yeah, if you could build a portfolio around 10%, then there’s lots of opportunities to do that with things which will consistently pay out. There’s also once the payout 15% and 20%. And getting aggressive. Yes. There are some there are some crypto ones which are a bit newer, and they pay a dividend. And you also hold crypto as well. And they’ve bought some of those they’ve dropped a bit and they reduce the dividend but you just again, you just sit on it and wait. And that will go through its own evolutionary cycle and

 

Erwin  

come back. Right, folks, this is financial advice,

 

Tim  

  1. financial advice. And as we talked about earlier, like there’s things I’ve done in my investing career where I’ve done some some mortgage lending, and it hasn’t worked out and I’ve lost money. Now everything you think is going to be the holy grail in terms of getting that passive income goes completely away. But I just you know, I just set it to the side as a learning experience and move on and try and find something else. And the way I’m doing at the moment may change and may alter as well. It’s just based on the world and the ability to make money. I think investing in large companies that have been around for for decades and decades seems to be a pretty steady road to just build things up. So there’s some

Erwin  

way stock hacking follows this very similar model to the funds that you’re investing in. Yeah, boring stocks, sell cover calls. And you know, I can I try to target like 10% returns. But But 10% is much better tax wise, when versus people who are lending for 10%. Like knowing what you know, now, would you ever lend your money again? No, especially your tax rate?

 

Tim  

Yeah. But it’s also just because for peace of mind, like I just don’t need I don’t need to do that. And anybody phoned me up, I don’t have to phone anybody else up. I mean, that’s

 

Erwin  

you control your money? Yeah, you could push buttons, it will be cash in your bank account.

 

Tim  

Yeah. And like I said, most of you know, I don’t do the when I first started, I did the drip thing, which is just as soon as you get paid out X amount of shares, or buy as many as it can, that you got paid in the dividend in the same company. Now I just, I get it all paid in cash. And then I just sit there and look at my portfolio and say, right, where do I want to top up percentages to make sure I have, it’s kind of like, diversity within diversity, because the funds themselves hold a bunch of companies. Some of the funds hold a bunch of other funds inside them. So they’re, it’s pretty universal diversified. And then I’m diversified myself in terms of like, I’d like to have not too much with any one particular provider and kind of spread out that way. So yeah, I don’t foresee any large changes, there are people and I know of people who are in where we’re at, at the moment, they say, right, when real estate comes down, again, they’re gonna get aggressive and start buying a bunch of properties. I just don’t, I don’t want to do that. Because I just like the easy life, to be honest. And I just like the the peace of mind is more valuable to me than trying to double my money again, again, as we talked earlier, I’m still working and bringing revenue in. So at the moment, I just reinvest in my, my dividends anyway. So it is continuing to grow just by virtue of leaving it alone.

 

Erwin  

So gonna have the benefit of having private conversations from you, but you have the option that work as much as you want, and not work as much as you want, right? Yeah,

 

Tim  

yeah, yeah, I’m a realtor. So I can, you know, during the two years of the pandemic, I was extremely busy, like a lot of realtors, and a built up a really nice base of clients. So now I just spend a lot of time taking care of them, and following up with them and making sure they’re taken care of and catching up with them. And, you know, I feel very fortunate with the job because it’s a lot of hopping around to see people for a cup of tea, or going out for a coffee or something. And I built my realtor business through prospecting, like crazy as well. So it’s the same kind of model where I spent a long, you know, I’d sit down for three hours a day in front of my computer, I would run Google ads, and I would just cold call, and phone people. And I pull up lists from the phone numbers from the internet. And I would go knock on people’s doors or their houses and just hustle hard, seven days a week for 18 months to build up a bit of a base. And then it’s kind of like, you know, like all these things, it’s kind of like launching a rocket or taking an aeroplane taking off, most of your fuel is used to get started. And then once you’re started is like right now I can, some days only work for a few hours, because I’m just going to phone a few key customers maybe have a meeting and then I’m like, I’m good, it’s fine. Now historically, I would have beat myself up and said, you need to do eight hours because at some point, somebody in history said nine to five, Monday to Friday, that’s the industrial thing to do. But now with the passive income working for me as well, I just think that, you know, if I’ve got the opportunity to hang out with the kids, or, you know, sometimes I just stop at lunchtime, and I go and work out in my gym. And that’s good. I can invest in myself then, which is important. So I love the freedom that it gives me to do those sorts of things. And I just feel very fortunate that I started in the moment in history when I did, and I worked out well. We have lots of I have lots of stories about opportunities I missed out on you know, I worked for a tech company, in my younger years that ended up getting acquired and I it turns out, I left like eight months before they got acquired and lost all my share options, which again would have been a nice big chunk of money. So you know, not everything works out. But I think if you keep trying and putting in the effort in then you kind of get there. So

 

Erwin  

amazing. Yeah. All right. Tim, we’re over time can ask you any final thoughts you want to share?

 

Tim  

I think my final my you know, the the thing that I’m sort of most conscious of at the moment is just how we spend time in our lives. And making sure you invest in the things which are really important to you. And if you’re at the stage where you’re still in the accumulation phase, and that’s, you know, listen to podcasts, reading books, get involved in communities where people are aggressively learning skills and trying to do things I think is a great place to spend it. That’s where I did and as I said to you offline before we started recording, I’ve always been the kind of person I like right real estate invest in student rentals. Let’s go now just like read all the books and take all the courses and meet all the people and you know, just I don’t know what it is my competitive upbringing environment that I want to learn as much as I possibly can to exploit this opportunity when

 

Erwin  

Never a competitive hockey player. Right? Yeah, exactly. being competitive.

 

Tim  

Yeah. And then yeah, and then I get, you know, I conquer that thing, whatever it happens to be, and I get there and I think I’m gonna do something different. So get stuck in and don’t be afraid to change. You know, I’ve gone from working in sales for a tech company and I started the anxiety podcast, I started coaching people life coach style stuff didn’t quite jive with that. So I kept the podcast, but went back to work for a real estate company, then I became a realtor. And so lots of my friends like you all over the place. And I’m like, Well, yeah, because I’m trying to improve my life. And I’m not gonna be satisfied with just, you know, this, isn’t it? And I’m not just going to do this to get a pension. I’m going to change me. We’re afraid to change.

 

Erwin  

Pretty cool. Don’t be afraid to change. Sam, thanks so much for doing this. Thank you for being open and honest, show us culture has been a real estate investing. That’s why SEO again, and again, I’m so proud of you for your success.

 

Tim  

Yeah, thank you. I you know, I attribute a lot of it. So relationships like ours, but we’ve just been continuing to keep in touch and all the help you gave me at the start. And yeah, it’s been good so far.

 

Erwin  

Amazing. All right, thank you again.

 

Erwin  

Before you go, if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forgive the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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UPCOMING EVENTS

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BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Building in Florida, Investing in Glamping in Ontario With Andrew Hines

Hello, back to school and back to routine, hahaha.

On top of that, welcome to another episode of the Truth About Real Estate Show, where we’re on this journey together for the most efficient path to our financial goals.

 
 
 
 
 
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A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

A quick note on financial goals: everyone is different, and that’s totally cool. Much like fitness routines, some want to be competitive bodybuilders, some want to garden.  Whatever one’s fitness program is, it’s better to do something, anything at all, than to do nothing.

I believe the same for investing; we all have different goals however, just like fitness, in my experience with investing and having 500 clients, including 45 self-made millionaire investors, the speed and efficiency one can arrive at their goal can improve with education.

What this downturn in the markets has shown me is how, sadly, many made uneducated decisions: more cash flow management, renovations, speculative purchases, and overleveraging.  This current market will sadly flush out the weaker investors and investments, while in my experience, we’re hearing from our clients they are buying and readying to buy in this dip.

Who knows if our timing is right, but my research is telling me this could be 2008 all over again: the best buying opportunity of our generation.

Only time will tell.

I’m trying something new with my morning routine. I’m coming into the office early while it’s quiet to get my non-urgent, important work done, for example, producing this podcast, completing the new book I’m writing, preparing for our iWIN Meeting on September 17th, a condensed economic update as part of my preparation for the Nov 12th Wealth Hacker Conference.

The Wealth Hacker Conference is a summary of Cherry and I’s journey as entrepreneurs and investors to the present. 

I used to be all about making tons of money, owning a 100 property portfolio, but my ambitions tempered once we got married and had kids hence we’re always looking for ways to grow our businesses, investment portfolio, and cash flow streams hence we have leading experts speaking to real estate, stock hacking, cryptocurrency while balancing happiness and raising kids. 

Cherry’s talk will focus on cash flow management as it’s a subject that’s extremely important in this current market and will likely save many small businesses and real estate investors from losing their shirts, as many have in the past 2.5 years.

That’s the IQ side. 

On the EQ or emotional quotient side, it’s been too long since our close community of investors has been together.

I literally almost shed tears at Seth’s multifamily conference in May as I haven’t seen so many of you for two or more years.  Thankfully I get invited to some smaller private, in-person events, but that’s hardly inclusive to our wider community, and based on who’s already bought tickets or sponsorship, pretty much all the who’s who are going to be there.

If you’re from out of town, start making plans for your road trip now, e.g. my friends coming from Ottawa all carpool and the networking on the road trip alone is worth coming.

Speaking of road trips, I drove our Model Y Tesla two hours up north for a golf tournament. Thank goodness it was the best ball as I was more terrible than usual, having not swung a club for over two weeks.  Joining me on the road trip were good friends Hussein Kudrati, the real estate lawyer and Kevin Hyunh of Empire Mortgages.  

From my experience at iWIN real estate, we’re seeing the best deals I can recall over the last 12 months. 

Hussein and Kevin shared their experiences and noticed the same: great deals. 

Yes, the real estate market could continue to decline as fear is high as we’re not seeing much competition from regular home buyers. We are, of course, being more conservative with cash flow forecasts, stress testing higher interest rates and longer lead times for permits and renovations.

One positive I’m hearing is with so many big players postponing projects, there will be more contractors available for work. Prices haven’t gone down, but at least renos can get done.

How long does that last? I doubt even 12 months, but we will see.

Building in Florida, Investing in Glamping in Ontario With Andrew Hines

On to this week’s show!

Our guest Andrew Hines I believe, needs little to no introduction.

He graduated from the top Business School in Canada based on my biased opinion of also graduating from the same school. 

Andrew is one of the good ones, having shared his losses investing in Ohio early in his investor journey; he’s built townhouse complexes and invested in high-end student rentals. 

Currently, he’s more focused on diversification by developing and building in Florida plus a start-up, 90-acre, high-end campground.

We talk about economics, where the market is going and when/where Andrew thinks there will be opportunities.

Have your pens and notepads ready!

 Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and me.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and, more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future, knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you, too, are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so, but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel; we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you by www.stockhackeracademy.ca, where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle, as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full-time musician who just made a 50% return in 2021.  Past, of course, does not predict the future, but if you’d like a free demonstration, go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right and click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration, I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners, and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Hello, welcome back to back to school and back to routine. On top of that welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show where we’re here on this journey together for the most efficient path to our financial goals. I believe the same for investing that we all have different goals hence no different than like fitness. In my experience with investing and having 500 clients, including 45 self made millionaire investor clients, the speed and efficiency one can arrive at their goal can improve with education. What this downturn in the market is showing me is how sadly, how many made I made good decisions around math cashflow management, renovations, speculative purchases and being over leveraged. It’s really sad out there. Fortunately, that’s not our clients experience them just speaking to other stories I’m hearing about from other groups of the current market will sadly flush out the weaker investors and investments in while in my experience we’re hearing from our clients that they are ready to buy in getting ready to buy in this dip. Just this past weekend at the meeting, I was sharing an MLS listing how this is the first time I can recall in a really long time where the pictures in the listing show a property in the middle of a renovation, for example, the kitchen is no longer there previous kitchens and taken out. So you just see patched drywall, and the bathroom, for example. There’s no toilet, the walls haven’t been painted yet, the tile shower has not been grounded yet. And then doing some for some context. Unfortunately, the seller purchased earlier in the spring, near the peak. And they’re renovating and looks like they ran out of money. So now they’re actually listing the property for a couple 100,000 less than they purchased it for. So these are not my clients. But yeah, like I mentioned, some of the weaker investors will be flushed out in this market. It’s really sad. It’s really sad. For ourselves though we don’t know if our timings gonna be perfect. We have no idea. But from the research from doing a lot of reading, this could be 2008 all over again, I don’t think this will be bad as bad as 2008 Real Estate this can be the best buying opportunity of our generation. Only time will tell I my crystal balls is as good as yours. On a personal note, I’m trying something new with my morning routine. I’m sharing kids, this helps anyone can walk into their office early before anyone else does. While it’s quiet to get my non urgent important work done. For example, I’m recording this podcast, I completed a new book and I’m writing. I’ve been prepping for all these presentations at the give including the one meeting that does pass on September 17, I had to work on a condensed economic update, which will form part of my presentation for the November 12 wealth hacker conference. Then uncovering some really interesting stuff, I think actually caught our government and some lies that are published on their own website. And I’ll be sharing these sorts of things at the wealth hacker conference. For those who don’t know, the conference is a summary of China’s journey as entrepreneurs and investors to the present. When I first started, I used to be all about making tonnes of money. Before I own a couple properties. I actually had a goal of owning having 100 property portfolio but my ambitions have since tempered you know after we got married and had kids parties changed, but we are always looking for efficient means to grow our businesses our investment portfolio and add to our cash flow streams. Hence we have leading experts on all the topics that you the listener interested plus I’m personally interested in well, we have someone who retired from stock investing. He’s a faculty member of soccer academy and Derek Foster. We have a cryptocurrency expert coming on it but also we have Jesse it sir, because he he’s at a point where he’s all about balance, Jesse is worth over 200 million, so he’s very rarely rich. But once you achieve a certain point of wealth and success, focus on it’s a change towards balancing happiness, raising your kids time with their parents, because our parents won’t be here forever. I think we all know that cherries talk will focus more on cash flow management as a subject that’s extremely important in this current market, and will likely save many small businesses and real estate investors from losing their shirts. Now she probably helped some into prosperity as well. But yeah, many small businesses and entrepreneur, real estate investors lost their shirts in the last two and half years. Again, that’s not our clients experience. This is what we’re seeing out there in the community. So that’s the IQ side on the EQ or emotional quotient side. It’s been too long since our community of investors has been together. I literally want to shed tears that sets multifamily conference in May, as I haven’t seen so many of you in for two or more years. Thankfully, I get invited to some of the smaller private in person events, but that’s hardly inclusive, like the smaller events might be 30 people at the most, usually the more like 235 But here’s an invite to the to be more inclusive to our wider community. And based on who’s already bought tickets and our sponsors, pretty much all the who’s who’s gonna be there. If you’re from out of town, please start making your plans for the road trip now. I plan a road trip like connect with others in your community, in your local community. For example, why Friends from Ottawa give me a large, pretty large contingent. We’re all going to somebody’s going to carpool. And you know, just do the journey together, meet up at the Big Apple together.

 

Erwin  

keep that conversation going on real estate and whatever else you’re interested in building wall. Speaking of road trips, I drove our model wide Tesla, two hours north for a golf tournament. This is a buddy’s golf tournament. Thank goodness it was basketball as I was terrible, more terrible than usual, having not swung a club for over two weeks. Joining me on that road trip was good friends who St. droughty, the real estate lawyer and Kevin Hayden of empire mortgages. From my experience in real estate, we’re seeing the best deals I can recall over the last 12 months. But you know, I like lots of data. So Kevin, and Kevin and Hussein being in the same industry as us, they shared their experience. And they’re also seeing great deals. Some even mentioned, they’re seeing prices back from like 2019. There are some sellers who are that motivated, they’re willing to give up the the appreciation from the last three years. Yes, the real estate market could continue to decline, as fear is at a high. And right now we’re not seeing much competition from regular homebuyers. It’s the more ambitious types like investors who are ready to get an earlier again, I think the market will keep continue going down. But again, I could be wrong. No one has a crystal ball. And we of course, in evaluating deals, being more conservative with our cash flow forecasts, or stress, testing higher interest rates, and expecting longer, longer lead times for permits and renovations. On the positive I’m hearing is that with so many big players postponing projects, like big players, like no other condo developers, there will be there’ll be more contractors available for work. Actually, that came out in the last unemployment report. When August is unemployment number came out of 5.4. The largest industry for lost jobs was actually construction. So unfortunate for them. Fortunate for us that we might have more labour available to do our own rentals. How long does that last? I don’t for very long, maybe 12 months, but we will see onto this week’s show. Our guest Andrew Hines, I believe leads little little to no introduction. He graduated from the top one of the top business schools in Canada based on my biassed opinion of also graduating from the same school. And here’s one of the good ones that’s out there. Having shared his losses early on investing in Ohio early on in his investor journey he has since built townhouse complexes. He’s invested in high end student rentals. Currently he’s focused on diversification by developing and building in Florida plus a start up 90 acre high in glamping. campground, of course, I think most of you know Andrew for him also from having one of the top podcasts in the Keene real estate investor space. We of course talk economics, we talked about where the markets going, when and where Andrew thinks there will be opportunities. So have those pens and notepads ready. This is a good one. Please enjoy the show. And your thanks for coming in. Thanks for having me. Let’s get you busy these days.

 

Andrew  

A lot of things my baby boy number one eight months old, almost nine now. So yeah, that’s that’s been a change, we’ll say. And, you know, we’ve got a lot lots happened actually, since the last time I was on here. I think it’s been what a couple years now bring about long. I think it was like, right, like, started 2021. So anyways, yeah, and we headed down to Florida since then, and, you know, got into investing down there and also picked up a campground and that’s had that’s had a lot of, you know, learning experiences included, and been something I think we’ll probably talk a little bit more about today. And we’ll

 

Erwin  

definitely talk about both those things. Just Just so we’re clear that they’re mutually exclusive. But campground is not in Florida,

 

Andrew  

campgrounds. Tober. Mari and then yeah, the Florida is an entirely different endeavour. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

yeah. It’s just those those two items keep coming up in our community. Florida, generally, us investing Florida seems to be by far the most popular destination for us investing and recreational, recreational short term rental is like Yeah,

 

Andrew  

yeah, so I don’t take any credit for the sort of short term rental side of things. With the Florida side of things. I feel like this always happens to me. Anytime I talk about something a lot, a whole bunch of investors end up in the same area. So I used to talk about well, and all the time, and then all of a sudden, well, it exploded. I was you know, early on, I’m like, There’s no way I could have any impact on these things. And I’m not tooting my own horn, but when enough investors because it doesn’t take that many to drive prices up in a market or to create a little bit of a movement towards the market. So I started talking about Cape Coral last year, and now actually have like a little community of people I know, says, you know, other people thought, yeah, we’re gonna get into Florida. Hey, you know, we’re looking at St. Petersburg, we’re looking at Tampa, Sarasota. And oh, Andrew, how do the numbers work where you are? And then I tell them the numbers are like, Okay, we’re coming down there. Yeah. So it’s funny, you know, community is really what it comes to. It’s not it’s not me, per se, but the community like people talk to each other. And the word gets out when there’s things that make sense. Yeah. And I think southwest Florida when we can dive into the numbers or what have you makes a tonne of sense. And a lot of the economics haven’t made a tonne of sense. So I think when you have something like that all it takes is some chatter for and people flocked to it.

 

Erwin  

It’s gonna be we would talk forever on how you got to Florida. We’ll touch on some of the things but yeah, the whole time for sure. X and

 

Andrew  

yeah, high level we can go over all of it. I mean, I think it’s not for the faint of heart, no one’s gonna go invest internationally, you know, if they weren’t compelled for a very sincere reason to do so.

 

Erwin  

Alright, you just said a mouthful person. My intention is I don’t mean to put words in your mouth but how glad Are you that you started a lot of this stuff before you had had your first child?

 

Andrew  

I wish I had done so much more

 

Erwin  

is the funny thing is like for my experience, like for example, the majority of our clients, they don’t come start investing in real estate till their kids are a bit older. Like eight, nine years old, or in high school or after university

 

Andrew  

that’d be easier. Yeah, I mean with with a newborn. I say this to people because I had no idea I thought everyone was being dramatic when they would tell me the horror stories. Tell me the horror stories of having a kid and how Oh, you’ll have no time enjoy your sleep where you can I’m like you’re being dramatic. Could you stop you know, let’s just take it easy. No, like the like the old nice dead. And this is like a new version in Jordan and I say the same thing like the oldest died and now we have you know the current current version, which I mean, love them. He’s so much fun. We just had to accept that like that life doesn’t exist anymore. And now it’s you know, Andrew and Jordan 2.0. And, but we’re we’re changing in a positive way. Like I mean, I Speaking for myself, like just really reaching out to people are really getting help building my team. Like these are things that I could coast by before and not do these things. It became a make or break scenario. Like I had to do it or I was done.

 

Erwin  

So I apologise for the hardcore real estate nerds like myself for listening, which is like dying to get into Florida. chemtron investor Yeah, but remember, we you and I use the golf a lot together. Every almost every week, almost every week. For example, when someone can’t make a tee time like they can’t the last minute the first people aren’t calling are people like yourself the old view? Single you are not single, the people who didn’t have kids. First People I call savvy call people like you, like Charles like Steve for before he had a kid. Yo, we needed me to force like I’m there. That’s the no did you?

 

Andrew  

Yeah. Well, I mean, I think that there’s room for that to come back. But I think as you know, yeah, like having a nanny, like we had a nanny over the summer. She’s left now we’re trying to, you know, sort that out again. And, you know, just everything in between a personal assistant and a nanny. And, you know, building out my team with my businesses like those are all things that can maybe help me get back on the golf course a little more often. So looking forward to that, because my game, sir, sure did suffer this year.

 

Erwin  

Actually, you’re just sharing now with your journey. And now being a father is a wonderful analogy for this life and business in general. You can’t do it by yourself.

 

Andrew  

No, you can fool yourself for a while, which I did. And I did have some help. But it didn’t have the kind of help I needed. And you hit that breaking point. Like, I think we all acknowledged procrastination is sort of the signal like I must be doing something wrong. If I’m procrastinating on this. It’s like your body, your mind is telling you you got to do to adjust here. And I think the next stage is like this point of despair, where it’s just like, what’s the point, I have no hope of catching up on all the stuff I have to do, which I was sort of getting to, even before before we had the baby. So then baby comes along. I’m like, wow, okay, well, things have to change. There’s no no way they could stay the same, which I think was a really positive thing. So I can thank my son for that when he’s a little older and can understand. But yeah, that that helped me, you know, push along. And you know, I hired my full time video editor full time assistant, both of them in March. And I’ve brought on an operations manager for my construction company. I’m now using a general contractor in Florida. These are things I wouldn’t have done before, I would have general contractor than myself, you know, try to try to do everything and then you know, burnout. And you can’t grow that way. And I think even with our campground, which we’ll talk about more like the team building, the amount of people that are in that organisation, the amount of help, and that’s been a learning experience, seeing just what can be outsourced? And how if you set the pieces up, right things can manage themselves, you have to have oversight, but you don’t need to be involved on a day to day.

 

Erwin  

Right. Okay, so I hope people are taking note, did you set a lot of really important points, oversight? And then you didn’t mention it, but I know you’re good at math.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, I like back of the envelope. Simple math, right. Things need to make simple sense.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. And so you’re managing your numbers, which is a great, so while you’re scaling up, so this is a really good segue as we get into real estate while you’re scaling up, you’re still watching everything and I think that’s been something that’s been missed by a lot of investors that we were talking about. Recording is many people missed on their numbers. And I’m talking about like overlap. For sure over leverage buying on the way up paying too much interest. You know, And yeah, it will

 

Andrew  

a lot of people aren’t cognizant of the ability to lose, right? I’ve lost, I lost back in 2012. I think a lot of people, you know, pie in the sky, like, you know, hey, look how good I’m doing. But the market was doing good. It wasn’t necessarily us it would did good. I always took a very clear look back on my projects and said, Well, if the market hadn’t gone up while I was doing that deal, would I still have been happy with that deal? Would I still have made money? And the answer wasn’t always yes. But the market saved me just like I saved a lot of people. And I’ve spent a lot of time pondering these things, I slowed down on my investing come like 2017, because the numbers started making less sense to me around here. And that’s when I started thinking, well, we’ll wait for this market to kind of cool off. But then it was obviously taking too long. So I started looking, okay, well, maybe Florida, maybe there’s other markets I can look at, I didn’t really want to go up to Sudbury and I was kind of battling my own challenges with no time. So was I going to take on distance investing, when I wasn’t really you know, delegating properly. So people, you know, long way of saying, you know, people weren’t really focusing on the fact that the deals didn’t really make as much sense anymore. They were counting on things to go up, they were counting on being able to have breakeven cash flow and low interest rates forever, which was never really that reasonable. So I was, you know, for me, I was thinking, let’s go find markets that haven’t been gone up by like crazy amounts, where the numbers are close to working, and it see what we can do. And that sort of led me to Florida and then also into the Airbnb side of things where, you know, you’ve got stuff that can generate a lot more than a typical rental.

 

Erwin  

Okay. Apologies. Gonna put a bit of a caution on this. I think for newbies, they need to focus on something preferably closer to home.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, for sure. Like me put it this way, like to hire a GC is a huge risk, I think across the board. Most new investors who hire a general contractor are probably going to get burned in some way. Because you don’t know how to ask the right questions. You don’t know how to vet these people in you probably are a little bit optimistic and want to trust when you shouldn’t. You know, I think that that’s something that people do. I did it early on, I wanted to trust the property manager I worked with in Ohio back in 2012. And the guy stole my money, he took my money, a lot of my house to be destroyed, and did it in a way where he act like the victim, like, you know, hey, you know, we’re just doing our thing, like getting things done. I’m like, Yeah, but how about that money? You have? Oh, yeah, I can send that to you. It was one of those. Oh, I’ll send that to you. Yeah, no problem. Call him again. The next week, can you send that to me? He owed me like 1000s and 1000s of dollars. And he said, Yeah, I’ll send it right over, never sent it. And eventually, after like months and months of that, Oh, this guy is actually just screwing me and pretending that he’s going to pay me like keeping things positive, I’d never witnessed that, you know, Service with a smile, we’ll call it or disservice with a smile. So I saw what people are capable of. And I’ve seen it in the contracting world, like, people are capable of some pretty nasty stuff and just sort of place your trust in a general contractor knowing that I would say there’s a good number of them out there that are willing to take all your money and not not do a good job. And that’s totally fine with them. I really started to focus on how do I find people who would have something to lose if they treated me that way. You know, the old way was I’ll do so much business with you, I’ll make them want to treat me well, because they know I’m going to do business with them with them long term. And the newer way was like coming into Florida. This is too new. I don’t know anybody here, I’m not even from here. Like I mean, I’m assuming most contractors, dollar signs light up in their eyes when they see somebody in that situation. Fortunately, I was coming in with some good experience and lessons learned. So I went to the RIA in Fort Myers, Florida. So on Gulf Coast, which is right next to Cape Coral, where I ultimately decided to invest, I wanted to find community, because I think community is so important. So then all of a sudden, I’m speaking with people who have been in this area for 10 years, and everybody talks in the investing world, everybody talks. So if you’ve got people who are doing good business, and that and you know, they’ve been able to do joint ventures for 10 plus years, and nobody’s talking trash about them, they’re still you know, they’re still coming to meetings. Now, all of a sudden, I think I’ve got a much better starting point to start interacting with people because they got something to lose. That’s the big thing. When I go to new markets now I’m looking for do these people have something to lose if they if they do something sideways? new investors don’t think like that, because new investors just want to trust that hey, this GC says they can do this. People talk people, people promise. I would say in the contracting business. 99% of promises are not fulfilled on time anyway, they might be fulfilled, but they’re not fulfilled or not fulfilled on time. We’ll have a forming contractor. Tell us Oh, we’ll be there on Friday. Don’t show up. Oh, okay. Something came up. We’ll be there on Tuesday. They don’t show up. Hope Thursday’s the day. Thursday happens. Oh, well, we’re all off today. Well, hang on. You said you’d be here on Thursday. You’re on vacation. You know that type of thing happens. And without experience. People just don’t know that this has come didn’t budget for didn’t budget for it. So you know, it started with the student rentals for me to GC my own stuff. I only had two to four months to do an entire renovation with an addition. And you know, getting anything done in four months is where the general contractors almost unthinkable. So we would do you know, partial guts, build an addition and close it and have students move in within a four month period. And so getting into that, that’s why I had to GC I wouldn’t have been able to do those projects otherwise. And still to this day, I don’t think I could have done them in the timeframe we did, unless I had my own employees working for me full time doing my own work, and some some subs, but I mean, at that time, I had probably 50% internal workforce. And then 50% sub

 

Erwin  

I know you mentioned before, can you share how many employees you had at that time? Or

 

Andrew  

just like four four or five like so like main carpenter site, super a couple of general labourers, and then another site super on a different site. But yeah, now I, now I’m about to have two in that. And then I have subcontract with my assistant is subcontracted my video editor subcontracted, but they are full time for me. Got it? Yeah. So but you have four or five employees on the tools? Yeah, probably three on the tools. Plus subs. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

got it. And it’s a, I think there’s more interesting to talk about here, just want to end the point with generally people who scale have in house staff, it has staff is so critical. Yeah. To keep the cost under control and schedule on control. It’s

 

Andrew  

tough, though, because like, then you’ll also see people who make a really good relationship with a general contractor and crush a lot of business. But you got to acknowledge that that general contractor is making a lot of money, like they’re building in a profit margin for themselves. And if that works for you, and it works for them great. In a market that’s going up in value constantly, that tends to work better. In this current market, I think we’re gonna see more people shift to this model with, you know, hiring your own staff, keeping them busy, like not Petia is a good example. He’s got his own full time crew that works on all his projects. So he knows, people aren’t going to say, Hey, I will be there tomorrow. No, you’re there today, or you’re not getting paid. So that’s very different in the employee relationship. That’s why things get done fast. Because downtime is huge. Like you’ve got, you know, between one trade and the next people say, hey, I’ll be there on Monday. Well, you say, well, this trade is finishing up Friday. So you’d be here Monday, they say Monday, but then they don’t show up until Wednesday. Now you’ve got two more days that the house was just sitting, if it’s your own employees, and they’re capable. Now all of a sudden, you’re moving a lot faster, less interest payments. However, you know, of course, the issue is you need to have enough business to keep these people busy. And people didn’t

 

Erwin  

understand that. Yeah, like I literally, I think we both literally know people who will take on projects, just to keep their stuff busy. Yeah. Yeah, I think risky. But I think Matt’s

 

Andrew  

actually offering his services out to other people, because I think he kind of scaled down a bit of his operation. So now he’s actually contracting for other people now keep his people busy, right, until, you know, things kind of come back around, which I mean, that’s another discussion we can have when you know when where’s the bottom? Where’s the bottom? If they keep raising interest rates? We’re not going to find that bottom for quite some time. But we’ll see. But anyway, so in the meantime, yeah, you know, he knows he’s got good people. He wants to keep him busy.

 

Erwin  

He’s smart. No, he’s a smart guy. You need to have him back on the mat if you’re listening, but you’re not.

 

Andrew  

He’s absolutely not listening. But you know, somebody can tell somebody will tell him tell him that. Yeah, yeah, definitely. He’s always a great conversation.

 

Erwin  

But again, a smart like, there’s lots of people still need renter contractors, and actually, it’s a part of a bigger story is people who do renovations, they’re still in short supply, even though there’s all these projects, like, for example, talk about Matt. Yeah, he’s pausing his own investing, yeah, to service other people as a contractor. And so my point is, contractors are still busy, even though there’s tonnes of projects being put on hold or not even happening,

 

Andrew  

but a lot of people are mid project. And I think what we’re really gonna see is it’s going to take like a year before you start to see a lot of developers didn’t do a new start, like they had something that was early in the in the stages, and they just decided, hey, you know, we’re ready to go for permits. But let’s just wait. And I think that that’s going to be a very common thing to see in the next couple of years unless these interest rate hikes level off or start to reverse. Because building expense has not gone down directly. Not yet. Anyway, maybe it’s true and labour, material and labour. I mean, maybe, maybe we’ll see once you know, a bunch of people get laid off. Now you’ve got all the sudden more supply relative to your demand. And maybe now we start to see it’s easier to get a contractor. It’s easier to get employees. And I’d be awesome. That’d be kind of cool. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

Like I wouldn’t mind starting to do some flipping through. Well, I

 

Andrew  

mean, we’re getting to a point like this whole market is changing. And now there’s a lot of people who will cry over the Spilt Milk and the money that they’ve they’ve in their head unrealized losses, versus looking at Holy crap, what an opportunity to buy a whole bunch of cheap real estate and cost average and do really well yes, the interest rates are higher, but the prices are going to come down relative and rents are on their way up. So there’s a huge opportunity coming, and one that I don’t think we’ll pretty much ever see again in our lifetime, which I think real estate is going on the other side of all this, the next boom period is going to take real estate out of the reach of the average Canadian completely.

 

Erwin  

I’m glad you say it because when I see it, I don’t believe it.

 

Andrew  

I 100% think that you’re already looking at affordability people can’t afford, you know, even their gas bills anymore. Like we’re going to a renter state and, you know, do you want to be the owner? Or do you want to be a renter, like, you know, build up your rentals. Now, the challenge will be for anybody buying something fundamental that can weather the storm, you know, the interest rates can survive a 10% interest rate. Because it seems like that’s the direction we’re heading. I mean, to undo the damage they’ve done with all this money printing and the fact that they’re still printing it. You know, when will be the right level of interest rate hikes, I didn’t think they would go this far. I didn’t think that they were willing to do something so ruthless when they were so generous before Oh, here it takes her to do all this. We just want to protect you will drop interest rates,

 

Erwin  

we’ll have appraisers that are going to come in because they shouldn’t come in.

 

Andrew  

It just it’s just crazy how they just flipped a switch. And now Now they’re out now we’re going to be responsible. Like there’s literally that quote of Justin Trudeau saying you’ll forgive me if I don’t think about fiscal policy. Like exact quote, you’ll forgive me he last. You’ll forgive me if I don’t think about fiscal policy. We’re going very much the other way now. So who knows where we go, how far down it goes. But I think that the, you know, there’s never a right or wrong time to know there’s probably a wrong time. There’s no right time to buy in this process. I think it has to be fundamentals, you’re going to find even if the market averages, you know, at point A, you could still buy something significantly below average, for a number that makes a lot of sense will cashflow even if rates go up further. That’s I think that’s where people’s heads need to be at

 

Erwin  

the sad thing that was that the best the vestments that our clients are transacting on, take a lot of capital. Like, for example, the opportunity that we’re seeing that we didn’t see we’ve almost never seen is single family to triplex conversion opportunities. That takes a lot of cap, you know, a tonne of capital. So that’s said the best opportunities are for those who have deeper pockets. People who prepare deeper

 

Andrew  

pockets can raise the money, yeah, more experience, for sure. Able to do those projects. But I mean to go in take all that time, especially when it’s so hard to get contractors. Now you’re looking at a project like that a year turnaround, probably in a year. Where’s that value gonna be? I mean, I think we can reasonably assume the rents will be pretty good. But will that work for you know, if you have to leave a few $100,000 in the deal? Is that okay? I think for lots of people it is, especially in our networks. But there’s a lot of people that that eliminates from that game.

 

Erwin  

Thankfully, we’re looking at some for example, where they have they have garages, two car garages that are hooked up hooked up for utilities. So we’re just we’re like, we never saw these opportunities, like six months ago. Yeah. Or like there’d be like 50 offers on? Yeah, I’m exaggerating, it’d be like six to 12 to 18 offers. But again, it takes a deep pocketed investor to be able to do these things, which is kind of sad for me, because I always I’m always pushing for the logo. I just want to see

 

Andrew  

the newbies. Yeah, when people buy the camera. Yeah, I don’t think there is an easy way to start from scratch. I mean, like, I know, a lot of people have listened to the podcast and when things were going up that worked. But now I feel like getting in and working for somebody, like just get into the industry somehow even part time work outside of your full time job. If you can volunteer. Come work for somebody like you and get coffee and just learn

 

Erwin  

for buddy up. Yeah, buddy. split everything. Split the mortgage. Split the work. Yeah, right. I ain’t gonna wind up. I ain’t going to Saskatoon to invest.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, that’s always how I felt. I didn’t want to do the distance. I mean, of course, Florida. I mean, but I kind of want to go there. I want to go down there. So I’m looking for excuses. So that you know that kind of works, but and Tomori to Okay, yeah,

 

Erwin  

you’re saying to me things because we’re going in different directions. Too many notes. Too many to me. opportunities for learning here. Let’s start with Florida. Cuz you mentioned it first. Yeah, it does. I’ve seen your numbers. It’s I can’t believe how cheap land is the start off of there. Why is the land so cheap? It’s not

 

Andrew  

as cheap as it was when I started. Well, yeah, so So may 2020. I started I don’t know, when I started buying, I think was right around the end of May 2021. I started closing on lots and they were like, anywhere from 23,000 up to 31,000. US saw us figures. Now lots are closer to like 45 in the areas that have been looking. And even

 

Erwin  

with everything’s coming down. Oh, yeah. Yeah. foreign markets strong. Yeah, I

 

Andrew  

mean, because North port and Fort Myers are in the top 10, two of the top 10 fastest growing cities in the US. So that area, like although the the interest rate pressures, you know, obviously to bring values down. The in migration is pushing it the other way. So that market hasn’t been hit like Ontario has. So

 

Erwin  

just to add to that, though, the insider information I’m getting a lot of people bring cash,

 

Andrew  

tonnes of cash. Yeah. 50% was with as of the last Remita meeting I went to it was 50% cash investors. I don’t know what it is now. But like over this boom period, 50% cash investors. Well, people serve cash buyers, sorry. And that means something different in the EU in the US in general, because when you say I’m buying cash, you can’t go get a mortgage. Like you can’t actually close with a mortgage whereas here you just don’t put their financing clause in and then you can still you can still add them or if they don’t do that they’re

 

Erwin  

if they have the cash but it’d be interesting context is often I have the financial means.

 

Andrew  

cash offer I have the financial means yes. Yeah, it’s literally cash. Yeah, literally cash. Yeah. So their real estate board was was saying 50% cash. So yeah, that’s big, a lot of money coming in. They’re easy. Yeah. And, and the biggest thing was relative price point, we talked about the lots for cheap. Well, the houses were cheap too, compared to here. Like if you think about what you get, comparatively. And I just looked at that. And I like we love Naples, which is about 50 minutes away. And we spent a lot of time there for last seven, eight years, every every winter, we’re down there. And so you know, I started going to the races just to see what was going on. I saw people flipping and doing things for low margin. And I’m like, I’m just not going to do that at a distance. That’s not, that’s not my skill set. And with my available time, they’re not going to do that. So your risk tolerance. Yeah. And but then I heard a guy that I ended up partnering on a deal with Dave, he was speaking on stage, he’s like, hey, you know, I build new construction. And here are our numbers. And the numbers didn’t look fantastic. But they look decent. And I just looked at what was the completed product? Why can we build for I’m like, I need to get a foot in the door with construction down here. And so I use it as an opportunity. I funded the deal. I actually completely self funded the entire deal at this point. No mortgage so far. And I don’t think we’re going to be it’s it just didn’t work out that way. But it was an opportunity. He introduced me to the builder. I said, Hey, you know what, I’m going to have to do this on my own too. So I am going to be dealing with Sherry, who he introduced me to, and we’re gonna build more together. And I’m treating this as part of a business strategy that I’m building out in Florida. Is that cool with you said yes, that’s cool. We have great relationships, he and I and I still use them as my realtor down there when you know, I’m looking for stuff buying stuff, asking him what I should build, you know, Hey, what should I build Dave? What’s gonna sell well, so he’s, he’s available for all that stuff. And yeah, that’s gone. That’s gone really well. So I kind of lost track of what what direction we were going with this. So feel free to direct me what you want to know,

 

Erwin  

ideas and what you’re investing in. Like? Yeah, it’s square footage cost per square foot. So

 

Andrew  

the first one I’m building which were drywall now pool is dug. We’re gonna be done.

 

Erwin  

You’re renting it out. You’re gonna rent it out.

 

Andrew  

This one I’m gonna sell. Oh, first one. First ones for sale. Yeah, spec. Spec builds spec builds. Yeah. Sorry, just

 

Erwin  

for the listeners benefit spec build is when you build it first. And then you sell it.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, exactly. So I guess I’m technically more of a developer on the deal than the builder. Because I’ve hired a builder, although you could call me the builder because I own a lot. So I hired the GC. And they did all the permitting everything. I spent a lot of time obviously getting to know what their operation and all that. But also Dave helped with that, you know, create a new connection. And yeah, so we’ve got 18 180 square foot, plus a three car garage. It’s four bed, two bath. There’s also an outdoor kitchen, there’s about a 250 square foot area for the outdoor kitchen on the patio. And then there’s a covered lanai. So that’s that’s a covered patio, but then there’s a cover Lanai, which is not covered, it’s the screened in area, with a pool, and all of that, I think my all in cost, including the lot, we’re going to be around 420,000 And that one,

 

Erwin  

so we’ll buy a bachelor condo, GTA for that.

 

Andrew  

So it wouldn’t be that number anymore. But that was based on what I could buy the lot for and what my building costs were when I started. But initially, when this was a concept, we were looking at maybe 499 list price, which wouldn’t have been a huge profit would have been a very small profit, that spec went up to 599. As of like, by the time I broke ground, that was what we were expecting we would list for, and now we’re sort of back down to thinking we’ll list it for you know, 580, something like that, at this point. Now, you know, granted, there’s another two months, but there’s a good good buffer in there based on what I paid for what I’ll be into it for. So I have another one going not too far from that like within a kilometre, or I guess mile we’ll talk miles This is Florida. And that one is downs, even bigger 2150 square foot. I think 2130 Actually, outdoor kitchen This one also has a hot tub and three car garage. I’m trying to stick with three car garage and everything just because I mean envy like I want a three car garage. Let’s all build it until I finally get one. Okay,

 

Erwin  

all kidding aside, it’s an investment you’d like. You think you have your investor cap on.

 

Andrew  

No matter what I mean, triple growth car garage is going to be a selling feature. Right, right.

 

Erwin  

That’s the want people to think that they need to the way they invest is how they would want to live.

 

Andrew  

Oh yeah. No, and I am calculated. I do like to think of things like hey, would I live in that? So I go after a consumer that would think similarly to me in certain ways. But yeah, I’m setting these up for families. The big thing is like the general contractor I’m working with it had set models they were already building and I am working with those models. So the big benefit there is Lee Times weightless. They know what they’re building, they order their trusses early. They order all the materials in that day and the mechanicals they need early. They’re soft costs and the saw in the process for for generating permit packages, it’s all very simple because they’ve done it so many times. So I’m very much okay with that. Of course, some people you know, I want a custom house, that’s super unique. Yeah, that’s not what I’m doing. And that would cost more to do. Yeah, this is kind of working within their parameters. But that works well for me. So I’m going to do my own things that are going to make these really awesome for the ones that I keep Airbnb, like, the second one I was talking about, I’m keeping that I did things that I wouldn’t have done if it was just resale like putting in the hot tub. I don’t think that necessarily I’ll make that back. But maybe it would

 

Erwin  

be hot for vacation rentals. Yeah, certainly

 

Andrew  

means especially like, if you think Florida and like January and February. It’s not it’s not as hot at night and stuff like hot tub would be awesome. Like anytime we go to Florida in the winter, where we want the hot tub. So putting that in was was big, but you know, just certain other things, I’m going to put in a bunch of palm trees in the back to just you know, make it go for Airbnb, and wouldn’t do that if I was just selling it. So there’ll be different things like that, that I do. So the bigger one, that one down will be in for closer to 450. And I think the values cost us 450. Yeah, yeah, the value on that one, probably somewhere around six or over six. So not actually as good of a profit margin if I were to flip it, but for me, I wanted you know, a nice big one that would work really well for Airbnb. And that’ll be kind of the starting point for Airbnb down there. And, and then we’ll go from there. But my plan is, you know, keep one sell one, keep one sell one, I bought 10 lots, and just keep sort of buying. I’m going to build a few more before I buy. Because I mean, maybe those prices come down a bit. And there’s no rush like now they’re plentifully available, whereas before they were a little harder to get. So we’ll, we’ll keep that moving

 

Erwin  

so many questions. Okay, what made this location make sense for you?

 

Andrew  

Well, Gulf coast here at great sunsets, you’re within an hour Well, probably 45 minutes from from my lats to like great beaches like Fort Myers Beach, which is like, you know, world class beach. And I think the Gulf Coast in Florida is just better for

 

Erwin  

Strong’s convention centres.

 

Andrew  

Cape Coral is more of my friend calls it the Simcoe of Florida like oh, it’s a very it’s very much a value play. Like it’s among the it’s like your, you know, bang for your buck, call it and I think from a vacation standpoint, as well is people get to go down warm climate that’s below the where they call it the frost line, you don’t get frost down that far in Florida, typically ever. And so you get all the warmth, you get to be in southwest Florida, at a price that otherwise you can’t really get in southwest Florida, especially being that close to water. Cape Coral is really unique because it’s the Canal City. There’s canals running everywhere. Not every law has a canal and my lats don’t I’m avoiding that. But there’s a lot of people who will have their their boat right out back from their house. And so they can take the saltwater canal through the city and get it out to the Gulf Coast. So it dumps onto a river that runs between Fort Myers and Cape Coral, and then they can go right out into the Gulf

 

Erwin  

a bit of a geek I can’t imagine the infrastructure cost to have it took a while.

 

Andrew  

Another thing that’s great about roads are expensive enough, it is the weird thing about kypros I feel like they thought the city was gonna be so much bigger than it was back when they they originally sort of organised it and put in all these roads and lots because the whole northwest part is like very very scattered like there’s one house on a street and then you’ll have a whole bunch of vacant lots on either side in every new house going in is really nice, you know, nice house more expensive houses. It’s a very very up and coming area. But all throughout Cape Coral, you’ll find just a vacant lot here vacant lot there. Don’t like you’re not like here No, I think for the longest time it was fairly stagnant. People weren’t really building much that’s geared up more in the last few years. And I think as values were coming up it was kind of helping things a bit. But you know, it’s the chance to get into a place where there’s no HOA like there’s no homeowner’s association where you’re when you’re restricted on what you can do we’re going to be a condo board right basically yeah similar to a land condo or like a common element condo where they can tell you how you can use your property and what you know what you can and can’t do so for it’s like an Airbnb or is paradise down there because you can actually Airbnb your property whereas like in Naples say like everything is a gated community of mine it’s like one small pocketed area and in all those gated communities you can’t even rent out your place well not all but some of them you’re not even allowed to rent your place so let alone Airbnb it or long term rental anything like that. It just to

 

Erwin  

clarify for the listeners benefit. These organisations determine how you can operate your property or even how you live Yeah, I like to have like no pets

 

Andrew  

like you can’t have no pets or you can’t have a trailer in your driveway and you You can be put away to be put away. What what colour? Are you going to paint your house? We need to approve it before you do it like things like that. Like they’re trying to dictate everything that you as entrepreneurs love being told what to do. Yeah. So I mean, it’s like the same reason I avoid condos, I would avoid HOAs these condos, it’s like there’s a loud slamming coming from your door, my wife’s condo. She sold it now. But they, the neighbours were all saying that the door kept slamming, we’re like, Well, there’s one small problem. No one’s been in the condo for three weeks. So this couldn’t have been us. But you get into things like that with condos. So

 

Erwin  

but all condos are do that with the negative pressure in the hallways like the doors? Oh, yeah,

 

Andrew  

exactly. It was just silly. It was just silliness. So, you know, just just getting away from all that you’ve already got the municipality telling you what you can and can’t do, let alone you know, let’s not go go there. So I really like it. For those reasons. I think that there’s a huge value play from an Airbnb standpoint. And then if that doesn’t work, I mean, rents are being pushed up. And the price point makes a lot of sense for the actual value of the house. So I’ve got some exits, I can sell them, I can rent them long term. I mean, they’re not going to be cash cows long term with the interest rates. But you know, there’s a play there. There’s there’s several ways to write to sort of quote unquote, exit as needed

 

Erwin  

if needed. It sounds like you’ve taught business before. All this lingo I don’t even know about US News and people.

 

Andrew  

I don’t know. Like, I don’t know how much of it was was, you know, formal education or just experience like going through? Like, I think I’ve always been a bit of a critical thinker. Even as a kid, my mom told me, like, yeah, I just see a sit in there, like just often space thinking. I think I’ve always sort of done that just kind of evaluate things critically ask a lot of questions. And what if What would I do it right. And the negative to that is it’s caused me to be very slow at taking action in recent years.

 

Erwin  

Think of all the condo speculators right now trying to figure out how to get other cars there,

 

Andrew  

which I was our contract. I was purely saying, don’t do that, from the start of the podcasts. I’m like to go speculate on on condos in Toronto. Sure. It seems great. grass is always greener, what happens when that changes, you have no exit. If you have no cash flow, imagine being in a place where you have no cash flow, and it’s worth less than you paid for it. That’s just a lose lose scenario. One you never want to find yourself in. So just I think that these are the discussions with the podcast that people really enjoy hearing, like breaking ideas down and saying why is something inherently just not a great investment relative to another investment? Not to say that somebody with 1000 properties, couldn’t pick up a few pre constructions in Toronto and do really well. It’s just, you know, can you afford to lose? And will you care if you lose? You know, those are two important questions to ask yourself, which I think a lot of people don’t. People don’t ask themselves, they would care. But they don’t ask themselves that question. I just want I want to get into a couple of contests. I see people making money. Yes, that works until it doesn’t work. And some people won in spite of themselves. But it was a risky position. And it is. But for some people that makes sense. And some some it doesn’t. And there’s there’s no hard and fast rule. That’s good. That’s bad. For some, it’s all relative to whoever’s in. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

I don’t want to beat up on condos. But here’s a current example is people with cancelled condo projects, right? Versus I bought a house like I personally like to buy when I can see in touch. You don’t want to buy a concept. Yeah, buy paper. Yeah, I don’t want that’s just me. And then for example, I bought in 2020, versus people who bought bought a condo, and now they can’t close. So sorry, the price is cancelled. So yeah,

 

Andrew  

so pre construction, and those agreements probably gave the builder an out, we could we could choose not to build this. And if we do then then that’s that

 

Erwin  

attending. So one friend has agreement. He’s gonna get paid interest, okay, on percent on his deposit. 6%. But he lost on how much equity appreciation? Yeah, during that time. You know,

 

Andrew  

I mean, he was he was still would have been up if it was Bill. Oh, yeah. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

I told like we did the math, but the builder wanted more money to close. So even with the extra money, they would have made sense. Yeah. But he backed out. And then so like all so with the terms opportunity costs, I made equity gains on my properties. Yeah, he’s what he’s got his money back with 6% interest.

 

Andrew  

At the end of the day, though, like, we’re all seeing our real estate values come down to three now, right? So it’s the ability to not care about that. That is going to be the proof of whether you were doing it right or not.

 

Erwin  

I care about everything. Like, I have a basement rented for 1200 bucks right now, like 1800 a day. So I still care. No, not hurting,

 

Andrew  

like care. Like, you have to care in the sense that it adjusts your strategy, but not in the sense that you’re going to lose sleep over it

 

Erwin  

or gently funding your doctor tenant. No. Hey, you said you were gonna buy a place when you moved in this role of your short term thing, because my rent would be $100 higher if they laughed, they laughed.

 

Andrew  

Sounds like it might be a time to do an N 13 Rescue renovation and

 

Erwin  

it was too late. It doesn’t mean anything. Sorry. I digress. Any other final thoughts on Florida you’re liking it. You think you’re gonna go through with all 10 all 10 Lots, build and sell Oh, well. I

 

Andrew  

actually have a One coaching student that I made that wanted to be brought into the fold on what I was doing in Florida. So I brought him on, he’s actually buying one of mine that are ready to go for permit, because it’s already had the survey done. So one of them will be gone. I’ll keep building and, you know, until the numbers change, why not? Where else is going to make as much sense? You know, I guess that’s rhetorical that for me, like, I think that that just, you know, people are still going there, you know, whereas this market is going to keep dropping for quite some time. Who knows? Like, I hope not. But in Florida, I think, yes, there will be pressure downward, but it won’t, it won’t be hit as as extremely, because they only recovered their 2008, high about two years ago. So like, you know, we had a drastically different economic climate here in Canada than they’ve had there. And to them, they were they were screaming, hey, this is unsustainable, look how high you know who can afford $300,000 for a house, I’m like, you don’t know.

 

Erwin  

Like many Canadians in urban Canada,

 

Andrew  

like coming from where I’m coming from, I have a good perspective on this. Not to say that, you know, things should be that much higher. But specifically, from property managers down there, I’ve heard them scream, you know, how can people afford to pay more, and I don’t know how they will. But they’ll find a way. Like, it’s all supply and demand. If people need a place, there will be you know, maybe families move together. And you know, two families live in one, but you’re gonna have it, it’ll happen and it is happening, the rents are going up significantly. So these are just conversations from year and a half, two years ago, there was nothing

 

Erwin  

there. Again, they’re getting strong population moving in, and moving away from other

 

Andrew  

families like so you’re gonna see all kinds of new industry popping up in there in that area, Southwest Florida specifically, and other areas, too, but I’m not really focused on the other areas.

 

Erwin  

I think most people know if they’re listening to this podcast, generally know, the world’s pretty effed up and a lot of places very much. So pretty much all of those millionaires are going to somewhere where it’s not effed up. Yeah.

 

Andrew  

And I don’t think like the USA or in general is that place but I mean, where is that place anymore? Like, third world maybe go to the go to the third world less organised.

 

Erwin  

You want to go? I don’t know. No, no personal safety. My wife’s never going to agree to any of that. The only reason that private island on the whole island yourself I don’t know like and I feel it’s the thing that is also that I still conservative, I was lucky as messed up as we have things are here. And it’s messed up this world is this is way more messed up than the rest of the world. Yeah,

 

Andrew  

it’s like a competition who can be more messed up like everybody’s fighting for it at once. Justin Trudeau raises up the ante and then Joe Biden does similar. And here we are right back.

 

Erwin  

Like, like throwing lip matches at China like geez guy.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, it’s an interesting, interesting world, to say the least. And it’s that all you know, I think that all contributed to my being a little bit slower to take action in the last few years, just like trying to spot where are things going, you know, what’s actually going to happen. And so far, I’ve been right about way too much about all this in the economic direction. I’d love to see, you know, opportunity turned around. And I again, I do think there’s a lot opportunity coming up right now.

 

Erwin  

But from the outside view, will you’re right here, you can tell me if my view is correct. You’re still buying hard assets and assets that will produce

 

Andrew  

Yeah, yeah, just you know, it’s got to pass that fundamental test, right, like back people used to do 1% rule. And then that went away for a while. Well, that’s obviously coming back. And, you know, maybe we can up that to a 2% rule, who knows how crazy things get. But that’ll be all stuff that we have to remain aware of, like, can we find deals like that, and, and I think with more opportunity, like more properties on the market, you’re gonna have more opportunity to have sellers who are in a situation where they got to sell, and there’s a number that works for them, that could really work for you as a buyer. And those are the deals that we as investors need to be keeping our eyes out for.

 

Erwin  

We think we’re seeing that right now. Time will tell it’s

 

Andrew  

without question. If you have more property sitting for longer, there are going to be people with personal situations that just they can’t wait. And those are, those are opportunities, because you can do them a real solid by by getting them out of the deal they need to get out of for a number that works for them, but it also really works for you.

 

Erwin  

And I just like to add to that people, some people will say we’re bad people, but the seller needs the Quiddity

 

Andrew  

Yeah, sell it right. You’re making them an offer and they have the right to refuse it. So but if it works for them, they’ll accept it.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. Would you prefer no liquidity? Yeah. Would they prefer the bank ticket back? Oh, you want the bank to take the property but we’re the bad guy. Yeah, exactly.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, the whole thing with the wholesaling thing I always had like I always felt a little bad for the seller So Michael, you get it for so much less but some of them are perfectly happy with so much less I don’t agree with ever like misleading them or anything like that. But I mean, if you’re transparent with them, and they say hey, yeah, that works. I can do that. Yeah, then you have a deal.

 

Erwin  

My experience is a lot of those sellers just hate Realtors I don’t blame them. So they refuse to work with a realtor. They’re generally refusing the best exit

 

Andrew  

possible. Oh, yeah. Like the ones who take the wholesale deal. They take less money knowing but I think A lot of them, it might not be a hate, but it’s like, well, we just don’t want people coming through here. We don’t want to go through that. I think that’s a big pain point for people. Oh, really like three months listed with people coming through here all the time. Like, I don’t want to do that. Look at how messy this house is. You mean, you’ll just give me this number and we can be done with this. Okay. Yeah. Amen to that. They don’t know what I can do. They haven’t called

 

Erwin  

anyone. Seriously haven’t just we can help them a lot better than anybody else can.

 

Andrew  

Yeah. And no doubt. There’s always other opportunities, other ways to proceed. And you’re right, they probably don’t know.

 

Erwin  

Excellent. So we talked about one 2%. That actually leads me to more aggressive strategies, like short term rental. So that kind of brings us to what’s Wait, what’s the, what’s the campground called?

 

Andrew  

So the campground is Maple Ridge family camp. And that’s in Miller, Lake Ontario, about 20 minutes south of Tobermory, and torn was beautiful. Yeah. And I spent a lot of time up there. So my mother in law has a cottage in just north of sobble. So we would go up to Tobermory as like a little day trip, and we would go to Lions Head and the Grotto, which are all you know, within a 40 minute drive of where we were. And so when this opportunity came up, where we’re like 20 minutes between all those places, I’m like, wow, this is this is pretty much the most central you could be on the Bruce Peninsula, in the middle of all the things people want to go see. And we knew Airbnb was a big thing. Like there were cottages up and Saville getting like $1,200 a night on like weekends and high season during during the lockdowns. So, knowing that I wanted to get into Airbnb, but I wanted to do it in a way that I could scale. Like, there was actually a, you know, a possibility of, you know, generating a million dollars in revenue. And when the campground came up, initially, I was hesitant. But I did see that the opportunity to scale was there. So what we did is we actually came in, and we had a bunch of seasonals, 25, seasonal renters that had trailers on the site, and

 

Erwin  

started just to slow it down. They rented the spot. Yeah. So they pay for parking, they basically

 

Andrew  

pay for parking and utilities, so to speak. Yeah, so they have a connection desk, or Yeah, we have 14 of our 25 had sanitary connection, but get this, the owner was actually pumping out the tanks of the other 11. So they had like a tank on the ground that hold like 300 gallons of sewage. And he would come around with his little honey waggon on the back of his lawnmower, and he would pump them out and put them into the mains sanitary drain. So we obviously looked at this for like, there’s just no way, like, that’s not happening. And so we had to give the the rough news to the, you know, the existing tenants, they, you know, their contract didn’t get renewed. So the previous owner didn’t renew them specifically at our request, because we didn’t know exactly what we were going to do. But we ultimately gave them the news that we’re not renewing and we we asked them to, to leave so to speak. It was unfortunate and obviously it was news that they didn’t want but they were paying less than $2,000 per site per year. And those numbers were so far from making any sense at all. We just couldn’t keep that it would just wouldn’t work. So yeah, that finally did all unfold. We got everybody off sort of you know, mid May and then we we you know we’re renovating we bought some trailers some of the people leaving just said hey, you can buy our trailer we were able to make use of one of those in our glamping facility and then we’ve got how many did you buy and how many were of use Ah, if we probably bought like five five from people leaving and out of those like some of them will make good employee accommodations for next year but they were not at the calibre that we would have needed to to rent out on Airbnb. So what we did to start is we went in with glamping tents so we had platforms built we put 230 square foot tents with queen sized beds in them and we had our management team deck them out and Pauline has great vision she you know she could moonlight as a designer I guess she started does with us and she so she decorated them and made it all work and we got those listed at the end of June. We were full for for July on those you know renting around 200 bucks a night and

 

Erwin  

just take a pause there like if hotel doesn’t give you a Twitter night

 

Andrew  

that would be the next one okay, but these are like an experience like people want to go there to like Instagram shot like we’ll have people like go do yoga poses and post reels and tag us. You know there are people who want an experience so even going into the fall now as weather gets cold we figured our trailers would start booking up more because they have heat and no people are still booking the tents even into October people are booking the tents. I’m like, Do you know how cold it gets the camp and October heated? Not the tents.

 

Erwin  

Oh, but when it was heated sorry.

 

Andrew  

The trailers are heated.

 

Erwin  

Okay,

 

Andrew  

we’ve got right now I think we have four or five trailers for rent on Airbnb and they do have heat sources. And the tents are not they’re not but you know got extra blankets, it’s still really cool. But, you know, camping in October, you gotta be ready for that. So, yeah, that’s sort of how that progressed. And, you know, the hardest thing has been manpower, you know, we spent a lot of time making the site look better cleaner, you know, getting rid of extra brush, you know, prepping sites, merging sites, there might have been two sites that really small we merge them together. And our tent glamping is phenomenal, like the sites are completely treat in, you know, the, just check out our stuff for anybody watching or listening to get away glamp and see how nice these these 10 sites are. So it was a combination of, you know, being so secluded, and then having a really unique experience has done well for us. Plus, our location is right in the middle of all these prime things that people want to go to. So that that part’s worked out really well, we had a good solid year, but we started late. So we’re looking forward to next year, having a proper run out will be advertising through the winter. We’ll be looking forward to having people you know, tenting with us in May, whereas this year, we didn’t have any glamping rentals pretty much until the last week of June. And that was very minimal. Yeah, he’s it’s been a roller coaster, but we’re finding our bearings. Like it was just such a such a learning experience so much to know. But you look at full on business, it’s a full on business, while you’re doing it up. Yeah, so we still have that traditional camping part. But then, you know, we’re our focuses and growing the glamping. Because traditional camping, you know, you just you get a lot of people who are just looking for a cheap place to stay, it’s cheaper than that cheap. And you can do that doesn’t really fit that well with our clientele. You know, I’d say with our camp, our prime clientele is families who want to go for an experience. But the reputation of the site over previous years was a good place to go to do group camping for parties. And that is just in complete opposition to families and they don’t they don’t mix well. It’s like oil and water. So what we’re transitioning away from is the group camping we don’t really want that on our site, because it just attracts people who want to get a bunch of friends together, drink, make noise. And these are things we had to learn. We thought hey, group camping, that’s kind of cool people tent on bigger site. Now that’s not so great for us. But you know, we have wild campsites that are secluded for people who want to do the traditional camping. And then we have a lot of pull through RV sites. So people can come in stay for a few days. We have a sewage dump area. So when they leave,

 

Erwin  

does anyone have experience running a campground? No, but I mean, they’re all learning on the fly.

 

Andrew  

So Zach, in our ownership group, he was family they do RVing. So he kind of had some perspective with that, okay, as a consumer, as a consumer, showed Zach, but yeah, shout out to Zach. He’s listening. Yeah, he’s not listening.

 

Erwin  

He’s enjoying his vacation wherever he is. Zach’s been

 

Andrew  

travelling the world for the last eight months, but our management team does. So our management team have been managing trailer parks and campaigns for, you know, I think 20 years, so you’re not flying blind? No, no, they’ve been they’ve been huge. And then we’ve empowered them to hire as they see fit. And then we’ve also brought in help where needed, but next year, a big change will be we’re actually going to be providing guest or employee accommodations and bringing people in from out of town because it’s hard to find people in that area because every available unit isn’t for rent, everyone’s Airbnb, everything out there. So it’s actually hard to find started when

 

Erwin  

you said Oh, play accommodations originally, I thought you meant your own. But you’re, you’re gonna be accommodating. You’re kinda like a motel.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, exactly. So we’re giving like we’re gonna give employees a trailer to stay in so that they’ll still use our main showers but they can use the trailer to stay in Cook, do all that stuff and you know that’ll allow us to bring people in who want an experience we can get people and once we do that we have we have just unlimited opportunity with things like workaway.com and you’ll get people who want to travel and go to a cool place and work you know we’ll be able to accommodate them and hopefully get a little bit more help for next year. Yes provide internet we have internet at the clubhouse so like they wouldn’t have it in their trailer but they would have it we have really good cell phone signal on ourselves. So people can Yeah, you can use your you know I have like 50 gigabytes with bells so I mean I’m sure people have good cell phone package can just use that.

 

Erwin  

I hope none of our staff are listening to this. This was for their zoom background and like yeah, Dragon injuries aren’t you are all these campsites are they all great? Like you mentioned trailer you mentioned tent you mentioned just like out in the woods campsite, they’re all great. They’re not perfect.

 

Andrew  

There’s there’s better and worse ones. I don’t love our art pulled through trailer stuff. I mean, I think it’s it’s functionally good. I just don’t think it looks that good. So we’ve talked about things we can do and you know, maybe we shut down because we have like, I think we have 20 of them in a row you know, shut down 10 of them for everything except for the long weekends and that way people can book to side by side and now we can you know set up a picnic table in between. So we’re always looking at how can we make this cater to families better give people a better experience and repel those who just want a cheap place to stay or why come party because that’s just not you know, I’m sure there are campgrounds out there cater to that. But I just not what we want to cater to.

 

Erwin  

It seems to be general thing, like, for example, that we’re disrupting the short not that long ago. And like they’re they’re trying to clamp down on numbers, like, for example, limiting how many overnight guests you’re allowed. Yeah. Right. So it’s, it’s a problem everywhere.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, if you’re in this hospitality thing, Airbnb or camps, you know, volume hurts you like getting a lot of people in like, it just creates logistical and operational like problems. So it’s actually much better to try and focus on people who want to experience value, at least in my, my perspective, it is, and we’re looking forward to transitioning more that way.

 

Erwin  

That’s exciting. That’s pretty cool. Because I think a lot of people are looking at these opportunities.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, not not a simple, you know, simple project to take on, but we’ve got a good, you know, good diverse amount of experience with our ownership group. And it’s, it’s come really well into play. And then I’ve certainly learned a lot about delegating, you know, even better than I was, like, I was already decent at delegating some things. And now this year has forced me to be that much better. And I’m really actually happy to see how well it’s worked.

 

Erwin  

How many people were on the management team were

 

Andrew  

to two main, two main managers, we have two more employees that are working sort of semi full time hours right now. And we have a bookkeeper that actually is working out of the Philippines, he’s a CPA. So he and he’s busy, like there’s a lot of work to do on these books, a lot of transactions. And then of course, my assistant, she’s helping out on on this, and then our ownership group is there’s four of us. And we all sort of handle different things. I’ve sort of handle general oversight, specifically of the accounting and bookkeeping, and, and the management team. And then the other guys help handle acquisitions, certain operational problems, all oversight, none of us are, you know, full time on this, none of us are hands on site, although we have had, you know, you know, Mike goes up or Jake goes up, and they’ll spend a day or two on the site, dealing with management, you know, helping out a little bit, things like that just to integrate, make sure that we’re hearing them. And then we do a weekly Tuesday meeting where we go over what’s happening, how do we kind of go what do you need from us? Which direction do we want to go? What do we need to be thinking about for next year? How do we adjust our marketing or our positioning in terms of who we’re attracting? And a lot of these that came out of necessity, because we weren’t doing that originally, like we do a management team like or an ownership meeting, but we wouldn’t do a management meeting meeting and we really started to see there was a breakdown in communication. So doing that weekly meeting has been huge for us and just you know, now we’re on the same page and they take care of everything for us they run they run our sales on site, we you know, I just check the bank account and I see the sales coming in it’s July and August with the campgrounds fun like all the Airbnb payments, rolling in watching the account, you know, grow and then you gotta be prepared for the offseason when it doesn’t any plans for what the winter by the bylaw. We are not allowed to have stays for more than seven out of 10 months, which is a weird way of putting it so so basically seven, that’s how much you can operate. Yeah, I can’t so so that’s like eight and a half out of 12 months we’re allowed to operate. So we’re we’ll be shutting down for for the winter. We’ll be back open. You know, we’ll we’ll be starting operations again in April. And yeah, it’s weird. Why would they say seven out of 10? Why wouldn’t they say it out of 12.

 

Erwin  

But I’ve heard it with other recreational places, for example, like the boys and Innisfil. Jeez, I’m terrible. Anyway, they have to close them for one month because the policy there is if you’re if you’re open 12 months, people live there. So you need to invest in hospitals and schools. Yeah. Okay. But that’s 11 or 12 months. They’re like, obey your G You’re really restricted.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, I mean, but if I interpret seven out of 10 That’s, like I said, it’s like eight out of eight and a half out of 12, whatever. But we could, you know, longterm look at you know, and we’re thinking out loud, you know, there’s tonnes of land there is the potential for severance and development. Yes, I think there is. We haven’t really explored that. So that’s certainly on on our mind, and then, you know, maybe go and get a bylaw amendment or a minor variance to allow us to do something in the winter any skiing or snowmobile trails and the snowmobile trails right in the area and money Yeah, so we are allowed you know, we can go into a site plan control and actually start building more structures on the site. We can go get an amendment to the bylaw that allow us to maybe maybe we you know put a little cross country ski facility there or you know, offer winter stays for you know, for people who want to do that kind of thing snowmobiling and what have you. These are potentials I don’t know if that’d be pushing my business downhill which I would prefer to do. So yes, that’s possibilities. We haven’t gotten there yet. haven’t felt we needed to add more. I want to stabilise what we do in the summer before we start thinking to

 

Erwin  

specialise the summer. Yeah, and then we’re going to grow the summer part is it more trailers more tents?

 

Andrew  

Yeah, we’re gonna keep acquiring more units. So the tents did really well. We have three more that we didn’t even set up this year. So we’ll be setting up the remainder of those will be acquiring more trailers. You know, the big thing for us has been finding finding trailers just Kijiji marketplace. And hopefully they’re most So you’re renovated on the inside, don’t need too much. And you know, if we need to paint the outside, give it a theme, decorate it, you know, we’ll hire a designer to help us make it really cool. And we just we want to make we want to focus on the memorable, you know, whatever, whatever that might look like, but something super unique, where people are going to Instagram it. They’re gonna say, wow, look what I stayed in, like, I’ll never forget this experience, right? It’s not a hotel room. It’s something that they’ll remember.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty cool. We were organising any like real estate investor,

 

Andrew  

I was thinking about that. We don’t really have the space as of right now inside we have lots of outdoor space

 

Erwin  

but even just to coordinate like these, yeah, 50 spots or

 

Andrew  

we’re gonna do we’re gonna not Yeah, so that’s, that’s something that we can definitely consider I was thinking about that we just never got to it this year. But, you know, as we we, you know, scale up and get this next year in the works. There’s, there’s so many places, that’s the nice thing about it, it’s just like endless opportunities to add value. We have we have 90 acres, some of that is like marshland but we’ve still got tonnes of space tonnes of sites where we can convert them into glamping where you know, a single tent site can generate $45 A night whereas glamping tents could do you know 200 plus 250 I mean, we may increase our prices even more for next year just based on the demand we had this year. So you know, just thinking in terms of an operational strain on our septic facility on our well on our management team, you know, we’d prefer to to focus on the value experience where people are paying more getting an experience and then you know, we can give our management a break we’ll come back and we don’t need to drive you know 1000 People through the site a day or we can we can do much less than that and you know keep our sanity get really good reviews and and grow the business more organically that way

 

Erwin  

are you doing to drive traffic on Airbnb are we’ve done really

 

Andrew  

well with our Instagram like our Instagram page, we ended up partnership with explorer Ontario and got like US government, right zip tourism is a tourism is a tourism website. I’m not sure if it’s government, but I think we paid them like $500 for a partnership sponsorship. And they they promoted it. We had 16,000 comments on the post. We got so many bookings I’m sure we got between 20 and 5025 and 50 bookings out of that because they can’t directly trace them you know, people go to Airbnb and booked but it was well worth it. We did it again with the airstream got a bunch of bookings on that those promotions were very, very lucrative for us. Good luck, good return we’ve got we’ve got our Google AdWords, you know, working away for us for the campground that’s been, you know, steady and not not that we’re spending a tonne. But we’re getting very targeted, you know, people wanting to camp in our area. And we know that that’s ideal, but there’s so much more we can do. During the policy standpoint, I

 

Erwin  

should ask this earlier. Is it all on Airbnb or is it

 

Andrew  

so yeah, we’re on Airbnb, we’re on booking.com. And our preference is obviously to people to book direct at grotto. getaway.com. And yeah, they can see all our listings there and book and we’re going to have for the upcoming season, we’re going to have our new launchings coming up first on our website, so yes, they will be available on Airbnb, but we’re going to do like special promos where people can book early through our website, because we want to start doing more that way. Because obviously there are certain limitations to working with Airbnb. And it’s very expensive. But Airbnb has been good. I’m pretty sure we’ll have our super host by the by March 1, I think October 1. And I think we have like, last time I checked like 130 reviews. Since it and we didn’t even have retros until the end of June. Crazy. Yeah. So it’s it’s been interesting process tonnes to learn a little bit more intense than, you know, passive real estate. But,

 

Erwin  

but this is not passive. No, I

 

Andrew  

take it can be made more passive by having good teams though.

 

Erwin  

Can you share some numbers? The acquisition cost is this property,

 

Andrew  

New Year 1.5 million to acquire. And as far as revenue goes, I suppose cheaped a lot of people 2.9 Yeah, see, like, you know, revenue targets like I don’t know how much I should say right now, but I you know, just out of respect for my partners, but we did well, we didn’t do as well as we wanted to this year, but it’s a startup here. And you know, treating it as a new business. So we’re confident with a full season next year it’s gonna you know, it’s gonna be a profitable year. And I’m just gonna wasn’t as well because we were delayed the delay. It hurt us the most right? And like if you think about Airbnb, and he photos, right, and you don’t want photos with trees with no leaves, so you need trees with leaves, and you know, tents, trailers, you know, some of those things were it was just like, when’s the ideal time to buy a campground if you’re going to do this? There is no ideal time. Like no matter what, like you’re gonna buy it mid season, no one’s gonna sell you a campground mid season because that’s when they’re making money. Yeah, pipi price, peak price and they’re making all their money. They want to wait until October until they’ve milked every last cent cent out of that campground then they want to sell it which is exactly what the owner who saw the task did smart. Hey, why would you? Why wouldn’t you? Knowing that like we, you know, we did our best, but I mean, you don’t really get leaves on the trees until mid May anyway, we should have been ready to take photos and it just didn’t work work out there. That way, we didn’t have enough help. So we’re kind of acknowledging these things, seeing what we needed to change. And next year, we’ll be ready or

 

Erwin  

injured. We were way over time, but you are a wealth of information. So I apologise.

 

Andrew  

Oh, cool. Yeah, I have no idea what time it is. But yes, before

 

Erwin  

we overtime for this, and then we’re gonna get into chairs, YouTube after this. Final thoughts, General,

 

Andrew  

general thoughts on the market on anything? Yeah. Interesting times, I think like people who are thinking about getting started, I don’t know how much of your audience that is. But never been more important than to focus on the fundamentals. It was always important. But now I think people are really starting to internalise how important that is, you can’t expect your property to go up in value. In fact, why not invest with the expectation your property’s gonna go down in value and still be alright with that, you know, maybe you can start looking for cash flow plays where you don’t care if it goes down. 100 grand, you know, it was all relative to what you pay. But you know, you can you can still invest here, I still believe Ontario’s a place you can invest in becoming more and more lucrative by the day. But you know, somebody, someone like me to go and go to Florida? I don’t think that that’s for everybody. I really don’t I think that you have to have a certain skill set certain experience. And you got to be very diligent, and I was prepared for that. But I don’t think new investors necessarily would be which I agree with you, you know, saying invest closer to home when you’re starting down the road? Yeah, you can look at something like that more seasoned investors. Yeah, I know, tonnes of them reaching out to me wanting to do it, and they’re probably ready. But not everybody is.

 

Erwin  

Because we’re finding property we can we can buy for less than build costs. So that’s a pretty

 

Andrew  

good guy. And that’s gonna become more and more common. And I’ve always said, you know, buy for less than cost a replacement, because I mean, they’re not making any more land. And if you can’t build it for that price, the long term outlook on that property is probably pretty good

 

Erwin  

in labour and construction is scarce as well.

 

Andrew  

So it is like it’s not getting cheaper to build things right now. And will it if demand comes down enough? Yes. But where we’re at right now, I think that’s a great strategy, buy for less than cost of replacement is a good strategy right now. Doesn’t mean that’s perfect doesn’t mean every property that fits that bill is going to be a good one. But it’s it’s probably a good starting point. Yeah, no one rule is perfect. And not for everybody, even if it’s perfect. For one. It’s not it’s not perfect for all,

 

Erwin  

like, you might want one 2% rule, but you’re gonna buy a caregiver like Andrew.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, that was that was a different play. That was that was real estate adjacent, you know, as a business with real estate component, which, you know, the big thing was owning land and wanting to own a lot of land and check that box. And we’re getting it to a point where, you know, it’ll satisfy cash requirement too. And that’d be a great way of hanging on to a bunch of land

 

Erwin  

the dumbest question for you Sure. That’s gonna ask him you on the way I’m gonna Jim Crow. Don’t do that.

 

Andrew  

I don’t think that is allowed. But I know that, you know, there’s a lot of hunting out that way. You know, it’s a very much a hunting culture, you know, especially in like the surrounding sobble area. I would assume this area too.

 

Erwin  

Because I’m just thinking like, if all hell goes a handbasket, you need to live somewhere off the land, but you can live off the land easier than I can live off

 

Andrew  

the land. grow some food

 

Erwin  

on your animal friends, you don’t want to hurt them.

 

Andrew  

Yeah, I mean, like, have some chickens, maybe eat the eggs. I mean, I eat vegan but I mean, like, if it ever came to it, I would you know, but I don’t feel like I need to so I don’t, we’re just

 

Erwin  

crazy, cuz you’re a big guy. Alright, Andrew, thanks so much for doing this. Yeah, thank you had fun podcaster and yeah,

 

Andrew  

this is this is such a cool setup, man. It’s cool. I’m looking forward to having you back on my podcast and we’ll we’ll dig into what you’re doing. Can’t wait.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but So many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

What Our Clients Are Transacting On Right Now with Coach Tammy DiTomaso

What a time to be an investor, lol. 

Pretty much everything is down except for Oil, but I’m not too worried; we survived and thrived in 2008 during the financial crisis with our real estate investments. 

Houses we invested in went up close to 6X since then. 

My biggest regret is not nailing the stock wave of 2008 and the more recent crypto wave, but thankfully (I think), I’ve learnt my lessons and am now poised to take greater advantage than ever thanks to the experiences I’ve gained, the education I’ve consumed and the people I’ve surrounded myself with.

In the stocks and options world, my mentor Derek Foster and 6X best-selling author is positive on the year while every benchmark, index and fund manager is down 10-40%, our speaker at the Wealth Hacker Conference and regular contributor to the Stock Hacker Academy. 

Derek’s been retired for almost 20 years, just stock and option investing, so you don’t want to miss out on how he retired and, more importantly, stayed retired and completely beat the market.

On the crypto side, we’re super excited to announce our crypto expert speaker for the Wealth Hacker Conference is Jordan Anderson, the Chief Operating Officer of Bitbuy, the first regulated Canadian cryptocurrency exchange. 

Bitbuy has 375,000 Canadian clients and facilitated $4.4 billion in transactions. Bitbuy recently sold to Shark Tank star, Kevin O’Leary’s company WonderFi Technologies Inc for $206 million.

Jordan will be sharing at the Wealth Hacker Conference his journey as an entrepreneur from a startup in the cryptocurrency space to now a massive, successful exit.  

As a leading Canadian cryptocurrency expert, Jordan will explain what the Blockchain is, why and what he will be investing in on the dip, and I can’t wait to hear what he has to say.  

After all, Kevin O’Leary has 20% of his portfolio in cryptocurrencies and Blockchain and added to his Bitcoin and Ethereum positions; I think all investors need to have an open mind on what could be a once-in-a-generation opportunity.

www.wealthhacker.ca for details. 

For you, my loyal 17 listeners, we have a special discount code, the five-letter word ‘truth’ – this code matches our current promo, which is currently 40% off any ticket level, including the VIP, which will sell out. 

This is not just another conference; this is a game-changing, community-based, unique event.  

A reunion for investors after two years of lockdowns, all the who’s who will be in attendance, and I look forward to seeing our friends from Keyspire, REIN, Rich Dad, Rock Star, and the list goes on and on.

GET YOUR TICKETS HERE!

On a personal note, summer is effectively over, and our September is packed! 

We just returned from a week up north with my brother’s family and some family friends at a cottage we rented from a friend.  

Our friends normally charge $4,500 per week, plus a $300 cleaning fee plus tax.  We, of course, receive a friend and family discount, but wow! For anyone else, this would have been an over $5,000 week!

We’ve been going to the same cottage for the last few summers, so it’s neat to see how the kids have grown.  

For example, we fish at least every other day, and this was the first year the kids cut their own worms and put them on hooks.  They both caught more fish than ever, well over ten combined.  

My daughter Robin liked helping the other kids with their gear and worms and hanging out on the boat while others fished.  Last year, she had enough challenges with her own gear.

My son Bruce said the cottage was his favourite event of the summer after an exhaustive list of activities we put the kids through: two weeks of swim lessons, three golf camps, a weeklong overnight camp, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Crossfit, on top of their Kumon: Math and English homework five days a week.

 

Speaking of homework, we’re making a major change in the Szeto household. We’re cancelling the kids’ extracurricular homework. Cherry just read, and I’m about to finish “The 5-Hour School Week,”  and we’re allowing the kids to decide what they want to learn.

My daughter, the picky eater’s first project, is to prepare a report on what she should be eating and how much.  My sons is less academic: Sharks.  Since they don’t have homework after school today, they have time to go to one of their favourite places, the library, to do some research.

Most of the arguments and stress at home with our kids is related to the homework and tutoring we pay $500/month for, so we’re having an open mind and trying something new.  

Wish us luck, and if you have experience with learning/teaching outside of the traditional classroom, I’m all ears!

What Our Clients Are Transacting On Right Now with Coach Tammy DiTomaso

On to this week’s show!

We have coach Tammy DiTomaso with us from the iWIN Real Estate Team. 

She is a licensed Realtor, one of the top Realtors at Rock Star Real Estate, and she’s here to share with us the types of deals and some numbers on the properties our clients are transacting on right now in this crazy market, including the best practices on how to sell properties in this market.  

That’s right; we have clients taking profits or trading up in property in the best buyer’s market I’ve seen since 2008.

 Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and me.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and, more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future, knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you, too, are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so, but for now, we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel; we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you by www.stockhackeracademy.ca, where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle, as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full-time musician who just made a 50% return in 2021.  Past, of course, does not predict the future, but if you’d like a free demonstration, go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right and click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration, I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners, and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Hello, everyone, welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show. My name is Erwin Szeto, founder of our real estate team, the four time winner, realtor of the year two masters and co founder of stock hacker Academy. Of course, my wife and I own her accounting business and what time it is to be an investor. Pretty much everything is down except for oil. But oil has almost given back everything that’s gained in 2020 21. Two, sorry. But honestly, I’m not too worried. We survive and thrive in 2008. During the financial crisis, with our real estate investments, or my very small stock investments, everything else life got back to order. In my opinion, this recession is going to be a lot softer than the financial crisis of 2008 2009. It was houses that we invested in back then have their up nearly six times since the bottom, my biggest regret is not nailing the stock market after the crash. There was an incredible opportunity in 2008. And also, I missed the more recent crypto wave. I cut it all the way down, unfortunately. But thankfully, I think I’ve learned some lessons along the way. And now I’m poised to take chair and are poised to take greater advantage than ever thanks to the experiences that we’ve gained education we’ve consumed and the people I surround ourselves with, and the stocks and options world. My mentor and Derek Foster and 610 best selling author is positive on the year. Well, every benchmark out there, for example, the stock market, the s&p 500 Many people consider that stock market, they’re talking in generalities just North Americans. That’s down six and a half percent as of this recording. And again, Derek is positive on the year. So there is likely beating every single fund manager out there. I even know a Toronto fund manager who’s down around 40% on the year. So choose who you like to follow for inspiration and maybe advice our speaker as well. Derek’s also happens to be our speaker at the wealth hacker conference and regular contributor to the stock hacker Academy. There’s been retired for almost 20 years. Thanks for stalking option investing. So you don’t want to miss this. There’s nothing more passive and how Derek invests if you follow their journey at all, and we’ve shared risk has been a guest on this podcast twice. And he truly honestly does. Little to no work. You know, I know a lot of real estate investor friends who say they’re retired, but they honestly traded their job for a full time gig in full time real estate. Nothing wrong with that. It’s just one is completely passive, and one is quite active and very active.

 

Erwin  

Anyways, on the crypto side, we’re super excited to announce our crypto speaker for the wealth hacker conference and he is Jordan Anderson chief operating officer bitbuy. The first regulated team crypto currency exchange and fit by has 375,000 TD clients and facilitated $4.4 billion dollars in transactions bit by awesome as making the news recently this year, Shark Tank star Kevin O’Leary hidden his company wonderful technologies purchased that buy for $206 million. So Jordan will be sharing as well our conferences journey as an entrepreneur from a startup in the cryptocurrency space to now a massive, successful exit as Jordan is a leading Canadian crypto currency expert. Jordan will explain what the blockchain is why and what you will be investing in on the dip. And I can’t wait to hear what you have to say. Again, I missed the run up. I missed the last one up in crypto, I don’t plan on missing it at the end. After all, if you don’t believe in crypto, that’s okay. Lots of people are unsure that area. Someone who’s not unsure is Kevin O’Leary, who has been publicly stating that 20% of his of his investment portfolio is in cryptocurrencies and blockchain. And he also added just recently, last few months, he added to his Bitcoin and Aetherium positions as well as other other positions. So he’s buying the dip. I think all investors need to have an open mind on what could be a once in a generation opportunity. Don’t have regrets, like I do. Wealth hacker.ca for details for you my 70 model listeners, we have a special discount code for you. It’s a five letter word, truth, tr U. th. This code matches our current promotion, which is currently 40% off any ticket, including VIPs, which will sell out our VIP saw that last time and pretty sure it will sell at this time as well. We’re actually we’re on sales in terms of VIP ticket sales. So this is not another conference. If you’ve been to the conference before, from what people told us it was pretty good one, it’s going to be a game changer, a community based unique event we are bringing the such better that our community asked for. So this is for you are 70 listeners and the the event North Africa conference, in our experience was also a reunion for investors after two or three years now After two and a half years lockdown, you know a conference that has been delayed three years now, all the who’s who’s will be will be in attendance. And I look forward to seeing all my friends from key spar rain Rich Dad rock star and the list goes on and on. We, you know, cheering I love everybody. In my experience, the thing is easier, versus Oh, yeah, so my experience, we have a discount code link as well. So in my experience, and as we’ve had lots of customers, ticket purchasers have issues with the discount entering the discount code. So I have a link that directly applies the discount. So you know, finding, figuring out where the key in truth. So that’s in the show notes, hopefully know where that is, wherever you’re listening to this on, on your pod app. Or if you’re on my email list, you’ll get the link will be in the show notes. So on a personal note, summer is effectively over. Most people I know it’s not time for me over but most people consider somewhere over when Labour Day rolls by and are still just as packed. We just returned from a week up north with my brother’s family and some friends of family friends at a cottage we rented from a friend. And I cannot believe the price of cottage rentals these days, like cars that he rented. The normal price is 4500 per week. And I think that’s a little bit on the low side, plus the $300 cleaning fee plus tax on top of all that the tax alone is over $600 to rent a cottage for we we of course received the friends and family discount. But wow. For anyone else this would have been over 5000 Just a random person. Remember that our food in Costco Bill was something else. We’ve been going to the same college for the last few summers. So it’s neat to reflect back and see how the kids have grown. For example, we fish we fish at least every other day. Some days, some of those days were twice a day once in the morning once before dinner, and the kids for the first time they were cutting their own berms and putting them on books. They both caught more fish than ever well over 10 combined. My daughter Robin liked helping the other kids just she seemed to prefer helping other kids with their gear and putting worms on books and fishing for herself. In general just hanging out on the boat. Yeah, we couldn’t fish at the dock we had zero success off the dock. So we had to hop in a canoe or a rowboat. And then two parents last year, both my kids had enough trouble with just with their own gear. So it’s kind of neat to see how they grown up. My son Bruce did because it was his favourite event of the summer. After an exhaustive list of activities, we put the kids through two weeks in our backyard swimming lessons, three Golf camps week long overnight camp,

 

Erwin  

put them into Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. They started CrossFit in August, and now they’re gonna stay with it on top of their Kumaun, which is their math and English homework, which they have five days a week, including to, to one on one tutoring sessions. And speaking of homework, we’re making some major changes in our household are actually cancelling the math and enrichment homework, our kids are taking them out there are Kumada, wrapping the former as turning on the middle of reading and trying to finish a book called The five hour school week. Again, the link is in the show notes. We’re allowing the kids to have more leeway in deciding what they want to learn. Yeah. And also, you know, with everything going on, the tutoring was $500 a month between the two kids. So someone’s six grand a year after tax money. So it’s something we’re happy to save money. And also, this was where most of the arguments and stress that are in our household that’s really mostly originated, are you with the kids to get their homework done. This is not school, either. This is private tutoring that we pay for. So back to we’re giving our kids some more leeway in terms of what some of what they want to learn about. For example, My daughter, she’s a bit of a picky eater. She eats she doesn’t eat very much. So her first project is to prepare a report on what she should be eating and how much my son’s topic is Sharp’s that’s his biggest personal interest. Now, since they don’t have homework from school, and now they don’t, after school, with their tutoring, they’re going to have a lot more time to explore what they’re interested in. And the kids obviously reputable library. So they’ve been going to the library bigger library a couple times a week already. And some of the legal import times including the in school library, hopefully by librarian in house will output as well in their research project. So let’s let’s be sure we have coach Tammy deeds Basil is with us from my own island real estate team. She is a licenced realtor, one of the top Realtors overall at Rockstar real estate. And she’s here to share with us the types of deals and some numbers on the properties our clients are coming back on. Right now. It’s a crazy market, including we’re seeing some of the current best practices from our experience is we’re seeing a lot more traffic immersion so So Tammy won’t get into that. And also we still have lots of clients who are taking profits. So incredibly important. on how to sell a property in this market. So Tammy is here to share about that as well. Yes, that’s right. We have clients who are still taking profits. But again, most of our clients have been in market for like 8765 years. So they’re still taking some pretty significant profits, profiting somewhere between 30 40% On average return on investment per year. So again, can you tell me tell me what’s keeping you busy these days? Work or personal? All the above? I’ll tell you, like many entrepreneurs, you don’t really separate the two. Right?

 

Tammy  

Personal puppy, you got a puppy?

 

Erwin  

Oh, Puppy, is it? Is it a kid’s puppy is a your puppy.

 

Tammy  

So Robbie, he’s 11. But he’s been asking for a puppy for about 15 years now. And he’s always loved all animals, especially dogs. And they were begging me for any, mostly Ravi begging for any kind of pet. And so I few months ago, I’d say it was March. Maybe I cave and I still keep fighting will get a fish. Terrible, right? I know. And I was like, okay, so I was actually going to the aquarium store with the kids to get this fish. And I was like, Oh, my goodness, like these tapes are expensive and all this other stuff. And and of course Tesla’s like, why would a decorate inside and I want this rock and I want this castle and I want all this stuff. And then we looked over and there was these $15 hamsters. They’re like, Oh, hamsters. I’m like, let’s do it. Let’s go to hamster instead. Right? So we ended up getting the hamster that’s still ended up costing me a little more than I thought because Tessa got deep into the hamster life and researched everything. And so we had to upgrade all of our original stuff. We needed a bigger cage than the original cage. Now she was barbed biting. That’s not good. So now we needed a glass cage. We had to change that. So anyway, so we did all of that. And then, so we’ve had this hamster, which you know what? Hamster now we don’t even know about this yet. Okay, the hamster still gets a touch. But Rob has been asking for a puppy. And Tessa has actually been very scared about getting a dog. She’s been terrified of puppies ever since she was jumped on when she was little. And so we had to ease her into all of that and make sure everybody was ready. So certainly, it’s a family dog. But I would say Robbie was the one that prompted wanting to get this dog so badly. So Tommy loves it. I made sure my parents were on board. My parents live with me. And I knew when the kids were back to school, and we’re, you know, at work, my parents were going to be there, if we want to go away on vacation. You know, my parents were there. So they were on board to the little yorkiepoo. She’s almost four pounds adorable,

 

Erwin  

and the kids will walk it. So right.

 

Tammy  

She’s very timid, scared little puppy, which I like, because she’s quiet. And it was also good for Tessa because they could grow together. But she is definitely coming out of her shell. So we’re not at the point of walking her just yet. We’re probably gonna wait to the rest of her shots are done and so on before we start doing all that, but yeah, Bobby has been actually really great. They’ve taken her out. They cleaned up her hoopoes. Yeah, so they’ve been actually really great and research a lot to Robbie, when they wanted a dog, he actually put together a PowerPoint presentation for me. Yeah. And they’re like, listen, we’ll pay for half of the dog bowl, it’s $13. So we’ll pay for half of the dog bowl. Anyway, stuff like that was keen. So that’s what’s keeping me busy, I guess at home and just summer stuff, the kids are winding down to get ready for school. And then workwise, a little slower through the summer, which is typical for real estate market in general. But a lot of times with our investors, that’s a good opportunity for us to pick up some properties. But given the market with, with the interest rates climbing, although the house prices coming down, we still have a lot of nervous investors just wanting to feel things out. So a little bit slower there. But a lot of people starting to come out of the woodwork now. So I’m getting a lot more calls a lot more texts and emails, just staying in touch with everybody still staying on top of what’s happening in the market and seeing houses. So we’re still busy that way, did a lot more selling of properties this year than I have in previous years. So one given the fact of where the market was. And two, because we’ve had some investors decide that it was time to scale up and cash out some of these properties. So it was a good time to do that as well. So we were starting to see a little bit more of that.

 

Erwin  

So did any of these sellers lose money in real estate?

 

Tammy  

Zero? No, nobody lost money? Definitely not. Now it’s so it’s you know, it’s it’s weird, because when you think back to in, you know, January, February, we’re at the peak of the market where let’s say I’ve given an example of a legal duplex and where they were selling it and where they’re selling it now. Sure, you could take it as a loss because you would think well, I’m selling it for less than one of that. But obviously you can’t let your brain think that way. But I think about it like what did we pay for this house when we bought it the house not only cared for itself with the tenants paying the rent, but a lot of times people were I had positive cash flow as well. So they were making money on these properties that were also paying for themselves and now they probably are good. I’m gonna say three minimum of $300,000 higher than when we bought it. So you know if we bought them at four cents 7500, for example, and we’re selling at minimum of eight, nine. And so and then I’ve had other clients that refinance those

 

Erwin  

big deal to you. That’s a big deal for people like you. But people are profiting like, $300,000. Oh, it’s a big deal for me. And capital gains.

 

Tammy  

I know. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there’s obviously a lot of moving parts, maybe not the exact numbers, but I’m saying if I take the price of what they purchased it at and the price of what they’re selling it the difference there, maybe it’s not everyone’s story is obviously a little bit different. Just like I was gonna say that there was some clients who also refinance their properties in during the time period that they held them where they pulled out some money and then use that to purchase another property. So again, just the plus sides of obviously owning real estate, there’s always your ups and downs on on it, but but the clients that we had that have sold Yes, have definitely did, they did make money.

 

Erwin  

Apologies to some of the listeners. I’ve made an observation just watching social media, especially Twitter, I find that whoever is the most negative and reporting the negative news gets the most attention. But even though prices are down right now, we don’t really have any unhappy clients. Like I’m sure that other happy they missed the peak. Yeah. But they’re still making still taking profits. And they’re taking a whole lot of profits, like hundreds of 1000s of dollars. Exactly. Nope, definitely. Sorry, folks. There’s no, there’s no loss porn here. Did you have any buyers not able to close on properties through this whole thing?

 

Tammy  

No, no, no, look, I mean, we haven’t experienced anything like that personally. But you know, I have heard some stories. I’ve heard through some of our lawyers that we talked to, that they had buyers that were looking to try and get out of transactions that they had to be having those. No, no, I would say if you want like, we have some clients that had some pretty crappy tenants, there’s a one a negative story.

 

Erwin  

That’s, that’s par for the course.

 

Tammy  

dollar wise, no, I mean, obviously, yeah. The greatest negative side was just the fact that they didn’t get to cash out as much as we had maybe hoped if he had sold at a different time period. But it depends. Maybe they’re waiting for renovation, or some of our clients were waiting to have tenants that were moving out. Before we listed it. Yeah. And so on. Okay.

 

Erwin  

All right. We’ll get to some of those tenant stories in a bit. First of all, so that you suffer a bit of a refresher, because it’s been almost a year and a half since your last on the show. What did you do for a living prior to being in real estate?

 

Tammy  

Prior to being a realtor? I had my own aesthetics business. So I did that I can’t remember like, 1517. So like that years? Over 15 years, for sure. I’ve done that a long time. And it is a lot. Yeah. And, and I love that. I loved that job. It was a little different at first when I you know what it was, I saw, I was with a boyfriend at the time. And I saw a friend’s girl, another friend’s girlfriend who we went out and she had her own little salon. And I actually thought, wow, this is pretty cool. You’ve got your own business here. You got your own salon. And I thought maybe I’ll try that. I’d like to do that. And so I went to school to take the aesthetics course, not really realising that I was going to be touching people’s feet and waxing certain parts. So it was a little bit of a

 

Erwin  

you know, it’s pretty creepy. Yeah.

 

Tammy  

Yeah, I remember I remember I had a facial. Facial. Yes. I had a gentleman one time though. He did fitness competitions. And so they need to be waxed. Right. It was all professional and he wanted to be waxed. And he wore his bikini bottoms. And I was like, Oh my gosh, this is so weird. But yeah, waxed his legs for his show. Competition, but

 

Erwin  

okay, that’s, that’s

 

Tammy  

no, yeah. He asked for more. I said, No. No, and then yeah, so that’s what I did these days. I love absolutely love doing it. I loved I don’t know if I realised this, that but I looking back at it. Now. I love meeting people. I love being with people. You know, getting to talk with so many different clients. And a lot of them I’m actually still very close to. There’s a client in particular, I helped both her daughters recently just buy houses. Fantastic. So yeah, yeah. And actually, I still meet up with her for lunch. Because another client that I had from aesthetics, and she’s an older, older woman, she’s probably in her 70s At least. And she we heard I meet up for lunch from time to time. So definitely, relationships.

 

Erwin  

You made a lot of money as an esthetician like you do as a realtor.

 

Tammy  

Yeah, yeah. No, not at all. But at that time, I felt like I I thought I felt like I was doing well, you know, at that time, and it was it was a lot of cash, cash job, but you know, maybe 500 bucks a week coming in cash. And at that time, I felt like that was kind of it. Now we’re going back a while because this was oh, that’s a long time ago. I can’t even think of how long ago that was, I guess 15 years at least because they’re 10 years ago, over 10 years ago. I’d say for sure, it was before my kids. So my kids were Robbie’s 11. And so it was prior to him that I had the business doing that. So it was right out of high school. I had done that. But I realised, you know, that unless I was going to open up a salon, were how else was I really going to grow? I mean, I was working nonstop as it was. And I enjoyed it. That was fine. But it still it was a lot of hours and a lot of time that I had put in. And even though I thought it was doing well, I realised, you know, especially now looking back, I always thought it was kind of a person that didn’t maybe like to travel. But maybe I just realised I also didn’t have the money to travel. Right? Because I wouldn’t say like, I’m I love travelling at this point right now. But I have noticed that ever since be more successful by doing real estate, I certainly have certainly taken a lot more vacations travelled a lot more, and you’re pretty successful. I’ve been doing well. I’ve been doing well at it doing well. It’s so weird. I don’t know why that’s a weird thing. I should have just said yes. Because you know, it’s great. And I love it. And they work really hard. But it’s also, I feel a little shy about that. But yeah,

 

Erwin  

any idea how you rank on the board or anything like that?

 

Tammy  

No. Okay. No, you know what I shouldn’t say, I know that we see these changes on our team had sent us a list and it shows you what the average Realtors make. And that and that was a while ago when I saw that. So I was definitely on the top top part of that list. Top four top 1% though. I thought it was Yeah, but yeah, I have to relook at that. Right. So that was two years ago. So who knows.

 

Erwin  

Tammy is a top between top four top one percentile realtor. So she’s quite successful. How does that happen?

 

Tammy  

You you work me like a dog.

 

Erwin  

Pretty good life. I don’t know what you’re talking about.

 

Tammy  

You know what, it’s interesting, because I’ve talked about this story. Last time on the podcast, you know how I’ve been friends with James for so long. And I saw him doing it. And I had him and his wife over for dinner. And I talked about wanting to get into real estate. He’s like, You should do it, you should do it. And I did have interest in it. And it wasn’t really though, until I got involved, that I realised how much absolutely loved it. But again, there’s all the other parts of the job, like I love working, I love being out there getting to meet and talk to so many different people all the time, I have this goal that I put on myself where I meet a client and they’re looking for something, yes, I want to get it and when they’re excited to get it. I’m excited to help them get it. And so it just drives me to kind of keep going more and more. And I guess I think the biggest thing with this job really is about hustle in all honesty is making sure that you’re constantly out there. And you’re always, you know, looking for properties and look for houses and talking to your your clients and so on. And I think I do that. So I think that’s been a big part of it. That’s why I think this job can be maybe a part time job for a lot of people because depending on how little or how much they they want to do.

 

Erwin  

You want to do a lot.

 

Tammy  

I do. I love it. Yeah. Not to get away with my family. And it’s not to get to get to travel. But I just genuinely love the drive behind it. I guess. Knowing that I’m helping or helping people is awesome. You’re helping people as an esthetician. I was maybe that’s part of why I like to clean them up pretty nice.

 

Erwin  

You’ve had some pretty serious success stories among your clientele. And can you share some of them? Um, yeah, we just had Joe on on the on the show. So yeah, I’m pretty sure he wants to tell not only the youngest, our youngest client, but also our youngest, the youngest to achieve self made millionaire status.

 

Tammy  

So I’ll never forget when Joe approached me, and it was January 2019. And we were at one of our meetings or monthly meetings that we host I would meetings. And I did a presentation there. And on that presentation, I actually showed a best buy property. And I had there was I think over 200 people there that at that meeting, and I had said how this property was so great, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, at the end of the meeting, Joe comes up to me introduce himself, he said like to work together like fabulous, I love it. Let’s do it. So we got into talking, and nobody, nobody came up to me and talk to me about this best buy property. And I was like wow, this is such a good one. So when I was talking to Joe, I said listen, this is a really good property, we got to go for it. And this was all at the same time when we were leaving do remember we were going to see Grant Cardone in February we went to Miami and Joe and I and this is where I feel bad because it was our first real deal together transaction together. And I’m in the airport on the phone with him say okay, look at this is what we got to offer. This is what it’s going to work and, and and he’s like, Well, I think we should do this and I’m like, no, no, listen, you gotta listen to me. You gotta trust me, you know and so anyway, we got it done. He got this property was a fantastic property for him. So I was super super excited. But that’s why was our first meeting and our first real interaction And, and then and then it’s snowballed from there. Right. And, and a lot, you know, I certainly as a realtor helping Joe with all of this, but then also Joe being very driven himself. So the two of us together, I think we, we hit it off, and we’re able to help them get some good properties.

 

Erwin  

So you’ve talked a lot of first time investors, what are some of their challenges? And how have you helped them?

 

Tammy  

I think one of the biggest challenges, and I think it’s more for me, personally, is that I know when I know, there’s a really good property, a really good deal or a really good opportunity. And I want to portray that to my client, and I want them to know that, and I’m always worried that I’m gonna come off as a salesy kind of person, or I never, I don’t want to be pushy, but I want to push them. Do you know what I mean? And I don’t want somebody to think I’m just doing it because I need I want to get paid, and I want them. And I hate that. I would hate that part of it. Not that I’ve heard that. And that that has I don’t think that’s happened. But I’m saying that’s what goes on in the back of my mind where I want them to know. And I’ve heard other people say, lines of, you know, you don’t buy it, I’ll buy it. That’s just not me. But I have to, you know, try to word it how, how it’s sincere for myself to know that when something’s really great, and actually, it’s funny, because my clients now who certainly know me, know, my reactions. And they know, I was in a in a property recently with Mike Ferreira. That unicorn property we got. And it’s funny, because I didn’t even realise that he was reading me on the outside. And we were in this house. And I was loving it. I was like, Oh, my goodness, this is fantastic. And I guess I actually went a little bit quiet, which is rare, that that usually quiet. And he’s like, you’re quiet. What are you thinking? And I looked at him. No, I was said to him, I’m thinking to myself, if you don’t buy this, how can I buy this? That’s what I was thinking that was legit, right? But I was like, Yeah, money can move real quick. Where can I get? So yeah, so I think that was probably one of the challenges with new people for me. Just making sure that they know that I am sincere, I’m, you know, I want everyone to be happy. I’m not an agent. And I, you know, I have actually said this in the past, I can’t just let something roll off my shoulders and just let things go. And that may be something I need a work in progress as well, because I need to toughen up that way a bit. But at the same time, I just, I care a lot. And if something’s not quite right, I will overthink it. I’ll think about it all night. I won’t sleep you know, and I and that’s just me, and that’s who I am. So I don’t know if that can be changed much. But but that’s always

 

Erwin  

said to Mike though I think he got the first sick deal in this correction.

 

Tammy  

I know. Yeah, that was an amazing.

 

Erwin  

I know, we’ve covered it before. But just just give us the headlines. What made this a unicorn property.

 

Tammy  

So this one here, when we went to go look at it, Mike didn’t actually even want to go see it. Because the main floor of this house, it’s a bungalow is super, super nice. And he’s like, this is gonna go for too much. Forget it. So I said, Well, let’s go check it out anyway, and then you know, fill out the agent and go from there. So this one here, the owner had renovated the house. Now the owner is also builder contractor. So he actually did everything by code. So he turned the basement into another unit that he had a friend of his renting from him. But it had like it had fire rated drywall. The windows were so massive, like the biggest Windows probably I’ve ever seen in a basement. And so we were good with egress to panelling. He did everything. And except that he didn’t go get the drawings done. And he didn’t run it through the city so that it became a legal duplex. So that one was really great, because it was going to be a really small conversion. I ended up finding out now because we had a pretty good idea of what we were getting into, of course, but the whole conversion to turn that into a duplex cost him $10,000

 

Erwin  

That’s it. Yeah. disclaimer here. This is not normal. It’s not normal, versus not normally $10,000. This is a fleet abnormality. Yeah. So hence why this is part one of the reasons this is a unicorn property.

 

Tammy  

Yeah, it was. Because for drawings and half that was for drawings, and the other half is because we did a couple of upgrades. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

Just from context, folks, for listeners benefit, bigger properties get higher rents. So just because property is a duplex and it gets a certain rent, and someone else gets this, it’s a much, much higher rent, than my next question is How big is it? Right. So just want to clarify that this was a pretty big one. Was it not?

 

Tammy  

Yeah, I mean, a lot of times we’re looking at 1000 You know, to us big a big square footage for a bungalow would be you know, 1100 1200 that would be large. So and those will fetch more rent. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. The upstairs of this house. The kitchen is nicer than most kitchens. You see, that’s nicer than my own kitchen. So it was beautiful upstairs, and like I said it already had this You know what’s interesting? It had this basement that has the second unit. And it’s a little bit on the smaller side but not too small. Like it’s great. It’s got its two bedrooms living room kitchen. So on. It’s nice, but there’s actually a whole nother separate side of the basement that was that hasn’t been touched for like, Ooh, another unit.

 

Erwin  

No, I want to touch on a point. Pretty much everything was already renovated. And there’s quite a lot to touch on is, well actually take the kitchen. For example, if someone wants to instal that kitchen, how much would that cost?

 

Tammy  

Oh, geez. I think it could easily be 3040. Okay. Yeah. 1000.

 

Erwin  

And then the basement. If we were to go get a quote today to say that basements unfinished? Yeah, obviously,

 

Tammy  

you do a conversion? Yeah.

 

Erwin  

How much would it cost to renovate the basement? I’m going to say about 150,000. Right, right. Right about 100, navy, Cavan, just between the kitchen and the basement? Now, one observation that I’ve seen these days is contractors have not their prices have not gone down? Right? They’ve gone up?

 

Tammy  

Yes, some are going up. And right now they’re kind of sitting still a little bit, which is nice. Last little bit.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. And then kind of my point is like, I know a lot of a lot of folks out there who are teaching to buy a really ugly property and then renovate it. To come out of pocket 180 grand for a basement and a kitchen alone on top of the downpayment and everything. That’s, that’s, that’s a lot of capital. Yeah. And

 

Tammy  

no, typically, we wouldn’t put that amount into the kitchen upstairs. But that would be still the same total that we could easily put in upstairs. So if you do buy a rundown house, like you said, and we got to go through the main floor, you know, we can break it down when we’re in there. And I’ll say, hey, we need floors, we need paint, we need kitchen, we need bathroom, and I’ll break it up, we’ll make 5000 Another 5000 10,000 here and you can easily be 3040 on the main floor. For sure. And that doesn’t include other items that you got to take into consideration like a roof, or a furnace doesn’t need new windows, right? Driveway expansion.

 

Erwin  

Now there are other features of Mike’s house that made her the unicorn what else biggest and

 

Tammy  

most exciting part was that it had a large garage, existing garage in the backyard. It’s on a large lot is already got this garage, but this garage already had electricity. So has the electrical panel that has gasline that had a water line. The only thing left that it needs to do a card and speak because that’s our plan was

 

Erwin  

sewer line. Interesting. You had a water line but no sewer.

 

Tammy  

It had us. Okay, so did have a sewer line previously that was added to a septic tank that can’t be used. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

Right. So it needs a sewer connection to this to the cities, the city sewer, any idea how much that’s gonna cost?

 

Tammy  

I don’t have the breakdown of that. But the total cost for that garden suite is going to be about 70,000 which is again, a unicorn. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

cuz I can’t stand those TV shows really give you like, ridiculously. I talked about that. Yeah, I know. Just understand 70 grand is not normal for a currency conversion. Okay, so 70 grand, and then what?

 

Tammy  

What it cost him because he had an existing because he had the existing structure of the garage. He’s probably saved about half the costs.

 

Erwin  

So he’s always he has spent how much then? So he’s about 70 is going to be about 70. Right? 7075? Yep. And then what can you rent it for after

 

Tammy  

so I’m comparing the garden suite rentals to be very similar or even a tad more than the that’s usually a two bedroom let’s say typically are going to be a two bedroom if we can compare to a three bedroom main floor rental. So if you’re getting 2000 or 2500, whatever it is, you’re getting, because it’s obviously going to differ city, the city for your main floor three bedroom, then you’re going to get very similar, I think to your two bedroom because it’s completely separate. detached

 

Erwin  

from the house. Do you think this will be a two bedroom and it’ll be close to three bedroom rent?

 

Tammy  

I do. Yeah. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

So what’s the total rent on this then? I’m sorry. What’s Mike in for? What’s his total? What’s his total?

 

Tammy  

So he’s 70 on that and 10 in the house? It’s under 100

 

Erwin  

What do you think his rent is gonna be within 2300

 

Tammy  

I think his upper there is 22. This is Branford. So a little less than Hamilton. The basement is probably going to be about 19 I think he just rented it out actually. So I have to get those numbers. And so the garage I think it’d be similar to the to the main when you to do your 22 for the main garden suite. I think so. Yeah. I mean, obviously this is still very new to a lot of us and we haven’t been seeing it out there very much, but that’s certainly what I’d be alright. You might even try a little higher. It’s gonna look super sweet when it’s all done so 6300 and rent.

 

Erwin  

What do you pay for the house

 

Tammy  

like a triplex? I knew you were gonna ask me that and I thought I should pull that up. Well, he’s talking. i He paid I think it was 875. So far

 

Erwin  

under a million he’s got a triplex, right. That’s 6300 and rent a month. I’m doing the math as well.

 

Tammy  

I hear this stuff. Yeah, it’s only five Okay, good. No, no, I don’t do math on screen.

 

Erwin  

That’s 75,600 per year. And he’s in for less than a million. How that’s almost a percent rule. And it’s plus utilities, right? Yes. Oh, yeah. Yep, definitely. Wow. Congratulations, Mike Ferreira. If people want more of these, can they get one? Can I get? Well,

 

Tammy  

I know I actually got in trouble because people were like, Why didn’t you call me?

 

Erwin  

And that’s the glow. That’s why I know

 

Tammy  

exactly. We went out to look at properties and, and you know what, and he’s always hustling as an investor as well. And so I was very, very happy for him. But yeah, all the years we’ve been doing this. I mean, I’ve been on your team for seven years now. Like a realtor for five. So I’ve been with this in this business with you guys. And it’s the first time I’ve seen this, obviously.

 

Erwin  

And then just to disproportion understand how it works when you’re working with realtor, if your regular client wants to see the property, we’re not calling other people to try to sell it.

 

Tammy  

To me, right, yeah, no, absolutely.

 

Erwin  

That would be fair to my age. No, no, it’s not like why didn’t you call me is like more like, you know, you need to make the time to go see the drink the effort to to get deals,

 

Tammy  

and this was, you know, when prices were high, and markets going crazy, and, you know, we needed to know that the numbers were gonna still gonna work and everything was gonna make sense for us. So I probably say the big question right now, just for the listeners is the fact that, you know, the garden suites are very new. So there’s we can’t, and I know, I would never guarantee it anyway, to be honest, but we can’t really guarantee where those refinance numbers are going to look like on the garden suites yet. No,

 

Erwin  

who cares? That’s kind of unicorns.

 

Tammy  

That’s the only that’s the only part when you’re running your numbers that we do have to keep that part in mind. But

 

Erwin  

yeah, we might have to wait a few years for the for did a good refi number, get appraisal number. The duplexes with you guys. Yeah, just see what some of the duplexes on duplexes are a new thing. We couldn’t get appraisals, the appraiser people would just use like in law suites as comparable against our legal basement apartment houses. But that’s actually something that’s a good point to bring up with the the investor realtor relationship is when I was practising as a realtor, my clients who were active who are ready to buy, we’d have a standing meeting. Right? So like, every Thursday at two o’clock, we go see property. So that client usually gets dibs versus the client that says, Call me if you see anything good.

 

Tammy  

Absolutely. And that’s really tough to Yeah, because I’ll often, it’s actually a really big thing that I want, especially when I’m talking to my new investors that I say, you know, let’s book ahead of time, let’s book in and pencil in a date to go out and look at houses. Because when you have that day pencilled, you’re gonna go and you’re gonna look at him. And let’s just say there’s nothing really on the market. Because we’ve had, we’ve seen those markets before, where there’s not really much out there, right? Two things, one, we can still go and see the couple that are there just to check them out. Or to if you needed to cancel, we can cancel that appointment, everyone’s busy, and we could fill up their time. But if you have that appointment set there, you’re more likely to keep that appointment and get out there and go look at the houses. And I always say all the investors that do super well are the ones that are out just always looking for always got that appointment, they’re always checking them out. And that’s where the success is for sure. Because I have many clients as well, new people where they’ll say, I’ve, you know, probably been talking to them for two years, maybe even some three years, just, you know, let me know if you’re if you see this, or if you see that we are but you have to come out and you have to see it. And that’s the important part of that. Right. Right. Yeah. And

 

Erwin  

that’s what it is to work with, with investors on a regular basis is we have lots of clients who have very similar criteria. Because because we have a pretty good idea what the best investment property is.

 

Tammy  

You know, what’s funny, is that I get that question. How do you decide if you see a property comes up? And don’t you have everybody all looking for the same thing? And the answer is like, yes, but also no, because of all the investors that say that I’m working with right now. So let’s just say I’ve got as an example, you know, 12 active buyers, but as people that are ready, let’s just say as an example, a lot of them have different price points that they’re approved for. A lot of them have some particulars that their own personal stuff of what they want or don’t want. Some are looking for single family student rentals, duplexes, triplexes, some that want to do a conversion. Some are looking in different cities than others. So a lot of I’ve only ever had one time, where I had two clients that both wanted offer on the same property. And one ended up actually changing their mind. I was like, Whew, I’m kind of glad. Because I had to make sure I had that conversation with them to make sure that they both knew but all in all, like as much as we’re all out, then there’s so many investors, there’s also a small pocket of us that are out there, right? out doing this.

 

Erwin  

So someone wants to be next in line. What do we have to do to me for the next unicorn?

 

Tammy  

Oh, again, going back to it, you have to go out you have to get out there and look, this is exactly what happened with the scheduled time with you. You have to Yeah, it’s in you know, what is this? A lot of different things. One, I think it’s a really good experience to see all the different types of properties, especially for a lot of our investors trying To get acquainted with the neighbourhoods, and learn in the neighbourhoods, you know, we did that as realtor, I remember when we started going out to well, and I would drive out there by myself purposely all the time just to constantly see houses. So as an investor doing that, as well and coming out and, and I found that every time I’d go out with an investor and talk about these properties, and let’s say a conversion, for example, all the rules and everything, every time we were out date absorbed something new, new, new, constantly, and it was so important. So I think just honestly getting out there and always looking and I tell my clients to even if they’re not ready, or they’re in a window where they’re waiting for financing, if they want to go see houses, I’ll do it, I love it. I love looking at houses, I will go by myself. So if you want to go let’s go together, right? It doesn’t mean that they have to go because they have to buy right there. And then it could be a lot of really good learning process as well. And it’s nice for us to meet in person, you know, so many times we have a phone call and a chat. And it’s nice to get out there face to face and and look at look at everything. So I think that’s probably the most important. Get out

 

Erwin  

there. Yeah, get out there. Because sometimes you might get out there and you see a house and the price and that might not be right. And then the house fails to sell. Yeah. And then and then that’s an opportunity, right? Absolutely.

 

Tammy  

We just haven’t had one of those. We did. Yeah, we just had one of those happen with Emily, clay and Emily. And she’s always hustling. We’re always looking for houses. And it’s fantastic. And I remember when Emily first called me, she had so much energy. And so excited to jump into investing, she didn’t have any properties before we had gotten together. And now she’s and that was just Whoa, she actually did a post on Instagram that has been doing it now for one year was when her first purchase was, I was like, Wow, a year has passed already. I can’t even believe it. But I do remember, she’s her being super excited and going out. And we’ve continued that way. And so we went to go see this property in the end of May, I believe it was in May, beginning of June. And the price point was a bit higher. And I had a tenant in there that was paying low rents. So when we worked out the numbers, it really just didn’t quite make sense right now. And so I’ve been keeping my eye on this property. And I noticed that in the listing remarks, it said that the tenant was moving out. So vacant possession was going to be available, all the updated. But they updated it. They updated the listing to say don’t pretend it would be moving out. Yep. So I called her. I called her immediately, because I knew he had seen the house. And actually, I think I texted her I think I sent her a text saying hey, remember that house we saw such and such, I just found out that the tenants moving out and speak in possession her response, let’s put an offer in immediately. She goes, let’s work out this, this. And this was like late at night, because tomorrow morning was offer. So we were able to jump on it. And we were able to act on it. Because we had already seen this house. So it was great. And actually even still putting in a conditional offer because we put a condition to see it again. It’s been a while and we want to make sure everything is still really good. And do do our due diligence there. And it’s been a bit of time. And so we did have that condition in there. But the agent did tell me that she had four showings booked that weekend. So if we had that up when we did,

 

Erwin  

yeah, this is August for showings booked.

 

Tammy  

Well, they dropped the price. And that was fake possession. And it’s funny because this is the kind of house that’s been sitting in the market for so long. That probably everybody’s seen seen this house. Even our own team when I didn’t have anybody buying it. I remember talking to it. And you know, we’re having people look but it were again with that tenant just didn’t really make sense. But second, I saw that, yeah, we jumped on that.

 

Erwin  

Was it this disruptive tenant or the rent was low? Why? Why would the impediment for the house to sell

 

Tammy  

was a longtime tenant. They had been there for about 14 years, and paying 750 a month. I know. And then it’s like what

 

Erwin  

750 For what they get all inclusive, three bedroom.

 

Tammy  

I don’t know if it was utilities, or I did that. That wasn’t disclosed yet. We didn’t get that far. But it probably was all inclusive, actually. And it was two bedroom. It was the upper unit of a house. So this is a two story house. And it was the whole upper level. So these are two it’s a duplex and it’s above grade. Both units.

 

Erwin  

So many square feet was this house. I saw the pictures pretty nice.

 

Tammy  

Oh shoot. I forget. I forget what the square footage is. It’s quite large. Yeah, I mean, it was probably at least 17 Plus Yep. Is huge house was big, I would say about 17 Maybe duplex. So this house here is a duplex with with the city recognised and was possibly purposely built that way actually. This owner had been the owner for the most of the time this house had been built. And she had owned it and live there since she was five years old. So her parents then gave it over to her. And she was the one that lived on the main floor. And she is now in a nursing home and she had the upper tenant there that was there for the long time. So there was actually no way to access As the unit’s from inside the house, oh, separation, complete separation. Exactly. And it’s on a double a very large lot. So it’s 60 by 120, we did look into the options of severing. But that’s not going to be our best route. So we’re going to go ahead with our original plan, which is to turn in the again, existing detached garage, which is about 550 square feet and turn that into a garden suite.

 

Erwin  

Sorry, it’s 550 square feet for garage. Yeah,

 

Tammy  

it’s a big double car garage.

 

Erwin  

And what’s the budget for the conversion?

 

Tammy  

So the garden suite there is probably going to be about while we’re still waiting, we gotta get some quotes on this one. But we’re, I think it’s gonna be about 150 50. Yeah, I mean, I know when we’re building from scratch, we’re roughly estimating numbers around 250, approximately, that’s nothing written in stone there. Obviously, that could be some given taken lots of things, but in involved there, but this one here just had it did have some electrical to it. And then, um, so I’m more thinking, it’s going to be a little process, obviously, to get everything done, it’s going to take a bit of time. So you know, we’re rents are, then we’ll see, as of right now, I’m gonna probably say at least 2000. Because I know within this last year, our properties are duplexes of the bungalows, three bedrooms on a main floor. And well, and we’re renting for about 1900. That was like a year ago, and they go up. So let’s say, you know, they’re going up, getting towards the 2000. Then again, garden suites, similar as well. And then the inside of this particular house, we’re going to do a big renovation, though everything, it’s completely outdated. Everything’s wood.

 

Erwin  

Wood. Can we sure what she what the house sold for?



I don’t know. Can I share that? On the load?

 

Tammy  

Let’s say we got it. Well, under asking. Yeah, the asking was five 525 hours, but they got down to so when we originally went to go see it, it was 650. gone down to 600. That’s when we saw it at 600. Then it went down to 550. And then 525.

 

Erwin  

All right. Well, under asking, Well, under Yeah. And then what’s the renovation budget for the main house,

 

Tammy  

it just actually needs some updating. So it’s probably going to be a good, I’m gonna say it still might be about 100. Because they’re going to do the two full units. So typically, you know, that could be 40 50,000. And she might have some extra plans. So it’s a little a little hard to say everything’s this just happened like a week ago. So we do have some ideas, but the ideas are constantly kind of changing. So we might put some extra bedrooms in the basement and so on.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so let’s use 500 for the house. That’s not what she paid 100 for the Reno plus 150 for the basement for the garden suite. Yep. And then just for the audience’s benefit, Tammy knows renovation numbers better than almost anybody. She’s just looking for trying to be extremely exact, versus I would just ballpark something. So we’re talking about contractors too much. Yeah. Jamie’s talking to contractors every other day. Constantly. Yeah, constantly, every other day at a minimum, right?

 

Tammy  

Yeah, because there’s a couple of contractors and I would say we’re definitely speaking every week.

 

Erwin  

And then And then what’s the duplex gonna rent for?

 

Tammy  

So probably gonna get? You know what I’m gonna probably it depends on it’s hard to say right now, because it depends on if we’re going to put some extra bedrooms in the basement or not, obviously, that’s going to change things. So assuming all of that I’m gonna aim for maybe about 2000 On the main unit, you’re gonna have the main unit plus the basement, and then maybe 18 For the upper. And I probably match the garden suite to the main just for argument’s sake right now.

 

Erwin  

Sorry, I have 550 800 a month in rent. Okay, okay. Hang on. I need the calculator again. Alright, so 5800 a month works at two times 12. That’s almost $70,000 divided by, we’re in for about 750. Wow, that’s almost 9.3. The rent annual rent to price plus rental ratio was about 9.3, which is extremely high. So this is gonna cashflow really well.

 

Tammy  

Yeah. And you know, the other thing I’d like to add to is that, you know, every investor is a little bit different on how they run the numbers and their risk or comfort levels. And so on. This time around. I know that Emily wanted to be like, super conservative on our numbers as well. So we knew going into this that our big thing that we wanted to look for was going to be definitely that third unit. We wanted the third unit, whether it be in the house attached to the house or detached in the garage, right? That was key for us.

 

Erwin  

So how easy was it to find this type of deal like six months ago?

 

Tammy  

Yeah, no, we weren’t finding a whole lot six months ago, six months ago was definitely pretty tough. I remember looking at properties to, you know, pencilled in that date with the, with a, an investor to go out, look at the properties, and there’d be maybe two. And one of those two I knew probably weren’t going to be great. But getting out there and seeing houses was nice in itself. But yeah, and we’re now I just went out with another another great client of ours, Coach went out with him just recently. He’s ready. So he’s, we bought last year, and he did a duplex. And he got all his approved permits for a garden suite on his Hamilton property. And so we weren’t gonna get back out there and look again, and I was looking at the list to go through and I probably had about a dozen to choose from and then from there, I just really shrunk that list up so I think we ended up seeing about seven properties that day. And we were looking to particularly for garden suite potential properties for sure. And they weren’t they weren’t a winners once we get there and you kind of measuring things out of course, it’s a little bit tough, but just the fact that they were though they had the listings to go look at was

 

Erwin  

so you know how to measure for you understand zoning and setbacks and all that.

 

Tammy  

Yes, and I’ll be honest, I’m definitely still Yeah, as far as garden suites still learn learning like I don’t have it all completely memorised. But I do have my cheat sheets and I’m ready. Definitely,

 

Erwin  

again, oh, hang on one second, Tammy against being modest. Please go pull. If you know 10 agents, go pull them. Ask them what their zoning requirements are for the garden suite see me know the answer. Because I don’t even know the answer.

 

Tammy  

And then duplexes Yeah, definitely know about this, Tammy,

 

Erwin  

you’re the change your name. Again, like you know, famous Mandy Tran, to me knows, zoning better than any other realtors he’s ever met. So there you go. Talk a little bit of the buy side. the sell side is really interesting in this market as well, like we’re recording this on late August 2020 20. Like, for example, like since the pandemic started, it seems tend to properties are way more difficult to sell, they wouldn’t sell they’d sell at a discount. And I almost wonder if we’re seeing that even more like vacant properties are selling for a significant premium over tenant properties. Just kind of wild. Any insight into that, like you have experienced in this as well. Yeah.

 

Tammy  

Yeah, definitely like when I would say when the market was at its peak, where we talked about that right earlier in the year and 2020 20. Honestly, I don’t even know if it mattered to how much you had tenants. It’s always better to not, but that a little

 

Erwin  

bit, you get a bit of a deal with

 

Tammy  

the tenants, right? So but when the market started changing, sorry, started changing, we started really realising the importance of when we didn’t realise it. But we knew the importance of vacant possession. And it was massive, I would probably say that if I had somebody sell a house earlier on with tenants, that it would have had to been discounted, but people were going to take them. I think there was investors out there that are obviously being sneaky, taking them and then Cash for Keys. And I shouldn’t say sneaky, but they’re doing Cash for Keys, and they’re doing the things they need to do to remove the tenants. But we would see that a little bit more, but then

 

Erwin  

let’s gloss over that. Okay, homeowner, landlords, whatever you are offering money to tends to move out, and that removing, you know, for me to get paid someone offering me money, I’m not often offended. Especially when we’re talking about 1000s of dollars, 10s of 1000s of dollars.

 

Tammy  

Right. And so those might have been some of the means of what people were looking at at the time to be able to get a property even though it had tenants at it in it. And then let’s say they were paying, for example, you know, at the peak with vacant possession might have been over a million dollars for these duplexes, where if they had tenants in it, maybe they were looking at like 900 or less, where you know, what, if you’re in a slower market right now, and you have it vacant, you’re going to be least similar to that and or do even better? So it depends because it was a little bit of a challenge in a game like, you know, do we sell some people or do we sell it at the peak, even though as tenants but then they felt like they were taking a loss because it was selling for lower because they had the tenants in there, then you take the time to get the tenant out. But during that time now the markets changed and the market started dropping. So there was that little bit of challenge obviously, we did have a client though recently where they had to remove the tenant. It was a troubled tenant, they had to remove it, it was not gonna sell it was gonna sell no matter what market you put it in. Right. So we definitely had to go through those those challenges with that one,

 

Erwin  

right. So like we’re seeing significant discounts. If the property is tentative. Like for example, I believe you sold the property for 10% more than the comparable because it was vacant for 10% more than the comparable that is tenanted that’s insane.

 

Tammy  

Yeah, yep. There was another property we sold recently where the upper tenant had decided that they were going to move out they were moving into Do another one of the same landlords property, but larger. So that was all great. But it became vacant. And it was a game changer. It was hard chopping it around at the time, but the tenant and once the tenant was gone, who sold? It’s crazy.

 

Erwin  

And again, it’s not always like this folks like I’ve sold. I’ve sold it into property before but I had wonderful tenants there, they already already leave there to give notice, that’s probably partly our trigger for selling it. They are wonderful to work with. Even our photographer said the same thing. Our photographer said, normally, I won’t shoot tenants properties. But he said this was great. So

 

Tammy  

the other key thing is, if you have a tenant and they’re paying pretty good to great rents, well, then that’s fine. And they’re good tenants, then yeah, there’s no problem there. It’s obviously the ones that are troubled tenants or tenants that have wrecked the place or

 

Erwin  

are denied access to the property for people to see for sale. Perfect. Yeah.

 

Tammy  

Little Red Flag. Yeah, yeah, that’s awesome. I just heard a story recently. Can I just say so real fast. I just heard a story of of a property that there’s a gentleman trying to sell a house, it’s exclusive right now, because he refuses to try and put it on MLS. He said that the tenants that are there right now are not only refusing, but when they put a lockbox on the house, they took a torch to it. And they melted all of the numbers on the front of the lockbox and nobody can open and get in. So there’s some some crazy stories out there. Okay, so that’s the

 

Erwin  

scary part. No, because no, you’re

 

Tammy  

right. It is good to hear that kind of side. But yeah, for the most part, knock on wood. We’ve been great. We really, really have. And we’ve been and and I think for a couple of reasons why we’ve got good tenants is one, we’re really good at screening them. Or we’re really good at helping our clients learn how to screen them. Or two, we refer them to great property managers that do tenant placements. And these are people that we trust as well. And then they do well. So all in all, for the most part, I mean, it’s just a small handful that we’ve had to encounter. Some of these other stories have been other longtime tenants that have been in and maybe the landlord could be absentee who knows what the story is right from everybody else. But I mean, if it wasn’t so great for the most part of it, then the money would certainly have to be so great to have to put up with all of that, right? So obviously, there’s a big advantage,

 

Erwin  

right? There are some bad apples out there. But there’s bad apples and everything. That’s my screening is incredibly important. And we help our clients with that. Or we hand them over to property managers who will do who did the screening for them. And that generally is a good experience. It’s considerably better than what I see amateurs do. And just for as an observation, with even with a bias even though I am biassed our clients, their tenants are typically better, even if they don’t use any help. Their tents are generally better than what we see out there from other landlords. Yeah, we’re just going to be way pickier. I think our systems might help. To me any final thoughts? I know, I’ve had to do for a while

 

Tammy  

there, that’s okay. Um, I just think that if anybody is out there, and, you know, thinking about it, and wanting to get into real estate, you know, call us and make that connection. Because I find that, you know, we do, we do a lot of meetings, and we do our webinars, and we do all this kind of stuff. And a lot of people think that we’re putting it out there saying, oh, let’s do a one on one, call me. And it’s just all 100% Just based on sales, and I get why people would think that with all the businesses out there, and that that’s how it goes. But just starting with that connection, and contacting us, and having those conversations to get the ball rolling, because, you know, we got somebody like Joe Costanza, who’s, you know, 24 when he started and you know, he had a real fire under his butt, he was ready to get going. But, you know, for most of us, we look back and wish that we had done that and wish we had started. And at any age myself, I was 40 You know, when I started as well, just getting out there and getting started and get talking to people and then get to the point where you’re looking at properties and learning and surround yourself the right people. It’s just so important and so key because, you know, I remember being 20 and seeing somebody who have a friend like a boyfriend’s mom’s friend who had investment properties, thinking, that’s smart. That’s what you need to do. And then I didn’t do it. I’m like most people I didn’t they didn’t do it. So you know, if you’re nervous, you know, call us they’re rude. We’d love it. We’ll talk about

 

Erwin  

real estate. Love it.

 

Tammy  

I will talk about that. And I’ll talk about everything else too. But yeah, I think that I think that’s just a really important thing for people to take away and just make sure that they know that, you know, it’s not as scary as it needs to be and call us and just have that that initial conversation is, you know, call someone you trust and go from there.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, and I think hopefully people pick that up as well. We’ve never seen turnkey duplexes for this cheap before. They’re so cheap. It almost doesn’t make sense to buy something that needs renovation, because the rent is gonna cost you 150 For the basement. Yeah, why not just buy something something that’s already turnkey, is partly about the turnkey properties is they paid a lot less for the renovations that we did. This just with inflation, you know, to me just makes so much more sense to buy turnkey so it’s easier than ever to be a real estate investor.



In my opinion. Yeah. Awesome. All right. Thanks, Tammy. Thanks

 

Erwin  

so much for doing this.

 

Tammy  

No problem. Thanks, guys. puppies.

 

Erwin  

Puppies. Awful quiet.

 

Tammy  

Oh, yeah, the kids have all have are all occupied out there. She’s a puppy so she still sleeps a lot.

 

Erwin  

Go enjoy your puppy.

 

Tammy  

All right, thanks. Good bye, guys.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already then sign up to my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forgive the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like I did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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Email Address: tammy@infinitywealth.ca

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
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Closing on 5 Apartment Buildings and 177 Units in 2022 With Quentin D’Souza

Quick rant on rent control…

I posted on my Facebook and Instagram story where 100 prospective tenants lined up to view a rental property in Dublin, Ireland.  Their government, wisely, please read the sarcasm, implemented rent control so rents do not keep up with inflation forcing landlords to sell their investment properties. 

The next property owner may move in this, removing rental supply or a new landlord, typically with deeper pockets than the previous, will want a return on their investment hence turnover of the tenants, renovate, and raise rents.

The supply and lower-end rents are forever gone, and the rich get richer.  

Rental developers do not like rent control. However, no capitalist wants their prices to be controlled, so it’s down to the government to build us enough housing… good luck with that.

My team, iWIN Real Estate and I will provide an economic update and drill down into what investments we’re getting into, including turnkey properties. You wouldn’t believe it, triplex conversions. 

We’ll get into the details around the strategy, renovation plans, budgets and calculating cash flow, so you don’t want to miss it. Saturday, September 17, 2022, at our office in Oakville.  Just two more meetings until the Wealth Hacker Conference on Saturday, November 12th. CLICK HERE TO REGISTER.

Much to learn, network and wealth building to be done!

On the personal front, the new Tesla Model Y we’ve had for three weeks has been an experience! The electrical quotes were steep as we have an in-law suite occupied by our nanny’s family, so our electrical panel is quite full.

The Tesla charger itself is $700, but a dryer outlet will do if you already have one.

The learning curve is steep, like going from my analog Nokia 8210 I had in the year 2000 vs. a modern iPhone.

First off, it’s one-pedal driving because the Tesla abruptly slows down once you remove your foot from the accelerator pedal because the regenerative braking kicks to recover some energy wasted in braking. So I rarely touch the brake pedal anymore.

The Autopilot is pretty sweet. It’s especially good in traffic as the Tesla will come to a stop and go when traffic moves again.  I do have to wiggle the steering wheel once in a while when queued, so it knows I’m paying attention.

The storage is great; our hotel on the weekend had a great parking spot near the lobby with free charging. Not that charging is expensive. A full charge for a depleted battery to 100% is $7.30, and that’ll take us over 500km, but we use less than 20% daily, so it costs less than a double double at Tim Horton’s to drive it. 

Of course, we would not consider the Tesla without the $55,000 plus HST deduction. Thank you, Justin Trudeau, for giving the rich such a lovely tax benefit, lol.

Much to learn, network and wealth building to be done!

On the personal front, the new Tesla Model Y we’ve had for three weeks has been an experience! The electrical quotes were steep as we have an in-law suite occupied by our nanny’s family so our electrical panel is quite full.

The Tesla charger itself is $700 but a dryer outlet will do if you already have one.

The learning curve is steep like going from my analog Nokia 8210 I had in the year 2000 vs. a modern iPhone.

First off, it’s one pedal driving because the Tesla abruptly slows down once you remove your foot from the accelerator pedal because the regenerative braking kicks to recover some energy wasted in braking. I rarely touch the brake pedal anymore.

The Autopilot is pretty sweet. It’s especially good in traffic as the Tesla will come to a stop and go when traffic moves again.  I do have to wiggle the steering wheel once in a while when queued so it knows I’m paying attention.

The storage is great; our hotel on the weekend had a great parking spot near the lobby with free charging. Not that charging is expensive. A full charge for a depleted battery to 100% is $7.30, and that’ll take us over 500km, but we use less than 20% for our daily use, so it costs less than a double double at Tim Horton’s to drive it. 

Of course, we would not consider the Tesla without the $55,000 plus HST deduction. Thank you, Justin Trudeau, for giving the rich such a lovely tax benefit lol.

Read more about the tax implications here: https://realestatetaxtips.ca/buying-a-tesla-and-save-22826-of-tax-immediately/.

Closing on 5 Apartment Buildings and 177 Units in 2022 With Quentin D’Souza

Speaking of rich people, this week we have the very successful Quentin D’Souza on the show. 

There are many coaches and Multifamily experts, but in my experience, Quentin is one of the best. I know many of his past students, including Steve Phillips, on my iWIN Real Estate team and his investment partners. Not many share a track record of success like Quentin.

He’s on today’s show with Cherry giving the interview as I was out hosting a golf event with fellow 7 figure entrepreneurs, so as we sometimes do, “divide and conquer.”

I wrote down some questions I wanted to ask Quentin about apartment building investing, investing in the US, where best to find cash flow, and what the future holds. 

You know, the same stuff you ask anyone who bought five apartment buildings or 177 units this year alone and is always looking to level up.

Quentin is an old friend, the Chief Education Office and founder of Durham REI, a really great, long-running networking group that meets monthly; he’s authored four books, including the most recent ”The Action Taker’s Real Estate Investing Planner” link https://www.amazon.ca/Action-Takers-Estate-Investing-Planner/dp/099367173X?dplnkId=a0338035-2ffa-4400-9b24-053578dc6df7&nodl=1#aw-udpv3-customer-reviews_feature_div.

Obviously, a big-time investor. 

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

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To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Hello and welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate show. And my name is Erwin and I have a quick rant on rent control. I posted on my Facebook and Instagram just last week, an article about how 100 Plus prospective tenants lined up to view a rental property in Dublin, Ireland, their government wisely, this is sarcasm, their government wisely implemented rent control. So the rents do not keep up with inflation forcing landlords to self investment properties, the next property owner may move into the property, thus reducing rental supply or a new landlord. Typically one with deeper pockets. Some of these are massive investment funds now, they’ll want to return on their investment. Hence they’ll turn over the tenants renovate and raise rents the supply and lower and rents are forever gone. And the rich just get richer. Understand that rental developers and people who build purpose built rentals, they do not like rent control. Hence, we saw a whole bunch of projects get cancelled, when rent control was reinstated by the Ford government. No capitalist in general likes their prices to be controlled. So it’s down to the government down to the socialists to build a system of housing, that I am not gonna hold my breath. I’m gonna do what I can to take care of myself, my family and my kids in terms of rental housing. So my team at Island real estate team and I will provide an economic update and drill down into what investments we’re getting into, including turnkey properties, and you wouldn’t believe it. Thanks to this market correction, we’re actually seeing more and more opportunity for triplex conversion going from single family to three. And we’re just talking about lack of supply. My clients and I were creating supply, sometimes doubling or tripling that of one property a single family home, we’ll get into the details around strategy, renovation plans, budgets, and of course, tucking in cash flow. So you don’t want to miss it on Saturday, September 17. That Saturday morning, doors open at 830. At our offices in Oakville, Ontario, just two more meetings until the wealth hacker conference on Saturday, November 12. I’ll post the link in the show notes to register for our meeting. There’s much more fun to learn out there. And there’s always much smarter to learn. And of course, networking with like minded folks, and wealth building to be done. On the personal front, our new Tesla Model y we’ve had for about three weeks now, it has been quite an experience, the electrical quotes were steep, we had to upgrade our panel and obviously have an electrician to instal the Tesla wall unit. Just to test the wall unit just to charge her nothing fancy. It’s not a battery or anything but the charger itself is seven or $700. Or you can just you can just use a dryer outlet. If you happen to have one in your garage, which we do not we do not the learning curve of owning and driving a Tesla is really different. I would compare it to my old analogue Nokia that I had back in the year 2022 years ago, versus a modern day iPhone, it’s completely different. The technology inside of Tesla is really impressive. For example, we dropped off the Tesla to get wrapped for protection on the front end and some window times whatnot. And I was just curious if they started work yet. So I checked my Tesla app. And I could turn on the cameras within the car and it did check where it was. And also have exact GPS location. So I know they moved in the car. Also, the Tesla operates under one pedal driving, because if you take your foot off the accelerator pedal, I used to call the gas. Now there’s no gas, so they call it the accelerator pedal. So that’s one call to when you take your foot off it or ease off of it, the regenerative braking kicks in, it’s actually pretty abrupt. That’s it’s pretty hard break. That’s what it feels like to the point of that is to recover any energy wasted during the braking process. Hence, I actually rarely break anymore. So it’s pretty cool. Also really cool is the autopilot feature, which is the fancy cruise control. It’s especially good and stop and go traffic as the car will come to a stop if the car in front of you stops. And when the car in front of me goes, the car will go without me really having to touch anything. I do just have to keep my hands on the wheels wheel to let it know I’m still there. Once in a while. Charging hasn’t been that bad. And we’ve taken it on like a road trip already up to Blue Mountain Village. And the next thing was our hotel for the weekend. They had a great parking spot for our Tesla for the free charging station right next to the lobby. And again, it was free. Not that charging the cars expensive for a zero to 100% Charge. We’re talking to $8. And then for our daily usage, Jerry and I we use less than 20%. So we’re talking about the cost of a Tim Hortons double double. It’s really inexpensive to drive. Of course, we would not have never considered buying a Tesla without that $55,000 plus HST deduction for tax purposes. Thank you Justin Trudeau for giving the rich such a lovely tax benefit.

 

Erwin  

understand almost everything electric vehicles over 50 grand the Tesla Model y was was significantly more than that. It’s the most expensive car you’ll ever own. And we’d never do this deal without this monster tax credit. Thanks to our lovely government, you can be more of a tax implication and I would left a link to cherries article on the on a tax savings for buying a Tesla or equivalent electric vehicle. Speaking of rich people, this week, we have the very successful Quint D’souza on the show. There are tonnes of coaches and multifamily experts out there but my experience Quentin is one of the best. I know many of his past students, including Steve Phillips on on my island real estate investment team. And I know many of its investment partners. They’re all like Clinton’s legit. Let’s leave it at that. Not many have a successful track record like Clinton’s, so you probably want to pay attention to this show. He’s on the show today with cherry actually, Terry’s been delivering the interview. It’s always out hosting a golf event with fellow seven figure entrepreneurs. So Charlie and I had to quote unquote, divide and conquer. We don’t conquer anything, though. I don’t know why. You can see that term, actually prepared the questions that I wanted to ask Quentin personally about pardon building investing, investing in the US where to find cashflow these days, and what the future holds. You know, the same stuff you’d ask for someone you know, with hundreds of units in their portfolio. Yeah, quite. It’s pretty successful if you don’t know and also like the show title. Quinn has closed or real close on 177 units this year alone. He’s always looking to level up Quinn’s an old friend. He’s the chief education officer and founder of the germ Rei, a really, really great long running working group that meets monthly majorem region. He’s authored four books including the most recent the action takers, estate investing planner, and I’ve linked in the show notes to the Amazon that are going to search Amazon you can search Quentin D’souza or again the name of the book The action takers real estate investing planner. Obviously, Quentin is a big time investor. Please enjoy the show.

 

Cherry  

Hi, Quentin. 

 

Quentin  

Hey, how you doing cherry

 

Cherry  

Welcome to our truth about real estate investing Show and welcome to my very first podcast host duty show. I hope we will be doing okay. What’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Quentin  

Let’s see I’m buying apartment buildings. We closed on in March we closed on 17 unit and a 24 unit 24 unit was in Kingston 17 unit was in Belleville we’re closing on 100 units at the end of this month. Next month we’re closing on 20 unit and another 16 unit. So we’re buying apartment buildings. Keeping me that’s keeping me busy. Seems sounds

 

Cherry  

a little bit busy. But how’s how’s the summer How’s been? How’s been not being a baseball dad.

 

Quentin  

So it’s been really good. My my oldest son got on to the York bulls baseball team. So we’re going to be doing a lot of that in September and October. He has doubleheaders every weekend, my younger son is doing house league baseball, and we were really enjoying that. I did a trip to Machu Picchu or the Inca trail with my oldest son we did a week at the end of June and we and then both my son’s we did a whitewater rafting trip at the beginning of August for about four days. So we had lots of fun there. 

 

Cherry  

So that’s amazing. 

 

Quentin  

Yeah, it’s been good. 

 

Cherry  

Yeah, I hear baseball is worse than hockey in terms of training schedule. And then also competition schedule.

 

Quentin  

The definitely is a lot, a lot of time, but now that he drives and so that makes it a lot easier. So he is able to drive himself to practice. And my older son works out like every day. So he goes for like two or three hours, takes the car and goes and works out comes back. Right. So like it just it makes it a lot easier. And then we just show up to the games.

 

Cherry  

Yes, that is very that’s like I would say 80% of the battle. Yeah.

 

Quentin  

Oh, yeah, for sure. There was a lot of of chauffeuring going on between Laura and myself, just, you know, getting the kids to different events and stuff like that. And now with the older one driving sometimes you can take the younger one. Oh, that’s amazing. I hope so. Quite a bit for sure.

 

Cherry  

How do you like go like, I don’t know if I would ever be able to like completely like go drive the car, take the car and not worry about that.

 

Quentin  

Well, I mean, you still worry about them. The other thing was he’s not driving my truck. We bought another car using this. We call it the family car. Oh, okay. Right. And it’s neither my wife’s car, my car, we’re, you know, we have a third vehicle so and it’s just like, little Hyundai can’t remember. It’s just like a little Hyundai and you know, it’s great for getting from A to B and so it’s worked out well. That’s awesome. Yeah, it’s amazing. And he’s been really good about you know, we we He make sure that he contributes to the, you know, the car. So he’s paying for his insurance then yeah, and then, you know, after the first tank of gas, because that’s to get to work and to go to the different places he’s paying for anything additional to that. So want to make sure that he has some responsibilities to, you know, when it comes to keeping in maintaining the vehicle, any tickets he’s gonna pay? So

 

Cherry  

Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah. So like, like going along with that line. I know, you have been an educator for many, many years before you jump into being a real estate investor full time, and you’ve got a wealth of knowledge to share. And how are you educating your kids? Because your kids are? I mean, my kids are eight and seven, they’re relatively young, maybe 10 years behind your kids? How are you educating them? And how are you developing their financial sense?

 

Quentin  

You know, it’s being open having conversation. So at dinner time, my wife often says that we talk about finances quite a bit. Right. And it is something that I never did when I was a kid, but I’m making sure that we talk about it now. We talk about, you know, prices, we talk about inflation, we talk about just different concepts, real estate and the purple book, right, the Robert Kiyosaki book. Yeah, we, I would have them listen to that when we did car trips. So I did I put on the, like, the audiobook version when they were younger. And when I took them on long trips, I would just put that on. And then we were talking about concepts. You know, I like definitely encouraging the older one to read books. And, you know, making sure that that he reads the books. Right. So that’s, that’s been good. The younger one, he’s still you know, he’s interested more in cryptocurrency and NF T’s and that sort of thing. So I’m encouraging. I bought one of his NF T’s. Right. So I was like, Sure, I’ll buy it. I don’t know. Yeah. Right. So I’m encouraging them to experiment. And, you know, do that. But yeah, I mean, it’s always, it’s always about sharing, and just telling them what I’m doing. Like, I’m often saying, Look, I’ve raised this, we’re buying this, this is what I’m doing, right. So I’m pretty open about it, so that they understand what I’m doing. They don’t understand the details and going into it. But if they are interested in I’m always happy to share more, right. So

 

Cherry  

that’s really cool, really cool. I’m trying to make Bruce do these burpees as they do, as he does burpees, he earns, like 10 cents per burpee. And so he’s doing a lot of burpees. Lately, it was by accident that we discovered that Bruce was bruises only seven years old. So he’s like quite young, he doesn’t really quite grabs the concept of money. So it was by accident, he loves to go into he loves going to the gym with me. So my trainer offered him 10 cents for burpee, because he’s always reading the book at a gym. And so he started doing burpees, he got so excited about doing burpees because of the money that I realised, hey, like, you’re actually very motivated by money, I’ll just pay you to earn that money. And then a few weeks later, we go to Niagara Falls, and we were at this breakfast place, which is totally a tourist trap. Anyway, so they charge $5 for a cranberry juice, a glass of cranberry juice, and Bruce wanted the cranberry juice. And I said, that’s fine. So you have to pay for it as $5. And then I said how many burpees? Do you have to do 500 books. He’s like linking the two and he’s regretting it. So he’s linking the two. I know, it’s not a direct kind of science to match the two, nobody is going to pay him to do burpees ever. But it’s kind of like introducing that concept. I think introducing it and talking about what you do. I think leading by example is also extremely to me, it’s extremely important. I’m trying to live up to that standard.

 

Quentin  

Yeah, for sure. And I mean, like they they really need to know that. Like there is different ways to earn, like money as well too. Right? So that’s, you know, time per hour. Right? And that’s definitely how everybody starts off. Right? And then there’s other ways like investing your funds in order to have your money make money for you too. Right. And that comes later on but that’s that’s great. That’s a definitely a fundamental concept for them to learn. So that’s that’s pretty cool. I like that.

 

Cherry  

Hey folks, his burpees So you mentioned that you have been so busy purchasing closing properties and then skelding properties to buy as well. Can you share with us where or how you’re investing in finding these deals because majority of the people are complaining like there was no deals out there. Maybe there are more deals now after the interest rate has gone up so much. But before people were complaining, like I can’t find these deals.

 

Quentin  

Well luckily I have a book on that top Back to finding properties toolbox. It goes into a lot more detail. But with there are a lot of different approaches to being able to find properties, particularly multifamily properties. And it’s more about the relationships that you have than it is about the marketing strategies, there are a lot of like, I get, like, every week, I get mail from realtors, from people who want to buy directly, like, who’s purchased a list and our, you know, mailing apartment building owners directly, I get phone calls from brokers asking me whether I want to sell my buildings, right. So there’s that approach to doing it. Another approach is talking to, you know, the people who are interacting daily with apartment building. So talking to property managers and saying, Hey, listen, especially because I’m not a realtor. So I can say, look, property manager, if you have, you know, of one of your clients that are looking to sell, I will pay you $5,000 referral fee, if I close on the building, and I’m happy to do I’ve paid a property manager $20,000 to close on a building, and then I refinanced all my money out of the building like two years later. But, but I mean, like having those just because I know I can do that, I do that. You can talk to trades and be able to find that. The other thing is that develop relationships with realtors and brokers who that’s what they do daily. That’s the relationships that they have are with building owners, that’s where you’re probably going to get your biggest result is developing good relationships with people who are actually in the trenches day to day dealing with the relationships that they’ve built over the last 1015 20 years to connect with other building owners. And now they’re connecting, what they’re trying to do is connect the buyer and the seller together themselves. That’s who so if you can build those relationships, those are three different strategies that you can use to, you know, be able to pick up multifamily buildings. And if you want more go pick up a book.

 

Cherry  

So what’s the percentage of your property purchase? Through the strategies that you mentioned? Or are they also on MLS? How many are through your relationships, or your network? And how many are really through the public MLS? I saw this list thing, like the rumour or the story that I’ve always been told is that when you buy multifamily, it’s never on MLS, those are like probably the last ones that you would look at.

 

Quentin  

I don’t think I bought a build apartment building off the MLS at all. I don’t think so nothing I can think of off the top of my head. No, the other 25 Plus buildings, none of them have been on MLS Wow. Not that I can think of usually, it’s relationships. Yeah. Just trying to think if there was one on the MLS or not, and no, but

 

Cherry  

that already gave me the all the audience the percentage that, you know, if you want to get into the game, you’re not just relying on MLS, you have to develop these relationships.

 

Quentin  

And that’s actually why people tend to want to partner with me is because I’ve developed all those relationships. And you know, I’ve been able to, like, have the deals that that makes sense. And I have developed partners who get deals as well. And like, all of that stuff is things that have been developed over the years, right. I often make jokes, sometimes that MLS is where good deals go to die, like, especially in the apartment building space. But I mean, if I was to list the property, I would probably want to list it on the MLS, right? Because I know that I would probably be getting the most I could for for them. Now if you develop a relationship with a broker, and they’re able to give you the price that you want. And it makes the most sense because based on cap rate and net operating income, you get the price that you want them Why even go to the MLS at the same time. Right? Does that make sense? So I don’t know there’s there’s a lot of pros and cons, I guess. But when it comes to buying properties, it’s always been based on relationships and relationships that have been developed for sure.

 

Cherry  

Like I have to say, early on in my career, I was very focused and very narrow minded and I would just hide myself in the home office like cranking numbers and crunching tax returns and doing all these things and it wasn’t until recently like just to be fair, I I am still at heart and introvert people don’t call me an introvert but I am at heart very much an introvert to put yourself out there to do the network and make yourself known is not my own nature. Are you an introvert? Yes, you are.

 

Quentin  

Oh yeah, I’m a big introvert. Well, yeah, sometimes you can see me A party’s and I’m, I’m just sitting there looking. You know, I do push myself to be able to go out and talk to people. You know, most people would call me an extrovert, but I’m not like I am. It’s just not, you know, I like to sit in think honestly, I would rather be going for a walk by myself than I would be in a party with a bunch of people. Like I would rather be hiking or, you know, camping and I’m good with being by myself. You know, it’s funny, I was at a retreat once, and people were all talking about, like, what they would like to do. And I was like, Well, I just like to be on an island by myself for a week.

 

Cherry  

I don’t think I’m not that extreme yet.

 

Quentin  

You know, I just sometimes like, you know, I, when I was in university, I did tree planting, right, and tree planting was enabled me to pay for university, and I got paid per tree, but I wouldn’t be working by myself for eight hours, just like hard labour. And that was fine with me, I was good. You know, you crave at that point, you start to crave being social with people, right? Because you’re often by yourself, but I was okay with it. Right? Like, you know, everybody’s different, you got to kind of do you do have to talk to people, you do have to do events, and you know, but it’s about pushing yourself, right? I’m a very goal oriented person, we, I like to do travelling I like, you know, I like to do, and push myself to do new things. And that makes me get out of my comfort zone. And the only way to grow is to get out of your comfort zone. So I agree. Sometimes I tell people, if you want to change, especially what you’re doing, add a zero to every deal that you do going forward. Right? And all of a sudden, you move from a $1 million deal to a $10 million deal. Totally different, right? That’s gonna push you out of your, your comfort zone, right? Kind

 

Cherry  

of the 10x mentality. Yeah, absolutely. And it’s

 

Quentin  

not for everyone, right, you have to decide for yourself if that’s for you. But if you want to grow, you need to do something different. You can’t grow by doing the same thing over and over again, you need to grow by doing something different. And then once you find something that you’re happy with, then you just you know, you can continue to get to a point. But what gets you to one place is not going to get you to, you know, a different place. You have to change what you’re doing.

 

Cherry  

Absolutely. So speaking of that changes and going into different markets and buying multifamily, because we talked about earlier on between us that you grew from you didn’t start buying multifamily unit, no, like 100 unit in one town. Right from the get go. There was a journey from your beginning from the beginning to now and you also quit your job focus on this full time. I want to revisit that story a little bit. Because I think to our listener here, there is a lot to learn from you. Because a lot of us are attracted to real estate because they want financial freedom and dreaming one day that hey, maybe one day I can quit my job with the real estate portfolio. How did that happen to you?

 

Quentin  

Well, I mean, what ended up happening was that I built a small portfolio of properties, mostly single family homes and duplexes. And I ended up with about $5,000 a month in cash flow that had come from my portfolio. This was back in 2013. And 12, I had bank, I’d been banking that money aside, and then 2013, I needed to make that decision whether to continue or not. Now, when I quit my job, I really only had that one source of income, I was running the Durham real estate investor club. And that gave a little bit of of income, but it wasn’t as much as my portfolio was. And then when I quit my job, I added another form of income, which was flipping properties, which allowed me to gain and all I was doing was the same buy fix refinance strategy that I was doing before, but instead of refinancing, I was just selling them off. I always have a backup strategy. Whenever I did those projects, I always have two or three different ways to exit a property, either refinance and hold or refinance and partner with somebody or sell which is what I was doing at that time. And I was just I was just selling them off. And what was useful about that, and I don’t think a lot of people realise this is when they quit their job, you’re not going to get financing anymore. It becomes much more difficult to do that. Now you could go to be lenders, you there are different ways to go about doing it, but it becomes a lot more challenging. So what I ended up doing once I realised that that wasn’t going to be how I continued to grow unless i i I partnered with other people who would qualify. And I did. I’ve done that before. But what I ended up doing was moving to the apartment building space where it wasn’t based on my qualification, it was mostly based on the building qualification, right. And that allowed me to scale and can continue to grow. And then as I refinanced those assets, I was able to recapture some of the equity that I could reinvest into other projects and to do do what I needed to do with that. So, you know, I think that one to four unit properties are great for people to start to create that that base layer of financial freedom. And then once they take that, they get to a point where they say, Okay, now I’m going to leave my job, you know, I’ve created this great base of income. Now it’s time to think about moving to apartment buildings, for sure. And maybe even just before you do that, to move to apartment buildings, because I think that is where you actually create wealth, you create net worth, and you’re not creating, I think sometimes the mistake is that people think that apartment buildings, you know, they’re not a great cash flow generator, the thing is, is that you have to change your thinking into how that cash flow comes to you. Because in an apartment building, you may be reinvesting all of your cash flow into the asset. But in year three, or year four, year five, you refinance all of your money out, right. And then in year six, you do it again. Yeah, right. And they really the challenge is to make sure that you’re not extracting too much equity, so that their capital gains aren’t theirs, you’ve extracted so much equity, that there’s, you can’t pay the capital gains if you decide to sell the asset, right. So that’s, that’s a, that’s a problem. But that’s not a problem with, you know, one to four unit properties, right. And so it’s a different model. And I think that as you grow in what you’re doing, depending on where you’re at, that’s when you need to decide on what you’re switching to right. I have a great chart where I show, you know, people start off in the build phase, and then they move into the growth phase, right. And when they move from the build phase, they have high leverage, right? Because you owe everybody starts off with high leverage. And then as you’re building, your leverage starts to decrease and your cash flow starts to increase. And as you get further along in your real estate investing career, you end up with, you know, very low leverage, higher cash flow, but that takes time to be able to get to that point. The issue with real estate is that you can be equity rich and cashflow poor. Yeah. Right. And so

 

Cherry  

lots of clients like that showing negative every single year.

 

Quentin  

Yeah. And the challenge is, okay, well, then how do I how can I leverage the those one to four unit properties in order to access some of that equity, and maybe you lend it out, maybe you do some some other strategy in order to create cash flow from that. But that is really a problem with one to four unit properties. In the multifamily space, it’s based on net operating income. And because I can add, increase my rents, I can increase the value of the building, thus, I can refinance the asset a lot easier, and then recapture that equity and put it to work again into more assets.

 

Cherry  

So what’s the typical loan to value when you refinance? When it comes down to the multifamily space?

 

Quentin  

It just depends on the debt coverage ratio, and it depends. So let’s say you’re going to CMHC financing, you’re probably at a 1.2 debt coverage ratio. But that could mean an 85% loan to value depending on the asset. And we just did. Was it a 17? Unit? Yeah, the 17 unit was a 40 year amortisation 85% loan to value. Wow. But the debt coverage ratio is 1.2. On the asset makes sense?

 

Cherry  

Yeah, if you can get 40 Yeah, that’s amazing.

 

Quentin  

Right. And, and that’s in the multifamily space, right. So it is very different. But could I qualify for a car loan? This makes no sense. But this is the banking system, right? Instead of taking a loan, I’ll just pay for it in cash. All right, and then that’s fine. Like it’s just a different way of doing it, unfortunately. Right. But because I don’t have a T for income in the same way. I have to make sure that my my corporate books are in order. I can show what my corporations are making, but because I don’t take it personally because I don’t need it. Right. I may not be able to even it’s such a weird I know, weird situation. Right?

 

Cherry  

Yeah. Yeah. That’s how our banking system work. That’s right. So in Canada, yes. So okay, now that you mentioned in Canada, so I’ve seen somewhere that you’ve invested in the States. Yes. So yeah, yeah. Yeah. How are those investment coming along?

 

Quentin  

So I have, I’ve got properties in Tampa in Tampa properties I bought in 2008. Team. And because I couldn’t get financing, I had to purchase them cash, right? I couldn’t get financing on them. And then I got a foreign, like, what do you call it like a foreign buyers loan or whatever. And it was like 7% interest rate at 65% loan to value, which was a real pain. But since that time, just earlier this year, I actually was able to get a loan with a financial institution that had in Canada that had an office in Florida. And so what that enabled me to do is get a 75% LTV at like a rate that made sense, which was like 4%. Yeah, the properties in Tampa, I’d actually doubled in value since I had purchased them. And you know, now it’s still cashflow is about $2,000 per month on those assets. And you know, and I’ve got different, I’m involved in different projects down in, in the US, but I see my stuff in the US as a hedge against the Canadian economy gives me the opportunity to get paid in US dollars. And you know, that’s really the main reason for investing in the US. And it’s important to, you know, from a tax perspective, to avoid double taxation. Yeah, right. Because if you’re not structured properly in the US, you could really like it can really mess you up. And I find that a lot of advice out there is bad advice, because it’s old advice that doesn’t work anymore, like use LLCs. And things like that, right, which just don’t work anymore, right?

 

Cherry  

It’s not just that like we had in our practice. I mean, this is truth about real estate investment show. But I can’t help to talk about some taxes. We’ve helped a few of our clients doing some structuring Layli worth their US purchases. And we found that without experience, even with the great limited partnership structure, we see some crazy number of taxes, the Combine between the Canadian and the US side is crazy, even with the proper tax structure. And it’s almost like a cost of doing business outside of Canada, that people often don’t account for. So that’s the part that I always wanted to do up sort of a presentation on eventually, one day, I’m not ready. I’m not there

 

Quentin  

yet. So that would be a great presentation, I’m sure Yeah, yeah,

 

Cherry  

absolutely. So you know, a lot of investors in different stage in their journey. And I mean, I want an I never really invested in never made a lip to invest in, I guess, in apartment building. We wanted to every time like I went to the multifamily conference, I will I see all these people taking all these massive action, I talk to Sarah, I see that all everyone’s doing all these massive action, the only hope I have is like, I have my own accounting business that I do have to take care of. And my, my husband, Irwin has his own real estate team that he has to take care of we have businesses, and how much of the involvement in the day to day involvement. Do you like how much time do you need to do this thing?

 

Quentin  

So that’s a trick question.

 

Cherry  

I’m not sure.

 

Quentin  

But it depends on how you answer it. So what I would probably say to you is then you partner with somebody who is somebody who does the day to day work, and you don’t take on the amount of work that’s required in order to do this and build the relationships and do all those different things. So you don’t have to be that person that oftentimes I have. I have conversations with business owners, and usually professionals like doctors, dentists, I’ll talk to just different people who are busy. And instead of being you don’t have to be the person who is the operator and do the day to day to benefit from apartment buildings. You can be a partner and it’s okay. Okay,

 

Cherry  

so how does that how does that number work? Tell me Tell me pretend that I am the Crazy Rich Asians I’m no. I am. But how does the number work? Like if I were to put in like $200,000 and invest it in one of your projects? How does it work?

 

Quentin  

Well, I can’t really present something like that on a show like this. But like, in general, what happens is that you would take your your funds, and you would own an actual piece of the building, you’re actually an equity owner in the project. This is not like a fund, right? Like you’re actually an equity owner. So that that is shares that are equity positions in the building. But what happens is that within that within that structure, there are people who are you know, more active, those people will have a higher percentage, but they end up doing the business plan. So they’re working on you know, the day to day operations of the building. They’re all So doing the, you know, making sure that the property is going to be able to be refinanced and pull all the funds out. So usually what happens in year three to five, we’re looking to refinance the building and make sure that our partners are able to get back the funds that they invested, but they still own the equity share of the building. Right. And so if you think about that, from a return perspective, that in three to five years, that’s very lucrative. Yeah, right. And I mean, nobody can promise, you know, anything. But I’ve been doing this since 2009. You know, and I, you know, I work with people that I like, and that, like me, and I think you don’t have to be the person who is in the day to day. Now, if you wanted to be the person who is, and this is the other side, if you want to be the person that is going to be in the day to day, there are lots of great people that have courses and that that you can learn on, you know, how to do underwriting on multifamily building to make sure that you’re able to carry out a business plan, right, you need to spend time and effort into learning that business, you need to be able to develop the relationships and go out like, I’m often like, maybe once a week, at least going out for lunch or meeting somebody this morning, I was here as meeting I was, you know, I’m always meeting people in building my relationships. And that’s something that you’re going to have to be able to do, if you’re a busy business owner, you don’t have time to do that, right. So you have to keep in mind that there are a lot of things in the background that you need to do as well, you could just buy a building off the MLS, that’s definitely something that you could do. But that doesn’t mean that you’re going to be cashflow positive, when you’re doing that. And it doesn’t mean that you’re going to be in the position to refinance in three years. But it could mean that you still own that asset, right. So it just depends on like how you want to go about doing this, anybody can buy real estate, you don’t have to be you don’t have a PhD to do that. The problem is, is that, you know, buying the wrong asset is going to be a lot more expensive than just partnering with somebody in giving doing the right thing, right. Because like apartment buildings, like if you end up with an asset, that’s losing money every month, and then you have to put in 100,000 or $200,000, for renovations, and then you have to, you know, pay somebody to leave. And then you have the LTV issues that come up, you can be out like hundreds of 1000s of dollars, which is very different than, you know, dealing with one to four unit space. And that’s often why I say start off there, right. But I often have like we are usually, you know, working with people who want are working in the one to four unit space, don’t want to get into the commercial space, but know that that’s where they want to go. So when they saw an aside or, you know, they may work with us. Yeah, right. There’s just different ways of doing it. Like, yes, you can definitely do it how much time is really based on the amount you want to dedicate to it, right? That’s the success you’ll have, right? If you want to be great multifamily investor, expect to spend, you know, 20 to 30 hours, just like every week working on that business to a point where at some point, you’ll know what you need to do. And then you’ll be spending a lot less time doing it. Right? Just like any business,

 

Cherry  

absolutely. 100%. I like your when we go to events, we often get pumped up and think oh, it’s super easy. You’d like tomorrow, I the day after the event, I would hear or see my clients saying like, I’m doing this, my goal is this big. And I’m like happy for them. It’s just that at the same time, I’m looking at my own personal situation like, can I just quit my accounting job and just do this full time. And that’s not something that I can at this point I want to do. And so that’s why I’m like, I need a realistic picture in terms of how much time commitment you need, I guess with any business is the same.

 

Quentin  

It’s the same with your profit, like how long did it take you to get to where you are?

 

Cherry  

A long time? Eight years, 10 years, 10 years? Eight years?

 

Quentin  

Yeah. And same with me, it’s taken me that long to be able to build my portfolio to the size that it is and develop all the relationships and the business partnerships and all of that that got me to this place. So yes. Can anybody do it? Yes. Anybody can open an accounting practice. Can you? Can you be a successful accountant with a successful practice? That’s very different. Yeah,

 

Cherry  

absolutely. I agree. 100%. Yeah. Now speaking of all these investments, where do you think that interest rate is gonna go? That million dollar.

 

Quentin  

All right, first of all, I hate that question, because I get asked all the time, but I have to ask. I know. And, but the thing is, is that interest rates are just an expense. Let’s not get like people get all caught up with what’s happening in the last 30 days, and lose sight of what happens in the next 10 years from today. because if you think about interest rates in the fact that okay, interest rates have gone up, you’re probably thinking, you know, because the one to four unit market has lost 25% In the last six months, or whatever it is, you’re losing sight, the fact that in the last 10 years, that same asset would have probably tripled in price. Yep. Is it more like so let’s start to focus on whether the property cash flows that makes sense is cashflow positive, and you’re able to carry that asset based on, let’s say, 10 year rates? Can you carry that asset based on tenure rates, and that way, your stress testing, whatever you’re buying, and you’re able to hold that asset for the long term, because if you’re able to, like, if you’re able to hold that property, and everybody out there, I want you to think about, if you bought whatever property you lived in 10 years ago, what is it worth now? Right? Yeah, it’s probably worth a lot more. Yeah, right. Especially if you’re in a market that makes sense. Like, you know, we have population that’s coming to that area, we have different sorts of employment, we see governments that are investing into the infrastructure in the area, we see all of those good things that make the the economics of an area. Good, right? If we’re doing that, that’s what we should focus on. Because interest rate is just an expense. It’s just like property management. It’s just like property tax. It’s all it is, is an expense, let’s not get carried away, is what I want to tell people look at, stop thinking about what’s happened in the last 30 days and start thinking about what’s going to happen the next 10 years. And then make sure that you’re buying properties that are cashflow positive, always I’ve always said that if you buy a property that’s cashflow positive, and, and your plan is to hold it for 10 years, and you’ve stress tested the asset so that you know that you’re going to be able to withstand, you know, rates that go up, then what doesn’t matter what interest rates do?

 

Cherry  

So that’s such a tricky answer as well. The reason is, because then it leads to a lot of the questions that maybe I don’t get, but a lot of our clients would, would be asking that those questions. How do you find these cash flowing properties? Because it seems like it’s disappearing, like I think Durham and Hamilton Hamilton is where I invest. And I know you invest in Durham heavily, at least in that one to four unit space. So how do you find the properties that would still at least let’s not go to cashflow positive, let’s just go into like cash flow neutral? How do you at least find that properties that would be able to give you enough rent to support everything?

 

Quentin  

Well, let’s say prices decreased 20 to 25%. All of a sudden, you’re gonna see assets that make more sense. That didn’t make sense before. Yeah, the trick is to stop being fearful and, you know, start being greedy, because this is what everybody else is they’re being fearful. Aside from that what ends up happening over time is that you move out from from a market and you move further out. But you want to make sure that the economic fundamentals are there with whatever market that you’re interested in. So maybe instead of being in like 10 years ago, I could have bought a property in Pickering, and it would have been cashflow positive. I’m not going to buy a property in Pickering. That’s cashflow positive today, right. So I’m going out to maybe Bowmanville to be able to buy a similar asset. Now I’m still in the Durham Region. And but I’m going further east, right? Maybe I’m in Peterborough, maybe I’m in Kingston, maybe I’m in Belleville, right. And I’m looking at different markets as long as all the fundamentals are there for the market. And you you see the long term, macro economics are there. And then the fundamentals are there, that helps you to make a decision on where you’re going. I may be called the Durham Real Estate Group, but we have people from all over the place that come because it’s not about that it’s about buying cash flowing assets. So maybe what it is, is like people need to start thinking about a different area. Like if it’s if the area doesn’t make sense, right now move to a different area that does, right start, don’t get pigeonholed?

 

Cherry  

Well, we have, we work with a lot of clients who buy pre construction homes, and they they feel comfortable because they know and it’s like less to maintain, because it’s only a pre construction condo per se. So there was only 800 square feet to maintain. There’s only so many appliances in there. And so a lot of these people are unable to get financing. They are running into different challenges. And but they see the capital gain appreciation because they tie up your money for a number of years. And therefore there is that, I guess not forced appreciation but the market has gone up over time and then they see appreciation and they see this success. Would you say that over the last 10 years? To me I’ve seen so many different deals and some people are doing great. Some people have developed systems and I are truly successful. But there are mistakes that we may like to be honest, like I’ve seen in my own portfolio, we’ve sold a couple of properties that are barely breaking even. And I feel like we’re breaking even we’re lucky because thanks to the real estate boom, rather than, like my own success or my own decision making, I don’t like I don’t know, if I’m explaining myself well enough. I think what I’m trying to say is that real estate because of the asset class, it has been going up. And can we continue to? Can we operate smartly? And can we take advantage of the growth? Is what I’m trying to say the instead of relying on luck?

 

Quentin  

Yeah. And I think like, I’ve got to say, I’m not like, I am not a fan of pre construction, anything. I think that’s more speculation than anything, but this is my own personal opinion. And I, everybody does it their own way. So however you want to do it, yeah, I prefer to buy an asset that is cashflow positive from day one and continue to manage it. And you know, I think that there, you have to decide, I’m saying that from my perspective, because I don’t think it’s wrong for people to do that. You just have to decide for yourself, why are you doing it, like if you’re doing it to pass on intergenerationally a condo to your kids, and you want to be able to do that, you know, maybe that’s a great asset, or you’re looking to add net worth, or you’re just trying to make a quick buck, like whatever your reason is, are you trying to create cash flow, so you can quit your job, all of those things, kind of push you into different assets, right? Like when I’m buying, I’m not buying. But if I were to buy a pre construction, I’m betting that today’s price that I’m locking into is going to be lower than the price that it’s going to when it’s completed is going to be sold that right. And whether I take possession of that asset or not is, you know, it’s just going to depend on what I decide to do. Now, the tax consequences going to be different depending on whether you’re holding that asset or not holding that asset. Right. And so that plays a part, but not everybody talks about that, right? Oh, I

 

Cherry  

tried to trust me, I tried to every other videos is about assignment HST, and then assignment income, but people don’t like to hear it.

 

Quentin  

Yeah, well, they don’t like to. But that has to be part of that the like the thought pattern where most people, and I like to buy assets that I’m going to hold on for for the long term. I’m not looking to do quick flips. And I also think that sometimes those pre construction condos are, are marketed as quick flips. Right? And I just don’t, it’s just not me, that’s my point of view. I think that, you know, if you’re buying that asset, it’s cash flow neutral right now, I would say how can you change the way that it’s run right now, in order to change the way that the cash flow comes from that asset? Do you need to go back to your tenants and say, Listen, you know, I don’t think that this is, I’m not making any money here, maybe I can pay you, you know, a couple grand to leave. And, you know, we can end the tenancy, maybe I can, I can do something else to make sure that that cash flow is is there in that asset, you know, that, like, I think we’re only locked in because we think we’re locked in, right, there may be other ways to go about doing this. And, you know, thinking about the different ways that we can create cash flows from an asset to make it different, helps us to be able to hold on to that asset. So, you know, I understand what you’re saying. The other thing too is like, you know, there are rules that we can take advantage of, for example, if you have a unit that’s been created, I can’t remember the date is that like November 2018, or something like that, it’s built after that you’re not in rent control in Ontario, for example. And that allows you to like if you are cashflow neutral, all of a sudden you bump up or if you built a basement suite from an unfinished space, that basement suite maybe is not under rent control, but the upper unit is but that that basement unit can make maybe make you cashflow positive in a way that allows you to hold on to that asset right. So let’s like let’s be creative. Let’s think of ways that like I’m I’m a total you know I like to think of different ways to be able to do things there’s not always one way right and so like let’s you know what I would say is okay, let’s take a look at that that asset and see what we can do with it in order to make it cashflow positive. There’s there’s lots of ways to do that.

 

Cherry  

That’s amazing. Well, thank you so much you’ve shared so much with us today and I am very thankful to have you on our get like as my very first podcast host guest so thank you so much and if for anyone who wants to reach out to you or find out more about term Rei, how do they reach out to you Oh,

 

Quentin  

You can go to Durham rei.ca Or if you want to reach out to me I can I’ll do a 15 minute call if you are the right criteria if you go to Quentin D’souza dot com, and then you can we can chat and see if there’s a good fit.

 

Cherry  

Yeah. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you so much for coming on, again. wealth of knowledge, as always, and I appreciate it. No problem at all. You

 

Quentin  

did a great job to us. Awesome.

 

Cherry  

I just need to ask questions and have my text twist to it. That’s it. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you. Oh, you’re welcome.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forgive the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Recent Self Made, Real Estate Investor Millionaire, Hamilton/Sudbury, 28 y/o Joseph Costanza

With everything going on in the world right now, we’re fortunate to be Canadian

If you don’t believe me, ask your friends with family in China, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Russia/Ukraine, and even New Zealand.

 
 
 
 
 
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If you can believe it, a country with a population of only 5 million people has a higher average home price than we do here in Canada; hence they’re experiencing a massive brain drain in losing talented people moving out of the country.

In Dublin, Ireland, over 100 people waited in line outside a house for rent in Dublin, Ireland! 

Thanks to inflation, rising interest rates, and the inability to raise rents to match rising costs of living thanks to rent control, Ireland serves as a sneak peek into what we who operate under rent control have to look forward to.

The Smart Prosperity Institute just produced a report stating our housing shortage in Ontario is 471,500 units, and 1,034,900 new units are needed to keep up with demand over the next ten years for a total of 1.5 million units.

Unfortunately, the government forecasts only 700,000 new homes to be built over those same ten years. 

If you’ve been following the news or speaking to builders like me, you’ll know many projects have been paused, delayed or even cancelled.

There are a lot of unknowns going forward; however, here at iWIN Real Estate, my coaches and I are staying on top of the available economic data. 

I’m talking to people like my neighbour who works for a major consumer product company in supply chain management. 

From what he can tell, the Americans are 4-5 months ahead of us economically because they never truly completely locked down as Canada did, and the numbers don’t look great out of the US.  

Consumption is down; some job losses are already announced. For example, Ford Motor Company just announced 3,000 job cuts this week.  I don’t see how we, as Canadians avoid the same fate.

But I’m no fear monger; I fear for the short term and bullish in the long run for real estate; hence my team and I will be summarising all our research and how our clients and we are taking action. 

Some are selling; some are buying.  

We’ll be sharing what deals look like in this market to prepare and weather the current storms, and we’ll share our predictions on what interest rates will be doing over the short term at our September 17th iWIN meeting.

This is our first iWIN meeting since the summer break, so we have tons to share on what income prices are selling for, why certain properties take longer to sell, and what the rental market is doing; hence it’s not one you want to miss. 

We’ll be cutting through the clickbait and bullshit by sharing what we’re doing with our own $$ and portfolios all on September 17th at our iWIN Real Estate office in Oakville. 

Get tickets here: https://www.eventbrite.ca/e/erwin-and-cherrys-iwin-real-estate-meetup-september-17-2022-tickets-403481302437

This market is also the wildest I’ve seen, making 2017 look like a speed bump in the road. 2008/9 is a closer comparison, and we invested back then and will survive this cycle as well.

On the personal side, I’m now volunteering at our Brazilian Jiu Jitsu club during my kids’ class. I must have ADHD as I have issues sitting still and watching, then the problem got worse as they asked us, parents, to wait outside the matted class area.  

So what’s a bored parent who already spends too much time on their phone do? I bought a uniform and volunteered, so now I’m an extra set of hands, eyes and ears to ensure the kids don’t hurt each other plus, I get to observe the instruction and provide some pointers to the kids.  

The best part is I’m learning the curriculum so I can practice with the kids outside of class, have more in common and spend more time with the kids as I work enough as is.

The kids seem to dig it, so I guess I’ll keep this up till they’re sick of me 🙂

Recent Self Made, Real Estate Investor Millionaire, Hamilton/Sudbury, 28 y/o Joseph Costanza

On to this week’s show!

We have a young rock star in Joseph Costanza, who was 24 when we met and owner of the title of the youngest client we’ve ever had.  

He’s a young hustler who, when I met him, had three jobs: Architect day job; bartender, evening weekend job; landscaper with remaining time not sleeping.

Thanks to all that hustle and saving money by living at home with his parents, young Joe saved up enough money for his first investment property of now five properties.  

Crazy enough, he’s already made his first million dollars; hence he’s now our youngest of 45 self-made investor millionaire real estate clients at 28.

Joe’s here today, along with Coach Tammy from the iWIN Real Estate team, to update us on his expansion project in Sudbury, which didn’t go so well, and his lessons so you may avoid the same mistakes he made.

Plus, a gem of an expired listing in Hamilton that coach Tammy helped Joe with, that eventually was priced well under market because the property failed to sell, was rough, and the challenging tenant with previous orders against him by the Landlord Tenant Board.

We talk numbers on the most recent deal, so have your pens and calculators ready or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca, and we can send you Coach Tammy’s draft numbers.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Greetings, everyone. Welcome to another episode The truth about real estate investing show. And there is literally so much going on in the world right now. And what often comes back to me practising gratitude that I am Canadian. If you don’t believe me, ask our friends or ask your friends and we’re a family in China, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Russia, Ukraine, and of course, even New Zealand. If you can believe it, New Zealand, a country with a population of only 5 million people has a higher average house price than we do here in Canada, hence, they’re experiencing massive brain drain people are leaving the country, talented people are leaving the country. And that’s usually a bad thing for an economy when smart people you know, for example, like doctors and leading entrepreneurs when we’re taking their talents and their job creation elsewhere. That’s bad for an economy. Hopefully that hasn’t happened here in Dublin, Ireland, over 100 people waited outside in line, a house for rent one house, there’s my house for rent 100 people waited outside to view the house thanks to inflation, rising interest rates in the inability to raise rents to match rising costs of living thanks to rent control, Ireland serves as a sneak peek into what we may run into as we to operate under rent control. And hopefully this is not a feature we have to look forward to, in Ontario, in Canada might imagine anywhere else, where there’s rent control, and rent control provinces with lots of growth. You know, like BC, for example, like Nova Scotia, for specifically for Ontario, the smart Prosperity Institute just produced a report stating that the housing shortage in Ontario is 471,500 units. 471,500 units is how much the current shortage is. And 1,034,900 new units are needed to keep up with demand over the next 10 years, for a total of 1.5 million units. So we need 1.5 million units to be built over the next 10 years. Unfortunately, the government also paid for a study to be done. And there’s only going to be 700,000 new homes to be built over the same those same 10 years. So again, this is revisit the supply versus demand demand is there for 1.5 million. And supply is going to be less than half of that as 700,000 new homes to be built over that those same 10 years. Of course, the news really gets worse because if you’ve been following the news and speaking to builders like I do, I understand I’m friends with lots of builders, and who are part of builders associations, you’ll know and also it’s in the news, you know that many projects are being paused, delayed or even cancelled. So even less housing based on the current news is being built. There’s lots of unknowns going forward. However, here at iWin real estate, my coaches and I are staying on top of economic data. And that’s proven really helpful. I’ve mentioned a few times on the show, we haven’t had any clients with experiencing closing issues, because a lot of things they just worked out that we did. And it’s nothing like we’re seeing out there in the market. For example, we’ve had lawyers on the show, who described their regular retail consumer type real estate clients are having all sorts of problems closing on property, their appraisals are not coming in, and they’re not able to close because they don’t have they cannot come up with the downpayment necessary to come up with it for the shortfalls and appraisals, since the market has dropped. But anyways, we’re staying on top of things here. And thankfully, it’s worked out really well for ourselves and our clients. I’ve mentioned before that Terry and I, we ordered our appraisals on our properties for our refinances back in February. And thankfully that worked out that timing worked out very well. I’ve also been talking to people like my neighbour who works for a major consumer products company, they distribute and sell many products you have in your home, he specifically works in supply chain management, from what he can tell the Americans are about four or five months ahead of us in terms of economic terms, as in, their consumption is down, they’re buying less. You’ve also been well, if you fall, I like to read articles on corporate earnings. So for example, Walmart, their sales are down as well. People are consuming less instead of the article. She the CEO mentioned how they’re seeing sales down on, for example, four gallon jugs of milk are being replaced by sales of two gallon jugs of milk. So people are downsizing but they’re buying anyway. So the numbers don’t look good. The Americans are likely to four to five months ahead of us economically. And the theory would be is because they only like half locked down versus Canada as a whole country locked down pretty good. So they’ve had they’ve had more freedoms. So Canadians are still consuming heavily right now. So that’s my own experience. I was just in Blue Mountain Village and up north very popular recreational resort style area in north of Toronto, and it was absolutely packed A parking lot was packed, the hotels were packed, the restaurants were packed, the bars were packed. My point is, is that because Canadians were locked down, we’re taking that we’re taking our time now to enjoy our summer enjoy our freedom. And then my guess is in a few months time, we’ll start seeing Canadians start consuming less, you know, because stuff is expensive, might start seeing some pain in terms of job losses, for example, for just announced 3000 job cuts this week, they’ll mostly be in North America, Canada, USA, and I don’t see how we as Canadians avoid a similar fate. But please understand, I’m no fear monger. I do fear in the short term. But I’m bullish in the long term for real estate, am I investing and my stocks and my crypto I don’t most of all of its down this year. Hence, my team and I will be summarising all of our research and how we and our clients are taking action on this current market. Some are selling, some are buying. We’ll be sharing what deals look like in this market, and to prepare and also how we’re doing what we’re doing to prepare to weather the current storms. And we’ll share our own predictions for interest rates, where the market will be going in the short term. At our September 17 Ioan meeting, this will be a first time meeting since our summer break. So we have tonnes to share on what income properties are selling for why certain properties are taking longer to sell what the rental market is doing. Hence, this is a meaning you do not want to miss will be trying through the clickbait and the Bs by sharing what we’re doing with our own money and what our clients are doing with their money. And that’s all on September 17. At our island real estate office here in Oakville. Same place, same time, it’s a Saturday morning, so traffic’s been nil. The doors are open like 830 ish, there is no online option. You do not want to miss it. Understand that this market is the wildest I’ve seen. And I predicted early on that we could easily see 2017 happen all over again. But 2020 is making 2017 look like a speed bump in the road. I think 2008 2009 is a close comparison to what we’re seeing. I don’t think it will be as bad based on what I’m reading from the top economists in the world, and top economists in Canada. And to be honest, we invested back then we did quite well, we did more than survive this cycle. And I think we’ll do more than survived the cycle as well. On a personal side, I’m now volunteering at our local Brazilian jujitsu club during my kids class, I must have ADD, as I have issues sitting around and watching classes, then the problem got worse as we parents were asked to wait outside the amount of class area. Yeah, so it’s a poured beer for parents to do a bore parent, such as myself where he spends too much time on their phone. So what I decided to do was I bought a uniform, and I volunteered. So now I’m an extra set of hands and eyes and ears to make sure the kids don’t hurt themselves. Plus, you get to observe the instruction or close and provide some pointers to the kids. The best part is I’m learning the curriculum, so I can practice the kids outside of class and you know, have more in common with them and spend more time with kids as I honestly work enough as the kids seem to dig it so far. So I’ll guess I’ll keep this up until they’re sick of me. Oh, by the way.

 

Erwin  

Our our September 17 meet up. Link is in the show notes. If you’re on our emails or you follow me on social media, you’ll get the link you’ll see the link there to purchase tickets, clients, of course you go free onto this week’s show. We have with us a young rock star and just stanza who was 24 when we met 24 years old when we met and the owner of the title of the youngest client we’ve ever worked with. He’s young Hustler, who when I met him, he had three jobs. He is an architect by trade. So that was his day job, bartender for evenings and weekends, and a landscaper with the remaining time he wasn’t sleeping. Thanks to all that hustle and saving money by living home with his parents Young Joe saved up enough money for his first investment property. That was back in 2019 January 2019. And now he has five investment properties. Crazy enough he’s made his first million is actually about a year ago, he crossed the million dollar mark in terms of increased his net worth. Hence he’s also the owner of the title as the youngest of our 45 self made real estate investor millionaires of age of 20 I think it was 27 at the time anyways, if someone challenges him will will will sharpen our pencils and figure out the exact age of Joe. Joe is here today along with coach Coach Tammy from the AVID real estate team, my team to give us an update on his expansion project how that went in Sudbury when he was looking for diversification and his lessons from it not going so great. But you know, Joe’s smart and talented hands he bounced back pretty well. He got a gem of an expired listing and Hilton, that coach Tammy helped Joe with that was eventually priced well under market because the property failed to sell. It was rough later found a hole in the roof that could fit a soccer ball through and a challenging tenants with previous orders against them from the landlord tenant board. We talked numbers on this most recent on this most recent deal so have your pens and calculators ready or email us at Iowan at infinity wealth.ca And we can send your coach Tami’s draft numbers. Please enjoy this show. Okay, Joseph what year to be me?

 

Joseph  

2019 2019 you’re how old 24 When we met once you 23 Then turn 24 Once we bought four and then I turned 25 Okay, so

 

Tammy  

you wanted January 2019? Yeah.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, right after New Year’s that whatever that first event that you put on.

 

Erwin  

That’s big event. That was the one on the hill, Shawn Allen for referring you. Yes. Yes. Thank you, Shawn Allen.

 

Joseph  

I was going to like networking events and stuff like that. Prior but Sean’s lives in London. He was doing a networking event in Toronto we loop buyer Byron says by thing I can always always mess it up.

 

Erwin  

Your European

 

Joseph  

I can’t roll in our for my life. Didn’t matter. How’s your Italian? A horrible absolutely horrible my mom is very upset with

 

Erwin  

is your Italian better than his? Yeah,

 

Tammy  

probably my probably better than yours. And I just married one.

 

Erwin  

That’s the show is going off the rails? Why were you going to real estate meetups you you had at the time you had a career in your training. So you’re already making career wise as much money as you could?

 

Joseph  

Yes. But I think I was kind of looking to I don’t really know what I was looking for it to be honest with you. I had a few things that I wanted to I had a lot of money saved up

 

Erwin  

from that wasn’t that much money. It wasn’t more than to notice a lot of money to me. It

 

Joseph  

was a lot of money for most 2423 year olds. It was a lot of money for Yeah.

 

Erwin  

$80,000 Yes. That I worked very hard for but listen to your credit cards now. Yes. really different. Yeah, that’s fair. Yes. It was a lot of money.

 

Joseph  

Yes. Life Saving at the time. It was like my life savings.

 

Erwin  

Yes. But you blood and sweat it before since you were 16?

 

Joseph  

No, like more like right after more like after school kind of thing. Okay, but like still like working two three jobs study

 

Erwin  

for it. You basically never had to date your life. No. Until oh, gee, until real. It’s all downhill from there. To your parents. Yeah, they got you good. till you’re 24 to get debt free. And the new meta Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, no, I just wanted to kind of I wanted a little bit more for myself. I wanted to have a little bit more ownership of something. And I think the initial plan like in all honesty, the initial plan was to take the 80,000 by Tesla. Yes. Because the shares, right? No, Tesla Tesla car okay, but I don’t know what changed it. I think I had listened to a few episodes of bigger pockets or something along those lines. And that got me hooked up my show. No, I’m sorry. Sorry. I found you later on. I’m sure it all down here. Yeah. And then that kind of got me into it. Rich Dad, Poor Dad, my kind of dad went through pretty traumatic kind of heart attack experience. And then that kind of shifted from there. It was just kind of like I need to do something about this. And that was kind of like November of 2018. And then I started going to like a networking event every every other week. And then stumbled on to Iowa and grew up from there.

 

Erwin  

Like your yada yada your your father’s health scare.

 

Joseph  

Yes. Heart attack.

 

Erwin  

Why was that a trigger for you to

 

Joseph  

he thinks simultaneously as he was having as he had a heart attack I was like really deep into the weeds of reading Rich Dad Poor Dad and cashflow or not cash, not cashflow. tribit and Cashflow Quadrant and all those other books, and kind of still listening to real estate podcasts and stuff like that. And so I think he would just like the connection of the two and just that was just that I was just, I was hooked after that. And it’s always something I’ve always really wanted to do too. Like he’s always really like this like not necessarily in the investment side. But just like real estate in general has also been has always been like a something that really intrigued me. So it kind of took over from there was a

 

Erwin  

kind of, it’s not uncommon. We’ve actually had a lot of people on the show where a major life event usually with their parents that got them really going like really crank the crank up the temperature on their want to hustle to do more quickly. Was it just like you realise like Life is short?

 

Joseph  

I think. Definitely a little bit of that. I really don’t know, I never really I didn’t really take much time to think about it. It was just like, I’ve always been someone that was just like if this one needs to get done, I do it. I don’t really have any second thoughts about it. I just, I’ll learn as I go. So I’d really didn’t learn take time to learn that much about real estate before just jumping in, had the money to it’s not like I was like had to save up that much more to have all the money. I didn’t have all the money but

 

Erwin  

as you didn’t just have not not have all the answers. You didn’t have all the money.

 

Joseph  

But I think I’d have been exposed to real estate or a younger age through a series of different kinds of people in my life and that kind of helped to kind of make the job into it. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

the finding the money piece you actually detailed more now, just a year ago, the last episode. But unfortunately for you, we’ve gained about four listeners, I’m sure like both from 13 investors now to 17. So we need to, we need to spend some time to bring the other four listeners up to speed. Got it. Okay. We did that for them. Hopefully that was worth your time. For listeners will be appreciate that we brought in Georgia to we spent some time to bring you up to speed. And if you’re interested, go back and listen to the episode with George Costanza. This is your third time. Fourth time

 

Joseph  

fourth time. Yeah, we’ve we’ve done a yearly update every year since I started.

 

Erwin  

Okay, so what’s keeping you busy these days? Well,

 

Joseph  

in the next few weeks, I’ll be going to Greece. So that’s really been kind of doing a little backpacking trip for myself in Greece, just I needed a vacation. Yeah, I needed something just for me. I’ve really spent like the last four years really haven’t gone on anything major. A road trip here there been like nothing overseas or anything like that. So I just decided it was time to like treat myself. Um, besides that I’ve been in the last kind of five to six months been liquidating some assets and whether it’s in crypto or in or real estate to kind of make room financial flexibility for the market right now. And to kind of start taking advantage of the market in the kind of the next few months is kind of my projection. I don’t know everyone’s different. But that’s kind of what I’m feeling out right now. So

 

Erwin  

what did you sell off real estate wise,

 

Joseph  

I sold ours. I

 

Erwin  

know, we haven’t sold anything in Hamilton.

 

Joseph  

I have not sold anything in house firm. I’ve we’ve actually recently purchased something in Hamilton. But I sold off a property that I purchased in February, there was just a bunch of stuff that was going wrong with it. And so I decided my budget, my money was better used somewhere else than in something that wasn’t making them money or it wasn’t I didn’t have any sort of time horizon to start making money. And so it just made sense to kind of liquidate and move on to transition those assets into something else.

 

Erwin  

So what got you into Sudbury? What was what was the month? But because this is about 12 months ago? What was when you get inside?

 

Joseph  

When did I get in? Must have been March? It must have been? No, it was February of last year,

 

Erwin  

February of 2021. Yeah. What were you going through

 

Joseph  

a series of reasons I actually really liked the city. I think it’s a great place for investments. But I think the approach that I had was wrong, but that’s a different conversation. I went there just more for the from the cash flow perspective. Hamilton wasn’t cash flowing the way I wanted it to

 

Erwin  

cash flow if anyone wants to do more, more is always the answer. Yeah. How much cash? Would you like more?

 

Joseph  

That’s fair. That’s fair. No, I just wasn’t cashflow in the way I wanted it to. And I was trying to find a market that would cashflow a little better for me. And I liked the kind of future prospects of Sudbury with green energy becoming a major player in the space and having so much nickel up there and whatnot. So it was I think it was more of a nickel play, to be honest with you than it was a real estate play isn’t wrong. No, there was nothing wrong with it nice to actually really liked the city. Like I still have a property there right now. But the it just the renovation that I was doing there wasn’t really going the way I wanted it to. And so I just decided that it was time to kind of cut ties.

 

Erwin  

So this is a trick about real estate investing. It’s not always rosy sunshine and roses, is it? No, it’s not. So where did you find this contractor that didn’t go that went sideways? Fantasy coaches and legal troubles didn’t?

 

Joseph  

Oh, yes, we’re still I’m still dealing with the legal troubles actually, right now. So yeah, not not fun. Do not recommend it. But yeah, I found them through the network kind of through through people that I’ve met down there.

 

Erwin  

Sir, I’m sure.

 

Joseph  

Since found out that there was people kind of certain connections that I didn’t make at the time, that kind of may have changed my opinion about hiring a certain individual or certain company. But nonetheless, I tried to look at it more like a like a lesson rather than a mistake. Right? And so I’ve been really, over the last, probably the last, I’d say five to six months and really kind of analysed since we’ve kind of since I decide to sell it really analysing what What mistakes did I make and how do I avoid them? And how do I kind of improve my process going forward? Whether it’s in the hiring process, or in the vetting process? Or how do I really kind of iron out and don’t have these, essentially these these issues that came up from from this one guy? And it seems like it was just one thing after another with him and that was a complete fault of my own for maybe not vetting them properly.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, there’s a lot there though. Yes, great. Responsibility. Part of like taming I do is we also take responsibility for referrals we make again Oh, I know, I can think back to one contractor that’s had legal issues with our clients. And I’m we’re getting on the phone with him and yelling at him. Like you’ll never yeah is pretty. I’ve never yet I

 

Joseph  

almost haven’t seen you. I pretty much

 

Erwin  

never yelled in the business transaction in a business relationship. Right? I’ve had issues with other realtors and stuff like that. And yeah, people on my team, but still professional, because I still need things to progress. Right? We still need to keep it professional. But yeah, that Jeff guy yelled at him. And he just lied his teeth and everything. So the people that the folks that made the referral to you to general contract, did they? Do you have an escalation point?

 

Joseph  

Did I have an escalation point. And so

 

Erwin  

I got from corporate world, right, it was a big blue for seven years. So if someone in the company, if I’m working someone in the company, and they’re not doing what they said they’re supposed to do, I go to the boss, that’s just how it works in corporate, right, like for when we intervene and make referrals, we’re not their boss, but we’re often their number one referral source. So there’s some accountability there, we have some leverage in the relationship. So if our clients not happy, then we make the phone call, and let them know, we’re not happy that our clients unhappy, right? And then they know, because of our business relationship, like where basically, they don’t have a marketing budget because of us, right? They don’t have to go find clients, because we were making all the refer to we bring them clients. So if they want that St. Say stream of clients to continue, you have to make my client happy. And that’s often not hard. We’ve had many folks come to us because I like working with our clients. So what my question is, like, was there is there an escalation process? Because with us, absolutely is

 

Joseph  

in there? Yeah, there definitely is. I mean, like, even when I have issues, if I have issues with a renovation that I’m doing in Hamilton 99% of the time, it’s coming from you or someone else that is in the group, and it just in through conversation, like it will call each other talk to each other. And it’s like, oh, what’s like, what’s going on with this property? Oh, this going on? Not really happy with this. But we’ll get there. And then all of a sudden, that problem is fixed. And I call Tammy, I’m like, what would you say? Like, why are you what what’s going on? Why you’re getting involved. And but it just is nice, because it was like it was always like there was someone there kind of watching out to make sure that everything was going smoothly. Besides just me, I didn’t have that same experience there. And not to say that there was anything particularly wrong with it. I just didn’t have that. I think coming from an experience here with the group that you’ve put together, where everyone’s kind of family and everyone kind of works together to help each other out. There. I felt it was a little bit more lone wolf. more basic. Yeah, yeah. But just there wasn’t a network that was set up that is set here. And so I think just through a fault of my own knots, assuming that the process would be very similar, I didn’t do probably a well enough job of kind of understanding what needed to be done at the time.

 

Erwin  

But and what your experience isn’t different than what was No, I

 

Joseph  

imagine, most people have a similar experience, if they’ve had a contractor relationship go south,

 

Erwin  

like most Realtors offers offer basic services for join a search, they can book your showing appointments, open lock boxes, you know, ask you if you’d like the property or not, right, prepare all the paperwork and stuff like that, you know, it’s just for Tammy and I, we this is how we’d like to like to be service. Like as realtors, we’re paid a lot of money. Right. So I think a high standard of care is appropriate, including yelling at your contractor, if we have to call him threatening their business.

 

Tammy  

You know, I don’t even the vetting processes, it’s can change. And you have to roll with a little bit too, because, you know, even the contractor that we had, where things had went south, we had multiple people working with that person who had success as well. So it was really hard to know. And sometimes those things happen. So I think a big thing is to know when to recognise it, and when things need to be addressed and fixed or walked away or that kind of stuff, which you know, you did afterwards. I think that was that’s important too. And to know that it’s okay to walk away sometimes from things as well. failures. It’s

 

Joseph  

yeah, that was that was probably the biggest challenge for me was walking away, not because it wasn’t a smart financial decision, because I made money on on the sale. It’s not like I didn’t make money on the sale, even though we were only halfway through the renovation. It was I think there were a lot of it was there was a lot of ego involved. I was really kind of caught up in what is my image? And what does it look like if I quote unquote, fail? Yeah. And that held me back. So these issues are coming up back in November, and I realised that we close in August, renovation started mid August. And by the time November hit, I kind of taken like a month away and my brother’s wedding was in October and it hadn’t really gone up for like probably about five weeks. And then I started going up pretty consistently in November. And there was no progress made since mid September. And so I was going up every single week to and no progress was being made every week. I mean, like maybe one thing here or there but like in all honesty like I do more on weekends at my property than this guy did in the whole week.

 

Erwin  

And they have a crew.

 

Joseph  

He has a whole crew exact, and that’s his only job. Yeah. So that’s how they make a living. That’s not how you make a living.

 

Joseph  

Right. And so I think I kind of got caught up for probably about two to three months, not wanting to sell more from an ego standpoint. I wanted to, but a lot of it was I wanted to push through for myself, I wanted to kind of overcome the obstacle. But the thought that was rolling through my head is maybe it’s better to sell, maybe it is a good time to sell. And I was really battling with it. Like I was researching prices, what can I get for the property? What would be? What would be my exit? How much kind of leeway do I have before I start losing money on this deal? And a lot of not wanting to sell was because I didn’t know, I was worried about how people would see me. And then I think I think it could have been a conversation that we had over the phone at one point. I think you mentioned like your like you mentioned something about, it’s okay to make mistakes or we. Yeah, exactly. And it’s okay to kind of let go if something’s not working out,

 

Erwin  

like my crypto stocks. I wonder if you’re talking about? Sorry,

 

Joseph  

no one I sold some crypto to back in February. Yeah. And so I think realising when I finally came to terms with it’s okay to kind of make them realise that you’ve maybe made a mistake. And that the important thing is how do you adapt from that mistake? How do you kind of manoeuvre when you have made a mistake. And so looking at the property, not really seen a time horizon when this renovation would be done already firing the contract or having nobody out there, I realised my money was spent better somewhere else. And so keeping it in what I would call a dead asset wasn’t really an option anymore. And so that’s when we kind of started the process of selling.

 

Erwin  

Thank goodness, you didn’t lose any money.

 

Tammy  

That’s what I was thinking.

 

Erwin  

It was tough. It’s tough when you’re losing money in real estate, because it’s leveraged.

 

Joseph  

I can. Well, that was that was, I think that was the biggest fear. I mean, we’ve had the conversation, I think I’ve had conversation with both you guys about that particular situation we had went to sell it and then two days was coming down and market was, at the point when we were selling it was beginning of March, we just have that huge run with February, I had sold it at a premium price off market was gonna make a good amount on it wasn’t really upset about it a day before we closed, he put a lien for basically the full price of the contract that I have already paid him 50% for. And so that kibosh the deal. And for the next kind of three months, I proceeded to hold the property while the market was falling God. And we did some legal manoeuvres to be able to sell the property. And then luckily, the same buyer was still interested in buying it. And I said, I’m only selling it to you if we’re selling it for the same price. And they said that’s not a problem. So I lost a little bit in the holding costs. And then they got a realtor involved to make sure that they were secured. So I lost more than I would have gained if I had sold it back in February. But all in all, it wasn’t a loss.

 

Erwin  

Well, how would you rate your stress on

 

Joseph  

this deal? Oh, very high. Very, very, very high. I think for about three to four? No, probably since October from August to April of this year. I don’t think I slept very well down. Yeah, that was a long time. I’m doing I’m doing a lot better now. But so that’s all it matters.

 

Erwin  

And how far was it the drive?

 

Joseph  

Average out four hours, four hours each way? Okay. Depends on how you drive really like three. But if you stop for lunch and stuff like that three each way. Oh, mine the drive. I think there’s there’s a lot of young people here. But if you have kids, and you’re doing this, but I think there’s a lot of young people who don’t have a lot that they’ve saved up where their time is not worth as much. And that drive may be worth it for them to go out and buy a cash flowing asset. Because they may not be able to afford anything in the GTA and I think that’s fine. I just think you need to approach certain areas with certain strategies, you

 

Erwin  

can just partner with you. They don’t have to do everything themselves. That’s fair. Yeah. This this whole thing, like people like opposed to partnering, because I’m like, I’ve told I’ve told him to the family, you know, before the pandemic, for example, I was like, I have like cousins, so their brothers and like, you know, you too can buy like a 4000 square foot house for like under 3 million, versus you’re both gonna go spend about 1.5 and have way less square footage.

 

Joseph  

I think a lot of people like the pride of ownership, especially something is just there’s

 

Erwin  

I have a small ego some days. Money has been cheap. Yeah, I have no limit.

 

Joseph  

I would agree with that.

 

Erwin  

So it’s actually been it’s been in the news lately. Really? How bad friends are for example, Well, that’s why the only way for an average Canadian to afford rent is to share two bedroom with somebody. Yeah, for sure two bedroom apartment someone so I don’t know understand to me there’s no difference why two people when co venture on a property, right for me, I’d rather co venture with someone and buying like Hamilton an hour away versus four hours away. Right? And then I can divide the work down the middle. It doesn’t have to be Hamilton, it can be Oshawa, it can be Barry, whatever, right? My point is, I don’t wanna drive over an hour. And again, if I partner with someone, we can split up the work, you do the maintenance, I’ll deal with the tenant type stuff. You know, I mean, that kind of division. We don’t see that among our clients. You’re typically married couples, where one partner deals with a tenant that one deals with the tools and the maintenance. Right. So I don’t see why two people who aren’t married can’t do that.

 

Joseph  

I would agree. I don’t have anything to add to that. I think you’ve said it. Well,

 

Erwin  

wow. time you see something you

 

Tammy  

JV with Joe? No, it’s true, though. It’s it? No, it is good. It is good JV with Joe

 

Joseph  

coined a new term. To get

 

Tammy  

into the market, though there is a lot of people or maybe that you’re established or maybe some people can get on title. Some people can’t like it is a good good way to get in the market for a lot of people. No 101 was a JV as well.

 

Erwin  

And we have clients like just buddies who got together and bought a house

 

Tammy  

and mobile JV later, I mean, but what’s wrong with JV in first two, right? Yeah,

 

Erwin  

as long as our hard working people, like your hard working folks and hard working people,

 

Joseph  

I think it also comes down to what is both parties bring to the table, and like sometimes just the typical money, right, like the money partner and the working partner or the active partner, that relationship works, but sometimes you also need like, it depends on the size of the deal and the type of deal, like to active partners can be just as beneficial. But yeah, I see no issues with partnering. I’m actively kind of bringing on partners and looking for partners and and speaking with people about partnerships all the time. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

So the separate properties having a headache.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, your first one went well, the second one didn’t go so well. Okay, and you’re keeping the first one. It’s I’m keeping it there for now. A cash flow is fine. I don’t have any headaches. I haven’t driven there in six months.

 

Erwin  

Is it still there?

 

Joseph  

It’s it’s yes, it’s still there. So it’s just if I ever need to liquidate something, it’ll likely be the first one that goes.

 

Erwin  

So this is February 2022. Would you would you liquidate it, or do you keep it

 

Joseph  

if I knew what the market would have done right now? Yeah, I probably would have liquidated I kind of I sold in February not because the market was at a high I’d like to say that I like had enough foresight to say Oh, now’s a great time to sell. The reality is I was just fed up with property and I sold and I just got lucky enough that I sold when the market was at a high I’m surprised the

 

Erwin  

buyer took it still.

 

Joseph  

I will not comment I don’t know who’s listening. Yes. 17 people I know who includes that.

 

Erwin  

Give me your name is not that Google because there’s there’s enough stanzas out there that that makes you heartless

 

Joseph  

that a compliment or is that

 

Erwin  

just have names like You’re like I say I met you in like a thing. Like when I go to LinkedIn like Joe Costanza, like, damn, there’s like 40 of you in Toronto. Like, which one that I talked to? Like that. So your current deal wasn’t the easiest. But that’s a good point. There’s a good story to that is not easy deals are often the best deals. We might bless the last ugly house I bought mouldy basement contractors wouldn’t go in because there’s cockroaches. Right? I asbestos knob and two, I can I’m just shocked the bank lent me money on it.

 

Joseph  

Well, you did bank finance loan on that. I gotta

 

Erwin  

be lender. The lender called me the day before closings. Like did you know you have asbestos? Did you know you have knob and tube wiring? Right? Yeah, I did this for a living. I can’t believe I still got my mortgage. Because most lenders will not touch that stuff. Really? I didn’t know that. My basement was leaking.

 

Joseph  

Well, yes, I was in that basement. I know. Yes. I did the drawings for you on that on that deal.

 

Erwin  

Wait, did your mother say something about that house?

 

Joseph  

My mother? Well, yes.

 

Tammy  

She was faith in her when? Yeah.

 

Joseph  

Because I think I FaceTimed her while I was in the basement with an stupid made no mask on black mould on the wall.

 

Erwin  

Just work really.

 

Joseph  

They painted over it. It was pretty bad. It was pretty good. Yeah, it was pretty bad. I probably shouldn’t have been down there. But I was down there anyway. I’ll find her in 20 years.

 

Erwin  

But it wasn’t pretty was it? No, it was not pretty. Your mom would never invest in it.

 

Joseph  

Ah Uh, maybe now, but not then. She’s come around. She’s

 

Tammy  

coming around John’s place. I think

 

Joseph  

she’s I really pushed your boundaries. Yes.

 

Erwin  

But yeah, I had to deal with a lot of crap as a student rental too. So the deal with that student rental through the pandemic tends bail. Right. I think too much five to seven times bailed. Students. Yeah, yeah. Now it’s all turned around. Because I’m finding out that rents are now six $700 a room?

 

Joseph  

Yeah. Well, yeah. That’s it’s a it’s also a killer area like you are right beside this.

 

Erwin  

Yeah. But it wasn’t easy. No, it was easy holding this whole time. But I paid 400 grand for it. Now. I’ll be in humongous demand come next rental cycle. Right. Yeah. Because I hear like, even made the news. How little rental supply there is for students. Right. So payback time. But yeah, hard houses are not easy to finance. You didn’t want to go in the basement. Your mother would probably not want to go to my basement if she knew. I think I took my deal over yours, though, because I didn’t have a tenant.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, I would have taken your deal over mine to the I think mine was a little bit of a headache. Yeah, from day

 

Tammy  

one. Irwin tried to buy it off of you. Half a

 

Joseph  

dozen $5,000. So a big commitment

 

Erwin  

to excuse me, came down when I heard there was issues that the tenant,

 

Tammy  

no, no, this was that was a score. We just for the record, we do call it John’s place. So if anyone’s hears this, or if you go on Joe’s Instagram, it’s John’s Thomas the tenant. Okay, so what have we

 

Joseph  

purchased the property back in? November is when we closed or when we when we offered on it. We’ve got an accepted offer. We’re supposed to close in January, November 2020 2021. We’re supposed to close who you’re supposed to close in January. And they were kind of going through

 

Erwin  

Washington will bring us back a little bit. Okay. The host previously failed to sell that or not. Okay, so

 

Joseph  

I had found this property listed on the MLS back in November of 2020. I went to go see it. I offered off market on it, when they taken it off their offer Express and that fell through. And then every kind of two or three months. Why did it feel to sell the market was on fire? They were they were trying to sell it for 850. Back when it was probably worth like 600

 

Erwin  

or 600. It was that bad? Well, it was

 

Joseph  

duplexes at the time, were selling for around 800. So they were trying to sell it as a legal duplex, which it was at 800. The problem is it needed 200 to 300 Depending on how much rental you wanted 200 to 300 of work. So no one’s gonna buy it for 800 or whatever they listed it I think it listed initially at like 850 At some point at one point. So I’d offered on it. Even when they’re asking when their offer fell through at 800 or whatever when they’re listing fell through at 800 I offered some really probably insulting offer at like 600 or 650. Obviously, that got the client and they ended up selling it back in or they ended up getting an accepted offer on it at 750 Back in a must have been mid mid 2021

 

Erwin  

Sorry, except to that how much at 750. And they didn’t take it and run this sale

 

Joseph  

fell through. So I was checking in on this property probably every two months I would call the realtor at some point I ended up getting the owner’s number and I was calling either the realtor or the owner like every two months, just like what’s going on with your house are you guys selling and then for a little while I kind of went off market and I thought okay, so they they told me that it sold it must have closed and now it’s done. So I didn’t really think anything up but then I drive past the property every time it was a shitshow so I really wanted to see what they were doing with it just out of pure curiosity and the roof was absolutely mangled. And no one had done anything about the roof and this is like six months so it’s stuff growing on or whatever it was no like there was little holes in the roof. There’s holes in the roof when they when we ripped up the the ashphalt Yeah, there was like holes. I got pictures I’ll show you after there was like, very large loads, like, like soccer ball size holes in the like in the sheeting.

 

Erwin  

Oh my god. Yeah, you’re gonna need 50 for that. I know. A lot banks when finance that there’s pressure finds that

 

Joseph  

nobody found it. It was anyway, so yeah, so then I think I had reached out to them at one point because I’m like, Okay, this thing definitely has not sold yet. And this is must have been like October of 2021. And I got into kind of a little bit of a yelling match with the with the realtor. At which point I was like, Okay, I’m just getting a Tammy involves and no,

 

Tammy  

I’m gonna stop here and tell you what happened. Okay, you tried to do the deal without me. Just fine. Okay. You tried to do it? Yeah. But there was no what happened? was they were going to use one of their other realtors to represent you because they didn’t want the selling agent to represent both of you. So they said, I’ll bring in a realtor and you said, no, no, no, I have a realtor. I was only going this way if I was gonna get a deal, and No, you weren’t gonna have a Realtor you don’t know probably right. Yes. So you’re like, No, no, I’m gonna bring in my own realtor. So then I call him like, oh, so yeah, he kind of talked with Joe. And they’re like, yes. And that’s where we went. That’s how I came in. Yeah.

 

Joseph  

And then, as you call me, yeah. It wasn’t on market. So I figured I’m gonna try for a market sale. And they were actually just about to list it. They were just finalising some paperwork to get him out with a tenant tenant. And he was so close to being out. It was so yeah, it was really close to being out.

 

Erwin  

This was an unethical thing. He wasn’t when he got terrible tenant,

 

Joseph  

he did not take care of the place. I think the owner of the property didn’t take care of the place either. So between the two of them nothing was getting done

 

Tammy  

very very I mean, just that when the land when we found out the landlord tenant Board gave him a warning that if you do any of these the list of items, you’re gone and it’s instant, and it was smoking in the property smoking on the property, obviously not paying rent it refusing the seller, the owner landlord to come to its own property. And swearing at people on the like, there was a massive list that he couldn’t even like look sideways. Yeah, I think

 

Erwin  

the yellow people on his lawn you don’t get up? Yeah.

 

Joseph  

Well, no, it’s not yellow people on his lawn. It was yellow people who are trying to get into the property to view the property.

 

Tammy  

Not to mention it a bat by the door. Yeah.

 

Joseph  

Anyway, so.

 

Tammy  

So we did agree on bacon possession? Yes. Well, it’s too close in January.

 

Joseph  

We’re supposed to close in January. He didn’t. He didn’t leave. They extended the the court hearing date to

 

Erwin  

did he

 

Tammy  

agreed to leave? Did he not even agree, but he was supposed to leave a certain date because he instantly screwed up off the list, obviously. And

 

Joseph  

the court had said, you’re out by January 6, January 7, so

 

Erwin  

we slipped up. So now they have an order, you have to leave.

 

Tammy  

And we found one judge that said, Okay, we’ll hear you out again, we’re going to extend it. And so we extended our

 

Joseph  

and then yeah, so then the closing date, the closing date got extended to right after their next hearing, because we were like, Oh, for sure. He’s gonna get kicked out and already been kicked out before. Like, he’s already broken all the rules that he said he wasn’t gonna break and he’s not paying his rent. So I mean, like, add all that together. They gotta, they gotta let them they gotta let him go. The court hearing finishes, they’re like, Okay, we’re gonna issue the paperwork for you to leave. We’ll just find that we’re gonna find a date that works for us, and we’ll get back to you. So I go, okay, February, I’m counting 60 days is what they give you. Like most of

 

Erwin  

paralegal involved, too. Yeah, there’s legal. There’s been done on the

 

Joseph  

on both sides. Yeah. And so I’m like, we’re talking, I’m like, Okay, well, 60 days from the date that he’s supposed to close. Okay, let’s push the closing date. 60 days out, they have the according to the LT landlord tenant boards website, maybe I’m wrong, but they need to find hearing a decision in 60 days. So let’s go 60 days. So 60 days comes in passes. And we’re supposed to close on the property. And he’s still there. And word from nobody’s told us anything, which, you know, I didn’t expect anyone to tell us anything, because we are not are not the owners. But still, like, I would like to know kind of what’s going on with the process, couldn’t get in touch with anyone’s lawyer to figure out what was going on with the process. No one wants to get involved. Closing Date comes again, closing it comes again. And so we had a conversation, we wanted to extend again, and we had a conversation with the seller who like if you’re not going to sell on, if you’re not going to close on this place with the guy in there, then we’re just cancelled, we’re off of the deal. And we’re just going to sell another property.

 

Erwin  

So another property of theirs.

 

Tammy  

They needed to Yeah, they needed something. Yeah. And this was the one they were going to sell. And since it obviously was kept, you know, in for a long, longer, longer, longer. They finally said no, either you’re gonna have to take it with them or the deal is dead, because according to our offer, it allowed us to extend, extend, extend, and then somebody extends extensions. And then, you know, that was at yet agree. And they said, No, that’s enough. So he had to come up to the second possession. Yeah, big concession. Exactly. So he had to make a decision.

 

Joseph  

I mean, I had to make the decision at the time. And the reality was when we close on the property, we had it under contract for 745. And it was probably worth in the nines, really low nines. Well, you

 

Tammy  

have to figure at this point, the markets going up and up and they know that too, right?

 

Erwin  

Oh, sorry. What did you get accepted for?

 

Joseph  

We got to sell it for 745. Okay, legal duplex Sorry,

 

Tammy  

sorry, but it’s worth noting that that was October November 2021. Things are selling for like a million now. We’re into the early 2022 and everything selling for exactly

 

Joseph  

yeah, like that. That property just as it was with the shitshow that it was probably should have sold for around 900 When we bought

 

Tammy  

and sold it with that tenant made money because the market was going nuts. Do you remember that a soccer ball size holes in the roof? You can see that you could? Well, it was Yeah, from the street. We had a home inspection. Yeah, like we

 

Joseph  

knew what we were we were on the roof that had the holes in it. On the roof, just in step in the halls. So Joe ticket, yes. So I decided that we were going to close on close with him in it. And then the next day, and then the potential cut bait decided to fish. Yes, exactly. And then proceed to the next three months of me dealing with the landlord tenant board trying to get him out. And still landlord 10 board had not given us an issue had not given us a date. And so 120 days pass, and they finally give us a date. That’s a month from then by that point I had already signed with him and then 11 saying where I needed to start construction at some point the market was kind of doing the dip, and I needed to figure out okay, what are we doing with this place? Yes. So we did a little bit of cash for keys with the property to get them out. And then we started renovations in July.

 

Tammy  

So Joe did, did we try

 

Joseph  

catch Ricky’s earlier? No, nobody tried to catch it wasn’t it wasn’t I was waiting. I’m like, okay,

 

Erwin  

16 on the place.

 

Joseph  

I offered. I was like, Hey, listen, we’ll like we’ll, we’ll pay a little bit more if they do Cash for Keys. I got no problem. They’re like, No, no, no, we’re already in the legal process. We shouldn’t we should have them out soon. Obviously, closing day comes, he’s not out.

 

Tammy  

So even you took ownership on closing date, if Joe’s automatically offering Cash for Keys, except the landlord tenant board, again, was still so close to happening and felt like any day.

 

Joseph  

Every time I call them. They know any day now we’re gonna get a notice. And then two months go by I’m like, I can’t wait anymore. This is too much.

 

Tammy  

He did the sign the papers did the Cash for Keys. Everyone’s agreeing. He’s ready. That day comes and guess what the notice comes in that Oh, yeah. He’s he’s got to move out.

 

Joseph  

The day before he was supposed to move out. They gave me a notice saying he needs to move out. And it gave the day in two days. I’m like, I’m sorry. Yeah. saved you. $5,000. But

 

Erwin  

whatever. And how much in rent arrears did you have?

 

Joseph  

How much of what your rent rent? Did? You actually paid rent every single month, every single since I took over? He paid rent every month to me. So just give him

 

Erwin  

his money back? Basically.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, so it didn’t really cost us anything. But it costs us time, which in some respects may actually be more valuable.

 

Erwin  

So I haven’t heard how things are going now. So that was when when was that? What was the Cash for Keys? When did he move out? July? July 1. Oh, just last month?

 

Tammy  

It’s almost been Yeah. Almost a month. It’s

 

Joseph  

been it’s almost been two months of renovations. Yeah. Six weeks? Yeah. How’s it going? It’s going well, it’s gone. Well, the permits sorry, this

 

Erwin  

isn’t a problem. Number five properties you have now five? Yeah,

 

Joseph  

that’s four in Hamilton, four and Hamilton. Right now.

 

Erwin  

Those are the ones that are 20 years old.

 

Joseph  

Yes, 2828 still feels like I’m moving slow, can

 

Erwin  

turn on the social media. Go talk to your friends and find out how much they’re worth how many houses they

 

Joseph  

have. That’s not the point. That’s the expectations that I put on myself. Okay. Sure. Anyway, the renovation is going well.

 

Erwin  

But we wasn’t renovation plan. What are you doing so

 

Joseph  

initially, so for the listeners, it’s a one and a half storey house with a back split attached in the rear with a 400 square foot garage. So there’s about massive there’s about 3500 square feet of living space combined.

 

Erwin  

Oh my god, it’s

 

Joseph  

huge. It’s pretty large. Like the back unit is about, like 1500 and the front one and a half story is probably about maybe it was probably less than 3500 Sorry, it’s more like it’s more like 3000 It’s a probably another 1500 for the front’s we bring into my house. Garage. And then yeah, and then and then the garage as well.

 

Tammy  

So the front back duplex, not very typical up and down.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, it’s a front back duplex. The first the front unit is basically like your typical one and a half storey house like that typical kind of like century home kind of

 

Tammy  

main floor upstairs and still has the basement as well that

 

Joseph  

and then the back is kind of like a like a back split it’s basically it’s designed very similar to the back split there’s a basement to that back unit as well as kind of a second floor and then like a half level Okay,

 

Erwin  

so when you take possession once the way if you took possession tenants out, what would you rent this place out for? As is so you didn’t lift a finger?

 

Joseph  

Oh god. Oh, no, I wouldn’t

 

Erwin  

tend to take

 

Joseph  

they they took real advantage of this place. There was holes in walls. There was yeah, this

 

Erwin  

is bad. You don’t think okay, money compensates for everything. Someone would take it for like $300 a month.

 

Joseph  

Okay, well, we’re like, basically don’t consider that. Anything under 1000. Just entertain me. Okay,

 

Erwin  

what would the what the one and a half story ran for was the back split run for?

 

Joseph  

What would the one and a half so the garage you can rent? Right now currently there’s tenants in the back unit. They’re paying 1800 Plus utilities. You filled it? No, there were already they were already there. Oh, and 1800 plus future? Fully tenant. No, they did not get along with Okay,

 

Erwin  

so that’s probably probably the reason for the order as well. Yes. Okay.

 

Joseph  

But that that back

 

Erwin  

unit, that’s really good rent 1800.

 

Joseph  

It’s not when you consider what it could rent for I know. It could probably rent for around 20 to 2300. And that, and they’re not, they’re also using the garage, which I could probably rent for an extra 200. So they’re about six to 700. under market value. We’re keeping them because like you said, 800 1800 is not that bad. Right? The reality is, I lose about $700 of cash flow every month from potential cash, cash for that we’re not we’re not doing anything to earn.

 

Erwin  

One and a half storey rented out, as is John’s place. How much food costs that you could have gotten 1800 For just cleaning it up?

 

Joseph  

Maybe 1800 Probably for that front unit if we want it to occur.

 

Tammy  

That’s not bad. Because it is a full house. If it’s cleaned up. It’s basically full house. I

 

Joseph  

mean, full houses in Hamilton are renting for like 3000. Right. Okay, what’s the plan? So the initial plan was finished the basement and finished the main unit.

 

Tammy  

Can I just say Joe’s initial plan was an initial plan. Remember, you were all over the place? Emotional, legal basement Hold on, or Airbnb, maybe? Well, you’re right, we had

 

Joseph  

a submariner dealing with this, I was the SA there was all everything simultaneously. The initial plan was to renovate to fix to the basement, then do the main floor of the everything on the first house, the basement of the first of the main house in the front, and then do a full kind of cosmetic gut of the front unit. First and second floor.

 

Erwin  

We’re going to turn that into a duplex. We’re

 

Joseph  

essentially doing a legal triplex on the mountain.

 

Erwin  

Do we need to edit this out? Yes.

 

Joseph  

Sorry, sorry, we’re gonna do it all legal. But

 

Tammy  

otherwise, he was gonna do like proper, proper everything, everything’s gonna do stuff. But yeah, like underpin it to where we’re

 

Joseph  

going to lower the floor and everything saying, this is the thing is my my perspective is, I don’t want to ever have a rental, what I wouldn’t live in. That’s my golden rule for me. So if I wouldn’t live in it, I don’t want anyone else living it. I know, that’s probably not the best, like investment advice, because you can make money on things that you wouldn’t live in. And you can make really good money doing that.

 

Erwin  

Well, this is a state. This is clarify, though, when I was 22 years, I’d much different standards than I do now. So I sometimes I’ll speak to the 22 year old would you live here.

 

Joseph  

But still, so it was it’s a six foot five basement, and I wanted to drop it down to seven. And I don’t have the numbers on me. But like I rationalised that somehow at some point. And it kind of made sense in my head. The numbers, numbers got a little out of hand at some point, which is partially the reason we’re not doing it right now. So you didn’t actually do it. We’re so we’re not doing the basement anymore. And the reason we’re not doing the basement is with the market the way it is, I want the renovation to go quickly. I want to be in and out of this place. I don’t want like if we had the same market that we had back last year where everything was just moving. Yeah, sure, I just do the basement because the reality is from going to hold it with the appreciation that we are seeing in the market last year. Even if renovation goes slightly over budget, the market is gonna save me I know that’s horrible advice. But that’s the reality for a lot of investors last year or the even in 2020 the market save them for a lot of things, the market wasn’t really in our favour here. So the plan was be in and out of this property and get our money back. And then we will look at doing those renovations later down the line. As long as it’s stabilised and cash flows and it covers all expenses then in the future we can look to kind of increase our position and the property and that’s kind of it we knew buying the property that it would be an evolving kind of property as itself you don’t need to do all all the work phase one in phases every year or probably in like two years we’ll do that back unit kind of slowly kind of do what we need to do. We also found out that we actually can’t do the basement until that back units on because there’s some electrical wiring that needs to get redone in that place to run more power to the basement. So the reality is we would have to do the whole house if we were doing the basement so it just financially didn’t make sense. So we just settled for just doing a cosmetic on the main floor, which came out to be about 100,000 When everything included that the

 

Tammy  

front main and upper main and upstairs Yeah,

 

Erwin  

so basically like cosmetic.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, that’s just cool. I’m well we did we opened up structural wall we did a little bit more than just cosmetic.

 

Tammy  

So I needed a lot higher standards than I do. Yeah. shows live in there. But

 

Joseph  

very small when we’re in there without the wall. Yeah, no, you haven’t seen it with the wall

 

Tammy  

guy. I know we’re gonna come you know what everyone we should go by

 

Erwin  

go yeah, we’ll check it out. For me as it progresses in the market with historically high rents. I don’t need to do too much.

 

Tammy  

Well, we should do in the day two and get it approved with the tenants for a visit just so we can see that back unit because it’s really unique how it circles around and the space involved. It’d be nice to see the whole thing not just the front.

 

Joseph  

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, she’s sure she’s going. You let me know when

 

Tammy  

it’s John’s place. Remember John’s places?

 

Erwin  

So what’s the rent gonna be on this place? So you spent 100 grand spent 100 grand

 

Joseph  

the rents right now I’m projecting you can correct me if I’m if my numbers are wrong, but I’m projecting around 2600 to 2700 for that, just for that front unit, because it’s basically the full house.

 

Tammy  

You’re gonna be good there at least. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, we’re seeing we’re seeing like whole semis go for like 32 Yeah, you’re

 

Tammy  

gonna get probably close to the three could be could be three just because

 

Joseph  

I did my numbers. I’m very conservative with my numbers. I do all my numbers. I’m 20. Never guess right? I did all my numbers at 2500. So anything more than 2500 is gravy for me.

 

Tammy  

My my I my rental is a one and a half story as well. I have four bedrooms, two bathrooms, and I put tenants in last year getting 25 Friends gone up. So yeah, you’re definitely going to be at least at the numbers you just said at minimum. So I do like to run my numbers conservatively too. But when the time comes to actually rent it. Yeah, check in again. Breathing

 

Erwin  

stretch. 3000. Stretch, stretch. Over 3000 My friend Christians successful guys message me here. You put up you stretched his one bedroom? Yeah. 2200 for a one bedroom

 

Joseph  

probably get free with the garage. Garage. I think not

 

Tammy  

even and you know what else? You’ve done a lot of landscaping outside which I noticed which is huge to me. You did or your mom’s?

 

Joseph  

Mom, I like to I like to put a little I like, no, no. I like to put a little spin on every property that I I like to put a little bit of work into everything that I own that within reason.

 

Erwin  

I throw a bunch. Yeah, I

 

Joseph  

don’t think it’s the best financial advice for anyone like investment advice, but like, I do a little bit of myself.

 

Erwin  

I tried to kill the vegetation on my other property.

 

Joseph  

It looks great. I think it looks good, right? Yeah, it does. I killed all the vegetation on my other places through the art, this will probably all died as well. But

 

Erwin  

apologies the listener this sounds very dramatic. How does this compare to your other three other properties in Hamilton, or any of this this dramatic?

 

Joseph  

No, no, they

 

Erwin  

were all pretty straightforward, pretty boring duplexes. Yeah, I know that didn’t feel boring to you at the time, because I know you were sleeping in them and renovating and resolve. So I know it feels tough. But looking back at that compared to what you’re doing now,

 

Joseph  

I would not I wouldn’t 100% would not have been able to do what I was doing now, dealing with the stress associated with it. I did definitely grow through the process. And I think I mean, like my purchases have gotten gone from like, basically doing no renovations to a little bit of renovations to a full gut to now dealing with

 

Erwin  

the first property. You did a whole basement suite. Not really, really it was

 

Joseph  

already partially done. Okay. Right. And then the second one, the basement was already done, but the upstairs needed a full guide. Yeah. And then the third one, okay. The whole place needed a full gut. That would have been your more more work one. Yeah. That was the that was the biggest shock was doing the third one. Yeah. And then the fourth one was just like property. Yeah, John’s place was just like doing the tenants and then dealing with all the other crap and then doing a full guide then let’s

 

Tammy  

just add that the third property with all the surprises and the extra work you needed to do and all the gut but then when we got a foreign though, what you refight for he was like, it was worth it. Oh, yes. Different. It’s very worth it.

 

Erwin  

So what would you say the beginner so for example, I see a lot of courses out there teach to go after your John’s house. Basically, they teach that look for the off market. Look for the complete disaster soccer ball size holes in the roof. The Vanquish in my mind, when you think a beginner should take something on tape or something like that on?

 

Joseph  

I think you need a baby step your way. You can’t like at some point you need to jump in. But I think you need to kind of take your time to get to a certain point. And not necessarily sure if that because I can tell you from my experience, if I took on John’s place when I first started, I probably would have been turned off from the whole process.

 

Erwin  

It shouldn’t be 5k It would have I

 

Joseph  

could have made 5k. So I’d say no, I think like you need to kind of build up and get I mean, I usually wouldn’t recommend a turnkey property per se. But I think like even if you want us to do that turnkey route would be a good way to kind of get your feet wet with that in terms of buying a property that needs a little bit work, maybe find something that needs a small cosmetic workup rather than a full, a full gut. Right? I think of the comfort level, at the end of the day,

 

Erwin  

I think of a scuba diving analogy, when you scuba dive as a beginner to go to take any advanced course, they only allow you to do one at a time. So for example, you see you’re a recreational scuba diver. Now you want to do what’s called penetration, you’re gonna go and you’re an enter a wreck, right? You can enter a wreck, what you cannot do is do that at night, because Nate is a different advanced level diver. So you can only do one thing at a time. So take real estate investment properties. Dealing with tenants is one skill set risk factor. Yeah, dealing with renovations and contractors, another risk factor, dealing with a major renovation, where you need permits, and you have mould and knob and tube wiring, asbestos, another level, right? Dealing with the LTB situation, another level. So I think to each their own, they have to decide what level of risk you want to do whatever stage in life and you are on a stage investor, you are just imagining, like, I know that this was stressful for you and your family.

 

Joseph  

Yes, for sure.

 

Tammy  

You know, and I just want to add that I agree to that. I do think it’s, it’s nice. And it’s that nice the steps that you took building that up, and it’s nice for people, but we also have a lot of new investors that come to us wanting to do, let’s say, a duplex conversion. And that’s a really big project as well. So

 

Erwin  

that’s a vanilla one vacant house, good bones,

 

Tammy  

you know, and all kinds of, we’ve seen all kinds of things that can come up and so on. And everyone’s a little different on how they roll with stuff. But again, going back to trying to have that good team around you. And I don’t just mean me, and I don’t just mean you know, that all does make a really big difference. Because new investors, if you’re just gonna start out Yeah, it is nice to have that smaller project first, but at the same time, it’s not so scary when you have a bigger one if you have the right team to so it really kind of depends on what you’ve, you know, surround yourself with and, and how you deal with things. And we all learn that from each other. Like I always talk about James on our team, he can have things off his back, and I’m like, nope, oh, my goodness, I’m not sleeping, I can’t can’t eat it. You know, we’re all a little different, how we handle it, but trying to learn from each other and doing the best. We actually

 

Erwin  

had John’s house and you had your surgery team. Yeah. You want to wash your shirt.

 

Joseph  

But I think I think taking steps is not a bad thing. And I think I’m more took them out of necessity. I didn’t have the money. When I started to get into something that needed a full guide. At least I didn’t know how to find the money. All the money. Yes. Well, I wasn’t doing all myself. But yeah, I did a lot of it myself.

 

Erwin  

The stuff you didn’t need a licence for Yes. To do an electrical. Probably the tiling drywall.

 

Joseph  

I did. Yeah. And but like I did it more because I felt I was we were looking for those properties more because I couldn’t afford a profit entity to forgot. And I didn’t know at the time, I was too inexperienced to know that I could just go and find the money or borrow the money to do this work. Right. So I’m just looking at how much money do I have? What’s the renovation that needs to get done? Like I remember when we bought red Street, the first property that I own, like, coming to closing I was like, I actually don’t even have enough money to close on this place. Considering all the closing costs.

 

Tammy  

Is that the when you call me you’re like, I have to call my No No. Money is the one yes, that is. But then you you worked

 

Erwin  

out the neural comes through.

 

Joseph  

And then that did come on? Yeah, see? Yeah. So I think taking those steps were necessary for me because at the time learning through that experience and learning through kind of, like how to find money, how to borrow money, like I we bought the property, I didn’t even have the money to do the renovation. I was like, I’m just gonna rent it out. And we’ll deal with it at that point. And then the bank was like, Hey, do you want a $50,000 loan? I was like, Yeah, I’ll do that. Like that. Yeah, sure. And then we did that, like I was. So last minute, I was just like, I guess I’m doing the renovation now. It was just like, and then the rest is history. From there

 

Erwin  

funny how anything how things worked out. But you had all the answers from the beginning. When we met you when you were 24.

 

Joseph  

I think it was good for me though to not have the answers. Because it for no one he has all the answer. No, I know. But I’m saying what I’m saying is like

 

Erwin  

if a kid you’ll find out how many answers you do not have.

 

Joseph  

Try not postpone that right now. Not in I got too much Bill introduced filter for that stage of life.

 

Erwin  

You’ll be grateful when when you have your portfolio and then you have kids and you don’t have to worry about this stuff. Imagine having kids and then trying to build a portfolio. Yeah,

 

Tammy  

that’s crazy. I’ll never forget when when Joe and I first met and when we got the first property, and you were nervous, of course as you should be right and it’s I get it and and I remember saying to you, you’re 24 years old and saying, Do you know like we were closing your eyes? Oh my god, I can’t believe I can’t believe it. And I said Do you know how many people say I wish I started when I was 24 And you did it. You did that. You absolutely did that like this just so on

 

Erwin  

the record is our youngest Korean. I don’t really I Yeah, well, you do. Who’s you bumped up?

 

Joseph  

But whose wasn’t there somebody after me?

 

Tammy  

Well, somebody met Joe. I think they were 23. I was like, no. You’re waiting? No. They’re you know what they’re like most people, including myself who want to and talk about it and think about it, don’t do it. You did it.

 

Erwin  

There’s huge. Yeah.

 

Joseph  

I just do things and think about consequences later. I think that’s

 

Tammy  

gonna make some calls. No, getting. You did good. You did very well. Good for you.

 

Erwin  

Especially where we’re talking about rents and stuff. What are we seeing in the market for rents? Rents are our showings, up down? We’re in the middle of August. Yeah, I

 

Tammy  

was able to book this morning, went out with a client to see some houses had my pickings of 12 that I thought could possibly work, how to narrow down a little bit, we went to go see six houses this morning, very focused on one lot. It was yeah, it was an experienced investor, we were able to soak it all in. And we were able to narrow down the properties that also meet all the criteria for a garden suite. And that was just Hamilton. So it was great. So we got got to see quite a few and go from there.

 

Erwin  

I was like, compared to like, six months ago, oh, six months ago, they

 

Tammy  

would call I would even like go there’s one or two if you want, and I don’t think one’s really going to work. But we could show you

 

Joseph  

finding that a lot of people are now starting their search. I’m still people holding back a

 

Tammy  

lot of people holding back, but I am hearing a few people more calling me saying you know, Okay, we’re ready. Now we’re ready to get back in which is smart. Because right now is a really good time. You know, August 2022. Right? That’s right now is good time. I had a client yesterday, I called her up. I said, Hey, I just noticed this change on the listing we saw a month ago. And she’s like, let’s do it. weoffer done, you know, and we were able to get in and get it for a great price paid for 75. And well in for property recently. And but yeah, so we’re noticing that it’s a really good opportunity. We’re noticing a lot more, there’s certainly a lot more choices on the market, a lot less competition, a lot of houses sitting 3060 days, houses that are sitting there more ready to sell. So the house for example that we picked up yesterday was 525. We offered for 75. They had a couple other offers fell through so we went in firm they loved it took our price. So that’s what we’re seeing those kinds of changes. That because these houses check off boxes for us to check off, but this one in particular is already a duplex and welland on a 60 by 120 lot that houses all the way to the left, we’re looking into severance possibilities and the land and if not, we have a double car garage that we’re gonna turn to a garden suite, massive growth opportunity

 

Erwin  

for five. Okay, how much would have costed six months ago?

 

Tammy  

Well, it was listed six has been listed for a long time I’ve had my eyes on it, it was listed originally about 650. for probably about that long ago, I saw it go down to six. That’s when we saw it held off for a bit because I had a low paying tenant. I noticed the other day, I’m like, I just read that that tenants moving out. So that’s why we jumped on it because now it’s fully vacant and paid for 75 and went all the way up as key. That’s it exactly. Same as you

 

Erwin  

know, an argue that selling vacant is key as well as the seller if you want maximum money. Well, yeah.

 

Joseph  

But as a buyer, like the follow up, like if you’re, if you’re not following up with properties that like Why have you been surprised we’ve done it like all the time, I got my first deal the same way. The fourth deal the same, we’re just following up just be like, Hey, what did you guys sell? Would you guys sell for? All right? If they have sold and you don’t get it? And that’s fine. But like what did you guys sell for? Because I want to know, like, you know what, we have my own knowledge. So I’m going into next one, I can actually put a competitive offering. And we really

 

Tammy  

play the market because Joe and I have obviously been working together for years now. But in the market where houses were selling crazy prices were up the house that you’re talking about that you picked up was because I would talk to him about expired listings, I saw properties that are expired or sell properties that are cancelled, and so on. And these might be some opportunities down the road that we can take a look at that we’re not seeing so much in this market, because they’re actually on the market sitting that home. But before when that, you know, isn’t the case. And the only reason that house didn’t sell the way it did was because of that tenant. So another kudos for you saying listen, let’s let’s push let’s push the envelope here and then we’ll jump in and we’ll take it and take that risk a little bit

 

Joseph  

like even after like right now like we’re after this we’re gonna go see something of a showing we do we have showing and we’re gonna go look not because I don’t want to buy it at the at the price that the house is at right now. I don’t want to buy it. I don’t want to buy it at the price the house is now but yeah, it’s been sitting for 60 days. Yeah, so if they do a price reduction, I want to I want to be the first one that seen it already. So that if I want if I want to put an offer in already, and they say they dropped they go from 800 to 700. I’m just throwing ballpark numbers out there. I want to be the first one to put an offer firm at 700 Because I know I can buy it for 700 and I can do what I need to do for 700 Because I’ve already seen the place yeah So that’s, that’s the

 

Tammy  

most important part. I keep telling you, you got to get out. You got to see him. You got to see them. You got to see them. Because then once you have when an opportunity comes, you’re ready.

 

Joseph  

Yeah. I’m kind of at a waiting stage just kind of seeing what I’m doing. I’m pretty liquid right now. Just kind of waiting into nice. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

So you know, this conversation before? We’re 24 year old think about 20 year old you put so forget everything you think about you think about a 24 year old you would think Auntie so? So let me let me push that further. 24 year old you mean 20 year old you? You don’t know. 28 year old you’ve never met before? complete stranger you meet at a networking networking line? What would you think about a guy

 

Joseph  

28 Year 24 year old me would probably be pretty impressed. I don’t know if

 

Erwin  

because how much? I don’t always ask but I’ll ask you. How much is 20 year old you worth? Compared to 24? year old you

 

Joseph  

20? Well, six figures or seven figures? For sure. Millionaire?

 

Erwin  

Yeah, what would 24 year old you like holy cow, you have five properties are worth a million. And you only did in four years.

 

Joseph  

24 year old me would be probably be asking a lot more questions and trying to do the math in my head of how long I’d have to work to get to that point. And I think at 24 I was doing those numbers in my head, which made working for someone else not make sense. Which kind of started that trajectory. I don’t know if what 24 year old me

 

Erwin  

would think. But your 44 year old you’d be impressed by 20. Yeah, yeah. 100%.

 

Joseph  

I’m not impressed by myself, though. But

 

Erwin  

Are your parents impressed by you? I think I think so. Whatever your mother. Yeah, thank you. I’ll tell. I’ll tell her myself in this room.

 

Joseph  

You guys are friends. You guys talk all the time. On Instagram. On Facebook, like they have their own conversations. I’m

 

Erwin  

not gonna have a bunch of new Instagram followers. I’m gonna ask her after this. Are you proud of Joseph? She’s gonna say yes. That’s some other questions running out of time. Can you say your parents are retired?

 

Joseph  

Yes, they are retired. Now there.

 

Erwin  

And the former teachers, so they have very nice pensions. Yes, they do. And what do you think their retirement life would be with if they didn’t have those pensions?

 

Joseph  

I always thought because we were talking about this the other day. And so I asked them and don’t cool. Yeah, I did. I talked to them. My, my parents have always wanted to do something like this. Get involved in investing in real estate and stuff like that. And for the listeners, if we didn’t kind of mention on this podcast, I have two joint ventures with my parents. So that’s what I mean, when they say get involved. But I think from what they told me, they would still they would have started to invest, because the pain into your pension, although it’s great when you retire. When you add up all the money that they’ve paid into the pension, it’s actually really quite substantial. Right, which is why they’re able to retire now with the pension that they have. My parents are of the mindset that they think that they would have invested in something while they were working, instead of kind of putting their money away in the pension. Because for them the pension plan was the retirement plan. And so they didn’t have to worry about it. So they didn’t think about it, or they’re finding out now that the pension is not enough. The pension, is it? Yes, it is. But, but when you have a family that you’re still, like, kind of like dealing with and you have elderly people that you’re taking care of, and maybe those elderly people haven’t planned for their retirement. Right. things add up. Right. And it’s enough to have a good life. And but it’s not enough to have a what I would consider a fruitful tool to help us help other people Yes, to be able to help out people that yeah, that you love. It puts strain, there’s still there’s still money issues. Let’s have it that way. Right. It’s like the pension does doesn’t eliminate the money. Issues. Right. So my parents are of the mindset that they would have started investing earlier, if they didn’t have their pension. I don’t think they would have if you ask me, because my parents have been very risk averse their entire life. I think the only reason they started looking at investing is because mine invested my investments were going well. And I was showing that I was working hard at them. And I was at networking events every weekend, constantly reading up on things constantly looking at things. So I think the confidence they had in me was what got them into this. I don’t think they would have done the same thing. If they not if they were not paying into their pension. So long and short of it. I think that it probably wouldn’t have worked out very well for them if they had not planned if they hadn’t had a pension. Do you think you have any issues retiring? I don’t know. See this. What is retirement Of course you do wonder about everything. What is what is what is considered retirement? Like I think for a lot of like investors at retirement is just really entrepreneurship like being able to live all over the map live their life on their terms financially free. Right. Right. Like I look at you and like that looks like your life to me looks like retirement. I know you for you. It doesn’t look like retirement because it’s a lot of work. But you’re able to live life on your terms of doing what you want to do to some degree. Yes. All right, for me that that is the goal right now retirement where I put my feet up and not do anything. No plans.

 

Erwin  

If you want it to go by the age of 50. Do you think Yeah,

 

Joseph  

100%. But that’s is am I going to be satisfied with that? Is that the question?

 

Erwin  

Here’s one thing though. Do you lose any sleep? No, the idea of I don’t even be able to put up your feet and do nothing.

 

Joseph  

I have 50 I haven’t thought about it on me because

 

Erwin  

it’s not a worry. We were discussing before your mom’s gonna come summer 17. Next, I

 

Joseph  

will force her to come. Yes. September 17. Right. Next Saturday. Yeah, I’ll make her come.

 

Erwin  

Awesome. Because Tammy, we’re going to talk about what people are doing these days. It is funny, because I see all this fear stuff on social media. Like, there’s one lady who’s a broker, whatever she’s like, and what mind? Are you buying anything in today’s market? Message me if you are? Like, yeah, that’s view. We’re getting stuff we couldn’t get six months ago, we may not be able to get six from some experts six months from now. So we’ll talk about what what people are actually buying me. We’ll talk about what Joe bought today, at the September 17. i When meeting. Yeah, but yeah, we’re gonna just tell it like it is. I think the world is very scary. Right. But you know, we had to figure out how to navigate it. And then preferably profit from it. When talking about that, trimmer, 17. So you guys see you there, I will be there, I’m gonna be on your mom.

 

Joseph  

Do you have to invite her because I if she if I tell her to go, she will not go

 

Erwin  

to me will sign her book to see if she comes.

 

Joseph  

That’s it means a lot there.

 

Erwin  

Any final thoughts? Any final thoughts? Because we’re way over time.

 

Joseph  

I think a lot of young investors over the last year, and even now made a lot of decisions based on ego and based on and that ego kind of put them in situations where they’re over leveraged, and maybe they’re now kind of in tough situations.

 

Erwin  

I’ll add to that they’re following charismatic leaders who are no longer around

 

Joseph  

charismatic leaders who have probably liquidated most of their portfolios as well. And I think that people really need to step back and look at it from the long term perspective. Right? If you have to sell you have to sell that’s just the nature, right. But if you’re upset, because you may be down on the equity that you thought you would have had, or you may not be able to refinance for what you thought you would have had, like, you have to look at it from the long term perspective and long term perspective needs to be I’d say at least a minimum of five years, if not more, right? I

 

Erwin  

know that someone should, they should, if they’re gonna take advice from someone, they better be reading the economics, they better understand economics, because I predicted I predicted this year would be another 2017 Yeah, so if you knew God, this was your year was gonna be 2017 Are you really going hard? All right, in the early part of the year

 

Tammy  

I just want to add that we’ve been working together for a long time and I’m very proud of my son Joseph. We have an inside joke that I’m like his mom and yes old enough to be so but yeah, I think that no matter what age of anybody is going to be starting to get into real estate. You were smart that you said you know what I thought about this and I went for it and I’m doing it and a lot of people sit back and don’t always do that and you know, it’s proud of you for doing it. It’s obviously you know, young age is pretty impressive, but at any age getting into real estate is great but yeah, it’s been a pleasure working with you, Joe. We’re not done we’re going shopping today

 

Erwin  

amazing Marty come in use social media handles you guys want to share you guys got a book or something you’re coming up with

 

Tammy  

I have no book time I have a butcher Zito care if any chapter I know I didn’t even know I was so definitely going to take a look at this book. Thanks for free copywriter when you guys heard it here free copy

 

Erwin  

will cure insomnia. Social media handle

 

Joseph  

Yeah, they can follow me on Facebook or Instagram. Joseph Costanza for both Facebook and Instagram.

 

Erwin  

You lock that up or you’d have to compete for those those handles nothing. Just Joe Costanza. Joseph

 

Joseph  

Joseph Joseph Joseph Costanza, one full word on Instagram.

 

Erwin  

And you have a fat wallet just like George Wright died, voted sure

 

Joseph  

that I would not consider myself loaded but yes, sure. Pretty sure 24 year old you would consider 28 year old Yeah, probably but yeah. Oh my standards have changed.

 

Erwin  

Alright, well thank you guys for doing this. Thanks everyone. Good luck. Good luck in your property search

 

Joseph  

yes

 

Erwin  

before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announced our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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BEFORE YOU GO…

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It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

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Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

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Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Former Investments Insider, Real Estate Trader, Writing Low Ball Offers With Montu Dhillon

Greetings, my fellow real estate investors!

How much better are birthdays in 2022 than the last two years?!

If Cherry’s 2nd 20th birthday is any example, it was just like 1999! Apologies to the young people, “Party like it’s 1999,” is a Prince song. It’s ok, ignore this old man 🙂

 
 
 
 
 
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A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Cherry partied hard: spa, dim sum, karaoke, escape room, Lady Gaga concert, stupid expensive dinners and then the best part, the part I organized was a house party complete with pool, barbecue and fresh mango sponge cake.

We hosted a bunch of friends and their kids, including one family visiting from Dubai.  Everyone had a great time, and hosting everyone at our new house felt so good. 

It was like the last two years never happened!

As a present… well, I happened to be in Golf Town, browsing and picked out a very thoughtful gift set of Black Widow collector golf balls. The kids were super jealous. 

I also picked a pair of golf shoes for Cherry as her golf shoes are garbage. They’re over ten years old, and the spikes have all worn out, so their only redeeming value was they were waterproof. 

After this level of gift giving, I will humbly submit my application for the husband of the year 😂

News from the investment world… Have you heard about Tiger 21? I.e. the private network of high-net-worth individuals. 

The minimum to join is now $20,000,000 in liquid assets; the average net worth is over $100M.  

Why is this important?

Well, for this group, historically, the largest % of their investments was in real estate. Recently that just changed as stocks are now #1 as they are seeing “real bargains” in the stock market.

I’m a small fish, though, but I’ll continue to keep the majority of our wealth in real estate, AND I’m deal shopping in the stock market.

If you, too, want to learn more about how to invest like the ultra-high net worth, we’re sharing their secrets at the Wealth Hacker Conference on Nov 12, live and in person only at the Toronto Congress Center. 

We have amazing speakers and vendors planned. Just like last time, this will be the event of the year for entrepreneurs and investors alike. 

If you’re following me on my social or email newsletter, you’ll be informed of promotions, but just now, the price is only going up until the day of the conference; VIP tickets will sell out, so don’t delay. 

Your FOMO will be realised if you do not attend. Go to www.wealthhacker.ca for details.

Former Investments Insider, Real Estate Trader, Writing Low Ball Offers With Montu Dhillon

This week we have a really interesting interview of a gentleman, a co-worker at Rock Star Real Estate, my friend Montu Dhillon.  

He has a unique background, having worked his way up the corporate ladder in the financial services world, specifically compliance, so he saw firsthand who makes money in the investment services industry; hence he started buying real estate.

Montu shares how he started like most of us do, hustling hard in search of cash flow, buying houses, duplexes, fourplex, and Airbnb, then later transitioned into new construction condos for the negative cash flow but way fewer headaches.  

Montu is a bit of a trader as well, having divested some properties near the peak and what property type he has his sights set on may surprise you.

Montu shares his experience in the current market of writing low ball offers and being on the receiving end as well.

This is definitely a story of resilience, entrepreneurship, and taking control of one’s financial future.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

Erwin  

Greetings, my fellow real estate investors. Welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show for Canadians. My name is Erwin Szeto, I am a Canadian as last time I checked in how much better our birthdays in 2022 than the last two years. If Cherry’s second 20th birthday is any example. It was like a party just like 9099 Apologise to the young people. It’s a older person term to party like it’s 1999 it’s a Prince song. It’s Okay, nevermind, just ignore this old man. Cherry partied hard. She went to the spa, she did some karaoke escape room, and Lady Gaga concert 50,000 other people, some stupid-expensive dinners. And the best part the part that I organised which was the host party, complete with our use of our pool, barbecue, fresh mangoes, finder page, etc, etc. They hosted a bunch of friends and their kids, including one Vallely, visiting from Dubai, everyone had a great time. And it’s our good to host everyone that our new hosts. It’s like the last two years never happened as a present. Well, I have a deviant golf town browsing in picked out a very thoughtful gift set of Black Widow, you know, the Marvel movie character, Black Widow collector golf balls for cherry. And when I brought them home, the kids were super jealous. Also, I got her a pair of golf shoes as cherries, current golf shoes are basically garbage. And they’re well over 10 years old, extremely well worn. They were supposed to be weighed, you’d never know by the look of them. The spikes on the bottom of the cleats have been all worn off. They were plastic leads, they’re all worn off. Basically, the only redeeming value of the shoe is that they’re waterproof. But yeah, there’s no grip. After this level of gift giving, I will humbly submit my application as husband of the year. Sorry, ladies from the investment world. Have you heard of Tiger 21? That is the private network of high net worth individuals, the minimum to join for application purposes. You know what the pay them law, I’m sure you pay them. But the application purposes to be accepted, you have to have a minimum of $20 million in liquid assets worth of liquid assets. The average net worth of a tiger 21 member is over $100 million. Us. Why is this important? Well for this group historically, because I’ve been following them for close to a decade, they do a survey of their members and to see what they’re liking for investments, right. So historically, based on the survey results of their members, these really really rich people. Historically, the largest percentage of their investments was in real estate. So no surprise there. I’m a small fish, but that’s where most of my money is. And what’s more, I make almost my money. But how recently that just changed. As now stocks are now their number one take the number one largest percentage of their investment portfolio, as they’re seeing real bargains in the stock market. That’s the words of the of the CEO of Tiger 21 real bargains. I’m personally a small fish. So I’ll keep the majority of my wealth in real estate, and I am deal shopping in the stock stock market. If you too want to learn more about how to invest like the ultra high net worth, we’re sharing all their secrets at the wealth hacker conference on November 12. live and in person only at the Toronto Congress Centre, we have some amazing speakers and vendors planned plenty of free parking. And just like last time, this will be the event of the year for entrepreneurs and investors alike. If you’re following me on my social media, or email or on my email newsletter, you’ll be informed of any promotions that we run. But just so you know, the price is going up as in the discounts on the promotions will be to be declining. So if you buy closer to the conference, you will be paying more money so and also the VIPs tickets will sell out. So don’t delay. Your FOMO will be realised the sooner you buy it, the more money you save. So go to www dot wealth hacker.ca For details on the event. Nonsense sweet show this week ever. We have a really interesting interview of a gentleman, also a co worker of mine at Rockstar real estate my friend Monty Dillon. He has a unique background of having worked his way up the corporate ladder, but in the financial services world, specifically in the compliance department. So his job was to follow up on complaints on their own staff. And also like we audit other compliance staff I’ve met my my my experience, they audit also what their staff own certain members of the influential industry haven’t disclosed what investments they hold to their employer. So that’s the part of the point of the compliance department. Hey, there’s so much you have saw firsthand who really makes money in the investment services world. Hence he started buying real estate.

Erwin  

Montu shares how he started like most of us do hustling hard in search of cash flow by Houses duplexes for plexes Airbnbs then later transitioned into new construction condos, for honestly negative cash flow, but way less headaches. Mar two is a bit of a trader as well has he has divested some properties near the peak, just you know. So in the last 12 months is the vastness and properties and what property types his eyes set on for his next investment may surprise you. Surprise me. Marty shares his experience in the current market of reading lowball offers and being on the receiving end of lowball offers as well. We recorded this in the middle of August so you can expect some lowballs are flying around. This is definitely a story of resilience, entrepreneurship and taking control of one’s financial future. And also if you want a free copy of Monty’s digital book, go to Dylan Realty systems.ca. That’s d h i ll O N Realty systems.ca. Please enjoy the show. may want to Hey, hey dinner, good not golfing. But what’s keeping you busy.

Montu  

You know what I have been passionate about golf for the last little while, last couple of months. To tell you the truth. I haven’t been endorsing any condo projects in the last couple of months. And that’s because I’ve seen the potential for a huge pullback in the market since like, March, April. And I’m not one to like, start a panic spread of telling people hey, this guy’s falling. gotta sell your assets. Even that’s what I’ve been thinking. But I just couldn’t tell people to start buying during the decline. So I’ve been keeping myself busy with golf. You golf?

Erwin  

Poorly, or? Anyone lately, so? No, I haven’t hit one lately.

Montu  

So I’ve been golfing for about 25 years, never? Well, I have not I’ve been a terrible golfer for 25 years.

Erwin  

Please tell me it gets easier. Five years?

Montu  

Well, here’s here it is, you gotta get professional lessons. So I went in and spoke to like a coach a couple of times to straighten myself out. And the difference is night and day. So and I have been telling myself for the last five years that when I earn it, I’m going to buy myself some custom clubs. Nice. And so I think this, this is the year this is the year getting fitted and getting myself some some finally some good clubs. And it makes a huge difference. If there’s any golfers out there listening to this, stop struggling, you know, just go get fitted, different clubs performed differently for everyone.

Erwin  

Not the same shoe fits everyone, again, showing the term professional help. Yeah, her bad idea.

Montu  

Now just just proper training, everyone’s got to get straightened out.

Erwin  

That’s a good analogy for almost everything. I’d have a business coach and investment coach, I’d like business coaches in my life.

Montu  

People are trying to like buy real estate, just watching YouTube videos and trying to figure it out when what they really need is someone who’s run the laps before and can just hold their hands and guide them through the process,

Erwin  

right? Just gonna warn you if we’re gonna shoot a YouTube video after this. So we the same schmucks that people can learn from. But we’ve run some laps, we run some laps, we know a little bit of investing. So hopefully we’d like to be the good schmucks on here. So once you have an interesting journey, and you’re in terms of real estate, because you actually come from the investments world, can you tell us about First off what year was that? And then what was your experience working in investments world because you worked in the financial investments world, like large publicly traded companies,

Montu  

the early 2000s. So I do have a background in investments, I was stocks and options. licenced that was my previous previous life. I had the plan to build up a huge stock portfolio and let that say, make a million bucks in stocks and then just collect 6% For the rest of my life. And I thought I could live off of that. Lo and behold, a lot changes in a decade. Right? So I was working with investment advisors and portfolio managers, and I was trading for myself. And I just, I had a position in the compliance department. In a couple of companies like CIBC and Dundee wealth, we’re now they’ve become Echelon partners, I found that I was able to climb the corporate ladder really quickly, especially in Toronto. I come from Montreal, where the salaries were a lot less than Toronto. So when I came to Toronto in like the mid 2000s, my salary practically doubled. And then it would jump by like 30 40% because I would just change, change locations, change careers. Now careers change employers every couple of months, right, because it was so competitive. They were offering the headhunters were like really aggressive, and they were offering immense salary increases. So my salary went from like 35,000 in Montreal, to well, almost 100,000 plus bonuses, which pass those bonuses and the insurance and the stock options. Those are the golden handcuffs. That’s what I learned. So my journey in trying to make as much money as possible and retire early, I learned that I could not break a glass ceiling, no matter how hard I worked, because I was working for somebody else, they subdued my earning potential. So there was a level that I was trying to reach a director in the company I was at. And I had climbed to the position of manager, director, Junior director was right after that, and I just could not get it done, no matter how much work I put into it, no matter how many connections I made, apparently, with this company that I worked for, they only allowed people with like an MBA to reach the director and higher level to become a VP, you had to have an MBA, which was strange to me, because I mean, I knew some directors, and they didn’t look like they had MBAs. You know, I hope there aren’t any directors listening to this. feel slighted. But I mean, there’s smart people and average people. And I learned that in the investment industry, there are some incredibly brilliant minds who have amazing analysis capability. But those are few and far between. And most of them are just average people. In fact, I think every industry is just average people. And there are only a few that really step out, that are the cream of the crop that stand out from the rest, you know, the top 9% as I like to call them, it exists everywhere, in my opinion, even in real estate, you know, even dentists, doctors, lawyers, I’m sure we all know some bad lawyers

Erwin  

is bad, and everything is bad. And everything was great in every industry, too.

Montu  

So although I couldn’t break this glass ceiling, I thought my earning should not be limited. I felt I should be making 300,000 a year. My salary at the time was 90 something 1000 plus bonuses of like 20,000 bucks. So it was just north of 100k. But I was like no, I want to Dylan is a 300k minimum earn, you know, three to 500 should be my lifestyle. I think that’s what we all want. Because that we don’t just want the money. We want the freedom that money provides. So I decided to get a motorcycle and crash it and break about 24 bones in my body. This was terrible plan. Yeah, it was it completely backfired on me. Right. So lying there for three months, not able to sleep lying down. I had to sleep in a recliner. And that’s when I realised that okay, I cannot I was dreading going back to my workplace. It was just the most horrible environment with office politics and some of the characters were just you work with troll. Yeah, at least in this office. There was a couple of trolls and I really did not want to go back to that. So I said to my wife, darlin, I have a crazy idea. Better than motorcycling better better than a motorcycle. I’m gonna be we’re gonna buy some real estate. I think that duplexes if we have a portfolio of duplexes, it’s the cash flow. If we can get a five duplexes that are cash flowing, 1000 bucks, we’re gonna replace my salary. Yeah, that’s all I was making. I was making like 5000 A month after taxes. How the hell did we survive on that? You know what I mean? So that started my epic journey. And I found us got the television personality from HG McGilvery. I found him my wife brought his book to me. And I read it and I was like, Who is this clown? He’s got his picture all over his book. This is I’m not paying attention to him. He’s so egotistical. Then I watched a show one of his shows. And I was amazed at how humble and charming and good hearted he was nothing this guy’s got it figured out. Okay, let me read his book. So read his book. And I was like, Alright, this is what we’re going to do. We’re going to get some duplexes, Scotland McGilvery says, and we’ll be financially free, or

Erwin  

anything properties, income properties, it’s a suite of basements or anchor properties, for sure was all about

Montu  

and then I’ll slowly leave my job. And we can do this. And, you know, got licenced got my real estate licence, started work doing that part time and working in the financial industry full time. But in all 21 me I wasn’t doing much work full time. I was just focusing on real estate trying to figure out trying to get crack this code. And then one day, I stumbled upon income for life. Tom and Nick Carozza, Shadow Tom and Nick are our real estate Rockstar real estate and I read their book and be being a sceptic. I was I was like, telling me I was so angry and I was reading the book. I was like, this does not work. This is the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. This is not gonna work. And I was I was yelling at it every day to my wife. Look, look at what these guys are for. posing, there’s no way you can do a rent to own it just won’t work. By the end of the book, though, I’ve got to admit, I was sold as like, you know what, I think these guys are onto something, we got to try it, it just the It’s just math. And math doesn’t lie. So let’s do it. Let’s, let’s try, I’m gonna go to one of their free training classes. And yeah, that’s where I met Tom Carozza. So I didn’t join Rockstar brokerage right away, it was just, you know, part of my journey trying to accumulate a whole bunch of like, houses a whole bunch, you know, I bought a fixer uppers, converted them into with legal basements. So have like a two unit dwelling, I got bought me a four Plex I did one rent to own, which ultimately didn’t work out. And then, at some point, because of all the work I was doing, in my houses, I was like, I gotta get property managers, and all the tenant issues that I had the tenant profile in these duplexes, and for plexes, they didn’t really make a lot of money, and they often had problems paying the rent. So one day, someone told me that the best thing we ever did was buy a pre construction condo. And I was like, no way that doesn’t work. You know, houses land is where the money’s at, that’s what you want to get. But, you know, because I had extra assets, and I was able to get a mortgage. At the time, it’s really hard to do that. Now. I decided to go ahead and buy a pre construction condo, what ended up happening was I made like 150 or $200,000, within that timeframe, from start to finish, actually was over, just from start to closing, the value is up 200,000. And I sold it a year later. And then after all my you know, realtor expenses, and paying taxes, etc. I my profit was about $220,000. I didn’t have to fix up any houses, I didn’t have to clean up any cockroaches. I didn’t have any toilets to clean, which is what I was doing previously, you know, getting tenants into my homes, I didn’t have to do any of that. It was just I found good builders who knew how to build and deliver. And then I just started doing that over and over. I just found the pattern, made a few mistakes, figured out what the right pattern is. And then I would just go into business with those people who had the good projects. And then it was just like a sign if you checks, it gets cashed a couple of months later. And then on closing, you get a mortgage, you can either sell it but I found the sweet spot was selling the condo about a year to a year and a half after closing. Why is that? The sweet spot? Number one, there’s you know, tax benefits. You get your HST rebate, you lock that in your value of the unit with a tenant carrying it for a year. If for some reason, I haven’t figured out why but the value jumps within that first year. Lots of theories as to why because you know, the building is still in renovation, and then renovations are all done. People want new but they want now. Exactly right. Yeah. And they’re willing to pay for it. Right. So as an investor if I’m willing to carry it. And if sometimes even at a loss, these some of these units, they cashflow negative, about three 400 bucks a month. So I’m sacrificing about 4800 A year $5,000 A year. But in the end on the flip side when I sell I’m making 200 Without the struggle of having to maintain real estate, maintain houses, fix a leak in the basement, which I have tonnes of experience doing. Believe me

Erwin  

to someone to this let me apology there because there’s lots to unpack. Because you’re skim through the whole part. You worked in the compliance department in the investment industry. Sauron Konya. Yes. What did you see? What can you share? So because you saw you saw the skeletons in the closet shenanigans,

Montu  

right, so what I learned back in those days was there are good advisors and there are bad advisors. I like to surround myself only with good advisors, people who know what they’re doing. But as I manage the compliance department, I saw all kinds of shenanigans. I saw one fellow, this was unbelievable. It was just outright fraud. He would, he took his clients money, and when the market this one stock tanked, they went from $300,000 to $50,000. And clients investor clients investment their account, and he decided to create fictitious statements just on Excel. He sent them homemade Excel statements saying, Yeah, your account is fine, your money’s good. You’ve gone up. And then I remember every time we would try to have a discussion with him in the compliance department. He would say his grandmother died. So it wasn’t just me investigating him. He was other officers that were trying to figure out what’s going on with him. And then when it was my turn to investigate him, you know, and put the bring the boot down. He was like, Oh, my grandmother died. Sorry. Can I get back to you in two days? I’m like, Okay, sure. And then someone else tells me oh my god, that’s his grandmother died. That must be the third time. And I was like, oh, okay, we got a problem. So he ultimately disappeared. We think he left the country. There was a the police went looking for him. They just couldn’t find him. So, yeah, and that person’s whose account was destroyed. Luckily, the company I worked with made them whole. Wow. That’s nice. Yeah, well, I mean, you know, 100 million dollars a year profit, they could at least give them 250k back and avoid a major lawsuit. Right. But again,

Erwin  

you were in the investments industry, financial markets industry, why did you want to be a real estate investor need to be rich doing what the these investment advisors are recommending?

Montu  

That’s a great question. That’s what I wondered. Like, why couldn’t I get ahead? In the investment industry? World? You’re an insider. Yeah, that was an insider who paid less commission do friends and family specials, right? So what I learned was the only people who are really making money in the stock world are the middlemen, the ones who are doing the trades, who are making the Commission, which is ultimately the house, the brokerages. Right, the the CIBC is the RBC is the big houses, they have their investment division, and all their portfolio managers have pictures of their boats on the wall. They all do. I’m like, Wow, these guys are really got it figured out. But what I learned was because their clients were not making the money that they were, I couldn’t continue with it. I believe in you know, the rising tide raises all boats. And it was only their boat that was floating, no one else had a boat, frankly, so and I couldn’t stand that it really bothered me. So I said, You know what, I don’t want to be an advisor. I think the stock market is a rigged game, where only the market makers make any money. So I said, I’m going to do something where once I figure out how to make money for myself, I’m going to help others do it. And so like my my client base, in real estate, and as you know, I am a real estate agent, specialising in condoms, my client base are the ones that I try, whose votes I try to raise. And it’s been pretty good. It’s been a really good decade, I’d say.

Erwin  

Now, not all financial planners and investment advisors are bad. We were talking about before we recording. Yeah. And I, you know, I said are some people I would never trust with their own money. You know, we’ve all lost money at something. I think some people are more talented at losing more money than so I’m not against for certain people best right. That’s the right thing to do. Let someone else manage your money. And also, same thing that’s in common new construction condos. I think for certain people, that’s the right investment for them. Right. But I wanted to ask you, for example, in your journey that you had lost single family, where would you call it resale properties? Use properties? Did that fund your condo investing?

Montu  

Yeah, well, ultimately, it’s where I started. And it was those assets that grew. Yeah. And then I was either able to refi or sell them. And then, and I just thought to myself, You know what, I’ve made a profit. I don’t want to do it again. Because it’s really messy. I want to do something where I get something brand new.

Erwin  

You didn’t want to repeat the experience. You want the grief, you didn’t want the doing the maintenance, and especially the heavy millions.

Montu  

And it’s just because I’d rather do something else with my time. Right, right. Right now I’m golfing a lot, I spend more time with my family. It’s my custom designed life that I feel I’m living. And I wouldn’t want to change that. Even for money, right. So there’s one asset that you

Erwin  

see after you’ve made all this money.

Montu  

That’s one way of looking at it. But there’s one commodity, I think that we cannot ever create. And that’s time where the time the clock is against us. So I also believe that money is the store of energy. And more than just that it’s not just power. People think it’s power, it’s freedom. I think it’s just a store of energy. And when you unleash that energy properly, you create time for yourself, which is that’s the holy grail to me time to do what you want with who you want. And remove the elements of your life that are unpleasant. People places things right, get rid of those out

Erwin  

and just see so often though, that it starts with hustle like you hustled even with 24 broken bones. You went out and hustled in order in order to find an easier investment strategy. Right? Right. So yeah, that’s my like, I mean, like, you know, that’s right for you. It’s not right for everyone. I have this weird Asian mentality that the more suffer the more money it’s crazy.

Montu  

Well, don’t get me wrong. I still have houses in my portfolio. I’m still half in half.

Erwin  

Yeah, and you still hustle I know you have you. Do you still have any Airbnbs left?

Montu  

Well, during the pandemic, I had shut them down. Right. But we are planning on reopening, right. I have long term tenants in my furnished rentals. But now it’s it’s I think it’s time to go back to the service the tourist industry again.

Erwin  

And you do it inside a Toronto condo, right? Yeah.

Montu  

It’s been a bit trickier since Toronto condos, Toronto, the city itself has shut down. Well, as soon as they shut down, they’ve limited the ease that Airbnb operators were able to operate. And before, it’s a little more difficult, but those who know the system, insiders are still doing just fine. They’re still making six 810 $1,000 a month in these condos and there are opportunities. But they’re not for everybody because it’s hard work. It’s not a set it and forget it. A lot of people have to hire property managers to run their Airbnb and PMS. They take about 15 to 20% of the gross. And then what you do you have a property manager I used to write while it was running, right? Yeah, but now I’m going I’m going to reopen it. I’m just going to manage it myself.

Erwin  

You’re going to fluff pillows and well stocked toilet paper.

Montu  

Well, well, that’s the thing. It’s so easy to hire a cleaner to do that. Okay, so you hire out with our technology, you can just press an app and someone will go to your your condo and do it all for you. But as for the guests communication, setting the prices, looking at the market, I’ll do that myself. I did it before figured out how

Erwin  

right. So you talked about limiting grief with your other investments. How do you keep an Airbnb investment with limited grief that you’ve read the same stuff articles in the media? I have, you know, raging postgraduate graduation party in two people got shot, whatever. Right?

Montu  

Well, the media likes to print what bleeds. Yeah, because it reads, yes. That’s how media works. So I have found that 98% of the time you get amazing guests, they’re respectful, they just come in, they use your place. And then they leave

Erwin  

people like me, I’m not there to cause any trouble. You have my credit card. And I’m cheap, causing any trouble.

Montu  

So what I also did was I increased the deposit required on my Airbnb, increase your damage deposit to $1,000. Ultimately, it’s just a deterrent, because if they feel they can cause the damage, Airbnb is going to side with them. And lately, Airbnb has not been making owners whole, they’ve been a bit problematic, because they’ve scaled and now they’re a publicly traded company, they, they seem to be putting less effort towards owners of properties. But that said, like 90% of the time, you’re gonna have an easy run. You’re just a hotel, you own a mini hotel, and you just send your maid in to clean it once in a while. You make all the money. And then just remember, it’s a business, treat it as a business and business and I know you have experienced you guys ran your own Airbnb. So I’m preaching to the choir here. But for the listeners, it’s a business, treat it like a business and you’ll flourish treated personally, if you get upset about what they did to your place, you’re gonna want to quit, and then you’re giving up all these potential returns that you could be making.

Erwin  

I don’t talk about enough, I call it return on my grief. So just because I naturally think analytically, the story often shares one time. I had like a small piece of roof that just goes over my front porch and when our properties well as a windstorm, like we’ve had with some crazy wind storms. So it was blowing and just hanging off, right. And my tenant has four kids, single mom, and then I couldn’t get someone to take care of it. So I drove and went out and took care of it. I got a ladder unscrewed it took it down. Or I called a buddy to pick it up because it couldn’t fit my car was too big to take it away. But you know, it took me two hours total right? To drive out take care of it. Like oh, sucks the weekends my weekend that I think about how much money I made. on that property. You think about it, right? Yeah. You know, that property? Probably appreciated rental five, six grand that month alone cost me two hours. So that’s like, you know, 2500 $3,000 an hour. Yeah. That’s worth my grief. Right. So then like, okay, I’m okay. Yeah. Right. So that’s why me like return on grief for what was going on with that because Airbnb is not always easy. And also, like you said, you can’t get up. Like you can get upset, but then go back to quantify it. I was upset for 20 minutes. And a cash flow of eight grand this month. isn’t worth it. Think of how much grief people have in a day job to make eight grand a month. Right. There’s probably a lot of grief for almost everyone, you know, commuting whatever, office bullies, right. Yeah, office trolls, as you mentioned office trolls, or was that the name of the app that you mentioned that you use for booking a maid?

Montu  

It’s called bark.com is going to bark.com I think var K var K? And then finally, maybe, yeah, you just just say, hey, I need a cleaner. And they just send, you know, you get a whole bunch of people who are saying, oh, yeah, I could, I could clean your place, this is my price. And you get some good cleaners and bad cleaners, like everything else. So then when you find a good one, you just keep them and make sure you pay them well. Right? If they if they want 100 bucks, say, Look, I’ll give you 120 to come back. And you know, I think effort needs to be rewarded, right?

Erwin  

Because they kind of like what the market is, for example, good quality people. Exact 20%. Inflation. Yeah. And to make sure that your priority, exactly right. Well, if you’re caching like eight grand a month, you know, paying a little extra for cleaning, it’s probably worth it.

Montu  

Yeah, right. And people get bogged down in the details. And sometimes they run an operation like an Airbnb hosting operation. And they’re like, Well, I don’t want to pay 150 bucks for cleaning. Come on, folks. Here, you just made $1,000. This month, just shell out the extra 150 It’s a business. Every business has an expense. If you want it that’s one thing I’ve learned in the last two decades is when you throw money at a problem, it fixes it. Don’t rely on your own expertise that are other people are better equipped to take care of your problem. And just give them money to do it. In money. Just you’re storing some energy. And they can do it faster, better quicker than you can. Like, you know, plumbers, for example. I knew a couple things about plumbing and electricity with all the houses I’ve managed. I used to do it all myself. And now it’s I just find a plumber. And they fix it permanently. Yeah, they cost. Yeah, electricians costs. But guess what, I’ve never gone back to those homes, that I botched the electrical or the plumbing job myself. So now it’s it’s you know, one and done. When you hire a pro.

Erwin  

I think part of your grief issue is that you did a lot of the work yourself.

Montu  

Maybe it’s trying to save the money. Right?

Erwin  

I said it recently, it takes a village to raise a child it takes a village to have a successful investment property. Yeah. Right. And all these people tried to do it themselves. Yeah. Same thing with raising a child to not do daycare to not you know, do schooling to Yeah, like it takes a village. Can’t do it by yourself. It’s just a lot easier if you don’t do it by yourself. Can you give us a bit of a breakdown? What percentage of your portfolio is new construction versus like everything else?

Montu  

Well, here’s the thing. My new construction is I trade it. So right now my

Erwin  

if you’re not really an investor of new construction trader, I’m investing

Montu  

during the holding period. So yeah, I mean, as you point out my new beyond one year of Yeah, because especially with, you know, the recent downturn, I advocated everyone to sell in like February, I was like, Hey, guys, I think the markets gonna pull back sell what you have while you can, I sold two properties, one last year, one this year, in March or April. And I’m glad I did because I was predicting like a 30% pullback. At the same time, I was seeing a potential increase in condo prices, because of just the laws of supply and demand. So the houses that I sold, they did come down, and I’m glad I sold them. And I think versus last year.

Erwin  

The policies were these both condos that you sold her homes, or both houses. Yeah.

Montu  

What’s it nice low rise, one in Guelph. And one in Hamilton got it. Sorry, continue. So yeah, I made out made up well with them. And now I’m sitting on dry powder, because I think that there’s a next opportunity that’s coming. So I’m a 6040 in my portfolio with new construction and resale. And I am going to be adding so I’m not a condo nut know what I mean? Like I just saw an opportunity in condos in the last seven years. And I capitalised on it. I’m an opportunist.

Erwin  

You’re not You’re not an agnostic investor. Yeah, exactly.

Montu  

And I see the next opportunity right now coming in detached homes, because I think the carrying cost for them was way too high. Everything above a million bucks, carrying costs with current interest rates is like $6,000. Right? With property taxes, insurance, all that we’re talking about six grand how many people can afford that. So I think these homes, they’re going to be coming down because the demand is just not going to be able to meet that carrying cost. Luckily, I’m one of the few people who can pick up one of these units are and so

Erwin  

you’re not an everyday investor. Yeah, that’s like clear. Just because I want to I want to I always think context is important. You can afford to do this. You have the bankroll to do

Montu  

that. Exactly. And so I think these homes and I think it’s not just me, I think a lot of other people gonna be able to do.

Erwin  

I totally agree. Because detached is what’s coming down the most in price. Exactly. And also, so my thinking is, again, it’s math, the per square foot cost of a bigger home is less than that of a smaller home, right, a two story home cost per square foot is less than a bungalow, but the rent per square foot is probably the same same, the same. So there’s a bit of an arbitrage opportunity exact so why would I buy a bigger home and turn into a triplex? For example? This was my thinking, what what was your thinking around detached home investing?

Montu  

So everything most detached, different, people are paying like $1.5 million, or at least they were like the average detached home is going for about 105 to 2,000,002 bucks. It’s insane. Absolutely nuts. And I think a lot of it was speculation and people got ahead of themselves thinking, they’re listening to the wrong people thinking, oh, yeah, it’s gonna go to three, it’s gonna keep going up to the moon. And then, you know, when when the stack starts to shake, people are going to start dumping these, these things, these assets really fast. And you always want to go against the herd against the grain. I’m a contrarian investor. And that’s, I think, where I’ve made most of my money in the shortest amount of time, by doing the opposite what everybody else is doing. So sell high, buy low, but you know, you just get that queasy feeling that you’re doing it wrong. When you get that wrong feeling. You’re actually right. Because guess what 95% of people are wrong about money. Only 5% know what they’re doing. They actually understand money. It’s not currency or paper. It’s it’s a store of energy. And once you know how to like capitalise and hold it in reserve, and then release it. So hope people sold those of you who are smart enough and sold earlier this year, you’ve got some dry powder, you should be able to release it in a couple of months. We’re sitting here in August 2022. And I see an immense opportunity in detached homes coming up in like, October, November. And I think it’s just when the news is that oh, it’s gonna go even lower, or detached homes are going to be under a million bucks very soon, that’s when we buy because most people are wrong. And most people are going to be preaching that the market is going to tank markets gonna drop even further. That’s when I jump in and buy. I understand that for a while. We never act on it. Because we hear our neighbours and a lot of my clientele, they miss out on opportunities because they’re listening to their neighbours, who say you should sell your house for this price. But no, they’re they’re chasing the market down. The house is not that price anymore, and they’re not able to sell it. So you got to listen to the experts, right? Don’t listen to the other crabs in the bucket. When you get that feeling that you are right. Despite everyone else, you got to pull the trigger. And you’ll find that, you know, a couple of months later, everyone catches up to you. And then by then it’s too late.

Erwin  

So tell me what you’re looking for. Tell me what you’re looking for in a detached home.

Montu  

Okay, this is hard to get right now. Because you know, I’m out there making lowball offers. I got some amazing stories. I’m out there making lowball offers right now on detached homes and I am offending people. Oh my God, they are. They’re taking it so personally, they respond with such vile anger. You’ll moron, you think my house is worth this. So I’m just you know, pitching lowball offers to houses that have not sold, I look for something on the market that hasn’t sold in three weeks. So after two weeks, because they’re used to things being sold in two weeks, if in the third and fourth week, if it’s dry, even sometimes two months. So I can see that it’s not selling and then me being the opportunities that I am I look for contracts that are about to expire, meaning the realtor is going to lose the listing very soon. So he’s motivated or she’s motivated to get the place sold.

Erwin  

Right? That’s also been sitting to Yes, it’s probably been sitting Yeah, three months to six months. Exactly.

Montu  

Right. So my pitch a lowball offer 300k, under ask, under what actually under what I think is reasonable. And either the price will you know, we’ll meet in the middle, or I don’t move forward. Because I have the money. They want my money. And no one else has given them money. So they’re either going to sell it to me now or they’re going to sell to somebody in three months for the price I’m asking anyway. That’s how I see it. Anyhow, right. So I’ve offended a lot of people, but I don’t care. He’s just a numbers game. And you’re a real estate investor. You know what I mean? And the worst was check this up. This is so terrible. A house appeared on my street and I wanted a house on my street because it’d be so easy to Airbnb, very easy to manage. And they’re worth about 1.4 mil. And, you know, and they looked at 1.3 because they had an unfinished basement. And there was a lot of bad media at the time. I went in, I offered like 1025 like super lowball, and of course, the sellers were offended. And I told them

Erwin  

why it’s $1,000,000.20 1,000,025 when I was just just north

Montu  

of a million, and it properly dressed this house would have sold for 1.3 It just wasn’t dressed well. The agent didn’t really do a good job. afterwards, yeah, she, she doesn’t really understand staging or marketing, right?

Erwin  

So he’s terrible.

Montu  

And I have that skill set. So I’m like, Okay, let me just grab it, I’ll pay 1.1. For it in my mind, I’m thinking I’ll pay 1.1 for it, and I’ll dress it up, and I’ll sell it for 1.3. I could even hold it for a year, put a tent in there while the market recovers, if it sinks. So in retrospect, it was a bad idea to tell them all the things I found that are wrong with the house, because that’s what pissed them off. They’re like, they took it so personally. So I found there was basement moisture, I found a crack in the foundation, I found all kinds of you know that this is dated that’s dated. And so this is why my offer is this. And they weren’t getting any other offers, right. And I knew the market was dry. So they’re either going to take my offer, or it’s going to sit, and they’ll eventually take my offer if they get nothing else. Long story short, they wanted 1.2. They said we’re not going to be lower than 1.2. A week later, they sold it to somebody else other than me for 1060. When I found that they had submitted they had another offer on the table, I went in and offered 1.1 million. I offered 1.1. And they took the 1060 because they hated me. They did not want to deal with the guy who insulted them. Right there

Erwin  

hate for you. 40,000. Assuming capital exempt came Gains Exemption $40,000 after tax money was the dollar value for their hate for you. Yeah,

Montu  

exactly. So that’s something. So now when I’m pitching my lowball offers, I’m not doing that anymore. I’m not you know, telling them but the basement moisture. say here’s my offer, you want to take it or leave it, you know, and a key is Don’t piss off the other agent as well. Because he or she holds the door to your access to the sale and if you haven’t learned I’m I’m a tough negotiator. So I N You know this about me, I call it like I see it. I don’t pull punches. If I see something wrong. I don’t keep it inside. I tell them as Okay, that is kind of dumb. Right? Don’t don’t think you’re gonna trick me. This is BS, and a lot of people. They’re so sensitive. We live in a very sensitive world. Yeah,

Erwin  

but But again, we’re dealing with individuals you’re going to find. All right, you could have found the most sensitive individuals on the street. just gotten lucky. Yeah. All

Montu  

right. So that’s what I’m doing. I’m I think there’s a huge opportunity for low rise. Detached semis talents are going to be coming up right now. It’s for detached semis in towns are still going up in value, but I think they’re going to stop very soon in pullback. Meanwhile, the more

Erwin  

started a home the more seems to be resilient. Yeah, right. Yeah. Condos are presumed pretty reasonably resilient resale resale.

Montu  

At this time in August 2022. Condos are up like 7% versus last year. Oh my lord. Meanwhile, detached homes are down 3% versus last year. So condos have bridged the gap by about 10%. Right. That’s that’s the

Erwin  

time to return detached down 3% year over year, but from Peak, we’re probably down 15 or more

Montu  

24%. Okay, so the average price from February to now. Or I should say using the July data, it’s down 24%, the average price of a home. So I figured detachment is somewhere in there. But I’ve had a lot of very smart investors who were working with me that said, Yeah, let’s sell and they got out in like February, March, April. And now they’re sitting on some dry powder. And now they got some money burning a hole in their pocket. And they’re thinking, Oh, well, what should we do? Should we buy some Kryptos or not? And I just hold on to it, you know, the opportunities coming? And don’t don’t follow the herd. There’s other people buying just wait. I know. It’s

Erwin  

weird, though. Because then you know, the 17 listeners that listen to this podcast. Sure what we’re doing? Well, everyone’s doing buying the detached, need to do something else. You know, I mean, I get that too, because I talked to like, really smart people and like, Wow, all these smart people are doing this. Am I just following the herd?

Montu  

You know, I mean, the difficult thing is there’s going to be opportunities for detached homes, and they’re still going to be six figures. So the market has shown us they’re willing to pay ridiculous amounts of money for a detached house. 1.71 point 8 million is, you know, Richmond Hill, Markham Oakville, that’s what they’re clocking in at. And that tells me that the market is going to be willing to do it again, when the Fed ultimately has to cut their interest rates. We all know that they have to, you know, I don’t know if we all do.

Erwin  

We all do. Because like the people who are like fearing this, that’s the end of the world. Well, they’re the ones who know the 16% Right. They’re thinking right,

Montu  

these are the guys who are going to sell me their house for 40% discount. And once that opportunity is there and the investors are there to pick up the broken pieces they’re going to sell I don’t think we’re at the market bottom yet. I I think once the fed the US FOMC, once they start to cut interest rates, that’s when the bottom is going to be like, you can basically ring the bell. That’s the bottom decile. Nobody rings the bell at the bottom, but I’m calling it when the when they cut interest rates, that’s the bottom of the market. Some people will still be preaching that we’re going lower. But that’s when I’m going to be buying

Erwin  

any guesses when that will be? And I’m just not going to hold you to it because we don’t know what she’s doing crystal ball,

Montu  

I think spring of 2023 Not even far away. Yeah, yeah.

Erwin  

So we’re recording this August 2022, we’re talking six months,

Montu  

nine months, nine months, well see that the harvest always comes later. So the failed harvest takes about six to eight months to come to fruition. And right now, whatever we’re trying to harvest, like the supply chain issues that we have, people are getting laid off, a couple of my tenants just got laid off. So we’re in for a storm that’s coming. And to all my fellow landlords who were suffering during COVID. And Mr. Doug Ford, convinced all the tenants that, hey, you don’t have to pay rent, just buy food. You know, don’t worry, someone will pay the mortgage. Now you were in for that. Again, I think it’s coming. We’re gonna see massive layoffs coming up. And I think this is a manipulated and triggered event. I think the Keynesians they need to deflate the economy, I think the forcing us into a recession, and it’s going to be layoffs are going to be business closings, all the money that we have at all these assets, including the market, gold Bitcoin house, it’s all going to be pulled out. And it’s going to be like an exhale, and everything’s going to shrink a bit. So those of us who have assets sitting on the side, dry powder I keep talking about now,

Erwin  

but painful that dry powder with all this inflation going on. Yeah.

Montu  

So what what is inflation and loss of wealth? I’ve I’ve been pondering this for a long time, months and months. And I came to the realisation that we’re not really poor. When our assets go down, we only get poor if the things that we want go up in price where our assets go down

Erwin  

costs gone up in price. Yeah, golf clubs are way more expensive now than they were last year, year before.

Montu  

And if I if someone wants a Rolex,

Erwin  

it’s been a good investment. Or you want to hang out in Canada,

Montu  

too. So if our income and our assets like the stock market, are we listed, if that’s shrinking, and the things that we want, if I want to buy like a Bentley, I don’t have just an example. I’m not like, I’m very humble. I drive a Ford midsize SUV, right? If the things that we want are going up in value, we’re screwed. And I think that’s what we’re going to be seeing. So get that dry powder. While you can

Erwin  

refer for us we refight five houses in q1 this year, because I saw a storm common Yeah, yeah. So we don’t have debt related in dry powder. Okay, so some things unpack. I want to go back to the detached example, because I know you’re smart. You’re not just gonna buy a detached and not have like at least three options on how to make money on it. Yeah. What were your plans for how to make money on it? I think you mentioned Airbnb, you said in passing, you throw up a tent in one

Montu  

as a joke. So is that the

Erwin  

Airbnb the tents.

Montu  

what the plan is just, is to renovate it and just improve it. Because a lot of these house No one’s buying it because they’re not in good condition. So send a couple of send a team of contractors in there invest about 50 to 100k into it, and then put it back on the market properly staged and lovely. Second plan is to put a tenant in there to carry it through the storm, maybe two years if things turn bad. Get a tenant in there too. And yeah, I’ll probably be cashflow negative about 1000 bucks. Alright, I’ve run the numbers already. And Plan C is just to, you know, clean and put it back on the market right away.

Erwin  

Nowhere b b option therapy options.

Montu  

Well, yes, that’s like the tenant that

Erwin  

the long got it. Okay. You want a situation, have someone carry it? Got it. Got it. And again, this is for people who can afford these investments. It’s not everyone can afford a negative.

Montu  

Well, here’s the thing, and I think a lot of Canadians are a lot richer. Many of us have real estate that’s gone up in value. I think we have money, he locks, etc. And we have the dry powder. We just need to be fearless in releasing it. And I think a lot of people are not going to want to be wanting to release it that quickly. But other than detached homes. The other thing I’m looking at is of course new construction, but there’s certain things I look for in new construction condos. The deposit structure, it’s pretty important right now to have a favourable deposit structure, you want something around 15% with 5% occupancy, that’s what I like to see. Builder Calibre is very important. Believe it or not as an industry insider for pre construction condos, I think 40 percent of whatever was built that was ever was sold is not going to be built. And there’s going to be a lot of cancellations or delays. So you really got to do your homework and choose your builders who have deep pockets. If you want to see your project come to fruition, I’ve got my own algorithm, the old man to algorithm which, like I have a couple of things that I look for, that tells me a builder is actually going to be able to complete it. And one of those things, believe it or not, is price. If the price is too low, you’re not going to get completed. I’m sorry, if you if you bought something for less than 1000 a square foot in Toronto, the builder might walk away from it. Right? And then that’s

Erwin  

catastrophic for many people further pre construction to not close. It’s going to be common versus leaders versus my income property. Like if I’ve captured all the appreciation, right? And they just, you know, I had a friend he got he got he got interest. He got some interest money. Yeah, that was it honest that

Montu  

zondo gotta be really careful. You gotta be really smart. Oh, and just clarify Connor wasn’t cancelled.

Erwin  

They asked for more money.

Montu  

I’ll one of those deals. Yeah, wanna give us another 100k? Or we’re not gonna Yeah, Bill

Erwin  

or you can have it Yeah, right. So at least he had options better than Complete Cancellation he would have had you would have had some equity gain. We kept some equity gain if you’d come up with the money and that’s

Montu  

where the builder calibre so important, because if the builder is not one of the up and up guys, they can do that. You know, it’s

Erwin  

but everyone knows as builders downtown Burlington, you probably know that one and we won’t name names. But you know, the one I know the one right on the water downtown Burlington starts

Montu  

with an H.

Erwin  

Sorry, it’s actually public because it made headlines in the paper. So we shouldn’t trash people. Yeah, we should like why, again, like if the price is too low, I don’t blame. I don’t blame them, like you priced it wrong. It’s just like property managers. When I’ve seen property manager charge too little. I’m like, how are you going to get it? How are you going to make money at this, you’re gonna come from me somewhere else. I’d rather you just pay you here. And then you’re not going to come after me for when you like do change a doorknob charged me $100 To change your doorknob.

Montu  

And the last thing that’s very important for new construction is the neighbourhood. You want to have neighbourhood amenities, which are going to attract people to the neighbourhood that are going to float the value of the real estate. You want to have parks and libraries and commerce. The closer you are to downtown, the better protected you are from from a drop in demand.

Erwin  

Are we just talking Toronto or anything? Yeah, all cities you’d like. Do you like any other cities? Yeah, I

Montu  

  1. It’s not just Toronto that I help people trade in. I like York. Vaughn. Big fan of Vaughan, Richmond Hill, big fan of Oakville. It’s why moved here. And basically everything to the west of the DVP. I’m not crazy about the east side. Not just because it’s far away, but just the demographic isn’t what I would put in my own properties. But I like everything to the west. Up to Burlington, basically, Burlington, Mississauga is getting very congested Mississauga and Brampton, I kind of avoid for my own reasons. But everything else like Etobicoke great, great city. There’s a lot of attractions to people to these areas. So So basically in downtown

Erwin  

Lakeshore corridor, all the way to Burlington, is your preferred is your preference. Anything out of province?

Montu  

No, no, I looked at it. I looked at Montreal and you know, I’m from Montreal. I have nostalgic reasons for wanting to buy their beautiful city. But i i the political environment is not great. I won’t even get into Calgary. Maybe I can touch on Calgary. I’m not a fan of Calgary, there’s a lot of Oh

Erwin  

god, we’re going into a new construction. There seems to be a lot of new construction. I might be wrong. Social media is full of ads.

Montu  

And I might be dead wrong about it. They might flourish but they’re a one industry sector. And if something happens to oil, Calgary is going to tank again. Whereas Toronto we are we have three major industries finance, technology and media, film and media. And if one industry takes a hit, there’s a what do you call a float from the other industries that are going to help people and help the economy? That’s not gonna happen with Calgary.

Erwin  

Right on all the mining head offices are in downtown Toronto, for example. So yeah, there’s lots of high paying jobs downtown Toronto. So those are two favourite things and Monteux again, you’re agnostic investor, you do everything that you do. I remember we were talking when we were golfing the you Do you still have any holding the crypto stock or options?

Montu  

i Yeah, I’m a I’m a fan of crypto. There are four big ones that I am heavily trading. I have a little bit of everything because to me I don’t know which one is going to take off and become the next next one to the moon. But not a lot but I do trade Bitcoin Aetherium polka dot and this is not advice by the way. Polygon Yes. Not financial advice, folks. Sorry, one more time

Erwin  

Bitcoin. Just a polka dot

Montu  

polka dot Aetherium of course and Paul I got those are my four favourites because they have a trading pattern that as you know, I have like a background in trading they have a trading pattern that I’ve discovered from technical analysis that mirrors, Bitcoin and Aetherium everything else is just sinks and makes a move on sensationalism, or rumour or hype. But these four there’s something also something about the technology I really like. It’s found it has a real world use. I also have a dark horse hedera I’ve looked into it, I think this one is dark, you spell it? I can’t spell it. But the symbol is h bar HB AR. The reason I like this one is it solves the problem that Bitcoin has the speed and the you know, transferring crypto assets across the world, it should be within seconds. And Hadera does that Bitcoin very slow according to today’s standards? I mean, it’s 2022. We should be I shouldn’t have to wait, you know, 2030 minutes for my funds to be sent to Australia. That’s how impatient I am. You know, back in the day, it would take 48 hours to send money to Australia. But now I want it done. Yeah, we’re in 60 seconds tops, and Hadera does that it’s, I think what these guys have come up with this brilliant, not financial advice, folks. Don’t buy too much of it. But I think that could be the next big one. And Aetherium I like Aetherium more than I like Bitcoin, just because of its real world use. And it’s got more that technology is better, in my opinion, of course. And because of the high gas fees, it has a diminishing supply. So the supply is going down. It’s not increasing. And of course they got some kind of merger going on coming up in September. We’ll see how that goes. But

Erwin  

yeah, can you share what percentage allocation of your portfolio flows?

Montu  

Well, let’s just say I only recently started digging going down the crypto rabbit hole. It’s been about a year, maybe less than a year. It’s been about a year. And I had a goal to have 10% of my net worth in crypto. I’ve decided to just because it’s untested and anything can go wrong. It could go to zero. I’m reducing that to 5%. So my portfolio is 5% Crypto 5% insurance. Little bit of gold gold is just what kind of insurance whole life dividend paying and and the rest real estate baby that’s real estate has been working for the last 14 years. So

Erwin  

there’s look at what everyone paid for anything. Funny. Side use the story. I have a friend who works for trial. He bought his for like 600 just high 600 per square foot Wow. years ago. And that’s the only one he bought like, man, you’re an insider. Right? You know, exactly. You have access to all their research in like when there’s no you know, I was just like everybody else because I’m not I’m not in that industry. right close to it. You know, when I hit $1,000 a square foot, like, you gotta be kidding me. Right? Everyone went nuts. Everyone went nuts. And there was a 1200 square foot for comparing to what you know where no one’s buying bat. Right.

Montu  

So we this, this spring and summer I was seeing resale condos selling for 1500 to 1700 square foot or they’re nicer places, right? They’re newer buildings. Of course, not the older stuff. But still it’s the resale. It’s not the new construction, new construction, we’re clocking in at 1700 square foot to start in downtown Toronto.

Erwin  

I heard some new stuff selling selling for 17. Yeah, we don’t know if it’s gonna get built.

Montu  

Well, that’s the thing is if they’re selling it for 17, that’s I think that’s reasonable with the cost of everything. And labour is very expensive now. So they have a chance of being completed. If you’re paying 1300 to 1700 per square foot for new construction, you’re safe, or I should say safe River, because you never know. But if you’re paying less than 1300 for new construction, it’s I think it’s a dice roll. Because how can they do it? It’s expensive, their construction loan, you know, they’re paying more interest on that loan. So you may not get built.

Erwin  

And then same timing for nutrition kind of when interest rates start going down again. Yeah, on spring,

Montu  

the good builders will keep doing a good job. Everyone else is going to be delayed by about a year or two

Erwin  

right now because some builders will want to protect their reputation it was build it somebody even built it for a loss. Yeah. Crazy. Good on them.

Montu  

Well, there’s there’s a storm coming. You know, there’s a big storm coming.

Erwin  

We’re talking before this, like the storm has been coming forever.

Montu  

There’s always a storm. You know, this one was just a bad one. And it’s not about waiting for the storm to pass. Right. It’s about learning to dance in the rain. And I think this is going to be what’s upcoming people are not, they’re not expecting it. And if you don’t learn how to thrive in the rain and still push forward and still have a way to get through, if you’re just waiting for interest rates to bottom out, you know, or I should say peak out and prices to bottom out, you’re not going to you’re not going to do anything very, very, you still have to be an active, active person. I always look like right now I’m pitching lowball offers, even though I don’t think the market has bottomed yet. I think we’re going lower. Because real estate is perfect. Yes.

Erwin  

Like people will take deals that are imperfect. Exactly. So that’s, that’s it?

Montu  

No look for the opportunity here.

Erwin  

Because because we were looking at a deal, for example, where the bank was gonna take back the property. So either take our deal, or you let the bank take control, or would you rather, right, right, you’re gonna be hammered legal fees from the bank. As soon as they take the start taking it back. It’s and you’ve lost complete control. Now. It’s no longer your house, you can’t do nothing. You have no power. Right? So choose, right. Is to us. To me, it was a fair offer, but oh, gee, Monty, we’re way over time. Okay. Let’s talk about your book. Oh, yeah.

Montu  

Let’s cover that real quick. So insider secrets to pre construction, condo buying, renting and selling for maximum profit. I wrote this book a couple years back, it’s when I was predicting a rise in the condo value when everyone else thought that condos aren’t going to be worth anything. So I just put my experiences and tips and tricks, not just about condos, but you know how to deal with your selling, when you have to buy pre construction, how to sell pre construction, assignment opportunities. There’s even a bit of a little bit about some Airbnb how to short term to a short term rental. In my book, it’s really for people who want a an insider’s experience in the condo investing world, and how to find opportunities, because not everything is a good deal. So I kind of outline like, what types of properties what type of condos to look for what type to avoid, how to get a good deal. What are immediate delivery condos, because sometimes builders, they have extra inventory that they’re paying to carry, and they’re eager to get rid of it. So you can go in there and making them an offer. So if they’re asking like, you know, 900k, you can come and say I’ll take it off your hand if you throw in a free parking spot for 800k. And sometimes they do that. I got a couple of deals like that actually,

Erwin  

are their deals available in the assignment market right now? I

Montu  

think, again, it’s about going against the grain, there’s going to be a lot of people selling assignments. So if there’s excess supply, where is the demand? Let’s

Erwin  

just back up and explain the assignment market. So you correct me if I’m wrong. So people who bought new construction, and for whatever reason, they’re they’re wanting to sell their contract, basically, without closing guess, right?

Montu  

Yeah, they want to hand over their contract to somebody else, that person steps into their shoes and closes with the builder directly. So there used to be that assignments were very profitable, because they’re on a rising market, right. And they’re very, very little units available. So people are just gobbling them up. But right now, I think a lot of people are worried and that they’re going to be trying to sell their unit via assignment. It’s it’s a great time to buy an assignment, because there’s very few buyers. So you will get a good deal. But it’s not a good time to sell an assignment. Because you’re just going to get lowball offers. That’s what we’re seeing, like had a couple assignment listings. And all we got were lowball offers, even though the value of the unit is very reasonable to what we’re asking. It just people are just coming in 200k under

Erwin  

alright, because did you get emotional? Receiving?

Montu  

No, I did. I was expecting it because I was that guy on the other side. Right.

Erwin  

So that’s just the most you’re willing to give and take, you know, if you’re gonna give it you’re willing to take it. Yeah, exactly. And then any update, cuz I haven’t really seen it in the news, weren’t there construction slowdowns? Like weren’t certain groups on strike?

Montu  

Yes, lots of supply issues. And then labour strikes. So all new construction condos being built were delayed by another couple of months. So I started to say all I would say like 80% Because every project that I had, in my own portfolio that’s coming up for delivery, every builder sent me a notice saying hey, we don’t know how long this strike is going to last we’re delayed, we’ll let you know. Do you know what they’re asking for in terms of like more money? More money less? I don’t know. not privy to that. Labour agreements.

Erwin  

I’m just curious because then that gives me an idea how much labour inflation will be realistic. So

Montu  

labour is the builders biggest expense. So they have concrete steel lumber all that to pay for but labour is 40% of their costs.

Erwin  

So your your to build Yes. 40% including way as part of the between the whole pie that’s what

Montu  

that’s what they tell me. Right? So I don’t see their books, but they’re telling me there’s land costs. They’re soft costs, there’s closing costs, there’s materials costs, but labour is 40%. You are paying. So if you’re buying something for 1,400,000 of that is to pay people to like and it’s not just your unit. Remember, they’re building the entire building. They’re building the elevators are building the amenities. They’re, they’re building the foundation, they’re building the garage, so yeah, stuff’s expensive, man.

Erwin  

That’s expensive. And that’s part of the reason why real estates indexed to inflation. Yes. All right. We can’t just import labour. We kind of tries to but even whatever imports still expensive, if it came here to make more money, then come here and make less money. Wow. Okay. mattoni. Any final words?

Montu  

Okay, people in time. If people want to get a free copy of my book, they can download it at Dylan Realty. systems.ca. If you spell that Dylan d h, I ll O. N real TRAALTY systems.ca.

Erwin  

And we’ll have that in the show notes, folks. So if you’re driving, it’s okay. Yeah. Well, the link in the show notes.

Montu  

And yeah, I wish people luck and fortune. Those who partner up with an expert are going to achieve their goals.

Erwin  

Yeah, especially fear. Because I talk to people all the time in real estate. And I find I often find they don’t really know much what’s going on as literally golfing with someone just this week. And they said to me, I know all these people who, who bought a property already. Now they can’t sell their home. And I’m like, well, they get some bad advice. Yeah, I certainly more What’s worse than that? Is like no one could predict this. And like, I told my clients Exactly. This could happen. Right, right. I told me this could exactly be in 2017. Again, yeah. Right. So the advice from my mouth to our clients was you know, in December, January, February, March, if your plan is to sell the next 12 months sell it now. Yeah. All right. That’s exactly what I told you. Take the risk off the table. Right. I bought a risk right. And I did a sort of the same thing by refinancing. I’m too scared to sell and miss out on the game. Yeah, for more on all sides. iPhone crypto, Bitcoin at 23 grand. Like David, I missed the 20.

Montu  

What do you think so what you’re doing my pleasure, always a pleasure hanging out with you around. If you need any other advice, and if you want to discuss what good projects are coming up, you know where to reach me.

Erwin  

I’ll be bugging you about where you can fit for golf clubs. Awesome. Take care.

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself with so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Building a 7 Figure, 100 Unit AirBNB Business By Age 27 With Avery Birch

Hello, Real Estate and Stock investors, AKA Wealth Hackers!

How’s your summer going? Best summer since 2019?  I hope so. 

Cherry and I are having a blast and have much to be grateful for.

One of our Accounting clients, Ajay Kahlon and Manpreet Hansra, the power couple, are tearing things up in the multifamily space. 

Everyone in Keyspire knows them. 

Well, they invited us to Sherkston Shore, a private summer resort of vacation properties on the beach, for fun in the sun and a catered BBQ dinner back at their house in the resort.

 
 
 
 
 
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A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

The day was awesome for many reasons. 

Other than hanging out outdoors, Cherry and I got to meet and network with some movers and shakers from the Keyspire community, real estate investors with 40-400 unit portfolios and growing.

I’m usually socially awkward at these types of events when I don’t know anyone, but we all had real estate in common, so it was cool to mix family, fun, business and learning.  

Hopefully, I wasn’t too prying with all my questions; I’m naturally inquisitive and firmly believe learning is through listening, not speaking, and getting invited to more Keyspire meetups… So much fun to learn, yet so little time.  

I hope you’re all maximizing your summer and time as it’s the most precious resource. 

Building a 7 Figure, 100 Unit AirBNB Business By Age 27 With Avery Birch

Seeing how much folks are travelling these days, a trend I expect to continue, how do real estate investors capitalize?  

Well, today, we just so happen to have an Airbnb expert who manages 100 doors for AirBNB use and only owns one of them, a 250-acre property he’s going to develop into a vacation resort. Wait till you hear the numbers; they will astound you!

I met Avery Birch at a conference in Quebec City a few months ago. Having real estate in common and 7-figure entrepreneurs, we connected right away.

Do you see what extent I go to to bring you, my 17 listeners, interesting guests?

Since covid restrictions loosened, I’ve really enjoyed getting back out there and networking with like-minded investors and entrepreneurs.  

If you’re looking for the next can’t-miss conference, you’ll want to save the date, Saturday, November 12th, all day for the Wealth Hacker Conference, live and in-person near the airport with plenty of free parking.  

We’ve hired speakers and sponsors for everything you need for your most efficient path to your financial goals so you may have more freedom with how you spend your time: building your own business, retirement, travel, etc.

After interviewing Avery, maybe I’ll diversify a bit into AirBNB because with all the experience Avery shares today in operating 100 Airbnbs, we get an insider’s look into which Airbnbs offer the highest returns, and it’s not what you think. 

Please enjoy the show. 

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Greetings everyone, real estate investors and stock investors, aka wealth hackers, as I like to call them, How’s your summer going? Best summer since 2019. I certainly help So Jerry and I are having a blast and have much to be grateful for one of our accounting clients AJ Callen and Manpreet Hendra superpower, a couple, I think, most know, AJ is retired engineer, and he went full time in real estate, and around the mid round, 2015 ish. And Manpreet is extremely popular real estate lawyer. She’s done some of our deals. We’ve referred her clients in the past. They are a super power couple, and they’re tearing things up in the multifamily space. No surprise there. Everyone in the spire knows them. They invited us to I don’t know why. They invited us as little plugs Jerry and I, my family and my kids. They invited us to search the shore, which is a private 500 property, summer resort, and they’re all vacation properties. So it’s a three season resort. None of these properties are winterized. Some of them are trailers, some of these are telling trailer park but a bit nicer a lot of these houses are quite nicely renovated, including AJ Manpreet, has quite nicely renovated their properties not quite on the beach, but we met on the beach, there is a beach within this rich summer resort for some fun in the sun, and a catered BBQ dinner back at their house, which is also within their resort. They’re celebrating their 10th anniversary, and party and style. Because it’s kind of like we’re partying like it’s 2019. With COVID restrictions a lot reduced, the entire thing is done outdoors. So that’s very nice. The day was awesome for many reasons other than of course hanging out doors. Cheering I get to meet and network with some movers and shakers from the keestrack community real estate investors with like as little as 40 doors to 400 doors and growing. Normally, I’m pretty socially awkward at these types of events, like regular, you know, regular like weddings and anniversary parties, where I don’t know anyone. But in this case, we all had real estate in common. So it was cool to mix. Family Fun. And kids are they’re going to beach and join the barbecue joints.

 

Erwin  

At this resort, and pretty much all the property owners own one or two golf carts. So my kids and I took a Jays actually is actually we took Manpreet Sacco cart, golf cart for a ride. It’s a bit nicer than your typical golf cart. Anyways, I posted on my Facebook, but it’s fun to combine family and fun and business and learning. Hopefully it wasn’t prying with all my questions. I asked a lot of these investors a lot of questions what they’re up to what are they seeing opportunity, as I’m naturally inquisitive, as you can probably tell from the show. And I firmly firmly believe that learning is through listening that speaking. That’s why you don’t see me speaking much and letting the people who know what they’re doing talk and hopefully I get invited Marquis buyer meetups, it was a lot of fun to learn a lot and so little time. Hopefully, you’re all out there maximising your summer in time, as time is your most precious resource. See how much folks are travelling these days to try and extract to continue? As I record Airbnb reports, their earnings today, it’s August 2, I imagine they’re going to kill it. And just from experience and talking to other Airbnb investors, they’re all pretty booked. So it sounds like yeah, travel travel is is hot these days and I expect the trend to continue. So how do real estate investors capitalise? Well today it just so happens we have an Airbnb expert who manages 100 doors for Airbnb use, and only owns one Wildling ones one of those properties. The other 99 are not owned by him. He manages them for other landlords. Avery actually recently bought a 250 acre property, he’s going to develop into a vacation resort, similar ideas where I was just talking about insurance in the shirts an example. But wait to hear the numbers. They will astound you. I’m at Avery birch at a conference in New Mexico just a few months ago, I was having real estate in common and being filled with seven figure entrepreneurs we connected right away. So we’ve been we’ve been texting we’ve been chatting our zoom booked with them I think tomorrow as well to just chat about some other business opportunities. But do you see what extent I go to to bring you my 17 listeners interesting guests. Every is definitely interesting. Ever since COVID, restrictions loosened. I’ve been enjoying going back to conferences and networking events with like minded investors and entrepreneurs. So if you’re looking for the next camp Miss conference, you’ll want to save the date, Saturday, November 12. All day for the wealth hacker conference live and in person, there’s no zoom option. There’s no virtual option near the airport with plenty of free parking, just go to www dot while hacker.ca for details. And also if you’re following me on social media or on my email list, you’ll see opportunities for no save money. We have promos running from time to time, but the truth about the conference pricing, the sooner you buy, the more you save, because the prices will just consistently go up until the date of the event. And if you’re one of those who likes the VIP experience, those tickets will sell out. So you probably wanna take advantage of cheaper prices and making sure you actually get a ticket so you avoid disappointment. We’ve hired speakers and sponsors for all the things that you need to be on the most efficient path to your financial goals. So you may have more freedom in your life, and how you spend your time to be building your own business or folio, to be retirement to be travel, whatever it is, you’re going to take away some have some takeaways from the conference wealth hacker.ca for details after interviewing Avery, maybe I’ll diversify into Airbnb a bit because with all the experience every shares today and operating 100 Airbnb s, we get an insider’s look into what which property style. For me, Airbnb offers the highest return, including what every avoids. And also he shares a story about how he identified properties to start managing for, especially for younger investors out there who don’t have a lot of capital. Again, Avery does not own the vast majority of the properties he manages. So he actually gives some tips on how he got started. And I don’t see why anyone and young hustler cannot do the same. Please enjoy the show. 

 

Erwin  

Hi Avery what’s keeping you busy these days. 

 

Avery  

What keeps me busy running a skid steer, building roads that are new property. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, I’m cityfolk explain what that means. 

 

Avery  

I am running this piece of equipments to build roads, because in 11 days, we have our grand opening for our adventure getaway resort. I don’t know if the video is clear, but got about 300 acres of wilderness and a lake and trying to get people in to see it. 

 

Erwin  

Alright, so the shameless plug, we do have a YouTube channel, folks. So if you want to see every we are doing this video, and Avery’s background is stunning. So check it out on our YouTube channel as well. So every what it is in your background. 

 

Avery  

So what we’re looking at behind me is I’m standing on the peak of a mountain overlooking a lake. And we’re looking at Raw Nova Scotian wilderness is about 40 minutes away from the main city and just untouched forest. What we’re trying to promote get people outdoors. 

 

Erwin  

Sounds amazing. Okay, so we are Canadians. Everybody that listens to this show. What’s the main city Halifax? What is it? 

 

Avery  

Yeah, we’re based out of Halifax, Nova Scotia. 

 

Erwin  

And I love Halifax. It’s funny, because like when talking to people, oh, we’re asking people about travel, like, Oh, I’m going to Nova Scotia. And like, that’s very much like leaving the country it’s like from from Ontario. It is it’s very different colours are totally different, like car stop for pedestrians. 

 

Avery  

That is it’s funny. We’re trained at a very young age to do that. And so that’s why it keeps working. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah. And so yeah. Again, I love Nova Scotia, I love vibe. So we got introduced through a mutual friend at a conference. So we both members of entrepreneurs organisation, for those who don’t know, just stating facts, and I hate to brag about anything, members of entrepreneurs organisation are required to have a seven figure business US dollars. So that’s a million dollars of revenue US per year. And every built the master pretty sizable, real estate business. Can you tell us more about it? 

 

Avery  

Absolutely. We’ve been operating for about five and a half years at this point. And over the course of this time, and through a pandemic, we’ve become the number one and the largest air b&b operator in Nova Scotia, in Atlantic Canada. And along the way, we’ve now grown to have 100 different properties under our management’s and we’ve got about a staff of 20 people that run the show. Now we’re growing into developing, which is why I’m standing on the peak of a mountain because it’s the only way to get cell service, but we’ve moved from managing and to creating. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, so we’ll get into the development because I want to get into it. But I want to know, folks understand how you would dig into managing 100 different properties. So you own all these properties. 

 

Avery  

We don’t own any of the properties. I’m one of them. Well, we just got one. Wonderful 100 Okay, got it. Yeah, no, we don’t own anything. We have either management contracts with the people who own the spaces, or we’ll take on commercial leases in the right zoned areas and turn them into essentially a boutique hotel. But we’re essentially catering to people that come into the city for seven days to 20 days. That’s our typical. 

 

Erwin  

So what’s gets gets covered in the news is often you know, we’re a tenant, like a regular tenant will sign a lease for the landlord. And then without the owner knowing the operating Airbnb, is that what you accomplished? You duped 100 homeowners into renting out to you and you convert them into Airbnb? 

 

Avery  

I wish I was that interesting. No. Yeah, I hear that story a lot. To get our very first property I would say I wasn’t very exact with what my intentions were. However, once So I had that one, I could point to it for all the ones to come and say, Look, we’re successful. This is what I plan to do, please let me do this. And then later, I’ve become very close friends with the person who gave us the very first property. So we’re all good. But yeah, it was a it was an interesting start. And then from there, we’re 100%. aboveboard, and landlords love us because we are just super, super diligent. So we treat their spaces, like nobody else does. sort of funny. 

 

Erwin  

What’s the terminology for this? There’s all these new terms like house hacking, for example, I only learned like two years ago. Is there a common term for this? 

 

Avery  

Yeah, in in the short term rental space called Master lease. So you Google that master lease, short term rentals, you can learn all sorts of things about it. Essentially, we get a lease furnish rent for a markup, we’re catering to clientele that need to be in for different things that a year. Interesting. 

 

Erwin  

Okay. Okay, just to put out a joke because it’s in my head, I have to say it is in real estate here. Master bedroom is no longer the master bedroom. So that’s the principal or the primary bedroom. So maybe, maybe you and I here, we’ll we’ll start the term primary lease. Funny, James, yeah, let’s do it. He managed to start promoting it. We have primary leases. And then you’ll coined the terms. 

 

Avery  

I sort of like that, like in pitch and saying, Yeah, we’re the primary lease holder. And here’s what we do. That’s great. Thank you probably like that. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, it’s very politically correct. Because we’re inclusive on this show. The capitalist socialist, we love them all here. As much as him today. What is the typical property is their typical property? Are you talking about apartment buildings? 30 units are you talking about like single family homes that on you know, on Main Street, Halifax,

 

Avery  

Anything go? The only one that we don’t touch is condos. Some cities as we’ve looked to scale out our condo cities and some cities, our apartment cities, for instance, Calgary is primarily condos and Halifax is primarily apartments, they’re completely flipped of each other. So well touch apartments will touch single family will touch duplexes, basically anything but condos is everything. And they each have different things we looked at, and we’ve got tools that we’ve analysed, but every different property has a different strategy. And what we start seeing over time is that different properties, they only have only so many buckets that we fit into. So once we’ve developed the strategy for X, when we see x come along, again, we just rinse and repeat. Yeah, I think that’s a good answer to that. 

 

Erwin  

Tell me about Okay, so what would you do like a regular single family home? And a Suburban? Or actually, do you have a preference? Do you prefer a more urban setting, or suburban or rural, or you probably have a model for each, don’t you? 

 

Avery  

Yeah. It’s in different growth cycles of the business where the preference has changed. At this point. In our lifespan, we’re now looking for very unique combinations, something that we can truly put our mark on, and no one else can duplicate. In the past, we’ve really focused on commodity I think Airbnb fell into two buckets, commodity, and once or niche. So for a commodity, there’s no brand loyalty, except to Airbnb or VRBO, the platform, but that we’re a brand within a brand. There’s no loyalty for commodities, people need to be in the city, therefore, it will stay busy supply just always comes, it never stops. Unless there’s a pandemic, then we’re gonna get scrappy, or niches and once like what we’re building, it’s not a commodity. People don’t need to be here, they will wants to be here. Therefore, loyalty means people come back, because it’s unique. So there’s two buckets that we really look at. I don’t know how he got here. But fun fact, 

 

Erwin  

That’s just a good point. But the journey like you didn’t know what the journey would look like from the beginning. 

 

Avery  

No. One, like, let’s get five. Let’s get 25. Let’s get to 50. And then before you knew it, okay, I think the idea of what we’re doing now, 

 

Erwin  

Interesting, other than condos, is there any other property style that you don’t want, 

 

Avery  

There’s no style, it doesn’t work. It just comes down to working with your neighbours and the rules on the environment. So condos have the most challenging environments, therefore, we don’t even look at it. There’s so much opportunity that there’s no need for us to ever spend time there. You can you can run a condo it just takes extra work that we don’t want to do. 

 

Erwin  

Right? Yeah, cuz it’s, I live near Toronto. So it’s a big, it’s all condo people want to do it, but it’s because they want they can’t cashflow otherwise, but then your neighbours are not happy. 

 

Avery  

Yeah, it’s it’s extra work. Whereas in the park building, it goes through the management and they make a call. So when we come in and build a great relationship, we’re there won’t take. And we’re starting to get into a situation where we’ve asked to say we’ll take a whole floor. And that keeps it nice and separate versus an apartment building next door can be frustrating. So getting addition of doing a whole floor or a whole building, got it, the game changer total game changer, then we have complete oversight. And it’s really helps. 

 

Erwin  

That makes a lot of sense. Because for example, if I’m on a guy’s trip, and we know we’re going to be rowdy, we’ll ask the hotel when we book our rooms to be put in a section where no one else is. You’re trying to do the same thing you’re trying to isolate. That’s a great idea, right? I’m an empathetic person, right? When I want my sleep, I want my sleep, I don’t want to be disturbed. So please put us somewhere where we’re not going to bother anyone else. 

 

Avery  

And if you said that to us, we would know exactly where to put you. No one ever says that that’s actually very polite, 

 

Erwin  

At least a checkbox you put in like you’re putting in maybe one of your forms. We do you need a place where you can be loud. four acre property where the the nearest neighbours half a mile away. 

 

Avery  

Oh, I’m gonna add that’s incredible. You need to be loud. There’ll be a checkbox. 

 

Erwin  

And maybe just be a group that you like, oh, sorry, we have nothing for you. Quiet or network? It’s like a filter for like parties that you know. So you don’t want them? Actually, can you do cater for party? Do you have any options for that?

 

Avery  

We don’t, it’s not our bread and butter. And some of our research along the way. We found some really cool spaces that do. And they can charge a premium. The one that I’ll never forget, as I saw one in Montreal when we were looking at growth there. And it said party pad and, and like the walls were stainless steel and the rest was tile. It looked like at the end of each reservation, they came in with a friggin pressure washer. And just spray the whole place that like it like it was expensive. But it was like it was geared for parties. It’s like a bachelor pad place. I don’t know if Halifax would support that. Maybe just not a bread and butter. 

 

Erwin  

And then this seems like a pretty hot topic or hot button issue for people to who are avoiding doing short term rentals. And then also always, it often makes headlines as well. How do you prevent it? And when I’m trying to find party? I mean like excessive drinking, excessive substance abuse, excessive noise and property damage, of course. Yeah, sure, sure. But I’m talking about like, you know, five people having a beer watching hockey night in Canada. disrespecting disrespecting the state. Yeah, yeah, actually, as literally on the golf course. Yesterday, I was asked on the golf pro about they ever have problems. Yeah, we call the cops like, what are people doing? Excessive drinking, reckless driving with the golf carts. These things happen. 

 

Avery  

I think it depends on the location, we’re mostly focused around commodity. At this point, we’re just starting to build out niche. I suspect we’re gonna have more of that, now that we’re diving into that market. But if it was a golf course, that to me is not commodity that is niche. So probably more people have means that want to have parties will probably go versus on the commodity side. It’s because people need it, they’re not going on a party, they might be relocating moving into the country there temporarily as a student, very few people come to our spaces to just have a weekend away, only in peak season. But there’s two things that really keep parties are people who disrespect the space away price and minimum stay requirements. That was a game changer. When we’ve had we’ve had problems in the past. There’s got to be at least one. And it’s almost like clockwork, but I think we might have snapped the habit. It was like once once every year for four years in a row was a bagel, drug party. And we’d have to go and it’s like, it was like clockwork, yeah, there it is. All right, do the thing. We got used to it, but never any damage, very respectful people in Nova Scotia, they just wanted to have their time. However, they became loud and disruptive. So we had to kick them out. There’s rules around that if you wanted to dive into that subject, but you can get bring the police in, they’re not actually a tenant. So they’re a guest in your house means you can forcibly remove them, etc, etc. So there’s mitigation. But why that happens over and over and over was price. It was in the winter, when we were most eager to get bookings. And we lowered the floor too low. And that allowed it to be something attractive for let’s say, if the space was $100 You know, for people chip that is 25 bucks. So don’t be the lowest priced in the market. It’s not it’s just not 

 

Erwin  

That’s actually wonderful advice. 

 

Avery  

That’s the biggest takeaway. 

 

Erwin  

And that’s pretty much all you need to do the screen 

 

Avery  

Yeah, price in there’s other things too. Okay. Another one other big screening test. think that our managers use is if someone is reserving a space within our city limits, like if it says they’re from Halifax? Well, they better give us a good reason as to what they’re doing. And we’ll actually meet them on checking, just to make sure the argument or anybody else is not from Halifax. It’s all automated check in. You’re coming here from Arkansas, you know, you probably need to be here. But if you’re if you’re from Halifax for one weekend, and like, I don’t know, I don’t think we believe you. So that’s a very small percentage. But those those two things price and anyone in the local area meet on check in and if they’re carrying bottles of vodka, and we’ve actually caught people in the process and say, no, no, you’re not doing it, you can cancel and give your money back. Just leave. Okay. 

 

Erwin  

And there’s no recourse for them to like, leave like a one star review or something like that. 

 

Avery  

They know what they mean. Sure, anybody can do that. But in these scenarios, people know what they’re doing. They’re having a party, anything that people who have had party, other spaces have lived the best reviews because they felt that which is sort of funny. Hey, we know we were really ridiculous to deal with. So you did great five stars. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, I think there’s a Nova Scotia thing. I don’t think it’ll happen Ontario. 

 

Avery  

It’s East Coast hospitality. I think.

 

Erwin  

That’s hilarious. It’s funny, because I booked an Airbnb for Ottawa recently. And I know I understand their concern. So they ask the audio in town for like, I’m here. I’m coming from from Toronto, with my living staying with my wife, my videographer, and we’re here for business, taking some meetings. You know, I’m 40 plus years old. Feel free to Google my name. You know, I’m not a partier. I didn’t say that. Right. I didn’t say I’m not a partier. I think that’s probably a red herring. 

 

Avery  

Or something I just thought of. And one thing that’s always stuck with me, for anybody who’s listening that wants to get into the Airbnb space, or was already in it, and has had a very unfortunate booking where people have been disrespectful, the percentage of that happening is so small. Anybody who’s experienced that as an individual property owner, or maybe two, it’s just, it’s just bad chance that roll the dice because we’ve got 100 units, we have one incident in your 99% just fine. So like 99.5% Fine. So anybody who gets one stays just truly unlucky. 

 

Erwin  

This is all fascinating. Okay, if you don’t know how much time you have, I have a lot more questions. I’ll ramble. Okay, question around management, then. Have you ever had a short term person stay in cause damage, and you’ve had to go back to them to get money? 

 

Avery  

Yeah, it’s always small things never anything big. And you just do it through the resolution centre, Airbnb, though, they’ll cover it, you’ll always get it somehow. The larger the cost, the more annoying you have to follow up with Airbnb, but it’s all quite easy. And when it comes back, this might take some time. 

 

Erwin  

Maybe it’s a cultural thing. I’m just impressed how little problems you’ve had, or it’s just good screening. 

 

Avery  

I, I don’t know when you probably do have problems. I’ve just I’ve built a good team. We’ve got good processes, and we’re just diligent, so it might just be Halifax is a very special place. Yeah. It’s pretty smooth, very smooth. 

 

Erwin  

For someone looking to start a to say the same wants to do Airbnb their own property. What do they need to start with? 

 

Avery  

Find a place that is absolutely fine to places. dishevelled that is not nice that is not put together but no, seriously. The places that are nice means there’s demand means the landlords have power and why would they trust you places that are just shovelled means they’re not in demand. And if you come along, making an offer, let’s actually get looked at and typically place people who have to shovel places or small mom and pop landlords that you can actually have a conversation with the decision maker. So grab a dishevelled spot for a low rent, and then paint it. We used to not paint spaces because I don’t think I’d get the cost out of there. But you sign say, hey, I want a two year lease on this spot. You can get the value back from that painting. So painted, decorated really well celebrated works in your listing, and you’ll make the best margin and you’ll be able to get your foot in the door right away. Do not go premium to start I made that mistake. 

 

Erwin  

I think I’ve made that mistake too. By everybody was nice. 

 

Avery  

My very first face was dishevelled but we quickly after thought we need to go premium. So I did start with the dishevelled space and then looking back at it. That was the best decision now we do it time and time again we look for places that are not perfect. Because we get a good deal. We have a good conversation and it just goes longer now will sound like five year lease. someplace, 

 

Erwin  

Right, but I’m thinking whether the dishevelled place like, the landscaping will likely need a lot of work as well. And that’s something you’ll take care of a typical dishevelled property, especially rental properties. And this is why neighbours often don’t like rental properties is the light, like, for example, the landscaping has been taken care of. So that’s something you’d take care of as well take care of it. 

 

Avery  

Our goal is, we never want to talk to the landlord, we run the property as if it was our own. So we’ve got we’ll bring in landscaping, bring in all the cleaning, we’ve got our own maintenance, like if we’ve got a problem, we just deal with it. And then after the fact that here’s some stuff we’ve paid for, and we get some of this back. No, well, all right, we make the margin we need and to serve as our customers, it’s a cost of doing business. That’s how this up for a while it’s it’s not looking at who I was what, just at the end of the day, this is the business, we have the space to maintain it. If it cost us it’s unfortunate, but the margin is still plenty, 

 

Erwin  

Just to clarify, is looking for to show a property are you still looking for in good neighbourhoods? 

 

Avery  

Ah, whatever the data supports, neighbourhood doesn’t matter. Right? Okay, there’s a there’s a customer for every neighbourhood.

 

Erwin  

This is cool. Like he every I find a lot people meet again, myself, I’m I my decisions are largely data driven, versus people are largely emotional motional decisions like, again, like I have a realtor business, I’ve worked with people on the ground, and I’m showing people invest in properties. And people will say, I don’t like the kitchen, I don’t think this is a good investment property. Right? Something something like that. I don’t like the colour of the countertop, and like, but they don’t understand, like, you’re not the customer, you’re not the one who’s gonna be renting it, I know you’re buying it, you aren’t a customer that way. But your your audience for the for who’s gonna be paying you rent, right? 

 

Avery  

So they should be looking at the numbers versus how the kitchen is spit out. That’s yeah, they’re not the one buying the kitchen. 

 

Erwin  

Exactly every piece of real estate ever I ever look at or recommend to a client is because it’s it’s all data driven decision, all I see is ones and zeros and dollar signs. Right? I don’t care about anything else. Like it. Obviously, there’s soft parts of it, like how I judge a quality safe neighbourhood with nice neighbours and stuff like that. But again, all I see dollar signs behind that is I don’t know if it’s a nice neighbourhood scenario, nice school and get more rent. So again, it comes down to $1. Figure. 

 

Avery  

So there is a platform for that, that we use that anybody listening, listening, who hasn’t looked it up, just make data driven decisions. There’s a company called Air DNA, we’ve all used it. If you haven’t use it, I should get some promo from this company. I’ve recommended them to everybody. But it’s the only way you make decisions, you just literally can type in the address. And it will spit out comparables, it’ll show you a seasonality chart tells you exactly how much you’re gonna make by making this type of listing. So just you run the cost this much will make this much. Here’s the neighbourhood. Okay. And your work? 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, I’ve used air DNA as well, or dna.co. So erdene.co is a great for that as well. I paid for it as well. So I’ve used it fully. I actually find it pretty helpful. Just even just go look at to serve your neighbourhood for me. VRBO and to see what kind of availability they have as well. 

 

Avery  

Yeah, and it’s funny you can you can surf and see how much your neighbour is making on their property because it tells you it scrapes the data and says this property is making this much funny when you can see oh, no, I know our neighbours making 70 grand on their basement suite. Interesting. Interesting. Fun to know. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah. And then, obviously, the term the marketing terms hack, I’ll dig into why they get more rent than I do. I’ll go through their listing and understand try to understand what features they have. And maybe that’s why they get more rent than I do. For example, your friend of mine. He has vacation properties in Niagara Falls, and his his niche his go to strategies hot tubs. Yeah. All right. That sounds good all on Tom’s, I believe he said that his properties get double the rental income of properties that don’t have hot tubs within his own portfolio. So he’s you better believe he’s getting a hot tub for every property even though it means his maintenance costs go up, his cleaning costs go up. But the rents are more than covered. 

 

Avery  

That’s actually a strategy of vacation. The world’s largest short term rental manager. They have a hot tub programme, where if you want a hot tub it your stays, they will pay for it cashflow it, and take it off your monthly earnings until it’s paid for. So they know how well hot tubs work that they’ll put their money where their mouth is and they’ll buy it and then you pay it back. increases revenue by 30% on average. 30% Wow. Market dependent Yeah, it was also steady but hot tubs which ones do the best and near colder areas, mountains and activity doesn’t make the same effect in a city or hot places of course. So if he’s in the mountains, the absolutely like if you’re at a ski if you’re at a ski hill and you’re like a hot tub isn’t SVP of activity called M mountains. So it’s not triple whammy. 

 

Erwin  

I have this FOMO issue. I feel I feel like I’m just questions I’m not asking. I’m sure my listeners really have a full, full of questions as well. And David asked this question, 

 

Avery  

Then travelling with some of the really hard part is done some of the hardest ones that you will learn anywhere else. No, actually ever, ever, ever, ever did. 

 

Erwin  

To me. It’s a ridiculous story. So I just got back from Belleville, which is like, to me the vibe was like Niagara than the lake east of Toronto, right? We rented out a shack, they literally called the The Shack, they were very transparent what it was. And when we got to the property, my friend booked it. So I had no idea I was finding out when I saw the property. So it was actually the original house on the property. They’ve since the owners have since built a beautiful custom home, it’s probably over 3000 square feet with a pool and beautiful head of another house on the property as well. That was probably the second house that was built on the property. We’re living in the original. I was on the property tiny, it being called really as a one plus one one bedroom. And the attic was finished and had four bedrooms, the place including the attic, under 700 square foot for sure. As the kitchen has a bathroom, low ceilings, whatever. We paid $460 for the night. Literally a shack. 

 

Avery  

It’s amazing what will go if the value is there. I don’t know what the value. But you had a shack in the woods that is a customer Hey, work for you. 

 

Erwin  

And for that market, there was nothing else that was actually the last property available at market. It was just there. Nothing else specifically, it’s just Prince Edward County. So there was nothing else the demand was just that high. Because like Niagara on the Lake is the weekend. I stayed at a hotel the night before all the hotels were sold out. The vacation demand was just that crazy. So it wasn’t like actually spectacular, but it was more so supply driven. That’s what I would say. I think some people would think that’s a nice experience. When I saw the place like, yes, we’re in the middle of the country, the lake is you know, 100 metre walk away. Right? But when I first started like, you know, let’s go back to the hotel, just by the highway. But again, I’m not their target customer, obviously. But they got their money. So I’m very impressed get on them. I’m a social capitalist. So you got that money get on you. You are in debt. You are in debt. Like I don’t feel robbed by any means. If this is the last place available to rent, you burned it. All right. I don’t know what my point was. But there’s to your point about niche. I actually think some people would have liked this experience like a rustic experience. And like for example, I want my kids to like the cottages my my kids see these days are all a fully renovated. It’s not like for my generation when When did I friend’s cottage is when I was growing up? You know, the shock and awe of it? Yeah, like for example, the walls between bedrooms wouldn’t go all the way to the roofline, right? Oh, yeah. That’s whatever. Right? You know, I mean, so there’s basically no division between rooms really, you can hear everything. You know, I mean, that was my that was my context for cottages. You know, they’re not winterized. Like the heating is done through a wood stove. There is no gas furnace, there is no air conditioning. Am I right? Is there a market there is a market for this experience 

 

Avery  

Making a big comeback pandemic ignited it’s and it was strong before. So what makes going anywhere, but it puts tremendous pressure on the space, local travel and whatnot. But that’s what we’re doing. We’re we’re building these tiny, you think 700 square feet small. We’re doing 200 hanging, just to get away in the woods. Our nightly rate is much less to get away.

 

Erwin  

Okay, yes. Tell us about the development are your 200 square foot. What? 

 

Avery  

Oh, cabinets. It’s a small cabin. winterized. It’s got a propane stove on the inside. Right off of the lake comes with hot tub comes with hiking trails, or wheeling. It’s just it’s an adventure getaway. So it’s not so much the space and the size of the space that matters. It’s what value does the person get for being there? One thing that inspired me for just how simple things can be is I once read the story five years ago that someone built an igloo. And what’s the park in New York again, the main one central park, Central Park, they built an igloo in Central Park, put it on Airbnb for $16 a night. And they had customers it sold out instantly. It’s like, Oh, that’s great. It’s you could do any anything. They took snow from a park that wasn’t theirs. And they said come on in. We’re open for business. That’s amazing. So we got shut down after a week but you know, they made 600 bucks. So there we go. Great. It’s again, it’s not the space. It’s the Experience, space is just a vessel to have the experience. We’re building tiny combinations, building glamping accommodations, like Safari tents with really nice furnishings, nice stove inside. And what it comes down to is all the amenities that we get. So our turnkey costs for Safari tent is around 5500 set up, and then in peak season, they will turn out 4040 500. So basically pays itself off in about 40 days, retirement, right. And then the rest is product. So we can invest that profit into the property and the amenities. And that’s what we’re doing here. It’s essentially a place for people to get out of the city, unwind, kick back, relax, and then get back to do what they do best. So try to peel back the onion and prove people’s life. 

 

Erwin  

This is wild. Because again, you have because why I want to talk to you just again, you have a large data sample to draw from to make your decisions and to share on the show with our listeners are 17 listeners. Yeah, no one listens to the show. By the way. I don’t know why you drink. What do you decide to come on? I just like talking to you. So you could have done anything. And this is what you’ve chosen to put your own your own money into. Yeah, you start off you started off pretty early in the podcasting. Like you want you want Unique and this sounds very unique. And there’s no ski hill, nothing like that. It is just like that’s coming in your screens. Sorry. You’re saying go build a ski hill. 

 

Avery  

It’s gonna be one run, it’s gonna be just for me. But yes, buildings. We’re gonna pump from that lake and put the water onto this. And then go snowboarding. But just for me 

 

Erwin  

What I mean just for you, okay, so your your intake, your ATV up the hill are tearing it up the hill. 

 

Avery  

I’ve seen these things on YouTube where people can, I can make an electric winch setup for like 5000 bucks, you can pull me up. I don’t need a lift. I don’t need a fancy tow rope. I just need a motor and a pulley. And then you’re done. So I $1,000 I can get up there. 

 

Erwin  

We’ll just be able to use this. 

 

Avery  

Yeah, once we work the safety part out because I don’t think $5,000 winch is very safe. So maybe, maybe we’ll invest a bit more but it’s starting for me. And then soon yes, we’re doing a Nordic Spa here. We’re doing rock climbing, skiing, all sorts of things. 

 

Erwin  

Nordic Spas are like really hot here. 

 

Avery  

Like everywhere, everywhere. So the one secret sauce that we’re looked at is not exposed kill it happens in the woods kill it. And activity arcs kill it. Why aren’t all these three things in one place? We’re doing sounds like it’s gonna be like a bachelorette Haven. Oh, yeah. So you held your whole and Bakmi real Why am I bringing this up? Well serve all kinds of people, people who want private we can put over there. And people who want not private can go over there. This is this is this is huge. It’s like 300 acres over here. Looks like a screensaver back to the checkbox and said do you want noise? Yes, you want no and no. 

 

Erwin  

One thing that drives you bonkers but nor exposes you have Be quiet. Yeah, so actually going to what’s called a banya. I’ve never been to one of these before. I’m going to pick up some Russian thing. Apologies for my ignorance the listeners might have one of our 17 listeners actually knows what I’m talking about. But yeah, like the Russian spa, where you are allowed to talk and socialise and even have an adult beverage like sauna in and like hot and cold treatments whenever. And then my own experience. I’ve been calling Collingwood in Ontario, which is the private best ski is the biggest public ski resort in Ontario. It’s a massive bachelorette destination is Blue Mountain. Yes, Blue Mountains, a massive bachelorette destination in the summer. And the wishes are off season because the Nordic Spas and quote unquote, mountains that’s Ontario. It’s not it’s not mountains, like out east or west or Alberta. But yeah, it’s mountains. And yeah. And it’s it’s an hour from the city, but they draw and they charge ridiculous amounts of money and they’re busy. Yeah. So I imagined that can’t be the same for you.

 

Avery  

You know, there’s actually really, you’re totally right. And thank you. This is a fun. There’s this conversation around reoccurring revenue. Building a business around reoccurring revenue is the smartest way to build a strong company. And for the longest time, I started searching everywhere else to think how can I have a company that has recurring and someone made it evidently aware to me that we do have a reoccurring revenue business, but it only really gets activated in the niche part, not the commodity part. Because we built the space that is accommodating, affordable, and people keep coming back over and over and over. So with that knowledge we’ve considered maybe we had a subscription or something but Airbnbs can be reoccurring. revenue, which is an incredible investment. 

 

Erwin  

Fascinating. And then Okay, so for the novice explain, why not just build your own platform, have your own website and do all your bookings on your own on your own e business business whenever. Versus why would why would you host on Airbnb like, for example, what is Airbnb? What do you have to pay? What do you have to pay to Airbnb? 

 

Avery  

Airbnb bills the customer, not the host. And unique way that we don’t really feel it. But they’re marking it up 10 to 14% sort of theory, no explanation, but we never see it. So it doesn’t feel it doesn’t hurt. We don’t see it. We don’t hear it. We don’t feel it. So I just don’t, it doesn’t even happen. Other booking platforms like booking.com bills, the house. So we actually get an invoice saying, hey, this money, it feels different. Airbnb did something right in their design, that it’s a no brainer. And for the novice, the big lesson, I learned years back that led to my growth to come here was sell in bulk. Don’t sell individually, you’re going to spend the same amount of time might as well sell in bulk. Airbnb is the world’s largest platform, Wi Fi. I’m not trying to win that race. So work with them. Well, let’s do better. 

 

Erwin  

And what was your experience with the other platforms like VRBO, for example? 

 

Avery  

Yeah, we started on Airbnb natively. And afterwards wanted to bring another business depends on what their DNA again gets the demographics of where the buyers are coming from. Most buyers in Canada are Airbnb, the largest holding of VRBO is us. And booking.com is European. So depending upon what customers are coming to your market, you might want to consider those two channels from our experience. So we went through setting up on booking and VRBO and Expedia and these other ones, it really became so clear why Airbnb became a unicorn. They made it easy. And the others made it unfortunately, complicated for no reason. No reason. So that’s the difference. Airbnb is just effortless. And that’s why it took off. 

 

Erwin  

So okay, I have a lot of questions. There’s actually a question I miss. Apologies for coming back to it. So for your business, I’m sure people who want to start this business I’m sure they’re wondering, how do I convince a homeowner property owner to rent to me? That’s a good one. Like what kind of shirt use do you give them? Like? Because again, I’m sure the same people have read the same headlines. You know, see, you want to Airbnb you want to do? What’s my property? It’s gonna be bachelor parties and your people puking throwing the tech to the window, kinda like all those stories to get around student rentals as well. 

 

Avery  

That’s, uh, I actually coach someone on on that question. It’s really anything that you can offer is going to help you’re going after the disabled space is the best way because you’re gonna get your foot in the door. It’s all about getting your foot in the door. When we want when we see a listing that we like, well message, say I love the space. And like I said, the viewing in person, you do the pitch, you don’t do the pitch before you meet otherwise, you’ll never get the space. And we don’t say Hey, I like your listing, can I Airbnb? It would answer that, I don’t know, right? So anyway, love the space would love to love to view it, then you’re there you meet and say, hey, you know, this will actually do really well for what I’m looking for. And here’s what we do. I can say what we do now, because we’ve got that. But once you have one space, you can point back to it and have success. So getting the first one, it just requires a little bit of grit and cool offer that a friend of mine came up with for him starting was huge offer, like I can pay you six months in advance rent right now. And I was like, oh, that’s clever. So having the ability to do a heck of an offer. Yeah. So like, you want to get your first space, make an offer, they can’t turn down and call it marketing. Because every space after that is going to be a lot easier because you can point to saying I’m successful. And I’m going to do it again. Versus in the beginning. I don’t know what I’m doing because I have this. It’s the bad pitch. So six months up front was one thing and see money talks in real estate. So if you can put more down up front, it’s fine. You just gotta believe and you’ll make it back. And then if you don’t have that money to put down, it’s really talking about character. It’s like, this is my job. I have stable income. I want to create a side hustle and get into property management. I’ve made a surefire plan. Here’s my steps. This is why this space works. I’d love to have it and then you just have a conversation. It’s just negotiation, you’ll get turned down four to five times. But the fifth one just look at five places. Four to five, I think as the fifth place so it’s not like KFC you didn’t thinking 1000 pitches at the time. Yeah, so it’s much better than that. Yeah. 

 

Erwin  

So as the 100 Proper 100 properties Under doors, how many clients do you have are some of them bigger, and they have a sizable portfolio or a lot of these, like, Mom and Pop landlords like one, three properties. 

 

Avery  

It’s mostly Mom and Pop. But then we started working, we started working with small to mid size property management companies. And at this point, we have organic referrals because we do a good job and are accountable. So what’s actually happened on our side is just kept showing up. Number one rule of entrepreneurship just kept showing up, and they’d start sending us spaces. Hey, this one just come up came online, do you want it? So we’ll get first kick at the can because we are reliable. They always pay. We always maintain it, and they don’t hear a peep. So we’re like their outsourced management company. It’s just easier to rent to us. 

 

Erwin  

Okay, that’s fascinating. So apartment management, wants you as a repeat tenant, scalable repeat tenant, and they still they still get paid their regular, 

 

Avery  

I get paid, they get paid, they can start cutting back on their service request, because we’re taking care of most of the just because we have to it’s like a nature of the base. Like we’ll work with them. And we’ll we’ll offload as much as we can to save money. But at the end of the day, if I’m looking at $100 Night reservation for two weeks coming up, and I’ve got a plumbing issue. No, that’s getting planted today. So well, yeah, they like us. Because exactly they they like us, because we run their property, they just forget it exists. So that’s why we keep getting more spaces. Oh, wow. Fascinating, right? It’s so simple. 

 

Erwin  

It’s so fascinating. And there’s another question I’ve missed is are you worried about or any of these areas? Do you have issues with legislation? Like you see my posts on Facebook, I highly recommend everyone like my Facebook and see me Duff doing watch he does golf balls. In in Ontario, we have a lot of issues around lashes, a lot of condos, and then national we’re seeing a lot of municipalities now, banning short term rentals. London was the was the latest case where I can recall of one is not allowed to rent out their property in less than 30 days. Are you seeing that in your market? Or do you have any concerns? Can you still operate in that environment

 

Avery  

That’s coming down the pipeline, there are certain neighbourhoods like what it really comes down to his only issues come from respecting neighbours, like that is where all the push comes from. So there’s certain properties we have in certain neighbourhoods that we’ve just flipped to do 30 Day minimums. And all all this regulation we see around the world, when I keep repeating to people that ask this only affects things under 30 days. And the reason why is because if you look at the Tenancy Act in your province, it states how many days sublet can exist in a sublet is anything after 30 or more days. So there was never any rules written or anything below it. And that’s why they’re all being written now. So if you have someone for 30 days, or plus, it’s already written into the provincial and federal code from decades ago, it’s not going to change very quickly. So that even might get bumped around. And coming years after they push all the everyone to 30 day minimums, then we might address that as well. But that’s our strategy. So we really focus on getting those longer term reservations. People that come to stick around 30 days or 45, when we have some properties in downtown commercial zones, and if they want to come in and say no Airbnbs over a commercial operator, this is a commercial property. And here’s our commercial lease. So this is what we do. We host people that the end of the day regulations are only impacting areas that are zoned for residential that are being flipped in the Airbnb is because the neighbours are annoyed. All it is. And we look for commercial areas, and we look for 30 Day minimums in neighbourhoods. That’s it. So we’re proactively adapting to that, just expecting it. We’ve been making a slow shift for the last couple of years. So whenever it comes, won’t affect us. But that’s the strategy. 

 

Erwin  

Can you elaborate on what you mean when you look for commercial areas, 

 

Avery  

Like we’ve got apartments that’s above a pizza shop. It’s on it’s on a main strip. And while the our apartments that building is zoned commercially, so we can operate it, one that we took it on was downtown, it was above a convenience store what was apartments. Again, the zoning allowed us to make it into a boutique hotel. Zoning matters. We don’t actually dive into like, setting all these things up on all these permits and whatnot, but we look for the right safety net. And if the student situation comes where we’re talking to them, we say well, we’re in the right spot. And we haven’t had problems yet but we have a we have contingencies for it that does come up Long, that’s been our growth. Now it’s really focusing on commercially zoned areas just to be able to the race. When I look at an investment now it’s like, okay, commercially zoned on Airbnb site, what we’re just did were opened up a hotel, they actually took on a 25 unit, abandoned hotel, and, again, partially zoned, we just made an Airbnb. And we’re gonna start doing more of these because they’re awesome, the margins are incredible. It just needs a really good interior decorator, and you’re done. I’m gonna apologise to everyone because I think modern listeners are gonna buy every single abandoned hotel in the next 30 days across the country. I’m going to show on Netflix about motel flipping. Now, I can see why if we did, our first one is motels, if you know the historical hotel in your mind, they’re never very appealing. So make it appealing. And you already have spaces. And there’s a market for it. And so they just don’t do well online and they don’t look appealing. So you fix those two things. And you had a bargain on your spaces. 

 

Erwin  

Fascinating. Clean it up in that hot tubs. You’re probably good to go. That’s it. Clean the hundreds. Yeah, I can’t imagine the reviews if you don’t have a clean hot tub. Oh. Bad thing in my mind. I get so every Can you to rank for me your preference for investment then. So unique will come will be at the very top, I’m guessing. And then build a commercial? Yeah. And then below that would be like a commodity regular residential. Yeah. So that can be I can be urban, that could be Suburban. 

 

Avery  

Exactly. If I was going to rank in that order. That’s I never thought of it that way. But that’s exactly how we’ve morphed over time. So to do things that are niche, again, finding space to make that happen, a little more challenging. That’s why we’ve jumped into now by personal plans. And we’ll build a tiny accommodation, because we’re doing our thing you can hear like we’re off away, expensive in the city easier, just so we’re going more into unique now because it’s stronger in the long run.

 

Erwin  

Got it every day. But I want to thank you because that’s a really helpful point. Because from from what I’m hearing from investors, often they look to Airbnb to convert whatever their rental is, what the current use of the rental is, for example, it can be a condo, it can be a single family home in the suburb in suburbia. And then I think it would go Airbnb, but you’re saying that’s, that’s a bit lower on your on your preference level for an optimised investment. 

 

Avery  

Exactly. We still one arm of our business, and we’ll keep growing that and that’s fine. But so here’s a here’s a really good example for this. This is a startup and wanting to share, it blew my mind one year ago, when I dove into it. And why we started becoming developers is an average city space, it takes something here’s a number that can sort of translate across almost majority of cities. For average space not topped here, if you’re just gonna say like, let’s go on the averages. Take something like 18 days to break even and remaining 12 To profit. Yeah. So the margins okay, but you got to sell every one of those nights. So if there’s turnover days that you don’t capitalise capture, you’re just losing profits. So there it is 18 breakeven 12 profit over the course of the year the summer is different the summer peak seasons like five days, breakeven candy with our cabins is three, three days, four days to breakeven rest profit. So it’s quantum to quantum shift. It’s almost like eight times better so we can take comfort if there’s vacancies we don’t need to lower our price we’ve established this is what this is worth. This is our price but slower in the winter and that’s fine we don’t need to sell and that’s what sort of happens in the commodity space and Airbnb is during offseason well it takes 18 days to break even so that’s not happening and like oh no no wins the race to the bottom. So this is why we’ve made the switch is just it’s a lot more consistent in the cash the margin goes from like 30% to 6570 crazy.

 

Erwin  

I have a feeling your winter months gonna be busy like just what I see here like like ski has slammed private membership ski clubs I think they’re all their initiatives are double Wow. Like they went from like no one no one was interested failing businesses to having like waiting lists now for private ski clubs. Right? Oh, what a pandemic will change. I don’t know what’s gonna happen going forward. I don’t know if people will change you know, I mean, it like for example, even though we’re we’re all this recession talk. For example. Amazon Prime just had their best Amazon Prime ever. Right? Which is like a week ago. Yeah, it is the best ever. Even though we’re approaching, we still have supply chain issues, we’re approaching recession or we were in a recession already. But just because I my guess is part of it is because they have so many new customers. Right. And I think people have had a taste of more outdoor experiences. And I think that might persist. It may Trump may come down a little bit, I still think a lot of it will persist. Right? 

 

Avery  

Yeah, there’s, there’s definitely some things that have become sticky. And one trend that we’ve noticed as people became more familiar with their province, their country, travelling internationally might not be the question. And even now that we can, we’re still finding new spots. And, you know, within three hours that we really want to do, we’re now talking about exploring Canada. And it’s, it was a thing like, where the pandemic, people had the shift of I need to go to Paris, well, you can just go to Collinwood, actually, and now you’ve been exposed to it, although you’ve always noticed that you’ve never actually been. That’s, that’s a trend that sort of has stuck around. And it’s been motivating us. 

 

Erwin  

And then we have barriers. Now, just our airports are too busy. People’s luggage is lost. I don’t really want to go too far. And then crossing a border, all issues around COVID Stuff like I personally don’t, and I fight with my mom with my kids. I definitely don’t want to be crossing a border, right at this moment. Because I don’t want to be you know, so you test positive when you’re trying to cross when you try to come back to Canada. Now you’re stuck with my kids. We’re all stuck here. Now. I can imagine what the expense is going to be. So I’m naturally worrywart. All right. Again, I’m so sorry to my listener, because I’m sure there’s a lot of questions that they want ask how much is 300 acres costs in Nova Scotia? 

 

Avery  

Oh, sure. Who Yeah, when I first was 250. And when I first got into this to say, let’s figure out real estate, I thought like, Okay, that’s a good chunk of change. I don’t have it, but I’ll find it. What have later learned is that it is such a bargain, especially for anybody in the US. So this was 750 grand. 

 

Erwin  

Excuse me, his exact square foot condo in Toronto. Sorry, we need to reiterate this out. How much land Did you buy for 750 K. 

 

Avery  

We we have a small town of land 250 acres. Small small Township is what we have. I guess whole background behind me this is just a smidgen of it. You can see this. We have a lake on this Canadian dollar. Yeah, and it’s got some cool zoning too, that allows basically anything except fish processing and tires. I don’t know. But we can do anything here right you’re good? No fish processing. We don’t have it. 

 

Erwin  

So no fish processing your entire processing. That’s that’s your invitation. Okay, that’s it. All right. 

 

Avery  

Yeah, no, but this is a cool investment. And later after the ACA realise just how, how good of a deal. Nova Scotia and Atlantic Canada property is it’s almost oceanfront, we looked at a piece of ocean and Brian does 40 acres per 60 zoning was weird. We left it’s still under percent. It’s my most popular speech. We part of the process looked at 258 islands that was connected by a small causeway so we could build a road that was 2 million island. It has like 14 kilometres of ocean frontage. It’s crazy. The everyday mind. 

 

Erwin  

Thanks for projections on what this twinner for the acre property is gonna generate, like seven. This is This is insane. Well, what are the property taxes on 250 acres? No, no. Who cares? Please cash probably counting all sorted out. 

 

Avery  

It’s so the easiest way to break it down is to say how much how much does a space generate? Use the word space because not a cabin. It’s not a dome suntan like whatever space that’s matters because we’ve had scope creep and we’ve dialled back our cost per capita. Any space in this atmosphere we generate 30,000 Every year, excuse me. 22 inch square foot. very grand. Yeah, low end 25. If we really nail it, we can get 45 but I think it’s gonna fall on 30. So for each combination we put up, we just run the math. So we want to turn that Since we’re a million dollar operation, and the goal is to get to 40 spaces for the next three years, however, we’ve totally deconstructed our, our scaling model. And that’s part of our secret sauce, which anyone wants to talk about in this call. But essentially, we’ve just driven down the cost to get to, I think you can hit a million dollar business in our first nine months, which would be awesome. I can only do that because you’ve done it before. But I want to do it again. And and under a year. 

 

Erwin  

You mentioned you didn’t have the money, how are you? Financing capitalising this?

 

Avery  

There’s really cool programmes that exist. We had, it was a mix of private investment, we brought in sort of a 350 private investment, the land cost 750. And to develop it out, we’re gonna do one and a half million. So the bank saw half a million. Yeah, as our project, build out, the bank side is okay, you need you need to have X amount percentage of one and a half million, and then they’ll fund the rest. So one method was we did a vendor take back seller financing to get part of that downpayment, finance the rest of the friends and family. And then the bank came in, in Canada, there’s a federal Canada backed loan, up to a million dollars the loan over 20 years really favourable interest, and we’ll start with Business Development Bank of Canada. No, that’s the only one that doesn’t do it. But any bank, however, anybody? We’ve got the most success at credit unions, I love credit unions, credit unions will take a chance on you. And whereas big banks, put your number in a computer, and it says sorry. Peter said no. Anyways, it was a mix of credit union know about federal programmes, and then better take back mine with private financing. It was painful process, but we figured it out. 

 

Erwin  

Oh, financing developments are painful processes. To listener like listener like this is a straight up shows culturas about real estate investing, these things aren’t easy. This sounds crazy. 

 

Avery  

We’re going to scale again, though, is vendor take backs. That’s been our biggest tack to scale our business, we’re using that to buy our properties that we have landlords that Airbnb is with. We’re using that to buy development properties. Make a deal? Hey, I’ll give you your asking price you contribute 100,000, this will pay it back over two years plus interest depends on the discussion. It depends. It always depends, right? 

 

Erwin  

And of course, to me, it means of course, you’re speaking directly to the to the owner, you’re not going through an agent to have a VTB discussion when we went through the age for this to be able to have a good agent offence.

 

Avery  

Oh, yeah. But it also came because we had went looked at for three properties. And the last one, we went to go make an offer on someone else took it on the night of my wedding. And I was like I’m done. I’m done searching to come back to the drawing board picked five places and said, What’s your ideal space? We ended up with this one. And by this point, we had been done all of our research, we know exactly what we needed. And we have been turned down multiple times. So when we came into this meeting, we just said we want it. We’ll give you the price. But we need your your seller to play ball with us for some seller financing. They can throw 100 grand our way, we’ll figure out the terms are in and just sheer confidence after failing is what got us through. Because the first people didn’t too complicated. But sheer confidence in a very good agent is how we got it done. 

 

Erwin  

Yeah, you won’t keep that person’s number for life. Most agents, in my experience have no idea what vendor financing means their learning in this market. works a lot better in a buyers market too. Yeah. Oh, and just just out of curiosity, and I’m sorry. I know. We’re way over time. So I’ll let you go soon. Curiosity you choose to cut down on roads to build. How long are these properties sitting on the market? Like for example, like this, this 250 acres that you you’re you’re developing? How long? How long was it available for? 

 

Avery  

That’s a good question. I don’t think it was too long. I think it was maybe different targets. I think it was like 150 days. So anyone could Yes. In some at some of them, like the person we looked at had been on for years on and off. Although there’s a huge there’s a huge boom for people buying houses and markets. Some houses are on for day, most per day. Yeah, that didn’t seem to affect large land parcels, small home sized land parcels maybe more affected, but medium and large, lots of opportunity. And then the cost per acre is way less too. So, you know, part of our follow up plan, if we failed was, we could cut a chunk out and sell it for some capital. So if you can finance a medium sized portion like anything that’s like maybe 10 acres and above, less competition on it. 

 

Erwin  

Every year, apologies. I didn’t ask any early journey questions. How did you fall into this business? Oh, that’s yeah. I for short term rentals, 

 

Avery  

my whole life, I’ve thought I was an entrepreneur. So I kept trying and trying and trying failed and about 10 Different things that had no connection or relevance, just being part of the story. And I was running a painting franchise, college pro student works, this kind of thing. And that taught me all the fundamentals of how to run a business. So then all those my failures started producing. And one day a friend named Keith, which a room on Airbnb, I tried it. I had two bedroom, not one bedroom paid for my whole rent. So I thought, well, this is great. 

 

Erwin  

So your house hacking. 

 

Avery  

Alright, so I live in a two bedroom I had one and I rented out the other room and one room paid for my rent. Okay, I’m living for free now. This is great. How do I do more? And then I got home. And when I look back later at why this really stuck for me and why I love promoting it to others is totally inhibits my core value of fun. I just I can’t get involved in anything that I can’t have a little mayhem. Okay, Austin and Airbnb allows that allows flexibility and time freedom. Investment. I love promoting it to others because you can get the full 40 Hour Workweek you can train it, you can put whatever you want. It’s whatever you want. It’s blank, blank canvas big or as small as you want to go to market. 

 

Erwin  

Hey, I’m thoroughly enjoying this. I’d use up your whole afternoon if I could. But I only asked you for an hour now. Any anything? Anything I’ve forgotten to ask anything else you want to talk about? But what actually no, I said I asked you, you’re going to explain where the name of the of the resort came from. I don’t know if that’s even the right term. tortures peak orders peak. 

 

Avery  

Well, there is a lake a very well known lake in Nova Scotia called porters lake. And this is right up against it. And that’s at the very end and it has a mountain on so borders peak with it just it gave us the right alliteration sounded good to say. It was multifunctional so we can grow into it quarters peak spa orders keep refining orders thanks snowboarding orders people. There’s so many effects everything. And we also we also get the natural SEO for when people type in orders Lake orders. Oh let’s partner is key. So we might get accidental visitors. They’re just trying to go to the lake. 

 

Erwin  

I frickin love it. It’s such a I studied business in school. So I’m a bit of a marketing business geek as well. You borrow from an established brand, which is Porter’s Lake to build it into your own business versus some people would do Avery’s resort. Did you know SEO value? Yeah, so when you’re typing, you go to Google and it’s almost already on Apple Maps. We’ve even done frickin love it. And then the URL is Porter’s peak.com. Yeah. Good for you. And then I mentioned the opp before we start recording I thought was I thought it was Porter’s Porter speaks. Speak Porter speak. Probably I probably actually help people remember the name Porter pushers peak. Obviously there’s no apostrophe. Yeah, just Porter Porter’s peak. Anything else or anything else you want to tell us about the development that I haven’t asked? Other than the Instagram is also Porter’s Porter’s peak. 

 

Avery  

Follow our Instagram, one of my co founders, my business partner, Victoria, she runs the Instagram and it is not only entertaining, there’s also educational and it’s also going to make you want to come here. So our Instagram is very lively. Please check it out. And this is something that we’re growing. We’re going to be taking this model across the country. And a dream of mine is still a company across Canada and this is this is our knee. It’s our bread and butter and you are interested to learn more or want to learn how to do it yourself. I’m happy to take your email and If you need to talk I was wondering if we’re not working together I will happily help you. Because you know, there’s no such thing as competition that space is part. I don’t want people competing for your time. Competing with me for your talk doesn’t exist. Oh, time lab. Oh, God. You’ll pick up all this barley appointment slots in your town, we I’d love to take this offline too. This is a fun chat. I want to learn more about what you do to r1 podcast. 

 

Erwin  

I’ll stop the recording that and we can keep going. I don’t want to bore the listener with what I do for listener one, one last time, use the Instagram Porter’s peak, all supporters peak.com. Avery, thank you so much for doing this. I knew you’re a big time, man. Is this ever fascinating. I love how we got into the weeds. You know, I was actually thinking like, how am I going to title this show? I think the title of the show is if you’re gonna listen to a podcast on Airbnb, you have to listen to this. So thank you so much for being a wonderful guest and being so open. Yeah. And you know, it’s hilarious how we met introduction. We were both at the same conference in our mutual our mutual friend met you there. You already knew me. Well, it’s Oh, yeah, yes. And you meet this every guy. Right? And if if you weren’t there, I wouldn’t have never gotten the introduction to you. So my point I’m trying to get to his folks is like, you need to get out there. Right? You can’t just sit back on your Facebook or Instagram and think you’re gonna meet people and make connections. Alright, so yeah, okay, point. Yeah, get out there. Shake the tree when you’re stuck when someone’s gonna take up all your time. So I get the value by 70 listeners getting all the value for Avery this amazing, thanks. Thanks again so much for doing this. Let’s go check out the recording. Oh, in any final words, anything else you need other final words, 

 

Avery  

Go out there and get your first base started and you will never regret it. 

 

Erwin  

Alright, thanks so much.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already then sign up to my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow. But with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there. Forgive the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

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Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

W: erwinszeto.com
FB: https://www.facebook.com/erwin.szeto
IG: https://www.instagram.com/erwinszeto/

Flipping 60+ Houses, 8 Figure Portfolio, Ferrari Investing With HGTV Star Ryan Carr

Hello, my fellow real estate and stock investors, AKA Wealth Hackers!!

Speaking of Wealth Hacking, our conference is coming up on November 12th, and it will be the event of the year like it was in 2019!

I’ll let you in on a secret, Cherry’s 2nd 20th birthday is coming up, and because that’s 2 times 20, we have a 40% total off the price special for Cherry’s 2nd 20th birthday on August 5th.  If you’re on my email list or social media, you’ll be informed of the promotion. 

Please do make sure you’re there and bring those you care about because the future won’t be an easy one. 

One’s willingness to get outside their comfort zone is an indicator of future success; Unless one was taught all their lessons while growing up. This is an observation I’ve made. 

Our last guest on this show comes from multiple generations of successful entrepreneurs and investors.

The owner of my kickboxing gym’s 16-year-old daughter would beat my ass at kickboxing, thanks to world-class coaching from her father, a retired fighter with 37 professional wins combined with her years of hard work. Not that kicking my ass is much to brag about.

Thankfully our kids have adapted to new learning. 

Not exactly sure what we did right, but two weeks ago, when we dropped them off at their first week-long overnight camp, they were excited leading up to the drop-off and when we did drop them off, not once did they look back when carrying their stuff to their cabin. 

It’s an odd feeling of sadness they’re leaving you, not caring, while happy they’re acting independently.

We also talk to our kids about money, investing in stocks, real estate, and our charity, the Hamilton Basket Brigade, so they know how lucky we are and while many don’t have money for food and clothes. 

I can’t say I know what we’re doing, but I feel it’s the right thing to do.

Flipping 60+ Houses, 8 Figure Portfolio, Ferrari Investing With HGTV Star With Ryan Carr

Speaking of being out of one’s comfort zone, today’s guest, my old friend Ryan Carr is on the show. 

We share our practice of seeking the highest and best use of our time and capital however, he’s more aggressive and ambitious than I.

When I think of Ryan, I think of hard work (he used to work 7 – 7, 7 days a week for ten years). 

He runs a lean investing business and made a lot of money flipping 60 houses, duplexing, garden suiting, sever and build, land development, small apartment building, tiny house, short term rental, and cottage. Has his own renovation team on payroll.

He’s done basically everything under the sun!

Almost forgot, he’s one of the stars of HGTV’s newest show: Hoarder House Flippers. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Today, Ryan will share how it all came about and his behind-the-scenes experience of working on an HGTV show of investing in really gross, unsafe hoarder houses during a pandemic of all times.

Ryan also shares what kind of projects he’s investing in, and he’s writing a book and starting a podcast on the subject of the highest and best use for real estate.  

You’ll want to pay attention to what Ryan shares as beginners often get this part wrong in not being efficient with their time and money in maximizing their returns.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

 

Erwin  

Hello, my fellow real estate investors and stock investors, they get a wealth hackers. This is the truth about real estate investing show. My name is Erwin Szeto. And speaking of wealth hacking, our conference is coming up on November 12. And it will be the event of the year just like it was in 2018. And I’ll let you in on a little secret cherries second, yes, second 20th birthday is coming up. And because that’s two times 20, we have a 40% total off the price special for chairs, second 20th birthday on August 5. If you’re on my email list or social media, you’ll be informed of the promotion when it drops, please do make sure you’re there at the conference and bring those who care about because straight up, the future won’t be easy. I don’t imagine any generation pass our own will make more money than us. So you’ve hopefully you’re taking care of them as best you can. And those you care about are taking care of all their kids and future generations. So as an observation, I always have observations. Do listen to the show, you know, I always have observations. One of them is that one’s willingness to get outside their comfort zone is an indicator of future success. Unless one is taught other lessons while growing up. That’s actually a big benefit. This is an observation I made. For example, our last guest on the show comes from multiple generations of successful entrepreneurs and investors. Hence, they’ve amassed enormous amounts of wealth. So for those of you who are successful real estate investors or stock investors or entrepreneurs, just imagine all the lessons you can pass on to your your children and your grandchildren. For example, the owner by kickboxing gym, his 16 year old daughter would beat my ass kickboxing thanks to world class coaching from her father, who is a retired fighter 37 Professional winds combined with her years of hard work. Note that my ask is not that much to brag about. Thankfully, our kids have adapted to new learning. Not exactly sure what we did, right. But two weeks ago, when we dropped them off at their first week long overnight camp, they were excited leading up to the lead up to the event and the drop off. And when we did drop them off, not once did they look back, he hugs their goodbyes. And they walked off with their stuff to their cabin. We could see them for another minute or so just walked away, never looked back. It’s an odd feeling of sadness, leaving us and not caring. While we’re happy that they’re acting all independent. We also talk to our kids about money, investing in stocks real estate. My son said that you’d saved up like $80 or something, I said, we’re gonna go buy a bank stock, which pays dividends. He knows enough about passive income, that he’s all over investing also about our charity as well to help combat greed so they understand how lucky we are. And it’s part of our duty to give back to those who can’t. Because there’s many out there who don’t have money for food and clothing. I can’t say I know what we’re doing. But I feel it’s the right thing to do. Speaking of being out of one’s comfort zone, today’s guests, my old friend Ryan car, Ryan and I go way back, we actually mastermind together for about three years in the same group. So he’s back on the show, we share and we have common beliefs and values. For example, we both share the practice of seeking highest and best use of our time and capital. However, he’s more aggressive and ambitious than I am and hardworking that I mentioned that. When I think of Brian, I think of hard working. For example, just until recently, he used to work seven to seven every day. So that’s 12 hour days, seven days a week, for 10 years. He runs a lean and mean investing business. And he’s been a lot of money flipping 60 houses duplexing gardens reading several bills and development, small apartment building, Tiny House short term rental cottage has his own renovation team on payroll. He’s done basically everything under the sun almost forgot. He is one of nine. He is one of the stars of HGTV newest show on our house flippers today Rachael share how it all came about, including you share some behind the scenes experiences are working on each and HGTV show in some really gross, unsafe hoarder houses. Now, if you don’t know what a hoarder house is, it’s people who just collect stuff over the years. So if you didn’t make any, if you didn’t throw in anything for the last 10 years, imagine how much stuff you’d have in that wouldn’t be hygienic, that would be a health hazard. That could be a safety hazard too. Because these things if you have if you have belongings that stack up at the ceiling, that could potentially fall on you, and you might get buried alive. Imagine that being impaired a library or player buried by your possessions. So again, Ryan’s here to share what kind of projects he’s investing in right now. He’s also writing a book and starting a podcast on the subject of highest and best use of real estate. So you want to pay attention to what Ryan shares because in mice in my observations, I have lots of them. Beginners often get this part wrong. They’re not the most efficient because they could be with their time and money. And not maximising the returns. Please enjoy the show. Hi, Ryan. Thanks for coming in. Today

 

Ryan  

Hello, thanks for having me.

 

Erwin  

Oh, what’s keeping you busy these days? What’s

 

Ryan  

keeping me busy? Lots, lots. TV show, number one, still an active real estate investor very much. So number two, a little bit of personal time, which is kind of cool. Number three.

 

Erwin  

That’s a mouthful. People have no idea how busy you are.

 

Ryan  

I am an actual active investor. Yes. For real.

 

Erwin  

So we’ve known each other for a while and you’ve been on the show. This is probably the third or fourth time I think, as long as I’ve known you. You’ve been a seven to seven investor as in like 7am to 7pm. At a minimum, yeah. For how long were you doing that?

 

Ryan  

I was doing li Yeah. I’ve been investing for just over 10 years since 2012. So I was doing those hours or more for the majority of that time.

 

Erwin  

How many weekends? All of them, and you’re still married? I’m still married. You’re married that whole time?

 

Ryan  

I was married that whole time? Oh, yeah. 2020 13. So almost that whole time. Yeah.

 

Erwin  

And first of all, you just

 

Ryan  

follow me personally, personally, I had a conversation with somebody the other day, and I was at the dentist office, I was telling this. And my we got to chatting and I went to, I’ll back it up when I was a mechanic I got laid off from from doing that job. And I was on unemployment for about right. So I had a chance to go to the school where they taught you to be an entrepreneur. And I met this girl who wanted to start a dental practice. So I go to her dentist’s office, and depending on how tired I am, when I’m laying in the chair, that tells me if I’m working too hard or not like that has been my metric. So if I’m laying there, and I’m like, oh, man, this is so relaxing, I need to take it easy, then I know how I need to pull back. And if I’m laying there, and I’m a gung ho, then I know that I can give it up. And it’s just it’s just one of those ways that for me, over the years, I just, I don’t know, I just kind of adopted it. Because going to the dentist is historically not fun or not, you know, getting your teeth drilled. It’s not fun. So laying in the chair, I’m like, okay, cool. This is this is like this, this like intuitive guideline inside of me that says, hey, either you’re working too hard, or you’re good to go. And I was talking to her and I said, like, how long have we been on the school? And, and we just got chatting about that. And she said, How long have you been doing real estate? And I said, Well, just over 10 years now. And she goes, How many hours a week do you work? And I said, like, a lot of them? Right? And I said, for every one year that I’ve been doing real estate, it’s like if put in the hours for two have been doing it for 10 years, but I’ve put in the hours for 20. Right. And I do attribute a lot of the time spent to my success today.

 

Erwin  

Right. I think that’s a great point. On your level of knowledge, hard work, and mastery, you have the subject, because we’re going golfing after this. So the golf analogy is, you know

 

Ryan  

how this year by the way, so the interesting round,

 

Erwin  

right? And you want to golf today, you say oh yeah, golf the season? Yes. Once Yes. It’s like, you know, I’m a real estate investor, you know, say I’m three, whatever, whatever properties don’t care. I’m a real estate investor. So as Ryan Ryan has also a real estate investor. It’s not the same thing. Right. Just when we’re playing with Ron Jeremy today, yeah, he plays four times a week. Well, he’s gonna slaughter us, or he’s gonna destroy it. And I bet him money. My point, though, is also is that again, it’s we’re not the same. Yeah, right. So I think the another analogy I give is my car, my German car, and we’ll name it and JC Sumi, is, it has GPS, check the box. Right? But it sucks. I never use it. Yeah, it’s plug in my amble and your phone? Yeah. All right. But my point I’m trying to make is I see all these investors who say, Oh, I’m secured on title, I’m safe. And like, is that the only parameter that you need to determine your level of safety and security on an investment? Yeah, I just went on a bit of a tangent there. Like you measure risk, like, as an observer, one of your skills is you’re good at math. And good. Being good at math is being able to judge quantify risk. Yeah. Do you agree?

 

Ryan  

I do agree. Like you mentioned being on title. So like, you can be on title and the house is worth half of what you’re secured for, like you’re on title, you’ve done the thing. Yeah. But that doesn’t mean that

 

Erwin  

you’re safe. Exactly. And what else is on title?

 

Ryan  

Right. There can be 10 mortgages there and you can be the person last in line. Who knows? Like, you got to bet on the jockey not the horse, especially if you’re a lender, right? It’s Yes, it’s kind of about the asset, but like, a good investor will turn around a bad deal. The bad investor will completely obliterate a great deal. You know, so it’s the jockey not the horse.

 

Erwin  

I’d say it’s all because you forget, well, I’m sure we evaluate all as a quality jockey. So I’m trying to decide, okay, if you’re a top jockey, and you’re like on one of the top

 

Ryan  

horses, likely, right, likely, right? You’ll make good decisions.

 

Erwin  

If you’re on the best f1 drivers you’re likely on a good team. Yeah, right. I don’t know if I’ll say a qualify but whatever, and just throw it out there. Yeah. If you’re a great Instagram influencer, I don’t know. It doesn’t doesn’t tell me that the horse is

 

Ryan  

good. True. Well, you look at the fire festival, documentary, right? All of these people that had great influencer accounts at the time when they were talking about this new festival that was coming and including

 

Erwin  

all legitimate art. Sure. Art and music artists. Yeah,

 

Ryan  

like all these people are talking about this thing and This thing didn’t work out. And all of these people look bad for promoting that thing, you know?

 

Erwin  

And you’ve done. Do you even know how many deals you’ve done?

 

Ryan  

6768 over 60. Anyways,

 

Erwin  

any idea the dollar amount? Total dollar volume? No. Because again, there I have

 

Ryan  

never, I’ve never added that up. Actually dollar amount of like, you know, I think my rental portfolio at its peak was worth about 20 million like that.

 

Erwin  

So again, I think people that didn’t weren’t trying to make a point in trying to make is to qualify opinions and expertise and know how to qualify a horse. qualified investment property. All right, you know, I have units too. Yeah, my unit is probably worth like 10%, or one of yours. And the amount of effort to put in is play less than 10% of what you what you put. I’m just addicted with a bunch of duplexes.

 

Ryan  

Don’t even get me started on that.

 

Erwin  

Oh, I don’t like I don’t like inside jokes on the show. We’ll circle back and not come type completely back in together because I do want to talk about that that person because yeah, whatever. Yeah. Tell us what the show that HGTV is when did they first reach out to you?

 

Ryan  

So this all started in 2019. My wife and I live in Durham Durham Region, which is just east of Toronto. And somebody had asked me to come and speak at their seminar in like the Kitchener Waterloo area. So I did Sure I’ll come out, I’ll speak you know, we’ll talk about whatever you guys want to talk about. Because I just I’m a pretty open book, right? So came out, did my speech got off stage and this person approaches me from the crowd and says, Hey, you spoke really well up there. You ever thought about doing show? It’s like, not specifically, but like, what did you have in mind? And he goes, Well, I’m a producer, with HGTV. Why don’t we keep in touch. So we did. From there. My wife and I and Kiki. We went to Corus entertainment in Toronto, which is the parent company of HGTV, Canada and a whole bunch of other networks, right? They own them. So we met with all these big execs at this, like great big table. And all these people were in here talking and asking us questions, and they’re kind of they’re feeling at our character, they were feeling at the show, we’re kind of bouncing ideas off each other, and everything was good there. And then boom, COVID hits 2020. And everything got put on hold for a couple of years. So that that was a bit of a drag, because we were super excited to do the show. It’s called hoarder house flippers. It’s finally out now, which is great. We just went through the first season. And it was a lot of fun to shoot. But yeah, that took time to get to Okay, camera go, right. Like there was three years there of waiting. And okay, we’re going and did we find the property and okay, that’s not the right property. And you know, all those things happen logistically. So, yeah, it took time, but worked out.

 

Erwin  

How long a time, you know, I’ll have to talk about it. Those couple years,

 

Ryan  

because it was all kind of under wraps for a while. I don’t know why they do that. Specifically, I’m sure there’s reasons behind the scenes that we don’t know about. But everything just kept hush hush and the show for Joe. So for whatever reasons they have I’m sure that’s that’s cool. Maybe I’ll never know. But yeah, it was all hush hush for a bit. Because I

 

Erwin  

knew about it. It was hard for me not to say anything, it was even hard because I think we leaked it on the show, but we edited it out. We did We did. We edited it out though.

 

Ryan  

We had to be so strategic to write like you knew because it was strategic. We were gonna mastermind together. And like, like, there was a select group of people that didn’t know, because I had to be on point to find properties at the drop of a hat, I had to be on point to make sure that like mentally I was in the right spot keeping I had to be on point to make sure that we were in a good place with our relationship, which we always are. So like, all of these things like our support network still needed to be supportive for that role that we took on.

 

Erwin  

And then, uh, how long between starting to shoot? It’s a complicated sub topic, because the scope of these properties is not easy. Right? Like, firstly, to find a hoarder house

 

Ryan  

man, like, all of the houses that are out there of like flipping potential, I talked to a lot of wholesalers, right, I counted the other day, I’m on over 20 wholesale lists now. Plenty. And I reached out to them and said, Hey, of all the properties that you get, whether it’s, you know, 10 a year, 100 a year. Some people get more than that. How many of these would fit the criteria of hoarder house in the area that you farm? Right? And they said less than 5%? Great. So you know, it’s not very many properties that are hoarded and ready for an off market person to purchase, but they are out there. So for anybody listening, if you find a hoarder house, we would love to film in it. You know, please don’t clean it out. Call us first. We’d love to do that on camera. You know, it makes for a great episode.

 

Erwin  

What stops you from just like throwing garbage to a host to convert a crappy house into a hoarder house

 

Ryan  

real? It’s not real. You know, people want real they want authenticity. Would you watch any of those storage shows, knowing full well that somebody planted a diamond ring in the back corner? I don’t know they do. Right? And when that stuff comes out, people are like, Oh, well, it wasn’t really real. Like it’s not that exciting. We know there’s going to be something cool in there.

 

Erwin  

I’m not TV expert because I watch very little people still watch wrestling. Yeah,

 

Ryan  

for sure. And like that’s, that’s more theatre than Fight Club. Right? But like, yeah, they want it authentic. They want it real. When we go through these houses, it’s the real deal. Like we find some stuff in there and then we go, Oh my gosh, gross stuff, fun stuff neat artefacts during an example. Anything from like, the dirtiest underwear you’ve ever ever seen to. So girls, to really cool antiques that we repurpose and like staged at home with beautiful tea cups Keke Keke starting a tea line. And in each of the two episodes that we filmed this year, she found teacups and saucers and all this stuff that we were able to stage the homes with. So that was really cool, right and she was able to put them in the kitchen cupboards behind glass and they were showcased in Episode Six, which just aired last night. We were actually able to set the entire table with these beautiful china dishes have a gold leaf in Scripture in blue. They’re really pretty. We found them in the house.

 

Erwin  

You read that careful taking the garbage out. Yeah,

 

Ryan  

there’s some cool stuff. I found like 5000 bucks worth of snowblowers and generators and lawn equipment. And one of the episodes we did here making this sound sexy. Yeah, I mean, like, like, there is a component to it. That’s super cool. And then there’s some stuff that’s like, oh, it’s kind of gross. Yeah, let’s move on. Let’s Let’s fill the dumpster with that.

 

Erwin  

How many dumpsters on average? Seven.

 

Ryan  

Home. I haven’t got seven for your bins.

 

Erwin  

Cheese. Yeah. What is your typical non flip? So you’re taking it down to the stud

 

Ryan  

down to the studs. So this isn’t even down to the studs. This is just stuff from inside the house. So we don’t

 

Erwin  

wait so seven just the stuff stuff plus more for the renovation? Yeah.

 

Ryan  

Oh my usually like one bin for the Reno. Six worth of stuff. Yeah, there’s a lot of a lot, a lot, a lot of belongings and these homes, find a lot of duplicates. We find a lot of things from 30 years ago that have been buried, you know, so it’s almost a time capsule in the house. It’s kind of fun to unearthing some of these things. I found a book from the late 1800s Of all the surveys used of Toronto, right. So it was talking about like Oshawa and Pickering and, and Belleville and all the all the surveys were in this great big book. It’s like it’s maybe two feet tall and 19 inches wide, and beautiful coffee table book in great shape. So all the pages had like that, that old mothball smell to it. You open it up and it’s just like it’s a piece of history. It was buried under all the stuff you would have never known.

 

Erwin  

So other than the bins. How does one prepare for cleaning out a hoarder house? Like what are you wearing? For example? Yeah, so

 

Ryan  

for us we’ve been able to do it in plain clothes, sometimes masks and respirators gloves, obviously. Because you never know what you find sharp stuff. But generally we’ve been okay. There has been other people that have been full hazmat suit mould, you know, wet basement like the whole bit. It’s been it’s been pretty rocky, but for us we’ve been lucky to get

 

Erwin  

I did have some free time attention to the show, but it wasn’t you guys weren’t on it was as a family in the States. Three, two brothers and a cousin or something like that. Montreal. They’re from Quebec. Oh, okay. Yep. I knew something was off their English. Prices were really low, though.

 

Ryan  

Oh, dude. I’m so jealous. So we got in the show. There’s six episodes in total Kiki, and I have to a couple from Manitoba has two. And then a couple of them are the brothers from Quebec, they’ve got two as well. So six in total. And basically in the Montreal market, just outside of the Montreal market. And then in the Winnipeg market, their houses are like a couple 100 grand. And then you come into the GTA market, and the houses are like a million bucks. Right? This is a nine day nine day difference, like the cost of their purchases, like the cost of our bathroom renovation. Like it’s just it’s ridiculous, right? It’s so it’s so different. But the essence of the show remains the same. Right? People have stuff, remove the stuff, make the house pretty. Turn it back over.

 

Erwin  

Are the sellers ever part of this? In terms of

 

Ryan  

no thing? Okay, no. So this isn’t about the people. This is about the real estate and about the house and the transformation. Right. So like there’s other shows out there that talks specifically about the people and their circumstance and all that. That’s not our that’s not our forte, we’re investors first, right? So we talk about the asset and the house and how we can transform.

 

Erwin  

And it’s your crew, then it’s it’s RW investments that’s doing this, and then you have your antique are the faces.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, so like, this is still real, like real business day to day. In essence, the camera is documenting our journey. Right? And they’re coming along for the ride. Yes, there are things that you have to do to move an episode along. Because when you’re having a conversation about a house, or when you’re actually flipping the house, sometimes there’s long gaps between progress, right? So when they’re filming, we have to be strategic as to how we bring the cameras in so that the viewer can follow. Otherwise it wouldn’t make for good TV, right? So but 95% of what we’re doing is is sequential, right? And it’s actually happening real time.

 

Erwin  

Now there’s some out there who criticise these TV shows are on their budgets. But you know, your numbers I do where you’re transparent with your numbers.

 

Ryan  

I was I was very much so so I mean like what we spend is what we spend it’s a real deal, right? If that was donated, we do get free dumpsters, which is good, but I do try to include that So like if we spent

 

Erwin  

on a massive budget, how much is the dumpster now

 

Ryan  

dumpster is like 1000 bucks each, typically, depending on the size and the weight and so on, but I mean, like, like responsive bicycle paint. So that’s kind of interesting. Sometimes we get free flooring or things like that we do get some freebies. But like, generally speaking, I factor in dollar for dollar, like, what did we spend? Let me be transparent. I think when people watch the shows, and they don’t get the full story, it gives a false expectation in the market. Right? And when I was first an investor to like, like learning how to do things, what does lumber cost? What does paint cost? If somebody says, renovations 20 grand, and then you go in the real world? And at 60? Will you start to question like, okay, am I doing it wrong? Do I what do I not know? Right? So I do try to be very transparent.

 

Erwin  

Oh, can you imagine the poor contractors like, oh, you should get three quotes and you quote all three contractors quoting like, oh, unless show is like, 30%. Less than you’re quoting me. You’re screwing me over. Yeah, contractors like one another one. Another AGT. Yeah. But you kept the real, I keep it real. Thanks for keeping real Welcome.

 

Ryan  

Welcome. I’m transparent. I always have been, I’m always just, I’m just an open book. I think you’re better to just be honest with people, right? And then, if you come on a show like this, and people ask you questions, it’s like, yeah, this is what happened.

 

Erwin  

This is what it is, let’s just whack because a lot of shows are not real at all. I remember watching a show when like one of the realtor realtor working with a couple of whatever. And like, wow, they get every single property, he always wins. This is not possible. There’s only one other offer was last time, we had one other offering up against the GTA, so I knew had context. And then you find out like, the couple already owns that house are just acting.

 

Ryan  

Yes. That’s why they wanted the house to be authentic.

 

Erwin  

Wow, this isn’t this is a new angle that they’re going for?

 

Ryan  

It’s a good question. I don’t know, I didn’t get too into. I didn’t get too into the weeds on other shows and how they function, right in terms of like, what they do, or their houses real or whatever. I just know what we’re doing. Right. And so far, the show has been really well received. And like, I wouldn’t know any different because this is our first time right? But from what people are telling us and what, you know, we hear from friends, family, people in the industry, right? From what we’re told, so I’m happy about that.

 

Erwin  

I’m glad because maybe that’s the the tone going forward that things should be more real things should be more transparent. Share, you know, if people have ownership in these things, or things are being donated, or just be frank with people, ya know, yeah, my trust is broken, right with for a lot of TV shows, because I know it’s not real, or other shows. They’re just feeding the cast alcohol, right? This isn’t real.

 

Ryan  

We don’t get to do that. We don’t get to drink beer on our show. Get dramatic. It’s funny say that. Because, you know, when we first started the show, Keith and I said, Okay, how do we want to be portrayed in that, like, we had this really real visceral conversation, and you can be like, you can be like, the disappointed wife and like the asshole husband. Or you can be the couple that bickers right, or you can be like, one person is all about the money, the other person is all about making it beautiful. And you’ve got conflict, right? Where you can be like the wholesome, genuine couple that we actually are, right? And just be real and be fluid throughout not only the show, but our life too. Right. And that’s the way we decided to pick like, let’s just be us, if people like it great. And if they don’t, that’s okay, too. You know, not everybody will enjoy everything about every episode. And we’re okay with that. But like, at least Richard, ourself,

 

Erwin  

is talking about Keith a little bit, when did she join the business like full time, full time,

 

Ryan  

so keep her in the business, I would say a couple years ago, just as the show was kind of gearing up, she was always in the background, doing like, we had done the first couple of properties together, which is cool, including a principal residence, right? When she kind of did her own thing for a bit. Then she kind of came back and then we realised, hey, you know, we really have something here. She’s got a good eye for design. Let’s come on board. Let’s make these properties. Beautiful. We’re fixing them anyways, to actually make them pretty in colour coordinate and all that stuff. We can make some extra lift here. Right? Let’s bring her on board and let’s get her. Let’s get her opinion.

 

Erwin  

Are she also working seven to seven? No, always keep rolling. I

 

Ryan  

work the crazy hours. Always keep working. She’s She’s sporadic on her hours. So she’s a little bit different. So one thing that we’ve both learned about herself, is that we operate very differently. I’m more of a morning person. She’s not she’s more of a night hawk. I’m not. Right. So like, if I get up at 6am, I’m going home like ready to go. Right? Maybe she’ll be sleeping at that point, or the sun hasn’t even come up yet. So we have to be very conscious and considerate of each other because we’re not the same, right? And that’s okay. Right? That’s okay. Knowing yourself is so important to like real estate, investing in life, relationships, whatever, you gotta know, you gotta know. And if you don’t know and take the time to know, do a test do a disc test, right? Do a Myers Briggs test, do a some kind of a personality test. I did that. And it was huge. For me. I liked the disc test just because I understand it. But like there’s tonnes out there. Just do it for yourself. And then you realise Hey, I’m more of a dominant personality or I’m more of a compliance personality or, you know, I’m a stay at home mom and this is the way that I operate, you know, whatever your whatever your thing is play into that strength.

 

Erwin  

So we actually disk everyone No Oliver Oliver companies, we just everyone Hello. And then we actually try to read read our clients as well so that we can better communicate with them. Yeah and understand them and also how we communicate with them. I think it’s interesting. I think I repeated myself. Can you share what your disk is?

 

Ryan  

Yes, I am. They asked me I forgot. I am a s. Oh, no.

 

Erwin  

What am I worth the D?

 

Ryan  

There is I think I’m a CD. You see, first CD, I’m a CD. I’m not an overly dominant personality, unless I’m in a leadership role. And I have to be a more of a more like a passive guy. I’m big on compliance, math data, stuff like this. That’s how I help justify my decisions. Right? I’m not an AI. Like, I’m not an influencer. I don’t need the flashy, whatever. For outward stuff. Sometimes I like it. Inwardly, sorry. I enjoy the things. I enjoy the flashy things for personal reasons, but not to prove anything to others. Right. Yeah. You’re a bit of a gearhead. Yeah, which is very different than having to buy you know, the convertible because you want people to see you driving down Main Street with the loudest radio, right? That doesn’t matter to me, that stuff doesn’t matter. Even being on TV. That doesn’t matter to me. Like I’m not doing it for those reasons. So people go, you know, Ryan or Kiki, you guys are amazing. We just love it like, like the accolades are, they’re cool, but like, that’s not why I’m doing it. You know,

 

Erwin  

it’s just just for the listeners benefit. Tony Robbins gives away the disc test for free. So just Google Tony Robbins, Anthony Robbins, di es, si. You can go fill out the survey and the questionnaire and exchange for your email. They’ll email it to you. So you can find out what you are as well and compares out the Ryan. See if you’re also a CD and you’re gonna make $20 million like Ryan

 

Ryan  

made 20 million.

 

Erwin  

So I brutalised your story. When I tried to summarise your summarise you two people have a young gentleman that I’d like you to meet afterwards because you’d like to see your car. I explained to him like Ryan was a mechanic. And because he’s good with his hands, he figured out how to renovate houses off YouTube, and then just took action and worked hard. And now here he is. Yeah, we yada yada at a lot there are days, seven days a week, but you’ve slowed down a little bit. Why slow down the market?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, no, not necessarily. It was more of an internal thing. So again, going back to, you know, knowing thyself, going through all of COVID I realised that I’m more on the introverted side, less on the extroverted side. Even though I do like to speak and things like that and train like, I think it’s fun. I’m more on the introverted side, and I’m okay with myself. I’m okay with like, not going out on a weekend. I’m okay with these things. Right. So on the disc test personality side that really helped me in terms of what was the question again, slowing down slowing down? Yeah, so in terms of slowing down, you know, being an introvert, I was okay with like, just taking it easy. Taking a step back, really realising okay, I’ve worked really, really hard for 10 years put in enough time to call it 20 in terms of human hours, right, and it’s time to enjoy some of the some of the things that we have, whether it’s you know, we talked about cars, so like, whether it’s cars or whether it’s hobbies or whether it’s spending time at the cottage or whether it’s just like you know, Kiki and I like to have tea and pie on Thursdays completely non monetary. You know, and we’ve been so monetary for so many years trying to figure out how do we make money? What do we enjoy things like that? Let’s have tea and pie on Thursdays. It’s 12 bucks, right? Oh, you go to the restaurant sometimes we do. Sometimes we’d go home and just like you know, get a pie from like a baker’s market or something and, and make tea in the backyard. Right? Super simple, but those little moments are what changed my focus and saying okay, if you don’t enjoy life now when will you ever do it? I’m 34 now have worked really hard for a long time 10 years plus okay, let’s chill let’s take a breath I need to headspace see cut back I’ll buy a lot Yeah, I did well like one time I think the max Hi Max properties I had I think it was 15 and I’ve cut back quite a bit so like right now we’ve got a couple interactive construction which is which is plenty you know it’s easier to manage less moving parts less capital out there. The market is changing right now interest rates are up market is down the Oshawa market which is one of the markets that I primarily invested in it’s off 26% Since last year,

 

Erwin  

so much to unpack here but you still have any buying holds you still haven’t hold the intention to hold for forever

 

Ryan  

No Not forever I’m not a forever guy. So like some people say you know what is your what is your forever home or what is your I’m like, I don’t know you’re gonna be in 10 years, right? I can’t look that far. But that’s just for me. Some people can be like I’ve got a 30 year plan a 10 year plan or whatever. I’m like a one year plan two year plan five year plan. Let’s reevaluate type of guy. So for me Yes, I do have some buying holds. Do I think I’ll have a forever No, I don’t do I think I’ll have some for a long time. Yes, I do. I do like the benefits. of owning real estate, you know, whether it’s from a tax perspective or whether it’s capital gains versus active income, like a flip, like all of these things play into my my thought process, but yeah, I’ll keep some for a long time. So I’m gonna let go, what’s the makeup of your your holds right now? Primarily small. So I’ve got one, one multi unit, and then a bunch of duplexes. A couple of single families. The single families are primarily used because I’m severing land, you know, so buy the house, split the land, eventually sell the house. That’s why That’s why I have those financing is a little bit more favourable. If you’re buying a single family home on a big lot. You don’t have to close it private, you can close it with bank fine, like things like that. And then I’ve got a bunch of land that I’m developing as well. Where’s the land through? We’re gonna build what are you gonna build? duplexes, single family, semis? triplexes, things like that?

 

Erwin  

I mean, lots,

 

Ryan  

not that many, eight 810 something that can be hard.

 

Erwin  

Are they hard? Yeah.

 

Ryan  

They just take the cooperative, they take time. They take time, generally speaking, you know, barring being close to like a creek or like in some weird area, the cities are relatively supportive of infill development, because you’re using the existing services, and close to transit spines, you know, grocery stores, whatever. All of that stuff is great. On the flip side, if you’re in a part of town, where like, I’ll give you a real example. So I bought a piece of property three and a half, maybe four years ago, right? It was my first infill development project. So I bought it like older farmhouse on a double lot in town. And I went to the town said, Okay, I want to back the house down, cut that in half and build two new ones. Generally, they were supportive, except I found out six months later that I got stuck in what was called an interim control, bylaw. And interim control Bylaw is when all the neighbours get together. And they complain to the town and they say all these developers are whacking down the old houses on bigger lots and building mini mansions, right. And we don’t like that. In our area. We’re like, alright, so I got stuck in this thing for two, two and a half years. Oh, my. Yeah. When I had the shittiest tenants in this property, they rip the cabinets off the wall and they damage the place. It was just a mess. One tenant moved out, rip calves off. So I called the police I was like, Okay, so I’ve been clearly vandalised here, right? Like, this is beyond. This is beyond just like wear and tear. Like, you know, the corners are worn off because I have a big dog. Now, like the carpets were torn up. There’s garbage all over the camera. The cops come in, and they’re like, Yep, I understand where they are tenants. I said, yeah, they’re my tenant like what they did, right? And the cops are like, Sorry, can’t do anything. If they weren’t your tenants, then we can find these people to press charges. But because of your tenants, they’re basically protected. And I was handcuffed, not physically. I was handcuffed, like the property. Thank you for clarifying. Yeah, yeah. The property was like physically handcuffed. I couldn’t do anything.

 

Erwin  

I’ve actually spoken to a police officer in our community. And he says they can really It’s interesting. It’s just again, it’s they’re open opinion. Yeah, how much work they want to put in, I guess,

 

Ryan  

I guess. So like that, you know, shit like that. That really sucks and gives me mad. You know, I was really good at these people. As a landlord. I try to be really good at the tents to get people to get back to you. Right, unless they’re unreasonable people to begin with. And you just can’t reason with that. Yeah,

 

Erwin  

sorry. Just to clarify my case, I had a witness. No, I’m one of the random roommates. But still cops were called and they wouldn’t do anything. Yeah. But again, it depends on who you’re talking to. Yeah, yours would be tougher because he didn’t have a witness. Yeah. See, I like I like context that I keep telling me the context is everything. It is very, it is,

 

Ryan  

you know, you could glaze over that story and be like, Ryan buys house, Ryan takes house down builds new house. You know, Ryan keeps us long term. But like, there’s so many details in between that story of like, you know, what happened to the market? What happened with the tenants? What happened with the town? How did you push through it? The house, I built the house all through COVID? What about the price of lumber? What about the price of drywall? What about finding skilled trades during that time? You know, what about watching the government say, okay, everything’s open, okay, everything’s closed. Okay? The hardware stores are open, the hardware stores are closed, right? Like all of these things. Yeah, you have to chop through. And the margins have to be there at the end to actually make that make sense.

 

Erwin  

So another thing observation to have a view is that on the outside, you look like you’re calm, because everyone’s telling me one story how you you save the foundation? Because you just happened to check in and you saw and you caught the mid porn foundation and everything and it would have been a complete disaster. I was we’re not there. That was his house. This new building was so calm about it. It could have cost you like 100 grand probably or something like that. It would have Yeah, you’re just so calm about it though. Were you really calm on the inside

 

Ryan  

on the inside I was freaking out. Freaking out. That was the first time so what had happened was

 

Erwin  

and again context right? Again, like, but like quick summary that you gave. You could have had 100 grand mistake if you were not there. And not just if you were not there there or not. You had the experience and the knowledge to spot the problem. Yeah, that’s exactly what and how many people have that. Everyone the jobs they didn’t apparently didn’t

 

Ryan  

apparently, which was unfortunate. They dug up the municipal road, right for the listeners. They dug up the roadway. And they were putting in the water sewer and storm connection into the two lots that I was servicing. Right? Well, they went to Backfill the hole which is When I pulled up or pulled up, and they were missing the water pipe on one line, the sewer pipe on the other. I said, Whoa, like, what are you doing? And then like, What do you mean? What are we doing? What are you supposed to have three pipes in the hole and you’ve only got two? Where’s the third pipe? And they’re like, well, it’s not on the drawing. And I said, Do you think that I’m gonna go and build a house? With no sewer pipe on one and a water pipeline? Like, what? How am I going to make this house function? You’d have to dig a row back up? Oh, that makes a lot of sense. He says, Who are these people? Well, the municipal workers, they’re contracted by the government to put in the services. Yeah, like so frustrating. I thought to myself, are you kidding me?

 

Erwin  

I was working delegate the scale. Ryan, you guys, you missed that. You missed that hook in the motivational whatever. Yeah.

 

Ryan  

I was so rattled on the inside. I was. I was I was upset that they didn’t catch it. Because they were professionals at what they were doing. Right. They’re supposed to do this every day, every day, right? I don’t. I’m not a sewer guy. I don’t know. But I’m, like, bright enough to know that, you know, you need sewers, and water and all the rest of it to make a house work. So, you know, I said, Hey, put the thing in. It, put it in and they put it in. They’re like, Okay, can we Backfill the hole? I said, sure. Like so. So trivial. But that would have been so expensive to fix in

 

Erwin  

delay. Oh,

 

Ryan  

it would have been horrible.

 

Erwin  

I waited. You’re probably like finding the problem. Like, oh,

 

Ryan  

yeah, like, where’s my pipe? You would have been digging, looking for the pipe that wasn’t even there would have been horrible. Oh, cool. Yeah, but caught it. Right. another roadblock? I caught it. Move on. Let’s build the house. We’re okay.

 

Erwin  

I don’t want to scare people from doing these things. No, no, please. Sure. What’s tricky about real estate investing. Let’s we should at least talk about what what it is.

 

Ryan  

Yeah. Like, there’s positives and negatives to anything. Same thing with stocks, stocks go up, stocks go down, you hit the buy button, instead of the sell button, you know, trouble. You hit the sell button instead of the buy button. Maybe you save yourself who knows? Right? But educate yourself move forward, figure out the solution. Put $1

 

Erwin  

I see all these investors who are just, it’s not that common with this incredible ambition right out of the chute. Right? They’ll take on Orion car sized project on like their second deal. Or the by vacant piece of land off realtor.ca. Like, holy cow. What did you find? What did you see in this property that no one else saw that largely looked at this?

 

Ryan  

You wouldn’t believe I get like people call me from time to time and say, Hey, can you help me with this? And so I’ll try and help them right. And I talk more people out of doing deals than doing deals, because they’re too ambitious, as you say, I can’t reasonably see a positive outcome. Right? And they have no idea what they’re talking about. And I’m like, Hey, you might be missing this. You might be missing this. You might be missing this. You ever thought about that? And they say no, I have it. Right. And I’m like, there’s more deals that are bad deals than are good deals. And most people don’t understand that. All right.

 

Erwin  

Well, lots of good deals never see the light of day. So yeah, I think the folks need to understand that. Like, if it’s on realtor.ca, then that, or IC X even is IC X even around? I don’t think it is. I think you’re right, the commercial version over the last. If it’s made it there. A lot of people already looked at it. So you’d be like, have your guard up. Yes. All right. Be extra critical. Yep. Yeah, crazy. So tell me about the deals or the other deals the work that you’re currently active on? Yes. Because you’re known for do highest and best use. What are you doing that’s highest and best use on these are these just ugly houses.

 

Ryan  

A lot of ugly houses. But I mean, land 70s are big rezonings you know, cutting corner lots kind of backyards, off corner lots. That’s good. Tear down rebuilds rezoning for higher density. That’s big coach houses are kind of like the new big thing. So I’ve got a couple of those in the pipe. I might convert them to try Plexus instead of coach houses just because it’s more cost effective to build.

 

Erwin  

So how do you what’s the triplex? Can you paint a picture for me?

 

Ryan  

Yeah, sure. So buy big infill lot. Cut the lot in half, take the house down, build a triplex on the left and a triplex on the right.

 

Erwin  

Oh. So what is it like

 

Ryan  

three, three units in one building? small apartment building?

 

Erwin  

So basement unit main floors unit, the second floors unit? Yep. I tried to

 

Ryan  

build them as a raised bungalow, or like a raised basement style. So the basements four feet in the ground, right? Everybody has nice big natural light in the bottom. And then the second floor is elevated a little bit third floor even more so. Right. Right, right. And then because, excuse me, there’s more stairs to get to the third unit on the top level. Right? When it’s when it’s raised a little bit, we try to incentivize that top level unit. So maybe give them 10 foot ceilings or vaulted ceiling. So when you get up there, it’s like really beautiful, or they have a nice balcony. And that helps offset the pushback when people say oh, that’s a good tip. I don’t want to go that high.

 

Erwin  

How deep do the poor arrays bungalow?

 

Ryan  

Well, depends on the answer is four feet. Right, which is your typical frost coverage. Okay. Right. But I mean, it depends on your area. So like in Florida, they don’t freeze. So you’ve got less, less of less flooding coverage there. But here in Ontario, we’re about four feet. Are you seeing more deals available now? I’m seeing more volume now. But that doesn’t mean it’s a deal. So just because it’s inexpensive, more things

 

Erwin  

are coming across your desk, right? Because like the 20 wholesalers and the threats like

 

Ryan  

stuff is happening, things are moving in the market because the market is coming off. So people either want Say face, or you know, claim profits or whatever. But like whenever you get a market change, things come out of the woodwork.

 

Erwin  

I don’t even know to ask next. You mentioned Florida. So that book came to mind. Are you doing anything out of out of country or province thing?

 

Ryan  

Nothing? No,

 

Erwin  

come on, Ryan, there’s gotta be some shiny things you can chase. I know, it’s more than an hour drive from your house. I’m

 

Ryan  

trying to I’m trying to not do that actively. Like there’s, there’s an opportunity in so many areas that I could that I could reasonably foresee a positive outcome. Right, so many areas doesn’t matter what it is you could you could you own a better restaurant? Or could you have a better a cotton farm? Or could you have the, you know, the best piece of real estate? Or could you? You know, like, I went all the stock hacker stuff. Right? I took the course. But I never did actually do it. Right. And I thought the course was fantastic. And I thought you guys nailed it. Right? But I knew after I took the course, that I couldn’t have a split focus between real estate, and being great at that. And doing stocks and being great at that. For me. That doesn’t mean nobody can do it. I’m sure there’s less people to do. Right? I just need it for me. If I split my focus, I would split my results and I couldn’t do it. Right. Maybe when you’re retired, maybe yeah, maybe we truly

 

Erwin  

retire. You make you make so much money being so active in your business and you’re so good at it seems like it’s your highest and best use.

 

Ryan  

It is I just I’m able to see opportunity. Very, very like that, you know,

 

Erwin  

because the direction that stock hacker Academy is now is where I see challenges in the market for people are all these people who are private lending who are taking away too much risk for a fixed return. Yeah, right. And so the analogy often to them is like, you know, a TD Bank and payment will pay me over 4% dividend. Yes, taxpayer for preference. Yeah, I can say I can do something really simple. I’ve covered sell cover calls on it. Yep. And I don’t think I’m gonna lose that much money on TV, nor will it go to zero versus we know people that are losing lakhs of money in like the promissory note market and some REITs that are at risk out there like newer REITs. So yeah, I just I just wanted to put something out there that the risk and the reward was more in line with at least what our conservative than the massive amounts of risk I see people taking. Yeah, you know, I agree with your with what you’re doing, especially with how busy you are, back to the triplex. Now, I don’t know where I want to dig into one of these strategies. Okay, because we have a lot begins on the show. Yeah, which of the strategies that you’re currently work doing is something more something out beginner can bite off a seven build Severn, triplex just a basement suite,

 

Ryan  

I think the entry level stuff is always a basement suite. I mean, I cut my teeth on doing basement apartments, really, you know, 10 years ago, when I got started. And like a lot of the same, a lot of the same techniques you need to do basement hold true for a lot of development. So like getting a building permit learning that process doing a set of drawings, learning that process, understanding what a site plan is where we put in parking, how deep is the backyard, you know, what is a setback, right? A setback is how far you are from a lot line from your structures, all of these things matter. Right? So when you take that, that concept, and then you bring it over into infill development, right, the same thing applies, where are you putting the house? You know, how do you get your blueprints done? What are your setback, all of these things are the same, right? It’s just on a basement apartment. It’s easier because you have a defined space you’re working with on an infill lot, it’s a little bit more tricky, because you’re trying to deal with a town or something new. Right basements or existing construction. So basement apartment, that’s the answer. That’s the easiest entry level point.

 

Erwin  

Is it your own crews working on these on these projects?

 

Ryan  

Sometimes? Yep. So like, I think at my peak, I had three, three crews on the go. Right now I have one, sometimes two, but mostly just one full time staff T for employees. I’ve had them for years, right. And they’ve been awesome. I attribute a lot of my success is to having full time staff because they push me to be better because I want to be better for them. Not because I want to be better for me. Right? I’m always working six months ahead of my my guys, my staff, because it takes time to find the house close on the house, finance the house, whatever, plan the house so that they can come in and do the construction. Right. And that evolved naturally. I used to be the guy doing the construction. That was great. But you can’t scale your physical labour, you can only scale your thoughts. Other people’s labour. Right. So that’s that’s how that came about. But like yeah, I can confidently say that if I didn’t have full time staff, I probably wouldn’t be where I am today. Because I wouldn’t have pushed in the same manner.

 

Erwin  

Now having full time staff has so just, again, not many people have full time staff. So that’s some questions around it. I hopefully it benefits the listener. How much are you able to outsource and delegate to that full time staff? Are you able to be like, go golfing? You can explain it? How involved are you on with the construction since your full time staff

 

Ryan  

last year. So now, more so in the beginning, right. So when I when I kick start a project, we’ll call it every project when I start one. I’m a little bit more evolved at the beginning because I have to steer the ship, right? I’m the maestro to the orchestra. I have to say okay, the tuba goes here. The trombone goes here the violin now it’s your turn. Right whereas after that is set and the sheet music is written. They just have to play it. And I say just have to play it like kind of tongue in cheek because there is still some technique there, and they still have to be good at their job. But like, what I didn’t understand when I first started my business was I was just looking for people that were inexpensive, because I just wanted to write and a lot of people go through this, they don’t want to pay and whatever. Now I need people that come batteries included, no assembly required. Because I have to be able to delegate a task and say, Okay, you go hang the drywall, I’ll be over here. When you’re ready, then we’ll go on to the next task. I can’t spend the time to show you how to hang the drywall. Otherwise, I would just have to do it myself. Right. So that was a big takeaway for me, as I continue to grow, and now I’m less involved, right, I do still start the project, like I mentioned, as we progress through the project less or so. Right? And the final 10% is always the hardest, because then I come back in and I say, Okay, we got it still got to do this. Still got to do this. Okay, now we’re ready to go.

 

Erwin  

So part of the challenge was investors is, is they want to be as passive as possible.

 

Ryan  

That’s horseshit. I’m telling you right now, anybody that wants to be like, super hands off, and I don’t want to know anything about the problems, and you know, just call me when it’s done. And here’s the keys and whatever, that only works later in life. It only works later in life. That’s been my experience. Right? I think that’s been a lot of people’s experience. I can’t speak for every scenario, but anybody that says, I don’t want to know anything about it and right, fair, fine, but you will pay for that. One way or the other, like, something will come back. It’ll bite you. Yes, it’ll be bad, right? But it’s the wrong way to go about it. If you can’t see yourself in that business long term, right? I personally don’t believe that you should start because something will happen. And you’ll get frustrated, and you won’t want to be there. And you won’t have the foresight to work through the issues

 

Erwin  

and just wait for the person that thinks like, oh, Ryan works 77, I can fix that I can answer some delegate, I’ll hire an in house Operations Manager, for example. Does the model work with the full time staff between you and the project? So you don’t ever have to go on site? Maybe sometimes it does. Maybe someone sometimes your projects usually pretty have good meat on the bone?

 

Ryan  

They do. They do. So like if you have a tonne of margin, where you can make all the mistakes, and you can hire all the people and stuff like that everybody that’s just just like, oh, just delegate that delegate that delegate that. Well, eventually, when you get to the end, and there’s nothing left, but you delegated everything, what have you done it for? Right? So you gotta be really conscious on where you’re spending your money. You could lose so much in operational inefficiency, that like there’s like the project is a zero or a negative at the end, and you’ve just put in all the time, even though you’ve outsourced it and got your time back. Right? It’s all for naught. So you do still have to look at the margin.

 

Erwin  

Right? And it’s the thing that I see a lot of books talk about is like, oh, yeah, just just outsource and delegate everything. Yeah, my experience is similar. You just so much, you can’t,

 

Ryan  

you cannot, it’s very hard to delegate vision, right? It’s very hard to delegate, like a one off chore. It’s very hard to delegate art. It’s very hard to delegate anything that isn’t clearly repeatable.

 

Erwin  

Like Simon cynics book, for example, lead from the front. I don’t know if he can inspire people, if you’re on the golf course. And like not doing like any work, or you’re just doing cutting or cutting checks and signing checks. Yeah, I don’t know if that’s necessarily inspires your staff? No, I mean,

 

Ryan  

I wouldn’t think it would. That’s why, you know, I talked about this in the book, which, by the way, is coming. It’s been the longest, it’s been the longest book really supposed to

 

Erwin  

announce today.

 

Ryan  

It’s been the longest book release ever. And at first, it was like the production side that I was kind of getting held up on. And now it’s clearly just my fault. Like, it’s just clearly my fault. The book is written, it’s been proof read, right? And there’s still a few things that need to be done. And it’s just like, I am the bottleneck in that process. And speaking of outsourcing, I can’t outsource a couple of the things that need to be done because it’s coming for me. Right? So I’m the bottleneck. This is like real world entrepreneurship. I’m the bottleneck. This is it. Right? But like, you know, I talked about some of these things in that book, where you have challenges in the business that it’s got to be to fix it.

 

Erwin  

I did hire someone to read my book. Yeah, you gotta want to stay in forever too. It is out though. But again, the audio books not out yet but it’s hilarious because like it’s like the the guy who reads it. Very professional doesn’t stutter like I do.

 

Ryan  

I love it. Cool. I can’t wait to read it or listen to it.

 

Erwin  

I heard I heard a sample and Sherry’s book also we hired someone a woman at least Yeah, but yeah, like to hear like a professional speak versus cheering with their accent.

 

Ryan  

Yeah, this is hilarious trousers, very articulate with the word very delicate.

 

Erwin  

Because for me, whenever I read chairs, writing, I hear her voice in my head. So the hearsay throws me off.

 

Ryan  

We talk about the car. We can we can you like cars. I do like cars forever. Forever. Yeah. As a kid, I was always very mechanical. So like, before I got into being a mechanic I was, you know, like doing go karts and mini bikes and welding and stuff like this. All through like public school in high school. I was more into sports and public school and then I gravitated towards work with my hands even more. So you know, when I was like 1314 and then it just always stuck around.

 

Erwin  

And there wasn’t any cars particular brand and everything like was it on your vision board

 

Ryan  

or any Going for Absolutely. So I didn’t even know what a vision board was when I was a kid. But I always had little toy Ferraris, right. That was always my thing. It was my brand. They were red, and they’re fast, and they’re fun and they’re sporty. And that always stuck with me. Then going through, like all of this real estate stuff and making some money and like having successes. I said, okay, like, if I’m never gonna buy a sports car, or a Ferrari like, now’s the time. Let’s do that.

 

Erwin  

So we did. What was the time? What was the time, the trigger event? But it was like, now’s the time to buy it. Yeah,

 

Ryan  

so the school story. I always said to myself that I wanted a Ferrari, but I never wanted to pay full price for it because I was buying equity in real estate. I want to do the same thing with cars. I said to myself, when the market falls apart, luxuries go on sale, and that’s when I’ll buy it. Right and I did just that. So over the number of 60 some odd deals. I saved up a couple grand here a couple grand there just kind of put it aside forgot about it. That was my car fun. Right? And I got to the point where COVID came in. The market fell apart. luxuries went on sale was a very short time period. But there was the opportunity. There’s this window, I found the perfect car. Bought it right there.

 

Erwin  

rest is history. Keisha Keisha how you how you found it how you found the car. Yeah, so

 

Ryan  

I actually did Kijiji Facebook marketplace Auto Trader like all the online like all the online ads. And I did a we buy Ferraris fast for cash programme right in amongst that I had like

 

Erwin  

you had your the ad you had Yeah,

 

Ryan  

just like people do. We buy houses and Senate flyers I did like a I put one on Kijiji

 

Erwin  

so instead of like house pictures or house logos, you put a car. Yeah. Ferrari. Yeah. So Ferraris

 

Ryan  

like red with nice rims and like all this stuff, right? Put it up there. I think I put it in like Microsoft Paint. Like it was a cheesiest ad like we buy Ferraris for cash, call me. And in amongst that campaign where I was a waiting for inbound leads to come in, right and be reaching out to people saying, Yeah, you know, I see your cars for sale. If it doesn’t sell, give me a call, like things like this. Right in amongst that campaign. I came across the car that I wanted. There’s two particular models. And the rest is history. I bought it right there. I bought equity. Right? The person who bought it from us fantastic, like really great guy still have a relationship with that person today. And I love the car.

 

Erwin  

Right? He doesn’t feel slighted how much you made? No,

 

Ryan  

no, you know what he was thrilled, I think. And I all I can do is insert myself into the way that I feel he was thinking at the time, right? I called him he didn’t pick up. He called me back like a week later. And I figured, well, this car is pretty reasonably priced. Like and it’s really pretty. It’s probably gone. So I just kind of wrote it off. Well, he called me back a week later. Hey, I’m so and so whenever you’re available. Let me know. I’ll get the car down for you. He’s down. Yeah, that’s where I sit. Down comes down. Berry dough from okay. So I roll up and he takes it down off the hoist and takes it out into the driveway. And it’s all nicely polished, recently serviced all the owner’s manual service records the whole bit. And the car was really beautiful. It has everything that I want it and a guy was awesome, too. He’s like, come on into my home. We had a coffee, talk a little bit about it. I met his wife like, like really great. Just Just a great people. Right. And not only did he get the car, but he got the relationship. And I think that’s really

 

Erwin  

cool. So he called off your ad or they posted an ad. I reached

 

Ryan  

out to him. He posted an ad in my campaign of inbound and outbound. You know, trying fine. Right. I had reached out to his ad. And he called me back. There was a price on the end. There was oh, there was so I got a little bit of a reduction. Right, which is great. I also got an awesome car.

 

Erwin  

Any idea if he any other any serious inquiries or inquiries? He did?

 

Ryan  

He did. I again, I can only guess based on my interaction with him there. I think he sold it to me, because he liked the relationship too. That’s my guess. That’s my guess.

 

Erwin  

Can you give a percentage? How much has gone up in value?

 

Ryan  

Oh, yeah. That car went up in value. I think I bought it about 60 cents on the dollar. So it’s probably gone up 40% or more?

 

Erwin  

Is it $1 than or $1 60% of your 40% of 60 cents? You know, I mean, so I went up 20% 2628 cents.

 

Ryan  

It’s heavy math. I don’t know. We went up I went up my half the value of the car.

 

Erwin  

Okay, yeah. Okay. Oh, then it’s over. It’s over the dollar. That mountain. If you paid $1 on the dollar, then you know, you’re over.

 

Ryan  

I paid 60 cents for what the car was worth. And then it went up a bit. I don’t know it just went up.

 

Erwin  

Did you make money? I made money and you’re happy I’m very happy you ever gonna sell it? That’s dumb question.

 

Ryan  

Like it’s again for me it was more of the emotional buy like this wasn’t a this isn’t a flashy thing and like posted on social media like it doesn’t I get it every time I go somewhere people are gonna take a picture of the car and make sure right but like I’m gonna post this stuff like I’m not a flashy guy doesn’t mean that stuff doesn’t mean anything to me. emotionally. I wanted it for me, not for others. And the fact that other people enjoy it, I think is great. How’d you feel?

 

Erwin  

How do you feel about it?

 

Ryan  

I love it makes me feel good. Right? It just get in. It’s tight. It’s fun. It’s sporty, I take it to the track sometimes, you know, it looks great.

 

Erwin  

Park near you, right? You’re lucky. Yeah, this track is nowhere near here.

 

Ryan  

So the Ferrari dealership, they called me and said, Hey, we’re doing a track, they wanted to come out. So we went out. And like there’s, there’s a guy like with the espresso machine, it’s like, it’s all like a nicely done day, a whole bunch of people with other cars. And it was a really cool experience to be able to take my own vehicle to the track. And I did a little video on the way there, I never ended up posting it. But I did this little video. And I was like, I just sent it to my family. And I said, Hey, you know, big day, I’m going to the track today. And the coolest part is that I get to take my own car. Right? And you know, I sat next to people at lunch that sold their companies to American Express for like, you know, hundreds of millions of dollars, here’s me like little rental portfolio to cover the duplex. That’s right. That’s right. So it was a really cool experience to know that there’s people out there with, with more money or more experience or, or better cars or faster cars. And, you know, I was able to compete with that and hang out for the day.

 

Erwin  

And are you able to you’ve done any business with these people? Like, is it? Is it a good networking opportunity?

 

Ryan  

I haven’t done any business with anybody car related. I imagine it would be a good networking opportunity. But I don’t really use it like that yet. It definitely does, though, because I’m part of a few other car clubs. It definitely does open the door before you even open your mouth. Right. It’s just a visual representation of, you know, some success that you’ve had in your business career. And people automatically attribute that to Yeah, this guy probably knows what he’s talking about. Right. So that is really cool.

 

Erwin  

That’s cool. Now we’re running out of time. So I want to ask you, you’ve done a fair amount of education, hired coaches and stuff. Any particular favourites? Any favourites? You’ve probably you’ve put, you’ve dropped a lot of money on coaching.

 

Ryan  

I have Yeah, I probably spent, I don’t know, over 100 grand anyways, coaching. But that’s returned to me by I don’t know how many folds, but several times even just just negotiating with tenants and stuff like that, trying to figure out, okay, I want to put a house on the market or on the market. What does that mean? How can I parlay this to the tenant so that it’s advantageous for both of us? Right? How do we work on that? So just the way that you use your words is important. Any particular favourite right now I really love Alex for mosey he’s on. He’s on YouTube. He’s got some podcasts and stuff. He’s great. He’s not a formal coach of mine by any means. But his content is terrific. Very, very good.

 

Erwin  

See the former gym owner? Yeah, lots of German. Yeah, always disciple of Russell Brunson.

 

Ryan  

Is it? Okay, I know he did a bunch of stuff with him. I didn’t know that he was like a descendant of okay,

 

Erwin  

any of the paid ones, then you have the paid real estate coaching that you’ve done that you want to shout out to?

 

Ryan  

Specifically? No, no, like, I just I really do. I really do appreciate when people share information with me. And I do appreciate paid or free content. Right. And I just think that, if you’re able to digest that, and then use it in the market, it’s worth the money because you’ll get it back. I’ve said it for a long time. Education is like a stove, buy once and use it forever. Right. And like, that just rings true for anybody who’s active and actually doing the doing, if you’re not doing the doing, like, don’t read the books, because it’s just not worth it. Don’t take the courses don’t do the weekend training because it’s just not worth it. Like who said that quote was like, there’s no difference between a person who doesn’t read and a person who can’t read? Is it Mark Twain? I don’t know if it was somebody like Mark Twain or Jim Rohn. I don’t know one of these guys. But like, it’s true. You know, why learn to play pool? If you’re never gonna play pool again? Right? Why would you why would you go to a weekend course to play pool billiards, right? If you never play with your friends, or if you never go to the bar and playing League,

 

Erwin  

or for my case, why learn golf when you suck someone? There you go. So we’re running out of time. Right? I want to ask some final thoughts. Like we’re in the middle of a declining market in everything.

 

Ryan  

Stocks, everything.

 

Erwin  

So is it time to like, pull the chute and, you know, sell everything or? We think

 

Ryan  

I’m short term bearish long term bullish. Right. I think I said this in the downturn, somewhere in 2017. We talked about on your show. I was short term bullish long term or short term bearish long term bullish there. Right. And I feel the same way. Now. I think we’re gonna go through some choppy waters for the next couple of years. I don’t think anybody saw what happened with COVID happening, because interest rates are so low, and they printed so much money with shot the market like straight to the moon. So I mean, yeah, I still think that we’re going to be in a short term, tough time. I think we’re long term bullish, because at the end of the day, it’s inflation that the government’s all want, right? They target 2% Inflation is like the goal, right? Because if we don’t have inflation, consumers get very bearish and they don’t buy because they know tomorrow, it’s going to be worth even less. Right. So to kickstart the economy, they keep a 2% hedge knowing that Okay, right. Next year is gonna be worth more which means consumers will shop two percents the goal, so long term, I’m still bullish short term, I’m definitely bearish, right, but that brings opportunity,

 

Erwin  

right. So then immediate term, you’re still buying stuff if something makes sense to you,

 

Ryan  

if you buy equity I’ve been like that and in a good market and a bad market, right? The strategy still rings true. Obviously, you don’t want to catch a falling knife. That’s like the going term. You know right now, but it’s true. Like if you buy something for 100,000 today and the market falls 20% it’s only worth 80 Tomorrow, right if you bought it for 60 Well, you’re still up. You still good. So obviously it

 

Erwin  

fantastic. Brian, thanks so much for doing this. Thanks for making the drive out. Thanks for bringing the car. Thank you for having me on. Yeah, hopefully we have some fun golfing. I agree. All right. Awesome. Thank you.

 

Erwin  

Before you go, if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forget the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more likes you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario. If you’re interested in learning more and register for free for my newsletter at www dot truth about real estate investing.ca. Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself what so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

 

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Dos and Don’ts From a Real Estate Investor/Lawyer Hussein Kudrati

How’s your summer? Making the most of it?

As Jessie Itzler, our keynote speaker for the Wealth Hacker Conference says, “Summer Hard”! 

No one includes September as part of summer, so we really only have 8-9 weeks of summer to enjoy and create memories… Especially after two years of locked-down summers.

When was the last time you saw your mom? For me, it’s been since 2019, as the lockdowns in China are tough, but she finally made her way back from Hong Kong to stay with us for a while.  

I haven’t seen her for over three years, and my parents aren’t getting any younger, so we’ll be looking to enjoy this season.

 
 
 
 
 
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A post shared by Erwin Szeto (@erwinszeto)

Couple of weeks back, the kids were at a week-long overnight camp while Cherry and I were at a friend’s cottage. It was a whole week without kids, so we caught up on sleep and worked less, but yeah, we still worked while on vacation; such is the life of an entrepreneur…

And some of it’s fun; I met up with a bunch of Belleville investors, including HGTV’s own Stephen Phillips, for a round of golf and a tour of Belleville for investment properties.

Why Belleville? Much of who I consider the smart money in the Durham region are investing in Belleville; hence I’m doing some R&D: rip off and duplicate. 

For example, our clients picked up a large bungalow on a good-sized lot for $400,000, i.e. prices we paid in Hamilton back in 2016; hence opportunities for cash flow are greater.  

My whole team of investor coaches: James, Tammy, Jamil, Chris, Tim, and Stephen went. Stephen is local to Belleville, so he hosted us in fine style, a private dinner in the country made with local ingredients, we drank local wine, and nothing beat the company.

I know I had a blast!

After seeing the opportunities in Belleville, we’ll run another tour soon, so if you’re an east-of-the-GTA investor, you need to put this town on your list!  

This current environment is the best opportunity to buy since the crash in 2017, where prices doubled almost five years later.

No one knows what the next five years hold, but all the smart money I know and follow is bullish in the long-term and cautious in the immediate term.

Speaking of smart money, we have one of our lawyers, Hussein Kudrati, on the show who is an active entrepreneur, real estate investor, stock investor and comes from several generations of successful entrepreneurs, real estate and stock investors.  

 

Dos and Don’ts From a Real Estate Investor/Lawyer Hussein Kudrati

Hussein is a trusted advisor to Cherry and me since he understands the problems faced by families with assets; hence he prepared our wills for us and handled our most recent refinancing of now five properties.  

That’s right… We’re freeing up capital and improving our cash flow to be ready to take advantage of these dips in the market.

Hussein knows a good investment when he sees one; hence he was one of the first to sponsor Cherry and I’s Wealth Hacker Conference.  

If you, too, are interested in sponsoring, please reach out to us by responding to any email you receive from us.

Hussein and I discuss several topics, including what investments he likes and absolutely refuses to assist clients with (yup, those investments are just that bad), how someone as successful as himself wants to raise humble children, and investing in physical gold.

As always, it’s fascinating to pick Hussein’s brain, so please do enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

Erwin  

Hello and welcome to another episode of The Truth about real estate investing show. How’s your summer going? Are you making the most out of it as just the answer? Our keynote speaker for the wealth hacker conference says summer hard because no one includes the timber as part of summer. Technically it is. But people go back to work in school and some separate September so it’s not for many part of their summer. So anyway, there’s really only eight, nine weeks of summer to enjoy and create those memories, especially after those last two years of lockdowns. When was the last time you saw your mom. For me it was as it was 2019 as lockdowns in China in Hong Kong are tough. But finally she made her way back from Hong Kong to stay with us for and with no return date. I haven’t spent mom in over three years and my parents aren’t getting any younger. So we’ll be looking forward to enjoying the next couple of months with my mom and making memories. So yeah, summer hard out there. This week. Our kids were at the cottage sorry, not on a cottage. They were at an overnight week long overnight camp, while cherry and I are at Cata cottage at a friend’s cottage so we had a blast. We had a whole week without the kids, which was weird. We did miss them of course. But we talked about opportunity to catch up on sleep. We were working less working less but still yeah still working while on vacation, such as the life of an entrepreneur. And some of its fun. I got to meet up with a bunch of Belleville investors, including HGTV zone Stephen Phillips for around a golf and a tour of Belleville for investment properties duplexing and other development opportunities. Why Belleville because much of who I consider smart money in the Durham Region are making the trip to Belleville to invest. Hence we’re doing some r&d rip off and duplicate that research and development. For example, clients of ours picked up a large bungalow on a good sized lot for $400,000. Those are prices that we paid in Hamilton back in like 2015 2016. Hence opportunities for cash flow are greater. Even though the prices are what we used to see you like 567 years ago, the rents are quite high. So again, great mix of more affordability and greater cash flow potential. My whole investor team of coaches we all make the trip out. James Tammy Jamil, Kristen, Tim and of course Steven Steven HGTV Phillips hosted us. Steven is of course local to Belleville, so he host us and find style. We had a country’s private dinner country style private dinner made with local ingredients and we drink local wine and nothing beat the company I had I had a blast and after seeing the opportunities in Belleville, there’s nothing more than joy in life than that great company and around, especially with like minded investors who you know are action takers and wanting more out of life are driven. And also of course, investment opportunities. So we’ll run out another tour soon. So if you’re east of the Greater Toronto Area, you need to put this town on your list. Come check it out. Likely it’s new to you. Towns are only 50,000 people. So unlikely any of your listeners are live to live in Belleville. So if you’re new to town, you definitely want to get in touch with someone who knows the area and knows contractors and knows property managers and knows what what the opportunities are. You definitely want to reach out to our team, especially since we have Steven Phillips on the team. He has been featured in or made appearances. I think this term whatever he’s been on HGTV like 2426 times anyways. But in this current environment, this is the best I’ve seen in the market in terms of opportunity to buy and cashflow since the crash of 2017. And for those who remember studied history in 2017, you know in the summer of 2017, and that was probably near the bottom. And since then prices doubled almost five years later, what the next five years health have in store for us I have no idea nobody knows. But all the smart money I know and I follow are bullish long term and of course cautious in the immediate term. Speaking of smart money, we have one of our lawyers who think of droughty on the show who is an active entrepreneur, real estate investor stock investor, who comes from several successful generations of entrepreneurs real estate and stock investors, who seems is a trusted adviser to Chennai since he understands the problems faced by families like our own who, who have assets and businesses just to care about preparing futures for hence he helped us prepare wills will wills whatever.

 

Erwin  

He’s helped us with our family, family, future estate planning whatnot. And he’s handled most of our recent real estate transactions including the refinancing of now five properties we refinance finance three and then we just now we just refinance two more. That is right. We are free of capital, improving our cash flow positions, ready to take advantage of these these dips in the market, both stock and real estate and crypto. We’ve seen it as a good investment when he sees one hand sees he was one of the first to sponsor cherry nice wealth hacker conference. If you too are interested in sponsoring, please reach out to us by responding to any of the email has received from us, or just reach out to me over social media, Hussein and I discussed several topics, including what investments he likes, and absolutely refuses to assist clients with. Yeah, those investments are just that bad. He won’t accept your money to help you to help you with them how someone as successful as himself wants to raise humble children, investing in physical gold of Ghana. And of course, we’re talking about real estate investing and stock investing. As always, it’s fascinating to see his brain so please enjoy the show. Having seen your own horror, you are excellent. What’s keeping you busy these days?

 

Hussein  

Not enough golf. That’s for sure.

 

Erwin  

Not enough. We were just out yesterday, last this week. Yep. What’s enough? What is enough,

 

Hussein  

I’d like to be playing twice a week, twice a week. But in all seriousness, works, keeping me pretty busy. And I welcomed the new addition to my family a few months ago. So that’s also keeping me busy. Being a father of two now is its own unique challenge that I’m really enjoying at this time.

 

Erwin  

You seem surprisingly awake for having a newborn at home. I have

 

Hussein  

a wonderfully supportive wife and very caring parents.

 

Erwin  

Are your parents doing? They’re enjoying

 

Hussein  

their loving grandparent life? You know, they say nothing better. Right.

 

Erwin  

Can I ask how long they’ve been retired for? Are they technically Would you consider them retired?

 

Hussein  

Yeah, I would say they’ve been retired. I’d say that they’ve been fully retired for the last five years, I would say, Okay, I mean, they still have their interests and their ventures that they do from time to time. Right. But it’s now more passive, you would say, more philanthropical if you will. Right. But fundamentally, their focus and their time commitment is largely dedicated to being grandparents now. That’s pretty cool. Yeah, I mean, there’s nothing I mean, as you know, especially from our cultures, the influence of a parent on the next generation is the grandparent to the grandchild, is the best way to inculcate them with the values, the traditions, the morals, the ethics, that you want them to have, right. And for me, I’m very fortunate that my parents have graciously agreed to assist with those objectives. It also allows me to have free time to pursue still things that I enjoy. While not they completely abdicate my responsibilities. But I really enjoy the ability to focus on building my law, practice networking, and building my connections within this community. Because, in truth, I’ve only been in this community for the last six years, which is not the longest time and especially when you had zero connections coming to this community. It’s always a work in progress this early to keep building your network and your connections, not just from a professional perspective, but just from a personal because it does take a village to live life event. And I want to build those relationships, I want to have those networks. And I want to create a stability and a foundation that if my children want to stay in this area, they don’t have to start from scratch, and they have the advantages of you know, parents are established in the community.

 

Erwin  

That’s funny, because you could choose any community that you choose this bunch of crazies.

 

Hussein  

Honestly, I truly love it here. I think the quality of life that’s offered here, as long as you make smart choices, and you still have to work hard, it’s not handed to you. But the quality of life here to practice, whatever career you want, whatever religion you want, whatever lifestyle you want. I think it’s something that as Canadians, I think, our generation and the generation coming up, takes it a little bit for granted. Like the quality of life we can have the freedoms we enjoy, are not appreciated. And I want to make sure that at least I do my part to instil that and like, for example, not to get political, but the recent election, right. I wasn’t thrilled with the choices available, or federal provincial election that just came. I wasn’t thrilled with the choices available to anyone was based on the voter turnout. But I appreciate the opportunity to still have a say. And so I insisted on taking my daughter with me. She’s still below five unvaccinated right now, but I still wanted to take her with me to you know, to experience that to know that it’s an important step to take, you know, and it’s a privilege to be able to exercise your world.

 

Erwin  

Did you explain your daughter who you voted for? And why?

 

Hussein  

No, because it’s my job is to teach the importance of voting not to influence our political ideologies. That is something I want her to form for herself.

 

Erwin  

I know but even to educate, you need to say something. These are the three main parties as far as their platform,

 

Hussein  

there will come a time when eventually I would hope that she would take the time to be informed actually read the platform’s not just go with what the talking heads are saying. And actually make an informed decision and vote for your interest because we see this happen it In the US, and almost everywhere in our where people have the privilege to vote, they go with the talking heads they don’t actually vote with. How does this make my family’s life better? Which policies advance? Us? No one thinks like that. It’s too much black and white. And the reality is platforms are grey. And you have to identify,

 

Erwin  

yeah, and it can be largely lies to you Sure.

 

Hussein  

I mean, politicians say one thing to another. We all know that to be true, but at least when you’re voting these vote with something otherwise, what’s the point? Yeah.

 

Erwin  

Nachi. I usually ask other people that are there. It’s a Tim Ferriss model, right? Yeah. You as someone who that’s who’s smart, and well read on the subject, if you have similar values to them, like, for sure. Oh, yeah, I had the toughest time trying to at least try to give like the Coles notes to my kids. We rode our bikes to go vote. Chair and I insist on voting because that ensures our right to complain about what happens. Because my thing is, if you don’t vote, you don’t have the right to complain. So yeah, I rode my bicycle with the kids and just trying to Coles notes, because they have no idea what that what’s going on when we the NDP or what they stand for whatever. Anyways, that’s funny. Anyways, I want to go back to your parents for just another moment, just because we don’t have much opportunity to have people on the show who are on the other side of hustle, right? We’re your parents worked hard.

 

Hussein  

Yeah. My parents, my grandparents and my great grandparents, like they worked hard. And they all sacrificed to some degree for their quality of life, because they wanted to set up future generations. And this is when I talk about importing values, it’s that you could focus on having everything for today, or you could focus on this much is good enough, because I want to leave a legacy for tomorrow. And that’s a choice that everyone has to make where that boundary lies. But I know that like I was fortunate to be privileged enough that my forefathers and foremothers were disciplined enough and motivated enough that they maybe did not enjoy all the day could enjoy. But they took enjoyment in the thought that my future generations will have more options. And I think that’s what we all want for our kids is that they should have more options. And that they should be able to pursue with hard work, what they enjoy, versus doing something simply for the necessity that this provides me a paycheck to put something on the table. And I think that’s the motivation, right? It’s about and I find that, you know, today’s when I’m when people say like, what’s your advice, and I’m like, work for your passion, right? Because often I find if you work for your passion, not everyone, but you will be able to get to a point where the money will flow, as long as the idea is solid, and your passion is solid. Because hard work is almost always rewarded. I find, especially in this country, too, I still maintain that if you work hard, and you are committed, disciplined, educate yourself, which is all part of hard work, you will get somewhere and the financial rewards will come. But also plan for tomorrow, save right? Like Canadians right now have record saving simply because property prices are still at ridiculous highs. But my question is, is where would your savings be if you took out your real estate value from there, and you have to have a hedge, like we’ve seen the softening in the real estate market, to some degree in some areas, and people are understandably stressed. And it shouldn’t be that so much of your wealth is tied up to real estate. Because while it’s a great tool for wealth generation and everything else, liquidity is also important. How are you taking advantage of opportunities? How are you also going to be positioned in the event that life throws you some curveballs, whatever they may be, you have to have some liquidity and you don’t want to have to sell properties. Like imagine if you had bought a property in 2019. You did you’ve done really well, you’re still up, but it’s gonna sting. And I find it hard to believe anyone who tells me otherwise, that if you didn’t sell in February, and you have to sell in April, or may you know that you’ve left money on the table from the peak right? So you never want to be in a position to be forced to sell it should be that it’s a choice. It’s you want to be the master of your own destiny.

 

Erwin  

And I want to say that this this correction or having as came faster and harder than I expected.

 

Hussein  

I think then a lot of people expected right because I mean, and it’s also surprising to me to some degree because the rate increases what telegraph people have been talking about it coming coming coming but for some reason it still caught people off guard

 

Erwin  

well I asked to add to that the run up was caught me off guard to how hard and fast and hard in the run up was was well for like December for January, February. Yeah, I mean, that was crazy. Because it was it was predict all the economists were saying you know, the trigger point for this tick box trickle down will be the first interest rate increase. Alright, so my teens followed and we’ve known

 

Hussein  

it’s interesting again, I mean, you know, who has seen them real estate market do as well as it did during COVID? Two, right, people would have thought people have been hesitant uncertainty around it, but it didn’t stop anything. You know, it ran on steroids

 

Erwin  

when people were just bored. I have all this time for a side hustle. Now. This is an income property.

 

Hussein  

Exactly. I think investors are a big reason that the property prices got driven up so much, because I don’t think it’s first time homebuyers are buying it right. They’re the ones kind of suffering right big time or this market.

 

Erwin  

I feel so bad for them so much political rhetoric and was around supporting and making, you know, making programmes available for the first time homebuyers benefit. You know, like, like waving the land transfer tax in Toronto, being able to use your RRSPs and stuff like that for to borrow for your first home. And they’re Yeah, they’re the ones getting whacked. And this because we were discussing on the golf course, like what your experience is. So for example, we had a guest on just few weeks ago, who does mostly regular real estate with regular agents, regular real estate, people buying and selling homes. In his experience, there’s lots of trouble closing, appraisals are coming in low. So then homebuyers who bought near the peak around the peak, they don’t have enough downpayment to cover. So So closings are being pushed, some people are walking away trying to walk by or some buyers are walking away. And our experience here of working with our clients is extremely different. Every time we’re together. We’re talking economics and what we’re seeing in the market. And our caution, right, like, for example, in this market, like our criteria, our investment criteria is so different as and we want multiple exit strategies and multiple ways to improve a property. So I prefer example, in this market, I want to be able to be able to basement suite, and ideally garden suite as well. Right? Unfortunately, we’re picking up the pieces for another investor who is working with someone else who doesn’t have a good read on the market realtor that doesn’t have agreed on the market. They bought a property in April, May, that had no exits, the sort of vanilla single family home, can’t speak the basement, can curtain suite, and they were paid for it. Anyways, my point is, what are you seeing in the market in terms of like closings appraisals? And then also I had to ask, start with that sort of that?

 

Hussein  

Well, I mean, we have a couple of clients that who are selling, who already bought and now are selling after the fact that bridge, and their buyers are potentially going to walk away, or have at least indicated that they may have trouble closing one of them sent a letter asking for a $60,000 price reduction. When I mean, our client basically told them, you know, wow, I can’t say this in polite company, their response. But that was their response, then I have another one that basically is the trying their to get an extension to the deal, because they’re to bring in foreign money from their parents abroad to help bridge the appraisal gap.

 

Erwin  

And these investors are these regular homebuyer and my understanding

 

Hussein  

is these actually like buying principal residences, regular homebuyers, or just, you know, caught with their pants down a little bit, right, because in both cases, their appraisals came substantially lower than what they bought the properties for. So they’re panicking, understandably so. And my clients, the knock on effect is there as well, right. Like, I’ve already had to connect my clients in preparation with litigators, because you also have to move fast, because you have an obligation of mitigating your damages, and so on and so forth. So you got to make sure that you’re set up to have that success. So that, you know, when this goes before a judge has it, may you have done everything, right, I want to basically create, like, you know, the perfect platform for them to recoup and mitigate whatever stress that they have in their life. So that’s the one side but for the most part, I would say that my clients have been okay. And that they’re, in fact, I see a number of them taking this opportunity to identify deals and are actually quite aggressively purchasing, some of whom are mutual friends, you know, who have done very well for themselves during this market. So it’s all about identifying where the opportunity lies. And the conviction of your business model, like, you know, and most of our clients is barriers or investor oriented, and they’re okay, because they just have had to adjust their numbers, make sure that thing deals make sense. And as long as they’re doing that, they’re going to be okay, because you have to remember this right. One, based on the immigration numbers coming into Canada,

 

Erwin  

we just set a record for this quarter for the highest immigration ever

 

Hussein  

in new units coming online. Or just the correlation is just not there. There’s far more people coming in to put pressure on the market. Investors have been in the game for Few years now have done exceptionally well. They’ve got a lot of equity. So they’ve got a lot of firepower. Even with rising interest rates, they have a lot of firepower and those who know how to use jayvees. Effectively. Again, there’s a lot of people who’ve learned how to use these tools in manners that can move them along. So I don’t see prices falling, because I think the pressures are there. Now certain areas, maybe because they’re just not desirable. But I think core fundamental locations, as long as the location is good, I think the opportunity is there again, do your own analysis, do your own risk tolerance, run your numbers, I am in no position advising somebody, I’m not saying go buy right now or anything. I’m not saying go sell anything. I’m saying analyse your situation. And be I always tell people be nimble. You can’t be static and flat footed, in investing in any area, whether it’s real estate, stocks, whatever you’re investing in business, you have to be nimble, you have to adjust, right? Like if you if you own a canning line, for example, even that, like you got to be able to know like, how is the tech changing? How can I get more efficient, right? Because if you have to pay higher salaries as wages across the board have been going up, you got to recoup that somewhere else, because fundamentally, nobody wants to be hurting their margins. And you don’t want to be fast, because when you pass on cost to your customer, there’s always addressed that they might go and start looking for somewhere cheaper. Yes, you hope that your quality of service, your history of relationship matters. But if someone’s willing to do something for cheaper, money often talks

 

Erwin  

often talks to winning earlier points about being nimble, a mutual friends of ours are doing the same thing, we’re talking about being a bit picky in terms of what you’re buying. So for example, I was talking about, I want multiple options to add value to my property, we have mutual friends who are doing several and built, right, so the buying a double wide lot, the severing it down the middle, basically, to create now to lots and then building on the now empty lot. Right in that deal was not available six months ago,

 

Hussein  

because they were going for the numbers would make sense, right. And now with a reduction in pricing, the numbers start to slowly make sense. But again, it’s important, it’s important to make sure that you get the right help talk to experts. And make sure when you’re getting into the game for new investors, get your performance evaluated. And then after you go evaluated, get it evaluated again. Because the worst thing is in your first one, if you get burned and you lose your savings, yeah, it’ll set you back. So make sure you take the time, pay, you know, take people out to lunch, you know, whatever it takes, but get them to give you the time to actually intelligibly review that pro forma for you.

 

Erwin  

For listeners benefit Hussein and I are available if you’re a member at rattlesnake or a joke, I’m talking about the premium golf golf courses. I just I just I forgot where I was going oh, and like to your point about protecting your your savings, your investment capital, I cannot believe the things that people putting money into. And you’ve seen, you’ve seen some crazy pooled investment funds that people are putting their money into without, I’ll say it actually there’s a there’s an article on the Globe and Mail just about two, three weeks ago about how all these investors are investing on stories rather than any sort of the businesses are the leaders ability to execute on their vision and performance.

 

Hussein  

So and I see this very respectfully, I don’t mean it insultingly at all, but I call it the lemming mentality. They’re just following along. Because that’s what everybody else is doing. They’ve heard Oh, well, my uncle did this, my arm did this. And my friend did this. And whatever it is, and they just go into keep going in and in and in and into these ventures. They don’t understand the project, they don’t understand the rate of return, they don’t understand who is actually the person driving it. And they don’t understand the fees that they’re paying on the capital. I’ve seen some of these proposals from some of the bigger name players out there. And they have like acquisition fee development fee, like they have a fee for literally everything. And I will say that if you have the capital, right that these people need, because ultimately they need your money. Yes, they aggregating it together with other people for you providing them a need to negotiate, negotiate for yourself the best deal you possibly can. And also have a firm understanding. Your question always should be how do I get my money back? Even if you don’t get a return? Right? But at least make sure you get your principal back. You and I have both seen stories where people have lost their principals forget their actual return that they were hoping to make. But they’re not even getting back 100% of their principal. And in a real estate investment with the way the market has been for the last four years. That’s inexcusable.

 

Erwin  

How does it happened?

 

Hussein  

Right and that because you didn’t do the due diligence, you just trusted what other people are saying. Remember, nobody looks after your money. The way you would look after your money. So take the time to ask the questions. And again, like this might seem like I’m trying to generate business for myself, but having a lawyer review like these agreements, what’s it going to cost? Maybe anywhere from 350 to seven or 50 bucks. But when you’re investing 50,000 100,000 200,000, what is that value compared to what? That peace of mind that someone who is experienced and seasoned is telling you this is worthwhile? This is worth doing? Or no, don’t do this. Because I can’t tell you the number of times LPS jayvees. I’ve had to tell clients, mortgages, private mortgages, we have to actually review and I showed the clients it because they’re like, Oh, well, look at this. I’m getting speaking to private mortgage, I’m getting 7%. Unbelievable. And I’m like, Yeah, you’re getting 7%, which have been 4% in fees. So what is your actual rate? It’s 11%. And they’re like, Oh, I didn’t know that. And unlike read it understand what you actually paying, always understand the bottom line, and then make a decision. If you’re then okay with it, at least you’ve made that informed decision, right? So therefore, there is no surprises, you might still be okay with the return, then that’s fine. But know that this is what is actually costing you. This is what your money is worth. And this is what you get and how much they’re making on your money. Always understand that everyone has a right to make money, everyone’s in this to make money. But understand the ratio, how much are they making? versus how much are you making on your money? Keep that in mind? It’s still your money? Yes, they identified a project, yes, they had an idea. But it’s still your money or

 

Erwin  

activity for recording. And we’re not going to name names, we’re talking about a large syndicated mortgage that pulled a lot of money together. And they’re paying fixed interest rates to the investors. And what the, what the developer was doing was they had to develop land, right, and to bring it ready to shovel a shovel ready, and maybe even build some stuff on it, I find a lot of people do not have enough context, like the saying is, it’s all relative, right? And how bring it to investment terms is every investment relative to another. So for example, in the syndicated mortgages, these pooled funds for developments, like it was paying like 8% a year. And then if everything went, Well, you get another 4% per year on the backend. But then for me, judging the risk of what the development was doing that return, if everything went well did not make sense to me,

 

Hussein  

can this and that’s the other thing, like the rate of return has to be relative to the risk, your money’s assuming development has inherent risk is 8%. Sufficient for the amount of risk your money is taking? You know, and because developers like especially smaller ones, who don’t have a tracker, so that’s a thing always check track record. And relating to that, for the small ones, if something goes wrong, they’re going to be delayed paying you out? Where are they going to get the money to keep paying you these returns, the risk of them going under is lower. So you have to think about what can you get upfront from them? Can you get a lending fee? Like, you know, is that available to you think about what options are available to you to structure it to make it in your favour.

 

Erwin  

And then I don’t think enough people understand like my money secured on where the second mortgage on the property was a second mortgage mean, there’s that question to ask. And then the question I ask is, even if things go sideways, how long it’s going to take to get your money back. If you can get your money back

 

Hussein  

and understand LTV, understand how LTV is being calculated, and make sure you’re not being fooled in the way the LTV is being calculated, right.

 

Erwin  

And from my experience from these deals have gone sideways, the appraisals were done, appraisers were done based on finished value versus current value, current appraised value. And so then LTV was loan to value was completely inflated. Exactly right. So but again, I don’t think beginners know enough to merely make this analysis. And that’s why I like talking to you. Because there’s a bunch of lawyers who won’t give opinions on an investment. Sometimes they don’t have the context. Like for example, if they’re new grad, they won’t have the context to say I’ve seen lots of these deals go sideways, right versus you see lots of stuff go sideways.

 

Hussein  

Unfortunately, I wouldn’t say lots I’ve seen enough that I know not just from my legal capacity, but just from being informed and be informed I care I care about. It’s like a hobby, right? Everyone has a hobby. For me Finance News, how markets work, how the economy is performing. It’s like a nerdy interest for me, right? Because, one, I’m actively involved in this space, not an interest in stuff because I mean, that’s for as you know, for personal or religious reasons that’s out of context, but from just in how to invest in ways that you know, generate returns because ultimately, the way my ancestors left things better for future generations. That’s what I want to work hard and make things better for my kids and my grandkids and you know, and leave something for them that’s built in a way that solid and how do I do that? If I’m not informed? I don’t erect not just what I’m working hard for. But what’s been done privileged enough to have been left behind by people that come before me I have an obligation to safeguard and grow. And that only comes from being informed.

 

Erwin  

Then an interesting about your story and journey is that you have the benefit of, of coming from multiple generations of investors, entrepreneurs, business builders. On this show, I think we rarely have someone who’s beyond a second generation investor, and as reading psychology and money in the book explained how, like, for example, RSPs are not that LOLed Rs, what do you remember when RRSPs or 401k? Is became a thing? 70s 80s?

 

Hussein  

I would have to assume maybe 60s.

 

Erwin  

Right. So my point is that the concept of saving for retirement is not that old. Really? No. Right, let alone investing.

 

Hussein  

But the concept of retirement itself is quite new

 

Erwin  

people died younger back then. So they didn’t have to worry about the

 

Hussein  

worth. I mean, think about it, right? Like, I mean, the old farmer types, given that we see them, right, the 8085 90. And they’re still going in tilling the fields. And you know, they still care, right?

 

Erwin  

I point is, and I don’t know, oh, you told me, I’m always thinking about the future. I like a little bit of neurotic about these things. Like, like, for example, I have a nanny. And my plan is to keep her until I need a nanny is my boy, right when I’m at I’m not telling fields. But I’ve planned for these things like financially my investments plan. Yeah. I don’t find enough people are planning for use it tomorrow. But really, we mean, yeah. I mean, 3055 generations down the road. Yeah. Are we anomalies? I think probably not amongst your clientele.

 

Hussein  

Even then, like I see there’s a mix. I wouldn’t say we’re anomalies. I think there are lots of people who are genuinely trying to create financial freedom, wealth, freedom, however you want to call it for multigenerational, and they’re working in their own way towards it. But I think there’s a lot of what is a social media age, and I don’t want to sound like an old grandfather on this, you know, back in my day, because you’re young. But having seen that I find is a great desire for instant gratification. There’s this great desire that I mean, x on this deal that said, I’m going on a vacation to Bali, I made x on this deal. I’m gonna get myself my luxury sportscar. And it’s like, okay, you got all your vacation to wherever you got your luxury sports car, you got your fancy watch, you got all these beautiful things you’ve gone and bought, what have you actually left in the bank that if tomorrow, God forbid, you got hit by a bus, and you couldn’t work anymore? And you need care? What do you have left? Can you afford it? What is your quality of life going to be? If suddenly you cannot work and you cannot do anything? And people don’t actually want to stop. They say it’s more but they say oh, it’s negative thinking, oh, you know, you’re manifesting failure. I’m like, It’s not that it’s a in my view. It’s only by the grace of God, or whatever you believe in, or if you don’t believe in anything, whatever. But it’s luck, that you have health, that you have opportunity that you’re in Canada, like, it’s all so much of our life is luck. And I’m like, we can’t just apply luck to 100% there’s already so much luck in what we do and where we are. That you have a responsibility to wonder and ask yourself, what is that luck changes? What does my life look like? And I motivate myself by saying that even if my luck changes, my parents, my wife, my kids, my grandkids, they’re gonna be okay. And myself too. You have to look out for yourself you can’t always be about others to you know, you have to look out for yourself, will I be okay? Will I be able to get whatever care I need? If something happens to me, will I be able to still have the quality of life to pursue the interests that I want to pursue? And all of that costs money and it’s only getting more expensive? So if you’re going and spending every there’s a time and a place I’m not saying don’t enjoy luxuries, and don’t have a good life at all. Go see the world go by yourself whatever you want. But make sure you’re still planning and being proportional in what you’re doing. And I just find this too much off. Oh, well the next deal I’ll save but that next deal I’ll save never seems to come

 

Erwin  

for an exercise just to understand our clientele and business. I was going down my client list especially are our clients had been with us since for like over 10 years and whatnot. And funny observation they made was how much our clientele is just like in the book, The Millionaire Next Door. Our clients are frugal people. They don’t dress with Flash. They don’t drive cars that almost none of our cars have premium vehicles as in like, you know, Acura Lexus Tadelakt, right. Almost none of them do. And even if they do, often they probably bought it used. And again, looking at them, you never know they’re, they’re real estate millionaires. But again, yeah, a lot of them are very frugal and And the reason I share this is because those with SEC financial success to people who aren’t sort of posting on social media, how much flash and dash they have. That’s true by rich clientele are they be sharing was nothing on social media about how successful they are financially? Like it’s interesting. Why do you need to you don’t need to.

 

Hussein  

But I always ask myself when I see it, I’m like, What is this person trying to show me? Right? And I’m not going to form judgement and pass it. But I always ask myself that question. Regardless, when people post on social media, I see the physical of the obvious of what they’re trying to show. But I always ask myself and within myself, what are you actually trying to show me? Right? And each have their own, everyone has to live their life and how they want to do it. But personally, it’s I find it very curious.

 

Erwin  

For example, I have lots of clients will come on the show, because of that private, and like, Oh, I’m not special, blah, blah, like, I’m like, look around yourself, and tell me who’s richer in your inner circle? Right? For example, if a client is a teacher, a retired teacher, like, do you know when teachers are at a higher net worth than yourself, and they don’t want to share, right, and my point to them is, you’re not gonna inspire anyone if you don’t share. So that’s my point. My observation of law in human behaviour is people won’t do things unless they think it’s a it’s low risk, and they think they can do it. So literally, actually, now that I remember this, that’s the kind of same kind of talking about the retired teacher, another client of mine, I was telling him how her about her successes, and he’s like, I know her, how come I’m not like successful, I need to try harder. And he did. Right. So he was inspired by the actions of another person. Right? The whole the whole term of social proof. You know, when you hit the when you drive the ball, 260 yards be like, Okay, I maybe can do that, too. Right? It’s humanly possible for Hussein, maybe it’s humanly possible for myself, you know, me, for sure. Alright.

 

Hussein  

It’s always possible if we apply, and people often, but not everyone knows what’s possible. They put limitations, they put your hand brakes on their own ambition. And I just find that some very skilled, very talented people if they just had some discipline, right, like, it’s what we talked about offline, where I don’t recall again, who said it, but there was some very successful US investor who said that if you put $500 a month into an index fun, but how many people do like, I guarantee you that in our generation, the next generation, if you told someone, you put $500 away a month, then you’ll be a multimillionaire in 20 years, how many of them do you think would have the discipline to do that, I would venture the percentage would be quite small, because they won’t be willing to sacrifice at $500 a month right now. Because they might mean a night out less a meal out last night, the newest sunglasses, that’s more important. Even if you could guarantee that, that in 20 years, you’d be a millionaire, if you did that.

 

Erwin  

I mean, it’s forced on my kids. Give me your login.

 

Hussein  

A lot of successful immigrant parents, who literally when the kids have started working very successful, great kids, but they but they literally require their kids to give them $500 A month, some frame is paying back for their education or their pet, what the parents are doing is they’re doing exactly that investing $500 in an index fund for them. The number is different, whatever it may be, but I know a lot of immigrant parents, especially who do that for their kids out there starting out professionally to keep them discipline. Plus, there’s also like some family planning and all that like family law benefits and all that to that kind of structure as well. So it’s like, you can kill many birds with thinking like that.

 

Erwin  

So what was the diversification

 

Hussein  

but this is only a small amount of the portfolio. It’s not diverse.

 

Erwin  

So you and I have been talking about gold offline, we’re actually we’re talking another thing that we talked about a lot. Now we have some pretty cool conversations. And we were talking about that, that gold discovery, for example, in Uganda, which is hopefully positive news for all those involved, understand a Chinese company that invested $200 million to help find that gold, but I’m sure everything’s gonna work out. Well, the poor people will get their own gold and everything like that. Anyways. But the headline was 31 million tonnes of gold ore discovered in Uganda, right? And then which made me dig deeper. Because it’s hard to find, how much would actually braille to repeal the protests? And I think the number was 31,000 tonnes? I think. So that 1% Yeah, what about 1% of the autodiscovery will be will be converted into actual gold. And why this is interesting to me is because as someone who just likes to geek out about economics and hard assets, I went looking for that news article news item because Michael Saylor mentioned it, Michael, Sylar being the CEO of not sure if he’s the founder, CEO of MicroStrategy. So one of the biggest had coined celebrities out there out there. He called that equal to that. That finding, because based on Google, I don’t know if it’s accurate. But the first result from Google, when I Googled how much gold is there in the world is about 20s. I don’t know what the date 27 million tonnes of processed gold existence in the world. So then 31 million tonnes would sound like we’re basically doubling the supply. And that’s when he said, right, basically, this new discovery basically doubles the gold supply. So folks, don’t please quote me on this, go ahead and look it up yourself. So that’s why I was digging into it. But in fact, it’s a 1% change.

 

Hussein  

Yeah, that’s the thing, right? is similar to what I mentioned earlier in this conversation about the social media and people posting and you, you take your take the obvious as what they’re saying. And then you ask yourself, what are they actually saying, right? It’s the same thing. Everyone has a narrative that they’re trying to push. And if you just go with the narrative they want you to take, sometimes they could be fine, that could be great and awesome. But it could also mean that you’re missing the point of what’s in your interest. Because you’re basically just accepting someone else’s narrative, and then adopting it into your life, and then you percolate it down. And sometimes this can be very, very damaging, right? It’s

 

Erwin  

because my understanding of gold would be incorrect. If my understanding was the same as Michael sailors versus 1% is not the end of the world. It’s not gonna change, not gonna change the hardness or overall value of gold.

 

Hussein  

No. And that’s the fundamental thing about gold is people just keep talking about gold is just like this jewellery item, right? Like this luxury item. But gold has so much functional use in industry, that people just and that’s where the when people say like, Oh, why are you so bullish on gold? And why do you like gold so much? It’s because it has functional use. And especially as we go towards electric vehicles, and all these other things, in my opinion, again, do your own research goal is going to play a factor in that to

 

Erwin  

you things can be needed for the production. It’s a fantastic

 

Hussein  

conductor, one of the very best existed like back in the day, McLaren used to use gold in their vehicles.

 

Erwin  

No G. Like the f1. Like

 

Hussein  

no like they’re the road supercars.

 

Erwin  

Like, but yeah, it’s it’s dropping weight, how much gold,

 

Hussein  

not not a lot, but because of this conductivity, right at those temperatures at those speeds, those heat, and I eventually they’re going to need to do that. And especially when you think about it, right, right now we use cobalt for batteries and things like that those are at this time, or more unstable sources, more volatile countries, gold is going to have more opportunity. And not just that in aerospace gold is used so much in planes and things like that. In defence systems gold is used, like, and then obviously it’s appealing jewellery and all that is, has been there forever. And again, though, thing ask is, and again, someone can much smarter than me who’s listening gear will correct me but from my understanding, almost nothing you can point to that has been a symbol of value and status, since as far back as history records, like it was value, like what else? Like I mean, animal skins, like no doesn’t have value today, right?

 

Erwin  

That’s not good for world culture.

 

Hussein  

That’s what I’m saying. Right? Like, gold is retain value, despite the world changing immeasurably dozens of dozens of times over 100 years, right? Like different systems, different countries, different cultures, different, different. Everything in gold has always retained value. Okay, if you own gold, you were successful and rich, no matter what time you lived it.

 

Erwin  

Right. So you said the word you said was retained. That’s why all your heard. So your your your gold investment is probably the right where the investment is you’re trying to store wealth, of course. Right. And so that’s your primary objective for gold. Exactly. Okay. And another conversation we

 

Hussein  

had and it’s and it’s fantastically efficient at transitioning wealth to the next generation. It is heavy, though, if you have a lot of it. But how do you show ownership it’s much easier to slide it down.

 

Erwin  

Hopefully no accountants are listening. And American conversation, you mentioned how it can be used as collateral. I’ve never actually I don’t have any personal experience or know many people with experiences using it as collateral for for like, can you give me any

 

Hussein  

you can borrow, you can borrow against gold, right? On a small scale, like bigger institutions do do it. But think of in a small scale, right? When people have like how does a pawn shop or you give them gold? They’ll give you cash you give them but you pay them back to cash. You take your gold back, right? They’re bigger institutions, same thing. You deposit gold at certain financial institutions, they’ll be willing to do lend against it.

 

Erwin  

What What would the minimum be? And that’s something we can discuss offline. Oh, yeah, it’s significant.

 

Hussein  

We’ll dive into that. As an offline discussion, no

 

Erwin  

one ever heard of these things. It’s funny because like, when you talk to people who have experience with with wealth, you learn all these other opportunities. Like, for example, I never knew what whole life insurance was before, because that wasn’t the crowds I was rolling with. Right. And partly real estate, is one of

 

Hussein  

the best tools is Yuming. It fits your other values and everything. But from an estate planning tool, it’s absolutely one of the best tools for crossing wealth down. And in fact, like whole life insurance is how the Rockefellers, the Kennedys and others actually transition their wealth.

 

Erwin  

Don’t talk about it, though, at least in my circles, yeah. Remember to worry about the leaves, how they’re playing and not playing. They’re playing golf really great right now, I’m sure. Before we started recording, we talked about other investments you do outside of real estate, and you’ve been yourself and your family and looking for trends. Any trends you want to share right now?

 

Hussein  

It’s not about like,

 

Erwin  

Should we be storing guns, the Trudeau Government is gonna take them away.

 

Hussein  

It’s not about so much transit, just thought about how do you analyse an investment, right? And I say that you can either do what everybody else is doing for the last 12 months and say, Okay, well, I’m going to do that,

 

Erwin  

because a lot of those things aren’t working right now.

 

Hussein  

Or, or you can think, how do I move this to wait, what do people need? What do people need to live? And where are they going to want to go 20 years from now? How are they going to want to go there basically be the creator of trends, especially if you have fun. Again, I’m not saying this is put 100% of your investment into it, be strategic, have you conservative investments, but also don’t put everything into what everyone else is doing? Put some allocate, my personal belief is 15%, to taking a little bit more risk, informed risk as we’ve been, it’s been a theme throughout this conversation, but think about what people are going to need what’s going to matter in this world, in your opinion, and from do your research. 20 years from now, because you can put your money in, in this 20 years from now, think about how much it’s going to be because for example, the example I give is, what was Mississauga 20 years from now, it was really started to build up. But how much of it was farmland and things like that. But if people saw that, you know, Canada’s got a population problem, they’re going to have people coming in Toronto only so much. This is the corridor to Niagara Falls, this is a logical place where things should develop, if you had the vision and started buying land in Mississauga, right? Instead of just keeping on buying in the city of Toronto, right? If you were an investor, and you had some money, and you decided to move your money to Mississauga, today, where would you be? Right?

 

Erwin  

Where will you be loaded?

 

Hussein  

Exactly? Where’s the opportunity? Right? And again, there’s still that same opportunity, you need to think about where Will people live? Where will people move? Are you willing to? And also you will take the risk, right? Because, I mean, there’s this whole concept of is the urban boundary going to move? Yes or No? Everyone can have their own school of thought duck for one, or I guess moving.

 

Erwin  

But

 

Hussein  

imagine before he won, right? Like, if you in late 2021, early 2022. If you started buying up land along projected errors, or whether expected urban boundary may move, right now, it was a risk. What if he didn’t win? What if he doesn’t follow through? What if you were you thought it was going to move it doesn’t move there and moves down the road? You might get burned? And with anything they risk, this risk? But if you it doesn’t move, usually turn up? Why can’t even you know, I’m not going to speculate on here, I have an idea of what multiple that means your property value change,

 

Erwin  

right? So you’d have a large piece of the land or your doesn’t have to be it doesn’t have to be you can reopen to like, you know, a single family home on King Street where the LRT might go through.

 

Hussein  

Why not? Like it’s everyone has to play to their scale, right. And this opportunity for small players opportunity for medium sized players opportunity for big players. opportunity exists. It’s all about your risk tolerance and what you’re willing to do with it. Right? And identify opportunity. Investing doesn’t have to be sexy. To me sexy is making money. So yeah, right. Next year, you know, it’s not about the flash, it’s not about showing the lifestyle or showing your asset off. You know, like, if that was the case, everyone would just have beachfront property in Miami and everything else wouldn’t be done. You know what I mean? So it’s about what are the returns How does your bank balance look? Right? And again, like, keep working till your bank balance looks like a phone number and I don’t mean 911 So

 

Erwin  

401111 If you’re what the memory I forget the what the city number is if you need the city, what are you looking at these days?

 

Hussein  

Honestly, I like resources. I like commodities a lot. I like resources,

 

Erwin  

in particular commodities because like oil is pretty High and gas is pretty high and coming down. I

 

Hussein  

mean, we it is interesting with export controls going on. I think copper is an interesting space to be in, I think nickel, cobalt lithium, these are markets that are again, quite interesting to invest in.

 

Erwin  

So you’re buying futures are you buying? Are you buying real estate in those areas where they’re being mined?

 

Hussein  

It’s a combination. It’s a combination of actually identifying opportunity, right. And then the other thing is anything waterfront, I’m interested in anything because water is going to be, in my opinion, one of the most sought after commodities, clean drinking water is in short supply, and it’s going to be needed. And especially in Canada, if you can get a property with riparian rights, you can use the water, there’s a lot of opportunity there. And then make and they’re not making more often either made me when people say manmade lakes and developments. I’m not talking about that what

 

Erwin  

I got one that’s gonna make me make me a lot of money. I got to drink it. God, that’s a terrible idea. Colleges, thankfully, colleges,

 

Hussein  

if it’s called riparian rights, but even just even without it, right waterfront properties are limited right? Now they’re going to have depth they’re going to flow. Again, if you’re looking for something in quick returns, don’t ask me for real estate buy, because I don’t look at my real estate for quick returns. I look at my real estate a minimum 10 year horizon, because that’s because, honestly, I’m busy. I don’t have time to be keeping up yearly. If I have a 10 year horizon, I commit to the plan, I have to be careful conviction. And then I see through I can’t tell you the amount of times you see people oh my god, I got this 10 year plan, but oh my god, the markets dipped two months into it. Gotta sell gotta sell. I’m like, what was your 10 year plan, you clearly have no conviction in your plan. You have to believe in it. Like when people react. It’s the same with anything, right? Like, if people are reacting to the market and not their plan. I’m like, your plan was worthless. So yeah. That’s That’s it. And again, I don’t mean any of this out of arrogance, or you know, I’m better than anyone. I’ve made mistakes, like, you know, as I’m sure a lot of others have,

 

Erwin  

I’ve made plenty but But ultimately, I live in a lot of fear.

 

Hussein  

Ultimately, why like to come on here is, you know, if you don’t share your experiences, how are people going to learn and avoid the mistakes you made? I feel like one of the decent things you can do as a human being is be willing to share that I’m not perfect. I’ve screwed up lots and lots of times. But I’m still here, I’m still standing and I’m still striving to be better. And if someone as flawed as myself can do it. So can you

 

Erwin  

we talked about cogs briefly. Are you seeing anything in the cottage market coming across your desk? No one’s coming in being very quiet. Oh, no one’s even off. No one’s even buying a

 

Hussein  

very for me and you and I’m sure other other lawyers may have more. But I’ve just not been See I’ve seen like maybe like three college deals this month, which is lower than average for me, but and to our sales that were forced by family dynamic more than anything else,

 

Erwin  

right, like an estate sale or divorce. Well,

 

Hussein  

just I think just not vanilla. Not getting along. The the decision was to sell the generational asset. Got it. And then one was just someone deciding that you know that meats had a decent year in their business and they wanted a cottage for their family. So they decided to buy one. And they took a good opportunity got a good deal and negotiated themselves a private deal, which is quite quite impressive. Like I really respect to that hustle going in knocking door to door to cottages they like saying, Hey, are you interested in selling and finally getting a deal? What month was this? In May?

 

Erwin  

There wasn’t really keen on a particular location. They wanted

 

Hussein  

to be in the corner this like they they 100% wanted to be on stony Lake, and that’s what they want to.

 

Erwin  

Cool. Yeah, I guess I’ve just heard anecdotal stories about some softness in the college market. But again, anecdotal, very limited data points.

 

Hussein  

Yeah. I mean, I’m sure there will be but ultimately, waterfront property, it’s solid, and effective. There’s opportunity, I would say do your due diligence, make sure it’s the right, it is a draw opportunity. I’d encourage you to execute right now.

 

Erwin  

And then people can bring you opportunities to review for sure what stage can they bring you an opportunity to review

 

Hussein  

at any at any stage, right? And honestly, depending on the relationship I have of where you’re coming through, you know, it’s quite inexpensive. Like, you’d be surprised that it’s actually very reasonable to actually just, you know, get on the phone with me for 1015 20 minutes and just say, Hey, these are my thoughts. You don’t have to you can take it or leave it but it just do not have another data point to add to your calculation or analysis.

 

Erwin  

Right. So what’s the downside? So if there’s inter, if there’s a tick tock influencer, touting out a new REIT that is formed, and I want to bounce it off you I can do that. Absolutely. All right. But the dance really well. I’m sure they can build condos like no tomorrow.

 

Hussein  

I

 

Erwin  

I make that up. I’m

 

Hussein  

Joe Granick. I was feeling I should have a better social media presence and I think about two things. One Who the heck is going to want to see my ugly face. And the other thing I think about is This, I can’t move to see my life. So I’m like, I anger moves. I’m not funny. And I’m ugly

 

Erwin  

social media and for me, are you to go the other approach to just show your fancy cars or something?

 

Hussein  

Yeah, that’s me, though.

 

Erwin  

We’ve seen it. Well, thank you for doing this. Any any final thoughts you want to share? Do you spend a lot of time for loss for sizing? I say that, right?

 

Hussein  

Honestly, it’s very simple. It’s be truly yourself. Have a vision, trust your plan. And ask questions from everybody you meet. You never know where they might be. But ask questions. Because you might be shocked at the answers you receive, and how much knowledge you can gain. Always be asking questions,

 

Erwin  

asking questions, how are banks these days on lending, on executing on lending,

 

Hussein  

I’m not a mortgage broker. But this experience, they’re very slow. So make sure you give yourself enough time to close to get instructions, be thoughtful, and get advice from the experts on whether you need to do fixed or variable in this evolving rapidly changing market and ask what programmes have available don’t go with what the first thing they’re trying to pitch, you see what’s available. And unless you’re very happy, or you have established relationship, shopping around, go see foods hungry for your business. It sounds a bit mercenary, but it is the beauty of a volatile market is people are hungry for your business, because it’s not as easy because at one point, it was so easy that they were motivated to fight for your business to struggle for your business. But as the market is evolving and changing, the balance of power is shifting to the consumer now versus the institutional side. So you can push you can say like, Hey, what can you do for me? Right? Because remember, these guys still have to lend out X amount of dollars, they still have their numbers, their quarters, they need to add,

 

Erwin  

and you expect service levels to stay at these levels. Because Because for recording, while simple, well, simple is laid out 30 minutes and who was it in the States was a Morgan Stanley, which major bank just laid off JP Morgan, JP Morgan was a 600 and 1000. I believe in mortgage people. And you think that we might see some of this in Canada as well.

 

Hussein  

That’s what I’m that from? Like, am I very active on Twitter to get news, I find it to be quite reliable source.

 

Erwin  

Twitter killed me on the provincial election? I thought Ford was going down for sure. No, I think that’s part of it as part of who was on Twitter, as certain political leanings on Twitter or a not on Twitter, or whatever, and whatever, it doesn’t matter. And my point is that, you know, there’s

 

Hussein  

an expectation that there’s going to be some kind of, it almost seems like there’s very few people who don’t believe we’re going to go into recession. Some people say we’re already there. Some people say will be a technical recession, whatever the case may be, and generally, layoffs, and recessions go hand in hand. I hope no, because I don’t want anyone to suffer. We’ve already come back come out of two years of a lot of turmoil and uncertainty, which sucks? Well, a lot of families have struggled one way or another. I don’t wish that for anyone. But if you asked him my honest expectation, I think there will be a short recession that will follow layoffs and going to question will service levels improve? Honestly, I’m not optimistic. Because ultimately, in my view, financial institutions don’t care about customer service. They care about shareholder service. And if they’re not paying wages, that means more on their bottom line. I hope I’m wrong. But my own personal experience of banking and stuff. I do have a very good small business advisor right now who I’m happy with. It’s no reflection on her. But having said that, the overall like at the branch level, the service you get is horrific. And a lot of it is just the training that good people like some of this new stuff may young but if you get no training, how are you going to know how to do your job? Right. And because it’s such a high turnover, banks are not investing in training in any meaningful way. Again, my opinion my experience if you’ve had different Daniela me, I’m just honestly sharing my opinion,

 

Erwin  

but you see what I’m going through with my with my refi. Yeah.

 

Hussein  

I mean, it’s been a joke, quite frankly.

 

Erwin  

I think we’re on a fourth revision. Yes. Yeah. Unless there’s context like we were ready this, like everything was was to be done. We’ve had to send it back like either us either. Yeah, I think we’ve sent about four times as in there’s mistakes in the file, like very, very bad mistakes. And most of them are in the are in my favour, so they won’t even go through anyways. So it makes no sense to allow these mistakes to go through by a four four revisions. And we’re almost there. We’re almost there. And then the feedback that we’re getting is also that they’re short staffed behind the back office, so to hear that there’s gonna be layoffs when they’re already short staffed. Oh, man. Things piling up worse for servers because the people that are are are trying to work overwhelmed.

 

Hussein  

Honestly, like sometimes like we get the exception where they get instructions to us pretty quick. But for the most part, like, especially if you’re going to be lender, give yourself a time, really give yourself time. Because you don’t want to be stuck where especially with people needing to use those funds to sell, buy whatever is going on. You don’t want to end up paying that like it’s it’s painful, it’s very stressful if you cannot close because your mortgage funds didn’t come through or whatever right?

 

Erwin  

Initiative ratio of the lenders that aren’t closing on time. This is a specific

 

Hussein  

B lender, I won’t name them. But from my own experience, and I’m not talking about like one or two deals I’m talking about having done about 15 to 20 deals with them in the last few months. Plus talking about the fact that having spoken to other counsel about this specific be lender 70% of their deals are closing on the day of closing.

 

Erwin  

Oh my God, that’s hard. That’s gone up a lot since we last talked

 

Hussein  

there. This is one specific one. All right, that just is very problematic.

 

Erwin  

Is it an appetite for lending? Or is it honestly,

 

Hussein  

I find there’s I think there’s systems and processes in this space. Like they’re very good in commercial space. They’re brilliant they so that’s it’s odd that they suck. And there’s no other word for it in the residential space. They’re terrible and have been for a long time. And it’s just gotten worse,

 

Erwin  

right? Because the demand is only getting greater for be landing in this environment, they

 

Hussein  

don’t review the file, you can send the file three, four days before they don’t review it till the afternoon after closing. They want to slam and they don’t pay attention to Nikki and half of it is asking for documents you’ve already submitted. And then they just go radio silent. So maybe at the end, it could just be a staffing issue could be whatever, right. But to me, it’s unacceptable. If a client has done everything in their possible power, there’ll be no mistakes anywhere along the chain. And you cannot find on time for a simple residential deal. There’s nothing complicated to it, nothing unusual. Some of it is owner occupied principal residence. What’s the issue? Why can you not close it? To me? It’s ridiculous.

 

Erwin  

And can you comment on the level of risk you’re seeing in terms of private mortgages these days, honestly, I’m

 

Hussein  

seeing a lot less. I’m seeing a lot less and less deals, I’m seeing a lot less deals, but they’re still there. It’s still going and I know some private lenders is just not lending. Look, I know clients, we used to use private lender x a private lender, why? And they just seem like until the fall, we’re just not issuing any new deals. So I’ve seen that also that that avenue of capitalist right up that avenues capital is dried up for certain clients, they’ve had to go to other private lenders. And I’m seeing the private lenders and are trying to get more upfront fees. And I’m seeing the LTV go down like before you it wasn’t uncommon, you could push up to 85. Now I’m seeing 7075 isn’t one of the sweet spot.

 

Erwin  

And then how many of these at the end of these terms at the end of private mortgages? How many you seen are being discharged cleanly?

 

Hussein  

Well, I mean, all of these are new, right? So it’s hard to tell like speak to me in a year but invite me back and we can evaluate this question but for the most part like my clients that have had to borrow private money have been able to pay back and you know, it’s been clean and it’s been good

 

Erwin  

just as someone who’s paranoid in this the last five years and like no, this isn’t the market want to Linden I don’t know what this is going to end. Now finally, I’m right. Finally, finally gravy trains ended. This is a hard thing to do. I did not want to would not have want to have funds landed out in. Right? You’re saying thanks so much for doing this. Appreciate that. You want to hang out with me when you can hang out with much cooler people and much more successful people funnier people than I.

 

Hussein  

Not at all. It’s a pleasure always to be with you or when thanks for having me on the show. And I’m sure we’ll get out on the golf course sooner rather than later. Hopefully,

 

Erwin  

it’s going to be cheering once you thanks to see no worries.

 

Erwin  

Before you go if you’re interested in learning more about an alternative means of cash flowing like hundreds of other real estate investors have already, then sign up for my newsletter and you’ll learn of the next free demonstration webinar I’ll be delivering on the subject of stock hacking. It’s much improved demonstration over the one that I gave to my cousin chubby at Thanksgiving dinner in 2019. He now averages 1% cash flow per week, and he’s a musician by trade. As a real estate investor myself, I got into real estate for the cash flow but with the rising costs to operate a rental business, it’s just not the same as it was five to 10 years ago when I started there are forgive the cash flow reduces your risk. The more you have, the more lumps you can absorb. And if you have none, or limited cash flow, you’re going to be paying out of your pocket like it did on a recent basement flood at my student rental in St. Catharines. Ontario, if you’re interested in learning more, but it’s true for free for my newsletter at www dot Truth about real estate investing.ca Enter your name and email address on the right side. We’ll include in the newsletter when we announce our next free stock hacker demonstration. Find out for yourself but so many real estate investors are doing to diversify and increase our cash flow. And if you can’t tell I love teaching and sharing this stuff.

 

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UPCOMING EVENTS

You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with! Build connections with empire builders and trailblazers at our iWIN events.
 
CLICK HERE to check out what’s coming up next.
 
 

BEFORE YOU GO…

If you’re interested in being a successful real estate investor like those who have been featured on this podcast and our hundreds of successful clients please let us know.

It is our honour to give back and educate others on how we build cash flowing real estate portfolios using all the best practices shared on this podcast, from the lessons of our hundreds of clients and of course our own experience in owning investment real estate.

If you didn’t know already, we pride ourselves on being the best of the best real estate coaches, having the best property managers, contractors, handy people, cleaners, lawyers, accountants, everyone you need on your power team and we’re happy to share them with our clients to ensure your success. 

New investor or seasoned veteran investor, we can help anyone by providing our award winning coaching services and this isn’t all talk.

We have been awarded Realtor of the Year to Investors in 2015 by the Real Estate Investment Network, 2016 by the Canadian Real Estate Wealth Magazine and again in 2017 because no one told the judges no one is supposed to win the award twice but on merit, our peers deemed us as the best.  In 2018, we again won the same award by the Real Estate Investment Network.

Hopefully being the most decorated team of Realtors in Ontario will make you consider us for your first or next real estate investment.  Even if you don’t invest in our areas, there’s a good chance I know who would be ideal for you. 

I’ve been around for a while, some Realtors are talented at servicing investors there are many with great ethics.  The intersection of the two, talent and ethics is limited to a handful in each city or town.

Only work with the best is what my father always taught me.  If you’re interested, drop us an email at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

I hope to meet you at one of our meetups soon.

Again that’s iwin@infinitywealth.ca

Sponsored by:

Infinity Wealth Investment Network – would you like to know how our investors returned 341.8% on positive cash flowing real estate over the last five years? On average, that was 68.4% per year.

Just imagine what winning in real estate could do for you.

If you would like to know how we did it, ask us how by calling 289-288-5019 or email us at iwin@infinitywealth.ca.

Don’t delay, the top markets we focus in are trending upward in price, so you can pay today’s price or tomorrow’s price.

Till next time, just do it because I believe in you.

Erwin

Hamilton, St. Catharines and Toronto Land Development, Real Estate Investor, and soon to be builder.

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Failing Grades, Fighting at School to Top 10 in Class, 11 Properties at Age 27 With Antonio Yong

Happy Anniversary to my wonderful wife, Cherry Chan, my life, business, and investment partner!

 It hasn’t always been easy; relationships are not easy but oh so important for long-term happiness and success.

One thing that’s worked out well is we share so many values, including how we raise our kids to prepare them for all the things I worry about ten years from now when they’re grown up.

For example, our kids will switch martial arts later this summer from kickboxing to Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.  If you’ve watched UFC, you know those two styles are among the most important.

This week we signed up the kids for more golf lessons as, in my experience, golf is a vital skill for business.  The networking opportunities from golfing are among the best I’ve seen and even better for the good golfers. 

Plus, it’s an activity that takes a long time that we can do as a family, so I look forward to the kids opening up and talking to us while golfing.

It’s well known that Tiger Wood’s favourite memories of his dad were when it was just two of them playing golf together.  That’s something Cherry and I focus on with our kids: building memories.  

Collecting things like houses is just a means to an end to invest for the long-term and provide us with our financial freedoms because as great as it is to be a business owner, we don’t have a pension. 

Statistically, among those without pensions, two-thirds will never retire—the opposite of financial freedom.

Speaking of financial freedom, we have a young investor as today’s guest Antonio Yong who’s 27 years old and already owned 11 properties.

Failing Grades, Fighting at School to Top 10 in Class, 11 Properties at Age 27 With Antonio Yong

Antonio had a broken childhood as the child of hard-working, blue-collar immigrant parents who were busy working 60-hour weeks to put food on the table.  

His story of how he turned it around is full of lessons for anyone wanting to turn their fortunes or with troubled teenagers.

And did Antonio ever turn it around, graduating from university top 10 in his class, getting the top co-op placements and great jobs after school.

As he’s a student of some of the greatest investors out there: Warren Buffet, Ray Dalio; he’s in private equity for the Ontario Teachers’ Pension learning from some of the best investors out there and currently works for one of the big five Canadian Banks on Bay Street.

Like myself, Antonio is not loyal to real estate; he’s an investor who prefers real estate for highest returns and best investment thesis.  

This is a pretty cool episode, and if you know any troubled younger people, you may want to share this with them.

Please enjoy the show!

 

This episode is brought to you by me! We don’t have sponsors for this show, I only share with you services owned by my wife Cherry and I.  Real estate investing is a staple in my life and allowed me to build wealth and more importantly, achieve financial peace about the future knowing our retirement is taken care of and my kids will be able to afford a home when they grow up.  If you too are interested in my systematic strategy to implement the #1 investment strategy, the same one pretty much all my guests are doing themselves, then go visit www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for our next FREE Online Training Class.  We will be back in person once legally allowed to do so but for now we are 100% virtual.

No need for you to reinvent the wheel, we have our system down pat. Again that’s  www.infinitywealth.ca/events and register for the FREE Online Training Class.

 

This episode is also brought to you www.stockhackeracademy.ca where everyday real estate investors learn the best practices in stock investing to earn cash flow in about 15-30 mins per day from their mobile phones. After real estate, Stock Hacking is the next best hustle as you’ve heard from many past guests on this show. Among our students last year, 31 trades were shared with them. 30 were profitable for an over 96% success rate and 12% return on capital. I will be giving free demonstrations online, very similar to the one I gave my kid cousin, a full time musician and he just made 50% return in 2021.  Past of course does not predict the future but if you’d like a free demonstration go to www.stockhackeracademy.ca in the top right, click FREE Demo.  At the demonstration I’ll have special bonuses. We do not advertise publicly for all my favourite listeners and I only have two more demos to give in the next few weeks.

Don’t delay www.stockhackeracademy.ca, what I consider the future of side hustles with real estate so unaffordable for many.

 

We’re hiring!

Just a friendly reminder that we are hiring more investment Realtors who want a full-time challenge to help our clients, regular everyday people, mostly from the GTA, invest in the top investment towns west of the GTA. 

This is for driven folks who want to multiply their current incomes.

APPLY HERE: https://www.infinitywealth.ca/hiring

 

To Listen:

Audio Transcript

**Transcripts are auto-generated.

Erwin  

Greetings my fellow wealth hackers. Welcome to another episode The truth about real estate investing show. Today’s show is titled failing grades fighting at school, but ended up graduating university in the top 10 in class, and 11 properties at the age of 21. Sorry, 27. With Antonio young before we get to Antonio a little wish my wife happy anniversary, her birthday is coming up. But right now, it’s happy anniversary to my wonderful wife, cherry Chan, who is my life in business and investment partner. It hasn’t always been easy. I think most people know relationships are not easy, but they’re also important for long term happiness and success. One thing that’s worked out well for us is we share so many values, including how we raise our kids, we both are planners and want to prepare them for all things. I tend to lean towards what I’m worried about, for like 10 years from now, when they’re all growing up, for example, my kids are switching from martial arts later this summer next month, actually from kickboxing to Brazilian jujitsu. For anyone who’s watched UFC, mixed martial arts, you know, those are pretty much the top two styles among that are the most important. It’s almost interchangeable, which is more important, but my plan is for kids to have both. Hence, again, they’re switching, they’re switching to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, which is, in my opinion, the most effective martial art for self defence anyways. And also this week, we signed up the kids for more golf lessons, as in my experience, golf is an important skill for business. It’s funny, they don’t teach that business school, I think they should. Don’t ever hire me to teach anything to business people. This is just my own experience. The networking opportunities from golfing are among the best I’ve seen. And even better for good golfers. Plus, it’s an activity that takes a long time that we can do as a family. So I look forward to the kids when they don’t want to hang out with us. And talk to us that bill even when they get older, they’ll open up to us because there’ll be stuck with us for four hours. So they better talk to us while we’re golfing. It’s well known and documented that Tiger Woods his favourite memories of his dad were when it was just the two of them playing golf together. That’s something that Terry and I focus on, is building memories. collecting things like houses is more of a means to an end. We teach our kids about that as well, to invest for the long term and provide us our financial freedoms. Because as great as it is to be a business owner, we don’t have pensions, and statistically those without pensions about over two thirds of about two thirds P folks without pensions will never retire, which is basically the opposite of financial freedom, not what I’m looking for. Speaking of financial freedom, we have a young investor, today’s guest Antonio young, he’s 27 years old, and he’s already owned 11 properties. He doesn’t own the law currently, as he’s rotating his capital from Ontario to Alberta. He’s here to share about that, and also about his broken childhood, as he was the child of hard working blue collar immigrant parents. Both of his parents worked 60 hours a week, just to put food on the table. His story of how he turned it around, as is full of lessons for anyone out there wanting to turn around their own fortunes or for those for those of you who are parents with troubled teenagers, and did Antonio ever, ever turn it around? He got around better, better folks. His parents switched schools and got them about better kids were focuses more around academics versus violence. Antonio actually ended up graduating for a really good school, Laurie’s business programme in the top 10 in his class, and he got top club placements, which are highly competitive, and great jobs and offerings after school is a student of some of the greatest investors out there. Warren Buffett Ray Dalio. He’s been in private equity for the Ontario teachers pension, learning from some of the best investors out there, and currently works for one of the big five teaming banks on Bay Street. Like myself, Antonio is not loyal to real estate. He’s an investor who happens to refer real estate for highest returns and best investments. This is a pretty cool episode. In my opinion. It’s been quite a journey for young Antonio. And if you know me troubled younger people, you may want to share this episode with them. Please enjoy the show. Hello, Antonio,

 

Antonio  

what’s keeping you busy these days? Just just work. Right now what I’m doing is I just ran a marathon on May 1. That was really, really tough for me. And then now I might my next fitness goal is I’m looking to get to 10% body fat. And so that’s what I’m working on right now. And then I also have a business partner named Kathie Lee. And right now we’re in progress of discussing with lawyers and different folks on how to build a

 

Erwin  

REIT fantastic, and you’re gonna do all this before breakfast. It’s a tough pile mine but I’ll try. Alright, a lot to unpack there. Look, listen and oh, how old are you?

 

Antonio  

I am 27 I just turned 27, seven days ago, and you have how many properties? For me, I bought and acquired 11 properties. So I actually sold maybe 12 properties. I sold six properties in the last two years. And then what I’ve been buying is in over in Alberta, so I have six properties in total right now. Awesome. And what’s your strategy? I’m Alberta, my strategy out in our Mirta was, so my strategy in Ontario was always the first strategy, because that makes more return than anything that I can ever find. And Alberta is a little bit trickier because I don’t know contractors there. And working with contractors is the hardest piece because managing them and then managing them from a distance is a little bit harder. So my strategy was just to buy under market value properties that don’t need too much renovations. And then really just rent them out because it cash flows in unvented.

 

Erwin  

That’s pretty crazy. And sorry, when you’re Bert, what kind of properties reboring single family homes, apartment buildings.

 

Antonio  

The properties I was burning was more so duplexes, I had some triplexes

 

Erwin  

sorry, really already duplexes, and triplexes when you got them when you turn them into. I didn’t

 

Antonio  

turn those into I was looking into that strategy, actually, in Kitchener. And then I was like, these numbers don’t make sense anymore to do them. So mine was really just buy things. And then some I had to cut, and then some more just lipstick renovations. Right, right. My strategy was always if I can buy low enough, there’s value here. And sometimes you can even burn things without doing major renovations.

 

Erwin  

That’s actually a really good point that you bring up. And I think, especially novices needs to understand that to do a conversion is extremely expensive and time intensive. And obviously, if it goes through government for it, yeah.

 

Antonio  

Well, I was I was talking to a lot of novice investors. And I’m actually really scared because I’m going to these real estate networking events. And I’m asking them for their numbers. And I’m like, Hey, where are you investing in this specific market? I’m not going to name the market, Ontario. It’s not Yeah, somewhere in Ontario, like in the suburbs. And like far out in the suburbs, and they’re just

 

Antonio  

so far, like tertiary or like, we’re talking about a five hour drive. Oh, my, okay. You can probably guess it now. But I was asking that was like Aubrey

 

Antonio  

was asking them, I was like, what’s the fundamentals there? What’s the different thing? They were kind of telling me? Hey, I’m investing there because this person is investing there. And the numbers work in the cash flow. But in my mind, I’m like, Oh, the fundamentals, like you got to invest based on fundamentals. They were telling me the numbers, and they were like, Yeah, I’m gonna buy this property for about 300k. I’m gonna put 100k in renovations, and the ARV is going to be 375. I’m like, Wait, so you’re putting in all this money, and you’re actually gonna lose money. It’s like a negative or, right? Because you’re putting a 400k. Like, all together, I think a property is only worth 375. And that’s when I got really, really scared. And I was like, I need to get at it. Ontario, and invest in Alberta.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, I know. A lot of people are struggling with it or properties in Sudbury. Yeah. Like, like you mentioned, contractors and then as far away so they’re managing from distance. Yeah, that’s Yeah. And you know, the funny thing is, so there’s gonna be some people who are upset that we’re talking about Sunbury people are losing money there was called The Truth about real estate investing. Hopefully people understood that when they read the title of the show, we don’t pull

 

Antonio  

punches. I’ll be transparent and stuff because I always desire the truth. Because as an investor, it’s like, once we have the truth, we can figure out the optimal solution. Yeah, that’s why I really liked the name, the truth of real estate investing.

 

Erwin  

Yeah, like this is kind of like a like a pocket mastermind here. We’re just trying to share best practices and also thing